McDonald: Hairston, Williams hold own

[duncan228]

Hairston, Williams hold own (http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/spurs/Hairston_Williams_hold_own.html)
Jeff McDonald

For the Spurs' Malik Hairston and Marcus Williams, D-Day has almost arrived. Five days remain before the NBA's roster deadline Monday, and they have almost certainly begun to do the math.

There is one likely spot up for grabs. Two legitimate contenders for it. One preseason game left.

Put together, that's not a lot of time to make a closing argument.

Hairston, a 6-foot-5 second-year forward, and Williams, a 6-foot-7 third-year wing, both have fans throughout the Spurs' organization.

Both are former second-round picks, and both are former Development League All-Stars. Spurs coach Gregg Popovich doesn't seem eager to cut either.

“They've steadily improved since the day they became a part of the program,” Popovich said. “They've put in their time in the D-League in Austin and summer leagues with us. They've both continued to develop nicely.”

Hairston was obtained in a draft-day deal with Phoenix in 2008, part of the same trade that also gave the Spurs the No. 37 pick used to select rookie DeJuan Blair this year. He appears to be a front-runner for the Spurs' 15th and final spot after following a successful run in the Las Vegas summer league.

Williams, who lost time during the summer due to a wrist injury, has played more sparingly this preseason. He did not play against Oklahoma City on Tuesday.

The Spurs could save some money by declining to keep a full complement of 15 players. Popovich intimated earlier this offseason that a non-guaranteed player would have to wow him to make the team.

Whatever happens to Hairston and Williams, Popovich is confident that cut day won't be the last he sees of them.

“They're both going to have a place in the league,” Popovich said. “They're good enough to be in the league and will make a team.”

Work in progress: Popovich released some semblance of a regular rotation during the 119-102 win over Oklahoma City.

The result? The Spurs hit 14 of 19 3-point shots, had five players score at least 13 points, and eclipsed the century mark with 10:08 to play.

Not bad considering many of the combinations Popovich used were playing together for the first time.

“It's like every timeout there's still a lot of questions being asked, a lot of things needing to be explained,” new small forward Richard Jefferson said. “Sooner or later, it's going to be a matter of everybody knowing their job and just needing to go out and execute it.”

[TIMMYD!]

Hairston better make it.

[celldweller]

No brainer!?! Hairston > Williams. So we all think.

[Mel_13]

Anyone care to guess on the likelihood of the 3 possible outcomes?

I'd say:

Malik: 40%
Neither: 40%
Marcus: 20%

[celldweller]

With Finley gone next year, Malik is ideal for his spot. IMHO. Common Pop, don't blow this one.

[VI_Massive]

Anyone care to guess on the likelihood of the 3 possible outcomes?

I'd say:

Malik: 40%
Neither: 40%
Marcus: 20%

If neither, who takes the spot of the one who otherwise would make it?

[ElNono]

If neither, who takes the spot of the one who otherwise would make it?

Nobody? I think the minimum is 13 players on the roster, 15 max (Please somebody correct me if I'm wrong)

[exstatic]

Nobody? I think the minimum is 13 players on the roster, 15 max (Please somebody correct me if I'm wrong)

You are correct. You only have to carry 13, but can carry anywhere from 13 up to 15. If the Spurs cut both, they'll likely go with 14.

[VI_Massive]

Nobody? I think the minimum is 13 players on the roster, 15 max (Please somebody correct me if I'm wrong)

Duncan
Parker
Ginobili
Mason
Jefferson
Blair
McDyess
Ratliff
Haislip
Bonner
Finley
Mahinmi
Bogans
Hill

Presuming these guys are the 14, why would we not take a 15th? That means the decision comes down to, as the article suggests, Hairston vs. Williams. So its gotta be one or the other, right? Unless we want to drop one of the above 14....

[Mel_13]

Duncan
Parker
Ginobili
Mason
Jefferson
Blair
McDyess
Ratliff
Haislip
Bonner
Finley
Mahinmi
Bogans
Hill

Presuming these guys are the 14, why would we not take a 15th? That means the decision comes down to, as the article suggests, Hairston vs. Williams. So its gotta be one or the other, right? Unless we want to drop one of the above 14....

Not keeping either player results in a savings of slightly more than 1.5M in salary and tax.

[exstatic]

Duncan
Parker
Ginobili
Mason
Jefferson
Blair
McDyess
Ratliff
Haislip
Bonner
Finley
Mahinmi
Bogans
Hill

Presuming these guys are the 14, why would we not take a 15th? That means the decision comes down to, as the article suggests, Hairston vs. Williams. So its gotta be one or the other, right? Unless we want to drop one of the above 14....

Money. The Spurs are in heavy tax territory, and footing a 1.5 or 1.6 million tab for a 15th player who will almost never see the floor might be more than they want to pay. I don't think it's one or the other, I think it's one or none.

[VI_Massive]

Not keeping either player results in a savings of slightly more than 1.5M in salary and tax.

But at this point, when we've already committed to spending a lot, and have invested a lot of time and money into both guys, arguably more into Hairston, but still, why wouldn't we carry one of the two into the regular season? That amount of money, given the decisions the team has made to spend for a championship in the immediacy, doesn't seem cost prohibitive.

[Mel_13]

But at this point, when we've already committed to spending a lot, and have invested a lot of time and money into both guys, arguably more into Hairston, but still, why wouldn't we carry one of the two into the regular season? That amount of money, given the decisions the team has made to spend for a championship in the immediacy, doesn't seem cost prohibitive.

How many season tickets have you bought?

[VI_Massive]

Money. The Spurs are in heavy tax territory, and footing a 1.5 or 1.6 million tab for a 15th player who will almost never see the floor might be more than they want to pay. I don't think it's one or the other, I think it's one or none.

But isn't one or the other the same as one or none? We're talking about a 15th man on a maximum 15 man roster. I'm just saying that since the team has already committed so much money to winning this year, don't you think they'll make a (admittedly hard) decision to pick either Williams or Hairston for the 15th slot?

[VI_Massive]

How many season tickets have you bought?

As many as I can find.

[Flux451]

If only I had money to buy a sign dragged by a plane just as Pop is leaving his favorite winery. "Spurstalk majority thinks Hairston should make the team."

How Pop would make his decision right then and there.

We are Pop.

[Mel_13]

As many as I can find.

Have you spent money on tickets for games you will not attend?

[barbacoataco]

I hope Hairston makes it.

[barbacoataco]

Another thing to look at is the investment they've made in the Toros. The Spurs want to show fans that it is worth their time to watch them and follow the players. Isn't there a possibility of cutting either Bogans or Haislip?

[VI_Massive]

Have you spent money on tickets for games you will not attend?

I'm not sure what this has to do with the topic. I guess it goes to a "1.5 million is not an insignificant amount" argument, but given that the team has already committed to spending a lot over the next year or two, and has invested time and money in developing both Hairston and Williams (again, probably more in Hairston), why would they not fill the 15th roster spot with the guy they felt was best equipped to help the team? I'm not sure of the DLeague implications but are either or both of them eligible to return to Austin? If not, then that adds to the stakes of the 15th slot decision.

I'm not in the tank for either one, I'm just saying it seems to make sense to me to fill that 15th spot rather than leave it open.

[ElNono]

1.5 million is a lot of money for a players that might simply not see the floor at all, IMHO.
Plus if they get waived the Spurs could hire them later on during the season if the need arises (unless another team takes them first, which I would argue is unlikely given the current state of the economy. A gamble nonetheless).

[Mel_13]

1.5 million is a lot of money for a players that might simply not see the floor at all, IMHO.
Plus if they get waived the Spurs could hire them later on during the season if the need arises (unless another team takes them first, which I would argue is unlikely given the current state of the economy. A gamble nonetheless).

This is pretty much it. There is some risk that Hairston could wind up on another NBA team, but I would say that possibility is quite small. It's also possible that he goes to Europe for a year and then we don't see him again until Summer League.

I want them to keep Malik, but I'll understand it if they don't.

If they keep Marcus over Malik, I'll be scratching my head.

[exstatic]

But isn't one or the other the same as one or none?
Actually, no, it isn't. One or none allows for a 14 man roster as the end result. One or the other does not.

It's really easy for us in the forum to say "it's only 1.5-1.6M", but that's actually a fuck of a lot for a player that may get into 15-20 total games at garbage time. I'm not going to bag on Holt if he doesn't want to pay it. Caterpillar isn't doing too well this year. He stepped up big already in taking on the tax burden for this year.

[AussieFanKurt]

hurry up and give Hairston the place

[VI_Massive]

This is pretty much it. There is some risk that Hairston could wind up on another NBA team, but I would say that possibility is quite small. It's also possible that he goes to Europe for a year and then we don't see him again until Summer League.

I want them to keep Malik, but I'll understand it if they don't.

If they keep Marcus over Malik, I'll be scratching my head.

I think you're right. I think Hairston is the more valuable commodity. Assuming that's the case, if there is little risk of losing Hairston to someone else, it makes sense to preserve an open 15th slot for whatever need may arise. If the need is for a Hairston-type player, we can sign him (assuming he's available). If we need someone else or want to swing some kind of trade that would fill our 15th slot, we retain that flexibility.

[SpurNation]

Another thing to look at is the investment they've made in the Toros. The Spurs want to show fans that it is worth their time to watch them and follow the players. Isn't there a possibility of cutting either Bogans or Haislip?

I was kind of thinking along these lines as well. Are all of their contracts guaranteed?

And regarding contracts...who would most likely be picked up by another team if released thus relinguishing the Spurs that financial obligation.

[Blackjack]

Anyone care to guess on the likelihood of the 3 possible outcomes?

I'd say:

Malik: 40%
Neither: 40%
Marcus: 20%

That's probably about right; unfortunately..

I'm not going to say I'd be clubbing baby seals if Hairston doesn't make the team, it's just something I wouldn't broadcast to the interwebs, but I think it'd be a mistake basketball-wise; Malik might be the 15th player signed, but this is someone that might be a rotation player given his defensive-prowess.

The neither option is a very real possibility. I understand the rationale in thinking Holt's already spent this much so what's another 2M, but it's just not reasonable; Peter Holt is not the federal government. At some point, there's a limit to where you can go no further. Unfortunately for Malik and Marcus, he may have passed that mark 5 or 6M ago.

Marcus is a little more perplexing to me. There's nothing that blows you away about him, but there's definitely been growth and a confidence that's blossomed in his game. His lack of any great athleticism can have him looking like he doesn't belong at times, but there's a pace and way he's gone about playing the point, specifically in the half court, that somewhat reminds me of Mark Jackson; not his game or level of point-guard ability, just the deliberate, under control and even slow pace he utilizes quite effectively. He did start making his shots and playing pretty decent in his limited minutes, but I couldn't justify him sticking over Malik. But, Marcus was an RC pick and someone the organization has seemed to have an affinity for, so I've never been able to dismiss the prospect of him making the team; despite my skepticism of his worthiness, given the competition.

[ulosturedge]

Hairston is better then Bogans. FO jumped the gun on the Bogans signing. They pushed a little too hard on the offseason acquisitions. Not that I expected a perfect offseason. It will still be unfortunate none the less if Hairston doesn't make the roster. He will have a place in the league even if it's not with us.

[Dalamar_the_Dark]

Hariston to make the team. Period.

He played well enough last year for the Spurs in the NBA.

Williams bombed out playing for the Spurs.

Its a no contest.

If Williams is on the team, he will be cut within 3 games of playing an actual NBA game.

Book it.

[mountainballer]

The neither option is a very real possibility. I understand the rationale in thinking Holt's already spent this much so what's another 2M, but it's just not reasonable; Peter Holt is not the federal government. At some point, there's a limit to where you can go no further. Unfortunately for Malik and Marcus, he may have passed that mark 5 or 6M ago.


that's also the one point I'm worried about, but as I tried to point out in another thread, I do hope Holt is enough of a foresightful business man to not only look at this season, but also looks at the 2010-11 and 2011-12 seasons. because then the 1.7 million investment in Malik for this year might pay big dividends.
why?
for 2010-11 Spurs have only one single wing under contract (RJ), they will need to re sign or replace Manu, Mason, Finley, Bogans. Malik is on a minimum contract till 2012. if he develops into a legit rotation player (I have no doubt he can at least be the #5), the Spurs will have much more flexibility about their 2010 negotiations and moves.
we also must not forget, they want to bring in Tiago 2010 and this will take the more than half of the MLE.
so, they might find themself with 2 million of the MLE left and the LLE. no more expiring contracts to use as trade assets. (assuming they won't use Tony's or RJ's contracts)
not a great position, if you need to find 4 wing players. they would be almost forced to re sign either Manu and Mason to the price they ask for. if Malik was under contract, this situation of course would not be solved. but it is of course a little easier to do your business, when you already have another player of your rotation under contract. this are the small dividends.
the huge upside of this deal would be this scenario: Malik develops great and is ready to take the #3 spot. Manu is re signed for reasonable money. (2 years/ 15 million?) Spurs just need to find a legit #4 and #5. it is possible to find a #4 for LLE money (or re sign Mason for that type of money) and usually you can get a #5 for the vet. minimum. so the whole wing rotation would cost about 26 million in 2010-2011, as against 33 million this season.
just a thought. I hope Holt thinks the same.

[TJastal]

that's also the one point I'm worried about, but as I tried to point out in another thread, I do hope Holt is enough of a foresightful business man to not only look at this season, but also looks at the 2010-11 and 2011-12 seasons. because then the 1.7 million investment in Malik for this year might pay big dividends.
why?
for 2010-11 Spurs have only one single wing under contract (RJ), they will need to re sign or replace Manu, Mason, Finley, Bogans. Malik is on a minimum contract till 2012. if he develops into a legit rotation player (I have no doubt he can at least be the #5), the Spurs will have much more flexibility about their 2010 negotiations and moves.
we also must not forget, they want to bring in Tiago 2010 and this will take the more than half of the MLE.
so, they might find themself with 2 million of the MLE left and the LLE. no more expiring contracts to use as trade assets. (assuming they won't use Tony's or RJ's contracts)
not a great position, if you need to find 4 wing players. they would be almost forced to re sign either Manu and Mason to the price they ask for. if Malik was under contract, this situation of course would not be solved. but it is of course a little easier to do your business, when you already have another player of your rotation under contract. this are the small dividends.
the huge upside of this deal would be this scenario: Malik develops great and is ready to take the #3 spot. Manu is re signed for reasonable money. (2 years/ 15 million?) Spurs just need to find a legit #4 and #5. it is possible to find a #4 for LLE money (or re sign Mason for that type of money) and usually you can get a #5 for the vet. minimum. so the whole wing rotation would cost about 26 million in 2010-2011, as against 33 million this season.
just a thought. I hope Holt thinks the same.

+1

Now you all see why I told you the Bogan's signing was fucking retarded, and might end up costing the spurs a great young player for not only this year, but forever if he ends up signing elsewhere.

That signing is basically telling Hairston he's less important and needed to the team than a journeyman SCRUB that was available for the vet minimum (because nobody else wanted him).

Hairston was finally primed and ready RIGHT NOW THIS YEAR to step into that Udoka role as a 5th wing off the bench and give the team much needed youth and energy off the bench.

Whatever happens, it can be certain that now the relationship between the spurs and Hairston is not going to be on good terms.

[ceperez]

+1

Now you all see why I told you the Bogan's signing was fucking retarded, and might end up costing the spurs a great young player for not only this year, but forever if he ends up signing elsewhere.

That signing is basically telling Hairston he's less important and needed to the team than a journeyman SCRUB that was available for the vet minimum (because nobody else wanted him).

Hairston was finally primed and ready RIGHT NOW THIS YEAR to step into that Udoka role as a 5th wing off the bench and give the team much needed youth and energy off the bench.

Whatever happens, it can be certain that now the relationship between the spurs and Hairston is not going to be on good terms.

Agree! Bad move. They should have kept their options open.

[anakha]

It's really easy for us in the forum to say "it's only 1.5-1.6M", but that's actually a fuck of a lot for a player that may get into 15-20 total games at garbage time. I'm not going to bag on Holt if he doesn't want to pay it. Caterpillar isn't doing too well this year. He stepped up big already in taking on the tax burden for this year.

This. Dear God, this.

It's going to suck if neither is kept, but I'm not going to bitch about it either.

[BOHOLANO#21]

actually, no, it isn't. one or none allows for a 14 man roster as the end result. one or the other does not.

It's really easy for us in the forum to say "it's only 1.5-1.6m", but that's actually a fuck of a lot for a player that may get into 15-20 total games at garbage time. I'm not going to bag on holt if he doesn't want to pay it. Caterpillar isn't doing too well this year. He stepped up big already in taking on the tax burden for this year.

+1.

[TJastal]

People here are acting like Hairston would have/should have riding the pine the whole year, and would have never seen a minute of action as the last wing off the bench.

Hairston could have taken over that vacated Udoka role as a 5th wing off the bench, and given the spurs a perfect complimentary piece to the veteran experienced but old as fuck Finley. He COULD have had a nice albeit SMALL ROLE as a youthful energy wing off the bench for spot minutes, and with his upside might have carved out more minutes with an opportunity.

More importantly, the spurs would have secured Hairston's services for the future as mentioned above. Now, Hairston's future w/ the spurs is cast in doubt and the spurs are stuck with a journeyman who has put up god awful stats so far in pre-season and has had a mediocre NBA career, but somehow convinced everyone in the spurs F.O. he is the next Bruce Bowen.. :rolleyes

[Whisky Dog]

I'm guessing both are gone and possibly brought back in season if available and a need arises. It would be cheaper like that.

[superbigtime]

Bogans is trash. I wish we could do a 2 for 1 trade to include him and maybe Bonner. It is really unfortunate that either Williams or Hairston will lose a spot after all this work and all this investment of time and $ by the Spurs to a journeyman scrub who is slow, short and has stunk it up in the preseason. He's not the next Bruce for sure. Maybe he'll turn it around but right now, I would definitely choose Bruce or Ime (if this was possible -- btw, Ime had 10 points for Portland the other night) or Hairston or Williams over Bogans. I hope Bogans is riding the pine in street threads. It seems very up in the air if he can help this team.

[Spurs Brazil]

Anyone care to guess on the likelihood of the 3 possible outcomes?

I'd say:

Malik: 40%
Neither: 40%
Marcus: 20%

I think it’s 60% for Malik and 40% for open roster spot

[mountainballer]

btw, Ime had 10 points for Portland the other night

btw. Ime just got waived by the Blazers......



http://blog.oregonlive.com/behindblazersbeat/2009/10/ime_udoka_i_thought_these_time.html
Another layer of adversity was added to Ime Udoka’s NBA career on Wednesday, when the Trail Blazers informed the Portland native that he would be waived on Thursday in favor of injured rookie Patrick Mills.

[dbestpro]

Willaims has no chance of making the team. The olny reason Hairston might make the team is that he can play in Austin. Unless there are injuries or major trades Malik will not see more than 50 minutes of Spurs time for the entire season. So, to sign Malik really is to sign him for the Toros. The question then becomes is he worth the double salary for the time hhe will play?

Sadly, the truth is no.

[HarlemHeat37]

I disagree with some of what you wrote, and agree with some..

the question is whether or not Hairston is worth THE RISK for the money RIGHT NOW, like you pointed out..

As a few of us have pointed out in the last week or 2, Hairston's preseason playing time compared to the other unproven players has been a lot different..Pop and RC clearly see that he could be worth keeping, and that he very well could move up in the rotation..if it wasn't clear, then there wouldn't even be a debate right now about keeping him, since we already have 14 guaranteed players, which is definitely enough to field a competitive team..

[dbestpro]

Here is aother take. Duncan will get paid somwhere close to $9,000 per minute of playing time this year.

If Hairston is kept (1.4 mil with tax), and plays 50 minutes with the Spurs, he will cost $28,000 per minute.
If he plays 5 minutes in 40 games, he will cost $7,000 per minute played.
Being part of the 15 just does not provide for him to be part of the 12. He is an expense that just simply will cost too much over the course of the season.

[Bruno]

Hairston has been better than Williams in the training camp and he also other edges over him: he is D-League eligible, he costs about $200K less to keep than Williams and he is under contract for 2010-2011.

If Haiston is kept, there are basically 2 options for him:
- 12th player on the roster ahead of Bogans.
- Send to Austin.

Now the cost is $1.5M to keep him.
Is upgrading your 12th man from Bogans to Hairston worth that? Is Hairston even an upgrade over Bogans?
Do you spend $1.5M this year on Hairston just to keep him in the pipeline?

[Blackjack]

that's also the one point I'm worried about, but as I tried to point out in another thread, I do hope Holt is enough of a foresightful business man to not only look at this season, but also looks at the 2010-11 and 2011-12 seasons. because then the 1.7 million investment in Malik for this year might pay big dividends.
why?
for 2010-11 Spurs have only one single wing under contract (RJ), they will need to re sign or replace Manu, Mason, Finley, Bogans. Malik is on a minimum contract till 2012. if he develops into a legit rotation player (I have no doubt he can at least be the #5), the Spurs will have much more flexibility about their 2010 negotiations and moves.
we also must not forget, they want to bring in Tiago 2010 and this will take the more than half of the MLE.
so, they might find themself with 2 million of the MLE left and the LLE. no more expiring contracts to use as trade assets. (assuming they won't use Tony's or RJ's contracts)
not a great position, if you need to find 4 wing players. they would be almost forced to re sign either Manu and Mason to the price they ask for. if Malik was under contract, this situation of course would not be solved. but it is of course a little easier to do your business, when you already have another player of your rotation under contract. this are the small dividends.
the huge upside of this deal would be this scenario: Malik develops great and is ready to take the #3 spot. Manu is re signed for reasonable money. (2 years/ 15 million?) Spurs just need to find a legit #4 and #5. it is possible to find a #4 for LLE money (or re sign Mason for that type of money) and usually you can get a #5 for the vet. minimum. so the whole wing rotation would cost about 26 million in 2010-2011, as against 33 million this season.
just a thought. I hope Holt thinks the same.

:tu

I think the Spurs would also be wise to look at it from a Toros aspect, as well.

I completely agree with your assessment of the roster moving forward and the cash considerations, but I think the actual bearing of fruit from their farm team is something that should also sway Holt and the Spurs; at some point, the potential prospects have to see a light at the end of the tunnel if you're expecting the Toros to be a true feeder team. Plus, it's good business for the Austin fan base to believe they're watching the Spurs of tomorrow and not a bunch of scrubs that will never make the roster.

Bottom line, Malik makes too much basketball sense for them to release him for basketball cents; even one-hundred-plus million of them.. Malik, in a vacuum, has done everything expected to make this team and he actually fills a need for a team still in need of a defensive stopper; no matter how high they are on Hill, he's just too small for the better 2' and 3's of the league.

[EricB]

sooooo easy to spend other people's money.

[Blackjack]

Soooo easy to understand that spending money on a guy like Hairston now, could actually mean spending less in the future.

Malik's got an upside that could make him a bargain, considering the potential role he'd fill; I suggest you read mountainballer's post and really make an effort to digest it.

[TJastal]

:tu

I think the Spurs would also be wise to look at it from a Toros aspect, as well.

I completely agree with your assessment of the roster moving forward and the cash considerations, but I think the actual bearing of fruit from their farm team is something that should also sway Holt and the Spurs; at some point, the potential prospects have to see a light at the end of the tunnel if you're expecting the Toros to be a true feeder team. Plus, it's good business for the Austin fan base to believe they're watching the Spurs of tomorrow and not a bunch of scrubs that will never make the roster.

Bottom line, Malik makes too much basketball sense for them to release him for basketball cents; even one-hundred-plus million of them.. Malik, in a vacuum, has done everything expected to make this team and he actually fills a need for a team still in need of a defensive stopper; no matter how high they are on Hill, he's just too small for the better 2' and 3's of the league.

Good take, Blackjack21. Hard to see a purpose for having this farm club if its best fruit always sits unharvested and untouched on the limb in favor of an old box of moldy fruit some other team tossed out.

[mad0214]

Gotta go with Hairston. Williams is too slow to guard most point guards, but for some reason, it seems like the FO loves this guy. Hairston has probably worked harder than anyone else and it shows the minute he steps onto the court. Hairston still has D League eligibility, and if the above reasons weren't reason enough, that should put him ahead of Williams. The question now becomes, where does Williams go from here? I'm guessing Europe.

[BlackBellamy]

+1

Now you all see why I told you the Bogan's signing was fucking retarded, and might end up costing the spurs a great young player for not only this year, but forever if he ends up signing elsewhere.

That signing is basically telling Hairston he's less important and needed to the team than a journeyman SCRUB that was available for the vet minimum (because nobody else wanted him).

Hairston was finally primed and ready RIGHT NOW THIS YEAR to step into that Udoka role as a 5th wing off the bench and give the team much needed youth and energy off the bench.

Whatever happens, it can be certain that now the relationship between the spurs and Hairston is not going to be on good terms.

++1 In roughly the same minutes averaged, Bogans = 2, 2, .5 and Hairston 7, 2, 2. On top of his offensive short comings showcased, Bogans hasn't showed his defensive prowess that he was brought in for. I think that maybe the Spurs knee jerked to replace Bowen and didn't trust RJ's improvement on the D-end. Between Jefferson and Manu as perimeter defenders and Blair, Duncan, Ratliff, ect. patrolling the paint it makes the Bogans signing almost a head-achey kind of perplexing. I'm not gonna bitch about the FO this year too much. If they feel that Hairston is good enough to pay some tax on, good for them. If they don't, he finds another home and proceeds to shred, it's the FO's own damn fault. Bottom line is that Bogans and Finley kicked some sand in the eyes of some youngsters this year, let's hope one small miscalculation doesn't bite us in the ass in coming years.

[EricB]

Soooo easy to understand that spending money on a guy like Hairston now, could actually mean spending less in the future.

Malik's got an upside that could make him a bargain, considering the potential role he'd fill; I suggest you read mountainballer's post and really make an effort to digest it.


I read it and again, its as always easy to spend someone's 3 million when its not yours.

[Manufan909]

Has Pop hinted in anyway who he thinks is playing better? Iirc, only Hairston has recieved praise from the players. MW... not so much.

And to the plane-sign guy, Pop does not GIVE A FUCK what ST thinks. I doubt he has ever visited this site of his own accord.

Also, Hairston has greatly outplayed MW and Bogans this preseason, his competition for varying reasons, but he's also outplayed Mason, and maybe even Fin. As long as MW isn't picked and Hairston makes the Toros or the Spurs, I'll be fine.

Oh, and everyone claiming the FO thinks Bogans=Bowen needs to quit smoking/drinking/injecting, no one ANYWHERE thinks that. They think he is a cheap addition to the D, nothing more nothing less.

[Mel_13]

Has Pop hinted in anyway who he thinks is playing better? Iirc, only Hairston has recieved praise from the players. MW... not so much.

And to the plane-sign guy, Pop does not GIVE A FUCK what ST thinks. I doubt he has ever visited this site of his own accord.

Also, Hairston has greatly outplayed MW and Bogans this preseason, his competition for varying reasons, but he's also outplayed Mason, and maybe even Fin. As long as MW isn't picked and Hairston makes the Toros or the Spurs, I'll be fine.

Oh, and everyone claiming the FO thinks Bogans=Bowen needs to quit smoking/drinking/injecting, no one ANYWHERE thinks that. They think he is a cheap addition to the D, nothing more nothing less.

Hairston did start with Duncan, McDyess, Jefferson, and Hill in the Clipper game. I don't think Williams got any such run with the first-line players.

[wildbill2u]

“They're both going to have a place in the league,” Popovich said. “They're good enough to be in the league and will make a team"

This may be a clue that neither will make the final cut --because of salary cost reasons I suppose

[senorglory]

1.5 million is a lot of money for a players that might simply not see the floor at all, IMHO.

Is $1.5 million a reasonable investment in a player that will be productive next year? If the Spurs have already invested a significant amount of resources in developing a player, is it worth $1.5M to see the investment through to next year?

I don't know. Just asking.

[Mel_13]

Is $1.5 million a reasonable investment in a player that will be productive next year? If the Spurs have already invested a significant amount of resources in developing a player, is it worth $1.5M to see the investment through to next year?

I don't know. Just asking.

I would imagine the FO and ownership are asking such questions now. We don't have access to all the info they have, so it's really hard to guess what they'll do. I'm sure it is a difficult decision.

As a fan, I want to see Malik on the Spurs.

[HarlemHeat37]

Hairston did start with Duncan, McDyess, Jefferson, and Hill in the Clipper game. I don't think Williams got any such run with the first-line players.

Also, as Bruno pointed out before, Hairston was the only "unproven" player to get first half minutes in the following game..everybody else(including Hairston again) played in the late 2nd half of the game..

[SpurCharger]

Im Ok With neither of them Making it....next year will be a Better Year For the 2 Of Them...

[Manufan909]

Hairston did start with Duncan, McDyess, Jefferson, and Hill in the Clipper game. I don't think Williams got any such run with the first-line players.

And he was one of the first to sub in in the Cavs game.

[MrChug]

Williams is horrible. He can suck some ass.

[The Truth #6]

I think they're both going to get cut. I don't think people are buying a lot of tractors these days. I'd like to see Hairston stick around and actually get a chance to play, but I don't see it happening. They should invest in Hairston to try him out this season because next year they could be without Finley (ha, just kidding, we know he'll play until he's 42), Mason, and if things go nuclear - Manu. Obviously, we won't lose them all - we'll still have Finley for years to come, but we do need to start training someone for the future.