ATRAIN must not go to Uganda

[peewee's lovechild]

Uganda Considering Death Penalty For Gays

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/12/08/uganda-considering-death_n_384650.html

KAMPALA, Uganda — Proposed legislation would impose the death penalty for some gay Ugandans, and their family and friends could face up to seven years in jail if they fail to report them to authorities. Even landlords could be imprisoned for renting to homosexuals.

Gay rights activists say the bill, which has prompted growing international opposition, promotes hatred and could set back efforts to combat HIV/AIDS. They believe the bill is part of a continentwide backlash because Africa's gay community is becoming more vocal.

"It's a question of visibility," said David Cato, who became an activist after he was beaten up four times, arrested twice, fired from his teaching job and outed in the press because he is gay. "When we come out and ask for our rights, they pass laws against us."

The legislation has drawn global attention from activists across the spectrum of views on gay issues. The measure was proposed in Uganda following a visit by leaders of U.S. conservative Christian ministries that promote therapy for gays to become heterosexual. However, at least one of those leaders has denounced the bill, as have some other conservative and liberal Christians in the United States.

Gay rights activists say the legislation is likely to pass. But the bill is still being debated and could undergo changes before a vote, which has not yet been set.

The Ugandan legislation in its current form would mandate a death sentence for active homosexuals living with HIV or in cases of same-sex rape. "Serial offenders" also could face capital punishment, but the legislation does not define the term. Anyone convicted of a homosexual act faces life imprisonment.

Anyone who "aids, abets, counsels or procures another to engage of acts of homosexuality" faces seven years in prison if convicted. Landlords who rent rooms or homes to homosexuals also could get seven years and anyone with "religious, political, economic or social authority" who fails to report anyone violating the act faces three years.

Gay rights activists abroad are focusing on the legislation. A protest against the bill is planned for Thursday in London; protests were held last month in New York and Washington.

David Bahati, the legislator sponsoring the bill, said he was encouraging "constructive criticism" to improve the law, but insisted strict measures were necessary to stop homosexuals from "recruiting" schoolchildren.

"The youths in secondary schools copy everything from the Western world and America," said high school teacher David Kisambira. "A good number of students have been converted into gays. We hear there are groups of people given money by some gay organizations in developed countries to recruit youth into gay activities."

Uganda's ethics minister, James Nsaba Buturo, said the death sentence clause would probably be reviewed but maintained the law was necessary to counter foreign influence. He said homosexuality "is not natural in Uganda," a view echoed by some Ugandans.

"I feel that the bill is good and necessary, but I don't think gays should be killed. They should be imprisoned for about a year and warned never to do it again. The family is in danger in Uganda because the rate at which vice is spreading is appalling," said shopkeeper John Muwanguzi.

Uganda is not the only country considering anti-gay laws. Nigeria, where homosexuality is already punishable by imprisonment or death, is considering strengthening penalties for activities deemed to promote it. Burundi just banned same-sex relationships and Rwanda is considering it.

Homophobia is rife even in more tolerant African countries.

In Kenya, homosexuality is illegal but the government has acknowledged its existence by launching sexual orientation survey to improve health care. Nevertheless, the recent marriage of two Kenyan men in London caused outrage. The men's families in Kenya were harassed by reporters and villagers.

In South Africa, the only African nation to recognize gay marriage, gangs carry out so-called "corrective" rapes on lesbians. A 19-year-old lesbian athlete was gang-raped, tortured and murdered in 2008.

Debate over the Ugandan bill follows a conference in Kampala earlier this year attended by American activists who consider same-gender relationships sinful, and believe gays and lesbians can become heterosexual through prayer and counseling. Author Don Schmierer and "sexual reorientation coach" Caleb Lee Brundidge took part; they did not respond to interview requests.

A third American who took part in the conference in Uganda, Scott Lively, said the bill has gone too far.

"I agree with the general goal but this law is far too harsh," said Lively, a California-based preacher and author of "The Pink Swastika" and other books that advise parents how to "recruit-proof" their children from gays.

"Society should actively discourage all sex outside of marriage and that includes homosexuality ... The family is under threat," he said. Gay people "should not be parading around the streets," he added.

Frank Mugisha, a gay Ugandan human rights activist, said the bill was so poorly worded that someone could be imprisoned for giving a hug.

"This bill is promoting hatred," he said. "We're turning Uganda into a police state. It will drive people to suicide."

Buturo played down the influence of foreign evangelicals, saying the proposed legislation was an expression of popular outrage against "repugnant" practices. But activists like Cato argue anti-gay attitudes are a foreign import.

"In the beginning, when the missionaries brought religion, they said they were bringing love," he said. "Instead they brought hate, through homophobia."

Susan Timberlake, a senior adviser on human rights and law from UNAIDS, said such laws could hinder the fight against HIV/AIDS by driving people further underground. And activists also worry that the legislation could be used to blackmail or silence government critics.

Cato said he thinks the Ugandan bill will pass, perhaps in an altered form.

"It's such a setback. But I hope we can overcome it," he said. "I cannot believe this is happening in the 21st century."

[oh crap]

Why did you start posting again?

[ATRAIN]

Thought he was done with this place like in his user title. What a pussy I knew he would be back.

[BacktoBasics]

Can't we all just hetrosexuallyhugitout.

[mrsmaalox]

Wow, scary stuff.

But the the title of the thread is :lmao

[DarkReign]

"It's such a setback. But I hope we can overcome it," he said. "I cannot believe this is happening in the 21st century."

:lmao

Africa isnt even in the 20th century, much less the 21st. No surprises here.

This is the same continent that practices witchcraft and hunts human albino children for their body parts.

Nothing, and I mean nothing surprises me with Africa. Thats why Islam spreading there is a scary, scary thought. The inhabitants are savages without purpose already...the last thing they need is purpose.

[ATRAIN]

I guess im pretty honored that pee wee has been gone a good while and his first thread back is about me. Guess he still thinks about me.

[z0sa]

"A good number of students have been converted into gays."

[BacktoBasics]

"A good number of students have been converted into gays."Maybe you could tell us if that's mathematically possible.

[I. Hustle]

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_yg0wzuV8KA0/SAtbobFkyZI/AAAAAAAABK4/PvaXxW-NW6g/s400/strangers-on-a-train-1-1024.jpg

[z0sa]

Maybe you could tell us if that's mathematically possible.

I was actually hoping you could. :wakeup

[desflood]

Lesbians in South Africa are being dragged off the street and raped in an effort to "correct" them, Sky News reports.

Sky News has found evidence of widespread abuse against the lesbian community — resulting in a new trend of so-called "corrective rape".

In the the township of Khayelitsha, on the outskirts of Cape Town, Sky spoke to a group of women who said they live in fear of their lives. All of them said they know someone who has been violently dragged off the streets and raped because they had come out as a lesbian.

Funeka Solidaat said she had been attacked on two occasions — and on the second time she was raped.

She said the men covered their faces with balaclavas and that she had been repeatedly threatened with rape in the township.

Funeka believed it was only a matter of time before it happened — and then it did.

But what shocked her even more, she said, was the attitude of the police. She was made to feel like "a laughing stock" when she reported the crime. Officers didn't bother to finish taking a statement from her, she said.

Funeka was part of a group of women Sky News met at a safe house in Khayelitsha township. As they talked, it became clear the so-called motive for the attack was to "correct" them.

Desire Dudu told Sky she had come out as a lesbian but, in her view, you risk your life in South African society if you make your sexuality clear.

[lefty]

:lmao

Africa isnt even in the 20th century, much less the 21st. No surprises here.

This is the same continent that practices witchcraft and hunts human albino children for their body parts.

Nothing, and I mean nothing surprises me with Africa. Thats why Islam spreading there is a scary, scary thought. The inhabitants are savages without purpose already...the last thing they need is purpose.

How cute and naive


You are aware that superpowers are responsible for all the shit going on in Africa, right?

[BacktoBasics]

I was actually hoping you could. :wakeupI'm 99% sure you're between the ages of 17 and 19. Possibly 20 but definitely not old enough to buy alcohol. I just wanted to let you know that I'm starting to figure you out.

[oh crap]

You are aware that superpowers are responsible for all the shit going on in Africa, right?

what the fuck are you talking about?

[Trainwreck2100]

Uganda Considering Death Penalty For Gays

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/12/08/uganda-considering-death_n_384650.html

KAMPALA, Uganda — Proposed legislation would impose the death penalty for some gay Ugandans, and their family and friends could face up to seven years in jail if they fail to report them to authorities. Even landlords could be imprisoned for renting to homosexuals.

Gay rights activists say the bill, which has prompted growing international opposition, promotes hatred and could set back efforts to combat HIV/AIDS. They believe the bill is part of a continentwide backlash because Africa's gay community is becoming more vocal.

"It's a question of visibility," said David Cato, who became an activist after he was beaten up four times, arrested twice, fired from his teaching job and outed in the press because he is gay. "When we come out and ask for our rights, they pass laws against us."

The legislation has drawn global attention from activists across the spectrum of views on gay issues. The measure was proposed in Uganda following a visit by leaders of U.S. conservative Christian ministries that promote therapy for gays to become heterosexual. However, at least one of those leaders has denounced the bill, as have some other conservative and liberal Christians in the United States.

Gay rights activists say the legislation is likely to pass. But the bill is still being debated and could undergo changes before a vote, which has not yet been set.

The Ugandan legislation in its current form would mandate a death sentence for active homosexuals living with HIV or in cases of same-sex rape. "Serial offenders" also could face capital punishment, but the legislation does not define the term. Anyone convicted of a homosexual act faces life imprisonment.

Anyone who "aids, abets, counsels or procures another to engage of acts of homosexuality" faces seven years in prison if convicted. Landlords who rent rooms or homes to homosexuals also could get seven years and anyone with "religious, political, economic or social authority" who fails to report anyone violating the act faces three years.

Gay rights activists abroad are focusing on the legislation. A protest against the bill is planned for Thursday in London; protests were held last month in New York and Washington.

David Bahati, the legislator sponsoring the bill, said he was encouraging "constructive criticism" to improve the law, but insisted strict measures were necessary to stop homosexuals from "recruiting" schoolchildren.

"The youths in secondary schools copy everything from the Western world and America," said high school teacher David Kisambira. "A good number of students have been converted into gays. We hear there are groups of people given money by some gay organizations in developed countries to recruit youth into gay activities."

Uganda's ethics minister, James Nsaba Buturo, said the death sentence clause would probably be reviewed but maintained the law was necessary to counter foreign influence. He said homosexuality "is not natural in Uganda," a view echoed by some Ugandans.

"I feel that the bill is good and necessary, but I don't think gays should be killed. They should be imprisoned for about a year and warned never to do it again. The family is in danger in Uganda because the rate at which vice is spreading is appalling," said shopkeeper John Muwanguzi.

Uganda is not the only country considering anti-gay laws. Nigeria, where homosexuality is already punishable by imprisonment or death, is considering strengthening penalties for activities deemed to promote it. Burundi just banned same-sex relationships and Rwanda is considering it.

Homophobia is rife even in more tolerant African countries.

In Kenya, homosexuality is illegal but the government has acknowledged its existence by launching sexual orientation survey to improve health care. Nevertheless, the recent marriage of two Kenyan men in London caused outrage. The men's families in Kenya were harassed by reporters and villagers.

In South Africa, the only African nation to recognize gay marriage, gangs carry out so-called "corrective" rapes on lesbians. A 19-year-old lesbian athlete was gang-raped, tortured and murdered in 2008.

Debate over the Ugandan bill follows a conference in Kampala earlier this year attended by American activists who consider same-gender relationships sinful, and believe gays and lesbians can become heterosexual through prayer and counseling. Author Don Schmierer and "sexual reorientation coach" Caleb Lee Brundidge took part; they did not respond to interview requests.

A third American who took part in the conference in Uganda, Scott Lively, said the bill has gone too far.

"I agree with the general goal but this law is far too harsh," said Lively, a California-based preacher and author of "The Pink Swastika" and other books that advise parents how to "recruit-proof" their children from gays.

"Society should actively discourage all sex outside of marriage and that includes homosexuality ... The family is under threat," he said. Gay people "should not be parading around the streets," he added.

Frank Mugisha, a gay Ugandan human rights activist, said the bill was so poorly worded that someone could be imprisoned for giving a hug.

"This bill is promoting hatred," he said. "We're turning Uganda into a police state. It will drive people to suicide."

Buturo played down the influence of foreign evangelicals, saying the proposed legislation was an expression of popular outrage against "repugnant" practices. But activists like Cato argue anti-gay attitudes are a foreign import.

"In the beginning, when the missionaries brought religion, they said they were bringing love," he said. "Instead they brought hate, through homophobia."

Susan Timberlake, a senior adviser on human rights and law from UNAIDS, said such laws could hinder the fight against HIV/AIDS by driving people further underground. And activists also worry that the legislation could be used to blackmail or silence government critics.

Cato said he thinks the Ugandan bill will pass, perhaps in an altered form.

"It's such a setback. But I hope we can overcome it," he said. "I cannot believe this is happening in the 21st century."

well i guess the hutus finally finished off the tutsis, so now they goin after the homos

Lesbians in South Africa are being dragged off the street and raped in an effort to "correct" them, Sky News reports.

Sky News has found evidence of widespread abuse against the lesbian community — resulting in a new trend of so-called "corrective rape".

In the the township of Khayelitsha, on the outskirts of Cape Town, Sky spoke to a group of women who said they live in fear of their lives. All of them said they know someone who has been violently dragged off the streets and raped because they had come out as a lesbian.

Funeka Solidaat said she had been attacked on two occasions — and on the second time she was raped.

She said the men covered their faces with balaclavas and that she had been repeatedly threatened with rape in the township.

Funeka believed it was only a matter of time before it happened — and then it did.

But what shocked her even more, she said, was the attitude of the police. She was made to feel like "a laughing stock" when she reported the crime. Officers didn't bother to finish taking a statement from her, she said.

Funeka was part of a group of women Sky News met at a safe house in Khayelitsha township. As they talked, it became clear the so-called motive for the attack was to "correct" them.

Desire Dudu told Sky she had come out as a lesbian but, in her view, you risk your life in South African society if you make your sexuality clear.

meh

[z0sa]

I'm 99% sure you're between the ages of 17 and 19. Possibly 20 but definitely not old enough to buy alcohol. I just wanted to let you know that I'm starting to figure you out.

Check my profile - I'm 20. Turning 21 on Christmas Eve. And I've complained about the minimum age for alcohol in this country many times on this forum.

WTH does that have to do with anything.

BTW, this was my 5000th post. Thanks Kori, Timvp.

[Trainwreck2100]

lol christmas eve birthdays
lol getting screwed by only getting one gift a year

no wonder you're always pissed

[I. Hustle]

Lesbians in South Africa are being dragged off the street and raped in an effort to "correct" them, Sky News reports.

Sky News has found evidence of widespread abuse against the lesbian community — resulting in a new trend of so-called "corrective rape".

In the the township of Khayelitsha, on the outskirts of Cape Town, Sky spoke to a group of women who said they live in fear of their lives. All of them said they know someone who has been violently dragged off the streets and raped because they had come out as a lesbian.

Funeka Solidaat said she had been attacked on two occasions — and on the second time she was raped.

She said the men covered their faces with balaclavas and that she had been repeatedly threatened with rape in the township.

Funeka believed it was only a matter of time before it happened — and then it did.

But what shocked her even more, she said, was the attitude of the police. She was made to feel like "a laughing stock" when she reported the crime. Officers didn't bother to finish taking a statement from her, she said.

Funeka was part of a group of women Sky News met at a safe house in Khayelitsha township. As they talked, it became clear the so-called motive for the attack was to "correct" them.

Desire Dudu told Sky she had come out as a lesbian but, in her view, you risk your life in South African society if you make your sexuality clear.

:lol her last name is Dudu.

[BacktoBasics]

Check my profile - I'm 20. Turning 21 on Christmas Eve. And I've complained about the minimum age for alcohol in this country many times on this forum.

WTH does that have to do with anything.

BTW, this was my 5000th post. Thanks Kori, Timvp. I don't really read your posts I just recently noticed you posted here. 20 seems about right.

[z0sa]

lol christmas eve birthdays
lol getting screwed by only getting one gift a year

no wonder you're always pissed

lol do I come off pissed all the time?

[DarkReign]

How cute and naive


You are aware that superpowers are responsible for all the shit going on in Africa, right?

Love to hear your rationale for this. So youre saying white Europeans made native Africans savages who practice witchcraft, slaughter human albinos for their organs and body parts, sport-kill lepers, force children into armies, "corrective rape" lesbians and are nearing a stage where they pass laws whereby homosexuality becomes punishable by death?

This is Europe's fault? Really?

Do explain, please.

[lefty]

what the fuck are you talking about?
Just saying

If you are watching CNN, the it's your choice

[BacktoBasics]

lol do I come off pissed all the time?Not just pissed but unnecessarily argumentative.

[z0sa]

Not just pissed but unnecessarily argumentative.

Argumentative? I can agree there. I'm never pissed on these forums except after a Spurs loss.

[lefty]

Love to hear your rationale for this. So youre saying white Europeans made native Africans savages who practice witchcraft, slaughter human albinos for their organs and body parts, sport-kill lepers, force children into armies, "corrective rape" lesbians and are nearing a stage where they pass laws whereby homosexuality becomes punishable by death?

This is Europe's fault? Really?

Do explain, please.
Yes yes yes

When you put a country in a shitty situation in order to take advantadge of their natural resources, people's behavior will be bad, due to:

- horrible economy
- no future

People start not trusting each other and will do everything to make $$$$

Oh, but it gets better; they train those killers, molesters, whatever you want to call them, when they are children, in order to turn them into psychopaths.



Of course, I can understand that you can not see that from Michigan, but I lived in a few African countries; I've witnessed things you wouldn't believe, but I've also met exceptional people; I also had the opportunity to speak with Afican and European writers and journalists when I lived in Belgium and France.

Basically, the U.S and the Internationale Socialiste Francaise have purposely created dissensions in African countries, putting dictators here and there who would weaken the population and come up with retarded laws; if democracy takes over and economic prosperity occurs, France, the U.S, Netherlands or Belgium wouldn't be able to take advantadge of the local natural resources, right?
That's why they spread the shit over there; and they also have spies too: diplomats, monks, teacher, and what not....... they have to be aware of any rumor that can lead them to believe that a revolution is coming up.

Control, control, control.


I don't want to sound like Noam Chomsky, but you get the picture.

[ginobili's bald spot]

Yes yes yes

When you put a country in a shitty situation in order to take advantadge of their natural resources, people's behavior will be bad, due to:

- horrible economy
- no future

People start not trusting each other and will do everything to make $$$$

Oh, but it gets better; they train those killers, molesters, whatever you want to call them, when they are children, in order to turn them into psychopaths.



Of course, I can understand that you can not see that from Michigan, but I lived in a few African countries; I've witnessed things you wouldn't believe, but I've also met exceptional people; I also had the opportunity to speak with Afican and European writers and journalists when I lived in Belgium and France.

Basically, the U.S and the Internationale Socialiste Francaise have purposely created dissensions in African countries, putting dictators here and there who would weaken the population and come up with retarded laws; if democracy takes over and economic prosperity occurs, France, the U.S, Netherlands or Belgium wouldn't be able to take advantadge of the local natural resources, right?
That's why they spread the shit over there; and they also have spies too: diplomats, monks, teacher, and what not....... they have to be aware of any rumor that can lead them to believe that a revolution is coming up.

Control, control, control.


I don't want to sound like Noam Chomsky, but you get the picture.


Good post lefty. :toast

[lefty]

Good post lefty. :toast
Merci beaucoup, thank you

[DarkReign]

Yes yes yes

When you put a country in a shitty situation in order to take advantadge of their natural resources, people's behavior will be bad, due to:

- horrible economy
- no future

People start not trusting each other and will do everything to make $$$$

Oh, but it gets better; they train those killers, molesters, whatever you want to call them, when they are children, in order to turn them into psychopaths.



Of course, I can understand that you can not see that from Michigan, but I lived in a few African countries; I've witnessed things you wouldn't believe, but I've also met exceptional people; I also had the opportunity to speak with Afican and European writers and journalists when I lived in Belgium and France.

Basically, the U.S and the Internationale Socialiste Francaise have purposely created dissensions in African countries, putting dictators here and there who would weaken the population and come up with retarded laws; if democracy takes over and economic prosperity occurs, France, the U.S, Netherlands or Belgium wouldn't be able to take advantadge of the local natural resources, right?
That's why they spread the shit over there; and they also have spies too: diplomats, monks, teacher, and what not....... they have to be aware of any rumor that can lead them to believe that a revolution is coming up.

Control, control, control.


I don't want to sound like Noam Chomsky, but you get the picture.

While I see your point, how this relates to the practice of witchcraft, the slaughtering of human albinos, the sport-killing of lepers and apparently a new law condemning homosexuals and their "conspirators" to death is a little lost on me.

Sure, every place in the world has been exploited by Europe and its descendants at one time or another (or currently, as is the case with Africa), this I readily recognize. But that does not explain barbarism in the 21st century and certainly cant be used as an excuse forever.

When almost an entire continent forcefully conscripts male children into militias, slaughtering other humans by the thousands as war bands, one has to question their humanity. I mean, some of the civil wars there are like straight out of a Roman history book. The only thing missing are mass crucifictions lining both sides of the street as warnings to those left alive. Then again, what do I know, maybe they are leaving messages like that.

Makes them all the more appalling. BTW, meeting good people in troubled lands is not unique to Africa, my friend. Lots of good Germans with good hearts and good families served the Fuhrer, too. If the good people of Africa cannot seize control of their own lands from the warlords and Western corruptors, then honestly, they arent fit to lead. I see Africa as a completely failed experiment that the West continues to exploit for its own ends. The natives are proof positive that you cannot give civilization away like a gift...it is earned and wanted. Guess that explains why aliens dont come down from on high, amiright?

But enough about this, you lived there, you obviously have a much better perspective and intellect on the continent of Africa than me. But one thing you are that I am not is emotionally involved.

[Trainwreck2100]

Not just pissed but unnecessarily argumentative.

that's what happens when you get christmas/birthday presents

[lefty]

While I see your point, how this relates to the practice of witchcraft, the slaughtering of human albinos, the sport-killing of lepers and apparently a new law condemning homosexuals and their "conspirators" to death is a little lost on me.

Sure, every place in the world has been exploited by Europe and its descendants at one time or another (or currently, as is the case with Africa), this I readily recognize. But that does not explain barbarism in the 21st century and certainly cant be used as an excuse forever.

When almost an entire continent forcefully conscripts male children into militias, slaughtering other humans by the thousands as war bands, one has to question their humanity. I mean, some of the civil wars there are like straight out of a Roman history book. The only thing missing are mass crucifictions lining both sides of the street as warnings to those left alive. Then again, what do I know, maybe they are leaving messages like that.

Makes them all the more appalling. BTW, meeting good people in troubled lands is not unique to Africa, my friend. Lots of good Germans with good hearts and good families served the Fuhrer, too. If the good people of Africa cannot seize control of their own lands from the warlords and Western corruptors, then honestly, they arent fit to lead. I see Africa as a completely failed experiment that the West continues to exploit for its own ends. The natives are proof positive that you cannot give civilization away like a gift...it is earned and wanted. Guess that explains why aliens dont come down from on high, amiright?

But enough about this, you lived there, you obviously have a much better perspective and intellect on the continent of Africa than me. But one thing you are that I am not is emotionally involved.

I totally respect your opinion, and we could talk about this for days.

One thing for sure: war sucks