Richard Jefferson... worst trade of the NBA offseason [Archive]

HarlemHeat37

11-06-2009, 01:10 AM

He's being put in a situation that doesn't look like a good fit for him anymore..doesn't look good as a defensive stopper..

We need a role player that can play the D next to him..Bogans or Hairston hopefully..

He hasn't been nearly as bad as you guys are saying though..his offense has been fine, everybody has sucked tonight..

evi11emons

11-06-2009, 01:11 AM

:lmao:lmao:lmao

lil_penny

11-06-2009, 01:12 AM

Damn LL to think we had said this about big dick a while back and nobody seemed to believe us..... he's not what the spurs needed, maybe the clippers but not the spurs.

GINNNNNNNNNNNNOBILI

11-06-2009, 01:13 AM

Bowen can't be any worse than that peice of caca Bogans

timvp

11-06-2009, 01:14 AM

lol oberto

HarlemHeat37

11-06-2009, 01:14 AM

Spurs#1

11-06-2009, 01:14 AM

He's bringing about as much to this team as Derek Andersen.

itzsoweezee

11-06-2009, 01:15 AM

please kill yourself. jefferson isn't the problem. the spurs big men, other than blair, are playing terrible.

dastrey

11-06-2009, 01:15 AM

Seriously, can he even finish at the rim if it isn't a dunk? And his D is worse than Bonner's. I would rather see Hairston play.

HarlemHeat37

11-06-2009, 01:17 AM

I understand the complaints about his defense tonight, but his offense has been fine..he's missed some shots, but did you guys expect him to shoot 100% from the field?..strange expectations..

he's playing within the offense, he's been arguably our best perimeter passer so far this season as well..

DPG21920

11-06-2009, 01:18 AM

Jefferson is 5-9 from the field, 2 3s, 3 rebounds, 3 assists, and only 1 turnover..this thread is strange..

His defense has been bad tonight, but so has every other player on the team not named Duncan..

Don't quote his numbers. If you watched the game, Duncan/Parker/RJ all played poorly overall.

MmP

11-06-2009, 01:19 AM

show some respect to fab timvp

braeden0613

11-06-2009, 01:20 AM

There isn't enough cliffs in the world to supply spurs fans..sigh.

lil_penny

11-06-2009, 01:21 AM

he's playing within the offense, he's been arguably our best perimeter passer so far this season as well..

Sounds like his little buddy luke....

SA210

11-06-2009, 01:21 AM

I said we'd miss Bruce

HarlemHeat37

11-06-2009, 01:24 AM

Don't quote his numbers. If you watched the game, Duncan/Parker/RJ all played poorly overall.

I agree..not worth a thread though, which is my point for bringing up the numbers..TBH, I thought he had a worse game than the numbers showed before I looked them up, but still..you would think he had a mind-blowing bad game..

spurtech09

11-06-2009, 01:24 AM

its just a game....not the end of the world lol......but yeah spurs defense was not good tonight....

Spursmania

11-06-2009, 01:25 AM

Michael Finley >>>>>>> Jefferson

Let's not push it now...:lol

Spursmania

11-06-2009, 01:27 AM

http://images.inmagine.com/img/rubberball/rbv002/rbv0021930.jpg

androck

11-06-2009, 01:28 AM

Richard Jefferson was a -18 on the night which was the worst of all Spurs. Tim Duncan was -15, McDyess at -14, and Manu at -10. Surprisingly Bonner and McDyess both played 17 minutes while Bonner finished at -4. Mason and Blair both finished the game at +5. Neither Finley nor Bonner were the problem tonight: Duncan, McDyess, RJ, and Manu could not get anything going and the Jazz abused them while they were on the floor.

#2!

11-06-2009, 01:29 AM

OP=retarded

HarlemHeat37

11-06-2009, 01:29 AM

+/- for one game should never be used as an argument in any way..

Morg1411

11-06-2009, 01:29 AM

There isn't enough cliffs in the world to supply spurs fans..sigh.

:lmao

Budkin

11-06-2009, 01:29 AM

It's November 6th.

VivaPopovich

11-06-2009, 01:30 AM

I agree that we should have re-signed Bowen, but give Jefferson some time, when he aggressively drove in he was in his old form

we have 9 new players out of 15, let them work the kinks out

alchemist

11-06-2009, 01:30 AM

:lmao @ at all these cliff jumpers

HarlemHeat37

11-06-2009, 01:32 AM

cue da_suns_fan in 3, 2, 1..

androck

11-06-2009, 01:32 AM

+/- for one game should never be used as an argument in any way..

Why not? It's a good measurement for how a player performed on a given night. I'm not claiming RJ, Duncan, Manu, and McDyess are the worst players on the team, I'm just saying they did not have a good game, especially RJ.

HarlemHeat37

11-06-2009, 01:32 AM

Why not? It's a good measurement for how a player performed on a given night. I'm not claiming RJ, Duncan, Manu, and McDyess are the worst players on the team, I'm just saying they did not have a good game, especially RJ.

They definitely had bad games, but +/- for small sample sizes is very misleading due to who is on the court with the player in question, and who is against him at the same time..

Sense

11-06-2009, 01:35 AM

4 games into the fuckin season... stop fucking crying..

This team wasn't going to mesh this fast.

androck

11-06-2009, 01:36 AM

They definitely had bad games, but +/- for small sample sizes is very misleading due to who is on the court with the player in question, and who is against him at the same time..

So would you rather look at RJ's line of 14-3-3 on 5/9 shooting? Pretty respectable except for the fact that he was a sieve on the defensive end which doesn't show up in a regular box score.

NostalgicSpursFan

11-06-2009, 01:37 AM

We need more length, who could we get before the deadline?

HarlemHeat37

11-06-2009, 01:38 AM

So would you rather look at RJ's line of 14-3-3 on 5/9 shooting? Pretty respectable except for the fact that he was a sieve on the defensive end which doesn't show up in a regular box score.

Everybody that watched the game has acknowledged that he had a bad game, especially defensively..nothing more to see..I'm just saying that +/- doesn't work for 1 game..

024

11-06-2009, 01:40 AM

i actually do think the spurs need a legitimate perimeter stopper. a trade for one *cough* battier *cough* seems more and more likely. jefferson at best can provide solid defense.

HarlemHeat37

11-06-2009, 01:45 AM

I honestly believe Hairston can be our stopper..if he fails, then I'm all for a trade..I believe he can succeed though, even though the odds are against us..

I'd rather save our trade for a big man though..

androck

11-06-2009, 01:46 AM

We need more length, who could we get before the deadline?

We don't need more length. We need our big man rotation to adjust as McDyess and Blair get more experience in the system and get more minutes. We need Manu to get back to his old self and Tim to get his legs under him. I didn't like the RJ trade to begin with (WP48 of 0.064), especially at his contract price, but I think he'll do better this year since he won't take so many shots. George Hill will get better every game and by the time February rolls around we should close out the season with the best post-All-Star-break record in the NBA.

Agloco

11-06-2009, 01:46 AM

duhoh

11-06-2009, 01:47 AM

i don't think most of these people know what's goin on here. . .

lennyalderette

11-06-2009, 01:48 AM

listen people !! its a brand fucking new team!! be hard on the old guys they should know better! as far as the new ones give em a break, by the fifteenth game if we play this poorly then i will be worried!! and as far aas trading yes it would be nice to get a camby kinda guy but pop needs to step up and figure out the rotation, theres alot of kinks to be worked out and by kinks i mean on the court (real nba play),not just because we had 4 days off. ill say even 20 games mark my words! do you actually think pop is going to continue to let his team play like this? tim duncan isnt going out like this! come on spurs fans lets project positive and quit acting like were in cali

Agloco

11-06-2009, 01:49 AM

So would you rather look at RJ's line of 14-3-3 on 5/9 shooting? Pretty respectable except for the fact that he was a sieve on the defensive end which doesn't show up in a regular box score.

You're forgetting about the nine other players on the court. RJ's defense by itself doesn't explain his +/-.

+/- is one of the most misleading stats out there, especially when considering one game.

Agloco

11-06-2009, 01:53 AM

Why not? It's a good measurement for how a player performed on a given night. I'm not claiming RJ, Duncan, Manu, and McDyess are the worst players on the team, I'm just saying they did not have a good game, especially RJ.

Fail.

It's a measurement of how all 10 players performed while said player was on the court. Theres far too many co-dependent variables involved to use it in this fashion.

lennyalderette

11-06-2009, 01:54 AM

we could panic all day, the best thing to do is think positive because everything we notice pop notices x10 that its right in front of him, hes a step ahead of us, and im sure he has an idea of what he needs to do

ManuTP9

11-06-2009, 02:00 AM

Fuck that we need Elson back and KT's googly eyes.

androck

11-06-2009, 02:03 AM

Fail.

It's a measurement of how all 10 players performed while said player was on the court. Theres far too many co-dependent variables involved to use it in this fashion.

You're right. Like all statistics in a team sport (as opposed to baseball), +/- is dependent on the other players involved in the game. In this case, RJ, the player with the third-most minutes on the Spurs tonight (after TD and Tony), while playing usually against the A-team of the Jazz and frequently along with TD, Manu, and TP was outscored. I agree that usually +/- is a poor indicator when looking at just one player for just one game but my point was to compare our best players against the Jazz' best players. That's why I put multiple players' +/- in my post. They wiped the floor with us and everyone who watched the game saw that when our A-team was on the court, our team defense was poor and RJ's man defense was not good. DeJuan and Tony played very well, the rest of the team was pretty lousy. That's all I'm trying to say and that's why I used the +/- to illustrate my point.

SA210

11-06-2009, 02:12 AM

i actually do think the spurs need a legitimate perimeter stopper.

We had one..

dirk4mvp

11-06-2009, 02:12 AM

:cry But he fits in so well with the spurs system. And now he's not on a bad team (lol, actually he still is) he can concentrate on playing defense and score when necessary :cry

Sean Cagney

11-06-2009, 02:13 AM

:cry But he fits in so well with the spurs system. And now he's not on a bad team (lol, actually he still is) he can concentrate on playing defense and score when necessary :cry

LOL so now this is a bad team? Are you serious?

lennyalderette

11-06-2009, 02:17 AM

:cry But he fits in so well with the spurs system. And now he's not on a bad team (lol, actually he still is) he can concentrate on playing defense and score when necessary :cry
the guy whos team just gave away a game to a really weak hornets team!!bahaha

KSeal

11-06-2009, 02:17 AM

I hate Spurs fans.

Me too.

dirk4mvp

11-06-2009, 02:21 AM

the guy whos team just gave away a game to a really weak hornets team!!bahaha

The guy who's team just gave away a game to a really weak Jazz team!! bahaha

timvp

11-06-2009, 02:26 AM

The guy who's team just gave away a game to a really weak Jazz team!! bahaha

lmao bolding fail

UnWantedTheory

11-06-2009, 02:27 AM

:cry But he fits in so well with the spurs system. And now he's not on a bad team (lol, actually he still is) he can concentrate on playing defense and score when necessary :cry

4 games...Lets bring up the destruction of the Mavs by the Wizards, or the pure ass beating they were taking up until a few minutes in the fourth of the Utah game...Its basketball...Its where shit happens...We win, we lose....It is very early on.

I swear the douchebaggery that goes on around here. Half of you bitching Spurs fans are just as bad. I am a little worried too, but damn its only four games. Give it time.

I too saw the game tonight where we had little to no defense, terrible rotations, disgusting chemistry, no offensive vision, and pure lights out bad shooting. It was one of those nights. I am only worried at the fact that those are two of "those nights" in the first four games. But again, it is still early...give it a rest for about 10-20 games...then start bitching bitches.

:lobt::lobt::lobt::lobt::flag::lobt2:

dirk4mvp

11-06-2009, 02:27 AM

Durr Hurr

Richard Jefferson fail.

Remembah when he was a better pickup than Shawn Marion?

dirk4mvp

11-06-2009, 02:28 AM

4 games...Lets bring up the destruction of the Mavs by the Wizards, or the pure ass beating they were taking up until a few minutes in the fourth of the Utah game...Its basketball...Its where shit happens...We win, we lose....It is very early on.

I swear the douchebaggery that goes on around here. Half of you bitching Spurs fans are just as bad. I am a little worried too, but damn its only four games. Give it time.

I too saw the game tonight where we had little to no defense, terrible rotations, disgusting chemistry, no offensive vision, and pure lights out bad shooting. It was one of those nights. I am only worried at the fact that those are two of "those nights" in the first four games. But again, it is still early...give it a rest for about 10-20 games...then start bitching bitches.

:lobt::lobt::lobt::lobt::flag::lobt2:

u mad

UnWantedTheory

11-06-2009, 02:28 AM

It hurts so much.....

Greg Oden

11-06-2009, 02:30 AM

Durr Hurr

Richard Jefferson fail.

Remembah when he was a better pickup than Shawn Marion?

lol I do. It lasted all of 1 game.

UnWantedTheory

11-06-2009, 02:30 AM

u mad

Asking or telling? Question or statement?

But to answer, I am completely sane and I am not angry.

024

11-06-2009, 02:31 AM

We had one..
bowen is 38. can't live in the past.

lennyalderette

11-06-2009, 02:35 AM

u mad
listen yes the spurs sucked tonight, im just saying quit acting like your freakin team is undefeated, if the regular season meant rings you guys probably wait a minute... would still only have two, but anyway its about a larger picture something mark cuban has never thought about. and i would much rather be beaten by a well played jazz, and bulls team then to lose to the wizards, and a crappy hornets team. dirk can put up big numbers every year and your weak ass team still doesnt finish

dirk4mvp

11-06-2009, 02:37 AM

listen yes the spurs sucked tonight, im just saying quit acting like your freakin team is undefeated, if the regular season meant rings you guys probably wait a minute... would still only have two, but anyway its about a larger picture something mark cuban has never thought about. and i would much rather be beaten by a well played jazz, and bulls team then to lose to the wizards, and a crappy hornets team. dirk can put up big numbers every year and your weak ass team still doesnt finish

I realize you're new to being a spurfan and want to make a good impression, but slow down and try to type something other than a wall of words.

lennyalderette

11-06-2009, 02:38 AM

oh and mark my words were going to beat you on friday so i would get all your shit talking in before your too late

UnWantedTheory

11-06-2009, 02:38 AM

the guy whos team just gave away a game to a really weak hornets team!!bahaha

That one too...

lennyalderette

11-06-2009, 02:41 AM

I realize you're new to being a spurfan and want to make a good impression, but slow down and try to type something other than a wall of words.
ive been going to games since the hemisphere! i dont need anyones approval here, im a spurs fan regardless of posts kid

UnWantedTheory

11-06-2009, 02:41 AM

Might as well ignore that douche Lenny....they are not capable of recognizing their betters. :)

lennyalderette

11-06-2009, 02:45 AM

yeah sometimes they get you at just the right time. haha
i

timvp

11-06-2009, 02:45 AM

lmao troll login logout

SenorSpur

11-06-2009, 03:12 AM

I never thought of RJ as being a defensive stopper. While it's true that, at one time when he was younger, he may have been an adequate to average defender. Yet it's probably a bit naive of anyone, including Pop, to think that somehow he was going to turn back the clock and "recapture his defensive magic". He's had too long to develop poor defensive habits.

Trevor Ariza is looking mighty good, and cheaper, right now.

EricB

11-06-2009, 03:36 AM

Is this what Spurstalk has fallen to.

A forum with Spurs fans who don't know shit about basketball and trolls who come in to talk BS just cause its "fun"?

How the mighty have fallen.

SA210

11-06-2009, 03:46 AM

bowen is 38. can't live in the past.

And he's still a better defender than anyone in the NBA on the perimeter.

BG_Spurs_Fan

11-06-2009, 03:48 AM

And he's still a better defender than anyone in the NBA on the perimeter.

Apparently 30 teams don't think so. Apply for a GM job.

KSeal

11-06-2009, 03:49 AM

Trevor Ariza is looking mighty good right now..

5-21 shooting performances look mighty good to you?

jag

11-06-2009, 03:53 AM

meh....i'm not too worried about him. If he's still playing D like this in January, then i'll probably freak out.

Also, if Matt Bonner and Michael Finley are still on this team come the trade deadline....I'll flip my shit.

Chieflion

11-06-2009, 03:59 AM

Can someone summarise the game for me?

jag

11-06-2009, 04:01 AM

Can someone summarise the game for me?

Ass-beating by the Jazz.

See the box score.

Chieflion

11-06-2009, 04:02 AM

Ass-beating by the Jazz.

See the box score.
I can see the box score. I just want to know why the team sucked. I could not watch the game due to a major exam.

duncan228

11-06-2009, 04:02 AM

McDonald's recap:

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=138669

jag

11-06-2009, 04:04 AM

I just want to know why the team sucked.

They aren't playing well right now. There's no defense whatsoever. The interior defense especially....it's pathetic.

FeZZy

11-06-2009, 04:51 AM

you guys are all retarded what is this the fourth game and all of you are jumping off the bandwagon? to what join the lakers? COME ON! just because we lost to UTAH in NOVEMBER does not mean we aren't contenders and because Boozer finally decided to show up..you guys are despicable:nope...

oh and just because jefferson sucked tonight DOES NOT MEAN THAT HAIRSTON IS THE ANSWER I'd have a injured jack vaughn before we throw in some guy of the inactive list at least vaugh played

FeZZy

11-06-2009, 04:52 AM

And he's still a better defender than anyone in the NBA on the perimeter.

:lmao
obviously you were not around for last year...

PBEEZY

11-06-2009, 05:50 AM

The beginning of the season Where over reacting happens

Danny.Zhu

11-06-2009, 05:59 AM

Give him more time to prove...

TDMVPDPOY

11-06-2009, 06:15 AM

he attacked the rim alot today...but the brute force of the jizz affected his selection shots

Spurs Brazil

11-06-2009, 06:21 AM

Just 4 games so far

RJ is going to be fine.

urunobili

11-06-2009, 06:24 AM

http://fc00.deviantart.com/fs6/i/2005/115/7/e/__Jump_Off_a_Cliff___Emoticon_by_neek_zique.gif

ploto

11-06-2009, 07:14 AM

I have never been sure of how he really fits into the role he will be called upon to fill- the Spurs are all about filling a specific role.

spurspokesman

11-06-2009, 08:36 AM

I agree that we should have re-signed Bowen, but give Jefferson some time, when he aggressively drove in he was in his old form

we have 9 new players out of 15, let them work the kinks out

Agree. Cant hang em yet.:hat

spursfan1000

11-06-2009, 08:39 AM

lmao at Spurs fans, I'm ashamed to be a spurs fan

myhc

11-06-2009, 09:08 AM

Spurs fans, undoubedtly one of the worst in the NBA. Fuck you.

antimvp

11-06-2009, 09:09 AM

rj/fin/bonner for sjax...........NOW.

Horse

11-06-2009, 09:12 AM

This is so fucking rediculous after only 4 games. We played a tough team with a tough home court. This team always starts slow and it may take even longer considering all the new parts. Everybody settle down and let them get used to each other. Idiots!

hater

11-06-2009, 10:09 AM

It hurts so much.....

:lmao

seriously IMO we need to activate Hairston and see what he can bring. I think Jefferson will be ok, but now I don't consider the Jefferson move the best offseason move in the NBA. not at all

hater

11-06-2009, 10:10 AM

Can someone summarise the game for me?

we got raped. our D was laughable. Tim and Manu played like little sissies turning the ball over and over and over. Mcdyess and RJ looked like they came from special olympics on D. Parker set the tone with a horrible 1st quarter, then payed ok. Pop looked drunk out ther. and everyone else pretty much didnt give a shit, except for Blair.

modtxspur

11-06-2009, 10:17 AM

D looked horrible as a TEAM. Jefferson is not comfortable yet, give it time. Every game you see glimpses of what he will eventually bring to the game but i guess it a bad trade. I mean he is supposed to bring 30ppg 7ast and 6reb per game and also be our kobe/dirk/lebron/howard stopper......

skinsfan1

11-06-2009, 10:20 AM

i have to say i am disappointed so far in his preformance. I hope he improves alot quickly.

Tully365

11-06-2009, 12:49 PM

Is this what Spurstalk has fallen to.

A forum with Spurs fans who don't know shit about basketball and trolls who come in to talk BS just cause its "fun"?

How the mighty have fallen.

:wakeup I haven't noticed any changes over the past couple of years at spurstalk, except maybe fewer threads by sequspur with titles like "lick my balls" or "Pop fuckin sucks dick".... all in all, I'd say little has changed.

vander

11-06-2009, 12:58 PM

RJ > Manu

also

Bonner > Mcdyess

Bukefal

11-06-2009, 01:01 PM

:lol at this thread. What is your problem? Jeezz, a loss and all these threads popping up. It's getting worse and worse in here with the exaggerated drama panic of some spurs fans over here.