The decade according to 9yr olds

[mrsmaalox]

http://vimeo.com/7989835

[Dr. Gonzo]

Those kids are stupid.

[desflood]

No, they aren't. They're nine. And they're putting out exactly what's been put into their brains.

[Dr. Gonzo]

They don't even know what a dial-up modem is.

[desflood]

That just means that they're not old, like we are.

[mrsmaalox]

They don't even know what a dial-up modem is.

Yes but they know Britney Spears shaved her head! Pretty sad....

[Dr. Gonzo]

I'm not old. I'm young and spry.

[DarkReign]

It should read..

The Decade According to Minority 9 year olds

It would seem this country has a real dearth of white kids these days. That or every video, advertisement and public video-display of people completely overcompensates their political correctness meter.

Judging by that video, I'd venture a guess the United States is thus composed:

58.3% Latino
08.3% Black
16.6% Asian
16.6% Caucasian

Judging where I live, I'd say this is a very accurate representation of 9 year olds influences and opinions.

[DarkReign]

Then again, maybe this video is not so much representative of current population as it is indicative of the current population's reproduction ratios.

But I would think Black people would be better represented in this area, cousin.

[DarkReign]

BTW, the global warming part...

Fucking hysterical. Good to know the children of this country are being properly indoctrinated.

Yeah kid, people are losing their jobs because there isnt enough resource [sic] for everyone.

Is this really what theyre being told?

[DarkReign]

Who is the biggest celebrity of your lifetime?

George Lopez

What is your biggest fear?

Bloody Mary and the devil. (Devil mentioned 3x all by Catholic Latinos, Im guessing)

See post #8 for explanation of these answers.

[desflood]

BTW, the global warming part...

Fucking hysterical. Good to know the children of this country are being properly indoctrinated.

Yeah kid, people are losing their jobs because there isnt enough resource [sic] for everyone.

Is this really what theyre being told?
Yes, it is, even in private schools. My kid (7 years old) came home from school crying one day because "nobody cares about the polar bears". I kid you not. I just told him that maybe the polar bears were meant to go extinct, like pandas (sorry, Pandaspur) or any bird stupid enough to nest on the ground.

[DarkReign]

Yes, it is, even in private schools. My kid (7 years old) came home from school crying one day because "nobody cares about the polar bears". I kid you not. I just told him that maybe the polar bears were meant to go extinct, like pandas (sorry, Pandaspur) or any bird stupid enough to nest on the ground.

Good for you, seriously. Dont let these corporate sponsored, agenda-driven federal morons fuck your kid up too much.

[Dr. Gonzo]

Good for you, seriously. Dont let these corporate sponsored, agenda-driven federal morons fuck your kid up too much.

Yeah. Kids are supposed to get fucked up by their parents not corporate assholes.

[Dex]

One day I'm going to tell my kids how I had to dial-up to the internet both ways in the snow. And we didn't get no goddamn DNS entries or Bookmarks, we had to remember IP addresses!

Seriously though, I don't miss the days of my 2400 baud modem.

[mrsmaalox]

BTW, the global warming part...

Fucking hysterical. Good to know the children of this country are being properly indoctrinated.

Yeah kid, people are losing their jobs because there isnt enough resource [sic] for everyone.

Is this really what theyre being told?

No that is not what they are being told. They're 9 yrs old, that's how they understand things. Bill Cosby and other comedians have been spotlighting children's misinterpretations for years.

[DarkReign]

No that is not what they are being told. They're 9 yrs old, that's how they understand things. Bill Cosby and other comedians have been spotlighting children's misinterpretations for years.


Yes, it is, even in private schools. My kid (7 years old) came home from school crying one day because "nobody cares about the polar bears". I kid you not. I just told him that maybe the polar bears were meant to go extinct, like pandas (sorry, Pandaspur) or any bird stupid enough to nest on the ground.

'nuff said. But then again, you may be right. No offense, but my faith in the public reeducation system in this country is null. School is more youth internment camp than center of learning. School teaches children how to be good little worker bees, how to sit, when to stand, know your place, raise your hand, dont buck the system, nothing outside the box, etc.

Its boot camp for corporate working environments. Worst part is its working as evidenced by America's standing amongst 3rd world, undeveloped shithole countries. Lazy-asses like to blame television, video games or the media. When in reality, things are the way they are because of lazy, uneducated, unengaged, wholly unhappy, highly medicated and unsatisfied adults reproducing serially worse children than themselves.

Groupthink and doublespeak are alive and well, Mr Orwell.

[DarkReign]

Yeah. Kids are supposed to get fucked up by their parents not corporate assholes.

At least the parents arent trying to sell them anything with the limited income they'll soon have because learning and education were wasted on more important issues like global warming, discipline and workplace boot camp.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

Yeah. Kids are supposed to get fucked up by their parents not corporate assholes.

Uh well actually that's what supposed to happen. That is if their parents aren't pedophile pychopath deadbeat killers.

[EmptyMan]

:depressed That makes me feel old.


Bigfoot scared me much as a child as well :(

[desflood]

'nuff said. But then again, you may be right. No offense, but my faith in the public reeducation system in this country is null. School is more youth internment camp than center of learning. School teaches children how to be good little worker bees, how to sit, when to stand, know your place, raise your hand, dont buck the system, nothing outside the box, etc.

Its boot camp for corporate working environments. Worst part is its working as evidenced by America's standing amongst 3rd world, undeveloped shithole countries. Lazy-asses like to blame television, video games or the media. When in reality, things are the way they are because of lazy, uneducated, unengaged, wholly unhappy, highly medicated and unsatisfied adults reproducing serially worse children than themselves.

Groupthink and doublespeak are alive and well, Mr Orwell.
You and John Gatto - peas in a pod. Problem is that you're both right.

[CuckingFunt]

That is if their parents aren't pedophile pychopath deadbeat killers.

Killers who are deadbeats? Or killers of deadbeats?

[Viva Las Espuelas]

Killers who are deadbeats? Or killers of deadbeats?

Forgot to use commas

[Dre_7]

Bloody Mary and the devil.

:lol I love when the kid at the end said "but my mom told me Bloody Mary is just a drink."

[mrsmaalox]

Yeah. Kids are supposed to get fucked up by their parents not corporate assholes.

Exactly!:lol

I know that all kids are different and parents are different and that our educational system is lacking in individualization. That is why I don't leave my children's education up to the school only. I'm the most important factor in their education, not the school. So we talk about what they hear in school and I tell them what some people believe (and why they believe it) and then what I believe and why. I have absolutely no doubt that Desflood's kid came home and said the polar bear thing; one of my kids did too. But my other kid came home and asked what kind of gun he could use to kill a polar bear, and my other kid "didn't hear the question". It wasn't an issue to me of them being indoctrinated/fed false information, it was an issue of me picking up where the school left off.

And I just don't believe my children can be indoctrinated. God knows I have been trying for years! :lol

[MiamiHeat]

who gives a shit, they are 9 years old

they don't even know how to properly wipe their ass.

[z0sa]

who gives a shit, they are 9 years old

they don't even know how to properly wipe their ass.

You couldn't properly wipe your ass when you were nine?

[DarkReign]

You couldn't properly wipe your ass when you were nine?

:lmao

That...is an excellent observation/question.

Do tell, MH.

[MiamiHeat]

dp

[MiamiHeat]

You couldn't properly wipe your ass when you were nine?

i had shit stains everywhere i went. i used to take off my underwear and throw it at teachers when they gave me homework.

Slick Willy Shit Stain they used to call me, I could get a shit stained underwear unnoticed in places you would never imagine

[PM5K]

Don't get the video, was it supposed to be funny, interesting, entertaining, enlightening?

For me it wasn't any of those, so what purpose does it serve?

[Cyrano]

Hell, when I was nine, after riding the brontosaurus to school, we were taught that you could survive a nuclear attack by hiding under your desk.
You could go trick-or-treating without any worries.
We never locked our doors.
My cub scout den took a tour of the Reynolds tobacco company, and they gave
each of us a CARTON OF CIGARETTES to take home to mom and dad.
Duncan yo-yo's were the most popular toys, closely followed by toy guns...cap pistols, tommy guns, and of course, bb guns.
NOBODY had color TV.....most of us had a 12-inch black-and-white set.
Saturday mornings were for Bugs Bunny, Popeye, Jonny Quest, and Roy Rogers,
followed by Mark Wilson and the Magic Land of Alakazam.
Going to a movie included two cartoons and a short subject film, and they played the National Anthem before the show started.
We all had to say the Pledge of Alliegance before the first class of the day in school.

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

BTW, the global warming part...

Fucking hysterical. Good to know the children of this country are being properly indoctrinated.

Yeah kid, people are losing their jobs because there isnt enough resource [sic] for everyone.

Is this really what theyre being told?

Yeah, because it's all a big global conspiracy and has nothing to do with the 3,600,000,000,000t of carbon humans have artificially primed the carbon cycle with, nothing at all... :rolleyes


Yes, it is, even in private schools. My kid (7 years old) came home from school crying one day because "nobody cares about the polar bears". I kid you not. I just told him that maybe the polar bears were meant to go extinct, like pandas (sorry, Pandaspur) or any bird stupid enough to nest on the ground.

What an advanced knowledge of ecology you have!

Did you ever consider that the panda is severely endangered because humans have left it no natural habitat? Humans are currently causing a mass species extinction event on the scale of the dinosaur disappearance 65mil years ago. Well done for filling your child's mind with your own ignorance.

[Death In June]

No, they aren't. They're nine. And they're putting out exactly what's been put into their brains.Nine year old kids are stupid.

[mojorizen7]

Where the fuck are the white kids?

[desflood]

What an advanced knowledge of ecology you have!

Did you ever consider that the panda is severely endangered because humans have left it no natural habitat? Humans are currently causing a mass species extinction event on the scale of the dinosaur disappearance 65mil years ago. Well done for filling your child's mind with your own ignorance.
I understand that completely. Did humans cause the disappearance of the dinosaurs? You do realize, of course, that it is the natural order for species that cannot adapt to their current enviroment to go extinct? Someday humans will go extinct due to their infinite stupidity, and that will not be a bad thing (that "stupid" bit is aimed at humanity in general, not you specifically).

Just to ease your mind a bit, rest assured that I do teach my children that it's important to care about the enviroment. We recycle, pick up trash when we see it on the ground in a public place, we sometimes walk when we could drive. I even used cloth diapers when the kids were little. Save your simple lecture for somebody who needs it.

[DarkReign]

Yeah, because it's all a big global conspiracy and has nothing to do with the 3,600,000,000,000t of carbon humans have artificially primed the carbon cycle with, nothing at all... :rolleyes

Look, I know youve hitched your career wagon to climate change, and thats fine.

But dont lecture me about it. In case you couldnt tell, there is no consensus in the scientific community about the validity or invalidity of human-related climate change.

I know, I know...here comes the part where you site every scientist in the fucking world who ascribes to only your way of thinking. Because, obviously, you having a career in the field certainly has no bearing on your judgement.

Its like...exterminators telling the world that a global horde of crop-killing locusts are going to overrun the planet unless we pool all our resource and money together to stop them. Yeah...consider the source and follow the money...mainly, the dollars flowing into your pockets, Ruff.

[ashbeeigh]

When I was 9....in 1995... I was all about the 4 "R" reducing, reusing, recycling, oh and recovery.I would throw everything in the recyling bin. It would drive my parents nuts. I still do it. Am I thinking that I'll save the world from global warming though? Probably not.

But, I really think ignorance is bliss when you're 9. My goodness. even at 25 ignorance is bliss sometimes. No need to tell my 9 year old cousin that the panda bear that he is all about and wants to go see in Australia one day may not be there one day because he is ruing the planet because his dad isn't driving a prius which will in turn create a massive meltdown.

I thought the video was adorable. But, I have the same question..where were all the white kids?

[Leetonidas]

Don't worry guys, the kids will smoke weed here in about 4-5 years, maybe sooner, and they'll realize what a bunch of horse shit America is. :lmao

[DarkReign]

I thought the video was adorable. But, I have the same question..where were all the white kids?

Having white kids on camera isnt very politically correct apparently.

I realize the irony of my statements in this thread, it comes off as semi-complaining about being PC when thats exactly how PCness got started in the first place and continues to thrive.

[ALVAREZ6]

why do all of these kids talk like retards? my sister is 9 and sounds 5 years older than these kids..

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

I understand that completely. Did humans cause the disappearance of the dinosaurs? You do realize, of course, that it is the natural order for species that cannot adapt to their current enviroment to go extinct? Someday humans will go extinct due to their infinite stupidity, and that will not be a bad thing (that "stupid" bit is aimed at humanity in general, not you specifically).

Yes it is the natural order for species to go extinct over geological timeframes, the difference here is that humanity is causing the environment to change so rapidly that a lot of species don't have a hope. We have vastly increased the rate of environmental change on the planet. In the case of animals like pandas, we have simply destroyed any livable habitat for them. That is not "natural", that is a human-created situation.

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

Look, I know youve hitched your career wagon to climate change, and thats fine.

But dont lecture me about it. In case you couldnt tell, there is no consensus in the scientific community about the validity or invalidity of human-related climate change.

I know, I know...here comes the part where you site every scientist in the fucking world who ascribes to only your way of thinking. Because, obviously, you having a career in the field certainly has no bearing on your judgement.

Its like...exterminators telling the world that a global horde of crop-killing locusts are going to overrun the planet unless we pool all our resource and money together to stop them. Yeah...consider the source and follow the money...mainly, the dollars flowing into your pockets, Ruff.

You don't know a damn thing about me, so don't pretend you do.

I have not "hitched my wagon to climate change" as you say - I'm concerned about a far broader topic than that called sustainability. The most immediate threat to humanity is actually peakoil, which will start to bite some time in the next two decades and when it does will threaten world food supply (for example, growing 1ha of corn consumes 40L petrol and 75L of diesel) and ruin the global economy. A largely untalked about factor in the GFC is the price of oil going to just under $200 a barrel, at which point it was consuming about 1/4 of global GDP just to buy the oil. That is the first thing we need to address.

And after that we need to address the insane idea that a linear material throughput system of disposability can ever be sustainable on a finite planet with a growing population. We need to look at valuing water, soil, forests, fisheries, etc. properly and managing them within long-term sustainable limits. We need to reduce the level of toxic pollution we put into the air, land and water. We need to switch our energy consumption to renewable sources. Coincidentally, getting many of these things right will also help to reduce humanity's load on the carbon cycle.

As for climate change, there is concensus in the scientific community, and beyond that thereis consensus amongst those actually witnessing the effects. I challenge you to go to the climatology department at your local university and debate them on the science of climate change. You will discover just how wrong you are.

As for accusing me of championing a cause for monetary gain, GO FUCK YOURSELF. I actually believe in something, a sustainable future. As a result of this, I downshifted 4 years ago. I have drastically cut my environmental footprint to about 1/4 of the Australian average. I earned 24K last year and spent 13K. Yes, my annual income last year was $24,000. The year before it was $12,000. I have few worries and live a peaceful life. Fuck you, your assumptions about me, your ignorance of reality, and your money is everything paradigm, because I don't give a shit about money. I give a shit about the world transitioning to a sustainable civilisation before the whole thing comes crashing down due to the weight of our own greed and hubris.

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

When I was 9....in 1995... I was all about the 4 "R" reducing, reusing, recycling, oh and recovery.I would throw everything in the recyling bin. It would drive my parents nuts. I still do it. Am I thinking that I'll save the world from global warming though? Probably not.

But, I really think ignorance is bliss when you're 9. My goodness. even at 25 ignorance is bliss sometimes. No need to tell my 9 year old cousin that the panda bear that he is all about and wants to go see in Australia one day may not be there one day because he is ruing the planet because his dad isn't driving a prius which will in turn create a massive meltdown.

I thought the video was adorable. But, I have the same question..where were all the white kids?

Recycling is about a move towards closed loop manufacturing, reducing the input of new materials and energy into our manufacturing system, something that must happen in order to create a sustainable system. That does help to reduce energy consumption, and in turn carbon emissions, but it's a lot bigger issue than that.

BTW, what have pandas got to do with Australia?

[DarkReign]

You don't know a damn thing about me, so don't pretend you do.

I have not "hitched my wagon to climate change" as you say - I'm concerned about a far broader topic than that called sustainability. The most immediate threat to humanity is actually peakoil, which will start to bite some time in the next two decades and when it does will threaten world food supply (for example, growing 1ha of corn consumes 40L petrol and 75L of diesel) and ruin the global economy. A largely untalked about factor in the GFC is the price of oil going to just under $200 a barrel, at which point it was consuming about 1/4 of global GDP just to buy the oil. That is the first thing we need to address.

And after that we need to address the insane idea that a linear material throughput system of disposability can ever be sustainable on a finite planet with a growing population. We need to look at valuing water, soil, forests, fisheries, etc. properly and managing them within long-term sustainable limits. We need to reduce the level of toxic pollution we put into the air, land and water. We need to switch our energy consumption to renewable sources. Coincidentally, getting many of these things right will also help to reduce humanity's load on the carbon cycle.

As for climate change, there is concensus in the scientific community, and beyond that thereis consensus amongst those actually witnessing the effects. I challenge you to go to the climatology department at your local university and debate them on the science of climate change. You will discover just how wrong you are.

Oh, just ask the local "climatology department" about the importance of their employment?

You know, I dont much give a shit about this sort of thing considering that the world is about as fucked up as it can get right now without the added pressure of semi-transparent science pervading every Western political scene like a fucking albatross around every economy's neck.

You want to better control the price of oil/natural resource, fine, lets hear how your superior logic and reason is going to convince the other 4 billion people of the world that affordable, ready made and easily obtained fossil fuel is not an open commodity available to them without added, theorized cost. That their native reserves are somehow better served in the hands of foreign scientists who are, by way of science and knowing whats better for you, ultimately just denying your country the ability to industrialize like their country did.

That the world over must suddenly convert an entire global economic structure on the basis that the world supply of resource is now under the purview of a global scientific, un-unanimous theory.

Right. You know, I'd understand your position more if you just openly admitted that its a total pipe dream and that for any real difference to be made on behalf of your beliefs, force must be applied by the world powers that be upon the hapless and undeveloped.

That the virtues of enlightened society (us) far exceed the necessities of the great unwashed (them).

How very absurd and predictable.

You know, in my line of work, I deal with Quality Control people under my employment and with my customers on a daily basis. By far, they are the single most useless aspect of any business. Not because their immediate need isnt apparent and important, but that they are constantly trying to expand their influence into areas that does not include them.

What starts as a person who is tasked with checking individual parts for tolerance and conformance, ends up being a rule sheet for the issuing of purchase orders and staff management limitations based on documented training records.

Basically, they overcompensate.


As for accusing me of championing a cause for monetary gain, GO FUCK YOURSELF. I actually believe in something, a sustainable future. As a result of this, I downshifted 4 years ago. I have drastically cut my environmental footprint to about 1/4 of the Australian average. I earned 24K last year and spent 13K. Yes, my annual income last year was $24,000. The year before it was $12,000. I have few worries and live a peaceful life. Fuck you, your assumptions about me, your ignorance of reality, and your money is everything paradigm, because I don't give a shit about money. I give a shit about the world transitioning to a sustainable civilisation before the whole thing comes crashing down due to the weight of our own greed and hubris.

Hit a nerve?

Maybe there will come an Elightenment for me and my ilk, maybe not. I admire your conviction, but that dedication doesnt make your argument anymore or less convincing. I hope most arent so easily swayed.

[jdev82]

god this is why i hate kids

[sabar]

Yes it is the natural order for species to go extinct over geological timeframes, the difference here is that humanity is causing the environment to change so rapidly that a lot of species don't have a hope. We have vastly increased the rate of environmental change on the planet. In the case of animals like pandas, we have simply destroyed any livable habitat for them. That is not "natural", that is a human-created situation.

Species have to adapt to short-term change too, or there would be nothing alive on this planet. Natural disaster, global catastrophe, and disease are all things that take place on a tiny timescale that species had to adapt to.

It is tragic, but it is what it is. Humanity cannot grow while protecting everything that they need. If we don't get wiped out ourselves, we will eventually pave over every square inch of terrain on this planet and wipe out 99% of all species. There are too many species that cannot reproduce in captivity and we will need the land. This is part of the evolution of a planet that sustains intelligent life. A path towards a singularity.

The ones that are well adapted will thrive (dogs, cats, rats, birds, roaches, disease) and the rest will die. This planet doesn't have room for large animals that have 1-2 square miles of territory for each of their males. The poor nations which these animals live in don't care about protecting the environment. The entire western world got to ravage its natural resources to become wealthy, and now we tell those poor nations that they are not allowed to do the same.

I'm all for sustainability, but nothing will change until push comes to shove.

[Cyrano]

_aFhj0x7aZ4

[ashbeeigh]

Recycling is about a move towards closed loop manufacturing, reducing the input of new materials and energy into our manufacturing system, something that must happen in order to create a sustainable system. That does help to reduce energy consumption, and in turn carbon emissions, but it's a lot bigger issue than that.

BTW, what have pandas got to do with Australia?

Oh course it is. And I understand that, now, at 25. But at 9 you don't need to know more than that. As I said in my previous post, ignorance is bliss at 9.

And you can replace any other animal with panda. Dingo? Koala? Squirrel?

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

Oh, just ask the local "climatology department" about the importance of their employment? (1)

You know, I dont much give a shit about this sort of thing considering that the world is about as fucked up as it can get right now without the added pressure of semi-transparent science pervading every Western political scene like a fucking albatross around every economy's neck. (2)

You want to better control the price of oil/natural resource, fine, lets hear how your superior logic and reason is going to convince the other 4 billion people of the world that affordable, ready made and easily obtained fossil fuel is not an open commodity available to them without added, theorized cost. That their native reserves are somehow better served in the hands of foreign scientists who are, by way of science and knowing whats better for you, ultimately just denying your country the ability to industrialize like their country did. (3)

That the world over must suddenly convert an entire global economic structure on the basis that the world supply of resource is now under the purview of a global scientific, un-unanimous theory. (4)

Right. You know, I'd understand your position more if you just openly admitted that its a total pipe dream and that for any real difference to be made on behalf of your beliefs, force must be applied by the world powers that be upon the hapless and undeveloped. (5)

That the virtues of enlightened society (us) far exceed the necessities of the great unwashed (them).

How very absurd and predictable.

You know, in my line of work, I deal with Quality Control people under my employment and with my customers on a daily basis. By far, they are the single most useless aspect of any business. Not because their immediate need isnt apparent and important, but that they are constantly trying to expand their influence into areas that does not include them.

What starts as a person who is tasked with checking individual parts for tolerance and conformance, ends up being a rule sheet for the issuing of purchase orders and staff management limitations based on documented training records.

Basically, they overcompensate.

(1) And the deniers aren't in it for the money? Let's see - size of the global fossil fuel industry: over $30trillion. Size of the scientific grants you mention - in the hundreds of billions. So, who has more at stake again? Also, heard of peer review?

(2) Semi-transparent? Go to the source, read the actual papers. They are fully transparent and peer reviewed. The problem is that the topic is too complex for most laymen to follow, so it is easily hijacked by vested interests and their "folksy wisdom", even if it is a bunch of disproven garbage.

(3) "Theorized cost"? You must be referring to the cost of the externalities, specifically the cost of the pollution, and the future cost of resource depletion, which has NEVER BEEN PAID FOR. BTW, I never advocated for control of the resources to be put into scientists' hands, that was your creation.

Sadly, you are right. The world will keep gobbling fossil fuels until they are gone. In the case of oil, that is a very short time horizon, and it's going to smash the world economy like nothing humanity has ever witnessed before.

As for developing nations, the rich nations should be helping them not to make the mistakes we did by subsidising them to keep their forests intact and develop along clean energy pathways. At the same time, the developed world should be progressively switching towards sustainable economies. Unfortunately, human nature, more specifically greed, is getting in the way.

(4) Nothing is ever completely unanimous. Some people still believe smoking is not linked to lung cancer. Here's a recent study of scientists' attitudes to climate change:

http://tigger.uic.edu/~pdoran/012009_Doran_final.pdf

(5) The majority of emissions come from the developed world, China and India. The rich, that is "us", are the ones who should be cutting first. For example, the average American or Australian produces over 20t of C02 a year, the average Chinaman 5t, and the average Indian 2t. Just to prove that it can be done, and quite easily at that, I have cut my impact to about 5t over a 3 year period with no impact on my lifestyle. If the citizens of developed nations all did that, we'd be a good way down the road to solving the problem, and India/China would be far more likely to come to the table.


Hit a nerve?

Maybe there will come an Elightenment for me and my ilk, maybe not. I admire your conviction, but that dedication doesnt make your argument anymore or less convincing. I hope most arent so easily swayed.

You asserted that I am just "in it for the money", when that couldn't be further from the truth. So yes, I am touchy about that.

People like me are pushing shit up hill, I am well aware of that. But what else am I to do? Ignore all that I have learned and be complicit in the disaster? No fucking way.

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

Species have to adapt to short-term change too, or there would be nothing alive on this planet. Natural disaster, global catastrophe, and disease are all things that take place on a tiny timescale that species had to adapt to.

It is tragic, but it is what it is. Humanity cannot grow while protecting everything that they need. If we don't get wiped out ourselves, we will eventually pave over every square inch of terrain on this planet and wipe out 99% of all species. There are too many species that cannot reproduce in captivity and we will need the land. This is part of the evolution of a planet that sustains intelligent life. A path towards a singularity.

The ones that are well adapted will thrive (dogs, cats, rats, birds, roaches, disease) and the rest will die. This planet doesn't have room for large animals that have 1-2 square miles of territory for each of their males. The poor nations which these animals live in don't care about protecting the environment. The entire western world got to ravage its natural resources to become wealthy, and now we tell those poor nations that they are not allowed to do the same.

I'm all for sustainability, but nothing will change until push comes to shove.

Have you heard of carrying capacity? It is the ability of a given environment to sustain a particular organism. The carrying capacity of the earth for humans who live like we do is about 3 billion people - food and fresh water supplies are fully exploited, the oil is half gone, and yet we premise an entire global social system on INFINITE GROWTH. That is an impossibility and an absurdity on a finite planet with limited resources.

Species that exceed their carrying capacity in an environment inevitably experience a population crash which reduces the population below the environment's carrying capacity. As our population bumps up against the limits of the earth (fresh water, healthy soil, healthy fisheries, balanced carbon cycle, energy supply), we will experience your "push comes to shove", and it will be ugly for all but the rich.

BTW, I do not advocate telling poor nations not to develop, I advocate rich nations transitioning to green economies as quickly as possible (because we can afford to if we can get over our collective greed) and helping poor nations to develop along green pathways. That will be the foundation of the next economic boom if only the vested interests will let it happen.

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

Oh course it is. And I understand that, now, at 25. But at 9 you don't need to know more than that. As I said in my previous post, ignorance is bliss at 9.

And you can replace any other animal with panda. Dingo? Koala? Squirrel?

Fair enough.

Koala I guess, but they're hard to find. Kangaroos are everywhere. BTW, we don't have squirrels, but we do have possums!

http://richard-seaman.com/Mammals/Australia/Possum.jpg

[DarkReign]

The last word is yours.