SI.com Roundtable: Artest vs. Ariza

[duncan228]

Roundtable: Artest vs. Ariza, more (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/basketball/nba/11/03/roundtable.artest/index.html)

Four SI.com writers analyze the latest news and address hot topics from around the NBA each week. (All stats and records are through Monday.)

1. Ron Artest has struggled in his first few games with the Lakers while Trevor Ariza has thrived in Houston. Is Artest experiencing some adjustment pains, or are the Lakers destined to regret choosing Artest over Ariza?

Ian Thomsen: In early July, the Lakers felt they would have a hard time driving the price of Ariza's contract down to the mid-level exception (which he ultimately accepted from Houston). Artest's mid-level contract with L.A. was actually smaller than the salary Ariza was seeking. Based on the speed of their decision to forego Ariza, the Lakers viewed it as a no-brainer to quickly sign Artest while leaving enough money in reserve to also retain Lamar Odom and Shannon Brown. Ariza is a versatile complementary forward, and Rockets coach Rick Adelman is bringing out the best in him. But no one should think Ariza would be scoring 33 points for the Lakers, as he did for Houston against the Blazers the other day. Artest will prove to be an upgrade over Ariza, and there hasn't been any meaningful evidence yet to change my opinion. Is Artest going to be high maintenance? Of course. But we won't know until later in the season whether the daily issues he creates are wearing out his teammates and Phil Jackson.

Jack McCallum: Is there any player in the league more prone to emotional volatility, more likely to have high highs and low lows, than Artest? (OK, maybe Stephen Jackson, the subject of the next question.) Artest was so gung-ho about making a name in a new city with a new team that his nervousness and inconsistency could've been predicted. I love Ariza -- he was my nominated breakout player in last year's postseason -- but Artest will figure it out soon ... or Kobe Bryant or Phil Jackson will figure it out for him.

Chris Mannix: The triangle is the most complicated offense in the league, so it was predictable that someone like Artest -- a motion-based or low-post player for most of his career -- would struggle picking it up right away. Likewise, Ariza's numbers were supposed to spike playing on a Houston team without a lot of offensive options. Still, my original prediction stands: The Lakers will rue going for the proverbial jugular by adding a combustible star like Artest and letting a smooth fit like Ariza walk away.

Arash Markazi: You can't just go off statistics when comparing the two, because Ariza is getting a chance to put up big numbers as a go-to guy while Artest is the Lakers' third or fourth option. That said, Ariza has played better early, but Artest is starting to find his role. He isn't being asked to put up 15-20 shots, but instead be a shutdown defender and score when he's open. Against the Hawks on Sunday, Artest had his best night as a Laker -- but not because he had 12 points, seven rebounds and four assists. It was because of his defense. Joe Johnson scored 18 points on Kobe in the first quarter before Artest switched on to him. Johnson scored only nine points the rest of the game as the Lakers won.

[RedsLakers24]

its difficult playing in the triangle, when Ariza was first introduce to in the starting line up he struggled and even said he prefered the bench because they dont run the triangle, Artest just needs some time to get used to the triangle

Artest>>>>Jordan

[kingmalaki]

its difficult playing in the triangle, when Ariza was first introduce to in the starting line up he struggled and even said he prefered the bench because they dont run the triangle, Artest just needs some time to get used to the triangle

Artest>>>>Jordan

Adelman's system isn't exactly easy to learn either.

[djohn2oo8]

^ lol

[Finperro]

^ lol
The only thing amusing here is a dumbass laughing at another dumbass. You can never launder yourself color anyways, still you'll always be identified as an exasperating parasite till your shitty ass gets cremated or buried.

[mavs>spurs2]

The only thing amusing here is a dumbass laughing at another dumbass. You can never launder yourself color anyways, still you'll always be identified as an exasperating parasite till your shitty ass gets cremated or buried.

:lmao

[sook]

He breaks up too many plays and goes into tru warrier mode. Thats my only issue

[Indazone]

Artest Dinoboy going into Dinomode. Will he ever stop putting his head down and driving into the lane for a brick? Will he never learn to set both feet first before throwing up that three point clanker of his?

[Mr. Body]

Long-term, yes, the Lakers will regret the swap-out. But if they win a championship and Artest is a big part of it, then it's fine.

[IronMexican]

Ariza's better right now, and most likely will be for the foreseeable. Future.

[21_Blessings]

Ariza's better right now, and most likely will be for the foreseeable. Future.

Not defensively he isn't.

[djohn2oo8]

:lmao

Waiting for your fellow Mav buddies to back u up is admirable :rolleyes

[Allanon]

Waiting for your fellow Mav buddies to back u up is admirable :rolleyes

This is the weak part of some of the Mavfan game.

Only some do this, most Mav fans here stand on their own.

[024]

artest is a better player than ariza, although the talent gap isn't as big as i originally thought. ariza's hot shooting from the three point line seems to have carried over from the playoffs. good thing he's no longer on the lakers or he would be a perfect fit. it also isn't inconceivable that he eventually becomes scouted and is shut down by the other team's defense. without yao and mcgrady, it shouldn't be that hard to defend ariza and brooks. however, if he keeps putting in the hard work and mcgrady returns at a high level, i can see him averaging 14-17 pts a game.

[mogrovejo]

Ariza is simply a better defender than Artest right now. Artest was always a pretty selfish defender - he'd shut-down his man but would help a little as possible - and nowadays he can't defend the quicker perimeter players anymore. Still great to defend longer, slower power 3s, especially if the refs are allowing him to be physical, but Ariza is more versatile, can guard every backcourt position equally well and a better help defender.

Maybe Artest is still better offensively, in spite of his atrocious shot-selection, but as stated in the article, he's the 4th/5th option, so who cares? Ariza is a better 3pt shooter now, he'd be a better fit for the Lakers on both sides of the floor.

[duncan228]

Ariza Should Be Thanking Artest (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=tsn-arizashouldbethankin&prov=tsn&type=lgns)
SportingNews

It was a brutal, scurrilous, often misleading series of negotiations, the kind of hard-headed business that makes little sense to those unfamiliar with that part of the NBA. And at the end of it all, Trevor Ariza—supposedly the crown jewel of last summer's free agent youngsters—was headed to Houston for roughly the same amount the Lakers ended up paying Ron Artest.

Ariza found out the market wasn't as sparkling as he'd thought, and Artest roared into town, likely without pants, willing to work for food. To be sure, it was a bizarre situation. It remains to be seen if Artest, who admittedly is quite a different player from Ariza, will … see, it's not even a question of filling a void, except with regard to a few broad duties like "threes" and "defense." More that Ariza got greedy (some some will say), waited too long and ended up with no home to go home to, because Ron-Ron was already sleeping in his bed.

At one point, Ariza was disappointed that the money didn't work out right, but also because he felt cast out by the Lakers, the team that had taken a chance on him and watched him flourish. It's also worth mentioning that L.A. is his hometown in the States. So yeah, in effect, Ron Artest stole his life.

These days, though, he's working through the disappointment. From the Los Angeles Times (http://www.latimes.com/sports/la-sp-trevor-ariza4-2009nov04,0,7857488.story):

"Of course I was upset," Ariza said. "But there was nothing I could do about it. … "I'm happy for Ron Artest. He's doing what he wants to do and he has a chance to play in L.A. like he's always wanted to do. I don't never have no hard feelings and I don't wish bad on anybody. I wish him the best of luck and that team the best of luck."

Ariza has spoken with many of his former teammates, and said he watched the Lakers play on television last Friday when they lost to Dallas.

It's a testament to Ariza's sense of loyalty and indifference to being "the man" that he's still pining for the Lakers on some level, and that he can't see the difference between Artest's career arc and his own. Maybe I'm underestimating the grandeur of championships, but dang, Ariza's got one already at the relatively young age of 25. Now he gets to strike off on his own as the unquestioned star of the Rockets (for now, at least) and expand his horizons.

Based on what I've seen so far, Ariza's game is expanding at a crazy rate, and has lost nothing from being outside of the Triangle's shelter. He's more fluid, capable of doing more with the ball, and makes threes from more than just one spot (and less mechanically so). Meanwhile, that wacko Artest is hoping to bring out his best qualities and distill his game so it can fit into a system crowded with stars.

Ariza's proven he can play the supporting role and got the ring to show for it. Now it's time to go out into the world and try and get one with his own name displayed more prominently. It's a hard pill to swallow, and as a city, L.A. beats Houston, but Ariza should probably be thanking Artest for putting him on the road to a career people will really remember. With that ring, he's already got that monkey off his back, as well as something pretty to show the grandkids if he crashes and burns in the next couple seasons.

They may have swapped positions, but Artest was in a bit of a desperate situation. Ariza's free to start the career he probably always knew he was capable of.

[TheMACHINE]

Ariza is simply a better defender than Artest right now. Artest was always a pretty selfish defender - he'd shut-down his man but would help a little as possible - and nowadays he can't defend the quicker perimeter players anymore. Still great to defend longer, slower power 3s, especially if the refs are allowing him to be physical, but Ariza is more versatile, can guard every backcourt position equally well and a better help defender.

Maybe Artest is still better offensively, in spite of his atrocious shot-selection, but as stated in the article, he's the 4th/5th option, so who cares? Ariza is a better 3pt shooter now, he'd be a better fit for the Lakers on both sides of the floor.

haha first time i heard of a "selfish defender" for shutting down his man (who is normally the opponents best offenseive player) :lol

[hater]

Ariza could make the allstar game, Artest... not so much

[Double-Up]

The only thing amusing here is a dumbass laughing at another dumbass. You can never launder yourself color anyways, still you'll always be identified as an exasperating parasite till your shitty ass gets cremated or buried.

What's up Rogue? :rollin

[The Franchise]

I think they're both happy with the way things worked out. Artest is happy to live his dream of becoming a Laker, and Ariza is happy for the chance to florish in a way he would never be able to in LA. It's a win,win.

[Brazil]

Ariza>Artest

[21_Blessings]

Ariza>Artest

Pau > Parker

[HarlemHeat37]

HarlemHeat37>21_Blessings..

[RedsLakers24]

RedsLakers24>>>all spurstalk posters

[21_Blessings]

harlemheat37>21_blessings..

15 > 4