Mason- still a good piece

[poop]

went to last nights game, Fin got lots of minutes but missed all his shots, and did nothing really...the guy was good even a couple years ago but as we all know hes done as an NBA player. meanwhile mason played for a bout one minute, just came in and hit a long range 3 then got benched again. although hes hardly a better defender than Fin, i think he is the best pure shooter on the team...last night (before the end when manu went off) guys were bricking 3's left and right...i know mason would have nailed some of those.
obviously he is just a specialist peice and should be used sparingly (and NOT as a pg), but
IMO Fin and bogans should warm the bench and Mason should get both of their minutes. he is the best pure shooter on this team period.

[antgomez2009]

That is why your name is poop!

Finley may be done, but pop is testing to see if he has it in him still, alah Manu Ginobili, im sure you were one of the few that were saying he was done, like your saying about Finley now!!

Mason is good, but Bogans defense is better! Pop has to choose, Bogans for D or Mason for possible 3!!!!!

Jefferson is strictly playing the three now, i think thats a good move by pop!
Mason is streaky, like any other shooter! i think your right about using him sparingly, but to take Bogans and Fin's minutes, he has to earn it, which im sure he just might if Finley never gets it going. Mason does mess up, def. not a good PG, sometimes he can barley dump the pass to Duncan or one of the low posts! Mason D is not that good either! you can tell he is just a shooter, his feet seem set in the ground at all times!

[DesignatedT]

mason bogans and finley are all shitty. pop is seeing what he can get out of finley... because mason is obviously not working out. yeah he can hit a fucking 3 ball... hes useless in every other aspect of the game... plus isnt he shooting under 40% from three this year? if he cant hit then there is no reason he should be on the floor (see matt bonner)

[poop]

That is why your name is poop!

Finley may be done, but pop is testing to see if he has it in him still, alah Manu Ginobili, im sure you were one of the few that were saying he was done, like your saying about Finley now!!

Mason is good, but Bogans defense is better! Pop has to choose, Bogans for D or Mason for possible 3!!!!!

Jefferson is strictly playing the three now, i think thats a good move by pop!
Mason is streaky, like any other shooter! i think your right about using him sparingly, but to take Bogans and Fin's minutes, he has to earn it, which im sure he just might if Finley never gets it going. Mason does mess up, def. not a good PG, sometimes he can barley dump the pass to Duncan or one of the low posts! Mason D is not that good either! you can tell he is just a shooter, his feet seem set in the ground at all times!

ugh, wtf??

i NEVER said that about Manu, quite the opposite actually, hes and invaluable part of this team, is irreplaceable and one of the few who brings it every game.

also,based on what you have said, you are a complete idiot (or just trolling)

[HarlemHeat37]

Our defense is actually better when Mason is on the floor and worse when Bogans is on the floor..so if Pop is picking Bogans for his "defense", then that's laughable..

Bogans has by far the worst +/- on the team..

I do agree that Mason, Finley and Bogans are all mediocre players..it's obvious that Finley and Bogans have a lot more room for error with Pop though..

[MaNu4Tres]

Our defense is actually better when Mason is on the floor and worse when Bogans is on the floor..so if Pop is picking Bogans for his "defense", then that's laughable..

Bogans has by far the worst +/- on the team..

I do agree that Mason, Finley and Bogans are all mediocre players..it's obvious that Finley and Bogans have a lot more room for error with Pop though..


Wouldn't it be nice if we had Salmons taking all the minutes from those three stooges. Not to mention Tyrus Thomas coming off the bench with Blair...:depressed

[benefactor]

Wouldn't it be nice if we had Salmons taking all the minutes from those three stooges. Not to mention Tyrus Thomas coming off the bench with Blair...:depressed
:bang

[TJastal]

Roger's defense is underrated by many on this board. I'd say overall Roger's shooting > Bogans' defense.

Roger is by far the better ball handler and playmaker and that's why he should be playing more.

Bogans is always a threat to travel or double dribble every time he puts it on the floor.

[DesignatedT]

Our defense is actually better when Mason is on the floor and worse when Bogans is on the floor..so if Pop is picking Bogans for his "defense", then that's laughable..

Bogans has by far the worst +/- on the team..

I do agree that Mason, Finley and Bogans are all mediocre players..it's obvious that Finley and Bogans have a lot more room for error with Pop though..

lol bogans defense is better than masons. i dont care what the +/- is. no way you can argue that masons defense is anywhere near "average". his defense is flat out terrible.

but then masons obviously is a much better offensive player... no doubt about that... even though bogans is shooting a better % from 3...? i dont see where mason has earned any pt.

[MaNu4Tres]

lol bogans defense is better than masons. i dont care what the +/- is. no way you can argue that masons defense is anywhere near "average". his defense is flat out terrible.

I agree.

Saying Mason has better defense because of his plus and minus is like saying Bonner was the best defensive player on our team last year.

[DesignatedT]

Wouldn't it be nice if we had Salmons taking all the minutes from those three stooges. Not to mention Tyrus Thomas coming off the bench with Blair...:depressed

a rotation of parker manu hill salmons and rj would be perfect with duncan dyess thomas and blair down low. but nope

[DesignatedT]

let me clear up that i still think bogans sucks balls. i just dont see what mason has done this year to earn any respect or playing time.... this isnt last year and he isnt playing like he did last year.

[TJastal]

lol bogans defense is better than masons. i dont care what the +/- is. no way you can argue that masons defense is anywhere near "average". his defense is flat out terrible.

but then masons obviously is a much better offensive player... no doubt about that... even though bogans is shooting a better % from 3...? i dont see where mason has earned any pt.

Easy to shoot well when your role is established and consistent, which Bogans has had the benefit of.

Remember when Bogans was getting spotty minutes in pre-season, what did he shoot, like 1-19?

RMJ shot 45% last year, and would probably be doing it again this year with a consistent role and minutes.

[HarlemHeat37]

I agree that Bogans' D is better than Mason's..

Bogans is an average man defender and occasionally an above average team defender..he's usually average in all facets of defense..

Mason is a below average man defender and occasionally an average team defender..I would say an all-around below average defender and sometimes just poor..

The question is whether Bogans' defense means more to the Spurs than Mason's offense does..now at first glance, you'll see that Bogans is shooting a better % from 3s by a few percentage points..this actually puts it in Mason's favor though, they shouldn't be so close..Mason's eFG% off jump shots is actually better than Bogans' this season, so he doesn't really have anything in his favor..

Mason has barely had a chance to get in a rhythm this season with his minutes being jerked around and it's clearly shown with the big drop off from last season's shooting %..he shoots 2.5 more times than Bogans does per game..68% of Mason's jump shots are assisted, while 96% of Bogans' jump shots are assisted, so he pretty much has no ability to create his own shot(not that we didn't know this)..

Bogans barely shoots better than Mason despite having no responsibility to create his own shot and shooting 2.5 less per game..

My point is that the stats show that the Spurs play better defense when Mason on the floor..while I don't agree that Mason is a better defender than Bogans, he isn't, but my point is that Mason's offense is more valuable to the Spurs than Bogans' D is IMO..Bogans' D literally has no positive impact on the Spurs..if they replaced him with almost any other NBA player, even a defensive liability like Mason, it wouldn't make a negative difference IMO..

I would have obviously preferred a proven guy like Salmons instead, but it's too late for that..I would obviously rather an athletic guy like Hairston get a shot, but that won't happen either..

[DesignatedT]

Easy to shoot well when your role is established and consistent, which Bogans has had the benefit of.

Remember when Bogans was getting spotty minutes in pre-season, what did he shoot, like 1-19?

RMJ shot 45% last year, and would probably be doing it again this year with a consistent role and minutes.

bogans minutes have been just as spotty as rogers. and there both averaging the same 20 mpg.

[bdictjames]

I think Mason can be a great piece this year. Contrary to previous years we don't have really good corner shooters. Now that Bonner's banged up, Finley's old, we've lost the deadly accuracy from three-point land. Hill and Jefferson are not outstanding three point shooters, neither is Bogan.

Hopefully when the season ends, everyone, esp. Bonner is healthy. I think we're going to need that offensive firepower.

[DesignatedT]

I agree that Bogans' D is better than Mason's..

Bogans is an average man defender and occasionally an above average team defender..he's usually average in all facets of defense..

Mason is a below average man defender and occasionally an average team defender..I would say an all-around below average defender and sometimes just poor..

The question is whether Bogans' defense means more to the Spurs than Mason's offense does..now at first glance, you'll see that Bogans is shooting a better % from 3s by a few percentage points..this actually puts it in Mason's favor though, they shouldn't be so close..Mason's eFG% off jump shots is actually better than Bogans' this season, so he doesn't really have anything in his favor..

Mason has barely had a chance to get in a rhythm this season with his minutes being jerked around and it's clearly shown with the big drop off from last season's shooting %..he shoots 2.5 more times than Bogans does per game..68% of Mason's jump shots are assisted, while 96% of Bogans' jump shots are assisted, so he pretty much has no ability to create his own shot(not that we didn't know this)..

Bogans barely shoots better than Mason despite having no responsibility to create his own shot and shooting 2.5 less per game..

My point is that the stats show that the Spurs play better defense when Mason on the floor..while I don't agree that Mason is a better defender than Bogans, he isn't, but my point is that Mason's offense is more valuable to the Spurs than Bogans' D is IMO..Bogans' D literally has no positive impact on the Spurs..if they replaced him with almost any other NBA player, even a defensive liability like Mason, it wouldn't make a negative difference IMO..

I would have obviously preferred a proven guy like Salmons instead, but it's too late for that..I would obviously rather an athletic guy like Hairston get a shot, but that won't happen either..

i understand, and honestly they are equally shitty in different aspects, IMO pop just needs to roll with one of them. whoever it may be.. playing 10 players by the end of the 1st quarter last night is just unacceptable. just pick a rotation and go with it and whatever he picks everyone just needs to accept. the argument of bogans-mason-finley can go on forever.

[TD 21]

Pop went with Finley against the Thunder because they have a surplus of length at the wing positions, with Durant, Sefolosha and Green (though he's really a combo forward). Mason is really about 6-4 (listed at 6-5) and doesn't have the length to guard any of these types of players. Finley, while an even worse defender, is at least 6-7 (I don't mean at least in the sense that he might be taller than that, I mean it in the sense that at least he has that going for him), so as long as he can do a half respectable job at keeping those guys (minus Durant, who Finley should never ever be matched up against) in front of him, he has the length, when he contests, to at least make things more difficult on them than Mason.

This has been an ongoing problem for years now: the Spurs don't have anybody to guard these types of players. Rather than addressing it, they continue to throw anything they can think of against the wall and hope it sticks. McDyess, Bonner, Jefferson, Bogans, Finley, Hill, all generally get their chance against these types, but not one is suited to guarding them. Although, Jefferson, specifically against Green, shouldn't be a bad match-up.

[spurspokesman]

:bang

This bogans character should be riding pinewood in the d league. The fo really hit the wall with signing him. Hell even with masons horrible defense I'd still pick him over bogans.

[DesignatedT]

Pop went with Finley against the Thunder because they have a surplus of length at the wing positions, with Durant, Sefolosha and Green (though he's really a combo forward). Mason is really about 6-4 (listed at 6-5) and doesn't have the length to guard any of these types of players. Finley, while an even worse defender, is at least 6-7 (I don't mean at least in the sense that he might be taller than that, I mean it in the sense that at least he has that going for him), so as long as he can do a half respectable job at keeping those guys (minus Durant, who Finley should never ever be matched up against) in front of him, he has the length, when he contests, to at least make things more difficult on them than Mason.

This has been an ongoing problem for years now: the Spurs don't have anybody to guard these types of players. Rather than addressing it, they continue to throw anything they can think of against the wall and hope it sticks. McDyess, Bonner, Jefferson, Bogans, Finley, Hill, all generally get their chance against these types, but not one is suited to guarding them. Although, Jefferson, specifically against Green, shouldn't be a bad match-up.

Trading for RJ this offseason seemed like we were addressing this very issue... but we know now how wrong we were.

[Manu_Ginobili]

went to last nights game, Fin got lots of minutes but missed all his shots, and did nothing really...the guy was good even a couple years ago but as we all know hes done as an NBA player. meanwhile mason played for a bout one minute, just came in and hit a long range 3 then got benched again. although hes hardly a better defender than Fin, i think he is the best pure shooter on the team...last night (before the end when manu went off) guys were bricking 3's left and right...i know mason would have nailed some of those.
obviously he is just a specialist peice and should be used sparingly (and NOT as a pg), but
IMO Fin and bogans should warm the bench and Mason should get both of their minutes. he is the best pure shooter on this team period.

AGREE 100% - I had no idea why Finley played so many minutes? he really hurt the team badly! Mason is the best 3-pt shooter the Spurs have - I see another Br. Barry in him...POP, PLEASE, play Roger and put back Finley on the bench - he is washed out!!! Had Mason played, the Spurs could've won easily by 15-18 pts...Another huge mistake by Popovich...

[TD 21]

Trading for RJ this offseason seemed like we were addressing this very issue... but we know now how wrong we were.

Jefferson isn't that type of player. He's not a prime Marion; he's strictly an SF. In certain match-ups (like against Green, for example), I get playing him at PF, but not against, say, Aldridge (as we saw earlier this season). That's just insane.

What the Spurs need is someone who's about 6-9, long, athletic and capable of guarding long SF's and mobile PF's. In terms of body type, someone like McGuire comes to mind.

[DesignatedT]

Jefferson isn't that type of player. He's not a prime Marion; he's strictly an SF. In certain match-ups (like against Green, for example), I get playing him at PF, but not against, say, Aldridge (as we saw earlier this season). That's just insane.

What the Spurs need is someone who's about 6-9, long, athletic and capable of guarding long SF's and mobile PF's. In terms of body type, someone like McGuire comes to mind.

We understand jefferson isnt that type of player now... when the trade went down many though he would be able to fill that role though. tyrus thomas would be nice right about now though.

[TD 21]

We understand jefferson isnt that type of player now... when the trade went down many though he would be able to fill that role though. tyrus thomas would be nice right about now though.

If you've seen Jefferson at all before this season, then you'd have known he's not that type of player, nor has he ever been. The fact that he can still get up and down and jump well doesn't make him that type of player. As I've explained before, there's difference types of athleticism and Jefferson isn't the type of athlete capable of fulfilling that role. Thomas definitely would be nice right about now and he is the type of athlete capable of fulfilling that role.

[ohmwrecker]

I think Pop is saving Mason for the playoffs. He's going to go "Jaren Jackson" on the Lakers.

[timtonymanu]

i dont know if i was just dreaming or something

but when we signed mason two years ago, were people saying that he was a good defender? i thought i remember hearing that which is why i was excited when we first signed him.

[ElNono]

i dont know if i was just dreaming or something

but when we signed mason two years ago, were people saying that he was a good defender? i thought i remember hearing that which is why i was excited when we first signed him.

Well, Pop thought he could turn RJ into a good defender too... and Bogans into Bruce Bowen... so YMMV...

[SpurNation]

Mason has been lost in the montage of be who you are...wait...be this type of player...wait...now be somebody else...wait...

Exactly what role is expected? To be a superstar that can go out and be a Ginobili...a Parker...a Duncan when called upon at a moments notice?

He's never been that type of player. He was at his best at the beginning of last year through mid season being the player that the Spurs originally brought in to be.

And for the check his getting...he's done a heck of a job when left to be that player. When asked to be a 10 million dollar player...well what would anyone expect...he's not.

[exstatic]

Mason has been pretty horrible for most of the year. Saying he wanted out probably didn't help his rotation quest.

[timtonymanu]

IMO, the Mason we have now is the Mason we should have expected.

People had too much expectations of him after his breakout season last year. He was our 3rd best player when Manu was out.

[DesignatedT]

Mason has been lost in the montage of be who you are...wait...be this type of player...wait...now be somebody else...wait...

Exactly what role is expected? To be a superstar that can go out and be a Ginobili...a Parker...a Duncan when called upon at a moments notice?

He's never been that type of player. He was at his best at the beginning of last year through mid season being the player that the Spurs originally brought in to be.

And for the check his getting...he's done a heck of a job when left to be that player. When asked to be a 10 million dollar player...well what would anyone expect...he's not.


huh? he was so effective last year because he was like top 3 in FGA night in and night out. He was pretty much our go to guy down the stretch... notice all the game winners... is that the roll he needs to have to be effective? our go to scorer?

[SpurNation]

huh? he was so effective last year because he was like top 3 in FGA night in and night out. He was pretty much our go to guy down the stretch... notice all the game winners... is that the roll he needs to have to be effective? our go to scorer?

Yep. He was a go to guy at the end of games when playing the role he was playing. Spot up shooter. Not asked to be a PG. Not expected to be a Ginobili. Not expected to be anything than what he does best.

Enter...you're going to play B/U PG...your going to be expected to drive the lane...your going to be expected to be a lock down defender. Your going to be expected to be something your not.

Is Mason a great player...NO. But one thing is guaranteed...he earns his keep a heck of a lot better than Jefferson.

Go figure that one out. Mason is expected to be more than what he ever has been...yet Jefferson is paid a butt load more to be just as effective.

[SenorSpur]

Don't know if I like the title of this thread - made me chuckle a bit.

As for the "long-in-the-tooth" Findog, he already looks pathetic on most nights. Against a young, quick team like OKC, his flaws are exposed even more. As far as I'm concerned, any minutes he spends on the court are wasted minutes.