Harris and Kidd

[Basketballgirl25]

So for the Nets, I have to say Harris and Kidd are the same player, both are needed to do good for the team to win.

So for Mav fans here, how would you compare them playing on the Mavs teams?

[pauls931]

I think they'd both do well, but Dallas will pay for it going forward unless their kidd replacement is better than Harris.

[Basketballgirl25]

I think they'd both do well, but Dallas will pay for it going forward unless their kidd replacement is better than Harris.

yeah I don't really follow dallas so I wasn't sure if they both helpped dallas in different ways, because on the Nets team they play different, but when Kidd was here we needed him to win and now we need Harris to play good to win, so they are pretty much on the same page as needing them to do good to win

[CGD]

Good player's become great players on crappy teams so your point about their importance to the Nets in well taken.

As for Dallas, I think they play (played) different roles. In Dallas, Harris was arguable only the 4th best player behind Dirk, Terry, and Howard. He really got his shot as a Tony Parker 2.0/Stopper. IMO it wasn't until NJ that he evolved into a star-caliber player as a result of his expanded leadership role.

[pauls931]

Good player's become great players on crappy teams so your point about their importance to the Nets in well taken.

As for Dallas, I think they play (played) different roles. In Dallas, Harris was arguable only the 4th best player behind Dirk, Terry, and Howard. He really got his shot as a Tony Parker 2.0/Stopper. IMO it wasn't until NJ that he evolved into a star-caliber player as a result of his expanded leadership role.

Makes you wonder if Dallas is going to get 'Joe Johnsoned' like the suns. Everyone knew Joe was good, but he didn't really take off until going to Atlanta. However I guess Harris didn't have to play second fiddle in Dallas unless you consider him behind Terry.

[mavsluva]

Great players spend more time on the court then they do on the disabled list.

[Muser]

Kidd is better than Harris on both teams.

[monosylab1k]

Harris brought better man to man defense and drives to the bucket. That's about it.

Kidd brings better team defense, basketball IQ, passing, 3 point shooting, maturity, and leadership.

And the Mavs personnel have already drafted a PG who will be better than Devin Harris in every way imaginable.

[stretch]

Harris brought better man to man defense and drives to the bucket. That's about it.

Kidd brings better team defense, basketball IQ, passing, 3 point shooting, maturity, and leadership.

And the Mavs personnel have already drafted a PG who will be better than Devin Harris in every way imaginable.

this

especially about roddy

that kid is going to be something special, and already has shown he is more gifted than harris in pretty much every aspect of basketball. hopefully he keeps working hard to develop it, but he is just as quick, just as good of a finisher, but is MUCH smoother, has better control over his body, is a better jumpshooter, has more controlled ball-handling, better passing/court vision, more athletic, and most of all he has far superior basketball IQ than Harris did at this point of his career.

roddy's IQ is what impresses me the most, for such a young kid. i really like the way Carlisle is trying to bring him in, by still limiting his minutes even though he is playing well, to keep him hungry and working hard for more.

[Basketballgirl25]

Makes you wonder if Dallas is going to get 'Joe Johnsoned' like the suns. Everyone knew Joe was good, but he didn't really take off until going to Atlanta. However I guess Harris didn't have to play second fiddle in Dallas unless you consider him behind Terry.

I'd say Harris kind of played second fiddle in Dallas, Dirk is Mavs main guy. Mavs will get Joe Johnsoned:toast

[stretch]

except joe johnson didnt lead his hawks to an 0-16 start ever

lol harris

[Basketballgirl25]

except joe johnson didnt lead his hawks to an 0-16 start ever

lol harris

has joe johnsom had 4 starters on his team injured with him and 3 others out, and only one starter playing? Tell me how he would do if that happened

[Basketballgirl25]

Here's a article about the Harris and Kidd Trade
http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=14484&utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

I have the agree with Harris. That you see two good players that were traded, and like he said no team has gone to a championship and anything like that so really people can't tell who got the better deal.

Both great players for teams right now, one isn't better then the other looking at the situations they are in:toast

[Muser]

Devin is overrated as fuck by some people.

[mavsfan1000]

Harris is the better player. Kidd is just on a really good team. Luckily Kidd has enough scoring options that he doesn't have to score to be effective. Also Beaubois can cover up for Kidd's lack of speed against the fast scoring point guards in the league. Unless Carlisle does something stupid and take Beaubois out of the lineup.

[duhoh]

Harris brought better man to man defense and drives to the bucket. That's about it.

Kidd brings better team defense, basketball IQ, passing, 3 point shooting, maturity, and leadership.

And the Mavs personnel have already drafted a PG who will be better than Devin Harris in every way imaginable.

:tu

[Findog]

Kidd is better than Harris on both teams.

Yes, and we can lock the thread now.

[Findog]

Harris is the better player. Kidd is just on a really good team. Luckily Kidd has enough scoring options that he doesn't have to score to be effective. Also Beaubois can cover up for Kidd's lack of speed against the fast scoring point guards in the league. Unless Carlisle does something stupid and take Beaubois out of the lineup.

:lol This guy does a great bit.

[Findog]

Devin is overrated as fuck by some people.

Yes. He's a little bit better than Mo Williams. That's about it. Well, I dunno, I'd rather have Mo Williams because he'll play 70+ games a year.

[mavsfan1000]

:lol This guy does a great bit.
This team was very weak the last 2 years. It's not until Marion, Humphries, Gooden, Beaubois, Tim Thomas, Ross, and Dirk being fresh were brought in that Kidd's weaknesses weren't exposed. Harris with these type of players around him would be scary. So much talent on this team now. Luckily the Lakers weakest spot is point guard as well as the Celtics. The Nuggets will probably be tough for us again.

[Findog]

This team was very weak the last 2 years. It's not until Marion, Humphries, Gooden, Beaubois, Tim Thomas, Ross, and Dirk being fresh were brought in that Kidd's weaknesses weren't exposed. Harris with these type of players around him would be scary. So much talent on this team now. Luckily the Lakers weakest spot is point guard as well as the Celtics. The Nuggets will probably be tough for us again.

Harris sucks and can't stay healthy. The only thing I would regret if I were Mark Cuban is tossing in the two #1 draft picks. By the way, he shot 6-22 last night and couldn't lead his team past the Queens.

[mavsfan1000]

Harris sucks and can't stay healthy. The only thing I would regret if I were Mark Cuban is tossing in the two #1 draft picks. By the way, he shot 6-22 last night and couldn't lead his team past the Queens.
He just came back from injury and he has a horrible team around him. What can he do? Other teams are thinking how do they stop Harris. He is not suited to be the man. Especially on a team that can't win without him and it looks like can't win with him either. Howard for Harris would be a great trade for us imo.

[Findog]

He just came back from injury

Where have we heard that before?


What can he do? Other teams are thinking how do they stop Harris. He is not suited to be the man.

He's a homeless man's Allen Iverson. (Iverson in his prime that is) It's pretty easy to let one guy get his than it is to stop a team that actually runs an offense. Harris is not a PG, he's basically the same kind of player as Leandro Barbosa but better. He'd demolish Kidd in a game on 1-on-1, but Kidd's skillset is much more valuable in an NBA setting.

[Ghazi]

I still think Kidd is better than Harris... even at his advanced age... as far as overall impact on a basketball game I think Kidd's is greater than Harris... Harris's impact does not correlate with his gaudy stats... but I think Kidd's stats do not do justice to his "impact".

Also you HAVE to factor durability... Kidd's only missed 1 game as a Maverick I believe.

[mavsfan1000]

I still think Kidd is better than Harris... even at his advanced age... as far as overall impact on a basketball game I think Kidd's is greater than Harris... Harris's impact does not correlate with his gaudy stats... but I think Kidd's stats do not do justice to his "impact".

Also you HAVE to factor durability... Kidd's only missed 1 game as a Maverick I believe.
It was already proven that team dropped off big time after the trade. This team needed another big player to take place of losing a scorer in Harris. That's where Marion made the difference. Marion is the perfect player to suit Kidd's style just like what he did for Nash. I'm a big Marion fan btw. He has done a lot for this team but the bench has been better than it ever has. We always had one or two players off the bench that hurt us more than helped in the past. Barea is not nearly as bad as Stackhouse or Van Horn were in that category.

[Ghazi]

Nothing was proven after the big time dropoff after the trade. That was just due to Avery, J-Ho playing like shit, and terrible luck in close games along with Dirk missing 5 games... it just so happened all of it happened after the Kidd trade, so kidd was blamed..

[HarlemHeat37]

Harris became very overrated last year, especially at the expense of Kidd, which is something I've been saying since the trade..he's one of the bigger ballhogs in the NBA, and he's horrible in clutch time..he's also completely lost his defensive ability since joining New Jersey, constantly gambling instead of even attempting to play team defense..

[mavsfan1000]

Nothing was proven after the big time dropoff after the trade. That was just due to Avery, J-Ho playing like shit, and terrible luck in close games along with Dirk missing 5 games... it just so happened all of it happened after the Kidd trade, so kidd was blamed..
It happened the next year as well. A year and a half dropoff until we got some better players to play around Kidd. Kidd and Howard didn't play well together as Howard seemed to get worse with extra pressure of having to score more. Harris is good as the third or 4th scorer on the team. Much less pressure on him and he can play his natural game. The nets have a horrible team and anyone would be discouraged if they had to play there. I feel bad for Harris and how stupid Cuban was to deal him.

[Muser]

I feel sorry for Brook Lopez, he's a damn beast but is playing with that bullshit team.

[jag]

Short-term: Jason Kidd
Long-term: Devin Harris


Roddy pretty much ends this argument though...his potential and athleticism makes this debate an old one.

[mavsfan1000]

Kidd is so fucking slow tonight. I hate when he plays like this. Stationary defense.

[Basketballgirl25]

I feel sorry for Brook Lopez, he's a damn beast but is playing with that bullshit team.

don't feel bad for him, we are going to be better next year, so don't worry about him, he will be happy. Worry for Kidd he is getting older and doesn't have as long to playe Brook is 21, and only in his second year he has longer then Kidd:toast

[Basketballgirl25]

Anyway the Mavs have far better a win/loss% than any of most other teams in NBA, not to mention the Nets who still have yet to break their virginity of win this season.

they are waiting to break their virginity while playing mavs, prefect way to do it, embrace Kidd:toast

[Basketballgirl25]

Harris became very overrated last year

So you are saying he pretty much became overrated like Kidd, I agree. I like me some Brook and CDR more, Devin is good, just like Brook and CDR better:toast

[HarlemHeat37]

So you are saying he pretty much became overrated like Kidd, I agree. I like me some Brook and CDR more, Devin is good, just like Brook and CDR better:toast

I agree that Kidd became overrated at the end of his Nets run too..

I love Lopez and CDR, I was high on CDR even before he was getting minutes..his talent was obvious in limited time before this season..