Top 5 most one sided NBA trades since 1980

[Goran Dragic]

Seems like a cool thread to make. I said before 1980 because most of us are too young to know about those rip offs involving Kareem and Wilt (no idea what those trades were). I don't want this to turn into a Gasol argument, so make your lists based on how the trade ended up in the long run, not how it appeared at the time. Since the Gasol trade ended up being decent for Memphis (regardless of how it looked at the time), it shouldn't appear on anyone's list or pop up at all in this thread. So basically, if draft picks or draft rights to a certain player are involved, your list should factor in what that pick or those draft rights turned into. With that in mind, have fun.


5. 76ers trade Charles Barkley to the Suns for Jeff Hornacek, Andrew Lang and Tim Perry. Barkley went on to win MVP that season and was a 4-time all star as a Sun. Was the superstar Phoenix needed to get to the finals. They couldn't beat Jordan in the finals but no one could. Philly remained a bottom feeder till the end of the 90's. This would be higher had Barkley lasted longer on Phoenix but Phoenix traded him 4 years after getting him and his career ended on a bitter note in Phoenix.

4. Milwaukee Bucks trade draft rights to Dirk Nowitzki and Pat Garrity to Dallas for draft rights to Robert "Tractor" Traylor. That by itself probably makes this list, but the fact Dallas ended up trading Pat Garrity for a backup point guard in Phoenix named Steve Nash makes it even worse. Dallas turned someone who wound being a fat bust into two players who both won MVP. The trade led to Dallas becoming a perrenial 50+ win team when they previously were a bottom feeder. In all likelihood Dirk will be considered the best Mavericks player ever when he retires. More than 10 years after the trade, Dallas has put together a darkhorse contender still built around Dirk. If Dallas manages to win it all with Dirk this trade moves into the top 3.

3. Houston Rockets trade Moses Malone to Philly for Caldwell Jones and the 3rd overall pick in the 1983 draft. Moses Malone fit in perfectly as the dominant big man to help Erving and Philly win its' 2nd championship in its 1st season with Malone. Houston had the worst record in the NBA the season after trading Malone and wound up getting a player (Rodney McCray) with the 3rd overall pick who went on to have a pedestrian career. Houston basically traded a HoF center for close to nothing.

2. Charlotte Hornets trade draft rights to Kobe Bryant to LA in exchange for Vlade Divac. Vlade only played two seasons with Charlotte, while Kobe has won 4 titles as a Laker will end up having the most career points as a Laker and be considered by many to have the most illustrious career as a Laker. This trade isn't #1 because Charlotte in all likelihood would not have done it had Kobe not demanded it.

1. Boston trades the #1 overall pick (Joe Barry Carroll) and the #13 overall pick (Rickey Brown) to Golden State for the #3 overall pick (Kevin McHale) and Robert Parish. Trade led to 3 Boston titles in the 80's and what most consider to be one of the best teams of all time (1986 Celtics). Both McHale and Parish are HoFers on the best 50 players ever list, while Brown didn't make it in the NBA and Carroll's career went nowhere after a few solid years.

[Findog]

Where's Devin Harris, Trenton Hassell, DeSagana Diop, Moe Ager, Keith Van Horn and two first-round picks for Jason Kidd, Malik Allen and Antoine Wright?

[redzero]

Well, if Kobe stayed in Charlotte, there probably wouldn't be a "New Orleans" Hornets, so I'm down with that.

[Goran Dragic]

Where's Devin "better than MJ" Harris, Trenton Hassell, DeSagana "Wilt Chamberlain" Diop, Moe Ager, Keith Van Horn and two first-round picks for Jason Kidd, Malik Allen and Antoine Wright?

fify


And that trade should probably be #1. My bad.

[monosylab1k]

Where's Devin Harris, Trenton Hassell, DeSagana Diop, Moe Ager, Keith Van Horn and two first-round picks for Jason Kidd, Malik Allen and Antoine Wright?

:tu

New Jersey bent Mark Cuban over and buttfucked him on that trade. That's why they're so awesome and Dallas sucks right now.

[Goran Dragic]

:tu

New Jersey bent Mark Cuban over and buttfucked him on that trade. That's why they're so awesome and Dallas sucks right now.


Good point. I heard the Nets might even break a record this season they're so good.

[redzero]

Dallas fans throwing Devin Harris and DeSagana "Duncan Killer" Diop under the bus again.

Tsk tsk.

[Findog]

Dallas fans throwing Devin Harris and DeSagana "Duncan Killer" Diop under the bus again.

Tsk tsk.

How are we throwing them under the bus? We made a trade that made our team better. Best wishes to them as they continue their careers elsewhere.

[monosylab1k]

Dallas fans throwing Devin Harris and DeSagana "Duncan Killer" Diop under the bus again.

Tsk tsk.

yeah that's it, that's exactly fucking it. You are one stupid cunt.

[monosylab1k]

How are we throwing them under the bus? We made a trade that made our team better. Best wishes to them as they continue their careers elsewhere.

I guess not believing Devin Harris is the Second Coming means we're throwing him under the bus.

[Goran Dragic]

Dallas fans throwing Devin Harris and DeSagana "Duncan Killer" Diop under the bus again.

Tsk tsk.

:lmao is this the same Diop who allowed Duncan to score 41 points in the 2006 series game 7?

Either way, please stick to the thread topic. Mavfan has proven their point that that trade was good for them especially with how Kidd's playing. Anyone who still thinks it was some monumental rip off for New Jersey is an idiot.

[redzero]

Don't pretend that you aren't taking schadenfreude in the failures of the Nets and whatever team that Diop is currently on.

[redzero]

:lmao is this the same Diop who allowed Duncan to score 41 points in the 2006 series game 7?

Either way, please stick to the thread topic. Mavfan has proven their point that that trade was good for them especially with how Kidd's playing. Anyone who still thinks it was some monumental rip off for New Jersey is an idiot.

Diop stopped Duncan when it counted--the final minutes of the fourth and in overtime.

Personally, I don't care either way. I just find it amusing how Mavs fans get so defensive when Devin Harris is brought up.

[monosylab1k]

Don't pretend that you aren't taking schadenfreude in the failures of the Nets and whatever team that Diop is currently on.

I don't give a shit about either of them. I take joy in seeing everybody who trashed the Mavs for making the trade look like dumbshits.

[jacobdrj]

Rasheed Wallace for a sack of potatoes doesn't make the list? Are you kidding? Joe D traded Chuckie Atkins, Zeljico Rebracca, and Lindsey Hunter, for Mike James and Rasheed Wallace, and even GOT HUNTER BACK!

[monosylab1k]

Rasheed Wallace for a sack of potatoes doesn't make the list? Are you kidding? Joe D traded Chuckie Atkins, Zeljico Rebracca, and Lindsey Hunter, for Mike James and Rasheed Wallace, and even GOT HUNTER BACK!

:tu that's a good one.

[Goran Dragic]

Diop stopped Duncan when it counted--the final minutes of the fourth and in overtime.

Personally, I don't care either way. I just find it amusing how Mavs fans get so defensive when Devin Harris is brought up.


Right, cause they were getting defensive. They didn't bring up Devin Harris on their own in this thread.

[Goran Dragic]

Rasheed Wallace for a sack of potatoes doesn't make the list? Are you kidding? Joe D traded Chuckie Atkins, Zeljico Rebracca, and Lindsey Hunter, for Mike James and Rasheed Wallace, and even GOT HUNTER BACK!


Do you think it's more lopsided than any of the 5 trades I mentioned?

[Findog]

Don't pretend that you aren't taking schadenfreude in the failures of the Nets and whatever team that Diop is currently on.

I gleefully take schadenfreude at all the "experts" and "analysts" who thought Dallas shot themselves in the foot with that trade. Harris is a nice player who would be a very good complementary piece for a good team. Sucks for him that he's stuck on Jersey. And as for Diop, the Bobcats are having their best season in franchise history. Good for him.

[jacobdrj]

Hornacek was the player that put the Jazz over the top in 1997. Not Phili's fault for having a crappy organization and not utilizing him. At the very least, Hornacek could play basketball in the NBA and went just as far as Barcley in terms of not beating Jordan in the Finals (granted in a lesser role). Atkins was almost a non-factor since he was traded away, and Sheed>Barcley. The gap in this trade was much bigger.

[JamStone]

Rasheed Wallace for a sack of potatoes doesn't make the list? Are you kidding? Joe D traded Chuckie Atkins, Zeljico Rebracca, and Lindsey Hunter, for Mike James and Rasheed Wallace, and even GOT HUNTER BACK!

The player selected with the first round pick included in the deal was Josh Smith.

You have to at least mention that.

[jacobdrj]

I was not aware of that.
And IIRC Zelli had an unresolved heart condition at the time. Bears mentioning as well...

[boston.balla]

where is the gasol trade? :p:

[Muser]

Richard Jefferson for Bruce Bowen, Fabricio Oberto and Kurt Thomas. Spurs got buttfucked on that one.

[Muser]

And Luis Scola for some sack of shit.

[Warlord23]

You could put a top 5 list involving just the Lakers. Apart from the Kobe-Vlade deal, here are some more one-sided transactions that LA was part of:

- LA traded Jerry Chambers, Archie Clark, and Darrall Imhoff to the 76ers for Wilt Chamberlain
- LA traded Elmore Smith, Brian Winters, Dave Meyers and Junior Bridgeman to the Bucks for Kareem Abdul Jabbar and Walt Wesley
-When the New Orleans Jazz signed an over-the-hill Gail Goodrich to an expensive contract, per league rules, LA was to receive 3 total picks from the Jazz including first-rounders for 1978 and 1979. The Jazz finished with the worst record in the league in 78, and the Lakers won the coin flip with the Bulls in the 79 draft to select Magic Johnson with the first overall pick
- LA traded Kwame Brown, Javaris Crittenton, Aaron McKie, Marc Gasol's rights and 2 future first round picks for Paul Gasol and a Grizz second round pick
- LA traded Shaq to the Heat for Lamar Odom, Caron Butler, Brian Grant and a future pick (the only trade where LA got the short end of the stick)

[jacobdrj]

Hey, like my submission, the did get something. Only submission 5 (Sir Charles/Jeff H. is really up for debate IMHO) Others are pretty darned 1 sided, much more so than Sheed or Pau.

[jacobdrj]

- LA traded Shaq to the Heat for Lamar Odom, Caron Butler, Brian Grant and a future pick (the only trade where LA got the short end of the stick)

I couldn't possibly disagree more. Caron was and is a stud. Had they kept him instead of panicking, they may have been in the Finals sooner. Caron>>>Odom.

[Muser]

I couldn't possibly disagree more. Caron was and is a stud. Had they kept him instead of panicking, they may have been in the Finals sooner. Caron>>>Odom.

No.

[jacobdrj]

No.

Yes.

No P-Jax, no playoffs. Caron > Odom. Period.

[BUMP]

Richard Jefferson for...oh wait :lol

[Warlord23]

Other honorable mentions to the list:

- The San Francisco Warriors traded Wilt Chamberlain to the 76ers for Paul Neumann, Connie Dierking, and Lee Shaffer
- The Cincinnati Royals traded Oscar Robertson to the Milwaukee Bucks for Flynn Robinson and Charlie Paulk
- The St. Louis Hawks traded draft rights to Bill Russell to the Boston Celtics for Ed Macauley and Cliff Hagan. The Celtics used the same draft to also pick Tommy Heinsohn and KC Jones and laid the foundation for their dynasty
- The Seattle SuperSonics traded draft rights to Scottie Pippen to the Bulls for draft rights to Olden Polynice
- The Portland Trail Blazers traded Clyde Drexler and Tracy Murray to Houston Rockets for Otis Thorpe, who left the Blazers anyway at the end of the season
- The Phoenix Suns traded Jason Kidd to New Jersey for Stephon Marbury
- The Detroit Pistons get Rasheed Wallace and Mike James in exchange for Chucky Atkins and Lindsey Hunter in a 3-team deal

I would have included the Garnett trade but the Celtics' run lasted only for a year.

[Muser]

Yes.

No P-Jax, no playoffs. Caron > Odom. Period.

Odom is a matchup nightmare for every team in the league except for teams with similar players (Aldridge, Lewis etc.) Butler is great I agree, but the Lakers didn't need another scorer, they already had the best one in Kobe.

[JamStone]

To be fair, this was about trades "since 1980."


Other honorable mentions to the list:

- The San Francisco Warriors traded Wilt Chamberlain to the 76ers for Paul Neumann, Connie Dierking, and Lee Shaffer
- The Cincinnati Royals traded Oscar Robertson to the Milwaukee Bucks for Flynn Robinson and Charlie Paulk
- The St. Louis Hawks traded draft rights to Bill Russell to the Boston Celtics for Ed Macauley and Cliff Hagan. The Celtics used the same draft to also pick Tommy Heinsohn and KC Jones and laid the foundation for their dynasty
- The Seattle SuperSonics traded draft rights to Scottie Pippen to the Bulls for draft rights to Olden Polynice
- The Portland Trail Blazers traded Clyde Drexler and Tracy Murray to Houston Rockets for Otis Thorpe, who left the Blazers anyway at the end of the season
- The Phoenix Suns traded Jason Kidd to New Jersey for Stephon Marbury
- The Detroit Pistons get Rasheed Wallace and Mike James in exchange for Chucky Atkins and Lindsey Hunter in a 3-team deal

I would have included the Garnett trade but the Celtics' run lasted only for a year.

[Warlord23]

To be fair, this was about trades "since 1980."

My bad ... although the lower part of my list has post 1980 trades ...

[jacobdrj]

Odom is a matchup nightmare for every team in the league except for teams with similar players (Aldridge, Lewis etc.) Butler is great I agree, but the Lakers didn't need another scorer, they already had the best one in Kobe.

Thank you for elaborating. Do you think it would have been possible for one of them to slide over to SF? Kobe would be a mathcup nightmare at the 3, and would have given him a chance to showcase that defense he is supposedly famous for.

[Findog]

For the Mavericks:

- Dale Ellis to the SuperSonics for Al Wood
- Detlef Schrempf to the Pacers for Herb Williams
- Mark Aguirre to the Pistons for Adrian Dantley

Somehow the Mavs have been involved in two Jason Kidd trades that should've been lopsided but weren't (Kidd and two scrubs to Phoenix for Michael Finley, Sam Cassell and the 40-yr-old virgin actually ended up being lopsided in favor of Dallas)

On the other side of the spectrum:

- draft rights to Tractor Taylor for the draft rights to Dirk Nowitzki
- Bubba Wells, Martin Muursepp, Pat Garrity and a pick that turned into Shawn Marion for Steve Nash
- Devin Harris and garbage for Jason Kidd and garbage
- Josh Howard, James Singleton, Quentin Ross and Drew Gooden for Brendan Haywood, Caron Butler and DeShawn Stevenson

[Goran Dragic]

You could put a top 5 list involving just the Lakers. Apart from the Kobe-Vlade deal, here are some more one-sided transactions that LA was part of:

- LA traded Jerry Chambers, Archie Clark, and Darrall Imhoff to the 76ers for Wilt Chamberlain
- LA traded Elmore Smith, Brian Winters, Dave Meyers and Junior Bridgeman to the Bucks for Kareem Abdul Jabbar and Walt Wesley
-When the New Orleans Jazz signed an over-the-hill Gail Goodrich to an expensive contract, per league rules, LA was to receive 3 total picks from the Jazz including first-rounders for 1978 and 1979. The Jazz finished with the worst record in the league in 78, and the Lakers won the coin flip with the Bulls in the 79 draft to select Magic Johnson with the first overall pick
- LA traded Kwame Brown, Javaris Crittenton, Aaron McKie, Marc Gasol's rights and 2 future first round picks for Paul Gasol and a Grizz second round pick
- LA traded Shaq to the Heat for Lamar Odom, Caron Butler, Brian Grant and a future pick (the only trade where LA got the short end of the stick)


Do you know how to read?

[Goran Dragic]

Sheed>Barcley.


:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao :lmao:lmao:lmao

[Girasuck]

Without question this one belongs in the top 5 most lopsided trades of all-time...

Utah traded Dominique Wilkins to the Atlanta Hawks for John Drew, Freeman Williams, and cash.

Can you imagine the Jazz with Wilkins, Malone, Eaton, and Stockton?

[jacobdrj]

:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao :lmao:lmao:lmao

Round Mound of Rebound never played defense. He said so himself.
Sheed was a top 5 man-on post defender from the time he was drafted until 2007. He could score and rebound too. Not as proficiently as RMoR, but enough where his defense made him the overall better player.

[mogrovejo]

I don't like the trades involving picks, like the Kobe trade, or even the Nowitzki one.

Kobe threatened to play in Europe if he wasn't picked by LA of Philly, so Charlotte traded the pick. If they never had Kobe, not even a shot at having Kobe, how could they trade him? The Bucks wanted Taylor, not Dirk - it was a scouting/drafting mistake, not exactly a bad trade. Ditto for the Parish trade, the Warriors brass could have picked McHale and Andrew Toney with the picks they got and that would make it a good trade for them. They drafted wrongly and that's what made it an awful trade.

[Goran Dragic]

Round Mound of Rebound never played defense. He said so himself.
Sheed was a top 5 man-on post defender from the time he was drafted until 2007. He could score and rebound too. Not as proficiently as RMoR, but enough where his defense made him the overall better player.


Barkley made the HoF and is on the top 50 players ever list. Sheed isn't gonna sniff either one of those. Sheed was a better defender, yeah, but Chuck is one of the best rebounders of all time and could be the centerpiece of a teams' offense. It's not even a close call.

[JamStone]

No. Don't mistake unmet talent versus HOF production.

Barkley >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Rasheed

It's about what you get. Not what you hope to get. You can have a Ford Taurus and Lexus LS and you could say the Lexus >>> Taurus. But if you fill up the Lexus' gas tank with human urine and the Taurus with premium gasoline, the Taurus >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Lexus.


Barkley >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Rasheed

[JoeTait75]

For the Cavaliers, trading what became the #1 overall pick in the 1982 Draft to the Lake Show for Don Ford and Chad Kinch. The trade was made late in the 1979-80 season and why it was made is unknown; the Cavaliers were pretty much out of the playoff race at that point anyway. All L.A. had to do was sit on the pick and watch gleefully as the Cavaliers imploded under the stewardship of Ted Stepien.

Of course, the pick eventually turned into James Worthy. Cleveland would have likely selected Clark Kellogg of Cleveland St. Joseph's HS and Ohio State, who was the biggest prep hoop star to come out of NE Ohio before LeBron James. Special K would have provided a major boost for the anemic attendance numbers at the old Coliseum. And he was a damn good player for the Pacers before his knees betrayed him.

[jacobdrj]

Rasheed's potential was great. Never met his potential. But still played great defense and was a catalyst on offense. RMoR never met his potential either. But I would take the defender over the offender any day of the week. Defensive bigs win titles. They don't have to be exclusively defensive, or DPoY defenders, but they got to D it up. RMoR did not. Sheed did. Both had 'tude.

And HoF tends to make light of defensive stats and ability.

[Goran Dragic]

Rasheed's potential was great. Never met his potential. But still played great defense and was a catalyst on offense. RMoR never met his potential either. But I would take the defender over the offender any day of the week. Defensive bigs win titles. They don't have to be exclusively defensive, or DPoY defenders, but they got to D it up. RMoR did not. Sheed did. Both had 'tude.

And HoF tends to make light of defensive stats and ability.


I'd hardly call him a "catalyst" on offense. And Barkley really didn't underachieve. He was a 6'5" power forward who managed to out rebound and out play guys 5 inches taller than he was. Sheed had the potential to be Tim Duncan with a better jumper. He instead was a franchise role player.

[jacobdrj]

Overachieving on 1 side of the ball does not excuse underachieving on the other. I don't excuse Sheed for his refusal to post, but he was an outlet passer like nobody's business while on the Pistons and terribly unselfish, to a fault. I am not saying Sheed is better than Duncan, but I am not saying Sir Charles is either...

[JoeTait75]

Barkley didn't underachieve. With the weight and personality issues he had coming out of Auburn he could very easily have washed out of the league in a very short period of time.

It's fortunate he was drafted by a veteran 76ers team that had a great role model in Moses Malone; had he gone to a young, relatively leaderless team like, say, Dallas, he might have been an out-and-out bust.

[Goran Dragic]

Overachieving on 1 side of the ball does not excuse underachieving on the other. I don't excuse Sheed for his refusal to post, but he was an outlet passer like nobody's business while on the Pistons and terribly unselfish, to a fault. I am not saying Sheed is better than Duncan, but I am not saying Sir Charles is either...


Duncan is better than both, I agree there. Barkley was better from every single offensive perspective other than jump shooting. I know Detroit won it all in 2004 with Sheed, but if they had Barkley instead of Sheed from 2005-2008 they would have won at least 1 more title since he's the player who can step up and carry the load offensively that Sheed was too lazy to become. They're not even in the same class. One was a superstar and one was a role player.

[jacobdrj]

Overachieve, underachieve. Not my point. Sir Charles didn't play defense. I don't care why. Steve Nash doesn't either. I don't blame him. But he doesn't play defense. Unless his surrounding team is so great as to overcome that, it makes you a liability.

[Goran Dragic]

Overachieve, underachieve. Not my point. Sir Charles didn't play defense. I don't care why. Steve Nash doesn't either. I don't blame him. But he doesn't play defense. Unless his surrounding team is so great as to overcome that, it makes you a liability.


:lmao yeah Sheed's never been a liability to his team.

[jacobdrj]

Detroit had 2 issues. First, it was an unusual situation where everything other than a scoring star was there (2nd best defense, 2nd best offensive bench, up and coming PG, defensive culture). Any scoring machine would have put them over the top. Sheed was not that. He merely enhanced the defense.

Second, Ben Wallace. He needed a man-on post defender to be effective (read: Win). Before Cliff Robinson became a Piston, Ben had a phenominal year in terms of stats, but the team defense was just medeocre, and the Pistons had a 32-50 record. In comes Cliff Robinson, and Ben's talent shined. Cliff was debateabley the best man-on post defender in the NBA at the time, being able to guard everyone from Duncan to Shaq well. Bam! 50-32. But he couldn't grab a board or score a point in the post season. He had off the court issues as well. Pistons dumped him. Pistons didn't play well the next season to start off. Not awful but not great. Until Sheed came to fill Cliff's shoes on defense and provide a teeny weeny bit more offense in the playoffs, the Pistons were ineffective on defense in terms of W and L.

RMoR wouldn't have helped Ben on defense. Might not have mattered, but it was a unique situation.

Also, IMHO it wasn't Sheed being lazy, so much as it was coaches not understanding his role. Pistons got rid of the post scorer, Corliss Williamson. Every coach, including Brown, tried to do what nobody else could, get Sheed to pick up the slack. He was not the Pistons' go-to-guy in 2004. Never should have been. But every coach, including Brown, tried to rely on him. That is both the coach's fault and Joe D's for not getting a post player when we lost Corliss. He thought he got one when he signed McDyess. But all McDyess was, was a replacement for Okur. A jump shooting big.

[jacobdrj]

:lmao yeah Sheed's never been a liability to his team.

Of course he has. He was a problem in Portland when Dunleavy relied on him as a post scoring star, and he reverted to a problem when Larry, Flip and Curry tried to rely on him offensively as a post scoring star.

When he was allowed to 'do his thing' on defense and offense, he was a huge plus.

I think over time, a guy like Sir Charles who would not play defense, would become a liability as well. Don't forget how he clashed in Houston. Hell he had issues on the Suns from my understanding before all was said and done...

[Bookit]

One of the worst trades(from a Rockets perspective) was an aging Charles Barkley for 26 year old Robert Horry and 26 year old sam cassell(plus spare parts) My father is a Rockets fan and still bitches about that trade.

[jacobdrj]

One of the worst trades(from a Rockets perspective) was an aging Charles Barkley for 26 year old Robert Horry and 26 year old sam cassell(plus spare parts) My father is a Rockets fan and still bitches about that trade.

I didn't even realize... Rox basically traded away all their 'clutch'. Dayum.

[Goran Dragic]

Of course he has. He was a problem in Portland when Dunleavy relied on him as a post scoring star, and he reverted to a problem when Larry, Flip and Curry tried to rely on him offensively as a post scoring star.

When he was allowed to 'do his thing' on defense and offense, he was a huge plus.

I think over time, a guy like Sir Charles who would not play defense, would become a liability as well. Don't forget how he clashed in Houston. Hell he had issues on the Suns from my understanding before all was said and done...


He got ejected from a must-win playoff game and his team wound up losing. Barkley never did anything like that.

[Muser]

Sheed also fails in the clutch defensively.

[jacobdrj]

He got ejected from a must-win playoff game and his team wound up losing. Barkley never did anything like that.

Fair enough. But I am comparing bodies of work. As far as I know, Sheed never spit on a fan either... But the beauty of the Pistons is that they didn't need anything out of Sheed other than his defense in 2004. Unfortunately, in 2005 and on, they did... Neither won titles as focal points of the offense. For different reasons. Sheed was a solid citizen on the court in Detroit until maybe last season.

[jacobdrj]

Sheed also fails in the clutch defensively.

(Pistons shouldn't have even been in the Finals in 2005, Miami was the better team)

[Goran Dragic]

Fair enough. But I am comparing bodies of work. As far as I know, Sheed never spit on a fan either... But the beauty of the Pistons is that they didn't need anything out of Sheed other than his defense in 2004. Unfortunately, in 2005 and on, they did... Neither won titles as focal points of the offense. For different reasons. Sheed was a solid citizen on the court in Detroit until maybe last season.


They were both hot headed in their own ways who did plenty of dumb things in the heat of the moment. Charles Barkley carried the 1993 Suns to 62 wins, won MVP, and took them to the finals. That's something Sheed was never capable of doing. Players aren't remembered for being defensive role players. When the showtime Lakers are talked about Michael Cooper's defense isn't what's remembered, Magic's offense is.

[Booharv]

(Pistons shouldn't have even been in the Finals in 2005, Miami was the better team)
Yeah, but they almost definitely win the series if he doesn't leave Horry alone on that shot. When you blow an NBA Finals it has to be mentioned in your resume.

[Muser]

(Pistons shouldn't have even been in the Finals in 2005, Miami was the better team)

Doesn't discount the fact he left a man known to make big shots wide open. I'll discount '99 because that was more a miracle shot.

[JamStone]

Almost definitely.

[Booharv]

Almost definitely.
This is a shot at me somehow but I'm not smart enough to get it.

[baseline bum]

For the Cavaliers, trading what became the #1 overall pick in the 1982 Draft to the Lake Show for Don Ford and Chad Kinch. The trade was made late in the 1979-80 season and why it was made is unknown; the Cavaliers were pretty much out of the playoff race at that point anyway. All L.A. had to do was sit on the pick and watch gleefully as the Cavaliers imploded under the stewardship of Ted Stepien.

Of course, the pick eventually turned into James Worthy. Cleveland would have likely selected Clark Kellogg of Cleveland St. Joseph's HS and Ohio State, who was the biggest prep hoop star to come out of NE Ohio before LeBron James. Special K would have provided a major boost for the anemic attendance numbers at the old Coliseum. And he was a damn good player for the Pacers before his knees betrayed him.

Freaking Clark Kellogg. When I was a little kid I got all but one card of my 86-87 Fleer set autographed at games, and Kellogg was the one missing piece since he never seemed to travel with Indy. :pctoss