draft87
04-06-2010, 06:29 AM
I'm gonna ask a purely hypothetical question. At the end. This is a long, whimsical, fantastic thread. Many of you don't like this type of thread. In other words, this is a daydream about a moot point. If you're busy, stop reading. Feel free to skip. No hard feelings. Otherwise, if you want to spend a few minutes distracting yourself from wondering about George, Tony, the last two weeks, and the first round, then spend a minute thinking about this.
At the beginning of Sunday's game I started thinking about Manu's career. And of course how it overlaps with Duncan's career.
Anyone who's a longtime fan has been through some absolutely amazing basketball and some serious heartbreak. Obviously when things are rough it's easier to focus on the previous bad times. Here's some of the downers we've had to suffer. Feel free to add to the list
2000-Duncan's end of season injury
2001/2002- an overachieving, yet inferior team standing no chance against the Lakers. A sublime Duncan performance gone to waste reminiscent of the mid-90s Robinson years
2004- .4 need not say more
2006- decent 1st round scare. 2nd round rotation purgatory
2008- a way too tough Conference Semi-Finals/Barry-Horry combined for one healthy leg/Pau Gasol/Manu's injury/aging/Derek Fucking Fisher again!!
2009- even more aging/Manu's sustained injuries/lack of roster changes/Duncan's knees
2010- this story has been overdocumented
-------------------------------------------------------
But just so I'm not filling this with only negative stuff I've got to add the highlights
1999-crazy season all around but Spurs make a fantastic run to the title. 16-2 postseason. Memorial Day Miracle. Finally got a ring, and it looks like Duncan will give us a new millennium of great basketball
2003-the ultimate season. Tied for best record. Coach of the year-Gregg Popovich. Back2back MVP-Tim Duncan. Redemption against the Lakers. A great system of defense, youth mixed with vets. Retirement party for the Admiral. Despite uncertainty on the future of the point position there's great promise Ginobili's rookie year. Even a Steve Kerr got to throw in a vintage performance
2005-Very solid regular season run up until the Duncan injury but a decent mid-season move to get another center-Nazr Mohammad. Coach Pop gets the team to mature in Duncan's absence and all questions about Duncan's health are answered during a very convincing post season run. Title #3
2007-Perseverance through a stagnant offseason and constant questions about the teams age. Another great post-all-star run through the postseason. Vintage Spurs ball fueled by solid defense and clutch performances by the big 3 as well as Bowen, Horry, Finley, and Barry. The emergence of Tony Parker as Top 5 Point Guard and Finals MVP
And even though we couldn't make it in 2004/2006/2008/2009 I can't deny that there was still some great basketball played. Up until the playoff defeats wasn't it great to see the Spurs destroy the 2004 Grizzlies(Dam I wish we could kill Gasol's teams ALWAYS), 2006 Kings(yes, this was a scary matchup..they weren't a true 8th seed, that year SUCKED with playoff seeding....but there were some great moments once the team got it together. Check out game 1 and if you can't watch just look at the box score!), 2008 Suns---How amazing was it to answer back to all the whining Phoenix bitches about Spurs being dirty and stealing the series even though we won game 6 AFTER Stoudemire and Diaw got back???!!! Yes. Amazing.
Game 1 is my favorite opening day playoff game ever. You know it's great when basketball fans who are not Spurs fans agree that it's great. Up through the 2008 Playoffs we saw a great San Antonio system of execution on both ends. And some bizarro calls by Coach Pop. Seriously, how many of you thought we could get 3s off of inbounds plays twice AND one is by Duncan?
*********************************************
Ginobili has been able to thrive in this system. He's committed to defense and has amazing playmaking abilities.
I'm leading up to the point soon, promise:
First,
I'm digging ESPN/ABC's starting lineup images. Unfortunately they're "2 shots" but the spurs lineup was arranged well since they had Duncan, the big man in the middle and the other four Spurs flanked him in decent symmetry. A lot of words on a nothing concept, right? Well for starters, as much as I don't hate Bonner, he just doesn't add any aesthetic value to a basketball collage. And doesn't Hill, Ginobili, Jefferson, McDyess, Duncan just look good?
Anyway, Manu's photo looks like it's from 2006. His hair is thicker, as in, not shaved. But it's not the full-blown-rock-star-2005-yeahNash-this-is-whatta-whiteboy w/long-hair-is-supposed2look-like long hair. Just thicker than he's capable of pulling off now cause it's pre-bald spot.
So seeing 2006 Manu reminded me of how disappointing his season was then. It wasn't bad just a bit of a downer considering how absolutely amazing he was in 2005. The injuries sucked and he just was missing something. I'm thinking about how absolutely amazing Manu has been during this run and kinda mulling over all the highlights of his career. I'm also thinking about the bonehead moves. We all know how is hypercompetitiveness can take over his logic. ....like the final play of 2007 Finals Gm4 where he fouled Damon Jones on a 3pt shot when we clearly needed to let the clock run and the game would be done...
....and of course I thought about the 3-pt shot at the end of Gm 7 vs the Mavs. Chasky's collection had some nice footage! I try to forget about that shot because GODDAMN when that shot went in I thought,
"yeah, this is the Ginobili moment I've been waiting for. We're fucking back from down 3-1. We're in the WCF, Phoenix doesn't stand a chance. Fuck the Mavs. Fuck Dirk. Fuck Jet. Win one for Finley. Thanks Mark Cuban, and by the way, FUCK YOU TOO. Let's play some Spurs D and finally get that back2back title we've been chasing for 6 or 7 years."
And you know the rest. The foul on Dirk that led to the 3pt play(which still, to this day, I contend that if you hold that up against the contact Duncan got the entire series THAT IS NOT A FOUL). Then Duncan got hacked on the final possession, and we lost in overtime. If that story is news to you then.....nevermind. Anyway, even though the officiating sucked really, really bad(I'm not blaming it, I'm not a whine-o. I seriously think that was the worst officiating ever up until the Finals where I admit the refs really handed it to the Heat) I wanted to wring Manu's neck for going for the block on Dirk. If he made the layup they'd still be up 1, had the ball and the chance to seal it with free throws and defense. We had Barry, Finley, Ginobili, Horry was shooting well, even Beno, NVE(yeah yeah), etc to shoot free throws. ....We very easily could have shut them down a possession or two and sealed the game. BAM. Western Conference Finals against a much inferior Phoenix team. I believe we could have beaten Wade and Shaq. I can only imagine the craziness when Duncan got #4 before Shaq.....
But unfortunately Ginobili went for the block, got the foul and we ran out of steam. The comeback was too good to be true and instead of titles in 1999, 2003, 2005, 2006, and 2007 fans are left with that "not-quite-right" feeling. The back2back eluded us. 5 Duncan titles eluded us.
------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm accepting the fact that I might not see Duncan's Spurs get another title before the end(of his career). I don't like the thought but what can I do? ...appreciate the championship years for what they were. If there's more to come then bring it on. If not, I can still say those years were a great run. 1999-2008= four titles and a hell of a great run. Most people like to say 1999-2007 cause that was the last year we won, but we can't let off 2008. Yeah, we didn't win and lost to the Lakers of all teams but 2008 was like 2007.2. We foolishly didn't make any real roster moves except let go of Scola(goddammit) and Beno. It was a good year up until the WCF. Ginobili had a career year and the while the team was way too old, the system had such good chemistry that we were contending with much younger teams and had a legitimate chance had it not been for the Gasol Heist.
So let's say the 'era' is over, for the sake of the conversation. This amazing run by Ginobili-the playmaking, the defense(steals, blocks)- would you trade it in for a chance to enter a time machine and hold him back from going for the block on Nowitzki?
In other words, as amazing as the blocks on Durant and Garnett were, would you sacrifice them if it meant that Ginobili DIDN'T go for the block on Nowitzki and therefore resulting in a 2006 championship?
Is 2006 Title>>>>>trying to get a title in 2010/2011/2012?
I bet some of you are saying YES simply based on the fact that in addition to the end of the Duncan era we have face the fact that this summer may be the end of the Ginobili era.
I already wrote a lot so I'll stop and leave the rest to your imagination. Thanks for the input. I don't expect many people to spend time reading this but really am curious what other fans think about this.
At the beginning of Sunday's game I started thinking about Manu's career. And of course how it overlaps with Duncan's career.
Anyone who's a longtime fan has been through some absolutely amazing basketball and some serious heartbreak. Obviously when things are rough it's easier to focus on the previous bad times. Here's some of the downers we've had to suffer. Feel free to add to the list
2000-Duncan's end of season injury
2001/2002- an overachieving, yet inferior team standing no chance against the Lakers. A sublime Duncan performance gone to waste reminiscent of the mid-90s Robinson years
2004- .4 need not say more
2006- decent 1st round scare. 2nd round rotation purgatory
2008- a way too tough Conference Semi-Finals/Barry-Horry combined for one healthy leg/Pau Gasol/Manu's injury/aging/Derek Fucking Fisher again!!
2009- even more aging/Manu's sustained injuries/lack of roster changes/Duncan's knees
2010- this story has been overdocumented
-------------------------------------------------------
But just so I'm not filling this with only negative stuff I've got to add the highlights
1999-crazy season all around but Spurs make a fantastic run to the title. 16-2 postseason. Memorial Day Miracle. Finally got a ring, and it looks like Duncan will give us a new millennium of great basketball
2003-the ultimate season. Tied for best record. Coach of the year-Gregg Popovich. Back2back MVP-Tim Duncan. Redemption against the Lakers. A great system of defense, youth mixed with vets. Retirement party for the Admiral. Despite uncertainty on the future of the point position there's great promise Ginobili's rookie year. Even a Steve Kerr got to throw in a vintage performance
2005-Very solid regular season run up until the Duncan injury but a decent mid-season move to get another center-Nazr Mohammad. Coach Pop gets the team to mature in Duncan's absence and all questions about Duncan's health are answered during a very convincing post season run. Title #3
2007-Perseverance through a stagnant offseason and constant questions about the teams age. Another great post-all-star run through the postseason. Vintage Spurs ball fueled by solid defense and clutch performances by the big 3 as well as Bowen, Horry, Finley, and Barry. The emergence of Tony Parker as Top 5 Point Guard and Finals MVP
And even though we couldn't make it in 2004/2006/2008/2009 I can't deny that there was still some great basketball played. Up until the playoff defeats wasn't it great to see the Spurs destroy the 2004 Grizzlies(Dam I wish we could kill Gasol's teams ALWAYS), 2006 Kings(yes, this was a scary matchup..they weren't a true 8th seed, that year SUCKED with playoff seeding....but there were some great moments once the team got it together. Check out game 1 and if you can't watch just look at the box score!), 2008 Suns---How amazing was it to answer back to all the whining Phoenix bitches about Spurs being dirty and stealing the series even though we won game 6 AFTER Stoudemire and Diaw got back???!!! Yes. Amazing.
Game 1 is my favorite opening day playoff game ever. You know it's great when basketball fans who are not Spurs fans agree that it's great. Up through the 2008 Playoffs we saw a great San Antonio system of execution on both ends. And some bizarro calls by Coach Pop. Seriously, how many of you thought we could get 3s off of inbounds plays twice AND one is by Duncan?
*********************************************
Ginobili has been able to thrive in this system. He's committed to defense and has amazing playmaking abilities.
I'm leading up to the point soon, promise:
First,
I'm digging ESPN/ABC's starting lineup images. Unfortunately they're "2 shots" but the spurs lineup was arranged well since they had Duncan, the big man in the middle and the other four Spurs flanked him in decent symmetry. A lot of words on a nothing concept, right? Well for starters, as much as I don't hate Bonner, he just doesn't add any aesthetic value to a basketball collage. And doesn't Hill, Ginobili, Jefferson, McDyess, Duncan just look good?
Anyway, Manu's photo looks like it's from 2006. His hair is thicker, as in, not shaved. But it's not the full-blown-rock-star-2005-yeahNash-this-is-whatta-whiteboy w/long-hair-is-supposed2look-like long hair. Just thicker than he's capable of pulling off now cause it's pre-bald spot.
So seeing 2006 Manu reminded me of how disappointing his season was then. It wasn't bad just a bit of a downer considering how absolutely amazing he was in 2005. The injuries sucked and he just was missing something. I'm thinking about how absolutely amazing Manu has been during this run and kinda mulling over all the highlights of his career. I'm also thinking about the bonehead moves. We all know how is hypercompetitiveness can take over his logic. ....like the final play of 2007 Finals Gm4 where he fouled Damon Jones on a 3pt shot when we clearly needed to let the clock run and the game would be done...
....and of course I thought about the 3-pt shot at the end of Gm 7 vs the Mavs. Chasky's collection had some nice footage! I try to forget about that shot because GODDAMN when that shot went in I thought,
"yeah, this is the Ginobili moment I've been waiting for. We're fucking back from down 3-1. We're in the WCF, Phoenix doesn't stand a chance. Fuck the Mavs. Fuck Dirk. Fuck Jet. Win one for Finley. Thanks Mark Cuban, and by the way, FUCK YOU TOO. Let's play some Spurs D and finally get that back2back title we've been chasing for 6 or 7 years."
And you know the rest. The foul on Dirk that led to the 3pt play(which still, to this day, I contend that if you hold that up against the contact Duncan got the entire series THAT IS NOT A FOUL). Then Duncan got hacked on the final possession, and we lost in overtime. If that story is news to you then.....nevermind. Anyway, even though the officiating sucked really, really bad(I'm not blaming it, I'm not a whine-o. I seriously think that was the worst officiating ever up until the Finals where I admit the refs really handed it to the Heat) I wanted to wring Manu's neck for going for the block on Dirk. If he made the layup they'd still be up 1, had the ball and the chance to seal it with free throws and defense. We had Barry, Finley, Ginobili, Horry was shooting well, even Beno, NVE(yeah yeah), etc to shoot free throws. ....We very easily could have shut them down a possession or two and sealed the game. BAM. Western Conference Finals against a much inferior Phoenix team. I believe we could have beaten Wade and Shaq. I can only imagine the craziness when Duncan got #4 before Shaq.....
But unfortunately Ginobili went for the block, got the foul and we ran out of steam. The comeback was too good to be true and instead of titles in 1999, 2003, 2005, 2006, and 2007 fans are left with that "not-quite-right" feeling. The back2back eluded us. 5 Duncan titles eluded us.
------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm accepting the fact that I might not see Duncan's Spurs get another title before the end(of his career). I don't like the thought but what can I do? ...appreciate the championship years for what they were. If there's more to come then bring it on. If not, I can still say those years were a great run. 1999-2008= four titles and a hell of a great run. Most people like to say 1999-2007 cause that was the last year we won, but we can't let off 2008. Yeah, we didn't win and lost to the Lakers of all teams but 2008 was like 2007.2. We foolishly didn't make any real roster moves except let go of Scola(goddammit) and Beno. It was a good year up until the WCF. Ginobili had a career year and the while the team was way too old, the system had such good chemistry that we were contending with much younger teams and had a legitimate chance had it not been for the Gasol Heist.
So let's say the 'era' is over, for the sake of the conversation. This amazing run by Ginobili-the playmaking, the defense(steals, blocks)- would you trade it in for a chance to enter a time machine and hold him back from going for the block on Nowitzki?
In other words, as amazing as the blocks on Durant and Garnett were, would you sacrifice them if it meant that Ginobili DIDN'T go for the block on Nowitzki and therefore resulting in a 2006 championship?
Is 2006 Title>>>>>trying to get a title in 2010/2011/2012?
I bet some of you are saying YES simply based on the fact that in addition to the end of the Duncan era we have face the fact that this summer may be the end of the Ginobili era.
I already wrote a lot so I'll stop and leave the rest to your imagination. Thanks for the input. I don't expect many people to spend time reading this but really am curious what other fans think about this.