Dear Conservative Movement: Stop Ruining My Life

[Marcus Bryant]

http://www.theawl.com/2010/01/dear-conservative-movement-stop-ruining-my-life-by-michael-brendan-dougherty

[Marcus Bryant]

The prelapsarian conservatives of the 30s opposed foreign adventurism and naive Wilsonian internationalism. They wanted to shrink the size of the federal government. In over 70 years, despite massive public spasms of disgust with the federal government, conservatives have only made it larger and stupider.

[Marcus Bryant]

But then this free market stuff. Live within your means. Fend for yourself. Be responsible. I believed that. But the people you elected didn’t. Bankers, GE, Archers Daniels Midland, military contractors, really all sorts of speculators—they deserved wealth transfers, cheap credit, debt cancellation. These are your welfare queens, conservative movement. Do you know how bad this makes us look, after having attacked poor people and minorities as free-riders?

[Marcus Bryant]

Though a minority of us still read and adhere to some hearty theology, Dutch Calvinism, Tractarianism or Latin-Mass Catholicism, you’ve abandoned your charges and America to Jesus-is-my-Boyfriend style mega-churches. If the choice is between listening to the wisdom of Kirk Cameron and singing Jars of Clay songs and pledging our virginity versus going to college, reading Kant and fornicating? I can tell you, categorically, we’ll be going at it like heathens and Democrats.

[Marcus Bryant]

P.S. Scott Brown is what you used to call a “squish.” So, you’re settling too.

[TeyshaBlue]

From the comments: Genius.

Neoliberal economic orthodoxy, dogwhistle racism, neocon hyper-interventionism, evangelical fundamentalism–these aren’t ideas, they’re cartoons of ideas that have long since metastasized and strangled to death any sane proposition or policy from conservative thought.

[Marcus Bryant]

Or, it's a lifestyle, or politics designed to fit a lifestyle, rather than an actual political ideology. These "conservatives" would prefer permanent minority status as that would validate, in a weird sense, their beliefs, or provide continued grist for their personal grievance mill.

[Marcus Bryant]

Lifestyle politics gave us a "conservative" president who expanded the state at all edges.

[Marcus Bryant]

Or, "conservatives" would have been happier had Gore won in 2000, free to engage in conspiracy theories and bitch about him for four to eight years.

They're energized now. McCain lost and they have Obama in the White House. Hell, that major "conservative" Limbaugh made his name and his real $$$ thanks to the Clinton years.

[EVAY]

Or, it's a lifestyle, or politics designed to fit a lifestyle, rather than an actual political ideology. These "conservatives" would prefer permanent minority status as that would validate, in a weird sense, their beliefs, or provide continued grist for their personal grievance mill.

I liked the article. I thought it was terrific.

But your comments that I quoted here? Marcus, I have chided you occasionally for cynicism or crankyness, but I honestly believe that your comments in the quote are brilliant! I had never thought of it that way, but it is a phenomenally cogent description of the reality.

"politics designed to fit a lifestyle, rather than an actual political philosophy".
Cool.

[Marcus Bryant]

What's wrong with my "crankyness" you whippersnapper?

[Winehole23]

Since the vogue of Jersey Shore is still general, I think we can safely say we're not exactly hitting a high point.

[Marcus Bryant]

To be fair, there's plenty of lifestyle politics played by the other side.

Still, "conservatives" should be above this.

[Marcus Bryant]

What is the price of arugula these days?

[Winehole23]

Dunno. I like salads but they sometimes make my belly hurt.

[Winehole23]

I'm more of a bag o greens guy.

[Winehole23]

3-4 bucks, like a dummy

[Winehole23]

Yuppie wines I can help with, but Cali is a weakness for me. I have more old world than new world mojo.

[Marcus Bryant]

That's not to say the left didn't find being the out party more fun than than the in....

[Marcus Bryant]

Yuppie wines I can help with, but Cali is a weakness for me. I have more old world than new world mojo.

Wine?

Commie.

[Winehole23]

The other side of the coin is dietary restriction and nerdly propriety with respect to energy consumption and Mother Earth, true.

[Marcus Bryant]

Or, worse:

Liberal.

[Winehole23]

Whatevs.

Coming from you, that doesn't piss me off so much. I have a determinate idea, however mistaken it may be, of what you mean by it. So yeah. That's cool with me.

[Marcus Bryant]

Whatevs.

Coming from you, that doesn't piss me off so much. I have a determinate idea, however mistaken it may be, of what you mean by it. So yeah. That's cool with me.

Well, sure. Sen. Taft preferred to be known by that. Sixty years later, "conservatives" throw it around like the left drops "Nazi."

[Winehole23]

Whatever one might say of the usage, I think the sentiment behind it is genuinely meant.

[Winehole23]

Branded correctly, almost anything can be sold. Conservative, liberal, progressive, whatever, is the just wrapping the present comes in.

[Marcus Bryant]

Branded correctly, almost anything can be sold. Conservative, liberal, progressive, whatever, is the just wrapping the present comes in.

Liberalism has been bastardized by both "sides" of American politics.

[Winehole23]

Apparently not to its benefit, either way.

[EVAY]

What's wrong with my "crankyness" you whippersnapper?

I've been called much worse than a 'whippersnapper', but don't make it a 'young whippersnapper'...afraid I haven't qualified for that in some time.

And of course you are right about it occurring on both sides.

[SouthernFried]

LOL

I find all of this brilliant in its obscurity and vacantness (is that a world?) Reminds me of a freshman philosophy class I couldn't quit giggling in. People prosetylizing about prosetylizing. Labeling classes of thought just so they can then decry the labeling of classes of thought. Finding truth and beleif in meaningless obscurities that they then classify and add syllables too, just because it sounds so much better and covers the fact they have no fucking idea what they're talking about.

Excessive Nomenclature is the tool of idiots and tyrants. The former to make him/herself seem less so...the latter to appeal to the former.

And then there's the guy in the front with the giggles...

[TeyshaBlue]

I shall fling poop whilst pondering syntax! Brilliant!

*Atlas Giggles*

[baseline bum]

Branded correctly, almost anything can be sold. Conservative, liberal, progressive, whatever, is the just wrapping the present comes in.

That reminds me of an old commercial where you see some guy filling up a glass bottle from a stream while talking about his future business plan, to which his friend replies "Don't be stupid: no one's ever going to pay for water!"

[Marcus Bryant]

(is that a world?)

You have to ask?

[SouthernFried]

I shall fling poop whilst pondering syntax! Brilliant!

*Atlas Giggles*

Flinging poop at syntax would be a more appropriate poop fling.

All the best Gods had senses of humor.

[Marcus Bryant]

Anyways, LOL.

I find criticism of my political beliefs to be amusing, because I can barely articulate them myself. If I am obtuse, I can't but help giggle at the one who seeks to interpret and critique my obtuseness. Hah, I am brilliant!

And on it goes.

[SouthernFried]

Anyways, LOL.

I find criticism of my political beliefs to be amusing, because I can barely articulate them myself. If I am obtuse, I can't but help giggle at the one who seeks to interpret and critique my obtuseness. Hah, I am brilliant!

And on it goes.

There you go!

I once had a professor say almost the exact same thing to me. "I sometimes don't know what I'm talking about, but it's that realization and the resulting journey that eventually leads to discovery."

...or something like that.

We were both pretty stoned at the time.

[Marcus Bryant]

This reminds me of the time I got stoned with a professor. Before he left a $20 on my nightstand, he said to me "I forgot what we were talking about we hit the sack, but the journey is what is most important."

or something like that.

That's the last time I got stoned.

And on it goes.

[DarrinS]

This reminds me of the time I got stoned with a professor. Before he left a $20 on my nightstand, he said to me "I forgot what we were talking about we hit the sack, but the journey is what is most important."

or something like that.

That's the last time I got stoned.

And on it goes.



WTF? Dude.

[Marcus Bryant]

youtube

/youtube

[EmptyMan]

You'd probably be assa12121324343ssina5353ted by the system if you were the real deal. Still, I'd make that one hell of a ride if I became Pre53252side564564nt.

[PixelPusher]

To be fair, there's plenty of lifestyle politics played by the other side.

Still, "conservatives" should be above this.

No true Scotsman would, that's for sure...

[Marcus Bryant]

Yeah, I guess. It's easier to fight a monolithic enemy.

[PixelPusher]

Yeah, I guess. It's easier to fight a monolithic enemy.

That, or you can stop giving a shit about labels and just be yourself.

[Marcus Bryant]

Of course, words have meaning. Or have they all been deconstructed?

[PixelPusher]

Of course, words have meaning. Or have they all been deconstructed?

Words can have extra meanings. Or different meanings over time. A "faggot" used to be commonly understood as a wooden stick suitable for kindling.

Sorry Plato, but there isn't a perfect Form of the word "Conservative", just rough identifiers that have always, and will always owe more to culture than ideology.

[Marcus Bryant]

Then it's settled.

It isn't.

[Winehole23]

Sorry Plato, but there isn't a perfect Form of the word "Conservative", just rough identifiers that have always, and will always owe more to culture than ideology.The terms have determinate meanings historically speaking. By no means is that dispositive for usage, though. America has certain distinctive lifeways and customs that all true conservatives seek to maintain, each in his/her own humble way. At least say what they are. For me it's the pre WWII, pre-New Deal republic. I wish we could have that back. The yearning for an actual, historical status quo ante.

Just make people rough it out. Conservatives should be able to articulate what they are conserving, and why it's important to conserve.

"Liberals", as commonly understood I don't know. Just like the soi disant conservatives, you have to take them one by one. When you interrogate them, most of the time they can't even tell you why they are conservative/liberal, or why anyone else should think it important, apart from the usual glittering generalities about liberty and freedom for everybody.

That may not be a fault, I guess.

[PixelPusher]

The terms have determinate meanings historically speaking. By no means is that dispositive for usage, though. America has certain distinctive lifeways and customs that all true conservatives seek to maintain, each in his/her own humble way. At least say what they are. For me it's the pre WWII, pre-New Deal republic. I wish we could have that back. The yearning for an actual, historical status quo ante.

Just make people rough it out. Conservatives should be able to articulate what they are conserving, and why it's important to conserve.

Ah, yes...the good ol' days. (http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/tue-january-5-2010/even-better-than-the-real-thing)


"Liberals", as commonly understood I don't know. Just like the soi disant conservatives, you have to take them one by one. When you interrogate them, most of the time they can't even tell you why they are conservative/liberal, or why anyone else should think it important, apart from the usual glittering generalities about liberty and freedom for everybody.

That may not be a fault, I guess.
Some Liberals, particularly Baby Boomers, are guilty of a little selective 50's nostalgia themselves (strong labor unions, pensions, ascendant blue collar middle class, etc.), but in general...no, we don't pine away for some past version of the America.

[Winehole23]

I can understand that and have no objection to that.

[Winehole23]

Cheers, PixelPusher. Let's drink together sometime. :toast

[Winehole23]

BTW, it's not an undifferentiated nostalgia, and it might not end up being strictly unrelated to the ultimate reining in of our truly massive discretionary defense spending, among other things.

[TeyshaBlue]

Flinging poop at syntax would be a more appropriate poop fling.

All the best Gods had senses of humor.

Ok...gimme your top 5 with the best omniscience:humor ratio!:lol:toast Loki doesn't count.

[rjv]

southern fried has a point. a lot of this forum is populated by posters,like myself, who spend way too much time pointing out the obvious tautologies about the inefficiencies of our government and the growing emergence of one vague political system divided into two not at all dissimilar parties. in that sense we are not really engaging in philosophical discourse at all. it is more of a logic festival.

outside that there is the fact that the real world moves on and there are other ways to address the inadequacies of our our poilitical society. how that is done is the question. even dissidents and self-proclaimed anarchists such as chomsky admit that, to get to where there ideals want this nation to be, they have to first work with the system that is in place.

but southern fried may be correct. perhaps many are more suited to wearing berets and sipping lattes over the political conversation of the day.

(i think i know how camus must have felt when he just got sick of the heavy nihilism of his peers and branched off.)

[TeyshaBlue]

southern fried has a point. a lot of this forum is populated by posters,like myself, who spend way too much time pointing out the obvious tautologies about the inefficiencies of our government and the growing emergence of one vague political system divided into two not at all dissimilar parties. in that sense we are not really engaging in philosophical discourse at all. it is more of a logic festival.

outside that there is the fact that the real world moves on and there are other ways to address the inadequacies of our our poilitical society. how that is done is the question. even dissidents and self-proclaimed anarchists such as chomsky admit that, to get to where there ideals want this nation to be, they have to first work with the system that is in place.

but southern fried may be correct. perhaps many are more suited to wearing berets and sipping lattes over the political conversation of the day.

(i think i know how camus must have felt when he just got sick of the heavy nihilism of his peers and branched off.)

Logic festival. Hmm...I'm a Carny?:(

:lol

[Marcus Bryant]

Never, never, never search for truth on a message board.

[admiralsnackbar]

Good find, MB.

[rjv]

Never, never, never search for truth on a message board.

didn't emerson say this ?

[admiralsnackbar]

didn't emerson say this ?

I think he was paraphrasing the Gorgias. :lol

[Winehole23]

but southern fried may be correct. perhaps many are more suited to wearing berets and sipping lattes over the political conversation of the day. This whole forum is a goddam coffeehouse conversation, rjv.

[RandomGuy]

http://www.theawl.com/2010/01/dear-conservative-movement-stop-ruining-my-life-by-michael-brendan-dougherty

I pretty much feel the same.

This is the biggest problem the modern GOP faces... anybody of real conscience or anything approaching intellectual honesty knows how truly dishonest and corrupted it is.

That dishonestly and corruption has literally killed the people who owe everythign to, our servicemembers who needless died in Iraq.

[Winehole23]

That dishonestly and corruption has literally killed the people who owe everythign to, our servicemembers who needless died in Iraq. It's understandable to get choked up sometimes. Or alternately, angry about it.