1 in 4 mortgages 'underwater'

[coyotes_geek]

CG: Oh by the way, that whole mortgage thing is still going on...........

********

NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- In a sign that more foreclosures could be on the horizon, 23% of people with mortgages owe more than their home is worth, according to a report released Tuesday.

Almost 10.7 million U.S. mortgages were "underwater" as of September, said research firm First American CoreLogic.

Another 2.3 million homeowners are within 5% of negative territory, the report said. The two figures combined comprise almost 28% of all residential properties with mortgages.

Negative equity, also called an "underwater" or "upside down" mortgage, has become more common as home values plummet. The report is closely watched because borrowers who are underwater are more likely to be foreclosed.

Would you walk away from your house?
Foreclosures have been rampant for some time, but lately the tide of decay had seemed to be slowing -- so Tuesday's report could dent optimism for the housing market over the next few months.

State totals: The majority of underwater mortgages are heavily concentrated in five states that have particularly suffered from the housing bust: Nevada, at 65%; Arizona, at 48%; Florida, at 45%; Michigan, at 37%; and California, at 35%.

These five states have been especially beleaguered because of a high rate of prime loans that went bad. Many of those loans were option-adjustable rate mortgages, in which borrowers could choose to make minimum payments that were so low they did not even offset the interest being accumulated.

When that accumulated debt reaches a certain point -- usually 10% to 25% more than the original principal -- the option-ARMs loans are recast into fixed-rate mortgages. When that happens, many borrowers cannot afford the new payments.

http://money.cnn.com/2009/11/24/real_estate/mortgages_underwater/index.htm

[EVAY]

CG: Oh by the way, that whole mortgage thing is still going on...........

********

NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- In a sign that more foreclosures could be on the horizon, 23% of people with mortgages owe more than their home is worth, according to a report released Tuesday.

Almost 10.7 million U.S. mortgages were "underwater" as of September, said research firm First American CoreLogic.

Another 2.3 million homeowners are within 5% of negative territory, the report said. The two figures combined comprise almost 28% of all residential properties with mortgages.

Negative equity, also called an "underwater" or "upside down" mortgage, has become more common as home values plummet. The report is closely watched because borrowers who are underwater are more likely to be foreclosed.

Would you walk away from your house?
Foreclosures have been rampant for some time, but lately the tide of decay had seemed to be slowing -- so Tuesday's report could dent optimism for the housing market over the next few months.

State totals: The majority of underwater mortgages are heavily concentrated in five states that have particularly suffered from the housing bust: Nevada, at 65%; Arizona, at 48%; Florida, at 45%; Michigan, at 37%; and California, at 35%.

These five states have been especially beleaguered because of a high rate of prime loans that went bad. Many of those loans were option-adjustable rate mortgages, in which borrowers could choose to make minimum payments that were so low they did not even offset the interest being accumulated.

When that accumulated debt reaches a certain point -- usually 10% to 25% more than the original principal -- the option-ARMs loans are recast into fixed-rate mortgages. When that happens, many borrowers cannot afford the new payments.

http://money.cnn.com/2009/11/24/real_estate/mortgages_underwater/index.htm

And this is news...how?

[boutons_deux]

news?

OK, not really, just a reminder how disconnected Wall St greed is from Main St pain.

[coyotes_geek]

And this is news...how?

I guess it isn't. Back to Sarah Palin...........

[spursncowboys]

This is good. Smart consumers can get 25% of the houses for sale cheaper than they are worth.

[CosmicCowboy]

This is good. Smart consumers can get 25% of the houses for sale cheaper than they are worth.

They could if consumers could borrow the money, but in case you haven't heard, banks are tighter than a fishes asshole these days when it comes to consumer lending. They would much rather borrow billions from the US government at 0% and speculate in hard assets and make double digit returns as the dollar drops in value.

[spursncowboys]

They could if consumers could borrow the money, but in case you haven't heard, banks are tighter than a fishes asshole these days when it comes to consumer lending. They would much rather borrow billions from the US government at 0% and speculate in hard assets and make double digit returns as the dollar drops in value.

Oh really. are the banks still without money? I thought the first stimulus was to give liquidity to the banks.

[coyotes_geek]

Oh really. are the banks still without money? I thought the first stimulus was to give liquidity to the banks.

Banks having money and banks being willing to lend money aren't the same thing.

[Winehole23]

Banks having money and banks being willing to lend money aren't the same thing.Perhaps inadvertently, SnC has drawn attention to the false problem of liquidity. Last fall, we papered over massive imminent default with the promise that more liquidity would reverse the credit crunch. It didn't. Why not? The real problem was solvency, not liquidity.

Turns out, mortgage lending in a declining market with a shrinking pool of qualified borrowers is imprudent compared to various kinds of investing. Instead of lending out money to homebuyers and businesses, it's objectively smarter for banks to lend it to one another for a guaranteed 3% return, or to find even bigger returns in forex, commodities and securities.

Especially so with wave of CRE defaults expected within the next year, plus ARM resets, and defaults and bankruptcies rising pretty much across the board.

The bailout money was a survival stake for the banks and broker-dealers. Anything else that was promised was a lie.

[coyotes_geek]

Perhaps inadvertently, SnC has drawn attention to the false problem of liquidity. Last fall, we papered over massive imminent default with the promise that more liquidity would reverse the credit crunch. It didn't. Why not? The real problem was solvency, not liquidity.

Turns out, mortgage lending in a declining market with a shrinking pool of qualified borrowers is imprudent compared to various kinds of investing. Instead of lending out money to homebuyers and businesses, it's objectively smarter for banks to lend it to one another for a guaranteed 3% return, or to find even bigger returns in forex, commodities and securities.

Especially so with wave of CRE defaults expected within the next year, plus ARM resets, and defaults and bankruptcies rising pretty much across the board.

The bailout money was a survival stake for the banks and broker-dealers. Anything else that was promised was a lie.

Solid observations. It certainly looks like the banks trust each other more than they trust homebuyers these days, and they have a valid reason to do so. Even after weeding out the unqualified candidate homebuyers banks still have cause to be afraid of the qualified candidates. All it takes is a job loss to turn a qualified candidate into a high foreclosure risk. Hell, we're even seeing cases where people with stable incomes get underwater and then go buy a bigger house that's in foreclosure and then just abandon the one they were in.

[Wild Cobra]

This is good. Smart consumers can get 25% of the houses for sale cheaper than they are worth.
And what they are currently worth as a nation average is still 30% too high.

Some people were looking for that "get rich scheme" and were caught when the bubble burst.

Some people took second mortgages when they should have just been happy with their lifestyles.

Some people were flat out unlucky in this economy and lost their jobs. It's this third group I sympathize with.

[spursncowboys]

Perhaps inadvertently, SnC has drawn attention to the false problem of liquidity. Last fall, we papered over massive imminent default with the promise that more liquidity would reverse the credit crunch. It didn't. Why not? The real problem was solvency, not liquidity.

Turns out, mortgage lending in a declining market with a shrinking pool of qualified borrowers is imprudent compared to various kinds of investing. Instead of lending out money to homebuyers and businesses, it's objectively smarter for banks to lend it to one another for a guaranteed 3% return, or to find even bigger returns in forex, commodities and securities.

Especially so with wave of CRE defaults expected within the next year, plus ARM resets, and defaults and bankruptcies rising pretty much across the board.

The bailout money was a survival stake for the banks and broker-dealers. Anything else that was promised was a lie.
Great point. However, there was a liquidity problem. You are painting a picture of no available loans for homes. Thats not the case. Sure subprimes are gone, and I think ARM's are illegal or are easier to see.
" Generally speaking, mortgage lenders today are requiring borrowers to have better credit scores, more substantial down payments and better debt-to-income ratios — especially if those borrowers want to qualify for the best interest rates on a loan." -http://www.homebuyinginstitute.com/mortgageprocess_article26.php

FHA is still giving loans to people with bad credit.

[boutons_deux]

lenders fired 1000s of mortgage paper grinders, so now even if they wanted to lend, there is a processing bottleneck, and they now demand much more paper, often not easy to produce, documenting credit, revenue, liabilities, making the bottleneck worse.

here's another angle:

In Crazy New Landscape For Banks, Taxpayers Are The Big Losers
from HuffingtonPost Full Feed by The Huffington Post News Editors

Fifty banks collapsed during the third quarter of 2009, while more than one in 15 are on the verge of failure -- the highest percentage since 1992 -- according to a new report from the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation that depicts a crazy new landscape for banking in which taxpayers are the consistent losers.

Because of all the failure and near failures, the fund that guarantees deposits hit the red for the first time since 1992.

Meanwhile, some banks are making money hand over fist, with the sector as a whole posting $2.8 billion in profits -- up from a $4.3 billion loss in the second quarter.

They're doing so in part by borrowing cheap federal money -- subsidized by the American taxpayer -- even while massively cutting back on lending. The plunge in lending since last quarter is the largest recorded since federal regulators began keeping track in 1984.

The whole point of the taxpayer-funded bailout and the cheap money for banks was to recapitalize them in hopes of stimulating lending, but the banks are holding back -- which is seriously slowing the economic recovery.

"We need to see banks making more loans to their business customers," Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation Chairman Sheila Bair said Tuesday in a statement. "This is especially true for small businesses that rely on FDIC-insured institutions to provide over 60 percent of the credit they use."

In March, the Obama administration announced a $15 billion plan to jump-start government lending to small businesses. But construction and industrial loan balances at banks dropped 6.5 percent in the third quarter; overall loan balances dropped 2.8 percent.

"I will not rest until businesses are investing again and businesses are hiring again and people have work again," President Barack Obama said Monday.

But the gulf between the haves and have-nots in the banking industry is widening, imperiling the very institutions whose lending is supposed to fuel the recovery.

• The nation's 7,408 smallest banks overall broke about even during the quarter.
• The 579 mid-sized banks, loosely defined as holding assets between $1 billion and $10 billion, recorded an average loss of about $3 million during the quarter.
• The biggest 112 banks, those with more than $10 billion in assets, recorded an average profit of nearly $42 million, according to the FDIC's latest figures.

Only three new banks were formed in the three-month-period ending in September, the smallest quarterly total since World War II.

Christopher Whalen, a noted bank analyst at Institutional Risk Analytics, told HuffPost
the situation in the banking industry is "pretty gruesome." His firm tracks the overall level of stress in the sector via an index -- and Whalen said U.S. banks haven't seen today's levels of stress since the 1930s. It's "much worse" today than during the savings-and-loan crisis of the early 1990s, he said.

He cautioned that the fourth quarter, which ends Dec. 31, is going to be even worse. While economists and the administration point to economic indicators that suggest the economy is slowly improving, Whalen said that banks always trail behind the rest of the economy.

"We're going to have a bloodbath," he said. Banks were under pressure during the third quarter to cut costs and increase revenue because of the federal government's "stress tests" in the spring -- exams that gauged the health of the country's 19 biggest banks. Federal regulators were trying to determine which banks needed to raise more money. Revenue was a key component of the formula.

So banks tried to outperform in order to avoid being forced to raise more money, Whalen said. Indeed, expenses across the industry fell and profit increased. But next quarter, banks on solid footing will aggressively write off their bad loans -- driving up losses -- and those in a more precarious position will simply continue to "muddle along," Whalen said. Either way, he predicted, lending will continue to fall.

"That's the problem for the economy. We've got probably a third of the industry that's contracting," Whalen said. "They're not making new loans, they're basically in a defensive posture, and that's not going to change."

[Nbadan]

big surprise...the banks are being greedy by speculating instead of caring about 'national interests'...

:rolleyes

[spursncowboys]

big surprise...the banks are being greedy by speculating instead of caring about 'national interests'...

:rolleyes

3% isn't greedy. It's safe.

[Wild Cobra]

big surprise...the banks are being greedy by speculating instead of caring about 'national interests'...

:rolleyes
Never expect a corporation to have the best interest of the nation. They are like liberals, only care for themselves.

Those who cannot manage their assets should fail. They should not be rewarded with money, That only prolongs the dependence on the government, like liberals are dependent on the government.

Our current government wants your reliance on them. That's how liberal politicians get your votes, keeping them in power.

[Nbadan]

3% isn't greedy. It's safe.

...3% is the 'safe' return....they are speculating on gas/oil/commodities that have higher returns but greater risks...

[Nbadan]

Our current government wants your reliance on them. That's how liberal politicians get your votes, keeping them in power.

...tell that to Bush and the GOP in Congress...

[spursncowboys]

...tell that to Bush and the GOP in Congress...

Bush needs your vote how?

[Nbadan]

Bush needs your vote how?

To keep him from being indicted for war crimes against humanity?

[spursncowboys]

To keep him from being indicted for war crimes against humanity?

What crime?

[Nbadan]

nevermind...

[Winehole23]

A decade after U.S. home sales peaked, 15.4 percent of owners in the first quarter owed more on their mortgages than their properties were worth, according to a report Friday by Zillow Inc. While that’s down from a high of 31.4 percent in 2012, it’s still alarmingly above the 1 or 2 percent that marks a healthy market, said Humphries, the chief economist at the Seattle-based real-estate data provider. Worse yet: The pace of healing is losing steam.http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-06-12/scariest-u-s-housing-chart-shows-nasty-scar-years-after-bust

[Blake]

The term "home owner" is so ubiquitous.

You're forever paying someone for your home. Forever.

[boutons_deux]

and foreclosures are still running way ahead of 2006

http://www.realtytrac.com/images/reportimages/foreclosure_activity_historical_2014.png

The Banksters Great Depression is far from over, and several signs show the 2015 economy is weakening.

[Sportcamper]

In So Cal the numbers are probably worse…Banks are making a push to get foreclosures through while real estate prices are so high…Good sign that a price correction is in sight…

[RD2191]

People need to get back to their roots. Buy and build cash. If you can't afford a 3 bedroom house then tough shit. Don't have 2 kids.

[Clipper Nation]

The term "home owner" is so ubiquitous.

You're forever paying someone for your home. Forever.
Like you'd know. You're living rent-free in a cucktainer in the backyard.

[cantthinkofanything]

The term "home owner" is so ubiquitous.

You're forever paying someone for your home. Forever.

No you're not. Simpleton.
Do you seriously not know the difference between taxes and mortgage?
Was this the rationale you provided your wife for not wanting to buy a house?

Nothing wrong with renting. But make no mistake, when you buy a house, you own the house. And once it's paid off, you REALLY own it.

[Blake]

No you're not. Simpleton.
Do you seriously not know the difference between taxes and mortgage?
Was this the rationale you provided your wife for not wanting to buy a house?

Nothing wrong with renting. But make no mistake, when you buy a house, you own the house. And once it's paid off, you REALLY own it.

Lol you're forever paying taxes on a home you've already paid off.

You don't pay those taxes, you get kicked out.

aside from having to pay for all the repairs as an "owner", explain how that's different from rent.

[cantthinkofanything]

Lol you're forever paying taxes on a home you've already paid off.

You don't pay those taxes, you get kicked out.

aside from having to pay for all the repairs as an "owner", explain how that's different from rent.

You want me to explain the differences between owning a home/paying taxes and renting?

[TeyshaBlue]

Lol you're forever paying taxes on a home you've already paid off.

You don't pay those taxes, you get kicked out.

aside from having to pay for all the repairs as an "owner", explain how that's different from rent.

As a homeowner who owns multiple properties that are rentals, and paying my repair expenses for my home and rentals, I'd probably just rent if I ever shed these properties.

[Blake]

You want me to explain the differences between owning a home/paying taxes and renting?

The principle, yeah sure if you're gonna go with simpleton

[Blake]

As a homeowner who owns multiple properties that are rentals, and paying my repair expenses for my home and rentals, I'd probably just rent if I ever shed these properties.

Yeah when those a/c units go out...

[cantthinkofanything]

The principle, yeah sure if you're gonna go with simpleton

That's exactly why I don't think I'll explain it to you. I could try to teach my dog The Pythagorean Theorum and while she might be able to regurgitate the formula back, she wouldn't understand it.

[TeyshaBlue]

Yeah when those a/c units go out...

I've dropped 20k on HVAC in the last year.:depressed

[Wild Cobra]

As a homeowner who owns multiple properties that are rentals, and paying my repair expenses for my home and rentals, I'd probably just rent if I ever shed these properties.
Yep.

Maintenance can be a bitch.

[Blake]

That's exactly why I don't think I'll explain it to you. I could try to teach my dog The Pythagorean Theorum and while she might be able to regurgitate the formula back, she wouldn't understand it.

K. The poop jokes are more your thing any way.

[DJR210]

I've dropped 20k on HVAC in the last year.:depressed

Fuck.. Closing on a house in the next month, HVAC replacement was the main thing I demanding they fix and she budged. Not trying to worry about that for a while.

[DJR210]

People need to get back to their roots. Buy and build cash. If you can't afford a 3 bedroom house then tough shit. Don't have 2 kids.

People are also just fucking morons.

I worked for almost 5 years in Bank of America's default mortgage department. I've seen the worst of the mortgage industry collapse. Some of the idiots who would ask for assistance on their loan are god damn nearly brain dead.. don't make a mortgage payment in 3 years, then start threatening to hire an attorney because you just found out you're getting foreclosed on Monday? Check.. add in my mother in law to the mortgage because of her income, but disclose to the bank that she was just to help you qualify and had no intention of splitting the cost of the mortgage as you're threatening to sue them..

Also saw some of the most extreme shit while I was there.. in home suicides stopping the sale of the home.. People threatening to burn the house down, then doing it.. etc

[TDMVPDPOY]

how much u clowns still owe?

im 130k :(

[CosmicCowboy]

hmmm. about 280K on the house but I could quick sell it for a half mil if I needed to. That being said, I don't consider my house an investment. I don't mind paying $2700 a month including taxes and insurance to live there. I couldn't rent anything equivalent for that.

[cantthinkofanything]

hmmm. about 280K on the house but I could quick sell it for a half mil if I needed to. That being said, I don't consider my house an investment. I don't mind paying $2700 a month including taxes and insurance to live there. I couldn't rent anything equivalent for that.

Yeah. This. With the land, I couldn't find anything to rent for even close to my payments now. But we also live in an area where real estate values should continue to increase a few % a year for a while. I couldn't take any savings from renting and do the same without taking on some risk. But if I was single or younger or living in a different part of the country, I can definitely see myself renting.

[CosmicCowboy]

I certainly understand someone that is young and not settled renting but if you plan to be in the same place for at least 5 years buying makes tons more sense. Rental rates include the cost of the mortgage, taxes, insurance and maintenance PLUS a profit. Also rent is just *poof*gone every month from after tax income. At the end of the year I can deduct the taxes and interest and take another 5 grand+ off my taxes.

[CosmicCowboy]

Caveat. I'm talking about Texas and the Texas real estate market in good areas. Real estate is always about location, location, location.

[Winehole23]

six years after the epochal financial panic, the housing market still faces significant headwinds. hopefully recovery comes before another bust.

[CosmicCowboy]

six years after the epochal financial panic, the housing market still faces significant headwinds. hopefully recovery comes before another bust.

Tight credit requirements and the inevitable higher mortgage interest rates aren't going to help housing, homebuilders, or construction jobs.

That being said, there are thousands of apartments under construction in SA right now.

[boutons_deux]

Tight credit requirements and the inevitable higher mortgage interest rates aren't going to help housing, homebuilders, or construction jobs.

That being said, there are thousands of apartments under construction in SA right now.

100Ks of young people with an avg of about $30K college loan debt, $1T+ total debt, and shitty "entry" jobs, if employed at all, can't buy homes, can't start familie$, etc, etc.

Busting people out of good jobs, out of their homes, forcing them to be renters is cash-flow strategy of rentier capitalism, along with all the rentier capitalism vampire-squid markets sucking wealth from citizens.

[cantthinkofanything]

100Ks of young people with an avg of about $30K college loan debt, $1T+ total debt, and shitty "entry" jobs, if employed at all, can't buy homes, can't start familie$, etc, etc.

Busting people out of good jobs, out of their homes, forcing them to be renters is cash-flow strategy of rentier capitalism, along with all the rentier capitalism vampire-squid markets sucking wealth from citizens.



Thanks Obama.

[boutons_deux]

Thanks Obama.

for what? blame O'Bama for everything the Repugs fucked up.

[boutons_deux]

Every Single County in America Is Facing an Affordable Housing Crisis


A new report reveals that zero counties in the U.S. have enough housing for families in extreme poverty.



http://cdn.citylab.com/media/img/citylab/2015/06/Urban_2013/lead_large.png?GE2DGNBWGU2DONZWFYYA====Urban InstituteFrom Portland, Oregon, to Portland, Maine.

From Jacksonville to Juneau. No matter where you look, there isn’t enough affordable housing.

Without exception, there is no county in the U.S. that has enough affordable housing. The crisis is national and it is growing. Since 2000, rents across the nation have increased. So has the number of of families who desperately need affordable housing.

Without exception, there’s no county in the U.S. that has enough affordable housing.New research from the Urban Institute (http://www.urban.org/research/publication/housing-affordability-gap-extremely-low-income-renters-2013) shows that the supply of housing for extremely low-income families, which was already in short supply, is only declining. In 2013, just 28 of every 100 extremely low-income families could afford their rental homes. Than figure is down from 37 of 100 in 2000—a 25 percent decline over a little more than a decade.

http://www.citylab.com/housing/2015/06/every-single-county-in-america-is-facing-an-affordable-housing-crisis/396284/

[RD2191]

People are also just fucking morons.

I worked for almost 5 years in Bank of America's default mortgage department. I've seen the worst of the mortgage industry collapse. Some of the idiots who would ask for assistance on their loan are god damn nearly brain dead.. don't make a mortgage payment in 3 years, then start threatening to hire an attorney because you just found out you're getting foreclosed on Monday? Check.. add in my mother in law to the mortgage because of her income, but disclose to the bank that she was just to help you qualify and had no intention of splitting the cost of the mortgage as you're threatening to sue them..

Also saw some of the most extreme shit while I was there.. in home suicides stopping the sale of the home.. People threatening to burn the house down, then doing it.. etc
:lolthat sounds like a stressful job. id probably last a week and the get fired for telling someone off.

[DJR210]

:lolthat sounds like a stressful job. id probably last a week and the get fired for telling someone off.

It wasn't too bad, I dealt w/ escalated accounts, and a lot of the time these people were getting fucked over by under trained idiots who are supposed to be experts. Dealing w/ attorneys was always fun.. breathing is in violation of some penal code to those faggots :lol

[RandomGuy]

People are also just fucking morons.

I worked for almost 5 years in Bank of America's default mortgage department. I've seen the worst of the mortgage industry collapse. Some of the idiots who would ask for assistance on their loan are god damn nearly brain dead.. don't make a mortgage payment in 3 years, then start threatening to hire an attorney because you just found out you're getting foreclosed on Monday? Check.. add in my mother in law to the mortgage because of her income, but disclose to the bank that she was just to help you qualify and had no intention of splitting the cost of the mortgage as you're threatening to sue them..

Also saw some of the most extreme shit while I was there.. in home suicides stopping the sale of the home.. People threatening to burn the house down, then doing it.. etc

I can imagine.

Just closed on our house, and mortgage process was pretty thorough. Makes me glad I am an accountant, and relatively intelligent.

[CosmicCowboy]

Every Single County in America Is Facing an Affordable Housing Crisis


A new report reveals that zero counties in the U.S. have enough housing for families in extreme poverty.



http://cdn.citylab.com/media/img/citylab/2015/06/Urban_2013/lead_large.png?GE2DGNBWGU2DONZWFYYA====Urban InstituteFrom Portland, Oregon, to Portland, Maine.

From Jacksonville to Juneau. No matter where you look, there isn’t enough affordable housing.

Without exception, there is no county in the U.S. that has enough affordable housing. The crisis is national and it is growing. Since 2000, rents across the nation have increased. So has the number of of families who desperately need affordable housing.

Without exception, there’s no county in the U.S. that has enough affordable housing.New research from the Urban Institute (http://www.urban.org/research/publication/housing-affordability-gap-extremely-low-income-renters-2013) shows that the supply of housing for extremely low-income families, which was already in short supply, is only declining. In 2013, just 28 of every 100 extremely low-income families could afford their rental homes. Than figure is down from 37 of 100 in 2000—a 25 percent decline over a little more than a decade.

http://www.citylab.com/housing/2015/06/every-single-county-in-america-is-facing-an-affordable-housing-crisis/396284/




That is a function of building codes raising the cost of housing to a point the poor can't afford it. The poorest asshole in the third world has a house. Might be made of packing crates and cardboard but he has a house.

[boutons_deux]

That is a function of building codes raising the cost of housing to a point the poor can't afford it. The poorest asshole in the third world has a house. Might be made of packing crates and cardboard but he has a house.

It's more complicated than that. Building codes exist for a reason, many GOOD reasons. In the case of builiding height limitations and density codes, the citizens approved the municipal codes.

Demand for housing drives up house prices, which drive up property taxes, and house insurance.

It's still cheaper, as has been demonstrated in many cities, to house the homeless rather than leave them on the street or in your crates+cardboard "homes".

And then there is the overwhelming reason that good paying jobs on the low/medidaum end don't exist, and you Repugs block all attempts at raising the Federal minimum wage.

[DJR210]

I can imagine.

Just closed on our house, and mortgage process was pretty thorough. Makes me glad I am an accountant, and relatively intelligent.

Yeah, what I learned at B of A watching people's lives fall apart is going to help me a lot in the long run. I'm an expert in short sales worst case if I ever have to request one :tu

[RandomGuy]

That is a function of building codes raising the cost of housing to a point the poor can't afford it. The poorest asshole in the third world has a house. Might be made of packing crates and cardboard but he has a house.

In this boutons has it spot on.

The purpose of building codes is to prevent deaths, property loss and injury.
http://www.usfa.fema.gov/data/statistics/#tab-2

Thumb through the tabs.

Such codes have the end effect of making housing more expensive, but cheap housing has its own hidden costs, such as the economic loss of deaths, and pure economic loss. Even with our present codes we still have roughly $15bn per year in pure property losses the US, per FEMA stats listed above. That likely doesn't include the economic value of the lost lives, let alone what actual value we might place on a human being, if asked to define that.

There are always trade offs.

We are willing to sacrifice 35,000 people per year, men, women, children and infants, in order to have the convenience of affordable vehicles.

While I am sure there are some building codes that would easily fall into the "stupid" category, from what I have read of them (skimmed a few when looking over inspectors report) they seem to be fairly well put together.

[CosmicCowboy]

I'm not advocating doing away with building codes but the whole system is stacked against affordable housing. The 3-2-2 is the gold standard of home financing now. Deed restrictions call for minimum square footage and masonry exterior. Plus, people have gotten away from "need to have" and moved on to "want to have". hell...1n the 1960's middle class people lived in small frame houses with a small kitchen, multiple bedrooms, one bathroom, no air conditioning and MAYBE a one car garage. They might have one window unit in the bedroom they would only use on the miserably hot nights to save electricity.

[boutons_deux]

those 6 kids killed falling from a balcony in East Bay a few days ago appear to have been standing on rotted wood, probably the builder saving a few bucks and violating building codes.

[CosmicCowboy]

those 6 kids killed falling from a balcony in East Bay a few days ago appear to have been standing on rotted wood, probably the builder saving a few bucks and violating building codes.

Now you are holding builders responsibly for bad or no maintenance?

[boutons_deux]

Now you are holding builders responsibly for bad or no maintenance?

it was a rental apt, are the renters responsible for structural rot, very probably from faulty construction, code violations?

[CosmicCowboy]

it was a rental apt, are the renters responsible for structural rot, very probably from faulty construction, code violations?

Now Boo wants the builder to be responsible for perpetual maintenance? Waterproofing has to be maintained. Hell, I have a "lifetime" standing seam metal roof on my house but it still has to be re-caulked every few years to keep it from leaking.

BTW, thirteen people on a 5 X 8 balcony is a bunch. Sucks that they fell but shit happens.

[boutons_deux]

Now Boo wants the builder to be responsible for perpetual maintenance? Waterproofing has to be maintained. Hell, I have a "lifetime" standing seam metal roof on my house but it still has to be re-caulked every few years to keep it from leaking.

BTW, thirteen people on a 5 X 8 balcony is a bunch. Sucks that they fell but shit happens.

the apt building is only 8 years old, not perpetuity. The builder doesn't warrant against defects in material or workmanshi? The apt owner has no responsibility for structural maintenance, inspections?

and yes, you blame the dead victims.

[CosmicCowboy]

the apt building is only 8 years old, not perpetuity. The builder doesn't warrant against defects in material or workmanship. The apt owner has no responsibility for structural maintenance, inspections.

and yes, you blame the dead victims.

What do you mean the apartment owner isn't responsible for maintenance? I'm sure the floor joists were fine when it was built. The original builder isn't supposed to go back on every property he has ever built and make sure the owner is maintaining it properly.

Waterproofing caulk shrinks and dries out. It has to be redone frequently.

And yeah 13 people on a fucking little apartment balcony is stupid.

[boutons_deux]

Berkeley calls for new citywide inspections of balconies after deadly collapse


http://www.trbimg.com/img-5589ba8e/turbine/la-me-ln-berkeley-balcony-collapse-20150623-001/750/750x422

The vast majority of rental property owners are left to their word on whether they have performed the annual inspections required by the city.

In 26 years of renting, Townley said, a landlord has never provided him with a copy of his apartment’s annual safety certification.

He said the subject of requiring at least periodic city inspections of rental properties came up in a city meeting as recently as May, but was shot down.

“Lack of staff, time and money stopped us,” he said. “It always comes down to staffing and the political will to spend money.”

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-berkeley-balcony-collapse-20150623-story.html

So under-financed govt leaves responsibility to the private sector, and people die.

[CosmicCowboy]

Berkeley calls for new citywide inspections of balconies after deadly collapse


http://www.trbimg.com/img-5589ba8e/turbine/la-me-ln-berkeley-balcony-collapse-20150623-001/750/750x422

The vast majority of rental property owners are left to their word on whether they have performed the annual inspections required by the city.

In 26 years of renting, Townley said, a landlord has never provided him with a copy of his apartment’s annual safety certification.

He said the subject of requiring at least periodic city inspections of rental properties came up in a city meeting as recently as May, but was shot down.

“Lack of staff, time and money stopped us,” he said. “It always comes down to staffing and the political will to spend money.”

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-berkeley-balcony-collapse-20150623-story.html

So under-financed govt leaves responsibility to the private sector, and people die.




People die all the time Boo. You are gonna die. I'm gonna die. Pack 13 people on a 5 X 8 apartment balcony? Yep. People died. As stupid as you are you could have been that apartment manager that didn't realize they needed to keep the crack from the concrete to the wall caulked.

[Th'Pusher]

I'm not advocating doing away with building codes but the whole system is stacked against affordable housing. The 3-2-2 is the gold standard of home financing now. Deed restrictions call for minimum square footage and masonry exterior. Plus, people have gotten away from "need to have" and moved on to "want to have". hell...1n the 1960's middle class people lived in small frame houses with a small kitchen, multiple bedrooms, one bathroom, no air conditioning and MAYBE a one car garage. They might have one window unit in the bedroom they would only use on the miserably hot nights to save electricity.

I'm pretty sure single wides are still available. Don't be such a drama queen.

[DJR210]

Tight credit requirements and the inevitable higher mortgage interest rates aren't going to help housing, homebuilders, or construction jobs.

That being said, there are thousands of apartments under construction in SA right now.

Fuck the SA housing market, took me two years to find a house. So many cash buyers right now, shit's been crazy.

[boutons_deux]

America Sucks at Affordable Housing. The Supreme Court Might Make It Even Worse.

"They're able to get into a neighborhood that's able to offer more opportunity, so they will stretch beyond the 30 percent thresholdbecause it has payoff (http://www.urban.org/urban-wire/new-evidence-should-drive-policies-neighborhoods-and-economic-opportunity)." After SCOTUS rules on Texas Department of Housing and Community Affairs v. The Inclusive Communities Project, likely in the next week, that payoff may grow even less accessible for low-income households.

A ruling that invalidates portions of the Fair Housing Act (http://www.scotusblog.com/case-files/cases/texas-department-of-housing-and-community-affairs-v-the-inclusive-communities-project-inc/) could hurt future legal challenges to a web of bank policies, zoning laws, and planning decisions that housing advocates argue make prosperous neighborhoods less accessible and affordable.

http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2015/06/affordable-housing-gap-study-scotus-disparate-impact

Who expects that the SCOTUS5 WILL NOT gut the Fair Housing Act?

Letting the frackers in, and keeping the n!gg@s and Messcans, out! Thanks, Texas!

[boutons_deux]

More Americans Are Renting, and Paying More, as Homeownership Falls

In the past, many families like the McDowells, whose household income is almost $100,000 a year, would already be nestled in a starter home, maybe even on the cusp of upgrading to something bigger and more expensive on the profits from their first house.
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/newsgraphics/2015/06/23/rental-squeeze/7556c64fc48f90c915e4371a8f53b11dc35fb329/0624-biz-webRENTING-Artboard_1.png

But even as the market continues to improve — sales of existing homes in May increased to their highest pace in six years, the National Association of Realtors reported on Monday, and first-timers make up 32 percent of the buyers — it is leaving millions of Americans unwillingly stuck in rental housing.

The flip side of the decline in homeownership is a boom in rentals and a significant rise in the cost of renting. On average, the number of new rental households has increased by 770,000 annually since 2004, the center’s report said, making 2004-14 the strongest 10-year stretch of rental growth since the late 1980s.

Many people living in rentals were once owners; they lost their homes toforeclosure (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/subjects/f/foreclosures/index.html?inline=nyt-classifier) and now have such damaged credit reports (http://topics.nytimes.com/your-money/credit/credit-scores/index.html?inline=nyt-classifier) that they find it nearly impossible to qualify for a mortgage. Others are trapped because lenders have significantly tightened credit standards after the abuses of the boom era.

And while the federal government has created programs to encourage lenders to offer mortgages requiring only a small down payment, the efforts are so nascent that officials won’t say how many people have taken advantage of them.

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2015/06/24/business/economy/more-americans-are-renting-and-paying-more-as-homeownership-falls.html

Fuck that disastrous Fed chairman Greenspan, the Repugs huge tax cuts for the wealthy that financed private, predatory, criminal lenders, and the entire fucking Banksters financial crime syndicate.

[cantthinkofanything]

More Americans Are Renting, and Paying More, as Homeownership Falls




charts are meaningless without labels...I fixed it for you

http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j17/kgomni/bd_zpsfvwazv7b.jpg

[boutons_deux]

charts are meaningless without labels...I fixed it for you

http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j17/kgomni/bd_zpsfvwazv7b.jpg

I gave the article link, no labels, you took the bait.

[cantthinkofanything]

I gave the article link, no labels, you took the bait.

what? I fixed your charts peckerhead.

[m>s]

I'm surprised it isn't more than one in four or did everyone just declare bankruptcy already back in 2008?

[boutons_deux]

Affordable Housing Crisis Grows Across the Country as Apartment Rents Skyrocket

According to a new study (http://www.jchs.harvard.edu/sites/jchs.harvard.edu/files/jchs-sonhr-2015-full.pdf) by Harvard University’s Joint Center for Housing Studies, vast stretches of the county are facing a rental housing crisis marked by big rent spikes.

“The number of cost-burdened renters [paying more than 30 percent of incomes]… set a new high in 2013 of 20.8 million, totaling just under half of all renter households,”

Harvard researchers found. “Although the number of severely burdened renters edged down slightly, the number of moderately burdened renters climbed by a larger amount.”

Most low to moderate income households are feeling a very big pinch.

The researchers said that 80 percent of households with annual incomes under $15,000, three-quarters of renters with incomes up between $15,000 and $29,999, and 45 percent of households earning up to $44,999, are all “severely burdened,” with non-whites and single mothers facing the greatest financial stress.

“Minorities and certain types of households are especially likely to have severe housing cost burdens,” the report said. “Indeed, 26 percent of black households, 23 percent of Hispanic households, and 20 percent of Asian and other minority households were severely burdened in 2013, compared with just 14 percent of white households. Nearly a third of single-parent families also had severe burdens, compared with a tenth of married couples with children. Finally, more than half of households headed by an unemployed individual in 2013 were severely housing cost burdened.”

Cities where these pressures are prevalent include Los Angeles, New York, Honolulu, Miami, Las Vegas and Orlando, they said. “Moreover, affordability pressures in the 10 most expensive markets reach further up the income scale. In fact, nearly half (48 percent) of households with incomes of $45,000–74,999 were housing cost burdened in these metros—more than twice the share (22 percent) nationally. As a result, the nearly 20 million households living in the 10 highest-cost metros must earn well above the national median income of $51,900 to live in housing they can afford.”

The causes for these spikes in rent come from a mix of private and public sector trends. On the private sector side, the housing market crash has led to a slowdown in building or improving rental housing stock in many regions, which has boosted rents when housing becomes available.

Meanwhile, government affordable housing subsidies available for renters have effectively shrunk, because they have failed to keep up with increases.

http://www.alternet.org/economy/affordable-housing-crisis-grows-across-country-apartment-rents-skyrocket?akid=13257.187590.ilvTfu&rd=1&src=newsletter1038647&t=1

[cantthinkofanything]

Affordable Housing Crisis Grows Across the Country as Apartment Rents Skyrocket

According to a new study (http://www.jchs.harvard.edu/sites/jchs.harvard.edu/files/jchs-sonhr-2015-full.pdf) by Harvard University’s Joint Center for Housing Studies, vast stretches of the county are facing a rental housing crisis marked by big rent spikes.

“The number of cost-burdened renters [paying more than 30 percent of incomes]… set a new high in 2013 of 20.8 million, totaling just under half of all renter households,”

Harvard researchers found. “Although the number of severely burdened renters edged down slightly, the number of moderately burdened renters climbed by a larger amount.”

Most low to moderate income households are feeling a very big pinch.

The researchers said that 80 percent of households with annual incomes under $15,000, three-quarters of renters with incomes up between $15,000 and $29,999, and 45 percent of households earning up to $44,999, are all “severely burdened,” with non-whites and single mothers facing the greatest financial stress.

“Minorities and certain types of households are especially likely to have severe housing cost burdens,” the report said. “Indeed, 26 percent of black households, 23 percent of Hispanic households, and 20 percent of Asian and other minority households were severely burdened in 2013, compared with just 14 percent of white households. Nearly a third of single-parent families also had severe burdens, compared with a tenth of married couples with children. Finally, more than half of households headed by an unemployed individual in 2013 were severely housing cost burdened.”

Cities where these pressures are prevalent include Los Angeles, New York, Honolulu, Miami, Las Vegas and Orlando, they said. “Moreover, affordability pressures in the 10 most expensive markets reach further up the income scale. In fact, nearly half (48 percent) of households with incomes of $45,000–74,999 were housing cost burdened in these metros—more than twice the share (22 percent) nationally. As a result, the nearly 20 million households living in the 10 highest-cost metros must earn well above the national median income of $51,900 to live in housing they can afford.”

The causes for these spikes in rent come from a mix of private and public sector trends. On the private sector side, the housing market crash has led to a slowdown in building or improving rental housing stock in many regions, which has boosted rents when housing becomes available.

Meanwhile, government affordable housing subsidies available for renters have effectively shrunk, because they have failed to keep up with increases.

http://www.alternet.org/economy/affordable-housing-crisis-grows-across-country-apartment-rents-skyrocket?akid=13257.187590.ilvTfu&rd=1&src=newsletter1038647&t=1




http://38.media.tumblr.com/ae6ffd132fb0cbd2e17073bcba96e58f/tumblr_inline_mi8btlwrMx1qz4rgp.gif