Adrian Wojnarowski: Jordan’s night to remember turns petty

[flipcritic]

Let 'er rip!

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=AgpI2ZqKNytJpIHFAXwOHH68vLYF?slug=aw-jordanhall091209&prov=yhoo&type=lgns

SPRINGFIELD, Mass. – The tears tumbled, flooding his face and Michael Jordan had yet to march to the microphone at Symphony Hall. He had listened to the genuine stories and speeches of a remarkable class. He had watched a “This is Your Life” video compilation of his basketball genius. Everything flashed before him, a legacy that he’s fought with body and soul to never, ever let go into yesterday.

Yes, Michael Jordan was still fighting it on Friday night, and maybe he always will. Mostly, he was crying over the passing of that old Jordan, and it wouldn’t be long until he climbed out of his suit and back into his uniform and shorts, back into an adolescent act that’s turned so tedious.

This wasn’t a Hall of Fame induction speech, but a bully tripping nerds with lunch trays in the school cafeteria. He had a responsibility to his standing in history, to players past and present, and he let everyone down. This was a night to leave behind the petty grievances and past slights – real and imagined. This was a night to be gracious, to be generous with praise and credit.

“M.J. was introduced as the greatest player ever and he’s still standing there trying to settle scores,” one Hall of Famer said privately later.

Jordan didn’t hurt his image with the NBA community, as much as he reminded them of it. “That’s who Michael is,” one high-ranking team executive said. “It wasn’t like he was out of character. There’s no one else who could’ve gotten away with what he did tonight. But it was Michael, and everyone just goes along.”

Jordan wandered through an unfocused and uninspired speech at Symphony Hall, disparaging people who had little to do with his career, like Jeff Van Gundy and Bryon Russell. He ignored people who had so much to do with it, like his personal trainer, Tim Grover. This had been a moving and inspirational night for the NBA – one of its best ceremonies ever – and five minutes into Jordan’s speech it began to spiral into something else. Something unworthy of Jordan’s stature, something beneath him.

Jordan spent more time pointlessly admonishing Van Gundy and Russell for crossing him with taunts a dozen years ago than he did singling out his three children. When he finally acknowledged his family, Jordan blurted, in part, to them, “I wouldn’t want to be you guys.”

Well, um, thanks Dad. He meant it, too. If not the NBA, he should’ve thought of his children before he started spraying fire at everyone.

No one ever feels sorry for Isiah Thomas, but Jordan tsk-tsked him and George Gervin and Magic Johnson for the 1985 All-Star game “freeze-out.” Jordan was a rookie, and the older stars decided to isolate him. It was a long time ago, and he obliterated them all for six NBA championships and five MVP trophies. Isiah and the Ice Man looked stunned, as intimidated 50 feet from the stage, as they might have been on the basketball court.

The cheering and laughter egged Jordan on, but this was no public service for him. Just because he was smiling didn’t mean this speech hadn’t dissolved into a downright vicious volley.

Worst of all, he flew his old high school teammate, Leroy Smith, to Springfield for the induction. Remember, Smith was the upperclassman his coach, Pop Herring, kept on varsity over him as a high school sophomore. He waggled to the old coach, “I wanted to make sure you understood: You made a mistake, dude.”

Whatever, Michael. Everyone gets it. Truth be told, everyone got it years ago, but somehow he thinks this is a cleansing exercise. When basketball wanted to celebrate Jordan as the greatest player ever, wanted to honor him for changing basketball everywhere, he was petty and punitive. Yes, there was some wink-wink teasing with his beloved Dean Smith, but make no mistake: Jordan revealed himself to be strangely bitter. You won, Michael. You won it all. Yet, he keeps chasing something that he’ll never catch, and sometimes, well, it all seems so hollow for him.

This is why he’s a terrible basketball executive because he still hasn’t learned to channel his aggressions into hard work on that job. For the Charlotte Bobcats, Jordan remains an absentee boss who keeps searching for basketball players on fairways and greens.

From the speeches of David Robinson to John Stockton, Jerry Sloan to Vivian Stringer, there was an unmistakable thread of peace of mind and purpose. At times, they were self-deprecating and deflective of praise. Jordan hasn’t mastered that art, and it reveals him to be oddly insecure. When Jordan should’ve thanked the Bulls ex-GM, Jerry Krause, for surrounding him with championship coaches and talent, he ridiculed him. It was me, Jordan was saying. Not him. “The organization didn’t play with the flu in Utah,” Jordan grumbled.

For Jordan to let someone else share in the Bulls’ dynasty will never diminish his greatness. Just enhance it. Only, he’s 46 years old and he still doesn’t get it. Yes, Jordan did gush over Scottie Pippen, but he failed to confess that he had wanted Krause to draft North Carolina’s Joe Wolf. Sometimes, no one is better with a half a story, half a truth, than Jordan. All his life, no one’s ever called him on it.

Whatever Jordan wants to believe, understand this: The reason that Van Gundy’s declaration of him as a “con man” so angered him is because it was true on so many levels.

It was part of his competitiveness edge, part of his marketability, and yes, part of his human frailty.

Jordan wasn’t crying over sentimentality on Friday night, as much as he was the loss of a life that he returned from two retirements to have again. The finality of his basketball genius hit him at the induction ceremony, hit him hard. Jordan showed little poise and less grace.

Once again, he turned the evening into something bordering between vicious and vapid, an empty exercise for a night that should’ve had staying power, that should’ve been transformative for basketball and its greatest player. What fueled his fury as a thirtysomething now fuels his bitterness as a lost, wandering fortysomething who threatened a comeback at 50.

“Don’t laugh,” Michael Jordan warned.

No one’s laughing anymore.

Once and for all, Michael: It’s over.

You won.

[JamStone]

Lmao. So well put and accurate.

[Culburn369]

[[[When Jordan should’ve thanked the Bulls ex-GM, Jerry Krause, for surrounding him with championship coaches and talent, he ridiculed him. It was me, Jordan was saying.]]]

I championed Krause first on this Forum. Yep-a-rooney.

Good article.

[benefactor]

Whatever, Michael. Everyone gets it. Truth be told, everyone got it years ago
This.

Though this is not surprising, it's still disappointing to see. It's truly sad that someone so great still feels the need to lash out at his critics like a child in front an audience of some of basketball's greatest contributors. Eventually his failure as an executive will leave him without a place in the NBA and he will die a cold, lonely old man.

[Culburn369]

& I wonder how much those last two years as a player in Washington has bitterized Jordan. He was abused mightily. A lot of old scores were settled, many pieces of his hide peeled off.

[resistanze]

MJ was a basketball player, nothing more, nothing less. Now that his career is over, so is his identity. MJ the person is certainly nothing to fawn over.

[MarHill]

I must admit this column by Adrian Wojnarowski was spot on about Jordan's speech last night.

However, I have been a little conflicted about how I perceived it. On the other hand, Jordan showed how vindictive and petty he could be and I immediately imagined it would have been tough to be his friend.

But, I have watched Jordan for the past 25 years and that was the most honest I had ever heard him in a public setting. I got a real insight into who he really was and what made him tick. I must admit I was surprised by his candor.

I never lived in Chicago.....so I know some of you will post he was liked this all of time. But, it has showed me how image and perception can create a pretty good shield around someone's true personality.

I did have a problem with him calling out his high school buddy, Jerry Krause, and being froze out in the All Star Game as a rookie. Mike....it's time to let that stuff go.

On the other hand...it was slights (real or perceived) that made him into one of the best players of all time.

My hope...for him that he finds some peace and gain a perspective outside of himself as he grows older.

There is a price to pay for greatness and I believe I saw some of that price last night.

[JamStone]

I still can't get over that Leroy Smith high school thing. And, the article makes mention that Jordan actually had him flown in to the ceremony. I only imagine that Leroy Smith was thinking at first, "wow, I guess I really can feel good about being one of Michael's biggest motivations, and it was cool that he would fly me in for that," only to be ridiculed in front of members of the basketball Hall of Fame. That wasn't appreciation. It's like a pretty girl in high school agreeing to go out with a nerd and then embarrassing him in front of the whole school. Honestly, what the fuck was that? Like the article said, you beat him. You proved him and your high school coach wrong. Good job. You're a multi-million dollar icon. He's a 6-foot-7 guy who probably works a 9 to 5. So you fly him in to ridicule him? I honestly can't get over that.

Hey, make fun of Isiah and Bryon Russell and Jeff Van Gundy. At least, they're used to public humiliation. You take a guy that was just trying to make the high school varsity basketball team like every other kid 30 years ago and do that to him? That more than anything, including cracks at Jerry Krause or his cavalier comments to his kids (at least they should be used to him being an asshole) or any of his stories making fun of JVG or Russell or Riley, showed about how classless Michael Jordan is.

[resistanze]

Worst of all, he flew his old high school teammate, Leroy Smith, to Springfield for the induction. Remember, Smith was the upperclassman his coach, Pop Herring, kept on varsity over him as a high school sophomore. He waggled to the old coach, “I wanted to make sure you understood: You made a mistake, dude.”


_PAmDaDgfZU&

[Culburn369]

Maybe having to hand over half + $1 to his ex-wife has him looney tunes. Nothing worse than dieing or losing money.

[redzero]

Rub it in, Michael. Rub it in.

[hater]

Jordan shoulda, woulda, coulda. :rolleyes

let the man be himself as long as he doesn't rape anyone

[tlongII]

That was a hack job of an article. Michael was being Michael. Nothing wrong with that. The people he criticized deserved criticism. It was refreshing to hear someone give a speech that was honest.

[Killakobe81]

I'm sorry but I think it just adds more balance to many of you that "suckoff" MJ when people say Lebron (or Kobe) does this or that many Mj loyalist say well Mj wouldnt of went off the court without shaking hands, or Kobe's an adulterer or they will NEVER be MJ ...I hope for them not. I doubt Kobe will catch MJ in rings (ha has a shot though) or in fandom ...buet much of the ego many despise in Lebron or Kobe is Mj has them beat in that as well ...

[DDS4]

That was a hack job of an article. Michael was being Michael. Nothing wrong with that. The people he criticized deserved criticism. It was refreshing to hear someone give a speech that was honest.

The article was spot on. Michael was being Michael, but that doesn't make the speech less petty and sad.

First time I've heard a hall of fame speech that was pathetically awkward.

[JamStone]

The article isn't criticizing Michael for not being Michael.

It's criticizing Michael because of who he is and for not growing the fuck up.

Everyone can agree Michael was genuinely himself. That's the sad part.

[tlongII]

The article was spot on. Michael was being Michael, but that doesn't make the speech less petty and sad.

First time I've heard a hall of fame speech that was pathetically awkward.

The article was a hack job. Apparently Wojnarowski or whatever the fuck his name is wanted Michael to be overtly gracious and humble or some shit like that. That is not who he is. The speech was neither pathetic nor awkward. I can assure you that most people there would agree with me.

[JamStone]

The article was a hack job. Apparently Wojnahowski or whatever the fuck his name is wanted Michael to be overtly gracious and humble or some shit like that. That is not who he is. The speech was neither pathetic nor awkward. I can assure you that most people there would agree with me.

Nope. He's saying how sad that this is still who Michael is as a 46 year old retired basketball player who already has reached legend and iconic status.

The speech was pathetic. I agree it wasn't awkward, but definitely pathetic.

[tlongII]

It's not surprising that most of the people criticising his speech are either Lakers fans or Pistons fans...

[JamStone]

I fully acknowledge being a Jordan hater. He's still an ass.

And, if you want some perspective, Isiah Thomas is just about as big an asshole and dick as Jordan.

[tlongII]

This wasn’t a Hall of Fame induction speech, but a bully tripping nerds with lunch trays in the school cafeteria. He had a responsibility to his standing in history, to players past and present, and he let everyone down. This was a night to leave behind the petty grievances and past slights – real and imagined. This was a night to be gracious, to be generous with praise and credit.

You should probably read the article again...

[JamStone]

Ok, one sentence. The real point of the article as a whole is about how pathetic and petty Michael Jordan continues to be at his age.

[tlongII]

Wojnarowski is easily one of the worst sportswriters I've read. He pulls stuff out of his ass all of the time...

[tlongII]

Michael has a HUGE ego. That is one of the biggest reasons why he accomplished what he did. Actually I've met MJ and he's a very nice guy.

[flipcritic]

Wojnarowski is easily one of the worst sportswriters I've read. He pulls stuff out of his ass all of the time...

Write him one of your poetic retorts. He'll love your input.

[JamStone]

Even shitty writers can write an accurate story every once in a while, just like even shitty NBA franchises can win a title every once in a while.

[monosylab1k]

Jordan haters see it as being petty and a chance to take one last shot at his detractors.

Jordan lovers see it as Jordan paying tribute to the guys who, while he obviously disliked them, he realized that they were the ones who really pushed him to be the greatest of all time.

The truth is in the middle.

[tlongII]

Write him one of your poetic retorts. He'll love your input.

How about I just copy one of your criticisms of Flip and send that in?

[monosylab1k]

How about I just copy one of your criticisms of Flip and send that in?

:lol

[callo1]

I agree that this joke if an induction should make some people put some things back into perspective in the currrent NBA world. MJ showed his true colors last night. The idea that Lebron, Kobe, Tmac etc. get called out so much for their character and their "poor teamate" status should be reevaluated.

After last night I will always remember the Jordan that got brought back down to earth as a Wizard....or better yet, Iverson breaking his ankles with that nasty crossover.

[flipcritic]

How about I just copy one of your criticisms of Flip and send that in?

:lol

[callo1]

i fully acknowledge being a jordan hater. He's still an ass.

And, if you want some perspective, isiah thomas is just about as big an asshole and dick as jordan.

+1

[hater]

It's not surprising that most of the people criticising his speech are either Lakers fans or Pistons fans...

[/thread]

[hater]

Isaiah is about 100x more of an asshole than Jordan. please.

[jazzypimp]

I stand somewhere in the middle. Jordan is the GOAT and only he can say a speech like that. That said, it was just distasteful. I don't know, but did anyone else feel like their was discomfort in that room when he was talking?? He had his decent moments but he also came off as a huge asshole and I don't give a fuck how successful you are you need to at least show some gratitude?? Did he say he was thankful for anything at all?? Oh yeah, i guess you can say he's thankful for all those he dissed right there right?? sure

[JamStone]

Both Isiah and Jordan are ginormous assholes. Guess it depends on your perspective as to who is a bigger asshole. Obviously, I have my colors that will show bias. But, it's not like there's an easy scale to prove who the bigger ass is. Post playing careers, Isiah has been more in the spotlight to expose his asshole and dick personality. Jordan has laid low more so, so perhaps people's memories of his personality plus his public Messiah persona cloud the perception of how much of an asshole he really is. But, it's your call, your opinion. They're both unbelievably huge assholes.

I would like to hear the defense of Jordan for flying that Leroy Smith guy just to ridicule him and throw it back in the high school coach's face. Forget all the other absurd things Jordan said in his speech for a minute, this is the one, single most outlandish, dick move by Jordan that pissed me off most. He flew Leroy Smith in just to sit in the HOF induction ceremony so he could make fun of him and say "fuck you" to his high school coach. Please MJ loyalists, defend that action.

[DDS4]

Wojnarowski is easily one of the worst sportswriters I've read. He pulls stuff out of his ass all of the time...


Sounds like you have more of a beef with Wojnarowski than we do with Jordan.

[jazzypimp]

Sounds like you have more of a beef with Wojnarowski than we do with Jordan.

This is the first time I have ever heard tschlong talk about anything other than the blazers. Sadly, he sounds worse than that Blazers homer we all make fun of.

[ShoogarBear]

So I'm reading this thread, and a little puzzled by some of the comments, and then suddenly a light goes on.


I work for Nike.

Got it.

[CubanMustGo]

I would like to hear the defense of Jordan for flying that Leroy Smith guy just to ridicule him and throw it back in the high school coach's face. Forget all the other absurd things Jordan said in his speech for a minute, this is the one, single most outlandish, dick move by Jordan that pissed me off most. He flew Leroy Smith in just to sit in the HOF induction ceremony so he could make fun of him and say "fuck you" to his high school coach. Please MJ loyalists, defend that action.

This.

[tlongII]

Sounds like you have more of a beef with Wojnarowski than we do with Jordan.

That may be true. I can't stand the guy.

[tlongII]

He didn't ridicule Leroy Smith. He ridiculed his HS coach. I didn't hear one disparaging remark about Leroy Smith.

[tlongII]

Did he write the first article of Oden being a bust?

He picked the Lakers to win the title this season.

[jazzypimp]

He didn't ridicule Leroy Smith. He ridiculed his HS coach. I didn't hear one disparaging remark about Leroy Smith.

so why did he fly Leroy Smith out there in the first place?? I mean it brings back such bad memories for jordan right?? That could have been a huge memory for good o'l leroy..He probably worked his butt off as a kid to make that team. Now its tainted like your moms vagina!

[tlongII]

so why did he fly Leroy Smith out there in the first place?? I mean it brings back such bad memories for jordan right?? That could have been a huge memory for good o'l leroy..He probably worked his butt off as a kid to make that team. Now its tainted like your moms vagina!

Do you think Leroy Smith didn't enjoy the event? I bet he did.

[JamStone]

He didn't ridicule Leroy Smith. He ridiculed his HS coach. I didn't hear one disparaging remark about Leroy Smith.

Michael said Leroy's game is probably the same now as it was back then, suggesting he got beat out by a kid that played like a 45 year old, old man. It was disparaging.

[JamStone]

Do you think Leroy Smith didn't enjoy the event? I bet he did.

Except for the part where Michael Jordan ridiculed him in front of the entire Hall of Fame and ESPN TV viewing audience, I bet he had a blast.

[Mel_13]

That may be true. I can't stand the guy.


Damaged goods?
By Adrian Wojnarowski, Yahoo! Sports
September 13, 2007

Just this week on the telephone, there was an Eastern Conference executive studying Greg Oden’s pre-draft physical in his office. Even now, this report still didn’t look like the body of a 19-year old prospect, but that of an older, worn veteran.

“From our (trainers and doctors), there were red flags everywhere,” he said

Suddenly, he’s no longer the promise of the next Bill Russell.

Suddenly, he’s the fear of Sam Bowie.

Until there’s proof that his body isn’t breaking down, there’s a natural and legitimate worry that the Blazers could’ve passed on a Jordan-esque talent – Kevin Durant – to take a center who will turn out to be more defective than dominant.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=aw-redflags091307&prov=yhoo&type=lgns

[tlongII]

Baloney. If you think you're being ridiculed for a comment like that you have serious issues.

[jazzypimp]

Baloney. If you think you're being ridiculed for a comment like that you have serious issues.

It's good to see you have thick skin, seeing how much you get ridiculed on these boards:lol

[Thompson]

Michael has a HUGE ego. That is one of the biggest reasons why he accomplished what he did. Actually I've met MJ and he's a very nice guy.

That's probably because when you met him you were nothing to him but an adoring fan. Fans don't make him insecure, they reinforce him, so he was nice to you. If you were ever his teammate during high school however, and played as well as you could (and the coach dared to pick you over him) he would fly you out to the ceremony to point out to you and everyone else how you were nothing and he was the GOAT.

I never really liked or disliked Jordan all that much (I wasn't an NBA fan when he was playing), but he helped me make up my mind about him; he's a jerk and a jackass of a person, and that's more important than what kind of basketball player he was.

[caribbean_spur]

I am a huge fan of MJ as a basketball player, but yesterday speech was totally inappropriate and distasteful. You just do not do that for such an event.

[EricB]

Everyone like this writer acts like its a shock.

Read the Jordan rules. Jordan is a self absorbed dickhead. I hate to go SpursDynasty here but "Nothing new here, Jordan was just being Jordan"

[DDS4]

I am a huge fan of MJ as a basketball player, but yesterday speech was totally inappropriate and distasteful. You just do not do that for such an event.


But he was being honest! [/tlong]

There's a time and place for everything and clearly Jordan didn't get the memo. On the distasteful scale, it's Michael Moore territory.

For the record, I don't hate Jordan. He's the best player in the history of the game. Period.

The point of the ceremony is to reflect, appreciate, and recognize others. Jordan's 20-30 minute grudgefest clearly was something I could do without.

[SenorSpur]

First off, I still can't get over Jordan's absolute brilliance, as a basketball player. Even after following his career, yet not seeing him in his prime for a few while, I have to say that it was utterly stunning to watch how perfectly gifted and dominant of a player he was - on both ends of the court. The absolute greatest of all time - no one can touch him.

Now to the present. Knowing that Jordan is the compulsive competitor that he is, the master of getting the last word, and the ultimate "one-up" guy, it wasn't surprising to see him take "pot-shots" at those who he felt "slighted" by. His way of getting the "last laugh" or saying "I told you so".

Much of what the writer stated was very true. Like others, I would have liked to have seen Mike use this night to bestow more thanks on some of his teammates, coaches, trainers and such. Tell some good stories, talk more about his upbringing, and take a vow of utter humility. However, that is not his way. He does STILL carry that grudge in his gut. The only problem is that it is now WELL after the fact and there is no longer a platform or stage left for him to prove himself. Competition is over. It's about life now.

The writer didn't lie about the him being an absentee executive and a terrible GM. We all know it. We've all seen it. Maybe somebody should tell him to his face just how much he sucks as a GM. Maybe then he's work as hard at that job, as he does on the golf course. Anyone ever wonder WHY he got fired in Washington?

Outside of sports competition, MJ IS pretty lazy. Hell, his own father often told stories on how Mike, as a young boy, paid off his siblings to get out of doing chores so he could go play. In reality, Mike doesn't need that job with the Bobcats. He's too busy running around the world being MJ - international man of leisure -and he's earned that right.

The writer is right on another point - HE WON! It really is over. Mike has nothing left to prove. It's just he seems to be the only one who doesn't know it or accept it. He seems lost without the sport he loves. He seems to be searching for that next level of competitive challenge - and he can't seem to find it.

[JamStone]

SenorSpur, I think that's a pretty fair view on it.

People are right that it's Michael Jordan so he can do whatever the hell he wants. Yes, he can be the competitor or jerk (however you want to view it) he is, and it's genuine. That's really who he is as a person.

I just think it's sad that he cannot evolve as a person, someone who matured with time to appreciate all of his achievements in a more humble way without needing to bring down people in order to demonstrate how great he was. It's just unnecessary to me. Sure, he can do whatever the hell he wants, say whatever the hell he wants, curse on stage and people will be amused because it's "Michael." He can do it, but why does he? Why does he need to be that way even now? People do change. The older you get, the more you should be appreciative and thoughtful and respectful. He's stayed in the mindset of a 16-21 year old boyIIman phase. For me, that's what caught me as sad, as pathetic. Just grow up already.

[kingmalaki]

That was a hack job of an article. Michael was being Michael. Nothing wrong with that. The people he criticized deserved criticism. It was refreshing to hear someone give a speech that was honest.

I think that's the point. Michael was being an a%%...

So the dude that beat him out for the high school team deserved to be criticized? For what exactly??

[kingmalaki]

He didn't ridicule Leroy Smith. He ridiculed his HS coach. I didn't hear one disparaging remark about Leroy Smith.

Didn't he say something along the likes of he probably has just as much game now as he did then?

[SenorSpur]

It's strange because when I saw those all those tears when he took the podium, I expected something so much different from him.

[tlongII]

But he was being honest! [/tlong]

There's a time and place for everything and clearly Jordan didn't get the memo. On the distasteful scale, it's Michael Moore territory.

For the record, I don't hate Jordan. He's the best player in the history of the game. Period.

The point of the ceremony is to reflect, appreciate, and recognize others. Jordan's 20-30 minute grudgefest clearly was something I could do without.

WTF are you talking about? The point of the ceremony is to recognize the people that are going into the Hall. There is no requirement for the inductee to act in any specific manner.

[jazzypimp]

WTF are you talking about? The point of the ceremony is to recognize the people that are going into the Hall. There is no requirement for the inductee to act in any specific manner.

Your right. Everyone is free to be an asshole! We are just stating that jordan is one. We are not stating he wasn't free to act like one. You are free to go to a wedding in your thong tlong or go to a funeral drunk. It's just in bad taste.

[tlongII]

Your right. Everyone is free to be an asshole! We are just stating that jordan is one. We are not stating he wasn't free to act like one. You are free to go to a wedding in your thong tlong or go to a funeral drunk. It's just in bad taste.

We'll agree to disagree then. I didn't think he showed bad taste at all yesterday.

[Galileo]

Jordan has always been way over-rated. I remember when the Sporting News picked him player of the year after his sophomore season. What a joke. He was not better than Ralph Sampson, Pat Ewing or Keith Lee at that time.

[MiamiHeat]

He didn't do anything wrong, lol

He was just poking fun at the people he played against, because they inspired him. he thanked them for it.

[DDS4]

It's strange because when I saw those all those tears when he took the podium, I expected something so much different from him.

2nd. He had a great chance, great forum to put a bowtie on his career.

Maybe I expected too much from him.

[DDS4]

WTF are you talking about? The point of the ceremony is to recognize the people that are going into the Hall. There is no requirement for the inductee to act in any specific manner.

Of course not. That doesn't excuse him from bullying his naysayers and getting in the last word before his induction.

He didn't do anything wrong. Didn't do anything right either.

[anonoftheinternets]

good article, spot on. But doesnt change the fact he was awesome for the game, and one of the very best to play it. The price of absolute competitiveness has to be paid and he's doing it now.

[tlongII]

Of course not. That doesn't excuse him from bullying his naysayers and getting in the last word before his induction.

He didn't do anything wrong. Didn't do anything right either.

There is nothing to excuse him for. His naysayers were dumbfucks.

[ploto]

Actually I've met MJ and he's a very nice guy.
I have met some NBA players who people think are really nice who have acted like real jerks (you'd be surprised) and I have met some who people think are real assholes who have been really nice. Can't that be true of anyone you meet?

[xtremesteven33]

I think Jordan rather go down as being seen as a arrogant, brutally honest, sincere person rather than a weak,lying two face......

The mans ego is out of this world no doubt. But man, there will NEVER be another like him.....

[Twisted_Dawg]

I love watching Jordan play in those golf tournaments and get his ass handed to himself, even though he is a good golfer.

[mingus]

who knows Jordan well enough to say it's just "Jordan being Jordan"? whether you like his speech or didn't, you can't make the call, obviously. no one on here knows him personally.

i personally believe he was just trying to be funny most of the time. i don't think he meant a lot of it.

that doesn't mean i think his speech was good. i thought it sucked. Stockton's and Robinson's blew his away, esp. Stocktons, which had the right balance of humor and biography. Robinson's was good for the same reasons more or less, but he loses points for starting to go all Christian fundamentalist at the end. Jordan's lacked any kind of balance that they had though.

[myhc]

Forget all the petty bullshit about guys he annihalted in high school he can't let go of, I thought his most distasteful comment was telling his kids in front of a national television audience that they wouldn't live up to his shoes. I guess thats just MJ being MJ!

[ORION]

He wasn't inducted into the friendship hall of fame. The dude is probably the greatest to play the game and he let everyone know what made him so. I liked it because he was honest. Basketball players talk shit. Some stop at certain times but others keep going. A 50 year Jordan is still better than Bonner.

[Stringer_Bell]

David's speech was more about a man that lived a life doing something he enjoys yet had much more to his identity than his actions on the basketball court. He's always shared that excitement and success with a team, all the ups and downs.

MJ's speech was more about "look who did better than you" and "my mom works 2 jobs." Seriously, did I hear that shit correctly? MJ's mom works two jobs when her son is the greatest basketball player in history? After the speech, I can't help but feel that the only things he can be proud of were done on the court, things he did for himself because there is an "I" in win.

MJ really did leave it all out on the court, cuz he doesn't have anything now. (not to sound overly outraged, but ya)

[mingus]

He wasn't inducted into the friendship hall of fame. The dude is probably the greatest to play the game and he let everyone know what made him so. I liked it because he was honest. Basketball players talk shit. Some stop at certain times but others keep going. A 50 year Jordan is still better than Bonner.

Jordan's corpse would be better than Bonner.

[MarHill]

who knows Jordan well enough to say it's just "Jordan being Jordan"? whether you like his speech or didn't, you can't make the call, obviously. no one on here knows him personally.

i personally believe he was just trying to be funny most of the time. i don't think he meant a lot of it.

that doesn't mean i think his speech was good. i thought it sucked. Stockton's and Robinson's blew his away, esp. Stocktons, which had the right balance of humor and biography. Robinson's was good for the same reasons more or less, but he loses points for starting to go all Christian fundamentalist at the end. Jordan's lacked any kind of balance that they had though.


What's the problem with David expressing his faith?

You don't have to agree with it....that's your call.

But if it helped him to become a better man....that's nothing wrong with him speaking about in his speech.

He hasn't been phony with his faith and he wasn't trying to convert the audience to Christianity.

If David was Muslim, Buddhist, or Hindu....you wouldn't probably made that remark in your post.

Sheesh......

[DrHouse]

The underlying theme of Jordan's speech was to explain what motivated him as a basketball player. I think it was a good way to journey through his career, but he marred it by also taking the opportunity to blast his enemies along the way. But I didn't really expect anything different from MJ, I remember exactly what he was like when he played and how he's been since retirement.

The only people who are shocked are the idiot MJ worshippers who idolized and glorified the man so they could poo poo on the accomplishments of Kobe and Lebron.

[ginobili's bald spot]

This isn't news. MJ has always been a douche bag and he always will be. He was an amazing basketball player there is no doubt about that. But this is what happens to someone when they go through life with everyone sucking them off constantly and never calling them out for their B.S.

[Culburn369]

The only people who are shocked are the idiot MJ worshippers who idolized and glorified the man so they could poo poo on the accomplishments of Kobe and Lebron.

The Dr returns in triumphant splendor!

[whottt]

Michael was still competing, long after the competition was over. That's what makes him Michael Jordan. Because he kept competing when every else was tired, or wanted to quit, or wanted to give up, he kept competing and he's still doing it. If he wasn't like that, he would not have been able to win those championships. That's what it took to do what he did...it's either heroic or petty depending on you POV.


It's funny that Jordan thinks there are mysteries to him(or anyone else does) he's about as transparent as you can be and he tries to be brutally honest.

I personally think he's very overrated as a basketball player, he's definitely a great one but he's not near the best ever IMO. And if he'd had to contend with Magic and Bird in their primes this would be hammered home. Actually it was hammered home...and it would have been in the 90's too. And he is definitely overrated in the way he is viewed and outright worshipped.


The one area however where he is not over-rated is in his comptitiveness, he is definitely one of the most competitive people to ever live on this planet. It is pretty much all there is too him.


I wouldn't want to be Michael Jordan, but if you value competitiveness above anything and everything else, I can see why you would want to be him and idolize him...competitiveness is over-rated too IMO.

With him and greatness? It's just basketball....

[Amuseddaysleeper]

The Jordan Rules really is a fantastic book.

[daslicer]

The one area however where he is not over-rated is in his comptitiveness, he is definitely one of the most competitive people to ever live on this planet. It is pretty much all there is too him.


I wouldn't want to be Michael Jordan, but if you value competitiveness above anything and everything else, I can see why you would want to be him and idolize him...competitiveness is over-rated too IMO.

With him and greatness? It's just basketball....

Agree on the sense that competitiveness is overratted once you get out of the ring its pointless. It can actually drive people away from you. I have known people with MJ's personality they all have the same traits which are they are sucessful but lonely bitter people.

[Cry Havoc]

he loses points for starting to go all Christian fundamentalist at the end.

:lmao

Oh no, he loses points! How dreadful that you, a singular anonymous person on the internet, are telling one of the top 50 players of all time that he *gasp* loses points. On his Hall of Fame inductee speech. My, I was going to say David had a good day, but "mingus" from SpursTalk docked him for his speech, so D-Rob just isn't cool now. :depressed

For you to dock him for stating what he did makes me wonder if you're a new Spurs fan, or you are too young/have done something to make you forget all about the 90s.

[Shastafarian]

:lmao

Oh no, he loses points! How dreadful that you, a singular anonymous person on the internet, are telling one of the top 50 players of all time that he *gasp* loses points. On his Hall of Fame inductee speech. My, I was going to say David had a good day, but "mingus" from SpursTalk docked him for his speech, so D-Rob just isn't cool now. :depressed

For you to dock him for stating what he did makes me wonder if you're a new Spurs fan, or you are too young/have done something to make you forget all about the 90s.

Does it hurt?

[balli]

competitiveness is over-rated too IMO.
commie

[Culburn369]

What's the problem with David expressing his faith?

You don't have to agree with it....that's your call.

But if it helped him to become a better man....that's nothing wrong with him speaking about in his speech.

He hasn't been phony with his faith and he wasn't trying to convert the audience to Christianity.

If David was Muslim, Buddhist, or Hindu....you wouldn't probably made that remark in your post.

Sheesh......

Mar/goods/precision style.

[urunobili]

Jordan shoulda, woulda, coulda. :rolleyes

let the man be himself as long as he doesn't rape anyone

:wakeup

[urunobili]

and to give some more credit to Jordan... he is more competitive than Manu and that says a lot...

[angelbelow]

This MJ bash reminds me of the Kobe bashes. Who the fuck cares. He is who he is, that is Michael Jordan.

[diego]

I read all this then saw the speech.. don't really see what the big deal is. He basically admitted that he used any motivation he could get and gave thanks. Flying out the guy from HS, if they're not still friends, was low. other than that, he was honest. being hyper-competitive is not a crime. he's probably an asshole, but that doesnt change the fact that he was the most dominant, game changing player on both ends of the court at his position, and the icon of his sport.

[mingus]

:lmao

so D-Rob just isn't cool now. :depressed.

you get an A+ for distorting my post.


For you to dock him for stating what he did makes me wonder if you're a new Spurs fan, or you are too young/have done something to make you forget all about the 90s.

i'm not sure what you gathered from my original post to make these claims.

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

MJ was an ass when he had a chance to show the world he'd grown up, Jamstone is spot on, and as usual Tlong misses the point.

Nothing changes.

:D

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

and to give some more credit to Jordan... he is more competitive than Manu and that says a lot...

That is a very interesting point. Manu is a super-competitor, but he manages not to be an arsehole human being but the exact opposite - kind, generous, and humble. MJ, OTOH, is a winner and that's all he is.

Personally, I'll take a guy who can win and be gracious about it afterwards over the GOAT.

And yes, just to reiterate, I just said I'll take Manu over Jordan... not in a basketball sense, but in the sense of a fully-formed human being. MJ still seems to be stuck at an emotional age of about 17.

[TheMACHINE]

I read all this then saw the speech.. don't really see what the big deal is. He basically admitted that he used any motivation he could get and gave thanks. Flying out the guy from HS, if they're not still friends, was low. other than that, he was honest. being hyper-competitive is not a crime. he's probably an asshole, but that doesnt change the fact that he was the most dominant, game changing player on both ends of the court at his position, and the icon of his sport.

All this is true...but yet it was still distasteful.

[carrao45]

Michael has a HUGE ego. That is one of the biggest reasons why he accomplished what he did. Actually I've met MJ and he's a very nice guy.

course u have

[carrao45]

He didn't ridicule Leroy Smith. He ridiculed his HS coach. I didn't hear one disparaging remark about Leroy Smith.

If the "You made a mistake" line wasnt insulting in your eyes, then you're retarded

[sabar]

MJ is a loser. He's like that annoying kid you knew growing up that would keep telling everyone how they beat you at something even though it happened a week ago. Except the kid is on the verge of turning 50 and proved their point decades earlier.

He is trying to stay relevant in something that he is way too old for. He was the greatest of all time, but he acts like he's prepped to step onto a court and go one-on-one with these people from so many years ago, even though he'd bust his knees.

Get over yourself. We get it. We got it a long time ago. People trash Kobe frequently, but he has definitely matured in his time in the league, unlike MJ with the heart of a 15 year old boy with a grudge.

[Kermit]

Watching that jackass give that speech made me appreciate Kobe.

Gross.

I can't believe I just typed that.

[tlongII]

MJ was an ass when he had a chance to show the world he'd grown up, Jamstone is spot on, and as usual Tlong misses the point.

Nothing changes.

:D

Hardly. It is you that is missing the point. MJ didn't need to show the world anything.

[T2150]

Jordan flew him out to prove that the story was true and that Smith actually existed and it wasn't some made up legend that maybe people doubted ever happened.

It seems that we are trying to measure MJ's speaking ability or level of humility to his once in a lifetime basketball skill and that is not fair. Just because you are the best ever at one thing doesn't mean you are going to be good at other things. I think he had a tremendous amount of pressure on him (the longer speech time allotted to him, his iconic status etc...) and anything short of a professionally written and rehearsed speech would not do him justice. His mistake was not hiring a professional writer to write this for him and then rehearse it. Big deal. It's obvious he's not the most humble person on earth nor the most gracious or for that matter even the best educated (he eluded to avoiding academics in the speech). The reality is he was born to play basketball and did so better than anyone else ever has in the history of the world. Maybe he lacked some tact or decorum but I don't think he intended to spit fire on his critics so much as to let them know that he did pay them mind and their words or slights were a motivational tool for him. He actually showed some frailty on the podium (which is something he NEVER DID AS A PLAYER) and seemed genuinely humbled to be there. For those that remember his pre-championship days the consensus was that he would never win an NBA title because of his scoring and his lack of a complete game. He not only overcame this criticism but did it many times over.

At the end of the day he's a victim of his own genius/talent. We have him perched so high up because of what he did on the hardwood that everything else he ever does in life will never be MJ-esque...

[Kermit]

Hardly. It is you that is missing the point. MJ didn't need to show the world anything.

Which is why he didn't need to act asshole-like and continue to try and prove people wrong. You are the one who will be not getting.

[Sdayi135]

Maybe MJ should have said thank you and walked off the stage.

[tlongII]

Jordan flew him out to prove that the story was true and that Smith actually existed and it wasn't some made up legend that maybe people doubted ever happened.

It seems that we are trying to measure MJ's speaking ability or level of humility to his once in a lifetime basketball skill and that is not fair. Just because you are the best ever at one thing doesn't mean you are going to be good at other things. I think he had a tremendous amount of pressure on him (the longer speech time allotted to him, his iconic status etc...) and anything short of a professionally written and rehearsed speech would not do him justice. His mistake was not hiring a professional writer to write this for him and then rehearse it. Big deal. It's obvious he's not the most humble person on earth nor the most gracious or for that matter even the best educated (he eluded to avoiding academics in the speech). The reality is he was born to play basketball and did so better than anyone else ever has in the history of the world. Maybe he lacked some tact or decorum but I don't think he intended to spit fire on his critics so much as to let them know that he did pay them mind and their words or slights were a motivational tool for him. He actually showed some frailty on the podium (which is something he NEVER DID AS A PLAYER) and seemed genuinely humbled to be there. For those that remember his pre-championship days the consensus was that he would never win an NBA title because of his scoring and his lack of a complete game. He not only overcame this criticism but did it many times over.

At the end of the day he's a victim of his own genius/talent. We have him perched so high up because of what he did on the hardwood that everything else he ever does in life will never be MJ-esque...

Excellent post.

[jazzypimp]

Excellent post.

Horrible post! I keed I keed! nice post I guess!

[ShoogarBear]

It's obvious he's not the most humble person on earth nor the most gracious or for that matter even the best educated (he eluded to avoiding academics in the speech).

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_viWbhRtuOio/Sf2-6PoGEuI/AAAAAAAABOo/8Cpal4pjwcY/s400/Irony.jpg

[Booharv]

MJ is a loser.

Actually he's a winner, one of the greatest winners ever actually. You sound like one of those parents who'll tell his untalented kids that they're winners in life because they're polite even though they suck at everything.

[tlongII]

MJ was an ass when he had a chance to show the world he'd grown up, Jamstone is spot on, and as usual Tlong misses the point.

Nothing changes.

:D

It's unfortunate that you're clueless, but what else is new?

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

Hardly. It is you that is missing the point. MJ didn't need to show the world anything.

Like MJ, you have no idea what "gracious" means, but then I don't expect it from you.

Let's see, most of the people in this thread think MJ behaved like an ass, but you're right. Please explain to me why it was a great speech. I'll now explain why it wasn't.

MJ is the greatest basketball player of all time, a winner on a level seldom seen in professional basketball or any other sport, and an incredible althlete and competitor by any measure. So, why then did he have to get up and brag like a 12yo? If a small portion of the speech, maybe 2-5 minutes, was devoted to explaining where his ultra-competitiveness came from, with a few humourous asides about those guys thrown in, I think we all would've laughed and enjoyed it. Instead, MJ spent the whole speech telling us about how he proved everyone wrong and beat down people who challenged him or weren't as good as him - it came off as crass and attention-seeking, as if he somehow needs more validation. Afterwards, it left me feeling pity for the guy - he's 46, just been inducted into the HoF, and yet he's still settling petty scores that the rest of us considered settled a decade ago. It confirmed to me that MJ, GOAT that he is, is a bitter and unhappy man, and for that I feel sorry for him. Actually, I hope he can find some peace, because from that display of childish surliness, it doesn't look like he's found any peace at all.

I'll leave it at that.

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

It's unfortunate that you're clueless, but what else is new?

How old are you again? Fuck dude, haven't you grown beyond meaningless ad hominem snipes?

:rolleyes

[024]

i always wondered why i never liked jordan as a kid. he was the greatest basketball player ever but i could never remember why i just didn't like him even when he was racking up all those championships. this reminds me why.

[NoOptionB]

Good article.

I remember trading every single one of my Jordan cards for Pippen ones. For some reason, I never liked Jordan growing up.

[ezau]

Like MJ, you have no idea what "gracious" means, but then I don't expect it from you.

Let's see, most of the people in this thread think MJ behaved like an ass, but you're right. Please explain to me why it was a great speech. I'll now explain why it wasn't.

MJ is the greatest basketball player of all time, a winner on a level seldom seen in professional basketball or any other sport, and an incredible althlete and competitor by any measure. So, why then did he have to get up and brag like a 12yo? If a small portion of the speech, maybe 2-5 minutes, was devoted to explaining where his ultra-competitiveness came from, with a few humourous asides about those guys thrown in, I think we all would've laughed and enjoyed it. Instead, MJ spent the whole speech telling us about how he proved everyone wrong and beat down people who challenged him or weren't as good as him - it came off as crass and attention-seeking, as if he somehow needs more validation. Afterwards, it left me feeling pity for the guy - he's 46, just been inducted into the HoF, and yet he's still settling petty scores that the rest of us considered settled a decade ago. It confirmed to me that MJ, GOAT that he is, is a bitter and unhappy man, and for that I feel sorry for him. Actually, I hope he can find some peace, because from that display of childish surliness, it doesn't look like he's found any peace at all.

I'll leave it at that.

Great, great post. MJ, despite his accolades seems like he's a pre-pubscent dude trying to prove himself to everybody else. Sure, basketball-wise he is great but I believe he has never been thankful for the simple things in life. The way he scoffed at his children during the ceremonies really disappointed me. Sad, sad guy.

[ezau]

The underlying theme of Jordan's speech was to explain what motivated him as a basketball player. I think it was a good way to journey through his career, but he marred it by also taking the opportunity to blast his enemies along the way. But I didn't really expect anything different from MJ, I remember exactly what he was like when he played and how he's been since retirement.

The only people who are shocked are the idiot MJ worshippers who idolized and glorified the man so they could poo poo on the accomplishments of Kobe and Lebron.

Well, well, House is back with bang!

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

http://basketbawful.blogspot.com/2009/09/hall-of-fame-speech-starring-michael.html

That says it all. Fuck, that is awesome. Spot fucking on. Y'all should read Bawful's blog regularly, it's an excellent take on the lighter side of the NBA.

Checkmate.

:lmao

[picc84]

We just witnessed what made Jordan the best player in the entire history of basketball. No one gets to his level of greatness without that kind of psychological mentality. I wouldn't want to know him personally, but watching this speech I was like "damn, so thats what made you that good".

[JamStone]

http://basketbawful.blogspot.com/2009/09/hall-of-fame-speech-starring-michael.html

That says it all. Fuck, that is awesome. Spot fucking on. Y'all should read Bawful's blog regularly, it's an excellent take on the lighter side of the NBA.

Checkmate.

:lmao

Here are the pics from that link. Pretty amusing.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3467/3920095072_5800620781_o.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3479/3920060990_254131150e_o.jpg
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2570/3919839633_dc536860f0_o.jpg

[flipcritic]

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/09/15/opinion/15brooks.html

"Today, immodesty is as ubiquitous as advertising, and for the same reasons. To scoop up just a few examples of self-indulgent expression from the past few days, there is Joe Wilson using the House floor as his own private “Crossfire”; there is Kanye West grabbing the microphone from Taylor Swift at the MTV Video Music Awards to give us his opinion that the wrong person won; there is Michael Jordan’s egomaniacal and self-indulgent Hall of Fame speech. Baseball and football games are now so routinely interrupted by self-celebration, you don’t even notice it anymore."

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

We just witnessed what made Jordan the best player in the entire history of basketball. No one gets to his level of greatness without that kind of psychological mentality. I wouldn't want to know him personally, but watching this speech I was like "damn, so thats what made you that good".

Oh really? You needed him to explain every little detail of every vendetta he's ever had to work that out?

:rolleyes

[tlongII]

Oh really? You needed him to explain every little detail of every vendetta he's ever had to work that out?

:rolleyes

:rolleyes

[picc84]

Oh really? You needed him to explain every little detail of every vendetta he's ever had to work that out?

:rolleyes

Well, I didnt really need him to but he sure did it anyway. :lol

It was a very narcissistic speech but I smiled throughout. Count me as an MJ fan.

[atxrocker]

RoFL.. who knew that the MJ hate ran so deep? Pretty amusing that people critcize his "humility" and character flaws. Hate all you want, it doesn't take anything away from him and he will always be what basketball players the world over can only dream of becoming.

[The Franchise]

This article isn't saying anything new that we were unaware of. Jordan has always been an asshole. He was just being true to his nature.

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

RoFL.. who knew that the MJ hate ran so deep? Pretty amusing that people critcize his "humility" and character flaws. Hate all you want, it doesn't take anything away from him and he will always be what basketball players the world over can only dream of becoming.

Who's hating?

As I already said, he is the GOAT, it's just a pity he decided to fling shit at everyone like a rabid monkey rather than displaying some grace like a decent human being. He displayed the emotional maturity of a 15yo, and that's pretty sad.

[Spurtacular]

MJ was a basketball player, nothing more, nothing less. Now that his career is over, so is his identity. MJ the person is certainly nothing to fawn over.

He's a top selling brand to this day. In fact, I think he's made much more money post basketball playing days.

[HarlemHeat37]

One of the most embarrassing nights in NBA history, tbh..worse than Malice at the Palace..

[Floyd Pacquiao]

Wojnarowski is easily one of the worst sportswriters I've read. He pulls stuff out of his ass all of the time...
Tlong has been giving shit takes his whole spurstalk career it seems.

[ElNono]

One of the most embarrassing nights in NBA history, tbh..worse than Malice at the Palace..

Would you rank it worse than 9/11, tbh?

[apalisoc_9]

Can't wait for someone to take the Greatest ever tittle from this douchebag.

[DMC]

Here's how Spurs crew looked at him:

http://i.imgur.com/nzYVdW4.jpg

[140]

Can't wait until kirby tries to emulate this in a few years :lol

[Thread]

Can't wait until kirby tries to emulate this in a few years :lol

So, in retirement he's gonna keep rentin' free in that gourd of your's?

[resistanze]

Tlong has been giving shit takes his whole spurstalk career it seems.

:lol

[140]

So, in retirement he's gonna keep rentin' free in that gourd of your's?

It will be a beautiful time to be alive, Cub. I sincerely hope you are still with us.

[DMC]

So, in retirement he's gonna keep rentin' free in that gourd of your's?
This is actually a very odd statement. Here you are on Spurstalk.com where you've been talking about nothing but Kobe for however many years and now that the shit comes back your way you're using the "rent free" thing? The only reason he's mentioned so often here is to get at fuckers like you who have sucked his balls dry for a decade.

So yeah, we're going to roast that coon over a spit for a couple more years for sure.

[Thread]

This is actually a very odd statement. Here you are on Spurstalk.com where you've been talking about nothing but Kobe for however many years and now that the shit comes back your way you're using the "rent free" thing? The only reason he's mentioned so often here is to get at fuckers like you who have sucked his balls dry for a decade.

So yeah, we're going to roast that coon over a spit for a couple more years for sure.

Just checkin' assholes, D.

My Kobe ledger is level.

[DMC]

Just checkin' assholes, D.

My Kobe ledger is level.

Bend over, I'll give you payment in arrears.

[SpursforSix]

Bend over, I'll give you payment in arrears.

Lol

[Thread]

Lol

Oh, yeah, just fuckin' hilarious.:rolleyes

[SpursforSix]

Oh, yeah, just fuckin' hilarious.:rolleyes

Bend over, I'll fucking make your eyes roll.

[140]

Bend over, I'll fucking make your eyes roll.

lmao

[Thread]

lmao


Look at ya,,,showin' your ass for everybody to see.:rolleyes

[140]

Look at ya,,,showin' your ass for everybody to see.:rolleyes
D and Six hit you with some funny materiel, just take it Cub

[140]

By the way, kirbs has some work to do in the second half in order to keep that 25.0 ...

[Thread]

By the way, kirbs has some work to do in the second half in order to keep that 25.0 ...

I'm keepin' an eye peeled on it. I wonder how much that 25 even can stand before it goes to 24.9?

[Thread]

D and Six hit you with some funny materiel, just take it Cub

Six for sure.

[Thread]

I'm keepin' an eye peeled on it. I wonder how much that 25 even can stand before it goes to 24.9?

25.1 lasted 3/4 of the season before it went to 25.0.

[140]

25.1 lasted 3/4 of the season before it went to 25.0.
You might be in the clear then

[Thread]

You might be in the clear then

I hope so. I wish he'd just sit down for 10 games.

[Kawhitstorm]

Can't wait until kirby tries to emulate this in a few years :lol

:lol

[DMC]

I'm keepin' an eye peeled on it. I wonder how much that 25 even can stand before it goes to 24.9?

Damn it's Somalia there in Lakersland, haggling over half a bag of UN rice.

[Thread]

Damn it's Somalia there in Lakersland, haggling over half a bag of UN rice.

This 1/2 bag is well worth the watch.