Game Thoughts: Spurs vs. Rockets - Oct. 6

[timvp]

In their first baby step to the ultimate goal, the San Antonio Spurs began the 2009-10 preseason schedule with a contest against the Houston Rockets. With Tim Duncan, Tony Parker, Michael Finley, Antonio McDyess and Theo Ratliff watching the action from the sideline, the Spurs were able to get an extended look at some of the younger prospects.


http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/4388/spursoct6.jpg

-Manu Ginobili played 14 mostly uneventful minutes in the first half. He hit a three-pointer and had a couple of vintage moves but was mostly taking it easy. Ginobili appears to be healthy and it'd be wise if he slowly worked his way back into game shape. This outing was a solid start.

-Richard Jefferson's debut wasn't very noteworthy. In 15 minutes, he didn't really stand out in any area. He applied good pressure on defense but was caught a few times overplaying his opponent. On offense, he didn't force much. He's going to be a major help but there will be a learning curve to figure out exactly how he fits.

-Leading the way in minutes (30), assists (4) and second in points (15), George Hill made a dent on the stat sheet. However, I wasn't too impressed with his play. He wasn't getting the team into its offensive sets fast enough and relied too much on the pick-and-roll. Hill needs to do a better job of breaking down the opposing defense to create scoring chances for himself and others. He had a golden opportunity to show that he's much improved from last year but this contest was nothing to write home about. He'll need to play better to keep the Spurs coaching staff from worrying about the team's point guard depth.

-Offensively, Matt Bonner helped the Spurs keep the score respectable in the first half. He shot the ball well and was particularly effective in the pick-and-pop play. Bonner appears to be confident and in good shape, which will likely be enough for him to stay in the rotation -- at least early on in the season. His post defense and rebounding were lacking but that wasn't much of a surprise.

-Ian Mahinmi started at center and fouled out in 17 minutes of play. He stats don't look very impressive (1-for-6 with three turnovers) but there were some positives to take away from his performance. Defensively, he showed promise as a help defender and was cognizant of his role on that end of the court. Offensively, Mahinmi was relatively aggressive. He still has a long ways to go before being considered for a spot in the regular season rotation but he didn't hurt his standing on the team with his play against the Rockets. Hopefully this is a foundation he can build off of for the rest of the preseason.

-Wow. DeJuan Blair had a rookie preseason premiere to remember. In only 22 minutes of action, the beastly power forward had 16 points and 19 rebounds. While it's true that a handful of his rebounds were off of his own misses (he shot 6-for-15 from the field), those numbers are difficult to ignore. It's dangerous to take too much away from this outing since he was going against the shortest team in the NBA and the Spurs were giving him the ball a lot more than they will with a healthy roster, but it's definitely safe to be excited. He already looks like an elite rebounder with huge hands and a bruising frame that can score around the bucket. He has to do a much better job defending the rim and sprinting back on defense -- but 19 and 16 in 22 minutes speaks for itself.

-The Spurs imported Marcus Haislip from Europe this summer and his first preseason game was forgettable. Defensively, he got abused by the Rockets post players. He didn't do a good job on the boards and his athleticism was nullified by the strength of Houston's bigmen. On the other end, Haislip showed some promise in terms of being a willing shooting and having the ability to put the ball on the floor. That said, he was loose with his dribble, had trouble finishing even if he got a step on the defender and his jumper looks flat and a bit awkward. He needs a lot of work if he's going to help.

-In his first few stints on the court, Malik Hairston played well. His defense was on point and he used his body well on the offensive end. Unfortunately, he played much worse as the game wore on. He started trying to do too much on both ends and it was a train wreck. All in all, Hairston still needs to prove that he can shoot against NBA defenders and show enough ballhandling skills to play out on the perimeter. He has good tools but he still has a ways to go to put it all together.

-Curtis Jerrells played a lot of shooting guard in college. Against the Rockets, that fact was obvious. Playing as the backup point guard behind Hill, he didn't seem to have much playmaking ability and the offense grinded to a halt when he was in the game. He seems comfortable shooting off of pick-and-rolls but he'll need to show more than that to have a legit shot of sticking on the roster. Jerrells gave good effort on defense but wasn't too effective.

-Marcus Williams didn't play too well (1-for-6 with two turnovers) but he illustrated some of the skills that impressed scouts last year when he was with the Austin Toros. His ballhandling in the open court is good, he's a deceptively crafty passer on the move and his body control in the air is at an NBA level. That said, Williams isn't very athletic and everything about him is slow -- from his shooting mechanics to his lateral movement. At the moment, he's an interesting prospect but he faces an uphill climb to make the team.

-Dwayne Jones grabbed a couple of contested boards but rebounding is about the limit of his value. He's not an offensive threat -- and that's putting it nicely. Honestly, if he catches the ball, that's a plus. To make the NBA, he'll need to become a better defender and learn to finish in traffic.

-Keith Bogans was invisible in his 16 minutes of work. He didn't get to show off his defensive skills and his play on offense consisted of him missing three shots. Hopefully he gets a few long runs during the exhibition season so the Spurs can figure out exactly what they have.

-Roger Mason, Jr. was another returning player who was going through the motions. The good news is that he looks like he's in better shape than last year. Let's hope that translates to better defense and better finishing ability at the hoop.

[TDMVPDPOY]

good read

hey about blairs offensive rebounds, how many of them came from his missed shots or from other spurs players missed shots?

[completely deck]

good read

hey about blairs offensive rebounds, how many of them came from his missed shots or from other spurs players missed shots?

You read that in a minute?

[jason1301]

Thanks!

[Bulwark]

As always, thanks for the Game THoughts. I look forward to continuing to read them through out this season.

[HarlemHeat37]

Haislip looked like Anthony Tolliver with a better handle and worse defense..he also looks awkward in the post on both ends of the floor IMO..

I don't think it would be a stretch to think that Bogans will have to actually prove himself if he wants a spot on the team..

[YODA]

[

What I like most about his articles are some of his tidbits, like how the rockets like are the smallest team. Little things like that this the common person might not know. Really gives you a better feeliing of dejuan blair's play. However, Like he said,,,its still impressive.

[duncan228]

Thanks. Always appreciate the time and effort, but even more so when I don't see the game. Thanks for the details.

[Spursmania]

Thanks timvp-always appreciated...:tu

[Solid D]

I would think Pop will be emphasizing transition D in practice tomorrow. Houston scored quickly too many times.

[completely deck]

That was a good read, timvp. Next stop, Olympiakos

[Spursmania]

I would think Pop will be emphasizing transition D in practice tomorrow. Houston scored quickly too many times.

Way too many times. It was pretty bad. They definitely looked lost on the transition D. They gave up many easy baskets.

[urunobili]

thanks timvp :tu

[chode_regulator]

Good writeup...thanks
Quick question only because I'm too lazy to look it up. Was the Rockets team that started and/or played most of the game the same way lineup wise? I would assume so.

[ulosturedge]

Hmmm, I thought George played really good. He is playing with a lot more confidence. Yeah he didn't setup his teammates a lot, but he is in the same mold of Parker. I see Pop putting him next to Manu and actually letting Manu play the point and letting them trade off the PG duties.

I was completely disappointed with Ian. He will be a project all year if he is still on the team. Granted he hasn't played in over a year, but i'm just not seeing a hint of anything that makes me think he is ready for the NBA. Maybe I was looking for him to be more assertive on offense. He looked very awkward on offense.

Haslip looks like he is confident enough in his offensive game which is good to see. He still needs to handle the ball better off the dribble and on the inlet pass. On defense he is lacking for sure. He keeps up with his opponent fairly well, but does nothing once the shot is going up. He reacts a bit slow as the shot goes up and lacks the assertiveness on defense.

Malik looked good pretty much til the end of the game. I don't think his last few blunders with handling the ball down the stretch was a deal breaker by any means though. I like to see him being aggressive out there. He is handling the ball alot better then last year and he will continue to improve.

Marcus Williams looked alot more calm and collected, but his game is too soft in my opinion. His slender physique doesn't seem to serve him well out there. Not really quick enough to keep up with the point guards and not really strong enough to bang around with small forwards. That slow shot release isn't really helping him either.

Dejuan Blair is as advertised. He is a rebounding machine. He shines whenever he is under the rim. His offensive game should come around nicely. He is quite the energy guy. Think Malik Rose 2.0, but as a rookie. His game still has a lot more room to grow. His defense still needs work, but he more then meets expectations as a 1st year player.


Thats my take on the young guns anyways.

[tlongII]

The Spurs don't appear to have much quality depth in my opinion.

[completely deck]

The Spurs don't appear to have much quality depth in my opinion.

Weak attempt at a troll. Do not pass go, do not collect $200

[DPG21920]

I find it odd that you and Pop have starkly contrasting views on Hill's game tonight. Pop said that Hill was his favorite player tonight and you thought his play could warrant serious concern. Why is that?

[phyzik]

And let the Timvp cock slobbering begin! :lol
















Good Read! :rollin

[ChumpDumper]

I didn't watch the game.

[timvp]

hey about blairs offensive rebounds, how many of them came from his missed shots or from other spurs players missed shots?I'd guess that half of his eight offensive boards were from his own misses.


Haislip looked like Anthony Tolliver with a better handle and worse defenseSo far, that's pretty true.


I find it odd that you and Pop have starkly contrasting views on Hill's game tonight. Pop said that Hill was his favorite player tonight and you thought his play could warrant serious concern. Why is that?Eh, I think Pop is just trying to make Hill more confident. He used the same tactic with others including Rasho and Elson. Those two were also Pop "favorite player" during preseason.

Hill wasn't horrible but I can't believe that this is the type of play Pop wants from him. If it weren't for a few bailout threes and some trash stats late, his line would have been pretty ugly.

[tlongII]

No I didn't. The channel was blacked out here. I'm basing my opinion solely on the box score.

[wildbill2u]

I was able to see most of the 2nd half--unfortunately. The Houston announcers never identify--and I mean never--the names of opposing players, even when they score or foul, so my personal hopes (Haislip) and biases (Mahimi) weren't given any rein.

What I saw was Spurs lineup without any team play or willingness to give up the ball. As a result, the offense stagnated into a "one pass to me and I'll go one on one no matter what" affair.

I realize these young players have to shine while they get the chance, but more often than not their inividual play resulted in a forces error or really bad shot. Hairston took one jumper late in the game that was described by a laughing announcer as a "15 foor shot with a 20 foot arc." It was pathetic.

For some it was their first NBA game and maybe they can be forgiven for some nervousness, but down the stretch I didn't see anyone who can really help us. Let's hope they show better next game.

[Danny.Zhu]

Thanks timvp.

[ChumpDumper]

No I didn't.:lol

[Spursmania]

The Spurs don't appear to have much quality depth in my opinion.

:lmao Please stop...

[rayray2k8]

We should have drafted Durant instead. :depressed

[tlongII]

You guys got waxed at home by a bad team. That indicates a lack of quality depth.

[urunobili]

It sucks learning that with the Spurs making these moves we stand no chance in the west.

:wakeup

[NASpurs]

You guys got waxed at home by a bad team. That indicates a lack of quality depth.

You sure do like to bait people don't you? I guess that's how you get your kicks from your asinine comments.

[ChumpDumper]

You guys got waxed at home by a bad team. That indicates a lack of quality depth.Nah, bench players did all the scoring and rebounding.

Good quality depth.

And it's preseason. I guess blazerfan take preseason much more seriously because -- well -- blazerfan is kind of stupid.

[mazerrackham]

You guys got waxed at home by a bad team. That indicates a lack of quality depth.

Guess you don't understand what preseason's about, huh. Our second stringers played against the rocket's first strings a lot, and our third stringers against their second stringers. Line ups were thrown out there and plays weren't being called, it's not like the Spurs were trying to win, they want to see the individual players.

[crc21209]

The Spurs don't appear to have much quality depth in my opinion.

And so the trolling begins....after the 1st pre-season game! :lmao

[#2!]

And so the trolling begins....after the 1st pre-season game! :lmao

actually lakaluva trolled the game forum.

:toastwelcome to the season everyone

[bbarry]

wow can tlongii be anymore more of a moron? he said he just watched the boxscore, but perhaps he needs glasses, or better yet go back to the 1st grade to learn how to read, because, apparently, he did not see a big fat DNP next to 4 or 5 of our main rotation players.

[koriwhat]

holy shit! that's all i got for dj blair.

the guy looked like he belonged here in the NBA more so than all of the scola threads + scola included! dude was far from a beast... he was the nightmare the beast dreams of. the dude just wouldn't let up. he was relentless on the glass, away from the glass, and he also dove! that huge motherfucker dove! are you understanding any of this? dj blair is a phenomenal talent!

marcus williams should hang it up already because malik thus far has solidified the roster's 15 man count. no room for me-first attitudes on this ball club.

hill looked great and then at times he was just trying...to hard.

ian, what can i say? i mean the dude looks great as a player if you never see what he does on the court. he was all over the place and never really got "into it" for more than a few seconds. he got called for all sorts of things.

jefferson, looked alright with the occasional blips from shakin' off the rust. ginobili the same except his presence could definitely be felt in that arena.

bonner was unbelievable from the arc. he wouldn't miss a shot! those 3's were just flowing like water and just as fluid until of course, the buzzer sounded. he still did manageable but man was he on when he needn't be(so much so).

td, md, & tr were all in drag... i mean dressed in fine linen made of baby seals in the north. actually, i think they were wearing just some regular ass shit. button ups.

pop was pop. just playing pop like pop should be playing pop. same ol' pop.

the rest i can't remember. sorry.

[Libri]

holy shit! that's all i got for dj blair.

the guy looked like he belonged here in the NBA more so than all of the scola threads + scola included! dude was far from a beast... he was the nightmare the beast dreams of. the dude just wouldn't let up. he was relentless on the glass, away from the glass, and he also dove! that huge motherfucker dove! are you understanding any of this? dj blair is a phenomenal talent!

marcus williams should hang it up already because malik thus far has solidified the roster's 15 man count. no room for me-first attitudes on this ball club.

hill looked great and then at times he was just trying...to hard.

ian, what can i say? i mean the dude looks great as a player if you never see what he does on the court. he was all over the place and never really "into it" for more than a few seconds. he got called for all sorts of things.

jefferson, looked alright with the occasional blips from shakin' off the rust. ginobili the same except his presence could definitely be felt in that arena.

bonner was unbelievable from the arc. he wouldn't miss a shot! those 3's were just flowing like water and just as fluid until of course, the buzzer sounded. he still did manageable but man was he on when he needn't be(so much so).

td, md, & tr were all in drag... i mean dressed in fine linen made of baby seals in the north. actually, i think they were wearing just some regular ass shit. button ups.

pop was pop. just playing pop like pop should be playing pop. same ol' pop.

the rest i can't remember. sorry.

I agree that Blair had an impressive game. Some may find Blair's case ironic and think that a player who had an injury in the past would shy away from contact but Blair doesn't do that. It seems that he looks for contact and thrives under that type of play.

[koriwhat]

It seems that he looks for contact and thrives under that type of play.

blair most certainly does!

[Chieflion]

I saw Blair's stat line and thought it was ridiculous. No way a rookie does that. But damn, he needs to look for easier shots if the shots don't fall.

[AnthonyM]

I'd guess that half of his eight offensive boards were from his own misses.


He must have done it on purpose to pad his stats.

[DMX7]

The Spurs don't appear to have much quality depth in my opinion.

Are you retarded? Ginobili, Antonio, Blair, Finley, Hill...?

[Rogue]

You read that in a minute?
Foreigners read faster than us. At least for the dude you quoted, having read it doesn't make any difference than otherwise. :wakeup

[whottt]

I'll just say that Mahinmi has got to be rusty due to all the time he's missed the past couple of years...that's probably the #1 thing with him so hopefully he'll get lots of minutes in the pre-season.

[Trainwreck2100]

I'll just say that Mahinmi has got to be rusty due to all the time he's missed the past couple of years...that's probably the #1 thing with him so hopefully he'll get lots of minutes in the pre-season.

that or he's a chinadoll bust

[angelbelow]

Are you retarded? Ginobili, Antonio, Blair, Finley, Hill...?

Im pretty certain he is retarded.

[Bruno]

Thanks for the recap.

It looks like it was a quite bad game for most of the players (except Blair). It's a quite disappointing start for the preseason.

[quentin_compson]

-Ian Mahinmi started at center and fouled out in 17 minutes of play. He stats don't look very impressive (1-for-6 with three turnovers) but there were some positives to take away from his performance. Defensively, he showed promise as a help defender and was cognizant of his role on that end of the court. Offensively, Mahinmi was relatively aggressive. He still has a long ways to go before being considered for a spot in the regular season rotation but he didn't hurt his standing on the team with his play against the Rockets. Hopefully this is a foundation he can build off of for the rest of the preseason.


I didn't get to watch the game, so I am glad to hear (or read) that, because his stats are certainly nothing to write home about. Hopefully, he'll get a lot of playing time in the pre-season to get comfortable. I still refuse to call him a bust, however.

Blair looked very impressive in the video recap. He'll probably get abused by a lot of bigs in the NBA, but his rebounding and his offensive skills should help him get his playing time.

[ceperez]

Bad game. Stagnant and uncoordinated offense, just plain bad defense.

Only 5 positive points. Blair is a complete menace in offense. Bonner has come prepared. Hill shoots a pretty good percentage. Mahinmi can be a defensive presence when he puts his mind to it. Hairston shows he got the strength to take it to the hoop.

Negative points.

(1) Hill just can't handle the ball like a pg.
(2) Blair is suspect in defense.
(3) Mahinmi can't drive hard to the hoop.
(4) Haislip needs to improve his long range shot. Needs to protect the ball better while dribbling. Absolutely can't defend anyone in the post.
(5) Bogans completely disappeared.
(6) Williams had a really bad game. Although to be fair, he had the highest +/- among all the players.

For the rest, Manu, Jefferson, Mason... they could have done better, but I think they don't need to prove anything.

Conclusion, Bogans so far hasn't shown absolutely anything for 2 games. I definitely don't think Hairston should be booted out to make space for him.

[polandprzem]

THX LJ


And it's a shame. Pop blew this one leaving Tim and Tony on the bench - with that kind of attitude spurs will be having troubles advancing to the regular season.










Ps. Same thing every year ...

[Spurs Brazil]

thanks timvp
My internet wasn't working yesterday and I couldn't see or listen to the game

[antimvp]

with timmy and antonio inside and parker getting so much attention all of these players will look about 100% better when they are in the games.

[Ocotillo]

How come Parker's name is not in the box score, even as a DNP-CD?

[completely deck]

How come Parker's name is not in the box score, even as a DNP-CD?

You can only have a certain amount of players that are "active" (able to play).

[raspsa]

First of all, I'm just glad everyone is healthy. No injuries w/c is priority No.1. Its just the 1st game and we'll see how individual players progress/regress as each game unfolds. No reason to be disappointed at this point in any individual player.. will wait to see their entire training camp performance before passing judgement.

[bigfan]

My annual "thanks for the excellent writeup, TIMVP!" post.

[jman3000]

Jesus. 19 Rebounds in 22 minutes is good for just shooting around a gym by yourself.

Granted it's just pre-season, but with his history of being a beast on the boards, this is a really positive sign of it translating.

[hater]

WTF?? did the rockets play with midgets or something?

[celldweller]

And let the Timvp cock slobbering begin! :lol












Good Read! :rollin

:lmao

[DPG21920]

Timvp, I have been thinking about this:


-In his first few stints on the court, Malik Hairston played well. His defense was on point and he used his body well on the offensive end. Unfortunately, he played much worse as the game wore on. He started trying to do too much on both ends and it was a train wreck. All in all, Hairston still needs to prove that he can shoot against NBA defenders and show enough ballhandling skills to play out on the perimeter. He has good tools but he still has a ways to go to put it all together.

It seems like you are expecting a lot from Malik. Sure, he could improve his ball handling an play making skills on the perimeter, but he is a league minimum type guy. Mason cannot defend very well or make plays on the perimeter, yet he has carved out a spot. Bonner has trouble defending (though not as bad as he seems) and he has a nice niche.

With how good Malik can defend, finish around the rim and now seemingly hit 3's, I don't see why you seem to think he is that far off.

[benefactor]

Tim Varner pretty much summed up my thoughts in his blog.

People who were disappointed with this game need to take a deep breath. There were 13 players who played for the Spurs last night. Out of those players, only 4 spent any meaningful time in a Spurs uniform last season...and out of those 4 only one played more than 18 minutes in last nights game. So the fact that is was sloppy is easily justified by the lack of knowledge within the majority of the team. Knowledge of the offense...knowledge of the defense...knowledge of each other. Even with a player like Haislip who got abused on defense, you really can't knock the guy that much. Heck, if Blair wasn't such a gifted rebounder(the rest of his game is pretty raw) he would have probably had the same type of game as the rest of the newbies.

There are a couple of players that don't get as much of a free pass. Namely Hairston, Mahinmi and Williams. Of the three, Hairston looked the most ready. He still has to learn to understand his limitations and play within the system, but I think that will come when he plays more with the vets. TBQH, I think he was forcing it so much last night because he was the most experienced of the new players and he probably felt like he needed to make something happen to get the team back in the game. He'll be fine as he learns his role more within the offense.

The jury is still out with Ian. BLACKJACK21 made some excellent observations regarding him in the game blog:


Now, he might not be the most intelligent ball-player or have the game come to him real instinctually, but there's definitely reason to be optimistic. The guy needs court-time, and a whole lot of it, because of the amount of time he's missed. He's got to find some kind of rhythm and comfort within his teammates and the offense so that he can just let his natural gifts shine.

It's like Coach Newman said, he's just got to understand that he only needs to be able to hit the boards, block/altar shots, be a presence, and be able to use all that length and athleticism he's been blessed with. They don't need him to be some offensive All-Star to warrant a spot in the rotation, just a guy that brings energy and a presence out there on both ends of the court.

Mahinmi is a lot like Bonner...in that he sometimes overdoes things and does unnecessary things that make him look like a bonehead. Once Bonner figured out all he had to do was let it fly when he was open he was fine. Mahinmi needs to take this same approach with his game. He needs to play good help defense(which he did last night), get on the boards and take the offense that is given to him. If he settles down and does these things he will find a spot in the rotation.

Marcus Williams....I stand by what I said in another thread...he is just not an NBA player. He has some good traits but his lack of athleticism for his size just kills him. The fact that he can't do one thing really well hurts him with this team...as the Spurs like thier bench players to specialize in something. Combine that with him not being strong enough to defend players his same size and the cards are stacked pretty high against him.

Hopefully Pop stresses defense in practice these next few days and the new guys start to show some continuity. Sure is good to see some Spurs basketball...even if it wasn't quite Spurs basketball. :)

[Brazil]

thanks timvp
My internet wasn't working yesterday and I couldn't see or listen to the game

:toast I think it was the case for the whole São Paulo state, I followed the game through the game blog on my black berry. I have to confess I was pretty pissed about that.

oh and :lmao at everybody giving an opinion without having looking the game. special word for tlongII that has a professional opinion of spurs quality deph by just analyzing a box score. Props to him ! better than Hollinger.

[I. Hustle]

I don't think y'all want my thoughts from the game. I was drunk and belligerent.

[timvp]

It seems like you are expecting a lot from Malik. Sure, he could improve his ball handling an play making skills on the perimeter, but he is a league minimum type guy. Mason cannot defend very well or make plays on the perimeter, yet he has carved out a spot. Bonner has trouble defending (though not as bad as he seems) and he has a nice niche.

With how good Malik can defend, finish around the rim and now seemingly hit 3's, I don't see why you seem to think he is that far off.

I don't think Hairston is far away from making it but his flaws right now are fatal flaws. He played PF in college and right now he doesn't handle the ball well enough to play guard in the NBA. He'll need to become a better ballhandler to make it.

Shooting is another area that Hairston needs to prove himself. He doesn't jump much on his shot and he's relatively short so it's not a guarantee that he'll be able to get his shot off on the NBA level. There are plenty of players who can shoot well at lower levels who can't get clean looks in the NBA (Tolliver and McClinton are two recent examples).

Mason and Bonner have flaws but they aren't fatal flaws. Plus they have a strength (shooting) that is elite. Hairston has strengths but none of them are elite at this point.

I have hope for Hairston but he's definitely a work in progress. Right now, if I had to guess, I'd say he doesn't make the team. Thankfully for him, there are plenty of preseason games for him to show the Spurs that he needs to be kept.

[rjv]

pop seemed to think the exact opposite of hill, as he went out of his way too indicate how impressive he has been.

[DPG21920]

I just think that Hairston's defense is at an extremely high level. He seems to be a good scorer, but I guess we won't know until we see him against NBA talent. I have seen him, when he was getting minutes with the Spurs, lock guys up defensively and get to the rim and finish, but his 3 point shooting is the real question mark.

[SenorSpur]

Mahinmi is a lot like Bonner...in that he sometimes overdoes things and does unnecessary things that make him look like a bonehead. Once Bonner figured out all he had to do was let it fly when he was open he was fine. Mahinmi needs to take this same approach with his game. He needs to play good help defense(which he did last night), get on the boards and take the offense that is given to him. If he settles down and does these things he will find a spot in the rotation.

I know the pressure is on Ian to demonstrate to the Spurs that he's worth them picking up his 4th year option, by 10/31. He may have a good game here and there, but inconsistency is the hallmark of most young players and this kid is truly STILL learning the game on the fly.

That said, it's quite possible that the Spurs may have a definitive answer by then.

It's too bad Ian missed all of last year. That lost time really set back his development.

[intlspurshk]

2nd unit should include Hairston, Hill, Blair, Manu and a tall centre
Bonner, Halslip, Mason should be packaged to trade for a defensive tall centre or wing (Does Orlando have a surplus backup centre?)
William should be cut and make room for a pass first PG (who will definitely take the 2nd unit to a higher level)
Cook or Chase Budinger should be in SPURS team to be the 3pt shooting big man (daydreaming though)
RJ contribution is not as good as expected but this is the 1st preseason game

[Agloco]

WTF?? did the rockets play with midgets or something?

Bah....he's long, you know that. But yeah, they are the shortest team in the league now.

[DaDakota]

Blair reminded me of a young smaller Moses Malone, tip, tip, tip......and aggressively go and get the ball.

If his knees hold up he is going to beast for you guys.

DD

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

Awesome recap Timvp!!

This game was eerily similar to the one played on October 6th!

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

Thanks for the notes, timvp. :tu


The Spurs don't appear to have much quality depth in my opinion.


No I didn't. The channel was blacked out here. I'm basing my opinion solely on the box score.

You must be some judge of talent to be able to tell that one game into the preseason from a boxscore!

You continue to prove yourself the most ignorant poster in the forum.

:lmao

[timvp]

This game was eerily similar to the one played on October 6th!

:lol Good point.

[Blackjack]

I don't think Hairston is far away from making it but his flaws right now are fatal flaws. He played PF in college and right now he doesn't handle the ball well enough to play guard in the NBA. He'll need to become a better ballhandler to make it.

Shooting is another area that Hairston needs to prove himself. He doesn't jump much on his shot and he's relatively short so it's not a guarantee that he'll be able to get his shot off on the NBA level. There are plenty of players who can shoot well at lower levels who can't get clean looks in the NBA (Tolliver and McClinton are two recent examples).

I don't think you're way out of the ballpark in your analysis of Hairston, but I think you're a bit off the mark in the conclusion you come to; especially in terms of 'fatal flaws.'

Hairston has always been pretty good hitting the seams and going from point-A to point-B off the dribble when the opportunity presents itself, but he gets into trouble when the destination isn't predetermined or he's forced to improvise off the dribble.

His shot is pretty much the same way, in that, if he's got his feet set and in position to shoot the ball, say like Bowen made a living off of, he's actually been pretty good and looks to have even improved upon from what I've seen. I think you're getting a little too caught up in the scouting aspect of a talent and not as much as how he'll look playing alongside the A-team. -- The Big 4 and co., not B. A. Baracus. :hat --

Malik wouldn't be coming in here to play the 2 as much as he would be to defend 2's and 3's. More of a Bowen role than shooting-guard. His offensive game only needs to consist of playing off the Big 4; corner 3's, dive-cuts/movement off the ball, hitting the boards, and attacking the basket while the defense is on their heals and looking to recover after doubles and/or penetration.

Like you, I'm not certain Hairston makes the team. But that's not an indictment on Hairston as much as it is a preference I've picked up on from Pop and the crew.


There are a couple of players that don't get as much of a free pass. Namely Hairston, Mahinmi and Williams. Of the three, Hairston looked the most ready. He still has to learn to understand his limitations and play within the system, but I think that will come when he plays more with the vets. TBQH, I think he was forcing it so much last night because he was the most experienced of the new players and he probably felt like he needed to make something happen to get the team back in the game. He'll be fine as he learns his role more within the offense.


I had the same impression and reading this particular comment of yours had me wishing I would have actually prefaced my Game Thoughts comments to provide a better context.

Not unlike Pop and the staff are for the first couple of presesaon games, I'm more in the evaluation/scouting-mode. For instance:

Watching Haislip and Hairston, ball-handling was a glaring weakness that both would need to considerably improve upon. And in doing so, their ability to create for themselves and others would allow them to become quality, well-rounded offensive players.

That's simply scouting a particular aspect, ball-handling, of both Hairston and Haislip and coming to a conclusion on what they need to do to improve individually, though.

But in terms of how detrimental their ball-handling would be in relation to the role and players they'd be playing with, the flaw in considerably lessened. After all, periphery players don't garner the type of attention that would force them to have to create or make a lot of decisions. They'd simply be asked to finish. And if you've already got a defense on it's heals, a suspect handle all of a sudden becomes an adequate and effective one.

That's just one example of one certain aspect, and I could do it with every newcomer looking to contribute this year, but it's the context I take in approaching the evaluation process.

It's the difference between a team's finished product and an individual player or player's.

[timvp]

Hairston has always been pretty good hitting the seams and going from point-A to point-B off the dribble when the opportunity presents itself, but he gets into trouble when the destination isn't predetermined or he's forced to improvise off the dribble.

Your right in that Hairston has a good power dribble when he's going in a straight line to the basket. But we've seen last year, in summer league and in this first preseason game that he has a pretty substantially hard time controlling the ball in traffic. His ball security in traffic is poor -- which especially hurts because he's best offensively when he's in the lane.

He also doesn't dribble it very well when coming up the court. Defenders can easily make him turn his back on the action. Even though I think Hairston is better than Williams, Williams looks like Magic Johnson when you compare their open court ballhandling.

The good news is that poor ballhandling is correctable. Bowen, for example, went from a horrible ballhandler to an adequate ballhandler by working at it.


His shot is pretty much the same way, in that, if he's got his feet set and in position to shoot the ball, say like Bowen made a living off of, he's actually been pretty good and looks to have even improved upon from what I've seen.

When he's open, has his feet set and has time to release his shot, Hairston looks really good. From long twos to three-pointers, he's accurate in with those circumstances.

But while you get those types of looks in D-League and summer league, those types of looks are few and far between in the NBA. 95% of the time a player is going to be defended or at least have a defender rotating to him -- even in the Spurs' system. With an NBA athlete closing out on his shot, that's a big difference than any level of competition he has faced.

That's why I want to see Hairston knock down some outside shots on the NBA level. He has proven to be a good shooter when open or going against lesser athletes. But given his lack of elevation, lack of height and his relatively slow release, he'll probably have to make an adjustment.

For the record, I like Hairston as a prospect. He's a bulldog defender in one-on-one matchups -- especially on the low block. He's deceptively a pretty damn good athlete, a willing rebounder, unselfish and plays a physical style of basketball. I really do hope that he can prove that he's improved enough to keep him around.

[Darkwaters]

BLACKJACK makes a good point. The team concept allows an individual player's personal weaknesses to be masked by other players or the system itself. While a player might not be able to do everything well it's only a serious problem if the team is going to ask him to. Clearly a team wants everybody to be well-rounded and capable of doing everything. But it's just not always realistic. Thats why we have specialists.

[benefactor]

If Keith Bogans can spend 6 years on NBA rosters, then Hairston should have a pretty good shot.

[Blackjack]

Your right in that Hairston has a good power dribble when he's going in a straight line to the basket. But we've seen last year, in summer league and in this first preseason game that he has a pretty substantially hard time controlling the ball in traffic. His ball security in traffic is poor -- which especially hurts because he's best offensively when he's in the lane.

I see where you're coming from and am cognizant of that particular flaw, but I think the role and circumstance in which it becomes a detriment would be considerably diminished playing with the Spurs.

Playing with the Toros or lower-level players, he's looked at as the star of the team; something that isn't lost on him. So with that in mind, he approaches the game accordingly. He's thinking to make more plays, take more chances, and carry a burden that he'd never be asked to carry at the next level; at least not in the immediate future. The traffic in which he operates in and attempts to penetrate, is nowhere near the quality at the next level and can leave someone like him taking on some bad habits. Naturally, what he can get away with at a lower level doesn't translate at the NBA level. And the mindset he acquired having to do a little more than he'd be asked to do for the Spurs, is something that would surely change given time to play with the big boys.


He also doesn't dribble it very well when coming up the court. Defenders can easily make him turn his back on the action. Even though I think Hairston is better than Williams, Williams looks like Magic Johnson when you compare their open court ballhandling.

The good news is that poor ballhandling is correctable. Bowen, for example, went from a horrible ballhandler to an adequate ballhandler by working at it.

See, I actually think he's as good or better a ballhandler than Bowen. The difference, at least in my eyes, is the acknowledgement of limitation that only comes through experience; a la Bowen.



When he's open, has his feet set and has time to release his shot, Hairston looks really good. From long twos to three-pointers, he's accurate in with those circumstances.

But while you get those types of looks in D-League and summer league, those types of looks are few and far between in the NBA. 95% of the time a player is going to be defended or at least have a defender rotating to him -- even in the Spurs' system. With an NBA athlete closing out on his shot, that's a big difference than any level of competition he has faced.

That's why I want to see Hairston knock down some outside shots on the NBA level. He has proven to be a good shooter when open or going against lesser athletes. But given his lack of elevation, lack of height and his relatively slow release, he'll probably have to make an adjustment.

For the record, I like Hairston as a prospect. He's a bulldog defender in one-on-one matchups -- especially on the low block. He's deceptively a pretty damn good athlete, a willing rebounder, unselfish and plays a physical style of basketball. I really do hope that he can prove that he's improved enough to keep him around.

Judging by the majority of your takes, in terms of scouting Hairston, there's actually more we agree on than not.

I think the biggest difference is in how we interpret it, and how we view it will translate at the NBA level with the Spurs.

It's just my belief that his type of size and release has seen plenty of success in the league, in terms of role-players, and wouldn't be the detriment you view it to be. A guy like Ellie immediately comes to mind; not saying Malik is the proven shooter at this point, but I'd venture to say his release is quicker and he brings a mental and physical-toughness that would put a smile on the ol' Junkyard Dog's face.

I'm obviously a big fan and a charter member of the C.O.H., but I'm not completely in the tank..:hat

He just has the potential to bring so many positive, lacking attributes on the Spurs' perimeter that no one else on the roster, or in the fold, seems to offer.

[ClingingMars]

You guys got waxed at home by a bad team. That indicates a lack of quality depth.

lol preseason, troll harder plz

[DaBears]

So is it my understanding that the Spurs currently have fourteen players under contract w/ one of them still undecided by the coaching staff of the spurs...

I think the houston game as well as the next 2-3 games will be the determining factor between Hairston, Jerrels... I hope Hairston gets the node by the coaching staff. he's a hell of an athlete.... Watched him during the open practice and the game one(preseason)... hairston seems like a good young talented fit for the spurs thats why i think they havent drop him from the rosters......Jerrels i think is not going to make hte cut becuase as POP has stated Hill is is favorite player i camp and has shown great improvement from last season.... So a backup point guard is not a priority anymore.... Others can take the PG spot if hill and or TP gets hurt.....