So basically us middle-class gets screwed over?

[PGDynasty24]

So we have to pay for "the poor" who didn't go to school and get the education and put in the hard work that we did. We have to carry the dead weight of this country and those who abuse the system of health care. We give "the poor" in this country around a trillion dollars a year and they still want more. When this bill passes the rich will remain rich. The average median salary of the middle class will go down and "the poor" are the beneficiaries in all this. Fuck this shit

[Nbadan]

You make more than 250K and don't have private insurance?

[Stringer_Bell]

So we have to pay for "the poor" who didn't go to school and get the education and put in the hard work that we did. We have to carry the dead weight of this country and those who abuse the system of health care. We give "the poor" in this country around a trillion dollars a year and they still want more. When this bill passes the rich will remain rich. The average median salary of the middle class will go down and "the poor" are the beneficiaries in all this. Fuck this shit

ofc the middle class must fill the gap, you don't expect the rich people to do it do you? it's better to have 2 classes than 3...way too much stuff to keep track of.

[Mr. Peabody]

I always thought it was the middle class who didn't have health insurance. The poor get covered by the government. It's the small business owner and it's employees who don't get health insurance. It's the people who make too much for Medicaid, but not enough to purchase health insurance on their own. It the middle class the bill is supporting.

[Winehole23]

Can the middle class afford the mandate? Honest question.

[jacobdrj]

Is there still a middle class?

[EmptyMan]

Yes.

[EmptyMan]

You think there isn't because your politicians refer to the "middle class", and not the actual middle class, to not hurt feelings.


Building millions is a long-term reality for the majority of multi-millionaires. Until you reach that point, you just have to play the game and bend over.

Obama speaks of sacrifice :rollinThe hardest working people have to sacrifice every day to build wealth.

[admiralsnackbar]

So we have to pay for "the poor" who didn't go to school and get the education and put in the hard work that we did. We have to carry the dead weight of this country and those who abuse the system of health care. We give "the poor" in this country around a trillion dollars a year and they still want more. When this bill passes the rich will remain rich. The average median salary of the middle class will go down and "the poor" are the beneficiaries in all this. Fuck this shit

Bright side: it gives us an incentive to not allow citizens to become unemployed, uneducated wastes.

[florige]

What is the $ range to classify one as "middle class"?

[JudynTX]

What is the $ range to classify one as "middle class"?

Less than 240K a year. :lol

[coyotes_geek]

What is the $ range to classify one as "middle class"?

In layman's terms, that range is defined as "a little less than what I make" to "a little more than what I make". :p:

[JudynTX]

In layman's terms, that range is defined as "a little less than what I make" to "a little more than what I make". :p:

High class richer. :lol

[coyotes_geek]

High class richer. :lol

:lol Not yet. Hopefully one day.

[boutons_deux]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Household_income_in_the_United_States#Quintiles

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_class_in_the_United_States

The middle class peaks out pretty quickly, under $100K

[Marcus Bryant]

Can the middle class afford the mandate? Honest question.

True. This is a rather significant tax on employment, and if one seeks to purchase a policy on their own, that cost will be substantial, and it's not a given that whatever subsidies that exist to cover the purchase of a policy will do so fully. So you have a requirement to buy something, the cost of which outpaces inflation significantly, and you may not qualify for assistance. Focusing on explicit tax rate increases is disingenuous, this mandate represents a substantial burden for the middle class should they seek to comply. At its core this reform does not end the 3rd party payer problem and premiums will undoubtedly continue to rise at a high clip. Small businesses will get relief from this by dropping health benefits altogether and paying the fine as I suspect many individuals will do.

[Marcus Bryant]

And just like the tax code, this monstrosity is going to be whittled at by those who own politicians to their benefit. It might as well be labeled the Lobbyist Full Employment Reform Act of 2010.

[boutons_deux]

ALL employees in group plans get 75%+ of their premiums paid by their employers, who write it off as business expense, ie, tax-free. That's non-employee taxpayers subsidizing for employee insurance as non-declared benefit-in-kind, while those same non-employees have to buy their own insurance with after-tax revenue.

[greyforest]

there's only so much that can be leeched from the middle class before everything just collapses

[Marcus Bryant]

ALL employees in group plans get 75%+ of their premiums paid by their employers, who write it off as business expense, ie, tax-free. That's non-employee taxpayers subsidizing for employee insurance as non-declared benefit-in-kind, while those same non-employees have to buy their own insurance with after-tax revenue.

Sure, that inequity continues to exist. But the cost of employment just went up and that will be a factor moving forward, even with the deduction.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

You make more than 250K and don't have private insurance?

Yep, the doctors, medical device makers, insurance cos, small business owners who now have to pony up for more insurance, etc., none of those people would ever raise prices and pass the costs onto the consumer (especially not those making <250K) to make up their newfound healthcare 'requirements'.

[Wild Cobra]

You make more than 250K and don't have private insurance?
WTF you taking about Propaganda Dan?

There are specific extra costs for the 200K + crowd. Those of us who pay a decent amount of taxes will have ours raised also. Just indirectly. Then when the Bush Tax cuts expire, I expect to pay something like $150+ more each month.

Fuck you Dan.

[Wild Cobra]

there's only so much that can be leeched from the middle class before everything just collapses

Hasn't it already collapsed?

We are in a downward spiral I believe that we my never recover from, because the middle class is getting smaller and smaller. It would be OK if the middle class was moving to the upper class, but they are moving into poverty because of our government.

Who's left to pay for the bigger government coming?

[Wild Cobra]

You make more than 250K and don't have private insurance?
Shouldn't it be a personal choice?

I only have insurance because it is mostly employer provided. I am very health for my age and if I made that much would not waste money on health insurance. Unlike most of you liberals, I am prepared to die when it's my time and have no need to unnaturally extend my life. If I'm in a car accident, those expenses are paid by my auto insurance.

Sometimes I just cannot wait to get to the next life, and hopefully no longer have to deal with the scum that live on this earth.

[Winehole23]

Hasn't it already collapsed?Muh-no.

[Winehole23]

Sometimes I just cannot wait to get to the next life, and hopefully no longer have to deal with the scum that live on this earth.You should meet balli sometime. I think you two have something in common.

[Wild Cobra]

Muh-no.
OK...

Started to collapse...

[EVAY]

You should meet balli sometime. I think you two have something in common.

There you go again matchmaking, WH.:toast

[Wild Cobra]

There you go again matchmaking, WH.:toast
No, it was just a sick joke, and that's how he meant it. He might fantasize that way, but I don't.

[SnakeBoy]

Can the middle class afford the mandate? Honest question.

Depends on what you call middle class. Under the plan people will qualify for subsidies if they don't make more than 4 times the poverty level, that currently equates to individuals making up to $44k or a family of 4 making $88k. With the median income at $44k ($60k for a family of 4) my honest question is how the hell is the government going to pay for subsidies to 50+% of the population?