So...........

[Viva Las Espuelas]

no one is touching the news about CIT and Ford? probably no need for a thread, but i'm surprised it hasn't been brought up. one turned down any help and is kicking ass and one was denied help and is going through what companies should go through if in trouble. to the "cash for clunkers helped Ford!!" people it kinda says something about the popularity of the companies that got gov't assistance. if people don't want those products why was a needless bandaid applied. anyone?

[Duff McCartney]

Ford is not "kicking ass". In fact they are pressuring not only the German government but also the Canadian government to extend their cash for clunkers programs. They are even threatening temporary factory shutdowns if they don't get the cash for clunkers programs extended.

Here's a little snippet about a story I heard in NPR...

"Yeah. Burning through nearly $8 billion of cash reserves over a four-month period as Ford did isn't exactly what you call a sustainable business plan. That now leaves Ford with about $19 billion to get it through the slump, and if the economy continues to go south, could run dry sometime after 2010."

Yeah..."kicking ass".

[MannyIsGod]

You're surprised the healthiest of the big 3 was able to turn it around fastest? I'm sure everyone is surprised by the 3rd Quarter number but there is a reason they were able to forgo the government assistance and its not because they were in the worst shape.

Ford obviously has better management than the other American automakers and found itself in a much better position. I hope they're able to continue their success.

[Nbadan]

LOL at wing-nuts wanting American companies to fail...

[Wild Cobra]

LOL at wing-nuts wanting American companies to fail...
Not wanting them to fail, but rewarding bad business practices with bailouts will not fix the root problems.

[MannyIsGod]

Not wanting them to fail, but rewarding bad business practices with bailouts will not fix the root problems.

That would be a fair critique if anyone actually believed that to be the case.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

LOL at wing-nuts wanting American companies to fail...


no. not at all. don't recall writing that out. please point it out if i have.

[Nbadan]

Not wanting them to fail, but rewarding bad business practices with bailouts will not fix the root problems.

Like all the businesses that survived previous govt. bail-outs and eventually paid back all the cash plus interest? Please...these are American jobs paying American salaries and this attitude is prevalent in the GOP...this is why workers won't trust the GOP in 2010 or 2012...

[Duff McCartney]

I personally don't give a damn about American companies creating American jobs. They could send their entire job catalog to another country for all I care. They are doing nothing that isn't illegal. They are merely trying to keep costs down and profits high, and that's the name of the game here in the United States. That's the price we pay to live in a capitalist system.

If people don't like that corporations stick to their bottom line, then they should ask for a change of our economic system, but nobody wants that. Or if they do, they cry about government intervention.

[Wild Cobra]

I personally don't give a damn about American companies creating American jobs. They could send their entire job catalog to another country for all I care. They are doing nothing that isn't illegal. They are merely trying to keep costs down and profits high, and that's the name of the game here in the United States. That's the price we pay to live in a capitalist system.

If people don't like that corporations stick to their bottom line, then they should ask for a change of our economic system, but nobody wants that. Or if they do, they cry about government intervention.

Yep...

Maybe if we taxed consumption rather than productivity, we would be better off.

No...

Scratch that thought...

No maybe about it. We would definately be better off!

[Viva Las Espuelas]

"the price we pay to live in a capitalist system"

yeah. i guess the computer your using is a loaner.................................

[Duff McCartney]

No it's not a loaner. But I'm not bitching about companies sending their jobs overseas like a large amount of Republicans and Democrats do. Like I said..these companies aren't doing anything illegal.

[boutons_deux]

"taxed consumption rather than productivity"

so the Americans with jobs more and more shittily paid would be forced to spend more where it hurts them much more than the Repug/conservative wealthy. Typical WC screw-the-people spin job.

[Wild Cobra]

"taxed consumption rather than productivity"

so the Americans with jobs more and more shittily paid would be forced to spend more where it hurts them much more than the Repug/conservative wealthy. Typical WC screw-the-people spin job.

Until you open your mind to real economics, you'll never get it. When jobs are taxed out of here, and outsources elsewhere, that hurts the poor even more.

[FromWayDowntown]

Until you open your mind to real economics, you'll never get it. When jobs are taxed out of here, and outsources elsewhere, that hurts the poor even more.

So we'll hurt them now so that we don't have to hurt them more later. I mean, really, those stupid poor people just don't understand that we have to put a massive tax burden on their backs to make this economy run!

[Wild Cobra]

So we'll hurt them now so that we don't have to hurt them more later. I mean, really, those stupid poor people just don't understand that we have to put a massive tax burden on their backs to make this economy run!
WTF is your problem?

You can put consumption taxes on goods that they don't buy, or need to buy anyway. Not food, toiletries, tootpaste, etc.

[coyotes_geek]

LOL at wing-nuts wanting American companies to fail...

LOL at wing-nuts wanting American taxpayers to subsidize corporate incompetence.........

[coyotes_geek]

Like all the businesses that survived previous govt. bail-outs and eventually paid back all the cash plus interest? Please...these are American jobs paying American salaries and this attitude is prevalent in the GOP...this is why workers won't trust the GOP in 2010 or 2012...

Like who? Chrysler? Oh wait, we ended up having to bail them out again. The banks? You want to make a bet that we won't be bailing them out again?

What about all the businesses that we didn't bail out in the tech and energy sectors who not only survived their respective crisis, but now now represent the strongest segments of our economy?

[Wild Cobra]

Like who? Chrysler? Oh wait, we ended up having to bail them out again. The banks? You want to make a bet that we won't be bailing them out again?

What about all the businesses that we didn't bail out in the tech and energy sectors who not only survived their respective crisis, but now now represent the strongest segments of our economy?
Bank employees don't make so much. Just the executives do. My daughters Boyfriend works for US Bank.

[coyotes_geek]

Bank employees don't make so much. Just the executives do. My daughters Boyfriend works for US Bank.

Those jobs aren't important anyways. Only jobs that belong to unions who can bankroll multi-million dollar campaign contributions are important.

[Wild Cobra]

Those jobs aren't important anyways. Only jobs that belong to unions who can bankroll multi-million dollar campaign contributions are important.
So why did we save the banks again?

My thought is supply and demand would have kept the banking industry alive. No need to bail them out, just garentee funding so they had money to loan. let the ones who managed money poorly fail, and the ones doing it right, grow and take their place.

[coyotes_geek]

I agree. The bailouts weren't neccessary. Instead of just taking the kick in the nuts today and being done with it we chose to prolong our pain for decades to come.