Religulous

[DMX7]

Just finished seeing it via the Netflix. It was pretty good.


eZpREDn4NFA

Just goes to show you though. Look at Bush, he started a war because "God" told him to.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2005/oct/07/iraq.usa

[SpurNation]

Interpretation is a dangerous thing. Also a human thing.

[DMX7]

Bill pretty much says it like it is.

[DarrinS]

You watched that on purpose?

[I. Hustle]

Bill Maher is an idiot. People want to bitch and moan about religious people pushing beliefs but then he goes out and tries to do the same? What's the point? Does it make him feel like a better person at the end of the day? The dude is one of the biggest douce bags ever.

[ChumpDumper]

I saw it downtown when I had some time to kill. Parts of it are pretty thought-provoking.

[DarrinS]

Bill Maher is an idiot. People want to bitch and moan about religious people pushing beliefs but then he goes out and tries to do the same? What's the point? Does it make him feel like a better person at the end of the day? The dude is one of the biggest douce bags ever.

+1


I'm not a religious person, but I can't stand the way Maher is so condescending to people of faith.

[boutons_deux]

If people of faith would stick to saving souls, and get out of politics, Constitutional subversion, pushing fairy tales as science, and blatant money-grubbing, Maher wouldn't have anybody to condescend to.

[DarrinS]

If people of faith would stick to saving souls, and get out of politics, Constitutional subversion, pushing fairy tales as science, and blatant money-grubbing, Maher wouldn't have anybody to condescend to.


The men that wrote the Constitution were athiests. :rolleyes

[clambake]

If people of faith would stick to saving souls, and get out of politics, Constitutional subversion, pushing fairy tales as science, and blatant money-grubbing, Maher wouldn't have anybody to condescend to.

this is a fucking EXCELLENT post.

[Fpoonsie]

Hilarious movie...and as CD said, many points brought up were terribly intriguing.

[z0sa]

those who love to hate will laugh and continue hating. Those who do not will write it off extremely easily.

[Fpoonsie]

those who love to hate will laugh and continue hating. Those who do not will write it off extremely easily.

I dunno. My enjoyment of it or the reason I found it to be so funny had nothing to do w/ "hatred". Some of the most important people in my life whom I love dearly are people of "faith".

The guy is witty...it's hard to deny that. And to a person tryin to figure out what it is that they DO still believe in (if anything), this film made some very valid arguments.

[clambake]

can you have it both ways, zosa?

[jack sommerset]

Bill Mahr is great. Agree with his non-religous beliefs and disagree with alot of his political beliefs. Plus the motherfucker is funny.

[z0sa]

I dunno. My enjoyment of it or the reason I found it to be so funny had nothing to do w/ "hatred". Some of the most important people in my life whom I love dearly are people of "faith".

The guy is witty...it's hard to deny that. And to a person tryin to figure out what it is that they DO still believe in (if anything), this film made some very valid arguments.

it's simply a movie meant to make god-haters feel better about themselves. Nothing more. Like I said, its easily written off - there aren't any valid points to religious folk.

[jack sommerset]

it's simply a movie meant to make god-haters feel better about themselves. Nothing more. Like I said, its easily written off - there aren't any valid points to religious folk.

+1. I felt alot better about myself after watching.

[z0sa]

can you have it both ways, zosa?

sure. The uneducated, dumbed down masses who are lukewarm in their beliefs anyway will get a good laugh and may even be converted becuase of his hateful "wit."

[clambake]

sure. The uneducated, dumbed down masses who are lukewarm in their beliefs anyway will get a good laugh and may even be converted becuase of his hateful "wit."

i don't know......you seem quite fixated on it being hate.

[clambake]

+1. I felt alot better about myself after watching.

now thats just funny....i don't care who you are.

[Fpoonsie]

sure. The uneducated, dumbed down masses who are lukewarm in their beliefs anyway will get a good laugh and may even be converted becuase of his hateful "wit."

So, because I want the most information from all sides concerning an issue of extreme importance to me...I'm "uneducated" and "dumbed-down"?

[ChumpDumper]

One thing about matters of faith -- they all come down to, well, faith. Any discussion will eventually end up at an impasse. A skeptic like Maher will always hit a brick wall of belief at some point, but it's interesting to see how he gets there and where those walls show up.

[z0sa]

So, because I want the most information from all sides concerning an issue of extreme importance to me...I'm "uneducated" and "dumbed-down"?

Judging from you calling the movie simply "information" as opposed to "biased, and ignorant, interpretation", yes. There's no "information" to be had, in a practical sense.

[z0sa]

One thing about matters of faith -- they all come down to, well, faith. Any discussion will eventually end up at an impasse. A skeptic like Maher will always hit a brick wall of belief at some point, but it's interesting to see how he gets there and where those walls show up.

It's interesting, "thought provoking" or "intruguing" to those on that side of the brick wall. To us on the other side, its just another blatant offensive by the "skeptics." Another way to cut us down and laugh at us.

[clambake]

Judging from you calling the movie simply "information" as opposed to "biased, and ignorant, interpretation", yes. There's no "information" to be had, in a practical sense.

do you think god talked to bush?

[z0sa]

do you think god talked to bush?

what do you mean?

[clambake]

what do you mean?

bush said he did. do you believe that?

[ChumpDumper]

It's interesting, "thought provoking" or "intruguing" to those on that side of the brick wall. To us on the other side, its just another blatant offensive by the "skeptics." Another way to cut us down and laugh at us.You seem to be taking this really personally. Tell me, are there any religious beliefs you find even the slightest bit kooky or are they all sacrosanct and worthy of only solemn reverence?

[z0sa]

bush said he did. do you believe that?

God has "talked" to a lot of people. You find that to be bullshit.

[clambake]

chump has asked a thought provoking question, don't you think?

[clambake]

God has "talked" to a lot of people. You find that to be bullshit.

if bush said he did, do you have to believe him?

[z0sa]

You seem to be taking this really personally.

I don't really care about the movie itself - color me umimpressed. Did I take it with a grain of salt? I did. There's no reason why I shouldn't have - I don't get "hurt" or "confused" about my beliefs because of what others say about them.


Tell me, are there any religious beliefs you find even the slightest bit kooky or are they all sacrosanct and worthy of only solemn reverence?

Not necessarily. Bogus preachers getting huge paychecks is far more kooky than Africans worshipping trees and the 'spirit of life.'

[z0sa]

if bush said he did, do you have to believe him?

Why would I?

[clambake]

who are the bogus preachers, and why would you pick on other peoples beliefs?

[Vici]

The president of the most power nation in the world said god talks to him. As someone who believes in god do you believe him Zosa?

[z0sa]

who are the bogus preachers, and why would you pick on other peoples beliefs?

is this a fucking questionnaire? 20 questions while I pass the time at work

[clambake]

is this a fucking questionnaire? 20 questions while I pass the time at work

you're not exactly "God's Warrior" are you?

[clambake]

damnit!!!! i lost him.

[TeyshaBlue]

damnit!!!! i lost him.

You can't just yank the rod when you think you have a bite!

Practice, practice, practice...:lol

[ChumpDumper]

I don't really care about the movie itself - color me umimpressed. Did I take it with a grain of salt? I did. There's no reason why I shouldn't have - I don't get "hurt" or "confused" about my beliefs because of what others say about them.You certainly get snippy about it.


Not necessarily. Bogus preachers getting huge paychecks is far more kooky than Africans worshipping trees and the 'spirit of life.'Why do you consider them bogus?

[MiamiHeat]

I saw this and I didn't like it much.

Mahr didn't do a good job. I could do a much better job at stumping these believers. He left out a lot.

[I. Hustle]

People like Bill Maher are idiots. Why can't people just be free to believe what they want without people like him telling them how stupid they are for not believing the way he does. Yes I know that goes both ways. If I choose to believe in something I don't need someone telling me how stupid I am for it. How does me being a Christian, Atheist, Buddhist, etc. have anything to do with his life?
To want to be a comedian and talk about other people's beliefs or make movies about them is fine. The people that would be offended don't have to watch, but when you are actually going up to people and attacking their RIGHT to believe in something... well that is just stupid and being a bully.
I also hate it when people who are totally against religion ask "Why do you believe that?" (in a condescending tone) I would ask Is whatever I say going to change your mind? No then why question me if you really don't care?

[clambake]

People like Bill Maher are idiots. Why can't people just be free to believe what they want without people like him telling them how stupid they are for not believing the way he does. Yes I know that goes both ways. If I choose to believe in something I don't need someone telling me how stupid I am for it. How does me being a Christian, Atheist, Buddhist, etc. have anything to do with his life?
To want to be a comedian and talk about other people's beliefs or make movies about them is fine. The people that would be offended don't have to watch, but when you are actually going up to people and attacking their RIGHT to believe in something... well that is just stupid and being a bully.
I also hate it when people who are totally against religion ask "Why do you believe that?" (in a condescending tone) I would ask Is whatever I say going to change your mind? No then why question me if you really don't care?

religion+politics=in your face.

[BacktoBasics]

Big Maher fan but like stated above he really didn't do a spectacular job of proving his point. It was simply clip after clip of idiots who know very little about their own religion followed by Maher poking fun at them.

He could have really knocked this one out of the park but instead it came as a very slanted sarcastic movie mocking dumbasses...not so much about religious misinformation.

[ChumpDumper]

How does me being a Christian, Atheist, Buddhist, etc. have anything to do with his life?The whole theme of the movie was how people's religion affects other people's lives.

[Vici]

People like Bill Maher are idiots. Why can't people just be free to believe what they want without people like him telling them how stupid they are for not believing the way he does. Yes I know that goes both ways. If I choose to believe in something I don't need someone telling me how stupid I am for it. How does me being a Christian, Atheist, Buddhist, etc. have anything to do with his life?
To want to be a comedian and talk about other people's beliefs or make movies about them is fine. The people that would be offended don't have to watch, but when you are actually going up to people and attacking their RIGHT to believe in something... well that is just stupid and being a bully.
I also hate it when people who are totally against religion ask "Why do you believe that?" (in a condescending tone) I would ask Is whatever I say going to change your mind? No then why question me if you really don't care?

People care because we had a president who sent us to war because he thinks he heard god's voice.

As for Bill, he doesn't really care if people believe in god. What he, and most of us care about, are the lunatic fringe who are tearing this world apart.

[I. Hustle]

I saw this and I didn't like it much.

Mahr didn't do a good job. I could do a much better job at stumping these believers. He left out a lot.

You can't even get your shit straight. The only faith you are qualified to question is that of your girlfriends.

[I. Hustle]

Big Maher fan but like stated above he really didn't do a spectacular job of proving his point. It was simply clip after clip of idiots who know very little about their own religion followed by Maher poking fun at them.

He could have really knocked this one out of the park but instead it came as a very slanted sarcastic movie mocking dumbasses...not so much about religious misinformation.

There it is. I don't agree with B2B when it comes to this stuff but I agree with that.

[baseline bum]

If people of faith would stick to saving souls, and get out of politics, Constitutional subversion, pushing fairy tales as science, and blatant money-grubbing, Maher wouldn't have anybody to condescend to.

+1000. Great movie. The best part was when he interviewed the Catholic priest at the Vatican; that guy was hilarious.

-e1H3KRcqKo

[I. Hustle]

The whole theme of the movie was how people's religion affects other people's lives.

It goes both ways then. I mean the whole thing is stupid. If you don't believe in religion listen to Patton Oswalts take on it. He's atheist and I laughed at the stuff he says.

[clambake]

It goes both ways then. I mean the whole thing is stupid. If you don't believe in religion listen to Patton Oswalts take on it. He's atheist and I laughed at the stuff he says.

it doesn't go both ways.

[jman3000]

This is basically people who saw it and liked it, saw it and disliked it, and never saw it and disliked it.

[I. Hustle]

People care because we had a president who sent us to war because he thinks he heard god's voice.

As for Bill, he doesn't really care if people believe in god. What he, and most of us care about, are the lunatic fringe who are tearing this world apart.

Hear is why I think this statement is retarded. Do you really think that the president is the end all be all? Do you think his word goes no matter what? There are others involved in it as well. The president can say "You know what? Fukk Nebraska it's no longer part of the US!" that doesn't mean that Nebraska is going to disappear or be cut out and flown out of here by helicopter.

Hell after 9/11 everyone wanted to grab a gun and go after anyone that wasn't from here.

[hater]

+1000. Great movie. The best part was when he interviewed the Catholic priest at the Vatican; that guy was hilarious.

-e1H3KRcqKo

:lol

what a funny dude. I'd go to his church every Sunday

not only that, he made Maher look like a rookie

[clambake]

Hear is why I think this statement is retarded. Do you really think that the president is the end all be all? Do you think his word goes no matter what? There are others involved in it as well. The president can say "You know what? Fukk Nebraska it's no longer part of the US!" that doesn't mean that Nebraska is going to disappear or be cut out and flown out of here by helicopter.
uh oh.


Hell after 9/11 everyone wanted to grab a gun and go after anyone that wasn't from here.

you wanted to grab a gun and come after me?

[I. Hustle]

it doesn't go both ways.

You are kidding right? If you take away religion or someone's beliefs you think that this type of society will survive? There has to be balance. If you tip the scale too far one way or the other then there is no balance and hell will break loose. Even in communist countries there are people of different faiths.

[clambake]

You are kidding right? If you take away religion or someone's beliefs you think that this type of society will survive? There has to be balance. If you tip the scale too far one way or the other then there is no balance and hell will break loose. Even in communist countries there are people of different faiths.

oh, i get it. you're clinging to you bible and guns?

[I. Hustle]

you wanted to grab a gun and come after me?

Yes and I still do. My point is that people were so caught up in emotion that regardless of their belief, or lack thereof, they wanted revenge on anyone and everyone

[I. Hustle]

oh, i get it. you're clinging to you bible and guns?

I don't own a gun and I'm not Christian. So you are clinging to a thread.
I just don't understand why people like Bill Maher have to force their way of thinking and try to make fun of people for believing the way they do then turn around and complain about religious people that do the EXACT same.

[nuclearfm]

You are kidding right? If you take away religion or someone's beliefs you think that this type of society will survive? There has to be balance. If you tip the scale too far one way or the other then there is no balance and hell will break loose. Even in communist countries there are people of different faiths.

Actually, most notable people in history and who have pushed society further have limited their religious intake. If anything, the witchcraft believing bible thumpers are not contributing to progress but just keeping things par just by their own doing. Things like this change, people like this are easily led to believe. They'll just be under a different influence, something like the Black Messiah is not that far out of reach. :lol

[jman3000]

By anyone and everyone you obviously mean Middle Eastern looking people and brown people who could possibly be Middle Eastern.

I remember for a few months after 9/11 there were countless stories about local Middle Eastern people being harassed and their businesses being broken into/vandalized at a pretty high rate.

[hater]

I don't own a gun and I'm not Christian. So you are clinging to a thread.
I just don't understand why people like Bill Maher have to force their way of thinking and try to make fun of people for believing the way they do then turn around and complain about religious people that do the EXACT same.

I doubt Bill Maher will start an un-holy war vs. christians

[nuclearfm]

I don't own a gun and I'm not Christian. So you are clinging to a thread.
I just don't understand why people like Bill Maher have to force their way of thinking and try to make fun of people for believing the way they do then turn around and complain about religious people that do the EXACT same.

He's doing it as a response, not a way to force people to his way of thinking. I'm agnostic, but I don't tend to side with him as much on creationism and I never feel like he's forcing it on me. His deal is to make fun of people who "preach" , his views are just a sidepoint. (note: creationism and evolution are not mutually inclusive)

[I. Hustle]

By anyone and everyone you obviously mean Middle Eastern looking people and brown people who could possibly be Middle Eastern.

I remember for a few months after 9/11 there were countless stories about local Middle Eastern people being harassed and their businesses being broken into/vandalized at a pretty high rate.

That's what I meant.

[I. Hustle]

I doubt Bill Maher will start an un-holy war vs. christians

Noone said he would. All I said is that he is complaining about the exact thing he is doing. No war comments from me.

[I. Hustle]

He's doing it as a response, not a way to force people to his way of thinking. I'm agnostic, but I don't tend to side with him as much on creationism and I never feel like he's forcing it on me. His deal is to make fun of people who "preach" , his views are just a sidepoint. (note: creationism and evolution are not mutually inclusive)

Ok well there will always be a response. There will be some idiot that will respond to him and then there will be another idiot that will respond to that person and so on and so on.

You guys think I am fighting for religion and in reality I am just fighting against idiots.

[clambake]

By anyone and everyone you obviously mean Middle Eastern looking people and brown people who could possibly be Middle Eastern.

I remember for a few months after 9/11 there were countless stories about local Middle Eastern people being harassed and their businesses being broken into/vandalized at a pretty high rate.

trailer park mentality.

[hater]

Noone said he would. All I said is that he is complaining about the exact thing he is doing. No war comments from me.

I get your point and it's a good one.

But at the same time, he mostly complains because of the results, which are the holy wars that killed millions.

[I. Hustle]

Actually, most notable people in history and who have pushed society further have limited their religious intake. If anything, the witchcraft believing bible thumpers are not contributing to progress but just keeping things par just by their own doing. Things like this change, people like this are easily led to believe. They'll just be under a different influence, something like the Black Messiah is not that far out of reach. :lol

You say limited their intake which means it is still present. All I am saying is there needs to be balance.

[I. Hustle]

I get your point and it's a good one.

But at the same time, he mostly complains because of the results, which are the holy wars that killed millions.

Yes but lets be realistic. Bush went after oil and the God spoke to me deal was to satisfy at least some of the masses. "Holy" wars were fought a great deal of the time in the name of faith but there was almost ALWAYS another motive. So you could look at these wars as political moves as much as religious ones.
Most heads of religions weren't even believers themselves.

[nuclearfm]

Ok well there will always be a response. There will be some idiot that will respond to him and then there will be another idiot that will respond to that person and so on and so on.

You guys think I am fighting for religion and in reality I am just fighting against idiots.

I think you mean hypocrite rather than idiot. Bill Maher is too intellectually testy to be an idiot.

[clambake]

by the way....if a president says "fukk nebraska, they're no longer a state", then the prez will be flown out in a helicopter.

[I. Hustle]

I think you mean hypocrite rather than idiot. Bill Maher is too intellectually testy to be an idiot.

No, the guy is an idiot. He isn't an intellectual because he thinks the way you do and brings out little tidbits of info that you didn't know. The same can be said for religious people that tell you that the evolutionary chart is wrong because the skeleton of the "Nebraska man" was formed entirely out of what scientest thought he looked like because of a molar that was found and thought to be that of an "apeman" only later to discover is what that of a pig.
I mean anyone can come up with some type of information that you didn't know before and that doesn't automatically make them a genius.

[MaNuMaNiAc]

How come the christians and catholics on this board always get so bent out of shape when someone ridicules their religion but have nothing to say when someone ridicules something like "Scientology"?

I don't think I've met a christian, catholic or anyone for that matter, that doesn't mock scientology... and yet they all love to bitch and moan about intolerance towards their religion. Hilarious.

[I. Hustle]

by the way....if a president says "fukk nebraska, they're no longer a state", then the prez will be flown out in a helicopter.

Exactly my point! Nobody thought he was that crazy or he could have been stopped.

[nuclearfm]

No, the guy is an idiot. He isn't an intellectual because he thinks the way you do and brings out little tidbits of info that you didn't know. The same can be said for religious people that tell you that the evolutionary chart is wrong because the skeleton of the "Nebraska man" was formed entirely out of what scientest thought he looked like because of a molar that was found and thought to be that of an "apeman" only later to discover is what that of a pig.
I mean anyone can come up with some type of information that you didn't know before and that doesn't automatically make them a genius.

He doesn't think like I do, believe me. Sometimes he annoys the hell out of me, but he makes me laugh enough to overcome it. We're not going to agree what being an intellectual is because it is subjective, so I'll leave it at that ( do note I am a university lecturer). He's generally considered funny and that does require some mental wit to say the least.

[I. Hustle]

How come the christians and catholics on this board always get so bent out of shape when someone ridicules their religion but have nothing to say when someone ridicules something like "Scientology"?

I don't think I've met a christian, catholic or anyone for that matter, that doesn't mock scientology... and yet they all love to bitch and moan about intolerance towards their religion. Hilarious.

You are arguing my point. I am talking about ALL people like that. I don't consider myself Christian or Catholic.

[clambake]

Exactly my point! Nobody thought he was that crazy or he could have been stopped.

bush said he talked to god.....after.

he know's he didn't talk to god. he said that to abuse it's only power.

[nuclearfm]

bush said he talked to god.....after.

he know's he didn't talk to god. he said that to abuse it's only power.

I'm quite convinced he's delusional enough to have spoken to god. He did that every time he authorized an execution. The funny part is that we lead the nation in exonerations. God is never wrong. :bang

[clambake]

I'm quite convinced he's delusional enough to have spoken to god. He did that every time he authorized an execution. The funny part is that we lead the nation in exonerations. God is never wrong. :bang

he knows how to reel in the suckers.

[Crookshanks]

People who are born-again christians talk to God all the time - it's called praying. And yes, God answers - not in an audible voice, but He answers nonetheless.

[ChumpDumper]

Does God only speak to born-again Christians?

[nuclearfm]

People who are born-again christians talk to God all the time - it's called praying. And yes, God answers - not in an audible voice, but He answers nonetheless.

I consider it quite rude to pray and ask God for things. What about the Divine plan? A little prayer is supposed to make God change it? Seems a very condescending way to treat someone who's supposed to be your friend.

[Crookshanks]

Does God only speak to born-again Christians?
I wouldn't presume to answer for God.

[ChumpDumper]

I wouldn't presume to answer for God.You just did when you said God talks to born-again Christians.

[I. Hustle]

I wouldn't presume to answer for God.

Dude I had them on the ropes before you waltzed in. They were folding like cheap suits.

[Crookshanks]

I consider it quite rude to pray and ask God for things. What about the Divine plan? A little prayer is supposed to make God change it? Seems a very condescending way to treat someone who's supposed to be your friend.
Let me ask you this - do you ask for something every time you talk to your father? Or do you just have conversations? Well, God is our heavenly father and it's the same way with him. But the bible does say that God wants to give good things to his children.

And let me leave you with a quote from C.S. Lewis. It was during the time his wife was dying and he was spending hours in prayer. One of his fellow professors asked him - "do you think your prayers are going to change God's mind and he'll heal your wife?" Lewis replied, "I don't pray in order to change God, I pray in order to change me."

[Crookshanks]

You just did when you said God talks to born-again Christians.

No - I said born-again christians talk to God and He answers. It's up to God if he wants to talk to others - but God doesn't force himself on those who don't want Him.

[ChumpDumper]

No - I said born-again christians talk to God and He answers. It's up to God if he wants to talk to others - but God doesn't force himself on those who don't want Him.Right, you answered for God, saying he answers an entire class of people when they talk to him.

I don't think it's a big deal, but you did answer for him.

[Crookshanks]

Right, you answered for God, saying he answers an entire class of people when they talk to him.

I don't think it's a big deal, but you did answer for him.
You know - you're screen name really describes you. You asked if God only spoke to born-again christians and I answered I didn't know. All I know is that christians talk to God and he answers - but the prayer is initiated by us, not by God. So if God talks to other people, that's up to Him and it's something I don't know and really don't care about.

But yes, God does answer an entire class of people - when they go to him in prayer. Is that answer good enough for you? If not, why don't you try talking to God and see if He answers YOU.

[hater]

How come the christians and catholics on this board always get so bent out of shape when someone ridicules their religion but have nothing to say when someone ridicules something like "Scientology"?

I don't think I've met a christian, catholic or anyone for that matter, that doesn't mock scientology... and yet they all love to bitch and moan about intolerance towards their religion. Hilarious.

because Scientology is not even a religion. It's a fucking joke. The founder is spossed to be an alien, or fucked by an alien or something.

Tom Cruise practices it for christ sake :lmao

[ChumpDumper]

You know - you're screen name really describes you. You asked if God only spoke to born-again christians and I answered I didn't know. All I know is that christians talk to God and he answers - but the prayer is initiated by us, not by God. So if God talks to other people, that's up to Him and it's something I don't know and really don't care about.

But yes, God does answer an entire class of people - when they go to him in prayer. Is that answer good enough for you? If not, why don't you try talking to God and see if He answers YOU.I made no comment on your belief. I only mentioned that you indeed presumed to speak for God.

[SpurNation]

If people of faith would stick to saving souls, and get out of politics, Constitutional subversion, pushing fairy tales as science, and blatant money-grubbing, Maher wouldn't have anybody to condescend to.

Praise God. You're part of His plan.

[DMX7]

"Christianity is the most perverted system that ever shone on man."

-Thomas Jefferson

[clambake]

i like it when people make up stories about god talking to them. it's a good place to lay the blame.

[Shastafarian]

You asked if God only spoke to born-again christians and I answered I didn't know.Good so far

All I know is that christians talk to God and he answers Whoops

- but the prayer is initiated by us, not by God. So?

So if God talks to other people, that's up to Him and it's something I don't know and really don't care about.But you know he talks to other Christians. You're answering for him. Get it?

[z0sa]

How come the christians and catholics on this board always get so bent out of shape when someone ridicules their religion but have nothing to say when someone ridicules something like "Scientology"?

I don't think I've met a christian, catholic or anyone for that matter, that doesn't mock scientology... and yet they all love to bitch and moan about intolerance towards their religion. Hilarious.

Do you know anything about scientology?

[Yonivore]

"Christianity is the most perverted system that ever shone on man."

-Thomas Jefferson
This is a somewhat-paraphrased version of the following:


"...those who live by mystery & charlatanerie [I saw that word somewhere else today. But can't remember where. I think it was spelled Charlatanry, though. I've seen the word Charlatan before but not in this form. Twice in one day? Kind of odd. --Y.], fearing you would render them useless by simplifying the Christian philosophy, the most sublime & benevolent, but most perverted system that ever shone on man, endeavored to crush your well earnt, & well deserved fame."
I think you could make a good argument Jefferson was anti-religion but, there is ample evidence he was not an athiest and some support that he was, in fact, a Christian.

Consider the following, from the archives in various volumes at Monticello:


1787 August 10. (Jefferson to Peter Carr). "Fix reason firmly in her seat, and call to her tribunal every fact, every opinion. Question with boldness even the existence of a god; because, if there be one, he must more approve the homage of reason, than that of blindfolded fear."

1803 April 21. (Jefferson to Benjamin Rush). "To the corruptions of Christianity I am indeed, opposed; but not to the genuine precepts of Jesus himself. I am a Christian, in the only sense in which he wished any one to be; sincerely attached to his doctrines, in preference to all others; ascribing to himself every human excellence; and believing he never claimed any other."

1814 September 26. (Jefferson to Miles King). "I must ever believe that religion substantially good which produces an honest life, and we have been authorized by One whom you and I equally respect, to judge of the tree by its fruit. Our particular principles of religion are a subject of accountability to our God alone. I inquire after no man's, and trouble none with mine; nor is it given to us in this life to know whether your or mine, our friends or our foes, are exactly the right."

1823 April 11. (Jefferson to John Adams). "The truth is that the greatest enemies to the doctrines of Jesus are those calling themselves the expositors of them, who have perverted them for the structure of a system of fancy absolutely incomprehensible, and without any foundation in his genuine words. And the day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the supreme being as his father in the womb of a virgin will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter. But we may hope that the dawn of reason and freedom of thought in these United States will do away all this artificial scaffolding, and restore to us the primitive and genuine doctrines of this the most venerated reformer of human errors."
That he was an athiest was contested during the election in which he won the presidency, I believe. But, in my short googling, I don't find if he ever directly responded to the assertion.

I think the quotes above, that both pre-date and post-date yours, demonstrate he believed in God and in Jesus but, while he doesn't address whether or not Jesus is the Messiah, he doesn't discount it, either.

[DMX7]

I think you could make a good argument Jefferson was anti-religion but, there is ample evidence he was not an athiest and some support that he was, in fact, a Christian.


I didn't say he wasn't a Christian. I'm just trying to imply that Jefferson recognized the destructiveness of religion.

"History, I believe, furnishes no example of a priest-ridden people maintaining a free civil government. This marks the lowest grade of ignorance of which their civil as well as religious leaders will always avail themselves for their own purposes." -Jefferson

[Yonivore]

I didn't say he wasn't a Christian. I'm just trying to imply that Jefferson recognized the destructiveness of religion.
As do we all...I hope.

[koriwhat]

i think maher is full of himself. i watched this movie a long ass time ago and all i got from it was one hater seeking out the easiest of targets within said "faith" to break down and judge for what they believe in whether it be true or not. why just go after christians? why not hindus, people of tribes, people of... because maher might actually get exposed for the ass that he is.

would maher call maria sabina or timothy leary losers or dumb fucks who believe in something out of their grasp? no and you know why? because maria sabina and timothy leary both experimented with psychedelics to induce their higher perceptions of life and creation. and we all know the druggy maher is because he practically "preaches" his drug life.

fuck maher!

[clambake]

i don't think hindus or people of tribes (whatever the hell that means) force their religions into the US political landscape.

[DMX7]

As do we all...I hope.

Sadly, I don't think we do. Huckabee, for instince, said this.

"[Some of my opponents] do not want to change the Constitution, but I believe it's a lot easier to change the constitution than it would be to change the word of the living God, and that's what we need to do is to amend the Constitution so it's in God's standards rather than try to change God's standards."

[Yonivore]

Sadly, I don't think we do. Huckabee, for instince, said this.

"[Some of my opponents] do not want to change the Constitution, but I believe it's a lot easier to change the constitution than it would be to change the word of the living God, and that's what we need to do is to amend the Constitution so it's in God's standards rather than try to change God's standards."
You didn't indicate the context in which that was said and, it's probably not something I would have said but, in my opinion, not much different that this...


When in the Course of human events it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation...
Or, this:


We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.

[DMX7]

You didn't indicate the context in which that was said and, it's probably not something I would have said but, in my opinion, not much different that this...


He said it in the context of wanting to change the constitution to reflect what he thinks god wants, Christian values. For example, he wants marriage consitutionally defined as only between and man and a women.

[Yonivore]

He said it in the context of wanting to change the constitution to reflect what he thinks god wants, Christian values. For example, he wants marriage consitutionally defined as only between and man and a women.
I meant, where and to whom were his remarks directed? Was it part of a longer speech or a remark/response? That's cool...I'll google it and, if I have anything further to add, I'll post it.