McDonald: Spurs weigh Mahinmi’s fate

[duncan228]

Spurs weigh Mahinmi’s fate (http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/spurs/Spurs_weigh_Mahinmis_fate.html)
Jeff McDonald

Sometime before Monday’s NBA roster deadline, the Spurs must determine whether Malik Hairston or Marcus Williams will still have a job in San Antonio when the season starts.

Elsewhere on the roster, center Ian Mahinmi is battling a different, delayed sort of job insecurity. The Spurs have until Halloween to determine whether he will still have a job here next year.

Mahinmi, the 28th pick in the 2005 draft, is in the third season of his standard rookie contract, which comes with a team option for a fourth season. As the deadline to extend Mahinmi’s deal approaches, the Spurs’ decision-makers still don’t seem to know what to make of the enigmatic 22-year-old Frenchman, whose career to date has been long on promise but short on production.

“We haven’t talked about it yet,” Mahinmi said after Friday’s preseason finale against the Pacers. “All I can do is take it day after day and see what happens.”

Sometime this week, the Spurs must have their reckoning with Mahinmi.

The team must weigh what it has already invested in its 6-foot-11 project — three seasons and what will total about $2.45 million by the end of this season — against the price of buying Mahinmi more time.

Should the Spurs opt to bring Mahinmi back in 2010-11, it will cost them an additional $1.78 million — and double that, if they are unable to get below the luxury tax line for next season.

“It’s a situation where I think we’re not going to get ahead of the game,” Spurs coach Gregg Popovich said. “We’re going to take it day-to-day and see what we feel when the time comes.”

When it comes to deciding the fate of Mahinmi, the Spurs wish they had what they do not — more time, and a greater body of evidence.

Mahinmi, who is guaranteed $989,670 for the upcoming season, has played just one full season in the United States, a 2007-08 campaign spent mostly with the Austin Toros. He missed all of his sophomore campaign battling a litany of lower leg injuries, eventually requiring season-ending ankle surgery in February.

In brief stints against NBA-caliber competition, Mahinmi has yet to consistently show the form that once made him a Development League All-Star. He has shown glimpses of a natural shot-blocking prowess and can run the floor better than most NBA big men. Yet he is still raw offensively and remains foul prone.

In what amounts to the Spurs’ final evaluation of Mahinmi, he averaged 5.7 points and 3.2 rebounds in 15.3 minutes this preseason.

“He’s really working harder than one can even imagine, because he wants it to work,” Popovich said. “He’s progressing in a positive direction. He’s actually holding his own against guys in practice. As his confidence level increases, I think we’re going to see a better player.”

It can’t hurt Mahinmi’s case that he is coming off one of his best performances of the preseason. In the Spurs’ 114-112 loss at Indiana, Mahinmi stayed in a tight game down the stretch and produced two big buckets over Josh McRoberts.

Veteran center Theo Ratliff says he can understand why the Spurs have devoted so much time and energy to developing Mahinmi.

“He can be an NBA player,” Ratliff said. “It’s just a matter of him continuing to develop, understanding the different nuances of the game. That’s something this coaching staff teaches very well.”

Mahinmi is beginning to believe he belongs on an NBA court. Asked if he now can envision himself as an everyday player someday, Mahinmi didn’t hesitate.

“Oh yes,” he said. “Definitely.”

Whether that day will eventually come with the Spurs, or some other team, is a question for later this week.

NOTABLE: X-rays on DeJuan Blair’s bruised tailbone were negative Saturday. The rookie is considered day-to-day for practices but is not expected to miss Wednesday’s season-opener against New Orleans.

[Blackjack]

This is kind of reminding me of Claxton, whose option they didn't pick up..

Both largely unproven at the NBA level and injury-prone, but talented players on cheap contracts as well.

My gut says they do pick up his option, but nothing would surprise me.

[DPG21920]

I cannot get a good read, but my gut tells me they will err on the side of fiscal caution and not pick up his option. If they were leaning towards picking up his option I would think they would be more encouraging and give him many votes of confidence.

As a fan, I hope I am wrong and they spend the money to evaluate him further. But I also understand he is still largely unproven and the Spurs have done a lot money wise recently; I can see them saving where the can.

[Marcus Bryant]

He's coming back after missing almost a full year. The Spurs can afford to wait for him to get back to full strength. And should.

[Riverwalkman]

Mahinmi has been a promising rookie for 3 years, just let him play.

[DPG21920]

I agree and I hope so. I just cannot tell how the Spurs feel about him. My initial thought is that they are annoyed with him. I know to some of us, it is obvious that he is coming back from injury and we should be patient. But we are not the ones investing money and time in Ian. The Spurs are. So one can see why they might be ready to give up.

I really, really hope Ian gets his option picked up and he is given more time to adjust. He potentially fills such a huge need. I wonder how much Tiago weighs into this decision.

[exstatic]

I think if they want him next year, they'll pick up the option. Don't jump to conclusions and say "duh!". In another year, they might not have picked up the option and tried to lowball him for year 4, but next summer, there's going to be a shitload of disappointed suitors in the FA game, and heaven help the team that has a prospect that's a FA.

[Marcus Bryant]

Mahinmi had his big year with the Toros when the frontcourt rotation was set and there was no room for him in SA. Last year there was room and he was injured. While I think the Spurs aren't sure what they have, I don't think they've soured on him as much as this forum believes they have. They'd be foolish to run him off, especially to save the amount they could.

[DPG21920]

The funny thing is, that even though Ian has had EXTREMELY limited time with the big boys, he actually has performed decently well, especially before he was injured (I know it was garbage time and a small sample...).

I think he has done well and shown enough, but you never know. We will have a lot of these questions answered on the 31st.

[lrrr]

They'll pick it up. Dice and Theo will only be around 1-2 years. The team WILL be in need of another big a year from now. It WILL cost MORE to bring Splitter over, and there will be a lot of cashed up teams with money to burn, and we all know how much bigs can command on the FA market.

The price for Ian is actually very low, even for a gamble that he will be a serviceable big.

[Darkwaters]

I think they should pick up the option. I'm not sure if Mahinmi will ever turn it around, but if he does he could be quite the player. And if he doesn't then he would be very easy to trade next year as an expiring young athletic big. If we soured on him and decided to part ways after this season then some team would be willing to take a shot considering the small risk involved.

[EricB]

No brainer.

You pick it up.

[JWest596]

If the Spurs were not in the luxury tax, IMO, it wouldn't be an issue. But I suspect that they may cut him for fiscal concerns because for the Spurs money is always an issue. We'll know soon enough but in the long run, SA 's possible loss will be a gain for someone. Big men are still a scarcity. And just as sure as the Lakers suck, Ian will blossom after his cut from the Spurs and will be one that got away.

[Blackjack]

Just thinking aloud here; as much as you can on a message board..

If things go right and they sign Splitter and Bonner gets extended, what's been rumored, that leaves the Spurs with a rotation of: Duncan, 'Dyess, Blair, Splitter and Bonner.

I can't really see much out there that's going to be better than picking up Ian's option, at least not for a sixth big..

[Ice009]

Why wouldn't you pick up Ian's option? If not for his game, you could do it for his potential trade value. I really doubt the Spurs would not pick up that option.

Same with Hairston, why would you not keep him? Don't you have until January until his contract becomes fully guaranteed and counts towards the salary cap?

Blackjack21 I also read in the last game thread where someone mentioned that Bonner is talking about a contract extension. Was that you? I can't believe no one else has mentioned this. Is this true? I was kinda surprised to read that.

[phyzik]

IMHO, Mahinmi was a nice project, but its time to let it go. He is a perenial all-star in the D-league and will probably only ammount to a 2nd string at best on another NBA team. We just dont have the minutes for him now with Mcdyess, bonner and Ratliff.

[Ice009]

IMHO, Mahinmi was a nice project, but its time to let it go. He is a perenial all-star in the D-league and will probably only ammount to a 2nd string at best on another NBA team. We just dont have the minutes for him now with Mcdyess, bonner and Ratliff.

Why throw away a potential trade chip when bigs are sought after in this league?

[024]

i say pick up his option but i'm not the one picking up the luxury tax tab. spurs could be thinking of declining his option just to save money for splitter. mahinmi won't see much playing time this year, if any. so the spurs don't really need him. on the other hand, ratliff, bonner, and haislip may no longer be on the team next year, giving mahinmi more chances to shine. i want to see him succeed but improvements probably won't appear until next year.

[Danny.Zhu]

If they thought 1.78m is too expensive, is it possible that Spurs doesn't extend his current contract but renegotiate a new minimum contract? I thought the minimum for a 5th year player is less than 1m.

[Blackjack]

Blackjack21 I also read in the last game thread where someone mentioned that Bonner is talking about a contract extension. Was that you? I can't believe no one else has mentioned this. Is this true? I was kinda surprised to read that.

I think MaNu4Tres was the last poster I've seen mention it but there's been some reports of Bonner's agent and the Spurs trying to get something done.

[angelbelow]

Well its encouraging to hear Pop call him a hard worker and that he wants it badly. Also, that hes holding his own in practice.

[SenorSpur]

Personally, I don't even know why this is even a question. Of course, the Spurs pick up the option. If Ian were 26 and his performance was steady, I could understand the hesitation. However, he's 22 and improving. Has tremedous upside and seemingly works hard.

With Duncan, McDyess and Ratliff all likely gone in 2 years, the Spurs would be big fools to throw away a young, developing big of his skill and potential. As I've said before, young, talented bigs are not growing on trees.

After all, Pop's comments on his practice habits and progress are convincing enough for me to believe that the team will pick up his option. I'd be shocked if they didn't.

[Ice009]

I think MaNu4Tres was the last poster I've seen mention it but there's been some reports of Bonner's agent and the Spurs trying to get something done.

Was it talked about anywhere else or was he the only person to mention it? That really did surprise me. I wonder if getting him on a cheaper extension would help his trade value. I mean could he be worth more next season in free agency than if he was extended at a similar amount to his current salary?

[Blackjack]

Was it talked about anywhere else or was he the only person to mention it? That really did surprise me. I wonder if getting him on a cheaper extension would help his trade value. I mean could he be worth more next season in free agency than if he was extended at a similar amount to his current salary?

I couldn't tell you where I read it but he's not the only one to mention it. And if they're looking to extend him, it's for no other reason than they want to keep him in the program; I know how hard that is for some to hear/read. :lol

Bonner would seem to be a major piece for the Spurs if they're to make a deal this year, but an extension would pretty much take that chip off the table..

[Ice009]

I couldn't tell you where I read it but he's not the only one to mention it. And if they're looking to extend him, it's for no other reason than they want to keep him in the program; I know how hard that is for some to hear/read. :lol

Bonner would seem to be a major piece for the Spurs if they're to make a deal this year, but an extension would pretty much take that chip off the table..

Yeah, That's what I thought too. Giving him an extension if you're not planning on keeping him and making him a big part of the rotation would not help his trade value would it?

lol unless some team said - hey we like Bonner so much that we'll take him if you sign him to an extension ;).

[Manufan909]

Personally, I don't even know why this is even a question. Of course, the Spurs pick up the option. If Ian were 26 and his performance was steady, I could understand the hesitation. However, he's 22 and improving. Has tremedous upside and seemingly works hard.

With Duncan, McDyess and Ratliff all likely gone in 2 years, the Spurs would be big fools to throw away a young, developing big of his skill and potential. As I've said before, young, talented bigs are not growing on trees.

After all, Pop's comments on his practice habits and progess are convincing enough for me to believe that the team will pick up his option. I'd be shocked if they didn't.

Perfect reasoning. Hope that works on Holt like it did on me.

[Obstructed_View]

The Spurs picked up Beno's option, and that money is gone. Trying to recover it by failing to pick up Ian's option would be an even bigger mistake.

[TDMVPDPOY]

no b rainer, drop his ass now

[MaNu4Tres]

I wouldn't be surprised if Spurs don't pick it up and sign him for a lesser contract next off-season. A contract much like Blair's would be ideal.

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

I think if they want him next year, they'll pick up the option. Don't jump to conclusions and say "duh!". In another year, they might not have picked up the option and tried to lowball him for year 4, but next summer, there's going to be a shitload of disappointed suitors in the FA game, and heaven help the team that has a prospect that's a FA.


Mahinmi had his big year with the Toros when the frontcourt rotation was set and there was no room for him in SA. Last year there was room and he was injured. While I think the Spurs aren't sure what they have, I don't think they've soured on him as much as this forum believes they have. They'd be foolish to run him off, especially to save the amount they could.


They'll pick it up. Dice and Theo will only be around 1-2 years. The team WILL be in need of another big a year from now. It WILL cost MORE to bring Splitter over, and there will be a lot of cashed up teams with money to burn, and we all know how much bigs can command on the FA market.

The price for Ian is actually very low, even for a gamble that he will be a serviceable big.

Triple yup, nice takes. :tu

For me it breaks down like this:

1. Does he have the physical talent to be an NBA player?

Clearly, yes.

2. Does he have the will and desire to be an NBA player?

It seems like the coaches think so.

3. What is the ratio of financial risk:basketball reward?

Even with the lux tax hit, $2mil is nothing to venture at this point on a prospect you've been developing for 3 years who could be just about to take the next step, and at a time when you're spending.

4. Does he fit a team need?

Yes, Ratliff is a one-year hire, and who better to teach the kid his role - shot-blocking, rebounding and running the floor - than Theo, Dice and Timmy?

If they don't pick up his 4th year it's a BAD call according to my decision matrix. ;)

[mountainballer]

dozens of reasons why the Spurs should pick Ian's option.
so few tries to also see the other hand.
and I don't think the money is the major point (of course also not to ignore though).
I guess even the biggest fans of Ian meanwhile agree, that he won't play a significant role this season.
BLACKJACK21 mentioned the possible 2010-11 big rotation.
for me this is the more important point than the money.
bringing in Tiago will be a priority and I'm confident that it will work.
then Spurs have Tim, Dice, Blair and Tiago for the regular rotation. a nicely balanced rotation with size, nice offensive and defensive potential and good mix of youth and experience.
then BJ21 mentioned the rumors, that the Spurs might extend Bonner. I also can see why. the 3pt shooting big looks like the missing piece for this front court. (whatever Ian could provide, Tiago can on a much higher level)
so again Ian would be the 6th big. no chance to play d-league. no minutes at all. not even garbage time.
and after 2010-11 his rookie contract is expired.
so, what sense does this make??????? they will have had a player for 4 years, who never climbed higher than #6 in the big rotation.
btw. it's not that the Spurs will stop any moves regarding big man for ever.
James Gist is still in the pipeline and 2010 they will have a 1st round pick again. as it looks right now, it could be pretty deep in the big man department (DX currently has 15 bigs going in the 1st round, plus 4 combo forwards)
and like every team the Spurs will scout the market, if an interesting project could be signed or acquired via trade.
question: do you rather give the spot of the 6th big to a player, who is on the last year of his rookie contract, or to a 1st round pick, who you could also send to the D-league and who is under contract till 2014?

[ceperez]

For a big man, we got a bargain basement price.

Think about it, he was a D-league all star 2 years ago. That's when he was 20 years old?

[MaNu4Tres]

for a big man, we got a bargain basement price.

Think about it, he was a d-league all star 2 years ago. That's when he was 20 years old?

he was 21. He turns 23 in roughly two weeks.

[mountainballer]

For a big man, we got a bargain basement price.

Think about it, he was a D-league all star 2 years ago. That's when he was 20 years old?

oh well....

the 2008 d-league all stars (maybe you get the picture):

Morris Almond, Utah
Lance Allred, Idaho
Sean Banks, Los Angeles
Elton Brown, Colorado
Andre Barrett, Bakersfield
Kaniel Dickens, Colorado
Rod Benson, Dakota
Nick Fazekas, Tulsa
Kyrylo Fesenko, Utah
Eddie Gill, Colorado
Keith Langford, Austin
Randy Livingston, Idaho
Ian Mahinmi, Austin
Dwayne Mitchell, Iowa
Jelani McCoy, Los Angeles
Kasib Powell, Sioux Falls
Carlos Powell, Dakota
Billy Thomas, Colorado
Jeremy Richardson, Fort Wayne
Cory Violette, Idaho

[mountainballer]

And Mahimni is the only player that has stuck on an NBA roster this year.

right. but I'm not sure what you try to say by pointing at this.
my point is, making the d-league all star team doesn't exactly prove you are NBA potential, as ceperez tried to tell us.

[Mel_13]

oh well....

the 2008 d-league all stars (maybe you get the picture):


Kinda like using some ACB highlight reels to project a player into an NBA rotation.

I have to believe that the Spurs are making their decision based almost entirely on Ian's performance behind closed doors.

[Bruno]

Sometime before Monday’s NBA roster deadline, the Spurs must determine whether Malik Hairston or Marcus Williams will still have a job in San Antonio when the season starts.

I'm really surprised to see Spurs taking that much time to make the final cut. Marcus Williams has been DNP-CD for the last two games and cutting him should be a no-brainer. Aside of Spurs having some trade talks where Williams is part of a package, I don't see why they are waiting that much.


Elsewhere on the roster, center Ian Mahinmi is battling a different, delayed sort of job insecurity. The Spurs have until Halloween to determine whether he will still have a job here next year.

I don't see Spurs picking Ian's option. The main reason of that is that if you pick Ian's option you have to give him some minutes this year (Ian won't improve if he doesn't play ).

Now, the deadline is at the end of the month. Spurs will play a back-to-back before that and Spurs could decide to give Ian some minutes in the second game to make their final choice (if they are still hesitating on what to do).

It's also noteworthy that Spurs have until the end of the month to pick Hill option for 2010-2011 even if it makes no doubt that the option will be picked.

[mountainballer]

I'm really surprised to see Spurs taking that much time to make the final cut. Marcus Williams has been DNP-CD for the last two games and cutting him should be a no-brainer. Aside of Spurs having some trade talks where Williams is part of a package, I don't see why they are waiting that much.


maybe it's just as simple as that: they don't want to make 2 announcements about either MW and Malik, but they are still not totally sure about Malik. (which wouldn't be a good sign that they will keep Malik btw.)



It's also noteworthy that Spurs have until the end of the month to pick Hill option for 2010-2011 even if it makes no doubt that the option will be picked.

didn't think about this. but it makes sense that even if it's a no brainer to pick Hill's option, they wait. if they go out with the message that they picked just Hill, everyone would assume that Ian won't be picked (Ian included). so it's better to also wait till deadline with the Hill option.

[MaNu4Tres]

I'm really surprised to see Spurs taking that much time to make the final cut. Marcus Williams has been DNP-CD for the last two games and cutting him should be a no-brainer. Aside of Spurs having some trade talks where Williams is part of a package, I don't see why they are waiting that much.



I don't see Spurs picking Ian's option. The main reason of that is that if you pick Ian's option you have to give him some minutes this year (Ian won't improve if he doesn't play ).

Now, the deadline is at the end of the month. Spurs will play a back-to-back before that and Spurs could decide to give Ian some minutes in the second game to make their final choice (if they are still hesitating on what to do).

It's also noteworthy that Spurs have until the end of the month to pick Hill option for 2010-2011 even if it makes no doubt that the option will be picked.

I really don't see where Mahimni fits in the grand scheme of things. With McDyess here for another year and possibly two. And with Blair and the type of playing time he will earn if he keeps producing the way he is, not to mention he will be here for another 3 years after this year if his knees are able to stay stable. The Spurs and Bonner are in talks about an extension. Splitter most likely will come over next year as well. That's Duncan/ McDyess/ Blair/ Bonner/ Splitter depth chart next year maybe the year after.

This leads me to believe :

A. Mahimni may be used as a sweetner in a deal.

B. Mahimni's option isn't picked up and Spurs try to sign him to to a lesser contract similiar to Blair's where they keep working with him until McDyess retires and a spot in the rotation opens up.

As much as I like Mahimni's skill set for a 22 year old athletic prospect, he is round peg trying to fit in a square hole. He simply doesn't fit in the grand scheme of things in regards of playing time and improving in that sense. If he is picked up most likely he will be on the inactive list the majority of the time not only this year but the ensuing years as well.


Good take on the Spurs taking their time with their decision on Williams and Hairston, considering Williams had DNP's the last 2 games. Maybe a trade is in the works? Who knows.

[Bruno]

I really don't see where Mahimni fits in the grand scheme of things. With McDyess here for another year and possibly two. And with Blair and the type of playing time he will earn if he keeps producing the way he is, not to mention he will be here for another 3 years after this year if his knees are able to stay stable. The Spurs and Bonner are in talks about an extension. Splitter most likely will come over next year as well. That's Duncan/ McDyess/ Blair/ Bonner/ Splitter depth chart next year maybe the year after.


Let's see:
- McDyess is old.
- Bonner has been horrible in big games and isn't a very good player.
- Blair's knees are a time bomb.
- It's far from sure that Splitter will go in NBA in 2010 and if he does, he will be a rookie.

In a perfect scenario, Spurs will have too much bigmen but there are many sources of concerns and odds are low that this perfect scenario happens.

I disagree with the notion that Mahinmi's option won't be picked because of too much bigmen. If the option isn't picked, it will be mainly because Spurs don't see Ian as an interesting enough prospect.

[MaNu4Tres]

Let's see:
- McDyess is old.
- Bonner has been horrible in big games and isn't a very good player.
- Blair's knees are a time bomb.
- It's far from sure that Splitter will go in NBA in 2010 and if he does, he will be a rookie.

In a perfect scenario, Spurs will have too much bigmen but there are many sources of concerns and odds are low that this perfect scenario happens.

I disagree with the notion that Mahinmi's option won't be picked because of too much bigmen. If the option isn't picked, it will be mainly because Spurs don't see Ian as an interesting enough prospect.


I think they already believe Mahimni is an interesting prospect. I just don't think they believe a player who will be on the inactive list the majority time is worth roughly 3.5 million next year.


Let's see:
-McDyess is 35 and is our second best big man on the roster.
I guess when Bruce was 35 years old that would be a reason why Spurs would have wanted to spend 3.5 million on the likes an athletic young prospect by the name of James White to spend the majority of the year in a sportscoat? Just because Bruce was simply old.

-Matt Bonner had a rough series against the Mavs. But so did everyone not named Tim, Tony and Fin. Fact is Pop loves Matty and values him more than Mahimni for sure. As long as Matt is here, Mahimni won't ever see the floor at the expense of Matt Bonner. Hate to break your heart but that's the truth. Matty had a very productive 82 games out of 87 last year. Darn.

-Blair's knees going down the shitter is the only way Mahimni would ever see the floor over Blair. Unfortunately for Mahimni, Blair's knees are fine right now and have been the past 4 years and on top of that they are monitored daily by Spurs trainers. That being said things look more bright than cloudy for Blair and his deteriating 20 year old body.

-If Splitter does indeed come over, he may be a rookie but he would be put in the rotation instantly. Something that can't be said for Mahimni.

[wildbill2u]

I think they give him a one year contract and see how it goes. Maybe they can sell it to someone if it doesn't go well.

[completely deck]

As someone already said, I think they'll keep him but only as trade bait

[galvatron3000]

If he's holding his own in practice and you have great veteran Bigs there to help guide this "22" year old prospect and everything the saying is true and not smoke screen to garner trade partners, then pick up the option. He is going to improve, how much who knows but he is going to get better. He can learn alot this year alone especially in limited practices. If just one Big gets hurt he'll be needed, I'm tired of Bonner anyway. I'd rather have size inside instead of size on the perimeter at this point simply because I want to see more rebounding and presence downlow. Bonner provides non. I don't see the point of Bonner and Haislip unless a trade is in the works soon.

Williams will eventually be cut because Hairston has perform well for a second year player in a system he is more familiar with. We asked for youth now we have it yet we holding on to age that we dont need "in some cases"

[velik_m]

Why pay 3 million for your 6th big? I say they don't pick his option.

[Muser]

Pick it up.

Best case - He develops into a decent big who can be used in the post Duncan era.

Worst case - Trade chip.

[MaNu4Tres]

To be completely honest if Spurs indeed don't pick up his option and believe 3-3.5 million is too much for a 6th big which is understandable, Spurs still will be in good position to resign him for a contract similiar to Blair's.

Reason why I say this is because next year the cap is due to decrease next year due to the economy.

On top of that most teams in the NBA aren't even carrying more than 13 players as they used to. There's a lot of players that had NBA jobs last year that won't this year because of the economy and with the cap decreasing that most likely will be the case next year as well.

Spurs will still be in good position to resign him for the price they want, if they decide they still want to continue developing him.

[Bruno]

Let's see:
-McDyess is 35 and is our second best big man on the roster.
I guess when Bruce was 35 years old that would be a reason why Spurs would have wanted to spend 3.5 million on the likes an athletic young prospect by the name of James White to spend the majority of the year in a sportscoat? Just because Bruce was simply old.

-Matt Bonner had a rough series against the Mavs. But so did everyone not named Tim, Tony and Fin. Fact is Pop loves Matty and values him more than Mahimni for sure. As long as Matt is here, Mahimni won't ever see the floor at the expense of Matt Bonner. Hate to break your heart but that's the truth. Matty had a very productive 82 games out of 87 last year. Darn.

-Blair's knees going down the shitter is the only way Mahimni would ever see the floor over Blair. Unfortunately for Mahimni, Blair's knees are fine right now and have been the past 4 years and on top of that they are monitored daily by Spurs trainers. That being said things look more bright than cloudy for Blair and his deteriating 20 year old body.

-If Splitter does indeed come over, he may be a rookie but he would be put in the rotation instantly. Something that can't be said for Mahimni.

Let's see:
- You compare Mahinmi to "James White".
- You think that Ian will never be at Bonner's level while Bonner is a very average player who does nothing when it mattered.
- You think that Splitter will be immediately above Mahinmi in the rotation.

It's hard to come with another conclusion that you think that Ian is a scrub. I have no problem with that but you should stop with the BS like "fits in the grand scheme of things" or "he is round peg trying to fit in a square hole". It's ridiculous.

[Ice009]

The Spurs and Bonner are in talks about an extension.

Where did you hear this?

You seem to be the only one on the message board saying this. I think I saw you mention this in the game thread the other day too. Did I miss the discussion on this?

[Bruno]

Bonner's contract can't be extended.

[Ice009]

Bonner's contract can't be extended.

If this is true why is Manu4tres mentioning it numerous times and why is no one getting on him about where he heard it?

[MaNu4Tres]

Let's see:
- You compare Mahinmi to "James White".
- You think that Ian will never be at Bonner's level while Bonner is a very average player who does nothing when it mattered.
- You think that Splitter will be immediately above Mahinmi in the rotation.

It's hard to come with another conclusion that you think that Ian is a scrub. I have no problem with that but you should stop with the BS like "fits in the grand scheme of things" or "he is round peg trying to fit in a square hole". It's ridiculous.

Lol I understand your biased towards your homeland. That is fine. I don't think Ian is a scrub. As I've stated before and I'll state it again. I just believe the Spurs may believe 3-3.5 million is too much for a player in a sportscoat. And no that's not an insult towards Mahimni. He just happens to play on a team that has quality depth and will this year and the next year as well. Especially if Splitter comes over.

Ian very well could be better than Bonner in 4 years. He certainly has the potential to be. There has been progress in his development, but it has been rather methodical. And that's understandable with the year off he had last year.

I'm not comparing Mahimni to James White the player. You used the McDyess is old excuse to justify spending 3.0-3.5 million on a player who will be on the inactive list or at the end of the bench playing mop up duty at best. That is why I used Bruce being old excuse to justify spending 3.5 million on an athletic prospect like White. I never said Mahimni has the same skill level and potential as White. Stop putting words in my mouth.

And Splitter would be put in the rotation before Mahimni. Hate to break it to you.


To cool down your french fries, I hope Mahimni is here to stay for the next 5 years so we could see him develop into a starting caliber NBA big man. I just think the smart thing to do would be to not pick up his option, but have him understand he's still wanted for the future by the organization. And make it known that their willing to invest in him for the future. Just for not as much money. A deal like Blair's would be ideal.

[Bruno]

If this is true why is Manu4tres mentioning it numerous times and why is no one getting on him about where he heard it?

Someone close to Bonner has posted here that there were talks about an extension. The only problem is that Bonner isn't eligible to get an extension.

[Bruno]

To cool down your french fries

I don't talk with xenophobic people.

[Ice009]

Someone close to Bonner has posted here that there were talks about an extension. The only problem is that Bonner isn't eligible to get an extension.

So that person lied then if it's not possible to extend? Does anyone know if he is actually close to Bonner or did everyone have to take his word for it? btw do you happen to remember which thread it was in Bruno? No need to search for it though just asking in case you recall which thread it was in.

[MaNu4Tres]

Bonner's contract can't be extended.

Maybe not extended but they are in talks already about a new contract. Some of these things happen before they are allowed to especially if the player plays for the team in negotions with his agent. Of course it isn't a rush. But the Spurs have made it known that it is of their interest.

[Bruno]

So that person lied then if it's not possible to extend? Does anyone know if he is actually close to Bonner or did everyone have to take his word for it?

This person is legit and reliable. I guess there have been some misunderstood.

[Ice009]

Maybe not extended but they are in talks already about a new contract. Some of these things happen before they are allowed to especially if the player plays for the team in negotions with his agent. Of course it isn't a rush. But the Spurs have made it known that it is of their interest.

So what is the deal here then? The Spurs won't trade him??? They want to keep him?

[urunobili]

I think the smartest thing is to lock Mahimni another year.... Bruno question if they don´t, would he become a restricted free agent or not not?

[MaNu4Tres]

Where did you hear this?

You seem to be the only one on the message board saying this. I think I saw you mention this in the game thread the other day too. Did I miss the discussion on this?

I have a family member who is married to a person within the Spurs organization.

That's all I can say.

[Mel_13]

I have a family member who is married to a person within the Spurs organization.

That's all I can say.

Bonner can't be extended. Not allowed under the CBA.

[Bruno]

Bruno questionÑ if they don´t would he become a restricted free agent or not not?

He would be an unrestricted free agent .

[MaNu4Tres]

I don't talk with xenophobic people.

I'm actually dating a girl from Ecuador.

[Ice009]

I have a family member who is married to a person within the Spurs organization.

That's all I can say.

Alright, fair enough thanks for the info. I just thought he would be shopped around for a trade, but if they want to resign him then I wonder if they would be willing to trade him.

[MaNu4Tres]

Bonner can't be extended. Not allowed under the CBA.

Maybe not extended. But the way it was told to me is that it is of Spurs interest to have Bonner in silver and black for a few more years.

Reason why this was brought up was because I was trying to find out if Bonner was being shopped around. Unfortunatley I was told that they are more interested to bring him back in the saddle for more years whenever this year is over with.

They can't extend him during the year but they can sign him once its over.

[ElNono]

I think if it would be a 'No Brainer', as many people mention here, they would have picked up the option already, and there wouldn't be an article written about it (pretty much how the 2010-2011 George Hill extension is going to go).
The reality is that there's simply not going to be enough minutes for him, and sending him to the Toros is no longer an option, so I wouldn't be surprised if they ask him to go play overseas for a while. The 'trade chip' idea is neat and all, but if you can't showcase the guy, it can be a tough sell in this economy. I can see him being more of a 'trade filler' instead.

[Ice009]

Maybe not extended. But the way it was told to me is that it is of Spurs interest to have Bonner in silver and black for a few more years.

Reason why this was brought up was because I was trying to find out if Bonner was being shopped around. Unfortunatley I was told that they are more interested to bring him back in the saddle for more years whenever this year is over with.

They can't extend him during the year but they can sign him once its over.

Yeah, well if that is the case then him being included in a trade for Jackson or Nocioni is not looking too good. Is a 3 point shooting bigman that important? Who on the Spurs values Matt that highly and what has impressed them to want to resign him, or express interest this early to resign him? Is Pop pleased with the effort he gave last season or the work he has done during the off season and preseason?

[picnroll]

At no point has Mahinmi shown exceptional talent, only a play here and a play there. If it was Ibaka I'd do it. Mahinmi for two years more development on the bench, then going into a total rebuilding situations with a retired Duncan and an elderly Ginobili. In no way has Mahinmi shown he's worth it.

[Russ]

People seem to be missing the fact that the Spurs hold all the cards when it comes to Mahinmi.

They can decline his option and still resign him next year if he works out. They'll have much more information upon which to base that decision next year as opposed to now (e.g., is Splitter coming, what roles can Blair handle). The only possible downside is if M has such a breakout year that his option contract looks like a bargain. In that unlikely scenario, the one year option probably won't mean much anyway -- he'll only be a year away from pricing himself out of the Spurs' range in any event.

The test as to whether the Spurs should exercise M's option may be his value to other teams now. Does he have trade value now? Viewing his contract in that light can help place his contract option in context. If he does not have value now, the Spurs will likely still be first in line for M next season even if they don't renew.

[Ice009]

At no point has Mahinmi shown exceptional talent, only a play here and a play there. If it was Ibaka I'd do it. Mahinmi for two years more development on the bench, then going into a total rebuilding situations with a retired Duncan and an elderly Ginobili. In no way has Mahinmi shown he's worth it.

Well I would be OK with the Spurs telling him they would still like to keep him, but on a minimum contract. I don't know if Ian would go for that and then you could also have another team willing to give him minutes and more money so I guess the best option would be to pick up that option.

[MaNu4Tres]

Yeah, well if that is the case then him being included in a trade for Jackson or Nocioni is not looking too good. Is a 3 point shooting bigman that important? Who on the Spurs values Matt that highly and what has impressed them to want to resign him, or express interest this early to resign him? Is Pop pleased with the effort he gave last season or the work he has done during the off season and preseason?

Bonner may not be included. He might you never know with the sports business.

But Spurs can still get Jackson or Nocioni by sending out Mason/ Finley/ Mahimni or Williams. Salary wise.

[exstatic]

If they don't pick up his option, you can pretty much write him off as a Spur. There will be a ton of teams with cap room next year, and one of them will almost certainly make Ian an offer. Shit, a team without cap room could steal him with a fractional MLE offer if the Spurs aren't willing to pay him a salary slot of $1.75M, a team like CHA and Larry Brown, who have been drooling over him.

I think Mahinmi's "development deal" was pretty much terminated when they signed Ratliff. When the team signs a veteran player who has the exact skillset they want you to develop, and that development has been slowed or hindered, it's never a good sign. Same thing with Bogans/Hairston. At this point, other than Hill/Blair, I don't think the Spurs GAF about anyone else's development. They're in a WIN NOW mode.

[ceperez]

100% guaranteed that the Spurs are going to pick up the $1.78m tab for Mahinmi.

That's a bargain basement deal, and I'm pretty sure if that it doesn't work out, that there are plenty of other teams out there willing to make a deal with the Spurs for this asset.

For the life of me, I can't see why there's even a discussion about this.

It's brain dead simple.

[Mel_13]

If they don't pick up his option, you can pretty much write him off as a Spur. There will be a ton of teams with cap room next year, and one of them will almost certainly make Ian an offer. Shit, a team without cap room could steal him with a fractional MLE offer if the Spurs aren't willing to pay him a salary slot of $1.75M, a team like CHA and Larry Brown, who have been drooling over him.

I think Mahinmi's "development deal" was pretty much terminated when they signed Ratliff. When the team signs a veteran player who has the exact skillset they want you to develop, and that development has been slowed or hindered, it's never a good sign. Same thing with Bogans/Hairston. At this point, other than Hill/Blair, I don't think the Spurs GAF about anyone else's development. They're in a WIN NOW mode.

This is it. If the Spurs want Ian for next year and beyond, they'll pick up his option.

The notion that they'll decline his option and then sign him next summer is nonsense. If he plays poorly, there's no reason to keep him. If he plays well, they won't be able to keep him.

If they decline his option, Ian's day as a Spur are numbered and will not extend beyond the end of the season.

[picnroll]

100% guaranteed that the Spurs are going to pick up the $1.78m tab for Mahinmi.

That's a bargain basement deal, and I'm pretty sure if that it doesn't work out, that there are plenty of other teams out there willing to make a deal with the Spurs for this asset.

For the life of me, I can't see why there's even a discussion about this.

It's brain dead simple.

I'll never give up my Rasheed quote until Bonner is wearing another jersey, but this one, after Oct 31, would likely be pretty tempting.

[Mel_13]

I'll never give up my Rasheed quote until Bonner is wearing another jersey, but this one, after Oct 31, would likely be pretty tempting.
:lol

[AFBlue]

I think they'll pick up Mahinmi's option for the same reason they're considering bringing back Bonner...he has a unique skill set that the Spurs likely can't get elsewhere at the same cost.

Mahinmi still has value to this team because he knows the system and brings something to the table that the Spurs need...an athletic big man that can run the floor, post up, block some shots and grab some boards.

The promise of that player should be enough to get the Spurs to bite for one more year. From there, it's all about Ian making the most of his opportunities...of which there should be plenty this year and next.

[Darkwaters]

I think they'll pick up Mahinmi's option for the same reason they're considering bringing back Bonner...he has a unique skill set that the Spurs likely can't get elsewhere at the same cost.

Mahinmi still has value to this team because he knows the system and brings something to the table that the Spurs need...an athletic big man that can run the floor, post up, block some shots and grab some boards.

The promise of that player should be enough to get the Spurs to bite for one more year. From there, it's all about Ian making the most of his opportunities...of which there should be plenty this year and next.

No, they signed Ratliff to do all those things too. And Ratliff makes about the same amount of money as Mahinmi, but without the rookie mistakes. And don't give me the "made of glass" routine either...they're both china dolls.

[HarlemHeat37]

Ratliff isn't an athletic big that can run the floor or post up at all..

[CGD]

If they don't pick up his option, you can pretty much write him off as a Spur. There will be a ton of teams with cap room next year, and one of them will almost certainly make Ian an offer. Shit, a team without cap room could steal him with a fractional MLE offer if the Spurs aren't willing to pay him a salary slot of $1.75M, a team like CHA and Larry Brown, who have been drooling over him.

I don't think its over at all. In fact because Ian is a unknown quantity, the Spurs will be in the best position to negotiate with him next summer. I wouldn't be surprised if the Spurs don't extend him and then pick him up for cheaper when he's a free agent.

[MaNu4Tres]

Ratliff isn't an athletic big that can run the floor or post up at all..

Either is Mahimni. Mahimni is athletic who's best at facing up on the offensive end, opposed to posting up. Mahimni is more skilled offensively but Ratliff is more savvy and smart defensive player. Something Spurs need.

Mahimni also runs the floor adequately but his problem is when he's the recipient of passes. He runs like he's uncoordinated and has trouble catching balls on the move and fluidly finishing strong around the rim. The only positive that you can get out of him running the floor well is getting back defensively in transition.

[itzsoweezee]

Personally, I don't even know why this is even a question. Of course, the Spurs pick up the option. If Ian were 26 and his performance was steady, I could understand the hesitation. However, he's 22 and improving. Has tremedous upside and seemingly works hard.

With Duncan, McDyess and Ratliff all likely gone in 2 years, the Spurs would be big fools to throw away a young, developing big of his skill and potential. As I've said before, young, talented bigs are not growing on trees.

After all, Pop's comments on his practice habits and progress are convincing enough for me to believe that the team will pick up his option. I'd be shocked if they didn't.

completely agree

[HarlemHeat37]

Either is Mahimni. Mahimni is athletic who's best at facing up on the offensive end, opposed to posting up. Mahimni is more skilled offensively but Ratliff is more savvy and smart defensive player. Something Spurs need.

Mahimni also runs the floor adequately but his problem is when he's the recipient of passes. He runs like he's uncoordinated and has trouble catching balls on the move and fluidly finishing strong around the rim. The only positive that you can get out of him running the floor well is getting back defensively in transition.

Ratliff is definitely a better player than Ian, and he's a more useful option at this point, that's not my point..Ian is potentially a much more versatile player though, which is why I believe he's different than Ratliff, and could potentially give us more..

Ian, even as raw as he is, has shown that he's a better offensive player than Ratliff without question IMO..obviously Theo has him beat everywhere else though, and he's definitely more reliable right now, and probably will be for this entire season..

[MaNu4Tres]

Ratliff is definitely a better player than Ian, and he's a more useful option at this point, that's not my point..Ian is potentially a much more versatile player though, which is why I believe he's different than Ratliff, and could potentially give us more..

Ian, even as raw as he is, has shown that he's a better offensive player than Ratliff without question IMO..obviously Theo has him beat everywhere else though, and he's definitely more reliable right now, and probably will be for this entire season..

I think you misunderstood what I meant Harlem. I agree totally on your notion that Ratliff is definitely more reliable right now and will be for the year most likely. 48moh had a great article on how dominating Ratliff's interior defense is. It's been obvious as well with Pop playing Ratliff in the rotation with the main rotational players the last two games. I was just stating that Mahimni doesn't really have a post up game and him running the floor well doesn't necessary correlate to easy buckets on the offensive end.

[TIMMYD!]

Knowing Pop and his love for projects, they'll pick up the option.

[Darkwaters]

Ratliff isn't an athletic big that can run the floor or post up at all..

At this point neither is Mahinmi.

[itzsoweezee]

Knowing Pop and his love for projects

that's a joke, right?

[NFGIII]

Based on the comments here I tend to believe that the Spurs will pick up the option on Ian simply since bigs are always in demand and hard to come by. He still is improving (according to the coaching staff), young (22) and shows so much potential. Hopefully they do and Holt continues to spend $$$ in order to keep a competitive team on the floor.

Though I'm not completely sold on Ian who is out there that we can get to replace him? Theo's gone next year and we all know what Bonner is here for and that isn't rebounding or D. We need bigs in this league in order to compete.

In the short term - pick up the option - but in the long term I'm in a wait and see mode concerning Ian.

[exstatic]

How's he supposed to progress when he's the 6th big, and will likely be modeling a suit for 60-70 games this year?

Tim
Dice
Blair
Rat
Bonner
Ian

I'm making my call now

Hill - option picked up
Ian - option declined
Malik - cut

[Thompson]

How's he supposed to progress when he's the 6th big, and will likely be modeling a suit for 60-70 games this year?


Garbage time and back-to-back games. Ratliff or Haislip might alternate games in a suit, with Hairston probably in Austin (though perhaps they could use Hairston for back-to-backs as well, with Manu in street clothes). As Mahinmi rounds back into form, he might get more time as his play warrants. I think they'd be crazy not to pick up the option, you won't find a player like him for that price in free agency (and Ratliff will probably be gone next year, won't he?).

[Interrohater]

Yea, it seems to make too much sense to pick him up right now on the cheap. With so much money out there next year, his stock is going to go up just because he's a young 7 footer with potential and he'll be too pricey. I say pick up the option now, that way you have him for cheap, or you make a profit by trading him to a team that's hurting and get a couple of picks and maybe a decent roleplayer.

[AFBlue]

No, they signed Ratliff to do all those things too. And Ratliff makes about the same amount of money as Mahinmi, but without the rookie mistakes. And don't give me the "made of glass" routine either...they're both china dolls.

Ratliff is old, fragile (will use it because it's true) and signed to a one-year deal. This "fate" being discussed is for next year, not this one.

[Mr. Body]

NOTABLE: X-rays on DeJuan Blair’s bruised tailbone were negative Saturday. The rookie is considered day-to-day for practices but is not expected to miss Wednesday’s season-opener against New Orleans.

I can only imagine how large the x-ray machine must have been to fit Blair's enormous butt behind.

[Interrohater]

I can only imagine how large the x-ray machine must have been to fit Blair's enormous butt behind.
:lol
The Cowboys Stadium bigscreen comes to mind

[Allanon]

Ratliff next year will be 37
Dice next year will be 36

They'll hang 'em up pretty soon so the Spurs gotta look at the younger guys:

Mahinmi
Haislip
Blair
Bonner

Haislip and Blair are probably keepers. Bonner is probably gone after this year unless he takes a huge pay cut.

So with only 3 Big Men (Duncan/Blair/Haislip), the Spurs would need to keep a guy like Mahinmi. They probably are taking their time with his option because they want to keep their options open in case the right Big man comes along for a good price. If nothing better comes along, I suspect Ian will be a Spur for a few more years.

[DPG21920]

How can you say Haislip is probably a keeper? Bonner take a huge pay cut? He does not make very much at all. His production is on par with his salary. Blair probably a keeper? The Spurs have him locked up already for multiple years.

[MaNu4Tres]

How can you say Haislip is probably a keeper? Bonner take a huge pay cut? He does not make very much at all. His production is on par with his salary. Blair probably a keeper? The Spurs have him locked up already for multiple years.

He's a Laker fan. He doesn't know any better.

[Allanon]

How can you say Haislip is probably a keeper? Bonner take a huge pay cut? He does not make very much at all. His production is on par with his salary. Blair probably a keeper? The Spurs have him locked up already for multiple years.

Sorry, didn't clarify:

Blair is a keeper because he's already under contract for multiple years
Haislip is a keeper because he's dirt cheap and serviceable

Bonner makes $3 million. With the Spurs over cap, I suspect he's going to have to take the Vet minimum to stay. I wouldn't pay $3 million for Bonner; he'd have to take at least a 50% paycut if not the minimum.

[Allanon]

He's a Laker fan. He doesn't know any better.

Very true.

[AFBlue]

Ratliff isn't an athletic big that can run the floor or post up at all..


Either is Mahimni. Mahimni is athletic who's best at facing up on the offensive end, opposed to posting up. Mahimni is more skilled offensively but Ratliff is more savvy and smart defensive player. Something Spurs need.

Mahimni also runs the floor adequately but his problem is when he's the recipient of passes. He runs like he's uncoordinated and has trouble catching balls on the move and fluidly finishing strong around the rim. The only positive that you can get out of him running the floor well is getting back defensively in transition.

Disagree about Mahinmi not being a post-up big. I'd say 90% of his offense is generated in the post and whether he ends up with a "face up" drive or a baby hook across the lane, he starts with his back to the basket. Ratliff, on the other hand, has literally no offensive game.

As for Ratliff being a more savvy defensive player, I agree...which is why he'll start out the season ahead of Mahinmi on the depth chart. But again, Ratliff's deal is for one year and Mahinmi's option decision is for next season. Perhaps it'll be good for Mahinmi to learn the ropes from Ratliff and at some point (this year or next) surpass him on the depth chart.

Either way, the point is that Mahinmi is more of a complete offensive player, which combines with his athleticism and defensive (shot blocking) potential to make his skill set a unique one for this squad.

Because of that unique skill set, I think his option gets picked up for next year with the hope that he steps up and turns the corner defensively. And I believe that he'll be given plenty of opportunity to prove himself throughout the season.

[Mel_13]

Sorry, didn't clarify:

Blair is a keeper because he's already under contract for multiple years
Haislip is a keeper because he's dirt cheap and serviceable

Bonner makes $3 million. With the Spurs over cap, I suspect he's going to have to take the Vet minimum to stay. I wouldn't pay $3 million for Bonner; he'd have to take at least a 50% paycut if not the minimum.

Haislip's cheap, but there's no evidence he's serviceable. I'd bet he's not in the NBA next season.

If Bonner shoots as well this year as he did last year, he'll be paid well above the minimum. He may be a one-trick pony, but it's a good trick.

[itzsoweezee]

If Bonner shoots as well this year as he did last year, he'll be paid well above the minimum. He may be a one-trick pony, but it's a good trick.

i think you're dreaming. the spurs way over-paid that dude. if he was a shotting guard, maybe. but a big man has to do something, anything, besides shoot threes.

[DPG21920]

Sorry, didn't clarify:

Blair is a keeper because he's already under contract for multiple years
Haislip is a keeper because he's dirt cheap and serviceable

Bonner makes $3 million. With the Spurs over cap, I suspect he's going to have to take the Vet minimum to stay. I wouldn't pay $3 million for Bonner; he'd have to take at least a 50% paycut if not the minimum.

Allanon, where to start with this....

Blair I agree with. He is still an unknown, and there are still long-term injury concerns, but he is under contract and early signs are good.

I still don't know how you can say that about Haislip when: 1) I can say with a certain degree of confidence that you have never seen him play and 2) that he has sucked something fierce with the Spurs so far. He has been one of the worst players, if not the worst.

It is not Bonner's fault the team is over the tax and has no bearing on his market/production value. He is being paid fairly for his skill set.

[Spurs Brazil]

Just thinking aloud here; as much as you can on a message board..

If things go right and they sign Splitter and Bonner gets extended, what's been rumored, that leaves the Spurs with a rotation of: Duncan, 'Dyess, Blair, Splitter and Bonner.

I can't really see much out there that's going to be better than picking up Ian's option, at least not for a sixth big..

Agree

I hope Mahinmi shows he can play but I don't see the Spurs paying $1.8 million for the 6th big

[Russ]

Ratliff next year will be 37
Dice next year will be 36

They'll hang 'em up pretty soon so the Spurs gotta look at the younger guys:

Mahinmi
Haislip
Blair
Bonner

Haislip and Blair are probably keepers. Bonner is probably gone after this year unless he takes a huge pay cut.

So with only 3 Big Men (Duncan/Blair/Haislip), the Spurs would need to keep a guy like Mahinmi. They probably are taking their time with his option because they want to keep their options open in case the right Big man comes along for a good price. If nothing better comes along, I suspect Ian will be a Spur for a few more years.

There is this fellow named Splitter my Laker friend . . .

[Russ]

I hope Mahinmi shows he can play but I don't see the Spurs paying $1.8 million for the 6th big

I think we finally have a winner. :toast

[Allanon]

Allanon, where to start with this....

Blair I agree with. He is still an unknown, and there are still long-term injury concerns, but he is under contract and early signs are good.

Agreed.



I still don't know how you can say that about Haislip when: 1) I can say with a certain degree of confidence that you have never seen him play and 2) that he has sucked something fierce with the Spurs so far. He has been one of the worst players, if not the worst.

I don't think he's sucked any worse than Bonner or Mahinmi. To me, he's still feeling out the NBA game. He's used to the Euro game, he'll need some time to adjust. I personally think he'll get more PT than Bonner this year.



It is not Bonner's fault the team is over the tax and has no bearing on his market/production value. He is being paid fairly for his skill set.

That's really a matter of opinion. Some guys like you hold Bonner in high regard, while others, like myself think he's a stiff. If you would like to see Bonner taking up another $3 million on the Spurs salary, that's cool. I personally wouldn't pay him any more than the vet minimum. But I'm just a fan; we'll see what the Spurs decide to do.

[DPG21920]

Look at the numbers, Bonner has been way more productive offensively and defensively than Haislip this preseason. Mahinmi has shown much more ability. Not really even up for discussion.

You can say what you will about Bonner, but he per minutes stats justify his salary.

[Mel_13]

i think you're dreaming. the spurs way over-paid that dude. if he was a shotting guard, maybe. but a big man has to do something, anything, besides shoot threes.

I guess we'll find out next summer.

In the meantime, you may want to take a look at salaries around the NBA. In the crazy context of NBA salaries, Matt Bonner is not overpaid.

[AFBlue]

There is this fellow named Splitter my Laker friend . . .

First...I don't think the Spurs can or will factor Splitter into their decision to extend Mahinmi because they just can't operate under the assumption that it will occur.

If Splitter doesn't come and the Spurs decided to let go of Mahinmi, do they just bring back Ratliff, who will be a year older?

Second...even IF Splitter comes over, I don't see how he'll start out on the depth chart ahead of Mahinmi without ever playing a game in the Spurs' system. Mahinmi, if kept, would most certainly not be the 6th big on next year's team.

[Allanon]

Look at the numbers, Bonner has been way more productive offensively and defensively than Haislip this preseason. Mahinmi has shown much more ability. Not really even up for discussion.

You can say what you will about Bonner, but he per minutes stats justify his salary.

Like I said, that's cool if you like Bonner, I just disagree. With the number of offensive guys already on the Spurs, I think Haislip is a better option than Bonner.

I think Blair+Haislip would make a 10x better duo off the bench than Bonner+Blair.

[Mel_13]

First...I don't think the Spurs can or will factor Splitter into their decision to extend Mahinmi because they just can't operate under the assumption that it will occur.

If Splitter doesn't come and the Spurs decided to let go of Mahinmi, do they just bring back Ratliff, who will be a year older?

Second...even IF Splitter comes over, I don't see how he'll start out on the depth chart ahead of Mahinmi without ever playing a game in the Spurs' system. Mahinmi, if kept, would most certainly not be the 6th big on next year's team.


Splitter is so far ahead of Mahinmi now, it is a virtual impossibility that Ian can catch him in one year, if ever. If Splitter comes next year, he immediately moves ahead of Ian on the depth chart.

[Allanon]

Splitter is so far ahead of Mahinmi now, it is a virtual impossibility that Ian can catch him in one year, if ever. If Splitter comes next year, he immediately moves ahead of Ian on the depth chart.

I agree with Splitter, he's way ahead of every one of the Spurs big men save Duncan.

[AFBlue]

Look at the numbers, Bonner has been way more productive offensively and defensively than Haislip this preseason. Mahinmi has shown much more ability. Not really even up for discussion.

You can say what you will about Bonner, but he per minutes stats justify his salary.

I'm not saying Bonner is overpaid, but Haislip's deal is for two years. So he's got the full year, IMO, to prove that he can be the perimeter-oriented big to stretch the D.

If he can prove that, in practice at first then in game situations, the subtraction of Bonner's one talent seems plausible.

It's a big IF given what we've seen from Haislip so far, but it's very early in the game to count him out.

[Spurs Brazil]

And about Haislip I think the Spurs regret giving him a guaranteed contract

[Mel_13]

Like I said, that's cool if you like Bonner, I just disagree. With the number of offensive guys already on the Spurs, I think Haislip is a better option than Bonner.

I think Blair+Haislip would make a 10x better duo off the bench than Bonner+Blair.

I'm telling you, I've seen the guy play. Haislip is an NBA player in name only. Spurs bet on a longshot, it's not gonna pay off.

[Mel_13]

I'm not saying Bonner is overpaid, but Haislip's deal is for two years. So he's got the full year, IMO, to prove that he can be the perimeter-oriented big to stretch the D.

If he can prove that, in practice at first then in game situations, the subtraction of Bonner's one talent seems plausible.

It's a big IF given what we've seen from Haislip so far, but it's very early in the game to count him out.

Only the first year is guaranteed.

[DPG21920]

Like I said, that's cool if you like Bonner, I just disagree. With the number of offensive guys already on the Spurs, I think Haislip is a better option than Bonner.

I think Blair+Haislip would make a 10x better duo off the bench than Bonner+Blair.

Ok, but why do you disagree is the question? How can you back up what you are saying?

Have you watched Haislip play with the Spurs?

[AFBlue]

Splitter is so far ahead of Mahinmi now, it is a virtual impossibility that Ian can catch him in one year, if ever. If Splitter comes next year, he immediately moves ahead of Ian on the depth chart.

I'm not saying Mahinmi is more talented than Splitter right now or even with a full year of development. I'm saying that it's doubtful Pop will immediately insert Splitter into the lineup if he has another viable option that knows the system.

You obviously disagree, so we'll leave it at that.

[Mel_13]

i'm not saying mahinmi is more talented than splitter right now or even with a full year of development. I'm saying that it's doubtful pop will immediately insert splitter into the lineup if he has another viable option that knows the system.

You obviously disagree, so we'll leave it at that.

ok

[HarlemHeat37]

Based on the 3 NBA games + exhibition game + scrimmage I've seen this month..Haislip is a significantly worse shooter than Bonner, worse handles than Bonner, worse defender than Bonner, about the same rebounder as Bonner..there's nothing he does better than Bonner, other than dunk..except he won't even be able to use that skill if the rest of his game doesn't allow it..

[AFBlue]

Only the first year is guaranteed.

I know. Which is why he'll be given the full year to display those skills he supposedly picked up in Europe. If he doesn't, no big loss.

If he does, he presents a viable, cheap option for the Spurs to consider for that perimeter big. And this one may be athletic enough to not be a defensive liability.

[Mel_13]

I know. Which is why he'll be given the full year to display those skills he supposedly picked up in Europe. If he doesn't, no big loss.

If he does, he presents a viable, cheap option for the Spurs to consider for that perimeter big. And this one may be athletic enough to not be a defensive liability.

We'll see.

I don't think he's got the whole year. The Spurs can trade him after Dec 15th. If he hasn't shown them anything by then, I think they'll look to move him in a tax-saving transaction.

[Allanon]

Ok, but why do you disagree is the question? How can you back up what you are saying?

Have you watched Haislip play with the Spurs?

I disagree because I've been watching him play in Europe. I've been watching quite a bit of Euroball the last 2 years or so. I've seen him in like 2 pre-season Spurs game, not much. But to me, he just has to adjust to the NBA game.

His athleticism and defense in my opinion are far superior to Bonner. He's not as good of a straight up shooter as Bonner but I think he shoots better than Bonner with defense on him. Bonner is much better at wide open shooting.

[DPG21920]

Well, I guess I cannot argue with your opinion, but I disagree on everything you have said about Haislip.

I am not saying Bonner is a world beater, but he is fairly paid and has proven himself much more than Haislip on both sides of the ball.

[024]

ratliff is on a one year contract, he's too injury prone and old for the spurs to resign him after this year. he'll probably prefer retirement anyways. mcdyess will be 36 and probably will have to come off the bench. a bonner resigning may be likely if he plays out of his mind this year and demonstrates he can perform in the playoffs. i doubt he can but it's a possibility. that just leaves blair, who is too young and inexperienced to defend starting bigs and haislip who has yet to prove he is an NBA player. if i'm not mistaken, i think haislip also has a one year contract.

that leaves the spurs with 3 bigs with guaranteed roster spots next year. duncan will start with mcdyess and blair most likely coming off the bench. spurs sound confident they can lure splitter over and he will most likely start. that leaves mahinmi as the fifth big which is not bad. again, the spurs might just decline mahinmi's option to save some money to sign splitter but that will leave the spurs with just 4 bigs next year.

[Allanon]

Well, I guess I cannot argue with your opinion, but I disagree on everything you have said about Haislip.

I am not saying Bonner is a world beater, but he is fairly paid and has proven himself much more than Haislip on both sides of the ball.

You are right, it's just my opinion. Let's see how it plays out.

[Allanon]

There is this fellow named Splitter my Laker friend . . .

I'd forgotten about Splitter until Mel brought him up. Yes, he is indeed a great prospect and probably already better than all of the Spurs big men outside of Duncan.

Question still is whether Splitter will give up $5 million to come play for $2-3 million on the Spurs....unless of course the Spurs spring for it and pay the $5.

[024]

i should also say that since the team has seen no indication of long term value from bonner, haislip, and splitter, they may just opt to keep mahinmi as insurance.

[Muser]

Damn it'd be awesome if Splitter came over next summer.

[MaNu4Tres]

I'm telling you, I've seen the guy play. Haislip is an NBA player in name only. Spurs bet on a longshot, it's not gonna pay off.


Well what do you know. Me and Mel actually agree on something. :toast:toast

Haislip may look great on those youtube videos. But he has looked like anything but an NBA player. He was a low risk, high reward that won't pan out. He will be sporting a sports coat the majority of the year. Bonner is better on both sides of the floor.

[Em-City]

Splitter is so far ahead of Mahinmi now, it is a virtual impossibility that Ian can catch him in one year, if ever. If Splitter comes next year, he immediately moves ahead of Ian on the depth chart.

yeah Splitter will outplay Mahinmi in his sleep

[Obstructed_View]

At this point neither is Mahinmi.

I'm guessing you've never seen him play.

[Marcus Bryant]

It's not a given that Splitter will be a Spur next season. You would think Spurs fans would know that by now.

[DPG21920]

For sure and I wonder how much Splitter will effect the Ian decision. If the Spurs are very confident they can get Splitter does that mean is let go? If they don't trust Tiago, do they keep Ian?

Maybe they are not mutually exclusive events. But I wonder how much it will factor into the decision.

[MaNu4Tres]

Splitter is so far ahead of Mahinmi now, it is a virtual impossibility that Ian can catch him in one year, if ever. If Splitter comes next year, he immediately moves ahead of Ian on the depth chart.

Don't tell Bruno that. He will call you a xenophobe.

[Mel_13]

Don't tell Bruno that. He will call you a xenophobe.

I am actually quite sure that Bruno would agree with that comparison.

[DPG21920]

I am actually quite sure that Bruno would agree with that comparison.

Have you noticed that you find yourself saying "quite" a lot more now that you interact with Bruno? :lol

Makes me feel smarter.

[Mel_13]

Have you noticed that you find yourself saying "quite" a lot more now that you interact with Bruno? :lol

Makes me feel smarter.

Interesting observation, not sure if it's quite true.

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

:lol

[benefactor]

Have you noticed that you find yourself saying "quite" a lot more now that you interact with Bruno? :lol

Makes me feel smarter.
Ha ha...I've always noticed that but I have never said anything. It's probably his favorite word. :)