Hoopsworld's Top 5 NBA Point Guards...

[Pauleta14]

http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=13673

1) Chris Paul – New Orleans Hornets: An easy call at #1. CP3 is not only the best point guard in the League today, he is quickly working his way up the list of all-time greatest PG's ever. Paul has now put two consecutive seasons of simply mind-boggling numbers. Chris became the first player ever in league history to lead the NBA in both steals and assists in consecutive seasons. In addition, Paul once again finished last season averaging over 20 points and 10 dimes. In the 63-year history of the NBA, there have only been seven players to finish a season with averages of at least 20 points and 10 assists. The other members of this prestigious 20/10 club are Oscar Robertson, Magic Johnson, Isiah Thomas, Kevin Johnson, Tim Hardaway, Nate "Tiny" Archibald, and, surprisingly, Michael Adams. Before CP3 did it in 2007-2008, no player had accomplished the impressive 20/10 feat in over 15 years. Timmy Hardaway was the last to do so back in 1992-1993. And over the last two seasons, Paul has posted a line of 25 points and 15 assists in the same game on nine different occasions. That is one more 25-point/15-assist game than all other NBA players COMBINED have recorded since the start of the 2007-2008 season. Paul's stats these last two years are basically the equivalent of Steve Nash's MVP-winning numbers on steroids. We could go on and on with the proof, but you get the idea…
2) Deron Williams – Utah Jazz: Drafted one pick ahead Chris Paul in 2005 draft, Williams has shadowed CP3's rise to greatness. While not quite on Paul's level of statistical absurdity, D-Will is clearly one of the more talented point guards to come into the Association in quite some time. Physically, he has everything you could possibly want in your PG: size, quickness, strength, athleticism, etc. Moreover, he possesses incredible court vision, passing skills, ability to run the break and either dish or finish in traffic. Not to mention he is solid shooter, as his terrific FG and FT percentages attest. Nearly every team in the League would love to have Deron Williams running their offense.
3) Tony Parker – San Antonio Spurs: It seems like TP has been in the league for ages, but he actually just turned 27. But because he joined the Spurs as a teenager, Parker has already established an incredibly impressive resume, consisting of multiple NBA All-Star appearances, three NBA titles, and one NBA Finals MVP trophy. And, the starling fact is Parker just keeps getting better and better. Last season, TP quietly produced the best statistical season of his career, averaging career-highs in points (22.0) and assists (6.9) – while still shooting a remarkable 50.6% from the field. And, as his NBA Finals MVP suggests, Tony tends to play his best in big games.
4) Chauncey Billups - Denver Nuggets: Billups doesn't post the mind-boggling numbers that many others on this list can boast, but he is an undisputed floor general in the truest sense of the phrase. He was the captain and the leader of those great Pistons teams. It is no coincidence that Detroit advanced to AT LEAST the Eastern Conference Finals in each of his six full seasons in MoTown - and the Pistons captured the title in 2004, with Chauncey taking home the NBA Finals MVP award. And Billups picked up right where he left off in Denver. Under Billups' stewardship, the Nuggets finished the regular season with a 54-28 record, which earned then the second overall seed in the Western Conference playoffs. And then Denver advanced all the way to the WCF, before bowing out the eventual champion Los Angeles Lakers. It was the first time the Nuggets had made it out of the first round since 1994. Billups, who was credited with bringing stability and leadership to his new organization, was hailed in many circles as a deserving MVP candidate.

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5) Steve Nash - Phoenix Suns: I went back and fourth on this one. Nash's resume speaks for itself. Not only is he the only active PG - and the first PG since Magic Johnson - to take home a regular season MVP trophy, he won the award back-to-back in '04-'05 and '05-'06. (Nash joined Bill Russell, Wilt Chamberlain, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, Moses Malone, Larry Bird, Magic, Michael Jordan and Tim Duncan as the only players to ever accomplish that feat.) And although his overall production has decreased a bit over the past two seasons, he remains one of the league preeminent playmakers. He's a guy that everyone in the NBA wants to play with because of his propensity to make teammates better. When critics look to discredit Nash's statistical achievements, they claim that he is merely a byproduct of Phoenix's up-tempo system. However, Nash not only puts up big numbers, he is also incredibly efficient - shooting over 50% from the floor, 93% from the free-throw line, and 44% from behind-the-arc. The main knock on Nash is his defense. He was never a good defender, and has recently gone from bad to worse. There were whispers last season that Nash has lost a lot off his fastball and was on the slippery down slope of his career. Well, Mark Cuban and the Dallas Mavericks thought something similar when the y refused to match Phoenix's mammoth offer back in 2004 and Nash joined the Suns as a free agent. Nash responded with consecutive MVP performances. Phoenix still has plenty of faith in his 35-year-old body, as evidenced by the $22 million dollar extension they gave him this summer...


Honorable Mentions
Derrick Rose - Chicago Bulls: Leaving Rose out of the top five was difficult. From a strictly physical talent and skill-set perspective, Rose is off the charts. D-Rose possesses other-worldly athleticism. His quickness is blinding; he can jump through the roof; and he is also a terrific passer who constantly makes plays. He is not a great shooter, but his jumper has improved, and can score from anywhere due to his slashing ability. But, at just 20 years old, he currently lacks the intangibles and leadership skills of veterans like Nash and Billups. There is very little doubt in my mind that Rose will quickly crack the upper-echelon of players at his position, and in the NBA in general; but he is still a pup matching up against wily old bulldogs.
Rajon Rondo - Boston Celtics: Rondo played very well back in 2007-2008, when some doubters believed the only thing that stood between the Celtics and their franchise's 17th title was a reliable point guard. Well, after lending a hand in the C's championship run in 2008, Rondo took his game to the next level this past spring. Rajon's performance during the playoffs this year was simply incredible. He helped lead the undermanned Celtics past the Bulls in an epic seven-game series, and then extended the eventual Eastern Conference Champion Orlando Magic to a seventh and deciding game in the semi-finals. The C's exceeded expectations and Rondo was a major reason why. The Celtics played 14 games last postseason, and in those contests Rondo averaged 16.9 points, 9.8 assists (versus just 2.7 turnovers), 9.7 rebounds, and 2.5 steals. Those are mind-boggling numbers for any point guard, let alone one who won't turn 24 until next February. Yes, there are certainly flaws in his game - Rondo will never win any "prettiest jump shot" awards - but he still has managed to shoot over 50% from the floor last season and, most importantly, his playoff production speaks for itself; as does the championship ring on his finger.

Baron Davis - Los Angeles Clippers: When he is healthy, and motivated, and in shape, B-Diddy is pretty much un-guardable. (If you're looking for proof - check out game tapes of the Warriors 2007 playoff run). The problem is you are not sure what you are going to get from Davis at any given time. For instance, last year a complete lost season for Baron. Dealing with an assortment nagging injuries and general apathy, Davis played in just 65 games - which marked the seventh time over the past eight seasons in which he missed at least 15 contests. And in those 65 games that he suited up for the Clippers, he averaged a pedestrian 14.9 PPG, while shooting just 37% from the field and a career-low 30.2% from three-point land. With Blake Griffin in town and the excitement around the Clippers mounting, Baron could very well respond with a great bounce-back season. Or, maybe he gets hurt or becomes disinterested...? We shall see.
Devin Harris - New Jersey Nets: Like Rose and Rondo, Harris is another player that will be looking to secure a spot amongst the league's best PG's in another year or two. At 26 years of age, Harris is entering his prime and has already shown he is a special talent. During his first full season in New Jersey last year, Harris was one of the league's true breakout stars. He got off to an extremely hot start, averaging over 26 points and nearly 7 assists per game in November. He ended up missing some time with an assortment of minor injuries, but he still made his first All-Star appearance and finished the season with career-highs across the board: Points (21.3 PPG), assists (6.9), steals (1.7), and rebounds (3.4).
Jason Kidd - Dallas Mavericks: Yes, he is a little long in the tooth at 36, but he has shown he still has gas left in the tank by putting together a solid 2008-2009 campaign. He averaged a career-low 9.0 PPG, but dished out copious amounts of assists and rebounded as well as any PG in the NBA. Surprisingly, he also led the Mavs in three-point FG%. Of course he isn't the elite player he once was, and he probably couldn't guard Mark Cuban at this point; but Kidd can still run a beautiful fast break and he makes the Mavs a better team when he is on the floor.
Gilbert Arenas - Washington Wizards: Obviously, the biggest question surrounding Gillie the Gangster is the health of his surgically-repaired knee. However, some tend to forget just how dominant Arenas was before the injury bug bit. During his last full season (2006-2007), he averaged 28.5 points, 6.0 assists, 4.6 rebounds, 2.8 three-balls, and 1.9 steals. The year before, he averaged 29.3 points (on 44.7% shooting) and 6.1 assists. Of course that was two years and three knee surgeries ago. But word out of D.C. is that Gilbert has been balling all summer long and apparently he looks great and is moving extremely well - which is bad news for the rest of the Eastern Conference.
Jose Calderon - Toronto Raptors: Calderon has shown flashes, but he has yet to take that 'next step' towards becoming a great PG.
Other notable names that missed the cut: Jameer Nelson, Monta Ellis (will Nellie have him playing PG?), Andre Miller, Mo Williams, Russell Westbrook (unlimited upside), Kirk Hinrich.

[coyotes_geek]

Pretty good list. You could have a good debate between Deron and Tony over who's number 2 and who's number 3. But either way I think most would agree that those two guys are the 2nd and 3rd best PG's in the league.

[bigzak25]

no dwyane wade?

[DPG21920]

Pretty good list. You could have a good debate between Deron and Tony over who's number 2 and who's number 3. But either way I think most would agree that those two guys are the 2nd and 3rd best PG's in the league.

I agree. We know who the number 1 is for sure. Depending on what you prefer, you could argue D-Will and TP all day long.


no dwyane wade?

SG.

[howbouthemspurs]

no dwyane wade?


He's not a point guard silly!!

[alchemist]

pretty much bullshit, Parker >>>> Deron.

[Muser]

I'd take Devin over Nash.

[honestfool84]

i think i can agree with this list; i love tony parker, but POINT GUARD-wise, paul and williams are better than him that way.

[romain.star]

I am a Spurs fan and I approve this list

[portnoy1]

No way it should be Calderon at 1.

Just kidding, Cp3 is an obvious 1, Deron Williams and Obvious 2 and Parker at 3.
to be No. 1 D-Will has to show that he is not just a product of J.Sloan's offensive system. For Parker to be No.1 he has to run more plays to get his teammates involved.

[DPG21920]

I would take Parker at number 2, but I can see how some would argue Deron.

[barbacoataco]

Funny how #5 Billups easily outplayed CPaul head to head in the playoffs. Stats and PER is one thing, but in playoff matchups Parker play CP3 to a draw in 2008, and Billups outplayed him in 2009. So even though his stats are clearly the best, I'm not sure he's really the best PG. One reason, his defense is nothing special, probably the weakest of the top 3. Also, he is shut down by certain players, while there really is no one who can stop Parker. Parker and Billups have Finals MVP's.

[DPG21920]

Billups is on the downside of his career. He is still effective, but CP3 is clearly better. CP3 did not have the bullets last year to fight with. His team was very weak.

[slick'81]

tony at 3 seems about right

[Ghazi]

CP3 was pretty fucking weak himself.

[angelbelow]

Not bad.

[DPG21920]

True, CP3 did come up lame, but still....

[ducks]

cp3 flops
he is no way number one
no homecourt advance he losses 2 assist a game
no chandler he loses 2 more a game

[timtonymanurich]

If you go off career accolades, TParks is the best of all the other 4. Parker 3 titles, 1 Finals MVP and has the better shooting percentage of all the guards. TParks usually outplays C3P0 or whatever, but not by a large margin. Last season when LA played Naw-lins C3P0 made several game-changing mental errors for the worse for his team. They had a lead in the last 1-2 minutes but C3P0 had mental meltdown after mental meltdown against LA. Derek Fisher never outplays TParks.

[buttsR4rebounding]

CP3 is #1, but not by as wide a margin as some would have you believe. His assists total is inflated by big time homecourt score keeping. It will be interesting to see how his assists go now that he has a more traditional post scoring option that scores in a manner that won't register an assist. Also, with all of Tony's accomplishments I don't see how you can rate DWill ahead of him. But overall can't argue too much.

[Cry Havoc]

Complete bullshit. Parker can only score.

Hey, it's you again!

Tony Parker - 2008-2009 Season - 6.9 assists per game.

You're one of the worst trolls on ST. But you're still fun to call out when you make ignorant posts devoid of fact.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

Parker is probably a lot closer to CP3 than people give him credit for. And I'd put him ahead of Williams.

Billups makes good teams great, and average teams good. That makes him pretty darn impressive as a point.

[mountainballer]

Parker is probably a lot closer to CP3 than people give him credit for. And I'd put him ahead of Williams.

Billups makes good teams great, and average teams good. That makes him pretty darn impressive as a point.

I would also put Tony ahead of Williams, but still put Billups at #2. his overall impact just can't be ignored and I also don't see him on the downside. he will deliver 2 or 3 more impressive seasons.

[exstatic]

He is not even close to Chris Paul. Tony Parker's finals MVP has Tim Duncan's name engraved onto it, and Kobe Bryant has an MVP award with Paul's name engraved onto it.

Are you fucking kidding? While no player wins the Finals alone, and Tim is the foundation of the team, Tony was CLEARLY the Alpha player in that Finals. It's not even really debatable. Tony was unstoppable. Mike Brown was SCREAMING at his team to keep him out of the paint, and they couldn't. He shot 57% from the field and 57% from beyond the arc.

[JamStone]

I think the list is pretty solid, pretty fair. I don't think there is a perfect point guard in the game, so each of the guys on the list has his own share of flaws. I pretty much agree with the top 3, and they're all fairly close to one another. On any given night, one of the top three could out-perform the other two. But, it's the same for all three.

I think perhaps the distinction between Paul and Parker might be the question of if you were to switch their roles and teams, how would each fare? If you put Chris Paul on the Spurs and asked him to focus on scoring, could he excel at that? And, if you put Tony Parker on the Hornets and asked him to make all the decisions in the sets, push the ball when he could, and consistently get his teammates involved, could he excel at that? I think both could likely do well in the others' shoes, but I think Chris Paul could probably handle Tony Parker's role better than Tony could handle Chris' role. Both still great point guards and both deserving of high praise as point guards, but I can see why many think Chris Paul is the better point guard. Not to mention, Paul is the more traditional point guard.

Between Tony and Deron Williams, I think again it's close. But, I can definitely see why many would believe Deron is better. He's a better playmaker as it pertains to setting up his teammates and does a good job in both the half-court set and in transition with controlling the tempo of the game.

I think if there were a list of best "scoring" point guards, Tony could easily top it. But, if we're talking in general, the point guard position, I would take into consideration point guard duties and abilities as very important in the analysis and ranking.

As for the argument that Tony Parker has the better career accolades, then listing 3 titles and shooting percentage, I don't think it's really a congruent point. Championships are team awards and field goal percentage is not really a gauge in evaluating point guards. If we go by career accolades, Steve Nash probably should be first on the list.

[coyotes_geek]

I think perhaps the distinction between Paul and Parker might be the question of if you were to switch their roles and teams, how would each fare?

Paul would be more successful on the Spurs than Parker would be with the Hornets. Paul is every bit the scorer that Tony Parker is, plus he's a better passer and defender.

[anakha]

Paul would be more successful on the Spurs than Parker would be with the Hornets. Paul is every bit the scorer that Tony Parker is, plus he's a better passer and defender.

I beg to disagree here. Better ball-hawker, sure. Defender? Eh.

[DPG21920]

I highly disagree that Paul is a better defender. He is a gambler. TP is a better actual defender both on the perimeter and down low.

[DPG21920]

It is hard to gauge because of the Spurs system. Playing with Duncan makes it difficult to rack up the assists, but TP still sets up the offense well and we should see how TP does on the break this year, now that he has some help.

[Fpoonsie]

I dunno. NEITHER one can defend for shit...though, for some reason, I wanna say that Paul routinely gets steal after frustrating steal against the majority of the opponents he faces.

I should prolly check that before I sign off on it...

[DPG21920]

He does get steals, but to say TP cannot defend for shit is very false. Go back and watch the game film. He is an above average defender for his position.

Now neither CP3 or TP can guard each other, but who can? Other than Paul, TP does pretty well against most on most nights.

[coyotes_geek]

I beg to disagree here. Better ball-hawker, sure. Defender? Eh.

Ball-hawking is a big part of the defensive responsibilities of point guards.

[hater]

I dunno. NEITHER one can defend for shit...though, for some reason, I wanna say that Paul routinely gets steal after frustrating steal against the majority of the opponents he faces.


agree with this

[DPG21920]

That is like saying "shot blocking" is a big part of the defensive responsibilities of big men and we all know that Camby is not a great defender. Same with Birdman.

I am not saying getting steals and blocks are a bad thing, but they often overrating peoples "defense".

[Fpoonsie]

Yeah, whereas TP averaged .9 SPG last season and 1 overall in his career, CP averaged 2.8 last season, 2.4 overall. (per nba.com)

Obviously, defensive prowess doesn't boil down to SPG alone, but it certainly doesn't hurt his case either. (and trust me when I tell you this, I HATE going to bat for that d-bag)

[hater]

That is like saying "shot blocking" is a big part of the defensive responsibilities of big men

huh, it is

[DPG21920]

huh, it is

Finish the quote. Shot blocking is a stat and sometimes a symptom of good defense.

Defensive responsibility is keeping the guy from scoring a high percentage and rebounding and helping out.

[coyotes_geek]

I highly disagree that Paul is a better defender. He is a gambler. TP is a better actual defender both on the perimeter and down low.

Paul's a gambler, and he pretty much always gambles right. Defending down low, sure, Tony's better. But not out on the perimeter. His defensive instincts aren't that good. Tony's quickness compensates for a lot of that, but if Tony is guarding someone who's pretty close to being as quick as he is, Tony struggles a lot.

[DPG21920]

So does Paul. Paul does not routinely stop other guys PG's from getting to where they want. Look at how bad D-Will torches him every time they play seemingly. Billups owned him as well and he almost never does that to TP.

[hater]

Finish the quote. Shot blocking is a stat and sometimes a symptom of good defense.

it's a lot more than that. if you have a great shotblocker in the paint, teams will most likely NOT try to penetrate. It's very valuable.

[DPG21920]

To a certain degree, but Camby was the best shot blocker in the game for a while and his team got run up.

He got lit up one on one. Having a shot blocker next to an anchor is valuable, having a guy who only cleans up off of weakside stuff 3 times a game, not so much.

[Cry Havoc]

it's a lot more than that. if you have a great shotblocker in the paint, teams will most likely NOT try to penetrate. It's very valuable.

Yeah, teams definitely didn't go inside against the Nuggets with Camby. :lol

I don't understand people saying Parker doesn't play good defense. Are they still watching games from 3-4 years ago? Numerous articles have been written this year about how proficient Tony has become at defending.

[coyotes_geek]

So does Paul. Paul does not routinely stop other guys PG's from getting to where they want. Look at how bad D-Will torches him every time they play seemingly. Billups owned him as well and he almost never does that to TP.

D Will torches Tony Parker pretty regularly too. Hell, no one in the Paul, Parker, Williams, Billups quartet can guard each other worth a damn.

[DPG21920]

I think Parker does better against D-Will and Billups than CP3 does, but I have not checked the splits. But yes, generally, they all torch each other. But you can also look at the crazy lopsided head to head match up between D-Will and CP3.

Even if you take those guys out, TP does better in a traditional defense than CP3 imo. CP3 is a better overall player, but I think TP is a better defender.

TP and D-Will, I would take TP, but D-Will can certainly be argued.

[coyotes_geek]

Yeah, teams definitely didn't go inside against the Nuggets with Camby. :lol

I don't understand people saying Parker doesn't play good defense. Are they still watching games from 3-4 years ago? Numerous articles have been written this year about how proficient Tony has become at defending.

I'm not saying that Tony doesn't play good defense. I just think that Chris Paul is a little bit better at it. JMO........

[IronMexican]

List sounds about right.

[Cry Havoc]

I'm not saying that Tony doesn't play good defense. I just think that Chris Paul is a little bit better at it. JMO........

I wasn't really referring to you, just people who think both Paul and Parker are abhorrent at defense, which is absolutely not the case. PGs get pick n rolled more than any player in the league, so they actually have to play a lot more defense to hold their man to lower scoring numbers.

[tomtom]

The top 3 are definitely close. I can't really put a number to each of them myself. Paul's the best playmaker and Tony's the best scorer but Deron's the best all round pg imo. All 3 are great though. Also I wish they would've included Westbrook in those honorable mentions. He's gonna be great some day.

[portnoy1]

Are you fucking kidding? While no player wins the Finals alone, and Tim is the foundation of the team, Tony was CLEARLY the Alpha player in that Finals. It's not even really debatable. Tony was unstoppable. Mike Brown was SCREAMING at his team to keep him out of the paint, and they couldn't. He shot 57% from the field and 57% from beyond the arc.
Parker deserved to win the 2007 Finals MVP. However he did what he does best, SCORE as you pointed out above. He was an explosive scorer in a low scoring series. Once again he deserved the MVP award, however it was his scoring alone that got him to the MVP trophy. No one was close because they werent consistent scorers like Parker. In games 3/4 Duncan/Ginobili had subpar scoring games and Parker put up numbers. I love CP3 and D-will but they may be overrated, but so is Parker. CP3 assist and playmaking may go down without T.Chandler right? D-will is maybe just a product of J.Sloan beautiful offensive system right? Parker has to have the ball all the time to be effective, right?

[Cry Havoc]

Parker deserved to win the 2007 Finals MVP. However he did what he does best, SCORE as you pointed out above. He was an explosive scorer in a low scoring series. Once again he deserved the MVP award, however it was his scoring alone that got him to the MVP trophy. No one was close because they werent consistent scorers like Parker. In games 3/4 Duncan/Ginobili had subpar scoring games and Parker put up numbers. I love CP3 and D-will but they may be overrated, but so is Parker. CP3 assist and playmaking may go down without T.Chandler right? D-will is maybe just a product of J.Sloan beautiful offensive system right? Parker has to have the ball all the time to be effective, right?

That's an extremely simple view to take. If Duncan had put up the kind of scoring numbers Parker did in the Finals, you would hear nothing but praise for how smart he is for "taking advantage of mismatches", "putting the Spurs on his back", "being a horrible mismatch for the other team", or "realizing his team needs scoring and stepping up accordingly". But Parker does it, and he's accused of being a one-dimensional player.

He shot at a 57% for the Finals (in a series where the scores were averaging in the low to mid 80s!). I'm not sure what he could have done to get assists in order to help the Spurs score a higher clip.

[portnoy1]

That's an extremely simple view to take. If Duncan had put up the kind of scoring numbers Parker did in the Finals, you would hear nothing but praise for how smart he is for "taking advantage of mismatches", "putting the Spurs on his back", "being a horrible mismatch for the other team", or "realizing his team needs scoring and stepping up accordingly". But Parker does it, and he's accused of being a one-dimensional player.

He shot at a 57% for the Finals (in a series where the scores were averaging in the low to mid 80s!). I'm not sure what he could have done to get assists in order to help the Spurs score a higher clip.
I clearly said that Parker deserved the 2007 Finals MVP. He stood out as the dominant player in the series for sure. You basically agreed with me, He shot well and scored in a low-scoring series. Duncan can get rebounds,block shots, etc etc and intangibles if he is not scoring. Parker is scorer and doesn't really do alot without the ball. Duncan affects the game on different levels, Parker affects the game alot on 1 level.

[exstatic]

I'm not saying that Tony doesn't play good defense. I just think that Chris Paul is a little bit better at it. JMO........

Chris Paul is the worst defensive PG in the league. One of the big reasons the Hornets dropped like a rock last year was the departure of Pargo. They could no longer hide Paul on defense. I don't care about steals. To get one steal, you have to lunge, gamble, and otherwise get yourself out of position five times. That's four cases of five on four in the halfcourt while CP3 picks himself up off the floor where his man's crossover left him.

[DPG21920]

Chris Paul is the worst defensive PG in the league. One of the big reasons the Hornets dropped like a rock last year was the departure of Pargo. They could no longer hide Paul on defense. I don't care about steals. To get one steal, you have to lunge, gamble, and otherwise get yourself out of position five times. That's four cases of five on four in the halfcourt while CP3 picks himself up off the floor where his man's crossover left him.

Not so fast there buddy :lol Steve Nash still plays.

[coyotes_geek]

Chris Paul is the worst defensive PG in the league. One of the big reasons the Hornets dropped like a rock last year was the departure of Pargo. They could no longer hide Paul on defense. I don't care about steals. To get one steal, you have to lunge, gamble, and otherwise get yourself out of position five times. That's four cases of five on four in the halfcourt while CP3 picks himself up off the floor where his man's crossover left him.

The Hornets were about a PPG better defensively last year without Pargo than they were with him the year before. So it sure doesn't look like they missed him on that end of the court. Offensively, sure, they missed Pargo a lot. When Paul went out of the game last year that team's offense just ground to a halt.

[coyotes_geek]

Not so fast there buddy :lol Steve Nash still plays.

No kidding. I'm not trying to put Chris Paul on anyone's all defensive team, but to say he's the worst defensive pg in the league is ridiculous.

[DPG21920]

No kidding. I'm not trying to put Chris Paul on anyone's all defensive team, but to say he's the worst defensive pg in the league is ridiculous.

http://www.nba.com/2009/news/05/06/defensive.team/index.html
2008-09 NBA ALL-DEFENSIVE FIRST TEAM
Position Player, Team 1st 2nd Points
Center Dwight Howard, Orlando 27 1 55
Guard Kobe Bryant, L.A. Lakers 24 5 53
Forward LeBron James, Cleveland 22 3 47
Guard Chris Paul, New Orleans 15 6 36
Forward Kevin Garnett, Boston 13 9 35


Sweet, sweet irony.

[coyotes_geek]

http://www.nba.com/2009/news/05/06/defensive.team/index.html
2008-09 NBA ALL-DEFENSIVE FIRST TEAM
Position Player, Team 1st 2nd Points
Center Dwight Howard, Orlando 27 1 55
Guard Kobe Bryant, L.A. Lakers 24 5 53
Forward LeBron James, Cleveland 22 3 47
Guard Chris Paul, New Orleans 15 6 36
Forward Kevin Garnett, Boston 13 9 35


Sweet, sweet irony.

:lol

You'll get no arguement from me that sexy steals numbers and a hefty ppg average will garner you some extra, and potentially undeserved, attention for the all defensive team. Lebron's place on 1st team all-d is pretty bogus IMO too.

[#2!]

:lol

You'll get no arguement from me that sexy steals numbers and a hefty ppg average will garner you some extra, and potentially undeserved, attention for the all defensive team. Lebron's place on 1st team all-d is pretty bogus IMO too.

Lebron on that list pretty much negates the whole thing.

He didn't even guard Turkoglu through most of their PO series. but i guess Courtney Lee is enough of an offensive weapon to require the attention of a top 5 NBA defender like LBJ.

[ohmwrecker]

It's hard to argue with that list. You could switch up the order of the top 4 and I probably still wouldn't have a problem with it. However, I don't think Steve Nash is top 5 anymore. I would go with Devin Harris. If Gilbert Arenas is healthy, you've got to move him up as well.

[lotr1trekkie]

So, so stupid! The PG's role always depends on the teammates needs. All of the top PG's can do it all. What does the team need is the unanswered question.

[spursfan09]

How lucky are we? To have a top 5 pg. Who knew what Tony Parker would turn into? Very happy with him! Each year he gets alittle better, so I look forward to an even better year from him.

[portnoy1]

Are you fucking kidding? Will you please tell me how many assists per game Tony Parker averaged in the finals?
He averaged 3.2ast/3.0turnovers a game in 4 games vs the Cleveland Cavaliers. I'll admit it was a low-scoring series but really 3 ast a game from your PG is very low. I'd say 5 should be the lowest under the circumstances of the series being low-scoring but not 3ast and 3 turnovers with it.

[picc84]

Parker got the job done and they won. In a sweep. Are you guys really griping about his assist #'s? Jezus chrizt.

List is deadly accurate too.

[portnoy1]

Parker got the job done and they won. In a sweep. Are you guys really griping about his assist #'s? Jezus chrizt.

List is deadly accurate too.
I said it before and I'll say it again. Parker deserved the 2007 Finals MVP award because his ball playing stood out.

[Macca76]

He averaged 3.2ast/3.0turnovers a game in 4 games vs the Cleveland Cavaliers. I'll admit it was a low-scoring series but really 3 ast a game from your PG is very low. I'd say 5 should be the lowest under the circumstances of the series being low-scoring but not 3ast and 3 turnovers with it.


Are you Spurs fans ? Really ? The man is Finals MVP, he destroyed the Cavs and you are bitching about his low assists assist number ?

TP is a LATE first rounder, and is paid 11 M$/year. Chis Paul and Deron Williams were drafted 3rd and 4th and recently got MAX contracts, they were/are/will be untouchable for the spurs.

I can't wait till TP has 35 pts and only 4 assists, you will again be bitching about his lack of passing abilities, it will be so much fun :lol

[Macca76]

I said it before and I'll say it again. Parker deserved the 2007 Finals MVP award because his ball playing stood out.

Spurstrodamus will be so mad at you :lol

Just kiddin', you're less a hater than I thought :toast

[picc84]

I said it before and I'll say it again. Parker deserved the 2007 Finals MVP award because his ball playing stood out.

But you still sound spoiled. In the grand scheme how many assists he had is completely inconsequential provided the Spurs win the series, which they did. He wasnt taking teammates out of the game, he wasnt getting his points out of the team flow. Like you pointed out it was a low-scoring series with great defense, so maybe his passes that should have been assists weren't because a teammate couldn't convert. Either way I dont understand why you're complaining.

[ffadicted]

no dwyane wade?

soooo true

[timtonymanurich]

He averaged 3.2ast/3.0turnovers a game in 4 games vs the Cleveland Cavaliers. I'll admit it was a low-scoring series but really 3 ast a game from your PG is very low. I'd say 5 should be the lowest under the circumstances of the series being low-scoring but not 3ast and 3 turnovers with it.

This argument is like the special Olympics; no matter who 'wins' you're both STILL retarded!!:bang:bang:bang

Assists are such a insignificant stats!! "OOOHHHH. someone PASSED the ball before his teammate scored with it!"

What a stupid stat and what a stupid thing to argue about!:bang:bang

[kace]

i would like to defend TP about his defense (for me he is an above average defensor), but i'm still angry about his defense in the last french NT game :lol


as for CP3, i can easily understand him being considered the best PG in the league, but i still think he is highly overrated.

1. he's not a good defender. he's clearly one of the example of this new hype in the NBA of claiming that the NBA superstars are the best defensors. last years, as best defensors, most medias were talking about CP3, D-Wade, LBJ..... and that's just a joke. there was a great article about D wade being overrated about his defense and the same thing happens to CP3, with his SPG stat that really doesn't mean so much.


2. i'm very sceptic about assist per game meaning. i will quote myself:

apg is an overrated stat.


let's look at the teams with great assists PG.

we all know that, obviously, the teams with an assist first PG aren't winning the title the last years. that fact only should lead to the statement that a high apg PG isn't as great as some people say or think.

if you take two of the greatest assist PG in the league, often included and compared with TP in the top 3 nba PG rankings, D-Will and CP3, you see that when they're not on the court, their team have almost the same amount of assists per game.

for Utah, it's 24,6 with D-Will and 24 without him (14 games missed in 08-9)

for NOH, it's 20,2 apg with CP3, 19.5 without him (even if it's a small sample of 4 games in 08-09).



let's now look at the percentage of points assisted of the 6 teams whom PG have more than 8 apg and are considered as assists first PG/ "floor generals":
NOH (55%), Mavs (57%), Suns (56%), Utah (64%), toronto (60%) and Boston (55%).

LA is at 58% and the Spurs at 57%, which means with or above most of these teams (except maybe Utah that is a little ahead).

let's be clear, i think that CP3, Dwill and most of these PG are great and useful players.

but, again, the APG stat alone is an overrated stat IMO.


PS: stats from NBA.com and 82games.com


for me, there are four or five PG that are more or less at the same level, with different skills. but i can't see any who would fit the spurs team better than tony.