If the U.S.A. gets invaded, do you think we will be able to defend ourselves?

[FalleNxWiZarDx]

We are in 2 Conflicts right now, about to start another any moment now (Iran)

Our military is in about 15 other countries, and is at the limit of there manpower...

Soooo if we was to get invaded it would be us citizens that would have to defend our homeland.

Do you think we are up to the task??

Will we get trained atleast?

What would you do?

Do you have any guns?

Should I buy a gun?

What kind of GUN should I get?

[lefty]

We are in 2 wars right now, about to start another any moment now (Iran)

Our military is in about 15 other countries, and is at the limit of there manpower...

Soooo if we was to get invaded it would be us citizens that would have to defend our homeland.

Do you think we are up to the task??

Will we get trained atleast?

What would you do?

Do you have any guns?

Should I buy a gun?

What kind of GUN should I get?
:lmao

[FalleNxWiZarDx]

:lmao


care to explain?

[Pero]

LMAO. Who would be able to invade you? Canada? Mexico?

:lol

[AFBlue]

http://www.joblo.com/images_arrownews/RA-RedDawn4.jpg

As long as we got Jed and them Wolverines on our side!

[FalleNxWiZarDx]

LMAO. Who would be able to invade you? Canada? Mexico?

:lol


It would be very hard for any Nation to invade us........

The only Nations that is able to invade would be China, and Russia

[FalleNxWiZarDx]

http://guns.yfa1.ru/eng/image/AR15_A3_Tactical_Carbine.jpg


Im thinking about getting this AR 15

[lefty]

care to explain?
By "wars", do you mean collecting oil and opium?

[FalleNxWiZarDx]

By "wars", do you mean collecting oil and opium?


I should of used Conflicts instead of Wars

[lefty]

I should of used Conflicts instead of Wars
That's better

[symple19]

We are in 2 wars right now, about to start another any moment now (Iran)

Our military is in about 15 other countries, and is at the limit of there manpower...

Soooo if we was to get invaded it would be us citizens that would have to defend our homeland.

Do you think we are up to the task??

Will we get trained atleast?

What would you do?

Do you have any guns?

Should I buy a gun?

What kind of GUN should I get?

Un-fucking-believable - This is the last country on earth anyone would want to invade. It would take a huge alliance of countries to assemble a conventional army large enough to even have a chance. America would also be a nightmare when it comes to guerrilla warfare (on a scale never before seen, IMO) considering the amount of guns present in the country.

Haven't you seen "Red Dawn" ?


The FBI estimates that there are over 200 million privately-owned firearms in the US. If you add those owned by the military, law enforcement agencies and museums, there is probably about 1 gun per person in the country.
If you want to get a rough idea of how many guns there are out there just look at how many people you see out there then multiply by a factor of estimated ownership. The last best guess was about 350,000,000 Total. That would be 1 weapon for every man woman and child. The average gun enthusiast owns several firearms which includes pistols, shotguns, and rifles of all makes and models. It is often estimated that about 1 in 4 people own any firearms and on average firearms owners own 4 guns each.

did I just respond to a troll or a 10 year old?

[MannyIsGod]

I'd vote for air dropping printed copies of your posts over the enemy armies. That would defeat them instantly.

[symple19]

I'd vote for air dropping printed copies of your posts over the enemy armies. That would defeat them instantly.

:lmao:lmao:lmao

[coyotes_geek]

No need to worry. Our nation's professional athletes are sufficiently armed to repel any invasion.

[Blake]

if anyone attacks us, I'm sure we have enough nukes to drop on them during the attack.

[Pero]

The only Nations that is able to invade would be China, and Russia

No they aren't.

[MiamiHeat]

We don't need to be invaded, and that would be a terrible plan.

Just nuke us to holy hell and hope that you weaken us before we nuke you for invading us.

Any invasion would be useless, because the offending nation/s would be warned to get the fuck out or be nuked.

If they don't leave immediately, bye bye Beijing and Moscow. The US has tens of thousands of stockpiled nukes and would be very easy to slap them on ICBM's and other methods to deliver them.

[CosmicCowboy]

"You cannot invade the mainland United States.
There would be a rifle behind every blade of grass."

- Admiral Isoroku Yamamoto
(Japanese Navy)

[RandomGuy]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fortress_America

I have this game still.

A conventional war of invasion on the US would not be possible.

Setting aside the US Navy for a moment, there are far too many people in the US to effectively control, and far too many small arms.

Consider the effectiveness of partisan action in the USSR and France during the German occupation and multiply that several times over.

Then add to that the fact that any invading force would have to contend with a nightmarish logistics scenario.

For a hostile power or combination of powers to invade the US, a nation of over 300,000,000 people would require an invading army of approximately 60,000,000 troops given standard counter-insurgency ratios, AFTER conventional operations concluded.

China or India could singly have the manpower if they drafted enough trigger pullers, but again, logistics would preclude such an invasion force, as it would require a vast percentage of their GDP.

The only real possibility would be if every nation on the planet cooperated against the US, and even then, it would still be a stretch.

[baseline bum]

"You cannot invade the mainland United States.
There would be a rifle behind every blade of grass."

- Admiral Isoroku Yamamoto
(Japanese Navy)

You have to wonder if all those rifles would be turned to looting stores and shit so people could get themselves a plasma screen for the bathroom though.

[clambake]

the only invasion would occur from within.

[CosmicCowboy]

http://guns.yfa1.ru/eng/image/AR15_A3_Tactical_Carbine.jpg


Im thinking about getting this AR 15

Oh please.

Not another idiot with an AR.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

You have to wonder if all those rifles would be turned to looting stores and shit so people could get themselves a plasma screen for the bathroom though.



Best post in the thread. The only way the US could successfully be invaded is if it deteriorated from within.

[FalleNxWiZarDx]

the only invasion would occur from within.


interesting point man...

if we get invaded (or a crisis within our nation occurs) I'm afraid that people will be looting and alot of people will be fighting over food.....

Chaos in the streets, with no police men around......

[Frenzy]

some one wants america?

[Pero]

If they don't leave immediately, bye bye Beijing and Moscow. The US has tens of thousands of stockpiled nukes and would be very easy to slap them on ICBM's and other methods to deliver them.

Yes and they can do the same to you. MAD.

[FalleNxWiZarDx]

Oh please.

Not another idiot with an AR.

wtf?

what other guns do you recommend??

The AR 15 will not be the only gun, but probably the main gun

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

If any 2 of the 3 (Russia, US, China) ever got in a war, it would eventually turn into World War III and would probably be the end of mankind.

[CosmicCowboy]

You like it why?

Because it looks "cool"?

Makes you feel like a real man buying such a "manly" gun?

:lmao

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

Seriously though, wtf is the point in buying that gun? Once I turn 21 I'm gonna buy a basic pistol of some sort to keep in my car, idk why anyone would ever need an automatic weapon like that. You've got bigger problems if you're ever in a situation that requires an automatic weapon.

[CosmicCowboy]

wtf?

what other guns do you recommend??

The AR 15 will not be the only gun, but probably the main gun

If you have never owned/shot a gun but want to buy something for home defense this is what you need.

http://www.remington.com/~/media/Images/Firearms/Shotguns/Model-1100-Tac-4/1100tac4-prod.ashx?w=570&bc=ffffff

[FalleNxWiZarDx]

You like it why?

Because it looks "cool"?

Makes you feel like a real man buying such a "manly" gun?

:lmao

UM, because the Military uses it?

its the best option?

I rather have a AR 15 then a AK from Distance

[phyzik]

If you have never owned/shot a gun but want to buy something for home defense this is what you need.

http://www.remington.com/~/media/Images/Firearms/Shotguns/Model-1100-Tac-4/1100tac4-prod.ashx?w=570&bc=ffffff

If its just for home defense, no point in spending $1000 on a semi-auto Remington.

Mossberg has several shotguns under $300 and they are pretty decent.

The Mossberg Maverick sells for $169 at Academy. Get a pump action for home defense. The sound of a shotgun being pumped is unmistakable and is usually enough to scare off any would be criminals.
http://www.academy.com/images/products/400/0350/0350-01883-5002-p1.jpg

And I think having just Texas being invaded would probably be too much for most country's, let alone trying to take the entire USA. I'd be willing to bet there are more guns owned than there are cars owned in Texas.

[FalleNxWiZarDx]

Seriously though, wtf is the point in buying that gun? Once I turn 21 I'm gonna buy a basic pistol of some sort to keep in my car, idk why anyone would ever need an automatic weapon like that. You've got bigger problems if you're ever in a situation that requires an automatic weapon.

I can understand why people would think why anyone would need a gun like the AR 15....

I dont plan to use it, and I pray to god I wont have to...

We live in dangerous times right now, and in any moment I feel like a World War will be inevitable...
Call me crazy, I dont care...

I rather be prepared, then sorry

As far as home defense goes, yea Ill have a Handgun


sry for the lame typing.... im VIA my blackberry

[CosmicCowboy]

UM, because the Military uses it?

its the best option?

I rather have a AR 15 then a AK from Distance

If you want distance you don't want an AR or an AK. Get a good bolt rifle with good optics. I've got rifles I could kill you with before you got within 1/4 mile of me with your AR.

BTW, the US military went with the .223 platform in Vietnam mainly because the pussy draftees were scared of the .30 caliber rounds that had been standard before Nam.

[bus driver]

http://guns.yfa1.ru/eng/image/AR15_A3_Tactical_Carbine.jpg


Im thinking about getting this AR 15

dont know about the rest of you all but i have guns and about to have 2 of these......just wont have alot of ammo so i will need to be selective :wakeup

but i am good!

[Geezerballer]

the only invasion would occur from within.

I think the scenario described in the book "One Second After" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One_Second_After is much more likely. Basically a surprise nuke detonated in the atmosphere causes an electromagnetic pulse (EMP) that takes out every electrical device including vehicles manufactured after the late 60's.

Our society would dissolve into a primitive, tribal culture in a matter of weeks. After a few months of this, we'd welcome the "relief efforts" from China delivered by their Military (like ours did in Haiti) and conclusively proving who did it would be nearly impossible.

[FalleNxWiZarDx]

dont know about the rest of you all but i have guns and about to have 2 of these......just wont have alot of ammo so i will need to be selective :wakeup

but i am good!

glad to hear your getting the AR15 aswell...

Im not to good with guns just yet, but I wanted to ask you.... what kind of optics are you getting?

whats good for LONG Distance, and whats good for Close Combat ?

[CosmicCowboy]

glad to hear your getting the AR15 aswell...

Im not to good with guns just yet, but I wanted to ask you.... what kind of optics are you getting?

whats good for LONG Distance, and whats good for Close Combat ?

Long distance...bolt action, good optics, lots of good guns and calibers but get something that can shoot at least 150 grain bullets....308 would be a good start for a rookie...doesn't kick too bad and lots of bullet choices.

Short distance...tactical 12 gauge shotgun.

[clambake]

I think the scenario described in the book "One Second After" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One_Second_After is much more likely. Basically a surprise nuke detonated in the atmosphere causes an electromagnetic pulse (EMP) that takes out every electrical device including vehicles manufactured after the late 60's.

Our society would dissolve into a primitive, tribal culture in a matter of weeks. After a few months of this, we'd welcome the "relief efforts" from China delivered by their Military (like ours did in Haiti) and conclusively proving who did it would be nearly impossible.

that would require several nukes.....that would be seen with launch detection...that would trigger return.

[Geezerballer]

that would require several nukes.....that would be seen with launch detection...that would trigger return.

From the article: "Toward the end of the novel, it is revealed that the EMP was generated by three nuclear warheads launched from container ships. One was launched from the Gulf of Mexico off the coast of the United States and detonated in space over the states of "Utah, Kansas, and Ohio." The container ship was sunk by an explosion immediately after the missile launch, and no indication remained of who was responsible for the attacks. The other two weapons were detonated over Russia and near Japan and Korea."

[jcrod]

If you have never owned/shot a gun but want to buy something for home defense this is what you need.

http://www.remington.com/~/media/Images/Firearms/Shotguns/Model-1100-Tac-4/1100tac4-prod.ashx?w=570&bc=ffffff


If its just for home defense, no point in spending $1000 on a semi-auto Remington.

Mossberg has several shotguns under $300 and they are pretty decent.

The Mossberg Maverick sells for $169 at Academy. Get a pump action for home defense. The sound of a shotgun being pumped is unmistakable and is usually enough to scare off any would be criminals.http://www.academy.com/images/products/400/0350/0350-01883-5002-p1.jpg

And I think having just Texas being invaded would probably be too much for most country's, let alone trying to take the entire USA. I'd be willing to bet there are more guns owned than there are cars owned in Texas.


:tu This is especially true if you have a wife. The sound and not having to worry about aiming is great, very intimidating.

[Spurminator]

:tu This is especially true if you have a wife. The sound and not having to worry about aiming is great, very intimidating.

I agree, I use this tactic on my wife all the time. Especially when dinner is late. Don't even have to leave the couch.

[CosmicCowboy]

I agree, I use this tactic on my wife all the time. Especially when dinner is late. Don't even have to leave the couch.

:lmao

[Sec24Row7]

A mainland invasion of the united states would be an absolute meat grinder...

First of all... Our MILITARY has proven that any large collection of Armor is suicide when facing our air power...

Secondly... without large armor divisions... it would be IMPOSSIBLE to make our population submit...

Machine guns... mortars.... RPG's are "pitched battle" type weapons and these are what we face in the insurgencies in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Here you would face something FAR FAR deadlier... the recreational shooter... MILLIONS and MILLIONS of people self trained with the ability to place precise shots in an area the size of a paper plate out to 500 yards....

Just forget it...

And you thought the world was scared of us when Bush was in power... you break the country down enough where the Country's voting class considers the average US gun owner a Hero and we are going back to Victorian age Imperialism after we kick the shit out of whoever invaded us.

[tp2021]

interesting point man...

if we get invaded (or a crisis within our nation occurs) I'm afraid that people will be looting and alot of people will be fighting over food.....

Chaos in the streets, with no police men around......

I'm pretty sure the exact moment we find out we are being invaded, nobody will be looting anything as long as there are still motherfuckers running around alive. I guarantee you, nobody would rather have a plasma than get to defend their own shit by blowing motherfuckers away left and right with no consequence other than moral.

besides, we can loot after they're dead.

[tp2021]

a mainland invasion of the united states would be an absolute meat grinder...

First of all... Our military has proven that any large collection of armor is suicide when facing our air power...

Secondly... Without large armor divisions... It would be impossible to make our population submit...

Machine guns... Mortars.... Rpg's are "pitched battle" type weapons and these are what we face in the insurgencies in iraq and afghanistan.

Here you would face something far far deadlier... The recreational shooter... Millions and millions of people self trained with the ability to place precise shots in an area the size of a paper plate out to 500 yards....

Just forget it...

And you thought the world was scared of us when bush was in power... You break the country down enough where the country's voting class considers the average us gun owner a hero and we are going back to victorian age imperialism after we kick the shit out of whoever invaded us.

amurrrica!

Fuckkkk yeahhhh!!!

[jcrod]

I agree, I use this tactic on my wife all the time. Especially when dinner is late. Don't even have to leave the couch.

:rollin

[CubanSucks]

Freedom isn't free. There's a hefty fuckin fee. If you don't put in yer buck 0 five who will? Just a little piece of my wisdom I felt like sharing

[Bukefal]

No one is going to invade you. Why do you think that? You yourself dont have to buy a gun and you dont have to defend your home from some countries :)

Besides, war nowadays are fought in a different way and for a different way.

The only threat the USA can have are maybe terrorist attacks.

And if you speak about protecting yourself from some criminal individuals, rather than countries in war, well, that's another thing. Just get a gun if you would feel better. I cant imagine why you would want guns in your house though.

[symple19]

amurrrica!

Fuckkkk yeahhhh!!!


Freedom isn't free. There's a hefty fuckin fee. If you don't put in yer buck 0 five who will? Just a little piece of my wisdom I felt like sharing

Excellent references gentleman :makemyday:tu

sWS-FoXbjVI


F5AuNrhpTBg

[Bender]

I used to have a bushmaster ar-15, but had to sell it when I needed money. Great fun to shoot. very reliable, always worked. Now I have a cheapo Saiga, but it's a piece of junk.

No shotgun, but it's on my list. Have plenty of other rifles, and pistols.

guess I'm ready for any SHTF scenario.

[jack sommerset]

What country ever would attack the USA? It's either suicide for them or suicide for the planet.

[Stringer_Bell]

If the Japs were too scared to do it, what makes you think the Chinamen in business suits have the balls to step on OUR land and try to take OUR shit? Nope, however...

We'd be totally fine, and I think it'd be awesome for national unity.

[Big P]

Oh please.

Not another idiot with an AR.

Explain? What does being an idiot have to do with owning an AR?

To the OP if you want real info on the AR platform & dont want to liten to uninformed people, try ar15.com.

You dont have to buy a bolt rifle to get a 308...plenty of .308's available in the AR platform.

Lots of people are getting into the AR platfrom for hunting, home defense, target practice & 3 gun competitions plus its highly customizable to your individual needs & situations

The people here in the US that dont want you to have the "evil black rifle"
are the people you have to worry about. Without that rifle or the Springfield M1 & a few others, there would be no FREE AMERICA.

[The Reckoning]

i fired an AR a couple of times...didnt like it. the whole aiming system and whatnot is completely different from a conventional rifle.

ill stick to my SKS, which is the most dependable weapon ive used.

[Big P]

The aiming system? You mean the front & rear sights?

[Bender]

I had an EOTech holosight on the Bushmaster AR I used to have. What a great sight.

Everyone should have an AR. Get 'em while you still can.

Everyone that's not a psycho that is.

[lefty]

http://yepyep.gibbs12.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/08/dumbass.jpg

[Pero]

:lmao:lmao:lmao

[boutons_deux]

"Mossberg Maverick sells for $169 at Academy"

they ain't got none, ain't none in San Antonio, ain't none at Academy distribution center. Ain't gonna be none for 30+ days. Didn't have any Mossberg 500s, either.

The gun guy told me people are using their tax refunds to buy up the cheap Home Defense stuff since the NRA told them Magic Negro was gonna take all their guns away. Guns and ammo ain't about the 2nd amendment, it's all about the $$$.

[Big P]

I had an EOTech holosight on the Bushmaster AR I used to have. What a great sight.

Everyone should have an AR. Get 'em while you still can.

Everyone that's not a psycho that is.

I have that seteup...Bushmaster/Eothech that is..

[Cant_Be_Faded]

http://guns.yfa1.ru/eng/image/AR15_A3_Tactical_Carbine.jpg


Im thinking about getting this AR 15

And splittin' mothafuckas by tha seams
my granddaddy mista A R Fifteen
said he was my only family
shoot straight
and please don't jam me

[Sense]

Wow.... I feel stupid after reading the OP

[NuGGeTs-FaN]

America seems to be doing a good enough job of destroying itself from the inside out, why would anyone invade it?

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

We are in 2 Conflicts right now, about to start another any moment now (Iran)

Our military is in about 15 other countries, and is at the limit of there manpower...

Soooo if we was to get invaded it would be us citizens that would have to defend our homeland.

Do you think we are up to the task??

Will we get trained atleast?

What would you do?

Do you have any guns?

Should I buy a gun?

What kind of GUN should I get?


It would be very hard for any Nation to invade us........

The only Nations that is able to invade would be China, and Russia

:lmao

You, sir, are either 11yo, or a simpleton, or maybe clinically paranoid.

The US has a little thing called a NUCLEAR ARSENAL, not to mention the fact that you spend 10x more money on defence every year than any other country on the planet.


http://guns.yfa1.ru/eng/image/AR15_A3_Tactical_Carbine.jpg

Im thinking about getting this AR 15

Please do NOT buy this. It will not end well. :nope

[Sisk]

Yes and they can do the same to you. MAD.

It took a full page for someone to bring up MAD..

Thank you for being intelligent

[Sisk]

Also, lefty.. what you have that picture saved as is perfect

I just bought an XD 40 service for recreational use/home defense.. shotgun is next on the list

[Bukefal]

http://yepyep.gibbs12.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/08/dumbass.jpg

:rollin this is funny shit

[MB20]

Invading USA? lol

Not even aliens can do it. Don´t you watch movies?

[MannyIsGod]

Invading USA? lol

Not even aliens can do it. Don´t you watch movies?

:lmao

[EmptyMan]

Please do NOT buy this. It will not end well.

:sleep

[EmptyMan]

Seriously though, wtf is the point in buying that gun? Once I turn 21 I'm gonna buy a basic pistol of some sort to keep in my car, idk why anyone would ever need an automatic weapon like that. You've got bigger problems if you're ever in a situation that requires an automatic weapon.


It's not an automatic, genius.

[Big P]

So much fail in this thread.

[EmptyMan]

You like it why?

Because it looks "cool"?

Makes you feel like a real man buying such a "manly" gun?

:lmao

Or because it is a great platform for what it is made for and is easily customized.

[EmptyMan]

If you want distance you don't want an AR or an AK. Get a good bolt rifle with good optics. I've got rifles I could kill you with before you got within 1/4 mile of me with your AR.

BTW, the US military went with the .223 platform in Vietnam mainly because the pussy draftees were scared of the .30 caliber rounds that had been standard before Nam.

You can customize an AR to be long-range. Not everyone uses them with banana clips and ski masks braaaaaah.

[CosmicCowboy]

Explain? What does being an idiot have to do with owning an AR?

To the OP if you want real info on the AR platform & dont want to liten to uninformed people, try ar15.com.

You dont have to buy a bolt rifle to get a 308...plenty of .308's available in the AR platform.

Lots of people are getting into the AR platfrom for hunting, home defense, target practice & 3 gun competitions plus its highly customizable to your individual needs & situations

The people here in the US that dont want you to have the "evil black rifle"
are the people you have to worry about. Without that rifle or the Springfield M1 & a few others, there would be no FREE AMERICA.

Dude, I'm hardly uninformed. I've owned and shot AR's AK's and SKS's both semi and select fire plus dozens of other guns. The fact is, this is a guy that wants to buy an AR because it looks cool. I made a lot of pocket change back in the 90's building up AR's with new aftermarket lowers and surplus parts and selling them to goobers like the OP.

Yes, you can get AR's in .308 and after spending a couple of thousand dollars you can almost get them to shoot as accurately as a good bolt action rifle that costs 1/4 the price.

If the AR is such a good long range rifle why is the military using Remington 700's as their go to unit sniper rifle?

[Big P]

Dude, I'm hardly uninformed. I've owned and shot AR's AK's and SKS's both semi and select fire plus dozens of other guns. The fact is, this is a guy that wants to buy an AR because it looks cool. I made a lot of pocket change back in the 90's building up AR's with new aftermarket lowers and surplus parts and selling them to goobers like the OP.

Yes, you can get AR's in .308 and after spending a couple of thousand dollars you can almost get them to shoot as accurately as a good bolt action rifle that costs 1/4 the price.

If the AR is such a good long range rifle why is the military using Remington 700's as their go to unit sniper rifle?

I did not see the OP say that he wanted an AR because of the way it looks...& you are proud that you were able to sell some home built AR's to "goobers" that usually requires a license..I take it you have your ffl or ClassIII?

You don't have to spend "a couple of thousand" to get an AR in .308..on the low end there is DPMS which you can get for about $1,000. Bushmaster just came out with a 308 that runs $1300

The military is using a variation of the Rem 700...the M40A3...pretty much everything is upgraded beyod your run of the mill 700...not to mention that the US is starting to provide AR's in .308. in Iraq & Afghanistan.

There is a lot of misinformation here.

[symple19]

So much fail in this thread.

this

[CosmicCowboy]

You don't have to spend "a couple of thousand" to get an AR in .308..on the low end there is DPMS which you can get for about $1,000. Bushmaster just came out with a 308 that runs $1300

Suggested retail on the bushmaster is $1825 and that's with a crap 6# single stage trigger and without a match barrel. Essentially a 2MOA rifle. Thats OK for an assault rifle but sucks if you are talking about really ACCURATE rifles.

[nkdlunch]

USA is already being invaded by Mexicans and other latin americans. Nothing they can do about it. Tried to build a wall but looks like that effort is failing.

I don't see why ppl are blasting the OP.

China is also invading USA with their money. in 10 years China will own every metropolitan area in the USA. USA won't be able to fart without China's approval.

[CosmicCowboy]

I did not see the OP say that he wanted an AR because of the way it looks...& you are proud that you were able to sell some home built AR's to "goobers" that usually requires a license..I take it you have your ffl or ClassIII?

You don't have to spend "a couple of thousand" to get an AR in .308..on the low end there is DPMS which you can get for about $1,000. Bushmaster just came out with a 308 that runs $1300

The military is using a variation of the Rem 700...the M40A3...pretty much everything is upgraded beyod your run of the mill 700...not to mention that the US is starting to provide AR's in .308. in Iraq & Afghanistan.

There is a lot of misinformation here.

[Big P]

Sorry for the links.

Here's the price on the .308 straight from Bushmaster.

http://www.bushmaster.com/catalog-308ORC-Rifle-BD200200.asp

Heres a review from a gunshop owner.

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=2&f=28&t=185862

Not sure where you are getting your info from, but that 2nd link to ar15.com I highly recommend. Their general discussion section is like the club on steroids.

[CosmicCowboy]

OK, first item...You don't need a FFL to build AR's...The only registered part of an AR is the lower receiver. You buy the lower from a FFL. You then assemble the rifle from the parts you want to use. After that, it works just like any other sale from one individual to another.

Already addressed the accuracy issue. Trying to make an AR platform into an "almost" 1/4MOA sniper rifle is technically possible but extremely impractical.

Glad the military is moving back to the .308 now that it is available in the AR platform. IMHO it's a much better round than the 5.56.

[Big P]

If you are going to build rifles for yourself without the intention of selling them, you are correct, you get the lower shipped from or thru a ffl, however, if you are buying lowers from ffl's & then building rifles for the purpose of selling them for a profit, that is illegal & the ATF is cracking down hard on people that do this stuff, ie. all the undercover ATF agents at the local gunshows.

You already addressed the accuracy issue? Did you look at the second link with the shooting review for this particular Bushmaster? Granted this is not a top of the line semi auto 308, nor is it a scientific test, but the accuracy in the review shows to be pretty damn good out of the box...the reviewer said that if match ammo & better glass, he could reach SUB MOA. It all depends on what you want to spend.

The military is not moving back to the .308 as the primary rifle round. They are starting to issue rifles to Squad Designated Marksman in .308(better to reach out & touch someone in the mountains in Afghanistan). Eventually there will be a 308 or two in each squad. The 5.56 is still the primary weapon caliber, althought they are looking at replacement for the current M855 ammo.

[CosmicCowboy]

If you are going to build rifles for yourself without the intention of selling them, you are correct, you get the lower shipped from or thru a ffl, however, if you are buying lowers from ffl's & then building rifles for the purpose of selling them for a profit, that is illegal & the ATF is cracking down hard on people that do this stuff, ie. all the undercover ATF agents at the local gunshows.

The ATF may be scaring people but as of now it is still legal for one individual to sell a rifle to another individual whether they made a profit or not. The lower receiver is still the only registered component on an AR.

You already addressed the accuracy issue? Did you look at the second link with the shooting review for this particular Bushmaster? Granted this is not a top of the line semi auto 308, nor is it a scientific test, but the accuracy in the review shows to be pretty damn good out of the box...the reviewer said that if match ammo & better glass, he could reach SUB MOA. It all depends on what you want to spend.

Sure, 1MOA is good for a short barreled semi-auto. No argument there.

Spend the same money on a bolt action however and you can get in the 1/4MOA range. THAT'S what I consider accurate.

The military is not moving back to the .308 as the primary rifle round. They are starting to issue rifles to Squad Designated Marksman in .308(better to reach out & touch someone in the mountains in Afghanistan). Eventually there will be a 308 or two in each squad. The 5.56 is still the primary weapon caliber, althought they are looking at replacement for the current M855 ammo.

Similar to the "unofficial" use of M1 Garrand's by some over the years instead of the issue AR's...

[Big P]

Yes, I said individual sales are legal, I can sell my gun to you face to face & make a profit, we dont even have to use an ffl, although it would be pretty stupid to sell a weapon to someone without transferring it to them thru an ffl.

Now if I want to go & buy 10 lowers, sure I can go do that, IF my intentions are not to sell them, they will be my 10 personal rifles...now if I go and buy 10 lowers & then build them out & start selling them out of my house, sorry thats illegal, you need a license to be a gun dealer.

So would you rather our soldiers have a bolt action rifle 308 or a 308 that can put 20 rounds accurately very qiuickly, just for what you say is a 1/4 moa...you make it sound like a AR in 308 couldn't hit the side of a barn...we are not talking sniper rifles here..the difference on moa between a bolt action or a semi auto 308 is minimal...moa or sub moa the bad guy is going down & I would rather have an extra 15 bullets in my mag ready to go rather than have to reload after 5 or so shots. There are some short barrel 308's out there, but alot are using 18 & 20 in.

Show me where our soldiers are still use or are issued Garrands.

Just curious where you were getting your pricing info from? You said $1,800 + thats alot more than the $1,300 or so that Bushmaster said it retails for. Not to mention that most of the time you are not going to pay msrp...my rifle listed at $1,800, I paid $1,380 with tax & transfer.

[CosmicCowboy]

Hey, I'm glad you are happy with your bushmaster and they are nice guns for the application they were designed for.

I never said I wanted our soldiers to use bolt action rifles. I'm not sure where you got that.

I'm not sure why we are even beating this dead horse.

You made this statement a couple of pages back...


You can customize an AR to be long-range. Not everyone uses them with banana clips and ski masks braaaaaah.

When I proved I knew what I was talking about and that by the very nature of their design they are not made for long range shooting (which by it's very definition is sub MOA accuracy) it then turned into well, they are KINDA accurate...uh huh. They are.

Lets give this a rest.

[Big P]

Sorry if you got upset or offended CC, I thought we were just having a normal discussion, it's just that there are a lot of ill informed people (not saying you are one of them), & the spreading of misinformation (not saying you did) about AR's gives people this horrble image of AR's, which in turn causes people to think they have the right to decide what IF any weapons another person can possess. We still live in America right? The Second Amendment and all?

[CosmicCowboy]

Sorry if you got upset or offended CC, I thought we were just having a normal discussion, it's just that there are a lot of ill informed people (not saying you are one of them), & the spreading of misinformation (not saying you did) about AR's gives people this horrble image of AR's, which in turn causes people to think they have the right to decide what IF any weapons another person can possess. We still live in America right? The Second Amendment and all?

:tu

Totally agree on all counts. AR's are fun to shoot and the ammo is still reasonably cheap to shoot. ( but unfortunately not like when I bought my first one and was getting 1600 round cases of FMJ for $80:depressed)

That was my go to gun for calling coyotes or headlighting/whacking hogs at night, but it stayed home when it was time to make 500 yard shots on prairie dogs.

[Big P]

I hear you... I wish I could get 1600 rounds for $80, I'm certain we will never see any prices like that ever again, if you buy in bulk, 1k of ammo with reloadable brass is gonna run anywhere for $300 to $500 depending on make & manufacturer...decent ammo is running anywhere from .33 to .50 a round..its depressing... I use my AR for coyote/hog hunting as well & it has served me well.

[MiamiHeat]

http://www.2dayblog.com/images/2008/january/hellokitty_ar15assault_2.jpg

http://www.2dayblog.com/images/2008/january/hellokitty_ar15assault_1.jpg

http://secretsocietynyc.files.wordpress.com/2008/01/hello-kitty-ar-15-rifle-2.jpg

[symple19]

China is also invading USA with their money. in 10 years China will own every metropolitan area in the USA. USA won't be able to fart without China's approval.

Hmmm, just like Japan in the late 80s early 90s right?

[symple19]

http://www.2dayblog.com/images/2008/january/hellokitty_ar15assault_2.jpg

http://www.2dayblog.com/images/2008/january/hellokitty_ar15assault_1.jpg

http://secretsocietynyc.files.wordpress.com/2008/01/hello-kitty-ar-15-rifle-2.jpg

sweet :lol

[bus driver]

glad to hear your getting the AR15 aswell...

Im not to good with guns just yet, but I wanted to ask you.... what kind of optics are you getting?

whats good for LONG Distance, and whats good for Close Combat ?

cant really say...my brother has the chance to buy them for about 700 each, so i guess whatever they are selling. i never shot one so dont know much about them only that my brother could get them. i figure this is a good chance to get one. i have only fired hand guns, shotguns and a SKS.

[SpursNextRomanEmpire]

Interesting idea, it would probably cause a lot of national unity and pride, lets be honest

[Pero]

LMAO Spurs the next Roman empire... I guess it's fitting since the Roman empire collapsed after a period of greatness and the Spurs now seem to be on their way out too. And Rome had a crazy emperor, Pop might be crazy too. :lol

[Sisk]

USA is already being invaded by Mexicans and other latin americans. Nothing they can do about it. Tried to build a wall but looks like that effort is failing.