Most overrated player

[Holmes_Fans]

Who do ya'll think the most overrated player in the NBA is?

[exstatic]

Kobe

[Experiment2100]

Penny Harda.......Dwayne Wade

[dcole50]

amare

[timvp]

http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/afp/20050131/capt.sge.gey26.310105003507.photo00.photo.default-277x384.jpg

This is not an MVP.

[Spurminator]

Shawn Marion.

[iminlakerland]

Jesus Shuttlesworth

Great shooter...but very soft!

[Leetonidas]

Dirk Nowitzki.

[King]

Can anyone give an example as to why any of these guys are overrated? Cause, I can't say I agree with a single one of them, except maybe Ray Allen.

[Holmes_Fans]

Tim Duncan (omg im so funny llolhahahlol!!11!!!1)




But seriously I don't think Steve Nash deserves MVP. Just because he has some people on his team who he can pass to. A player should have to earn his MVP not pass to players for them to earn it for him.

Carmello Anthony didn't seem like he lived up to the hype he had. I havn't heard much about him this season.

[Spurs košarka kultura]

Vince Carter
Amare Stoudemire
Carmelo Anthony

[Brodels]

Jermaine O'Neal. Shoots 43% in a season as a forward/center and gets MVP consideration. Get tougher. Shoot better. Win something.

[Dre_7]

Richard Jefferson

[kolko]

Amare

[Spurs košarka kultura]

Richard Jefferson

Damn good one he's so overrated I didn't even think of him. RJ sucks!!!!!!!!!

[whottt]

Shaq

BTW, I think Dirk is becoming under-rated.

[Jules Winnfield]

Dirk Nowitzki.

I wouldnt go as far as to say hes overrated.. but whats the dude gonna do hes german.

[xcoriate]

Yeah RJ, Amare and Kenyon MArtin(not so much any more)

See a pattern all had/have great distributers, spoon feeding all there shots.

Marion I don't think is overrated he is generally under rated but there are a few who understand what he brings.

[Jules Winnfield]

Richard Jefferson

You's a smart muthafucka, dats right!

[Manu20]

Steve Francis

[whottt]

I wouldnt go as far as to say hes overrated.. but whats the dude gonna do hes german.

Nowitzki is turning into an awesome player...the days of _irk are over.

[Jules Winnfield]

Nowitzki is turning into an awesome player...the days of _irk are over.

I DONT REMEMBER ASKIN YOU A GOD DAMN THING! :p

[SuperSpur]

Allen Iverson

[xcoriate]

Yeah Dirk is certainly not over rated. You got to wonder why he is hardly mentioned in the MVP race. His team has a great record, his playing improved D and his offence is as stellar as always.

[whottt]

I DONT REMEMBER ASKIN YOU A GOD DAMN THING! :p

No need to thank me...it was my pleasure.

[Jules Winnfield]

No need to thank me...it was my pleasure.

Shitchyeah

[whottt]

Yeah Dirk is certainly not over rated. You got to wonder why he is hardly mentioned in the MVP race. His team has a great record, his playing improved D and his offence is as stellar as always.

There's never been a 7 footer like what Nowitzki is turning into now...and he's turning into a good defender too...his rebounding and shotblocking are kinda weak compared to the other elite bigs...but he's getting there...

Guy is going to pull a Robert Horry and be like the second guy in history to have 100 blocks, 100 steals and 100 3 pointers in a single season...plus he's pulling down 10 boards and scoring 26 PPG, hitting 40% from 3(and taking a ton of them)...

The NBA has never seen a 7 footer anything like this guy before, he can literally do anything on the court...It's kinda sick.

[exstatic]

Can anyone give an example as to why any of these guys are overrated? Cause, I can't say I agree with a single one of them, except maybe Ray Allen.
You need to ask about Kobe? Where was LA last year? Where are they now? Who caused that? End of story. Your team's success, or lack thereof, defines you as a player.

[Jules Winnfield]

There's never been a 7 footer like what Nowitzki is turning into now...and he's turning into a good defender too...his rebounding and shotblocking are kinda weak compared to the other elite bigs...but he's getting there...

Guy is going to pull a Robert Horry and be like the second guy in history to have 100 blocks, 100 steals and 100 3 pointers in a single season...plus he's pulling down 10 boards and scoring 26 PPG, hitting 40% from 3(and taking a ton of them)...

The NBA has never seen a 7 footer anything like this guy before, he can literally do anything on the court...It's kinda sick.

get the fuck out my face wit dat shit

[whottt]

I like de "dis" and "dat"...Do you talk in 3rd person too?

I wish that sort of thing came to me naturally.

[xcoriate]

There's never been a 7 footer like what Nowitzki is turning into now...and he's turning into a good defender too...his rebounding and shotblocking are kinda weak compared to the other elite bigs...but he's getting there...

Guy is going to pull a Robert Horry and be like the second guy in history to have 100 blocks, 100 steals and 100 3 pointers in a single season...plus he's pulling down 10 boards and scoring 26 PPG, hitting 40% from 3(and taking a ton of them)...

The NBA has never seen a 7 footer anything like this guy before, he can literally do anything on the court...It's kinda sick.

Yeah no shit. And his handles the way he moves, quickness and speed. Gah its unfair :p

[Trooper 2112]

Yao

[Jules Winnfield]

I like de "dis" and "dat"...Do you talk in 3rd person too?

I wish that sort of thing came to me naturally.

Does he look like a bitch?

[SuBZer0]

CARMELO
Shaq


This is not an MVPOh come on, timvp. Surely not everyone who is the MVP has to have an IQ within 5% of yours...

[timvp]

Oh come on, timvp. Surely not everyone who is the MVP has to have an IQ within 5% of yours...

:huh

[whottt]

Does he look like a bitch?

English motherfucker! DO YOU SPEAK IT?

[Jules Winnfield]

English motherfucker! DO YOU SPEAK IT?

Shhheeiittt negro! Thats all you had to say!

[whottt]

Now that we got that out of the way...how about a foot massage?

[Jules Winnfield]

Now that we got that out of the way...how about a foot massage?

...fuck you

[Trooper 2112]

don't be telling me about foot massages, im the fuckin foot master!

[Jules Winnfield]

don't be telling me about foot massages, im the fuckin foot master!

I got my technique down and everything.. dont tickle or nothin

[Trooper 2112]

Would you give a guy a foot massage?

[whottt]

<<<already asked

[baseline bum]

Dirk's definitely off that list. With the way he's grown this year I see him as a lock for MVP sometime within the next 5 years. I never thought he would get to that level until I saw his play this season.

My vote is KG. A player who's supposed to be that good should not fail to make the playoffs. I know his teammates are cancers, but this guy was supposed to be at the level of Olajuwon, Duncan, Robinson, O'Neal, etc. Unless it comes out that he was hurt a lot worse than is let on I don't think I'll ever have the same respect for Garnett that I used to.

It's not that KG isn't a top 5 or even top 3 player... it's that he's just not the all-time great he's made out to be now. I let all of the first round exits slide, but with this season on his resume he's fallen off for good. Only a championship will ever begin to restore my respect for him.

[ShoogarBear]

Which one is your wallet?

[ShoogarBear]

Anyone, I probably like RJ better than most people on this board, but no way he should have been an Olympian. So he's up there.

As far as someone who hasn't been mentioned yet:

http://www.bballone.com/yaom/rockets/images/rockets24_resize.jpg

[Dre_7]

If he shouldnt have been an olypian, then he was overrated.

[baseline bum]

I don't consider Yao overrated anymore. The hype has died quickly now that it's apparent he'll never be the next Shaq.

[Trooper 2112]

As far as someone who hasn't been mentioned yet:

http://www.bballone.com/yaom/rockets/images/rockets24_resize.jpg
i did

[Leetonidas]

Allen Iverson

I disagree. I think AI has been one of the top 5 players in the NBA for 5 years now.

[ShoogarBear]

i did Sorry, you did it in the midst of "Conversations with Jules".

[Trooper 2112]

Sorry, you did it in the midst of "Conversations with Julius".
it's all cool :fro

[Jules Winnfield]

Sorry, you did it in the midst of "Conversations with Julius".

The names Jules.
Im an associate of your business partner Marsellus Wallace, you remember your business partner dont'ya?

[ShoogarBear]

Sorry, bro. Corrected.

Which one is your wallet?

[Trooper 2112]

Sorry, bro. Corrected.

Which one is your wallet?
The one that says Bad Muther Fucker on it

[Jules Winnfield]

As far as someone who hasn't been mentioned yet:

http://www.bballone.com/yaom/rockets/images/rockets24_resize.jpg


Sorry, you did it in the midst of "Conversations with Jules".

Oh, I'm sorry. Did that break your concentration? I didn't mean to do that. Please, continue.

[Jules Winnfield]

Sorry, bro. Corrected.

Which one is your wallet?

Its the one that says bad mother fucker on it.

[Trooper 2112]

You know what they call a quarter pounder with cheese in Paris?

[Rummpd]

Since one idiot had Shaq as the "greatest ever" period I can make a serious case despite his teams improvement and what happened in LA this year he is over-rated IMO.

Shaq = a liablity in close game due to foul shooting, has never led in rebounding and blocks and his range offensively is limited. Benefits greatly from not facing the Ewings, Robinsons, Hakeems of previous eras.

Plus he has only won with arguebly one of top five in game and now has another by his side in Wade.

Great great player but not best ever or other crap you hear about him all the time.

[ambchang]

My vote is KG. A player who's supposed to be that good should not fail to make the playoffs. I know his teammates are cancers, but this guy was supposed to be at the level of Olajuwon, Duncan, Robinson, O'Neal, etc. Unless it comes out that he was hurt a lot worse than is let on I don't think I'll ever have the same respect for Garnett that I used to.

I hate to say this, but O'Neal missed the playoffs in his rookie year, that's when his luck of having an all-star guard by his side started.
Also, KG is a bona-fide superstar, can't fault him for having crappy teammates and all.

[Jules Winnfield]

The one that says Bad Muther Fucker on it

Shut the fuck up fat man this ain't any of your goddamn business!

[Trooper 2112]

Jules, did you ever hear the philosophy that once a man admits that he is wrong, that he is immediately forgiven for all wrongdoings? Have you ever heard that?

[whottt]

I hate to say this, but O'Neal missed the playoffs in his rookie year, that's when his luck of having an all-star guard by his side started.
Also, KG is a bona-fide superstar, can't fault him for having crappy teammates and all.

Hakeem also missed the playoffs when he had bad guards...the year he had AJ actually...but so did Kareem and Wilt when they had no guards...In fact they finished in last place...

Drob stands all alone in that area of being able to carry total scrub guards to 55 - 62 win seasons...No other bigman has done it like Drob did it....Drob had to make adjustment...like being the first C in 20 years to win a scoring title, while leading his team in assists(and everything else) but he got it done...

If you go look at all the 60+ win seasons you will be hard pressed to find one that didn't have an All Star guard on it...except Drob.

Then when he got quintuple teamed in the playoffs because no one respected these guys perimeter game...people called him the choker and said he was soft...forgetting the fact that as rookie and second year player with guards with perimeter game Drob would throw down at a 68% clip in a playoff series.

So Shaq's not alone in that area of failing to make the playoffs with bad guards and neither is KG...they've got plenty of HOF company...it's just not named David Robinson.

[bigbendbruisebrother]

I don't consider Yao overrated anymore. The hype has died quickly now that it's apparent he'll never be the next Shaq.

They're sure trying with this "Year of the Yao" boondogle.

Yao's got my vote as most overrated.

[ceds]

Im sure as spur fans you guys understand the effect international ball can have on a players NBA season. Heck Manu and TD cant even last one year

Yao has been balling for 3 years without a break.This year he can finally have an offseason to relax and improve his game. Trust me, you havent seen anything yet.

[zeleni]

Also, KG is a bona-fide superstar, can't fault him for having crappy teammates and all.

Yes you can!
Bad team spirit makes players go away or underachieve. That's not only coaches foul, that players foul also.

[Rummpd]

One not mentioned that at least now is a definite = Chris Webber, live in Philly and he is becoming a head case.

[Solid D]

Latrell Sprewell

[Frenchise player]

Ray Allen

[themvp]

Garnett, McGrady :lol

[SLOVENIAN 8]

McGrady!

[picnroll]

Jermaine O'Neal. Watching him yesterday during crunch time chuck up and clank endless degree of difficulty - 10 shots against Miami was vintage Jermaine.

[GoSpurs21]

LeBron James today
Avery Johnson in the past

[Kori Ellis]

Andrei Kirilenko
Jermaine O'Neal
Shareef Abdur-Rahim

[ducks]

james
he is suppose to be a mvp candiate and he has missed the playoffs 2 years now in the weak east
atleast kg has the excuse he is the west

[Warlord23]

james
he is suppose to be a mvp candiate and he has missed the playoffs 2 years now in the weak east
atleast kg has the excuse he is the west

Why am I not surprised? :lol

[iminlakerland]

One not mentioned that at least now is a definite = Chris Webber, live in Philly and he is becoming a head case.


My how quickly i forget yes Rummpd add CWebb to that list...!

[Jules Winnfield]

chan ho park


Now look, maybe your method of overrated basketball player differs from mine, but shootin a ball in a hoop, and hittin a ball with a stick, ain't the same ballpark, it ain't the same league, it ain't even the same fuckin' sport!

[Jules Winnfield]

the thread subject is "most overrated player", not most overrated basketball player

Oh im sorry did I break your concentration?

[Slo spurs fan]

Linton Johnson III
Mike Wilks
Tony Massenburg
:)

[tlongII]

Bruce "No Talent" Bowen.

[Dre_7]

Bruce "No Talent" Bowen.

Enough talent to shut down some of the leagues best players!

[texbumTHElife]

Yao F'n Ming!!!!!!

Though he hasnt gotten enarly the praise this year there are still people who want his tea bag anytime he does anything halfway good(Bill Walton)

[picnroll]

I'd say Zach Randolph but I'm not sure anyone still think he's any good.

[101A]

Steve Nash.

If he's so damned good, why are the Mavericks?

[Spurminator]

If he's so damned good, why are the Mavericks?

Erick Dampier, Jerry Stackhouse, Jason Terry, Avery Johnson.

[GINNNNNNNNNNNNOBILI]

Lebron James, His may be really good, but dont compare him to Jordan, he has no heart and no fire inside of him, and plus he has a tattoo that says "chosen1" on his back.

[Spurminator]

They said the same thing about Jordan in Year 2. And Years 3, 4, 5, 6 and 7. Lebron is already involving his teammates much more than Jordan did before Phil Jackson became the coach.

[Jdspur20]

sean marks

[GINNNNNNNNNNNNOBILI]

It's not his game that I don't like, its his attitude, right now it seems like all the money has gone to his head. I realize he is still young, and will probably be great one day, but right now he is overrated in my opinion. And Jordan was scoring 61 against the celtics in the playoffs in his 2nd year.

[1Parker1]

Lebron James (I hate the Jordan comparisons...at least wait until the guy takes his team to the playoff's and see how he performs there)
Carmelo
Wade (He has improved because of Shaq and all the attention he draws when on the floor)
Amare (All dunks and no class)
Paul Pierce
Marbury--most overated of them all!

[tlongII]

Enough talent to shut down some of the leagues best players!


I don't know what he plays, but it ain't basketball.

[red kryptonite]

I'm not really sure who is rated high and who is rated medium and low, so it is definitely a subjective question. However, I think these players are ones that at times are highly praised and not at all consistantly deserving:

steve nash
andrei kirelinko
yao ming
ray allen (although he has done better this year)
reggie miller
chris webber
brad miller
carmelo anthony

I saw Lebron James, Amare Staudemire, and Dwayne Wade mentioned as well. These players are at least close to the hype they receive.

Dwayne Wade was outstanding in last years playoffs before Shaq.

Lebron is the only reason the Cavs have won more than 15 games.

Amare is the Suns MVP, not Nash. Amare is the whole reason Phoenix's team works. He is so athletic, he is able to play not only the 4, but the 5 and so the Suns are able to get away with a small quick lineup. Nash is a good catalyst, but Amare's the real difference maker.

[nkdlunch]

Amare is the Suns MVP, not Nash. Amare is the whole reason Phoenix's team works. He is so athletic, he is able to play not only the 4, but the 5 and so the Suns are able to get away with a small quick lineup. Nash is a good catalyst, but Amare's the real difference maker.


Howcome the Suns lost so many games when Nash was injured then?

[MadDog73]

Lebron James (I hate the Jordan comparisons...at least wait until the guy takes his team to the playoff's and see how he performs there)
Carmelo
Wade (He has improved because of Shaq and all the attention he draws when on the floor)
Amare (All dunks and no class)
Paul Pierce
Marbury--most overated of them all!

I don't know about those. Well, "Star"bury, yeah, but:

Lebron James: if anything, this guy has exceeded his hype, if that's possible. It's amazing what he's doing at his age, not even Michael Jordan was doing it. So, no, you can't compare him to MJ, because he'll probably be better. :) He just needs some decent teamates around him, which brings me to...

Carmelo Anthony: Again, I don't understand how he can be overrated if he carried his team to the playoffs. Sure, he has some decent players around him (Camby, K-Mart), but are those guys going to the Playoffs without Carmelo? No way.

Amare: Hmm, this is interesting. He's definately hyped, but Nash gets more credit than he does for generating his offense! :lol Still, it'd be nice for him to fail in the 1st round (not going to happen) and bring all these Sun band-wagoners down to earth!

Paul Piece: Is he really rated enough to be over-rated? :)
Seriously, a good player, probably under-rated if anything, but maybe your hearing stories I haven't. I tend to tune out when my friend tells me the Celtics will win it all this year..

[GINNNNNNNNNNNNOBILI]

The same reason the Rockets sucked when Charlie Ward was the starting point guard

[Jdspur20]

I don't know what he plays, but it ain't basketball.

thats the same thing i think when the blazers come to mind.

[1Parker1]

I don't know about those. Well, "Star"bury, yeah, but:

Lebron James: if anything, this guy has exceeded his hype, if that's possible. It's amazing what he's doing at his age, not even Michael Jordan was doing it. So, no, you can't compare him to MJ, because he'll probably be better. :) He just needs some decent teamates around him, which brings me to...

Carmelo Anthony: Again, I don't understand how he can be overrated if he carried his team to the playoffs. Sure, he has some decent players around him (Camby, K-Mart), but are those guys going to the Playoffs without Carmelo? No way.

Amare: Hmm, this is interesting. He's definately hyped, but Nash gets more credit than he does for generating his offense! :lol Still, it'd be nice for him to fail in the 1st round (not going to happen) and bring all these Sun band-wagoners down to earth!


Well, I live in the East and tend to see a lot of the eastern games, hence, the reason why a lot of the players on my list are from the Eastern Conference:)
But to address your points:
Lebron: I am not saying he is not a good player and that what he is doing at his age isn't incredible. However, the reason why I think he is overated is because people are already comparing him to the likes of MJ etc. without seeing him play in the postseason. Regular season is great---all his top ten plays, his scoring, rebounding, assists stats etc. look great on paper, however, playoff's tell a completely different story. I think all the hype he is getting is just a little premature, that's all.

Carmelo: He carried his team to the playoff's last year? Well, where the hell was he for the entire first half of this season I ask? How was his play and attitude during the Olympics I ask? Camby, K-Mart and CO. are a pretty good team with or without Carmelo IMO. All Carmelo can do is score, he is not a good all around player.

Amare: I agree it'd be great to see him and the Suns fall. I put him on the overated list simply because I hate his attitude and he is what he is this season because of Steve Nash (whom I believe deserves the credit).

Paul Pierce: I said that because here in Philly, AI vs Pierce is a class duel. I don't think he can carry the Celtics through the post-season like many people around here think. Whereas, I think AI just might be able to (but maybe I'm just being biased here :))

[ALVAREZ6]

Chris Webber is overrated...now that I see him every sixers game...he sucks ass compared to what people think. All he can do is hit 1 of every 3 jumpshots from 17 feet away, and when he misses, he bricks front rim. He barely gets the ball over the rim, and that's because of his knee injury. He can barely move compared to what he use to play like.

Shawn Marion and Amare are overrated IMO, 1Parker1 explained it. They both pretty much just get dunks off of Nash's passes, and without him, they wouldn't have the numbers they have.

[SirChaz]

Howcome the Suns lost so many games when Nash was injured then?


Because they were in a funk. How come they lost two games in that stretch before Nash was injured? How did they win games later in the season when Nash was out?


Amare Stoudemire is not overrated.
Anyone that thinks all he does is dunk doesn't watch the Suns or Stoudemire at all.


Most overrated in my mind is Carmelo Anthony. Good young player and good scorer but hardly the superstar he seems to get the pub for in the media.

[Dre_7]

Well, Webber is playing on only one leg. He is dragging his (right??) leg up and down the court. All he does is take jumpshots. I think that is because his injury doesnt allow him, or hes affraid, to get in the low post very much. IMO Weeeeeebeeer is washed up.

[JMarkJohns]

Amare Stoudemire is not overrated.
Anyone that thinks all he does is dunk doesn't watch the Suns or Stoudemire at all.

This is exactly right...

I didn't want to be the first to say it, but will anyways. Just because you dislike a player (or the team he plays for), doesn't mean said player is overrated.

That's just absurd.

Stoudemire has improved his scoring from 13 to 20 to 26 while improving his defensive numbers, percentages and after adjusting to playing out of position, is finally starting to rebound the ball better...

Stoudemire has developed parts of his game that most thought weren't possible. He hits his 18-foot jumper at about 50% a clip. He takes bigger centers off the dribble and can simply dominate down low vs. skinny/slow centers. He's got an up-n-under, a baseline spin and his power spin into the key, where he either lobs up a floater, lay's it in, power dunks or gets fouled and goes to the line where he now hits well over 70% of his free throws.

...realistically, there's only one player that can even challenge Amare one-on-one and that's Ben Wallace.

On defense he is much improved as well and while he's not the elite level shot-blocker (1.8), he picks his moments instead of going for every shot and getting in foul trouble. He's developed the Karl Malone "Slap the ball on the way up" move to the tune of 1+ spg and over the last three weeks, is averaging close to 11 rebounds a game.

HE'S STILL JUST 22.


Nash can be a bit overrated, but only statistically. His impact on the game should be unquestioned. Yes he has players to get the ball to, but he had those in Dallas as well...he never averaged 11.5 assists in Dallas. Fact is, Nash is on pace to become just the fourth player to shoot 50% from the floor, 40% from range and 80% from the stripe and will be the first ever to do so while averaging 11 or more assists.


I won't even justify the Marion-bashers with stats because they obviously have not done their homework. He is on pace to be a Hall-of-Fame small forward and has only been selected to two All-Star games. Before this year, he had just one and that's the same number as perrennial fuck-up, Wally Szczerbiak and fewer than bum Latrell Sprewell.


I understand most here have animosity towards the Suns, but realistically, noone on the Suns is overrated enough to be on a list of the most overrated players.

Yao Ming is the poster child for overrated, overly celebrated players.

Steve Francis
Carlos Boozer (at least coming into the season)
and perhaps Kobe, McGrady, Webber and Carmelo...

[Obstructed_View]

Stephon Marbury, Michael Finley and Paul Pierce.

[Spurminator]

I won't even justify the Marion-bashers with stats because they obviously have not done their homework. He is on pace to be a Hall-of-Fame small forward and has only been selected to two All-Star games. Before this year, he had just one and that's the same number as perrennial fuck-up, Wally Szczerbiak and fewer than bum Latrell Sprewell.

Marion puts up incredible numbers, but I'm not convinced the Suns would be any worse off with a lot of other SF's in the league. If Marion is a star-level player, how did the Suns miss the Playoffs last year? Same could be said about Stoudemire, I guess... If either of them were star-level players, the Suns wouldn't have been the Clippers all season.

I think all of the Suns players fit perfectly in the system, and have reaped the benefits personally and statistically. But if I'm a scout, and I'm evaluating whether he could play for any team and make them a winner, I don't see it yet.

[Spurminator]

And calling him a Hall of Famer at this stage is VERY premature...

[ALVAREZ6]

Well, Webber is playing on only one leg. He is dragging his (right??) leg up and down the court. All he does is take jumpshots. I think that is because his injury doesnt allow him, or hes affraid, to get in the low post very much. IMO Weeeeeebeeer is washed up.
Exactly.

I feel bad for him because of that little injury, his career is going downhill. He will never be as good as he was.

[JMarkJohns]

Marion puts up incredible numbers, but I'm not convinced the Suns would be any worse off with a lot of other SF's in the league. If Marion is a star-level player, how did the Suns miss the Playoffs last year? Same could be said about Stoudemire, I guess... If either of them were star-level players, the Suns wouldn't have been the Clippers all season.

I think all of the Suns players fit perfectly in the system, and have reaped the benefits personally and statistically. But if I'm a scout, and I'm evaluating whether he could play for any team and make them a winner, I don't see it yet.

I'm basing my "Hall-of-Fame" comment on Basketballreference.com's moniter system.

Marion is a 20-10-2-1 SF over his career and a two-time All-Star for it...

There aren't many 20-10 SF all-time, let alone right now.

[Spurminator]

That's probably because Small Forwards in the past haven't been Power Forwards like Marion.

He's less of a true SF than Duncan is a true PF. Is he even considered a SF in the lineup this year? Are QRich and Jim Jackson considered PFs when they take the floor?

[JMarkJohns]

That's probably because Small Forwards in the past haven't been Power Forwards like Marion.

He's less of a true SF than Duncan is a true PF. Is he even considered a SF in the lineup this year? Are QRich and Jim Jackson considered PFs when they take the floor?

He's playing PF this year, but is still very wing oriented.

He simply does not have a position. He has SG size, SF athlticism and PF instincts...He's a freak much like Dirk is.

But he has been a SF for much of his career and still plays it for probably 10 minutes a game this year. Most would still consider him a SF this year, just as most consider Amare a PF.

[ducks]

Shaq is an overrated fraud with very limited offensive skills. He just happens to be bigger than everyone else. When he hip-checks a defender out of the way, it's a foul. It's never called. He is also an actor, rap star and policeman. So am I