Harvey: Spurs see what a lab can never replicate

[duncan228]

Spurs see what a lab can never replicate (http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/spurs/Spurs_see_what_a_lab_can_never_replicate.html)
Buck Harvey

One of the coaches stood in the locker room late Tuesday night, marveling about DeJuan Blair. Then he paused and changed direction.

“I love Ian Mahinmi,” he said, “but ...”

The coach roots for Mahinmi, as does everyone in the Spurs organization. Mahinmi has done everything the Spurs have asked.

Still, on this night, the coach couldn't help but see the contrast. Blair turned 20 in April, and this is the first time he's ever lived more than a block from home.

And yet: He showed more basketball instincts in his first NBA game than Mahinmi had in four years.

It's October, and there are no guarantees Blair will be getting minutes in November. Still, his undeniable skill was on display. Blair had 19 rebounds in the first 22 minutes of his pro life, and this is something that works in any arena in any city.

Asked about his rebounding philosophy, Blair smiled. “I just go get it,” he said. “And if I don't get it, I'll get it the next time.”

He was the same his two years at Pitt before falling to the Spurs in the draft. But it wasn't just his knees that worried scouts. He's no taller than Manu Ginobili, and, further adding to the confusing package, he can't jump as Charles Barkley once did as a small-sized rebounder.

So Blair is a round mound stuck on the ground, and Mahinmi is the opposite. He has the classic NBA frame. The Spurs drafted him because of this, and because a slice of video once teased what was possible. Then, in France, he slammed with the force of Amare Stoudemire.

Given that, the Spurs tutored him overseas, and they drilled him in Austin. They waited for the bad-luck injuries to heal, hoping the game had sunk in. But they knew he was always going to be, at best, a manufactured player built in a lab. He would never be a natural, as Blair is.

Tuesday showed all of that. Then, Mahinmi wasn't sure where to take his next step. Blair subbed in the first quarter for, coincidentally, Mahinmi, and immediately looked like he belonged. Nearly as stunning as his 19 rebounds was his one foul while banging into various Rockets.

Mahinmi, meanwhile, fouled out in 17 minutes.

Blair showed a Dennis Rodman sense of backboard geometry. Asked if he ever observed Rodman to see how he did it, Blair shook his head.

“Nah,” Blair joked. “I was watching Michael Jordan.”

He comes across as a nice kid. He admits he's still growing up and that moving away from Pittsburgh is part of that. He wants to stay humble, and Gregg Popovich has seen that.

“He takes no quarter from anybody, as far as playing with his teammates, but still is respectful, at the same time,” Popovich said. “He doesn't grandstand or beat his chest. He just plays and goes back down to the other end.”

There was one subtle moment Tuesday, though. Luis Scola had been punishing the Spurs, reminding them again about the value of another of their second-round picks. Then Blair boxed out Scola, grabbing yet another rebound with his long arms and soft hands, and Scola took a hard swipe.

Blair cradled the basketball with body language that rookies rarely have. It said: Scola was nothing more than an irritant.

The Spurs would like to see Blair play a second game before they marvel any further. They would like to see him against Pau Gasol, and with Tim Duncan, and under pressure.

But what they saw the first time he wore a Spurs uniform confirmed everything. He understands angles as the naturals do, and when he rebounded, he had anticipation and ferocity and balance.

Mahinmi, again, had potential.

[jason1301]

Buck Harvey is the best, I always enjoy reading his articles. Words can't describe...

:lobt2:

[50Bestspurever]

Buck Harvey is the best, I always enjoy reading his articles. Words can't describe...

:lobt2:

+1 buck just gets it.

[timvp]

Is Blair vs. Mahinmi going to be the next version of Manu vs. TP?

Totally different players. It would make more sense to compare Mahinmi to Haislip ... or even Ratliff.

[Libri]

So Buck Harvey has given up on Ian?

[Manufan909]

Is Blair vs. Mahinmi going to be the next version of Manu vs. TP?

Totally different players. It would make more sense to compare Mahinmi to Haislip ... or even Ratliff.

It's sad that the comparison can be so easily made then. They're both bigs, both new to the NBA, both "prospects". But Blair has heart, desire, and is a beast on the court. Did Mahnimi at any point against the Rockets look like a beast? He looked like he might one day be a shot blocker, but Blair proved that one day SOON he'll be a legit rebounder.

To get on a non-confrontational note, does anyone know why Ian fouled out in less minutes than Blair, whilst being way less physical?:wow Blair was just fucking up everyone, almost CQCed Hayes I think.

[My Fault]

I still have hope for Ian and hope its because the injuries he's had that he is playing as he is. I hope he gets over it cause I think he could really be something special.

[Darkwaters]

Is Blair vs. Mahinmi going to be the next version of Manu vs. TP?

Totally different players. It would make more sense to compare Mahinmi to Haislip ... or even Ratliff.

In some ways yes. But Ratliff is an old vet that has proven he belongs and Haislip is not a rookie trying to prove he belongs...but a bust trying to get back in it.

Blair and Mahinmi are both in large part NBA rookies. Mahinmi technically has NBA experience and on the books it says this is his 3rd year. But he only has, I believe, 22 minutes on the court prior to this preseason. Incidentally, the same amount of minutes that Blair got in the last game. They're both raw and they're both completely unproven on this level. It makes sense. They're guys that were both touted as great prospects for the Spurs and given decent hype, but have yet to deliver on the pro hardwood.

[HarlemHeat37]

To be fair, Ian was much more likely to foul out than Blair was..playing the anchor role in preseason and summer league makes you much more likely to foul out, especially on the Spurs, where we don't really play our best guys..

Even in his first NBA-related game in 2 years and with the foul trouble, Ian was still easily our best defensive big man in this game, just for his physical presence alone..

[timvp]

In some ways yes. But Ratliff is an old vet that has proven he belongs and Haislip is not a rookie trying to prove he belongs...but a bust trying to get back in it.

Blair and Mahinmi are both in large part NBA rookies. Mahinmi technically has NBA experience and on the books it says this is his 3rd year. But he only has, I believe, 22 minutes on the court prior to this preseason. Incidentally, the same amount of minutes that Blair got in the last game. They're both raw and they're both completely unproven on this level. It makes sense. They're guys that were both touted as great prospects for the Spurs and given decent hype, but have yet to deliver on the pro hardwood.

I see the comparison on the level that they are both young and both are bigmen ... but that's about where I see the end of the comparison. They are almost polar opposites. Blair is a smooth player who doesn't have a classic NBA body but overcomes due to having great instincts. Mahinmi, on the other hand, is an awkward player who doesn't have very good instincts but is a worthwhile prospect due to his NBA body.

Haislip is much closer to Mahinmi. Like Mahinmi, Haislip doesn't have much NBA experience but has played well at a lower level of competition. They both rely on their size and athleticism, however they have to prove that their skills translate to the NBA. And Ratliff vs. Mahinmi at least compares two active, big bodies who could potentially change games with their athleticism and activity around both baskets.

Perhaps I am wrong but when comparing players, I look for more than just position and birth date.

[thOOdee]

To be fair, Ian was much more likely to foul out than Blair was..playing the anchor role in preseason and summer league makes you much more likely to foul out, especially on the Spurs, where we don't really play our best guys..

Even in his first NBA-related game in 2 years and with the foul trouble, Ian was still easily our best defensive big man in this game, just for his physical presence alone..

agree totally, his presence alone can alter ones shot. I really wish he was healthy last year to eat up the experience bonner had.

[baseline bum]

I have about as much faith in Mahinmi as I do congress. :pctoss

[lennyalderette]

i had some really good seats last night man and my voice is gone!!! anyhow let me say i was once again displeased with ian, williams,jonesshoot eeven bogans. those first three in my very strong opinion need a new home. im not just ranting because i saw ian have one bad game, its the way he plays after 2yrs, of practice after being a first rounder, his body when your up close to me is really thin but seems like he can hold his own, however when theres alot of bodies in the post hes being pushed around like a ragdoll! its his mechanics that worry me not his build. i really payed attention last night didnt even have a beer because i was soo excited! im glad you put that article up tim because BLAIR IS ABSOLUTELY AMAZING!!!!do you guys remember one of the rockets trying to take a rebound away from blair? i think it was landry, he almost hyperextended his elbow and broke it just to grab a rebound!! as soon as blair came in the game started turning around, it was incredible!! everytime blair came in we cut down leads significantly!! i honestly didnt think he would be that great, he threw scola around , got into a lil scuffle w/him didnt back down whatsoever. i noticed the rockets already started changing their defense around blair, and yes they were doubling him in the post already. bottom line i promise you guys if anything mahinmi will maybe and i mean maybeee get 6pts, 4 reb a game and that would be suprising to me!! proven? about blair i swear on my life this guy is going to be amazing, dont even compare the two blair is ready and knows what he can do!!ian needs alot of work just to become a sub!!blair will change games mark my word!!! as far as ian giving some sort of height presence in the post, i saw damn point guards and small guards going straight at him, he really has no skills it's really dissapointing, because he looks like hes an amazing bb player

[timaios]

Blair is really great but he is too small to defend against guys like Pau Gasol.
Ian Mahinmi has less talent but he has the size.

Blair is a good matchup against the Lakers in offense.
Mahinmi is a better matchup in defense.

[TimDunkem]

Blair is really great but he is too small to defend against guys like Pau Gasol.
Ian Mahinmi has less talent but he has the size.

Blair is a good matchup against the Lakers in offense.
Mahinmi is a better matchup in defense.
Chuck Hayes isn't very tall either right?

[benefactor]

Chuck Hayes isn't very tall either right?
Indeed...but Blair will have to work pretty hard to get to Chuck Hayes' level of defense. Hayes has some of the best on the block defensive fundamentals I have ever seen.

[ceperez]

Blair is really great but he is too small to defend against guys like Pau Gasol.
Ian Mahinmi has less talent but he has the size.

Blair is a good matchup against the Lakers in offense.
Mahinmi is a better matchup in defense.

Agree. Blair is a natural in the offensive end. He's a massive liability on the defensive end. However, if you think about it, did we not play Udoka against bigs last year?

Now Mahinmi, I think he just tries too much. If he plays within his skill and athletic level, he would be a useful addition. That is, he is good enough to stand around and take make medium distance shots. No need to drive hard to the hoop for a basket. He should learn from Duncan who makes efficient use of his athletic abilities. A big man can do that and thrive in this league.

[picnroll]

It all comes down to basketball IQ regardless of body type. NBA history is strewn with guys who had great physical tools who couldn't cut it. I see Mahinmi as potentially a young Camby type tools-wise, maybe even a little stronger, but unlike Camby so far he hasn't shown that his tools translate into playing the game. And honestly he's been at it long enough I'm starting to lose hope.

[GoSpurs99]

Blair has done very well against taller guys, like Thabeet (aka, Blair's bitch). So, I think it'll be interesting to see how he does against Gasol.

I think he'll pwn him as well ;-P

[raspsa]

I think Blair is going to get a lot of opposing bigs into foul trouble.. he is deceptively nimble for his size and he knows how to throw his weight around without drawing offensive fouls. He's just got a nose for the ball and the desire and persistence to go get it, a trait of all great rebounders.

[wildbill2u]

Is Blair vs. Mahinmi going to be the next version of Manu vs. TP?

Totally different players. It would make more sense to compare Mahinmi to Haislip ... or even Ratliff.

You mean real athletic guys who never play up to their the promise of their physical skills.

I think Harvey skewered Mahimi. No basketball IQ to go with all that 'potential'.

[toki9]

To get on a non-confrontational note, does anyone know why Ian fouled out in less minutes than Blair, whilst being way less physical?:wow Blair was just fucking up everyone, almost CQCed Hayes I think.

i think it's a lot easier to call a foul on the upper body rather than on the lower body...seems like Mahinmi plays a lot of defense with his arms and top length--which is pretty easy to call...and it seems like Blair knows how to use his width and the lower body to bully people around--which isn't as easy to call...plus, Blair is probably just a better basketball player than Mahinmi at this point...

[hater]

Is Blair vs. Mahinmi going to be the next version of Manu vs. TP?


not even close. As stated Blair has proven in 1 preseason game more than Mahinmi in 4 years.

[rjv]

what blair also has is an attitude that mahimini lacks. if ian wants to have any chance he better get a chip on his shoulder real soon.

[Flux451]

The Ian and Ratliff comparison is interesting. If in fact Ian can be alter like an experiment in a lab, then a Ratliff type would be an ideal solution.

Ian has the potential to become a shotblocker.

[antimvp]

Round mound stuck to the ground

lol

[Interrohater]

It's an interesting thought, that Mahinmi has been "created in a lab". It's really starting to seem like Ian is going to be no more than a serviceable backup, if that. I don't know why some of us seem surprised tho, we've tried and failed with the same experiment a few times, i.e. Mohammad, Elson, albeit without as much time invested.

Blair is intriguing because he seems (now don't freak out!!) like he could be a shorter version of Shaquille O'Neal. No hops, but enough length and strength to throw down a monster slam, soft hands for inlet passes and soft-touch putbacks, strong enough grip to keep the ball protected once secured, and a wide body that makes it extremely difficult for an opposing player to grab a rebound or even block a shot without getting a foul called. Of course, it will happen, but more often than not, he's gonna get a call. I do think, however, that one day in the distant future, people wil compare other young prospects to the soon-to-be-infamous Dejuan Blair.

[jcrod]

Ian is still only 22, he could be just coming out of college. Its way too early to give up or call him a bust.

[barbacoataco]

When all is said and done, basketball is still a GAME, and Blair is way better at playing the game than Mahinmi.

As far as Blair struggling on defense with taller players, I'm not so sure. i think he'll have problems with the pick and roll, and missing rotations. But as far as keeping position and playing man up defense, he might do better than expected. He has shown that he can use his lower body strength and large ass to get position on opponents. That is half the battle when it comes to low post defense. As someone pointed out, Chuck Hayes plays great defense on 7 ftrs even though he is only 6'6".

I think Mahinmi is such an enigma that it is all speculation. No one has seen him play for any length of time against quality competition. He is weak in the legs and has a hard time banging with the big boys, but his length and athleticism make him a presence in the post. However, with Ratliff available, I don't see the point of playing Mahinmi if the only thing he brings is potential shot blocking.

[MarCowMar]

I honestly think Ian will catch on somewhere eventually. He's not stupid or uncoordinated--just young and inexperienced. (Ok maybe he's a bit uncoordinated, hard to say for sure at this point. :) )

Think back at how messed up and confused you were at 21. Ian hasn't played in organized leagues to any great extent and thus never had a chance to develop the personality of his game. Every time he hits the floor now it probably feels like a major event. He doesn't have the space or time to make mistakes or be himself or just have fun.

He has a smooth shot, athleticism, and has shown an amazing ability to create offensively on occassion. He may not end up with the Spurs but he'll find a spot somewhere. Or he'll get Kwame Browned...

[Marcus Bryant]

This is asinine. Mahinmi is the young long, athletic, shotblocking big and Blair is the young solid, forceful, rebounding big. I still don't understand why Spurs fans want to run Mahinmi off. To secure Bonner's spot? So that Caldwell Jones Jr or whatever his name is makes the team? What's the fucking alternative, geniuses? Ugh.

[diego]

i dont think its about running mahinmi out. Unless you are a hater, you want Ian to fulfill his potential.

but i think the article is fair. Its not about mahinmi vs blair or anything silly like that. Its just that they make for a great comparison- Ian has a great body but learned basketball much later in life so his skills arent as developed as his body. Blair has good skills but his body isnt the prototypical body for his position/skill set. I dont see why stating that should mean you hate Ian or want him off the team. Its a good observation, and up until now neither of them have really proved whether they belong on the team or not.

[Ginobilly]

It's an interesting thought, that Mahinmi has been "created in a lab". It's really starting to seem like Ian is going to be no more than a serviceable backup, if that. I don't know why some of us seem surprised tho, we've tried and failed with the same experiment a few times, i.e. Mohammad, Elson, albeit without as much time invested.

Blair is intriguing because he seems (now don't freak out!!) like he could be a shorter version of Shaquille O'Neal. No hops, but enough length and strength to throw down a monster slam, soft hands for inlet passes and soft-touch putbacks, strong enough grip to keep the ball protected once secured, and a wide body that makes it extremely difficult for an opposing player to grab a rebound or even block a shot without getting a foul called. Of course, it will happen, but more often than not, he's gonna get a call. I do think, however, that one day in the distant future, people wil compare other young prospects to the soon-to-be-infamous Dejuan Blair.

What is with everybody saying Blair has no hops?? Did you ever him play in college? He has plenty of hops! Sure, he's no vince carter, but he has more hops than Duncan and Bonner.

[KenGee21]

I believe the young Marcus Camby comparison if about right, but in Ian's case, I think a young Jermaine Oneal is a bit more accurate. IIRC, dude was a ghost during his first four years in the L, and many people labeled him a bust as well, coming outta high school.

But as we've witnessed with the spurs, its difficult to develop young prospects when you're a title contender every year. There just aren't enough minutes to go around and most coaches would be more inclined to play a dependable vet like Finley rather than endure the inevitable mistake-prone play of a rookie.

[Spursmania]

We need to give Mahini several games in the NBA before we can really judge him. Blair is just a totally different player.

Let him play several games with a lot of minutes. Let him get comfortable and then let's judge...

[Spursmania]

This is asinine. Mahinmi is the young long, athletic, shotblocking big and Blair is the young solid, forceful, rebounding big. I still don't understand why Spurs fans want to run Mahinmi off. To secure Bonner's spot? So that Caldwell Jones Jr or whatever his name is makes the team? What's the fucking alternative, geniuses? Ugh.

:lol:toast

[Cant_Be_Faded]

Blair is a smooth player who doesn't have a classic NBA body but overcomes due to having great instincts. Mahinmi, on the other hand, is an awkward player who doesn't have very good instincts but is a worthwhile prospect due to his NBA body.


Yes. That is exactly what the article said. The level of them both being young and bigmen and spurs makes more than enough basis for comparison.



MB--It is lame for spurs fans to want to run ian out of town....but he hasn't given us much to look forward to yet.


I think it's a great article, and a pretty good metaphor for Ian. All we ever heard about the kid was how raw he is and his potential. Well as it's been said here before, he will be the ultimate test of the spurs farm system. If he fails, then we've been wasting time with the toros because he's the most promising prospect we'll have for a while in that system, and we've been ultra careful and considerate in this "lab experiment".

[barbacoataco]

I think the the Spurs should keep Mahinmi for 2 more years even if he is a "bust." He still is a cheap big. There are no good, cheap, bigs in the NBA, so even as a the 5th big on the roster Mahinmi is worth giving him an extension.

I'm still hoping that Mahinmi develops his game and becomes a great player.