Trade Buzz swirling around listless Hornets

[Thunder Dan]

What are the Cavaliers fans who love to use the various trade machines and cook up complex transactions going to do? Especially considering the team was deeply involved in the Jackson talks and is still very much in the market to absorb more salary to improve.

November trades are rare -- though this is two consecutive years there have been early season deals including last November's stunning Chauncey Billups for Allen Iverson swap -- because usually teams want to see 25-30 games before making big decisions. Also there's the key Dec. 15 date. After that, draft picks and players signed over the summer can be traded so it opens up the market considerably.

But if you still need your fix, do what many general managers throughout the NBA are doing and keep an eye on the New Orleans Hornets.

It is a bit of an unfortunate story. Two years ago, the Hornets were among the league's elite as they came home after two years in exile following Hurricane Katrina. They had young stars, solid role players and a growing fan base.

Things have changed fast, already leading to the firing of coach Byron Scott less than a month into the regular season. The general manager, Jeff Bower, is now coaching and many feel his job may be in jeopardy, too, if he can't lead a turnaround, which for the moment won't include injured superstar Chris Paul.

Without getting into too much detail, what the league is watching is the number $75 million, which is about the team's current payroll. That's about $6 million over the luxury tax line, which means a $6 million penalty if it stays there by the trading deadline.

As the team struggles and fewer fans show up, it is believed the pressure is going to be on from ownership to reduce current and future salary commitments. Owner George Shinn is not nearly as wealthy as most of his counterparts and, in fact, the Hornets are his biggest property.

Last February the Hornets, feeling the pinch of the economy, made a cash-dumping trade by sending Tyson Chandler to the Oklahoma City Thunder for expiring contracts, which would have saved the team more than $10 million this season and put them under the luxury tax.

But there was backlash within the team and its fans because the Hornets were headed for the playoffs and because of Chandler's on-court relationship with Paul. Then things changed when the trade was rescinded because Chandler failed his physical with the Thunder.

Perhaps feeling emboldened over the summer, the team traded Chandler again, but this time for Emeka Okafor and his gigantic contract, which has five years and $60 million left on it. But it isn't working and the Hornets simply may have to wave the white flag and dump salary.

There has already been a rumor that Okafor is back on the market. According to numerous league executives, though, for the most part the Hornets are currently in a holding pattern and aren't looking to make a major trade. But that could change and everyone knows it.

The team has four highly paid players in Peja Stojakovic, David West, Paul and Okafor. Paul is untouchable and Stojakovic is going to be very tough to trade because his game has declined and he's going to make $15.3 million next year. Which leaves West and Okafor. Expect there to be rumors about those two coming soon if the Hornets don't turn their record around.

New Orleans has other role players who make significant money, especially James Posey and Morris Peterson. They both could be in play, but won't be the prime properties because neither are playing very well and neither are a big man.

West is going to be the most desirable. A two-time All-Star power forward is a talented scorer and has the best contract of the bunch. It is $9 million this season and actually goes down in each of the next two years. Okafor is more of a classic big man and a double double machine, but his contract runs on through 2013-14 and for huge money.

Of course, the Hornets don't want to give any of these players up, especially West. They will deny they want to do it, just as they denied they were trading Chandler just to get rid of his salary last year.

But right now the Hornets are bad, expensive and in a small market. That is a terrible combination and the circumstances may force some action. And plenty of conjecture as well.

[Findog]

Sons, we are just off to a slow start and the team will turn it around. Don't believe this garbage you read sons, God Bless.

/BRHornet45

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

Of course, the Hornets don't want to give any of these players up, especially West. They will deny they want to do it, just as they denied they were trading Chandler just to get rid of his salary last year.

Um, last I checked, they traded Chandler for a worse contract with the intention of improving themselves. They've backed up their talk.

[Thunder Dan]

Sons, we are just off to a slow start and the team will turn it around. Don't believe this garbage you read sons, God Bless.

/BRHornet45

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_W1tnFxV75u0/SCOJi6R6KhI/AAAAAAAAAJA/GBCHMJTHHHA/s320/rudy-hornets-playoffs.jpg

[Thunder Dan]

Um, last I checked, they traded Chandler for a worse contract with the intention of improving themselves. They've backed up their talk.

According to this same insider, he wrote a couple week ago how that move was a move made to show the fans they weren't giving up to keep the attendance steady when they trade David West. Without that move, and already showing they wanted to get rid of Chandler for salary reasons, and if they traded West they would revolt. Getting Okafur alreast shows some attempt at winning. Who knows, sounds like a weird plan

[DaDakota]

Tmac?

DD

[IronMexican]

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_W1tnFxV75u0/SCOJi6R6KhI/AAAAAAAAAJA/GBCHMJTHHHA/s320/rudy-hornets-playoffs.jpg

That picture is so embarrassing for the guy.

[sefant77]

Its a good laugh...

Nice draft steals in West and Paul.

Getting Chandler for expiring.

2006: Signing Peja to a bloated contract
2007:Signing Peterson to a long contract
2008: Signing Posey to a long contract (uh another old SF)
Feb09: Trying to dump Chandler for nothing
August 2009: Trading Chandler for the bloated contract of Okafor
Nov 2009: Trying to dump Okafor?

:rollin

[duhoh]

Lol noh

[redzero]

http://www.nola.com/hornets/index.ssf/2009/11/reports_of_new_orleans_hornets.html

Reports of New Orleans Hornets trade talks have no merit and other NBA news

By Jimmy Smith, The Times-Picayune (http://connect.nola.com/user/jssmith/index.html)

November 22, 2009, 9:47AM

First, it was the baseless report out of Sacramento that the New Orleans Hornets were shopping center Emeka Okafor.
Now in today's Cleveland Plain Dealer (http://www.cleveland.com/cavs/index.ssf/2009/11/trade_buzz_beginning_to_build.html), there's rampant speculation that the Hornets are willing to deal just about everyone but Chris Paul.
According to high-level team sources, the Hornets won't be moving anyone anytime soon. The club is going to stick with this group to see what it can do. So any movement this far away from the February trading deadline is unexpected.


But don't worry, Thunder Dan! Maybe the Hornets will trade Chris Paul to the Cavs for Zydrunas Illguaskas.

[jonnybravo]

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_W1tnFxV75u0/SCOJi6R6KhI/AAAAAAAAAJA/GBCHMJTHHHA/s320/rudy-hornets-playoffs.jpg

Wow what a faggot ass sign.

[024]

The hornets should salary dump posey to the spurs. Everyone knows posey is only effective in the playoffs and the hornets won't be contending until peja's contract expires.

[Thunder Dan]

http://www.nola.com/hornets/index.ssf/2009/11/reports_of_new_orleans_hornets.html


But don't worry, Thunder Dan! Maybe the Hornets will trade Chris Paul to the Cavs for Zydrunas Illguaskas.

well when the rest of the league is talking trade, and pointing out such facts as your owner has cancer and is doing estate planning, and that the 4-9 team is $6,000,000 over the cap. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out what is going on. The Hornets said all along last year they weren't dumping salary, and then they traded Chandler away in a salary dump. So why would you believe them again when the team is worse?

[Mel_13]

It is a bit of an unfortunate story. Two years ago, the Hornets were among the league's elite


Change Hornets to Cavs and this is the lead for an article in 2011.

[Thunder Dan]

Change Hornets to Cavs and this is the lead for an article in 2011.

Change that the title to the Spurs for the last 2 years

[Mel_13]

Change that the title to the Spurs for the last 2 years

Surely you can do better than that.

[Thunder Dan]

Surely you can do better than that.

if this was a Family Feud question today

'It is a bit of an unfortunate story. Two years ago, the _______ were among the league's elite'

The Spurs would be the #1 answer

[Mel_13]

if this was a Family Feud question today

'It is a bit of an unfortunate story. Two years ago, the _______ were among the league's elite'

The Spurs would be the #1 answer

So you can't do any better.

Look, you've got to see the irony of a Cav beat writer doing a story about a fallen franchise when everyone associated with the city of Cleveland and the Cavs organization is on a deathwatch awaiting the decision one man will make in July, 2010.

[Thunder Dan]

So you can't do any better.

Look, you've got to see the irony of a Cav beat writer doing a story about a fallen franchise when everyone associated with the city of Cleveland and the Cavs organization is on a deathwatch awaiting the decision one man will make in July, 2010.
our owner isn't broke and dying, and the fans still pack the arena. Much bigger difference than the Hornets. And even if Lebron leaves, our owner won't be broke as he owns casinos and a fortune 500 company which is privately owned. So the Cavs and Hornets are a different situation

[Mel_13]

our owner isn't broke and dying, and the fans still pack the arena. Much bigger difference than the Hornets. And even if Lebron leaves, our owner won't be broke as he owns casinos and a fortune 500 company which is privately owned. So the Cavs and Hornets are a different situation

So the Cavs will still be championship contenders with a sold-out arena if LeBron leaves?

Saying that the potential bottom for the Cavs is better than the bottom for the Hornets really isn't saying very much.

I just think the Cavs' beat writer has better subject matter available than the misfortunes of another franchise, especially given the Cav's past and their potential future.

[JJ Hickson]

if this was a Family Feud question today

'It is a bit of an unfortunate story. Two years ago, the _______ were among the league's elite'

The Spurs would be the #1 answer



:lmao

[Thunder Dan]

So the Cavs will still be championship contenders with a sold-out arena if LeBron leaves?

Saying that the potential bottom for the Cavs is better than the bottom for the Hornets really isn't saying very much.

I just think the Cav beat writer has better subject matter available than the misfortunes of another franchise, especially given the Cav's past and their potential future.

why do people always write Cav's? It's Cavs or Cavs' and there is no singular Cav. You can't abbreviate a singular Cavalier when you are talking about a team of individuals

It's Cavs, Cavs' if you are showing possession of something like their beat writer. It's my pet peeve along with people who spell lose "loose"

[Mel_13]

why do people always write Cav's? It's Cavs or Cavs' and there is no singular Cav.

It's Cavs, Cavs' if you are showing possession of something like their beat writer. It's my pet peeve along with people who spell lose "loose"

Typo, I'll edit.

Any response to the content of the post?

[Thunder Dan]

Typo, I'll edit.

Any response to the content of the post?

you want me to answer why out beat writer isn't writing about 2010 and is writing about what every GM in the league outside of New Orleans is talking about? Why does that merit an answer?

Every GM in the league are acting as vulchers hovering above the Hornets. Brian is saying exactly what every GM in the league is saying: The Hornets owner got diagnosed with cancer, isn't a rich man, is losing money, and attendance is dropping. They are 4-9, their best player is hurt, and they are $6 million over the cap which turns into $12,000,000 after penalty. The GM's, and Brian in the article, even say that the Hornets will deny dumping players to save face up until the point they actually do it (just like last year).

So you are asking me to compare that to Lebron leaving? The difference is a) our owner owns the Cavs as a hobby of sorts. He owns it for fun. He makes his money through his Fortune 500 company he started from scratch, and supplements that with money from his developments such as Casinos and Fathead. No matter how much money the Cavs lose each year (which they aren't currently) he would rather see profits in his main businesses.

The Hornets owner on the other hand only owns the Hornets as his business. If they lose $4,000,000 this year, he loses $4,000,000. His income and worth depends on what kind of profit the Hornets turn. This is a major deal when you are diagnosed with cancer and are forced into estate planning estimates and life insurance obligations.

So even if the Cavs lose Lebron, they are still in a better position because their owner will still be looking to field a good team and not just make money. That said, the Cavs' owner is the person who is least concerned about Lebron leaving. He laughs it off every time and he and Lebron have a close relationship. He got Lebron a seat at the ultra exclusive Allen & Co convention this summer, offers him his private jet, and caters to him in ways no other team would. If Gilbert isn't worried about Lebron leaving, no reason Cavs fans should

[Mel_13]

you want me to answer why out beat writer isn't writing about 2010 and is writing about what every GM in the league outside of New Orleans is talking about? Why does that merit an answer?

Every GM in the league are acting as vulchers hovering above the Hornets. Brian is saying exactly what every GM in the league is saying: The Hornets owner got diagnosed with cancer, isn't a rich man, is losing money, and attendance is dropping. They are 4-9, their best player is hurt, and they are $6 million over the cap which turns into $12,000,000 after penalty. The GM's, and Brian in the article, even say that the Hornets will deny dumping players to save face up until the point they actually do it (just like last year).

So you are asking me to compare that to Lebron leaving? The difference is a) our owner owns the Cavs as a hobby of sorts. He owns it for fun. He makes his money through his Fortune 500 company he started from scratch, and supplements that with money from his developments such as Casinos and Fathead. No matter how much money the Cavs lose each year (which they aren't currently) he would rather see profits in his main businesses.

The Hornets owner on the other hand only owns the Hornets as his business. If they lose $4,000,000 this year, he loses $4,000,000. His income and worth depends on what kind of profit the Hornets turn. This is a major deal when you are diagnosed with cancer and are forced into estate planning estimates and life insurance obligations.

So even if the Cavs lose Lebron, they are still in a better position because their owner will still be looking to field a good team and not just make money. That said, the Cavs' owner is the person who is least concerned about Lebron leaving. He laughs it off every time and he and Lebron have a close relationship. He got Lebron a seat at the ultra exclusive Allen & Co convention this summer, offers him his private jet, and caters to him in ways no other team would. If Gilbert isn't worried about Lebron leaving, no reason Cavs fans should

Guess I touched a nerve.....

and that last line is laughable.

[Thunder Dan]

Guess I touched a nerve.....

and that last line is laughable.

no it's just annoying to hear every joe schmo off the street who doesn't know anything just revert to 2010. 2010 has nothing to do with the Hornets not being able to pay their bills.

[Muser]

Even i'm getting pissed off about the 2010 talk, just let the damn season play out.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

if this was a Family Feud question today

'It is a bit of an unfortunate story. Two years ago, the _______ were among the league's elite'

The Spurs would be the #1 answer


:lmao owned.

[Mel_13]

no it's just annoying to hear every joe schmo off the street who doesn't know anything just revert to 2010. 2010 has nothing to do with the Hornets not being able to pay their bills.

I never said he should be writing about 2010. I just said that there were better topics available for someone writing for the Cleveland fan base. You're the one who has taken this so seriously and now has resorted to personal insults. So sensitive.

[Thunder Dan]

I never said he should be writing about 2010. I just said that there were better topics available for someone writing for the Cleveland fan base. You're the one who has taken this so seriously and now has resorted to personal insults. So sensitive.

So should the Cavs beat writer only write about the impending free agency of Lebron James? He should forget that the Cavs are one of the very few teams in the league who want to add payroll this season? I think the Hornets looking to dump salary has alot to do with the Cavs. He reported the same thing last year about the Suns and that affected the Cavs as they got Shaq for Ben Wallace.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

I never said he should be writing about 2010. I just said that there were better topics available for someone writing for the Cleveland fan base. You're the one who has taken this so seriously and now has resorted to personal insults. So sensitive.

Yeah I agree.....it's hard to find news about 2010 free agency these days.

[Mel_13]

why do people always write Cav's? It's Cavs or Cavs' and there is no singular Cav. You can't abbreviate a singular Cavalier when you are talking about a team of individuals

It's Cavs, Cavs' if you are showing possession of something like their beat writer. It's my pet peeve along with people who spell lose "loose"


So should the Cavs beat writer only write about the impending free agency of Lebron James? He should forget that the Cavs are one of the very few teams in the league who want to add payroll this season? I think the Hornets looking to dump salary has alot to do with the Cavs. He reported the same thing last year about the Suns and that affected the Cavs as they got Shaq for Ben Wallace.

:rollin




What part of "I never said he should be writing about 2010" wasn't clear?

[Thunder Dan]

if Brian Windhorst wants to sell papers in Cleveland, he won't be writing articles about what the Cavs will be if Lebron James would leave. I think it's fairly obvious. I don't think brian's target audience wants to read more articles about the possibility of Lebron leaving. Much like the NYC audience don't want to read articles about him staying in Cleveland, and the national media just don't want to hear about it period

See what I'm saying? Brian works for the Cleveland Plain Dealer. The Plain Dealer is read by people who live in Cleveland. Most Cavs fans live in and around Cleveland. That means that the people who read Brian's articles are Cavs fans. This is why he writes articles: for Cavs fans to read regarding the Cavs. He doesn't write for New York, but if he did, he would write about possible scenarios for Lebron coming to play for the Knicks. He would be talking about how they might trade Eddy Curry. But the Hornets wanting to dump salary affects the CLEVELAND CAVALIERS, which is why he writes it for Cavs fan who may be interested in the CAVS adding a new player. The article is also newsworthy for the other markets looking for players this season.

[Mel_13]

if Brian Windhorst wants to sell papers in Cleveland, he won't be writing articles about what the Cavs will be if Lebron James would leave. I think it's fairly obvious. I don't think brian's target audience wants to read more articles about the possibility of Lebron leaving. Much like the NYC audience don't want to read articles about him staying in Cleveland, and the national media just don't want to hear about it period

See what I'm saying? Brian works for the Cleveland Plain Dealer. The Plain Dealer is read by people who live in Cleveland. Most Cavs fans live in and around Cleveland. That means that the people who read Brian's articles are Cavs fans. This is why he writes articles: for Cavs fans to read regarding the Cavs. He doesn't write for New York, but if he did, he would write about possible scenarios for Lebron coming to play for the Knicks. He would be talking about how they might trade Eddy Curry. But the Hornets wanting to dump salary affects the CLEVELAND CAVALIERS, which is why he writes it for Cavs fan who may be interested in the CAVS adding a new player. The article is also newsworthy for the other markets looking for players this season.

One last time. I never said he should be writing about 2010.

[Thunder Dan]

:rollin




What part of "I never said he should be writing about 2010" wasn't clear?

well then what the hell are you even comparing? Are you saying the Horents now are better off that the Cavs if Lebron leaves? What even makes you bring that up as an argument? What does that have to do with anything? The fact is, we do have Lebron James, therefore we are in a better situation than most teams in the league. Lebron is still on our roster which makes us a better situation than the Hornets. You making that stupid argument is like me retorting with: well the Cavs without Lebron suck, but the Hornets without Chris Paul suck more or the Spurs without Duncan, Parker and Ginobli are a shit franchise It's a bunch of nonsense

[Mel_13]

well then what the hell are you even comparing? Are you saying the Horents now are better off that the Cavs if Lebron leaves? What even makes you bring that up as an argument? What does that have to do with anything? The fact is, we do have Lebron James, therefore we are in a better situation than most teams in the league. Lebron is still on our roster which makes us a better situation than the Hornets. You making that stupid argument is like me retorting with: well the Cavs without Lebron suck, but the Hornets without Chris Paul suck more. It's a bunch of nonsense

Wow.

Allow me to explain.

You posted an article by a Cleveland writer that details the current troubles of the Hornets. As I said earlier, I find considerable irony both in the article and in the fact that you found it worthy of sharing here. So I took a jab by saying a line in the article could describe the Cavs two years from now. To the extent that any argument exists, it is all yours. I just found considerable irony in that part of the article, so I made fun of it. You've taken the whole thing way too seriously.

[Thunder Dan]

Wow.

Allow me to explain.

You posted an article by a Cleveland writer that details the current troubles of the Hornets. As I said earlier, I find considerable irony both in the article and in the fact that you found it worthy of sharing here. So I took a jab by saying a line in the article could describe the Cavs two years from now. To the extent that any argument exists, it is all yours. I just found considerable irony in that part of the article, so I made fun of it. You've taken the whole thing way too seriously.

so in 2 years the Cavs owner will be dying of cancer and broke? that's a bold prediction seeing as he is one of the wealthiest owners in the NBA and by all account rather healthy

[Mel_13]

so in 2 years the Cavs owner will be dying of cancer and broke? that's a bold prediction seeing as he is one of the wealthiest owners in the NBA and by all account rather healthy

Again, wow.

You're engaging in a one-man argument. I'm not making any such case.

It

was

a

joke.

[redzero]

Chris Paul: 3 years left on his contract.
LeBron James: 1 year left on his contract.

Thunder Dan, I think you should be more concerned with your own franchise player instead of the Hornets'.

[Thunder Dan]

Chris Paul: 3 years left on his contract.
LeBron James: 1 year left on his contract.

Thunder Dan, I think you should be more concerned with your own franchise player instead of the Hornets'.

why? We are going to get your best players this year and give you nothing for them, and you will like it!

[redzero]

why? We are going to get your best players this year and give you nothing for them, and you will like it!

Sure you will.

Anyway, what jersey would look best on LeBron next year? I'm thinking Lakers or Bulls.

[Thunder Dan]

Sure you will.

Anyway, what jersey would look best on LeBron next year? I'm thinking Lakers or Bulls.

DuncanOWNSKobe said the same shit last year, which is why JJ Hickson is such a big name around here. When everything shaked out, his Suns didn't even get JJ Hickson, they got Ben Wallace for Shaq

and 2010 smack, really original

[sefant77]

Why its important how rich is the owner?

When James left it will be pretty empty in Clevelands arena because not many ppl will pay a lot to see Mo Williams, Tingeltangel or Gibson fighting for #8...

Uh i forgot Cleveland is such a nice city, even without James very nice to catch free agents...