2010 Free Agent: Ian Mahinmi [Archive]

Bruno

04-15-2010, 03:27 PM

I don't have a clue what are Spurs' plan with Ian this summer.

3 months ago, it was so obvious that Spurs had give up on him. They didn't pick his option and Ian hasn't played a single minute for 2 and a half months.

After that, the situation went weirder and weirder:
- Ian get some major minutes against Nets. it was maybe a showcase but it was strange.
- Haislip goes to some crappy Euro team, Ian move up in the bigman rotation.
- Spurs didn't trade him at the deadline and he has never been included in a trade rumor.
- Spurs trade Ratliff, Ian move up again in the rotation.
- Spurs didn't sign a vet or a prospect PF/C. It was because of the money since Spurs have signed 4 perimeter players (Cedric Jackson, Gee, Jerrels and Temple) and kept 3 of them for the end of the season.

It's hard to find some logic behind these moves.
Maybe Spurs try to trade Ian at the deadline without success, they had to trade Ratliff for financial reason and they haven't find an interesting bigman to sign in March/April.
Maybe Spurs have changed their mind about Ian after the Nets game. All these moves fit with Spurs trying to work with Ian and please him without raising his FA value.

At this point, I wouldn't be surprised by Spurs bot being at all in re-signing him or trying him to re-sign him on July 1st. :downspin:

Libri

04-15-2010, 04:18 PM

I'm in favor of keeping Ian but his stay could also depend on how the Spurs plan to use Mcdyess, who said that next season could be his last. If Pop reduces Mcdyess' playing time, because of his age, then it could open up an opportunity for Ian.

Blackjack

04-15-2010, 04:23 PM

Maybe Spurs have changed their mind about Ian after the Nets game. All these moves fit with Spurs trying to work with Ian and please him without raising his FA value.

At this point, I wouldn't be surprised by Spurs bot being at all in re-signing him or trying him to re-sign him on July 1st. :downspin:

I've heard both RC and Lindsey lump him in with Hairston, Temple, Gee and Jerrells recently, which has given me the impression that they've done a bit of a 180 on him; not wanting to inflate his value could definitely be part of the equation.

I actually heard Coach Brown the other night mention that they hadn't had a real chance to see Ian play before and now that they have seen him play a little, they can't help but be impressed with how he seems to produce when given the opportunity.

So, basically, I think they gave up and were ready to wash their hands of him, which had him buried on the bench. But when Pop decided to let him play because he felt they needed some enthusiasm and energy that night against the Nets, Ian opened some eyes and made them question their decision.

I'm sure they've been trying to figure out what the hell to do ever since but since they didn't pick up his option, it'd make sense for them to keep him under wraps (to some degree). I'm just not sure if they'll be able to afford him when it's all said and done; not that he's going to get a massive contract, just something that might be a little too rich for the Spurs and the role he would assume.

It's definitely one of the stranger happenings when it comes to the Spurs and one of their players.

venitian navigator

04-15-2010, 05:20 PM

If we sign Splitter and re-sign Bonner to a decent contract (no mora than what he'smaking now) Ian like the last big man makes alot of sense...we can afford to give him a contract a la Blair for some season, he already knows (a bit at least) our plays, is young and probably better than any player we can take with our 2nd draft pick.
Let's not forget that our main bigs next season (Tim and Mac) will be one year older and needing a lot of rest in the regular season...

yavozerb

04-15-2010, 05:27 PM

I've heard both RC and Lindsey lump him in with Hairston, Temple, Gee and Jerrells recently, which has given me the impression that they've done a bit of a 180 on him; not wanting to inflate his value could definitely be part of the equation.

I actually heard Coach Brown the other night mention that they hadn't had a real chance to see Ian play before and now that they have seen him play a little, they can't help but be impressed with how he seems to produce when given the opportunity.

So, basically, I think they gave up and were ready to wash their hands of him, which had him buried on the bench. But when Pop decided to let him play because he felt they needed some enthusiasm and energy that night against the Nets, Ian opened some eyes and made them question their decision.

I'm sure they've been trying to figure out what the hell to do ever since but since they didn't pick up his option, it'd make sense for them to keep him under wraps (to some degree). I'm just not sure if they'll be able to afford him when it's all said and done; not that he's going to get a massive contract, just something that might be a little too rich for the Spurs and the role he would assume.

It's definitely one of the stranger happenings when it comes to the Spurs and one of their players.

I agree with the spurs opinion of Ian, but I believe the spurs were gonna owe Ian 2+ mil if the option was picked up earlier in the season. When you say massive contract, what range are you talking? I really do not believe he is worth more than 3mil per season at this point in his career.

If we sign Splitter and re-sign Bonner to a decent contract (no mora than what he'smaking now) Ian like the last big man makes alot of sense...we can afford to give him a contract a la Blair for some season, he already knows (a bit at least) our plays, is young and probably better than any player we can take with our 2nd draft pick.
Let's not forget that our main bigs next season (Tim and Mac) will be one year older and needing a lot of rest in the regular season...

Sounds good, but doesn't Ian have the option now when and where he wants to sign in the summer? Why would he sign with the spurs to be placed at the end of the bench again?

venitian navigator

04-15-2010, 05:41 PM

The point is that if he sign with us he will have a lot better chances to play...chances that he didn't have this year 'cause, more of all, the choice to not exercise the option in his contract at the beginning of the season (wrong choice, imho).
With a new contract for more than one year I think next season he could probably play, at least at the beginning, not less than 10/12 minutes a game, to give him the real chance he didn't have this season. If he works well, these minutes will be the some for all the season...
I don't think he has a chance to take a better contract from other nba teams (at least if he don't play, and play well, in the play offs, that won't happen if not for garbage time).

Blackjack

04-15-2010, 06:15 PM

I agree with the spurs opinion of Ian, but I believe the spurs were gonna owe Ian 2+ mil if the option was picked up earlier in the season. When you say massive contract, what range are you talking? I really do not believe he is worth more than 3mil per season at this point in his career.

I said not that he's going to get a massive contract, but he might command more than they're willing to pay for the role he'd assume.

The Spurs hope to add Splitter (whether they do or not remains to be seen) to a rotation of Tim, 'Dyess, and Blair which probably leaves two spots up front; one of which will likely go to Bonner (or a simialr type player, depending on what they can afford) and the last could be used for a rookie (with D-League eligibility), a veteran min or Ian (should he be willing to come back for a minimum type salary).

There's two factors that are key to what the front court will look like next year:

1.) Is Splitter coming over?

2.) Will the Spurs look to move 'Dyess?

Bruno

04-15-2010, 07:00 PM

Brazil

04-15-2010, 08:16 PM

barbacoataco

04-15-2010, 10:23 PM

The Spurs are taking a BIG risk because if someone else overpays for Mahinmi and he walks, and then Splitter winds up in Europe, the Spurs lose both of their C prospects without getting any value back. Doesn't that seem like a bad situation?

Big P

04-15-2010, 11:24 PM

Cane

04-15-2010, 11:46 PM

Unless the Spurs overpay Ian or can give him substantial minutes; I don't think he'd want to be in San Antonio since he's probably tired of the bench.

The Spurs seem confident that Tiago will be coming over but it will be interesting to see if Bonner will remain a Spur as well and whether or not McDyess will be moved.

venitian navigator

04-16-2010, 02:16 AM

Ian's got OKC written all over him.

Maybe you're right if it's true that his draft choice has been a Presti's one...however, I think that OKC will use his cap space ti sign a more proven big (a la Haywood) considerin their main hole is at starting center...and Ian is definitely too raw for starting for a team with title ambitions like OKC will be next year. After taht signing, I don't how much moneyOKC will have left...probably the same of Spurs...

mountainballer

04-16-2010, 03:00 AM

OKC now have Ibaka and I'm pretty sure they are pretty happy to have him and not Ian. and they have two more big man prospects under contract for next season (Mullens and White), both younger than Ian. plus the rights for DeVon Hardin. not really a lot of need to spend cap space and a roster spot for a player like Ian.

about Ian's future. he went up in the rotation by default. I can't see that the Spurs have changed their mind about him. but yes, if Splitter doesn't come over, the Spurs will be very limited to fill the roster and might turn back to Ian as 5th big. (after re signing Bonner). still can't see them pay more than what his 4th year option would have been (1.8 million), but likely they would offer even less. other teams won't push the price. (unless a team goes into the Jackie Butler - numbers by minutes - trap)

TDMVPDPOY

04-16-2010, 03:04 AM

this is how i see it, sign splitter

sign and trade bonner or mahinmi....

admiralsnackbar

04-16-2010, 04:10 AM

this is how i see it, sign splitter

sign and trade bonner or mahinmi....

If we have the money to sign Bonner, I'd be very surprised to see him traded since the odds of getting somebody who produces at his price point seem pretty low. The same may not be true for Ian, but in his case, I wonder how big a market there would be for a player as enigmatic as he is. He's very far from being a known quantity, and would represent more of a hope-and-see modest contract or scrub wages.

Darkwaters

04-16-2010, 06:52 AM

When considering the big man rotation I have to wonder how he'd fit. Assuming the team signs Splitter and resigns Bonner (or a similar 3 pt shooting big) then you'd have:

Duncan
Splitter
McDyess
Blair
Bonner

In this scenario Ian would be the 6th bigman again and he'd likely see little time. In fact, I doubt hes even active for most games. However, if McDyess is indeed traded for a non-bigman Ian likely moves onto the active list but still plays little. Unless the Spurs FO legitimately intends to give him another shot at getting in the rotation I don't think it makes sense for Ian or the Spurs. We would probably be better off either signing a vet to ride the IR list most of the season and jump in when necessary (Theo Ratliff/Sean Marks role) or draft a big in the second round (Dexter Pittman?) and let him develop in Austin when not active.

Bruno

04-16-2010, 07:03 AM

I can't see Pop playing with at least a big who can shoot the 3

I can see it. Spurs have played for years without a big who can shoot the 3. There are also a lot of teams in the NBA without that kind of players.

Spurs interior defense has been really bad this year. Improving the paint defense should be Spurs main priority for this summer. Now, if Spurs want to keep Bonner, who can shoot but who is also a poor defender, Ian won't be re-signed.

mountainballer

04-16-2010, 07:39 AM

Muser

04-16-2010, 07:46 AM

Brazil

04-16-2010, 12:21 PM

I can see it. Spurs have played for years without a big who can shoot the 3. There are also a lot of teams in the NBA without that kind of players.

Spurs interior defense has been really bad this year. Improving the paint defense should be Spurs main priority for this summer. Now, if Spurs want to keep Bonner, who can shoot but who is also a poor defender, Ian won't be re-signed.

Recently all indicates that Pop does want a big who can shoot the 3. The thing is when you see the Spurs moves and/or game plan (Ian not playing, Theo given to the catts, small ball love...), there is no clear indication that suddenly Spurs will fall in love with interior defense.

AFBlue

04-16-2010, 01:17 PM

If Spurs sign Splitter, the only way Mahinmi is back is Spurs don't draft a big with their first round pick and don't re-sign Bonner. Spurs will have a rotation of Duncan, McDyess, Blair, Splitter and Mahinmi. Duncan and McDyess will play less minutes in the regular season to be fresh for the playoffs and to let the young guys gain some experience.

Agree with one caveat. The Spurs may elect to sign Bonner and look to trade McDyess, whose contract is only partially guaranteed the following year.

Either way I agree that the Spurs aren't going forward with all of Mahinmi, Splitter, Bonner and Dice...one of them would have to go.

Bruno

04-16-2010, 02:28 PM

Trading McDyess won't be easy at all. With his 2010-2011 salary, the guaranteed part of his 2011-2012 salary and his trade kicker, he will cost $8.25M to the other team. $8.25M for one year of a 36 year old McDyess is a lot of money. I don't see a lot of teams ready to spend that.

And if Spurs trade McDyess, they will have to take back contracts. If Spurs trade McDyess and re-sign Bonner, it will push Spurs deeper in the luxury tax area and cost a lot of money to Spurs.

All in all, a McDyess trade is unlikely to happen.

xellos88330

04-16-2010, 02:29 PM

I want the Spurs to sign Mahinmi again. Then I want Pop to tell him to go with chip and develop a consistent 10-15 ft jumper. If he can develop that, he will be able to face up stronger bigs, and then put weaker/smaller bigs on the block.

This would create all sorts of options for him in the rotation. He would also be able to play with Duncan/Blair/Splitter? without causing overcrowding under the basket.

AFBlue

04-16-2010, 03:50 PM

objective

04-16-2010, 04:57 PM

I was always a big proponent of giving Mahinmi time just to see what they had.

At the close of the season, I have to say I'm convinced he's an NBA player, not just an NBA caliber athlete. He gets it. Yes he has foul problems, but that's common with big men short on NBA minutes. Just watch the way he seals guys to open layup lanes for his teammates. He did it for Temple after Temples block and even though Temple missed the gimme, he had it because of Mahinmi. Ian did the same thing in the Houston game freeing up Jefferson for two layups and I remember being so happy.

Because it's the little things like that which make an NBA player legit. That's beyond Stromile. The help defense, how he plays pick-n-rolls, everything, he's actually a guy with at least a decent basketabll IQ.

If a GM out there is smart enough he'll sign Ian and make sure he gets legit opportunities to play. He absolutely is legit starting-material big-man if he overcomes the fouls and turnovers, something that's reasonable.

I'm reminded with Ian how Robin Lopez has pretty much become the key to the Suns season. He was a foul-monster who couldn't get any court time, wasn't trusted, looked awkward, looked stiff, etc etc. But he had a coach who saw that it was worth the risk to give him the time, and now he's progressed so much that PHX area media don't think the Suns can make it out of the first round without a healthy Lopez. He's that important to their defense and rebounding. Yes, they had a decent record with Frye starting, but their team chances went way up with Lopez.

I hope Ian finds a team that will give him that chance, because I believe he'll deliver.

Mr.Bottomtooth

04-17-2010, 10:44 AM

He's gonna find his place in the league. He has all the tools, and he showed off his talent in the little times that he received. Hopefully it's with the Spurs.

exstatic

04-17-2010, 11:22 AM

I also don't think the shooting big is a dogma for Pop. Pop's dogma rather is to have as many players as possible, who can shoot a 3 on a somehow efficient ratio. so a big, who can hit the 3 might get some Brownie points on Pop's scale another coach wouldn't count, but if the price is to high (or the minus points to many) they go without the shooting big.
however, agree that interior defense (including defending bigs who step out to the perimeter) looks more urgent right now. Blair will get better, but there is no guarantee that he develops significantly in this area over the summer (although this will be the priority for his coaching plan). Splitter is a question mark, none can tell how he will do against NBA bigs. (IMO he will be at least a decent interior defender in the NBA once he acclimated)
but Ian also wouldn't change this outlook.

We signed Robert Horry in the summer of 2003, and have had a 3 point shooting big ever since getting rotation if not starting minutes. The downward trending of Spurs defense began in 2000 with the hand check rules, and picked up speed when DRob retired in 2003. I think that Pop realized that our offense had to be SUPER efficient, and that meant spacing the floor with all other players, including the other big. It's not enough to JUST space the floor, however. You have to punish the other teams for straying into the paint. The way that you do that is efficient 3 point shooting. If you get someone like Bonner shooting 40% beyond the arc, that makes his EFFECTIVE FG% 60%, since he scores 120 points on 100 shots, just like a big banging in the paint shooting a 60% FG rate. Bonner draws the other big WAY out of the paint, leaving just one big to guard the rim against Tim, Tony, AND Manu.

I think they'll re-sign Bonner. If they sign Splitter, Ian is history.

SPURSCHAMP

04-18-2010, 08:43 PM

i like ian and want the FO to resign, i think he's productive when he gets minutes, one question though, how come commentators prononce his name yawn and not eeeeean

angelbelow

04-26-2010, 10:44 PM

What are the chances of us keeping Ian? What type of contract do you guys think he deserves and what type of contract to you think he can pony up given his potential?

lurker23

04-27-2010, 03:00 AM

My guess is that the Spurs make a small offer. He rejects. Spurs sign Gist and Splitter, so their front line looks like

Duncan/McDyess/Blair/Gist/Splitter

More likely to re-sign with the Spurs is Matt Bonner. So unless Ian takes the cheap contract it seems he will be lost in the numbers game.

First part sounds right; I'm guessing even if he has to sign for the minimum, Ian would much rather do it with a team where he can get more playing time.

As far as Gist goes, I think the Spurs will sign someone LIKE Gist (a young, developable big man), but I think it will be a major competition in training camp to see who gets that spot. I like Gist, but one has to wonder if the Spurs got a better version of Gist in Blair. They both have a nose for the rebound and can bring high energy; Blair has the bulk advantage and Gist has the speed/athleticism advantage. One still wonders if they can co-exist, though.

As for the rest of the bigman rotation, I'll just quote myself from a Bonner thread:

I think a lot of it depends on the Spurs' opinion of McDyess. If they feel he can be a solid rotational big for all of next year, they might let Bonner walk, knowing that they have their top 4 in Duncan/Dice/Splitter/Blair, and they can fill holes around that, probably with one youngster in his 20s and one typical-Spurs vet in his 30s.

Darkwaters

04-27-2010, 04:04 AM

First part sounds right; I'm guessing even if he has to sign for the minimum, Ian would much rather do it with a team where he can get more playing time.

As far as Gist goes, I think the Spurs will sign someone LIKE Gist (a young, developable big man), but I think it will be a major competition in training camp to see who gets that spot. I like Gist, but one has to wonder if the Spurs got a better version of Gist in Blair. They both have a nose for the rebound and can bring high energy; Blair has the bulk advantage and Gist has the speed/athleticism advantage. One still wonders if they can co-exist, though.

As for the rest of the bigman rotation, I'll just quote myself from a Bonner thread:

I don't think Blair and Gist are at all alike. I consider Gist an undersized big who is trying to convert to the 3. There was never any talk of converting Blair. Sure, they're both the same height - but their bodies are completely different as well as their games. Bad comparison.

I'm not sure that Gist is in the mix anymore at all. But I wouldn't mind the Spurs scooping up a developmental big with D-League eligibility that they can tinker with.

hsxvvd

04-27-2010, 04:38 AM

Gist was a failure.

Mahinmi may linger on the roster for a few more years before blossoming. I don't imagine he'll receive much from other teams, but it's worth a wait and see.

lurker23

04-27-2010, 05:45 AM

I don't think Blair and Gist are at all alike. I consider Gist an undersized big who is trying to convert to the 3. There was never any talk of converting Blair. Sure, they're both the same height - but their bodies are completely different as well as their games. Bad comparison.

I'm not sure that Gist is in the mix anymore at all. But I wouldn't mind the Spurs scooping up a developmental big with D-League eligibility that they can tinker with.

I agree that Gist's best shot at making the NBA is as a 3, and that there was never any talk of converting Blair. I guess I should clarify.

Blair and Gist are not very similar players; they have completely different builds and athletic ability. However, there is one major similarity that I feels connects them: rebounding. When I've seen James Gist play, rebounding is the trait that shined the brightest and, of his current skill set, the one that would be his potential ticket into the NBA. His nose for the ball and aptitude at rebounding is uncanny.

If James never truly builds a perimeter skill set, then rebounding is the only real reason you put him on the court (he has some nice athleticism and jumping ability, but so does a deer). However, why would you do that when you have another rebounding beast like Blair on your team? I think DeJuan's emergence killed 95% of Gist's shot of making this team without some SF skills to go along with it (and honestly, he was going to need that crossover ability anyway).

Darkwaters

04-27-2010, 06:14 AM

Gist was a failure.

Mahinmi may linger on the roster for a few more years before blossoming. I don't imagine he'll receive much from other teams, but it's worth a wait and see.

Gist was the 57th pick in the draft. I find it hard to call that pick a "failure".

mountainballer

04-27-2010, 06:54 AM

personally I believe the Spurs will neither re sign Ian, nor sign Gist.
(assuming they bring in Splitter)
having a front court of Tim-Dice-Splitter and Blair, I would guess they sign a veteran as their 5th big, a defensive specialist in the Ratliff mold, or the shooting PF. (maybe Bonner, hopefully not). the 6th big more likely is a player, who is eligible for the d-league.
if they use the #20 pick for a long SF, as most of us think, to sign Gist makes even less sense. they still might look for a combo forward with the ability to defend perimeter bigs, but I don't think they see a player like Gist come in and immediately take this role and defend Dirk, Odom etc.
so or so, can't see Gist in the Spurs plans.

yavozerb

04-27-2010, 06:57 AM

Gist was the 57th pick in the draft. I find it hard to call that pick a "failure".

What would you call it then? It is either a success or failure, and since he is not in the NBA I would agree that is was a failure at the moment..

BronxCowboy

04-27-2010, 07:00 AM

Not in the NBA is exactly where you expect a 57th pick to be. It's only a failure if that guys DOES end up playing in the NBA, for someone else, and owns your team.

hsxvvd

04-27-2010, 07:31 AM

Failure in the sense that he has and will "fail" to do anything meaningful for the Spurs.

As a 57th pick, it certainly is by no means a "failure" of a pick, but he is certainly a failure as an NBA player.

BronxCowboy

04-27-2010, 07:35 AM

Fair 'nuff.

Redshadows

04-29-2010, 02:16 AM

I can't see the spurs would let ian go away

scottspurs

04-29-2010, 11:32 AM

I think the spurs would of gotten rid of Ian over Theo Ratliff if they had no intentions at all of bringing him back.

That being said I think some team will offer Ian more than the spurs are willing to pay and he will no longer be on the Spurs next season.

yavozerb

05-02-2010, 09:32 PM

I disagree. I think there is more postion potential for Gist. Unlike Ian and DeJuan who should stay at the 4/5, Gist could play a little 3. I bet Gist is a decent rebounder, but he is a far superior athlete. Gist Runs the floor well and can keep up with other long 3s like a Ariza, Gay or Gallenari, but at the same time he has the size and length to guard players like Zach Randolph or LaMarcus Aldrige. Plus Gist has the IQ and quickness to come over for weakside blocks, then the athletic ability to run the floor and dunk the ball. Gist would be closer to a Tyrus Thomas in my opinon.

The number 1 thing that Gist has going for him though is that he doesn't mind not being involved in the offense. He likes to defend, run the floor and rebound. The Spurs will have to extend a tender offer to Gist and at this point I fully expect Gist to except. If I were the Spurs GM I would make this my off-season:

Sign Gist and Tiago, draft Paul George and maybe Fran Vasquez out of MD. Find a way to fill void at the 2 spot with remaining MLE (Like that will happen) and this is what the line up will look like:

Starters
Hill
Manu
RJ
Duncan
Splitter

Bench
Parker
Fanny V/steal in 2010 free agency or draft
Paul George
McDyess/Gist (likely to go to Austin a little bit)
Blair/(either Ian or Bonner)

Now if I had it my way, while keeping it semi realistic, I would do a sign and trade of Parker for Wade, move Hill or Manu to the bench and start Wade. Use the LLE to possibly sign Scola and do all the other moves I mentioned. Plus sign a couple insurence guards, or keep Temple/bring De Colo over.

Wow I just realized I don't think I would want to be RC. This hurt my head just by thinking of a to-do list.

Also, just a side note, I fully expect Splitter to take the full MLE, and from the people I've talked to, he is worth it and good enough to be a starter in the NBA.

Hopefully we will see Gist in the summer and that will help with the decision if he can help out next season or not. I think you meant Greivis Vasquez out of maryland, right? I think I would rather prefer de colo over vasquez though.

kobyz

05-03-2010, 01:02 AM

bring Splitter and De Colo - split the MLE on them.
draft Paul George.
sign Raja Bell for the LLE.
keep Ian Mahinmi.

PG: Parker/Hill/De Colo
SG: Manu/Raja Bell/De Colo
SF: RJ/Paul George/Raja Bell
PF: Duncan/Blair/Ian Mahinmi
C: McDyess/Splitter

use the two spot remaining on our youngs like Hairston, Temple, Gee or some second rounded from this year.

Bruno

05-07-2010, 07:41 AM

bring Splitter and De Colo - split the MLE on them.
draft Paul George.
sign Raja Bell for the LLE.
keep Ian Mahinmi.

It would be a damn great offseason. I'm still not sure what is the best for De Colo development between staying one year in Europe to play the Euroleague or come in the NBA right away.

For Spurs' bigmen, a scenario that would make some senses is to sign Splitter and Mahinmi.
Limiting Duncan and Dice regular season minutes would be damn important next year. Dice will be 36 and Duncan's knees need rest. During the 2010-2011 regular season, Pop could give a lot of minutes to Splitter, Mahinmi and Blair. In 2011-2012, Dice will be gone and Spurs could roll with a Duncan/Blair/Splitter/Mahinmi rotation.

6 months ago, I was sure at 99.9% that Ian was gone. Now, I gave him a 60% odd of being re-signed by Spurs this summer. :downspin:

coyotes_geek

05-07-2010, 08:44 AM

Given the number of roster spots the Spurs will be looking to fill, I won't be surprised if the Spurs bring Ian back on a league min deal. Probably just 1 year plus a TO for a second. At this point I'm not expecting Ian to ever amount to much, but given that the Spurs did use a 1st round pick on the guy I can understand if they feel like they owe it to themselves to give him another year.

Big P

05-07-2010, 02:18 PM

I can't see the spurs would let ian go away

They did not pick up his option...that's kind of a big deal when you want to keep a player.

biziofromdowntown

05-07-2010, 04:31 PM

Gist will sign with an italian team next season.

yavozerb

05-07-2010, 05:21 PM

Gist will sign with an italian team next season.

I think we can officially end the Gist hype in 3,2,1...

Ocotillo

05-07-2010, 08:37 PM

6 months ago, I was sure at 99.9% that Ian was gone. Now, I gave him a 60% odd of being re-signed by Spurs this summer. :downspin:

Just a gut feeling or what's the logic?

Bruno

05-08-2010, 03:46 AM

Just a gut feeling or what's the logic?

The logic is based on Spurs moves since January:
http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4242081&postcount=3

And with Bonner sucking, I'm leaning with Spurs re-signing Ian.

Bruno

05-08-2010, 12:25 PM

Like I said, the Spurs are likely to try and re-sign Ian, but why would he want to stay?

Ian is surely disappointed to have played that few minutes this year but his history with Spurs is longer than that.
Spurs offered him guaranteed money with a first round pick and have worked a lot with him overseas and in Austin. Ian seems to also have a good relationship with his teammates.
There are a lot of reasons for Mahinmi to stay in SA if Spurs want him back.

Then if Splitter comes Ian is caught up in the numbers game again whether Bonner is re-signed or not.

Even with Duncan getting a lot of rest last summer and Pop limiting his RS minutes, he ran out of gas after the ASB. IMO, Pop will limit a lot Tim's minutes next year. 25mpg with no back to back seems realistic.
Dice will be 36 years old and playing his last season. He won't also play a lot of minutes.

The consequence is that a lot of playing time at PF/C will be available. I can see Blair, Splitter and a third player (like Mahinmi) getting all 20mpg during the regular season.

J_Paco

05-08-2010, 02:22 PM

Even with Duncan getting a lot of rest last summer and Pop limiting his RS minutes, he ran out of gas after the ASB. IMO, Pop will limit a lot Tim's minutes next year. 25mpg with no back to back seems realistic.
Dice will be 36 years old and playing his last season. He won't also play a lot of minutes.

The consequence is that a lot of playing time at PF/C will be available. I can see Blair, Splitter and a third player (like Mahinmi) getting all 20mpg during the regular season.

I completely agree, Bruno. Pop's two best rotation big men are going to need rest throughout the regular season which should open up minutes for Ian or whomever replaces him. The Matt Bonner experiment has been a failure, and I really think Pop will/should go with a more traditional front-court. Ian could finally get a real opportunity to play if re-signed, especially if either Bonner or McDyess don't return.

Bruno

05-08-2010, 03:40 PM

We'll see. It makes sense sure, and I'd love to see it because I know Ian personally and he is a great guy, but I just have trouble seeing him staying if a young team offers him more money and a better role.

Yep, we'll see.

Last November Ian said that his priority was to re-sign with SA. Maybe it has changed after a year without playing significant minutes, maybe not. I'm also curious to see how much other teams are interested in him.

Brazil

05-10-2010, 11:32 AM

Even with Duncan getting a lot of rest last summer and Pop limiting his RS minutes, he ran out of gas after the ASB. IMO, Pop will limit a lot Tim's minutes next year. 25mpg with no back to back seems realistic.
Dice will be 36 years old and playing his last season. He won't also play a lot of minutes.

The consequence is that a lot of playing time at PF/C will be available. I can see Blair, Splitter and a third player (like Mahinmi) getting all 20mpg during the regular season.

About the rotation bigs, 2 important things to consider IMO:
1- I don't see Pop abandon "the big who can shoot the 3" tactic. If we consider Tim, Dice, Blair, Splitter and Ian there is no room for this kind of profile therefore we can imagine Tim, Dice, Blair, Splitter and Bonner (or another big shooting the 3).
2- I'm not sure if Dice will play next year, he already said that he is thinking in retirement. If Dice retires Ian chances to be be signed improve a lot.

Globally I'm still puzzled by the way the spurs managed the Ian case: no cheap signing, 0 minute during a long stretch then spot minutes then huge minutes against NJ before the trade deadline then some spot minutes... It's going to be an interesting story during the offseason.

MaNu4Tres

05-10-2010, 11:53 AM

About the rotation bigs, 2 important things to consider IMO:
1- I don't see Pop abandon "the big who can shoot the 3" tactic. If we consider Tim, Dice, Blair, Splitter and Ian there is no room for this kind of profile therefore we can imagine Tim, Dice, Blair, Splitter and Bonner (or another big shooting the 3).
2- I'm not sure if Dice will play next year, he already said that he is thinking in retirement. If Dice retires Ian chances to be be signed improve a lot.

Globally I'm still puzzled by the way the spurs managed the Ian case: no cheap signing, 0 minute during a long stretch then spot minutes then huge minutes against NJ before the trade deadline then some spot minutes... It's going to be an interesting story during the offseason.

1- Pop doesn't necessarily need to covet a big that can shoot a 3 if he has a big small forward that can spread the floor( Maybe a summer with Chip can get Jefferson's confidence back).

2- Dice didn't say he was going to retire after this year. He said after next season. There's a reason why he signed for 2 years guaranteed last year.

I'm convinced Spurs kind of hid Mahimni hoping to resign him for 800k-1.5 million a year this summer.

Spurs gambled by not exercising Mahimni's option next year worth 1.75 million in hopes on saving Holt money next year. ( Mahimni would have essentially costed Holt 3.5 million if they exercised his option by being over the cap. If Spurs are able to resign him for 800k-1.5 million, they will be saving Holt 500k-2 million dollars.) Smart gamble by San Antonio's front office because Mahimni's market value shouldn't exceed the money he was due to make next year if they exercised the option.

Brazil

05-10-2010, 01:39 PM

1- Pop doesn't necessarily need to covet a big that can shoot a 3 if he has a big small forward that can spread the floor( Maybe a summer with Chip can get Jefferson's confidence back).

I agree with the Pop doesn't necessarily need to convet a big but the way he insisted with bonner during the RS and the POs the last two years even when Bonner sucked badly (and god knows he can suck badly) make me think he won't abandon this idea. I thought the fact that dice can shoot long 2 JS and RJ capability to score open 3s would be enough to spread the floor in Pop's mind. I was wrong he gave a ton of minutes to Bonner.

2- Dice didn't say he was going to retire after this year. He said after next season. There's a reason why he signed for 2 years guaranteed last year.

Thanks I misread his quote, so Dice will be there next year.

I'm convinced Spurs kind of hid Mahimni hoping to resign him for 800k-1.5 million a year this summer.

Spurs gambled by not exercising Mahimni's option next year worth 1.75 million in hopes on saving Holt money next year. ( Mahimni would have essentially costed Holt 3.5 million if they exercised his option by being over the cap. If Spurs are able to resign him for 800k-1.5 million, they will be saving Holt 500k-2 million dollars.) Smart gamble by San Antonio's front office because Mahimni's market value shouldn't exceed the money he was due to make next year if they exercised the option.

Convincing argument but I can see a team spending more than that for Ian, this kind of athlete is not that comun nowadays, I think another team will throw more money and take the gamble. Anyway I'm convinced Pop will go for a big capable to shoot the 3, so if Splitter comes in assuming Dice will stay, byebye Ian.

MaNu4Tres

05-10-2010, 02:25 PM

I agree with the Pop doesn't necessarily need to convet a big but the way he insisted with bonner during the RS and the POs the last two years even when Bonner sucked badly (and god knows he can suck badly) make me think he won't abandon this idea. I thought the fact that dice can shoot long 2 JS and RJ capability to score open 3s would be enough to spread the floor in Pop's mind. I was wrong he gave a ton of minutes to Bonner.

Spurs' front-court situation wasn't as deep as it will be next year with Splitter. Spurs had to play Bonner unless you suggest they should have played McDyess and Tim 35 minutes a night in the regular season.
Spurs had to play Bonner. They had no other proven options.

I think another team will throw more money and take the gamble. Anyway I'm convinced Pop will go for a big capable to shoot the 3, so if Splitter comes in assuming Dice will stay, byebye Ian.

I'm willing to bet you anything Mahimni will be a Spur next year, even if Splitter signs.

Look at last year's market, Channing Frye got 1.9 million and he was a main guy off the Blazers bench and contributed consistently to get them to the playoffs. Mahimni's value shouldn't be higher than Frye's was.IMO

I'll be more than surprised if a team offer's Mahimni half of the MLE.

Brazil

05-10-2010, 02:37 PM

Spurs' front-court situation wasn't as deep as it will be next year with Splitter. Spurs had to play Bonner unless you suggest they should have played McDyess and Tim 35 minutes a night in the regular season.
Spurs had to play Bonner. They had no other proven options.

It has not been the case during the suns serie tough. Dice played less than 20 mpg, maybe he thought Bonner was more mobile to cover the suns 3s or maybe he considers the way Dice and RJ spread the floor was not enough. Nevertheless he tried that 4 games and it didn't work because Bonner is really a liability in POs situation. We will see anyway but I will be like :wow if Pop hasn't his big who can shoot the 3s (see for instance the haislip experiment)

I'm willing to bet you anything Mahimni will be a Spur next year, even if Splitter signs.

Look at last year's market, Channing Frye got 1.9 million and he was a main guy off the Blazers bench and contributed consistently to get them to the playoffs. Mahimni's value shouldn't be higher than Frye's was.IMO

I'll be more than surprised if a team offer's Mahimni half of the MLE.

I really hope you're right, I'd love that to happen. Ian is nice guy kid and has a hell of potential, lets hope the Spurs will give him a chance.

Cane

05-10-2010, 03:00 PM

Brazil

05-10-2010, 03:15 PM

Every positive thing Ian has shown he's also had a dumb foul or defensive lapse to equalize it out. Unlike Scola, Dragic, Barbosa and the other Spurs blunders - Ian has been under the Spurs umbrella for a while and they have a damn good look on what kind of a quality player they've got. I don't see him sticking around since the Spurs didn't pick up his option and he also won't be getting minutes if the Spurs have Tiago/Duncan/Blair/McDyess and possibly Bonner.

I'm quite reluctant to respond to you cauz you gonna say i'm defending the french guys which is not the case really but come on between the so-called parker's decline and that, it seems we have a different way to look at the bb things.

First Ian is still very young (he has the same age than hill and we know that developing a big is a longer process) and second how can he be consistent if one day he is playing 5 mn, the other 0, the other one 20 mn and then nothing during 1 month etc... ? To contribute he needs time and I think that Pop was too busy by trying to integrate RJ, Blair and Bogans, it doesn't mean Ian is not a quality player.

Anyway, tbh I'm not optimist for Ian, priorities IMO for Pop will be bring Splitter, develop Blair and bring a big with a 3 point range or resign Bonner, not a lot of space for Ian.

SenorSpur

05-10-2010, 04:55 PM

I completely agree, Bruno. Pop's two best rotation big men are going to need rest throughout the regular season which should open up minutes for Ian or whomever replaces him. The Matt Bonner experiment has been a failure, and I really think Pop will/should go with a more traditional front-court. Ian could finally get a real opportunity to play if re-signed, especially if either Bonner or McDyess don't return.

Agree on all points.

Ian should be a priority this summer because he could potentially provide some immediate dividends. As Duncan is slowing down, his responsibilities should be offloaded immediately. In fact, the Spurs are about 2 years behind in this transition. Ian already knows the system, he needs "on-the-fly" playing time to fast-track his development. It's time for Pop and the Spurs to stop spoon-feeding this guy and thrust him into the rotation. I, for one, believe he will swim, rather than sink.

Need another reason to resign Ian? Here it is. The Fakers frontcourt depth. If any team is planning on trying to topple them, you're going to need to match their length and depth. You're not going to beat them with a small lineup. That said, a possible frontcourt of Duncan, Dice, Mahinmi, Splitter and Blair will have a far better chance at matching up against those guys.

Regardless of what happens with Splitter, Ian needs to be resigned. His skill set is much more of a necessity to this team.

Bonner, and his playoff failings have become an annual event. Time for him to go.

tdunk21

05-10-2010, 05:00 PM

i say resign ian....hire someone like alonzo mourning some great center as an assistant coach and start mentoring ian....dude has size and his only problems are fouls and turnovers....

objective

05-10-2010, 05:17 PM

Ian's only problems are minutes and trust, and he gets neither with the Spurs.

He'll blow up numbers-wise as soon as he gets an opportunity, and that's still probably not with SA.

MaNu4Tres

05-10-2010, 06:03 PM

Ian's only problems are minutes and trust, and he gets neither with the Spurs.

He'll blow up numbers-wise as soon as he gets an opportunity, and that's still probably not with SA.

Dyess won't get more than 15 minutes a game next year in the regular season.

I'll be surprised if Duncan plays more than 30 minutes a game. I think more around 25-28 mpg for Tim

That leaves around 56-51 minutes available for Splitter/Blair/Mahimni.

That's not including the second of back to backs Duncan or McDyess sits out.

IMO There will be plenty of opportunity for Splitter, Blair, and Mahimni.

I hope Spurs resign him.

Marcus Bryant

05-10-2010, 06:58 PM

My guess is he'll end up signing elsewhere on the cheap and then we'll wonder wtf Pop never played him.

Brazil

05-10-2010, 07:59 PM

My guess is he'll end up signing elsewhere on the cheap and then we'll wonder wtf Pop never played him.

lol it's a nice sumup

Mr.Bottomtooth

05-10-2010, 08:23 PM

Hopefully the Spurs sign him again. If he signs with another team, I'm sure it will be his coming out season. But I hope we see that with the Spurs. I still think he can be an above average player in the league.

SenorSpur

05-10-2010, 08:28 PM

ChumpDumper

05-10-2010, 08:35 PM

Invite him to summer league along with some other athletic free agent scrubs like Rod Benson and Kurt Looby and see if Ian can outplay them.

Biggems

05-10-2010, 09:11 PM

Would it be possible to trade Bonner and RJ since both have expiring contracts? I know RJ is making a buttload of money...so it might be difficult...

Biggems

05-10-2010, 09:19 PM

DesignatedT

05-10-2010, 11:57 PM

J_Paco

05-11-2010, 03:23 PM

Bruno

05-11-2010, 03:58 PM

Bruno, what's the likelihood that Ian will play for the French NT? Wasn't he playing well for them prior to getting injured last summer? Would be a great chance for Ian to play against quality international competition and help him with sticking in the NBA (with us).

It's a too soon to say. Ian wants to play for the NT this summer but it will depend on who is in (Noah and Turiaf are doubtful) and who the coach will select. I'm also not sure Ian will play with the NT if he hasn't signed a contract with a team when the NT campaign start (July 25th).

Yesterday, French NT coach has given a list of 31 players for this summer. Ian was in the list. What was said was the list would be shortened to 24 at the end of the month and to 16 in mid June. So we will a better idea on Ian playing or not with the NT this summer in one month with the 16 players list.

SenorSpur

05-11-2010, 06:04 PM

It's a too soon to say. Ian wants to play for the NT this summer but it will depend on who is in (Noah and Turiaf are doubtful) and who the coach will select. I'm also not sure Ian will play with the NT if he hasn't signed a contract with a team when the NT campaign start (July 25th).

Yesterday, French NT coach has given a list of 31 players for this summer. Ian was in the list. What was said was the list would be shortened to 24 at the end of the month and to 16 in mid June. So we will a better idea on Ian playing or not with the NT this summer in one month with the 16 players list.

If Ian does play with the French NT this summer, should we read anything into that?

coyotes_geek

05-11-2010, 10:14 PM

As old as this roster is, the objective is to get younger. Pop reiterated as much during exit interviews. That said, you don't accomplish that by jettisoning a young, 23 year-old, athletic center, who has not been given an opportunity to play. The time has come again to purge out older unproductive guys -not young talent.

This isn't an old roster anymore. Not by a longshot. Tim, Manu and Dyess are the only guys on the team older than 30 and there's seven guys younger than 25.

yavozerb

05-11-2010, 11:11 PM

This isn't an old roster anymore. Not by a longshot. Tim, Manu and Dyess are the only guys on the team older than 30 and there's seven guys younger than 25.

How many of these seven actually have contracts for next season?

coyotes_geek

05-12-2010, 06:05 AM

How many of these seven actually have contracts for next season?

Six. Hill & Blair = guaranteed. Hairston, Temple, Gee, Jerrells = unguaranteed. Mahinmi is the only <25 yr old on the team without a contract right now.

mogrovejo

05-12-2010, 10:05 AM

scottspurs

05-12-2010, 10:41 AM

Next season I want our bigs to be

C - Splitter, Ian, McDyess
PF - Duncan, Blair, Pittman

McDyess retires after next season, and Duncan in a couple of years.....that leaves us Splitter, Ian, Blair, and Pittman...which is a very nice nucleus of bigs to have.

Pittman is horrible and this is coming from a Texas fan. I wouldn't even want him on the toros. He can only play 18 minutes a game because of his conditioning and he would be the biggest transition D nightmare ever. He would make Tim Duncan look like a track star he is so slow. If you want a player from Texas it should be either Avery Bradley or Damion James because they actually have a chance to make it the NBA unlike Pittman who will be lucky to make it 3 seasons in the D-League.

Biggems

05-12-2010, 07:48 PM

Pittman is horrible and this is coming from a Texas fan. I wouldn't even want him on the toros. He can only play 18 minutes a game because of his conditioning and he would be the biggest transition D nightmare ever. He would make Tim Duncan look like a track star he is so slow. If you want a player from Texas it should be either Avery Bradley or Damion James because they actually have a chance to make it the NBA unlike Pittman who will be lucky to make it 3 seasons in the D-League.

Pittman has improved each season and so has his conditioning. You give him to Pop and he will be 6'10, 250 lbs of wide load in the paint.

I am a UT fan and I feel that Barnes wasted Pittman...IMHO, Dex was not a great fit for the style the Horns play. They are too up and down, to erratic. He was one of the biggest players in the nation, and they refused to feed him in the half court. Instead James, Bradley, Hamilton, and Johnson would take turns throwing up shot after shot.

BTW, if we drafted Pittman in the 2nd, he would be an end of bench player until McDyess and Duncan retired.....by then, he would have learned our system and had a few years in our strength and conditioning program, as well as allowed his game to evolve (improving his FT% and adding a midrange jumper).

But if you dont like Pittman, and I cannot convince you, there is always Zoubek from Duke. He is not a great athlete, but he is one heckuva rebounder, he is a legit 7 fter and he is a decent shot blocker.

J_Paco

05-12-2010, 11:22 PM

Next season I want our bigs to be

C - Splitter, Ian, Duncan, Blair, Pittman
PF - McDyess

McDyess retires after next season, and Duncan in a couple of years.....that leaves us Splitter, Ian, Blair, and Pittman...which is a very nice nucleus of bigs to have.

Fixed.

I think Ian and Tiago both have the mobility to guard power forwards, and I definitely think Ian can play PF on offense. Plus, Blair just doesn't have the size needed to be a center in the NBA. DeJuan needs to develop his jumper so that he can be paired with an interior scorer (Ian, Timmy and Tiago).

Uriel

05-13-2010, 12:28 AM

venitian navigator

05-13-2010, 01:54 AM

If you're a proponent of bringing back Mahinmi, I think there are 2 things you genuinely need to be concerned about.

First of all, the Spurs have made it clear that they intend to go hard to try and acquire Tiago Splitter. The way I look at it, having a frontcourt rotation that consists of Duncan, McDyess, Splitter, and potentially Bonner essentially relegates Ian to the end of the bench, leaving him with little to no playing time. This is especially troublesome since Ian, though he has great potential, is still somewhat raw and his deprivation of minutes, which is only compounded by his lack of D-League eligibility, will only derail his development.

Second, and I think most people fail to consider this, is that other NBA teams actually seem genuinely interested in him. As stated above, Ian, with his astounding physical tools, has, at least in my opninion, quite a high ceiling, and an NBA team may, as is usually the case with free agency, find a way to make him an offer that may put him outside of our price range.

Looking at things from this perspective, it's hard to see Mahinmi being back in the Spurs next season.

The way I see it, is that you can't have enough good big players on your team in a season that plays 82 regular season games.
My idea for next year will be (bigs) : Duncan - Splitter
Blair - Mahinmi
Bonner - Mc Dyess

Tim will be 34, Dice 37...how many regular season minutes per game should they play ?
I'll say more : how many regular season games should they play ?

The good of having 15 players is you can, and must, rotate them if you want to preserve energies...so let the young studs (Splitter, Mahinmi, Blair) play all games and the most part of minutes in regular season games, so they can develop confidence in each other.
I don't care if we don't make the play offs, we already seen that with our actual core we're gonna be swept long before the finals.
If with a young core we also make the play offs than our veterans will be rested and effective.
We have to talke some risk.
We need young energies...and start to think to preserve our veterans for what can be their effective contribution at a maximum level in play off's time.

Bruno

05-26-2010, 06:17 AM

Some news about Ian:
He was today on French radio and talked about his future:
- The deciding factor will be playing time.
- His goal is to stay in SA but it would depend on playing time.
- Spurs said they were happy with his season but they haven't told they want to re-sign him because there are a lot of parameters (FA, draft...). Ian told Spurs still don't know what they will do this summer.
- Splitter will be a factor. If Spurs signs Splitter and Keep Blair, Duncan and Dice, Ian should go. He doesn't want to be the 5th bigman like at the end of the year because only 4 ones get consistent playing time.
- If he has nothing in NBA, he is ready to come back in Europe. However, he sounds confident about getting another opportunity in the NBA. Even if teams aren't allowed to make offers, there are some good talks around him.

For French speaking people, a podcast of the show is available: http://podcast.rtl.fr/podcast_rtl_carrement_basket.xml
I recommend to listen it, Ian is damn well-spoken.

Mel_13

05-26-2010, 06:50 AM

Some news about Ian:

Thanks, Bruno.

Ian appears to be taking a mature, professional approach to the process. It's good to see that, as opposed to some of the emotional stuff posted around here, Ian still sees the Spurs as his first choice. It means that Ian never stopped working and the staff never stopped coaching.

Coming back as the 5th big, as you say, makes little sense for him. Although if the Spurs would guarantee 2 or 3 years then he could move into the spot that will be vacated by Dice in one year. Still, going someplace where significant minutes are more likely is probably better for his career.

I'd love to see Ian emerge as a productive NBA player with the Spurs. We've seen a few intriguing glimpses of what might be possible. Look at Robin Lopez. The guy had more fouls than points for more than a season and then, almost out of nowhere, becomes a legit NBA player.

mogrovejo

05-26-2010, 07:13 AM

He's done with San Antonio. Avec un peu de chance, il ira à Boston. Allez, allez Ian.

MaNu4Tres

05-26-2010, 07:25 AM

Thanks Bruno :tu

FWIW, not that it means much, a family amigo of mine that has ties in the org. made it aware they intended for Mahinmi to grow with George, Blair, Hairston on forward and he indicated San Antonio being his first option as well. Truth of the matter is, Spurs can't really foresee the future and know what exactly is going to happen. There's too many unknowns this early in the off-season, Splitter signing?; a trade proposal they can't turn down; a player in the draft dropping to them; ect.

Anyway it's good to know Spurs are still high on Mahinmi and were still happy with his season.

I'll be the first to admit, a year ago I wasn't sold on the guy. I was wrong. As the season went a long, the more and more he won me over in the limited action he received. Like Mel 13 said

I'd love to see Ian emerge as a productive NBA player with the Spurs. We've seen a few intriguing glimpses of what might be possible. Look at Robin Lopez. The guy had more fouls than points for more than a season and then, almost out of nowhere, becomes a legit NBA player.

Bruno

05-26-2010, 08:37 AM

Coming back as the 5th big, as you say, makes little sense for him.

It isn't me who say that but Ian. Ian said that if Spurs sign Spliter and keep Blair, Dice and Duncan, he would be again the 5th bigman like this year. He added that it would be a complicate situation for him. When asked if he would try to go elsewhere in that scenario, he said yes.

Personally, I can see Ian being back in that scenario.
First, it's not a given Ian will find a team where he could be the 4th PF/C.
Second, Spurs won't guarantee Ian some playing time but they can explain him he will get way more opportunities than this year. I can see Spurs sitting Duncan for a game of a b2b and Dice for the other game of the b2b. With about 20 b2b per year, Ian will be the 4th PF/C in 40 games. Add injuries, bad games from Blair/Splitter/Dice and Ian could have some serious playing time next year even as the 5th PF/C. In 2011-2012, Dice will be gone and Ian could end up as the 4th PF/C. If Spurs wants him back, they should be able to convince him with these arguments.

Mel_13

05-26-2010, 08:45 AM

It isn't me who say that but Ian. Ian said that if Spurs sign Spliter and keep Blair, Dice and Duncan, he would be again the 5th bigman like this year. He added that it would be a complicate situation for him. When asked if he would try to go elsewhere in that scenario, he said yes.

Personally, I can see Ian being back in that scenario.
First, it's not a given Ian will find a team where he could be the 4th PF/C.
Second, Spurs won't guarantee Ian some playing time but they can explain him he will get way more opportunities than this year. I can see Spurs sitting Duncan for a game of a b2b and Dice for the other game of the b2b. With about 20 b2b per year, Ian will be the 4th PF/C in 40 games. Add injuries, bad games from Blair/Splitter/Dice and Ian could have some serious playing time next year even as the 5th PF/C. In 2011-2012, Dice will be gone and Ian could end up as the 4th PF/C. If Spurs wants him back, they should be able to convince him with these arguments.

That makes sense. I'm just glad that some reasonable scenarios exist for Ian staying with the Spurs. For much of the season his return seemed almost impossible. I'd much rather see the team go a little further with Ian than sign another past his prime vet like Theo.

Brazil

05-26-2010, 09:53 AM

He's done with San Antonio. Avec un peu de chance, il ira à Boston. Allez, allez Ian.

you speak french mogrovejo ?

benefactor

05-26-2010, 12:13 PM

I'd like to have Mahinmi back, but if I were him I'd go elsewhere. Why would he want to come back when he sat on the bench watching Pop go small time and time again instead of actually using his big man rotation?

mogrovejo

05-26-2010, 12:25 PM

you speak french mogrovejo ?

Yeps, bien sur. Learning French was actually mandatory where I went to school.

tav1

05-26-2010, 12:38 PM

scuttlebutt from the draft combine was consistent with all this...Ndiaye is most concerned about playing time for Mahinmi...he'd prefer Ian play for a Euro team that will give him solid minutes...Ian is not content as the 5th big, but would be interested with San Antonio if he assumed McDyess' regular season minutes...assuming Duncan, Blair and Splitter are 1,2,3 in the depth chart. The Bucks and Nets are two teams that have, at least as of last regular season, an interest in Mahinmi. Situation is very much up in the air.

HarlemHeat37

05-26-2010, 12:57 PM

Yeps, bien sur. Learning French was actually mandatory where I went to school.

Same here, although I don't really have anywhere to speak it these days:lol..

As for Ian, I hope he's back, but obviously it would make sense for him to want PT..TBH, I can see Mahinmi getting minutes here next year..Duncan's knees gave up on him again this season, so I'm assuming that Pop will rest him even more..McDyess doesn't play a lot during the regular season anyways..

There will be minutes available if both parties are interested IMO..I wonder how Bonner ties in here though..

Mel_13

05-26-2010, 01:03 PM

There will be minutes available if both parties are interested IMO..I wonder how Bonner ties in here though..

Let's hope he doesn't. If they add Splitter and Bonner stays, then there is almost no way for Ian to get minutes.

HarlemHeat37

05-26-2010, 01:05 PM

Ya, that's what I meant..

I imagine the FO still likes Bonner though, so we'll see..

Mel_13

05-26-2010, 01:10 PM

Ya, that's what I meant..

I imagine the FO still likes Bonner though, so we'll see..

I hope not. Even for one year at the vet min. As with Mason, it is simply time to move on.

DesignatedT

05-26-2010, 01:29 PM

Pretty sure spurs want to sign splitter 1st then worry about the other bigs left on the roster. Duncan,Splitter,Dice,Blair would be a solid front court. the 5th big isn't that big of a priority and frankly Bonner might not be a bad choice for that role. He knows the system well and can give solid minutes if asked during the regular season (of course im assuming that he wont crack the rotation in meaningful games)

Bruno

05-26-2010, 04:49 PM

What happens in the draft will also be a big factor for Mahinmi's potential future with Spurs.

While we are focused on Spurs drafting a SF, we can imagine a scenario where one of Whiteside, Orton or Patterson is available at #20. Spurs could also don't like the SFs available at #20 and go with a player like Larry Sanders. They could even really like a player like Jarvis Varnado or Craig Brackins and grab him somewhere in the second round.

What I've learned when I heard Ian's today, is that Spurs clearly haven't fully given up on him. Re-signing is an option but Spurs could also take another route and that's why they haven't made some kind of commitment to him.

TD 21

05-27-2010, 01:11 AM

MaNu4Tres

05-27-2010, 02:04 AM

As you were saying, MaNu4Tres...

You never get it. You try to ...but you don't

I was simply saying what was brought to my attention earlier this year. I could care less whether you believe me or not. I never said Mahinmi doesn't care about playing. I never said Splitter won't be a factor in his decision.

What I did say is exactly what Bruno had to say in regards of the situation, which was brought to my attention.

Personally, I can see Ian being back in that scenario.
First, it's not a given Ian will find a team where he could be the 4th PF/C.
Second, Spurs won't guarantee Ian some playing time but they can explain him he will get way more opportunities than this year. I can see Spurs sitting Duncan for a game of a b2b and Dice for the other game of the b2b. With about 20 b2b per year, Ian will be the 4th PF/C in 40 games. Add injuries, bad games from Blair/Splitter/Dice and Ian could have some serious playing time next year even as the 5th PF/C. In 2011-2012, Dice will be gone and Ian could end up as the 4th PF/C. If Spurs wants him back, they should be able to convince him with these arguments.

Fact of the matter is, you can never predict what will actually unfold prior to an off-season. You just can't. There's just many scenarios that could play out (A trade proposal that you can't turn down; a draft pick falling in your lap, ect.) There could be a 90% possibility of something to happen and it could go down the shitter, if better opportunities present themselves. I figured you would be aware of that. I guess not.

Just do me a favor.... Save the immature mocking sentence until late July and perhaps early August when things actually unfold.

mountainballer

05-27-2010, 03:56 AM

one thing for sure. Ian isn't a priority and not a plan A,B or C.
he might be back into consideration when Draft, Splitter, trades, even Bonner questions are answered. for sure there is a scenario that sees Ian with the Spurs next season (either draft no big, Splitter doesn't come, Bonner leaves, trade involves Dice) but I think the chance is very very small.

Bruno

05-27-2010, 04:50 AM

one thing for sure. Ian isn't a priority and not a plan A,B or C.

Well, that's just your opinion.

Signing Splitter and Mahinmi to go with a Duncan, Dice, Blair, Splitter and Mahinmi rotation could very well be Spurs plan A.

One thing for sure, you and me don't know Spurs' plan.

MaNu4Tres

05-27-2010, 11:05 AM

“If a team offers me a consequent playing time, I will thus sign with it. If the Spurs offered me a good project, I will stay in San Antonio. I would love to stay in San Antonio.”

Bruno or anyone have an idea what he means by good project?

Bruno

05-27-2010, 11:23 AM

Ian said "If Spurs have a good development plan for me, I will stay in San Antonio"

venitian navigator

05-27-2010, 12:09 PM

I like this attitude.
He's right in asking to Spurs F.O. at least a good development for him...he has already demostrated that the F.O. has made an error not exercising his option and, for what I understood, the F.O. has already told him that they were pleased of the way he played and behaved this season.
Ian has not played enough for let people have a real idea of what he really could do...but in my wiew he's a good person, with very good athletic ability, that knows the system, has already good relationship with the other players and, finally, has a lot of will to show what he's able to do.
Not a bad combination at all...

SenorSpur

05-27-2010, 01:54 PM

Same here, although I don't really have anywhere to speak it these days:lol..

As for Ian, I hope he's back, but obviously it would make sense for him to want PT..TBH, I can see Mahinmi getting minutes here next year..Duncan's knees gave up on him again this season, so I'm assuming that Pop will rest him even more..McDyess doesn't play a lot during the regular season anyways..

There will be minutes available if both parties are interested IMO..I wonder how Bonner ties in here though..

I would also hope Bonner doesn't factor into Ian's situation either. The tools and talent that this kid has are much more harder to come by. He's shown more in his short stints of playing time, than Bonner has all season.

If the coaching staff would make a commitment toward getting Ian productive minutes, I believe we'd see a year of solid, productive contribution from him.

As a result, the Spurs frontline would be that much more better and deeper from tapping into the investment that is Ian, as opposed to watching another year of Bonner's postseason failings.

TD 21

05-27-2010, 06:45 PM

You never get it. You try to ...but you don't

I was simply saying what was brought to my attention earlier this year. I could care less whether you believe me or not. I never said Mahinmi doesn't care about playing. I never said Splitter won't be a factor in his decision.

What I did say is exactly what Bruno had to say in regards of the situation, which was brought to my attention.

Fact of the matter is, you can never predict what will actually unfold prior to an off-season. You just can't. There's just many scenarios that could play out (A trade proposal that you can't turn down; a draft pick falling in your lap, ect.) There could be a 90% possibility of something to happen and it could go down the shitter, if better opportunities present themselves. I figured you would be aware of that. I guess not.

Just do me a favor.... Save the immature mocking sentence until late July and perhaps early August when things actually unfold.

I don't give a shit what you supposedly heard, I told you why it's highly unlikely Mahinmi will return and Mahinmi himself basically stated the exact same reasons. So how exactly do I not get it, supposedly? Because I didn't agree with your opinion, which only took into account a fan's perspective? You may not have said those things directly, but you certainly implied that those things wouldn't stand in the way. In fact, did you or did you not have Splitter AND Mahinmi in the same front court together?

I'm aware that you can't predict with 100% accuracy, but if you're knowledgeable and logical, you can generally piece things together. I may not be able to nail the exact player to fill certain roles, but I can nail the exact type of player that will. What you did was look at the Mahinmi situation strictly from a fan's perspective, while disregarding the player's and team's. Then when I brought those two relevant perspectives to light, you took issue.

Do me a favor and remember that I'm well aware of the scenario in which Mahinmi would re-sign. So, if that scenario plays itself out, I don't want to hear "I told you so". If, however, Mahinmi re-signs, in addition to Splitter signing and McDyess not being traded, then you can gloat all you want.

Answer me this: If the Spurs sign Splitter and don't trade McDyess, what makes you think Mahinmi would want to re-sign and what makes you think they'd re-sign him, given their infatuation with having a stretch four on the roster?

MaNu4Tres

05-27-2010, 07:41 PM

In fact, did you or did you not have Splitter AND Mahinmi in the same front court together?

I did and I came to such consensus due to the information that was brought to my intention that

A) They loved his progression throughout the year and intend to retain him
B) That he loves San Antonio and it's highly unlikely another place would be his 1st option. (Assumption he loves San Antonio and staying in San Antonio still is a priority)
C) That there would still be minutes available for him, if you dissect the scenario, where Tim and McDyess' minutes are limited.
D) They want him to grow for the future with the young players. Mahinmi said playing time would be a factor. Well there will be more next year than this year for sure, and most definitely there will be some next year when McDyess retires.

Funny how Mahinmi was also quoted saying this.

“If a team offers me a consequent playing time, I will thus sign with it. If the Spurs offered me a good project, I will stay in San Antonio. I would love to stay in San Antonio.”

I'm aware that you can't predict with 100% accuracy, but if you're knowledgeable and logical, you can generally piece things together.

I want to think that I have pieced a lot of information together. Who knows maybe I'm unable to do that from your perspective.

Answer me this: If the Spurs sign Splitter and don't trade McDyess, what makes you think Mahinmi would want to re-sign and what makes you think they'd re-sign him, given their infatuation with having a stretch four on the roster?

*Why Mahinmi would want to resign?

Let me refresh your memory...
“If a team offers me a consequent playing time, I will thus sign with it. If the Spurs offered me a good project, I will stay in San Antonio. I would love to stay in San Antonio.” - Ian Mahinmi

Mahimni has a better chance being a Spur than you obviously think. You think Mahinmi will get offered a situation that gives him more opportunity. I agree to that to an extent. Although, I don't think there's a team out there that will offer him a starting job. Having said that now lets look at how many minutes most bench bigs play.( 12-20 minutes a night). Ok settled.

So if the organization that drafted him and groomed him with their very own personnel for 5 years offers him the same amount of money you don't think Mahinmi would resign? This is after R.C and the Spurs brass lays out the blueprint, which demonstrates to Yan how the opportunities will be there this year and especially next year when Dyess retires and even more so the following when Tim retires.

*What makes me think they would want to resign him? Or in other words interested in bringing him back and have him grow in the program?

- Because of what was brought to my attention (even if it was 2 months ago). As simple as that is. It's the truth.

*In regard of the stretch 4?

-It just so happened that the Spurs' 2nd best big man from 2004-2008 was Robert Horry, and just because Matt Bonner was their 3rd or 4th best big man from 2008-2010 doesn't mean Spurs will dig to the bottom of the barrel to find a stretch 4.

The quality of a big man comes first in regard of who they want to add to their roster, if they can stretch the floor that's even more valuable to their team. But quality comes first. They aren't going to overlook quality just to find a damn 4 that stretches the floor. Sorry they are not.

And if they had to dig to find a stretch four, the addition won't be intended to help this year or possibly even next year's team. The signing would be for development purposes and be spending his first year on the inactive roster and in Austin.

Spurs have just about always carried a 5th big on their active roster with the intent that he could help now. Therefore, digging to the bottom of the barrel to find a stretch 4 for the 5th spot in the rotation is very unlikely (sp?)

mogrovejo

05-27-2010, 08:22 PM

The quality of a big man comes first in regard of who they want to add to their roster, if they can stretch the floor that's even more valuable to their team. But quality comes first. They aren't going to overlook quality just to find a damn 4 that stretches the floor. Sorry they are not.

I think they are.

A Duncan+Splitter+McDyess+Blair+Mahinmi big man rotation lacks a big deal of versatility.

Up to a point, teams are willing to sacrifice some talent in order to gain some versatility.

Flux451

05-27-2010, 08:25 PM

Spurs have spent to much time invested to let him walk.
With Dyess playing minimal this year it only makes sense for him to be the 4th big man option.

I would hope Bonner walks. Size matters in the NBA now. We need a legit 7fter.

Flux451

05-27-2010, 08:26 PM

I think they are.

A Duncan+Splitter+McDyess+Blair+Mahinmi big man rotation lacks a big deal of versatility.

please elaborate this.

MaNu4Tres

05-27-2010, 08:31 PM

I think they are.

A Duncan+Splitter+McDyess+Blair+Mahinmi big man rotation lacks a big deal of versatility.

That's your opinion. Which I respect.

Although I disagree to an extent. Of course versatility is something teams look for. But do you dig to the bottom of the barrel just to add a 6'8"+ shooting big man that has the ability to shoot? I think not. And if you do would it make a difference in the grand scheme of things?

An example can be Scalabrine on the Celtics right now. Is his addition really as valued as you claim, in regard of teams value versatility over quality to a degree? I don't see it.

I'd much rather use Jefferson at the 4 than put my eggs into the basket of a Scalabrine or a Tolliver. That's just me though.

TD 21

05-27-2010, 08:52 PM

I did and I came to such consensus due to the information that was brought to my intention that

A) They loved his progression throughout the year and intend to retain him
B) That he loves San Antonio and it's highly unlikely another place would be his 1st option. (Assumption he loves San Antonio and staying in San Antonio still is a priority)
C) That there would still be minutes available for him, if you dissect the scenario, where Tim and McDyess' minutes are limited.
D) They want him to grow for the future with the young players. Mahinmi said playing time would be a factor. Well there will be more next year than this year for sure, and most definitely there will be some next year when McDyess retires.

Funny how Mahinmi was also quoted saying this.

“If a team offers me a consequent playing time, I will thus sign with it. If the Spurs offered me a good project, I will stay in San Antonio. I would love to stay in San Antonio.”

I want to think that I have pieced a lot of information together. Who knows maybe I'm unable to do that from your perspective.

*Why Mahinmi would want to resign?

Let me refresh your memory...
“If a team offers me a consequent playing time, I will thus sign with it. If the Spurs offered me a good project, I will stay in San Antonio. I would love to stay in San Antonio.” - Ian Mahinmi

*What makes me think they would want to resign him? Or in other words interested in bringing him back and have him grow in the program?

- Because of what was brought to my attention (even if it was 2 months ago). As simple as that is. It's the truth.

*In regard of the stretch 4?

-It just so happened that the Spurs' 2nd best big man from 2004-2008 was Robert Horry, and just because Matt Bonner was their 3rd or 4th best big man from 2008-2010 doesn't mean Spurs will dig to the bottom of the barrel to find a stretch 4.

The quality of a big man comes first in regard of who they want to add to their roster, if they can stretch the floor that's even more valuable to their team. But quality comes first. They aren't going to overlook quality just to find a damn 4 that stretches the floor. Sorry they are not.

And if they had to dig to find a stretch four, the addition won't be intended to help this year or possibly even next year's team. The signing would be for development purposes and be spending his first year on the inactive roster and in Austin.

Spurs have just about always carried a 5th big on their active roster with the intent that he could help now. Therefore, digging to the bottom of the barrel to find a stretch 4 for the 5th spot in the rotation is very unlikely (sp?)

I buy A, B and D, but not C.

As I've said all along, I get it from the Spurs perspective.

You're not understanding what I'm saying. What I'm saying is I understand the scenario where Mahinmi would re-sign. I just think the likelihood of that scenario coming to fruition is unlikely. What Mahinmi is saying is no different than what Mason said and we all know he's not coming back.

Once again, taking what I said out of context. I said if Splitter is signed and McDyess retained, why would Mahinmi want to re-sign?

You're not piecing information together. If you were, you'd take into account how this regime has constructed teams in the past. You and I may not be obsessed or infatuated with having a stretch four, but they are. They've made that abundantly clear.

I hope you're right about the quality of the big man coming first and not digging to the bottom of the barrel to get a stretch four, but their history suggests otherwise. Buford talked about their three-point shooting slipping from their championship years, so it's hard for me to see them just bringing in one wing who can shoot the three and calling it a day as far as that's concerned.

Blackjack

05-27-2010, 09:12 PM

I think you two are talking past each other a bit and are a lot closer in your view then the debate would leave one to believe.

Seems to me 'Tres is coming to his conclusions off of a little bit of insight he came across, which might not coincide with conventional wisdom or the best rationale. But conventional wisdom and rationale don't always consider loyalty, comfort and particular emotions that might supersede all the quantitative facts; minutes and role chiefly among them.

So I get where 'Tres is coming from and I want to believe he's correct. But I also see where TD 21 is coming from because he's speaking to recent history or how they've conducted themselves in the past, which would be conventional wisdom and sound rationale. I think the insight 'Tres was able to acquire is the biggest differentiation here and the argument might be completely reversed had TD 21 been given that insight and not 'Tres.

Buford talked about their three-point shooting slipping from their championship years, so it's hard for me to see them just bringing in one wing who can shoot the three and calling it a day as far as that's concerned.

That's obviously a big concern but what would be the likelihood that the Spurs could find that skill-set in a big man they could afford? I think they'll go with people they believe can contribute when the chips are down and possibly a young big with D-League eligibility if they don't believe Mahinmi can be that type of player. I'm sure they'd love a stretch 4/5 to make life easier on Tim and their paint-living point guard but with the way the season ended and the way Timmy looked physically ... I believe it got the organization's attention.

They need Bigs to be big. Or, more appropriately, Tim needs them to be big.

MaNu4Tres

05-27-2010, 09:18 PM

You're not piecing information together. If you were, you'd take into account how this regime has constructed teams in the past. You and I may not be obsessed or infatuated with having a stretch four, but they are. They've made that abundantly clear.

And where did those stretch 4's rank in terms of quality big men on the team?

Bonner was the 2nd most productive big last year and was the 3rd big man in the rotation most of this past year.

In Horry's case, he was the 2nd best big man from 2004-2007.

Spurs never have dug deep in the barrel (in terms of talent) and added a stretch 4 to help now, disregarding their overall talent level.

Spurs always carry 5 bigs on their active roster. Always. If there's any year all 5 guys will need to be of quality and need to be able to contribute, it's next year with Tim and McDyess in father time. This makes me believe even more so that they won't overlook quality just for the sake of adding a stretch 4 that can shoot, disregarding the talent level.

Mel_13

05-27-2010, 09:21 PM

I think you two are talking past each other a bit and are a lot closer in your view then the debate would leave one to believe.

Blackjack making peace. :smokin

http://www.singleskunkseeds.com/images/products/Peace_Maker_5.jpeg

Blackjack

05-27-2010, 09:24 PM

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f302/johnniewalks/l_41c691f3f3f3baf5169d70bd3a0d3def.gif

:elephant :downspin: :smokin

MaNu4Tres

05-27-2010, 09:34 PM

I hope you're right about the quality of the big man coming first and not digging to the bottom of the barrel to get a stretch four, but their history suggests otherwise.

Read my last post.

Spurs have never dug to the bottom of the barrel for the sake of finding a stretch 4, disregarding their overall talent level. So their history doesn't suggest otherwise.

Overall quality does play a vital part in their evaluation and will even more so next season. With only the minimum-LLE, they won't be able to attain a stretch 4 of quality. Unless it's Bonner because of the loyalty factor. If Bonner leaves for more money, the stretch 4's available for the minimum-LLE are no where near as valuable as Bonner (40% 3 point shooter) and would be of inferior quality.

Spurs need their 5th big to be of quality next year more than ever.

TD 21

05-27-2010, 10:55 PM

And where did those stretch 4's rank in terms of quality big men on the team?

Bonner was the 2nd most productive big last year and was the 3rd big man in the rotation most of this past year.

In Horry's case, he was the 2nd best big man from 2004-2007.

Spurs never have dug deep in the barrel (in terms of talent) and added a stretch 4 to help now, disregarding their overall talent level.

Spurs always carry 5 bigs on their active roster. Always. If there's any year all 5 guys will need to be of quality and need to be able to contribute, it's next year with Tim and McDyess in father time. This makes me believe even more so that they won't overlook quality just for the sake of adding a stretch 4 that can shoot, disregarding the talent level.

Remember Ferry?

What did you think Haislip was? You think they plucked him out of obscurity for no reason? It was a shot to see if they could find a cheaper, more athletic alternative to Bonner. The Spurs had planned for this situation a year ago.

The reality is the Spurs didn't plan on Blair falling to them. Had he not, the composition of this front court would look different than I expect it to look next season. But that's where a stretch four not being amongst the top four bigs got squeezed; Blair's spot. I don't think it was ever by design.

Read my last post.

Spurs have never dug to the bottom of the barrel for the sake of finding a stretch 4, disregarding their overall talent level. So their history doesn't suggest otherwise.

Overall quality does play a vital part in their evaluation and will even more so next season. With only the minimum-LLE, they won't be able to attain a stretch 4 of quality. Unless it's Bonner because of the loyalty factor. If Bonner leaves for more money, the stretch 4's available for the minimum-LLE are no where near as valuable as Bonner (40% 3 point shooter) and would be of inferior quality.

Spurs need their 5th big to be of quality next year more than ever.

Sure they never had to, because they generally had one amongst their top four bigs. Like I said, had Blair not fallen to them, I still think they'd have a stretch four amongst their top four bigs. When I talked about their history, I meant in terms of having a stretch four period.

Until I see otherwise, I'm going to assume that a stretch four is going to be on this roster. As for candidates, guys like Kurz, Tolliver, Novak, etc. are all attainable. I've brought up Cook (though the more I've thought about it, I don't think they'll sign him). There are options. Limited and not necessarily good options, but options nonetheless.

MaNu4Tres

05-27-2010, 11:21 PM

Remember Ferry?

Yeah I do, #35 bald guy who frequently competed with Malik on who could dive on the floor the most and get down and dirty. Had one of the purest set shots the silver and black has seen. That unfortunately never fell against the Lakers.

Ferry was a small forward. He wasn't a big man. He could have played the 4, but they never played him at power forward or the 4 spot. He always played the small forward position with Derek Anderson at the 2 and Terry Porter at point.

Making your point irrelevant. He wasn't a 4.

What did you think Haislip was? You think they plucked him out of obscurity for no reason? It was a shot to see if they could find a cheaper, more athletic alternative to Bonner. The Spurs had planned for this situation a year ago.

We were and are talking about the 5th spot in the rotation, assuming the successful pursuit of Splitter.

They didn't sign Haislip as their 5th big. He was a low risk;high reward small forward/power forward that they didn't expect to contribute. It was a low risk; high reward situation and he was the 7th big behind Mahinmi, Ratliff, Bonner, Blair, Duncan and Dyess.

Like I said before, Spurs will need their 5th big to be able to contribute right now. Quality will be the priority, regardless if they can stretch the floor or not for this spot on the active roster.

Now once they add their quality big man as their 5th big, like resigning Mahinmi for instance, then I can see the Spurs adding a project stretch 4 for the minimum as the 6th guy, who would be sporting a his best wardrobe from Men's Warehouse.

But since we are talking about the 5th big in the rotation ( not 6th, not 7th like Haislip, which is irrelevant in the grand scheme of things), I'm willing to bet anything they won't dig to the bottom of the barrel, overlooking overall quality, just to find a player of lesser quality that has the ability to stretch a defense out.(Kurz, Tolliver, Novak)

What you got?

50,000 VBookie cash? You down or what? Put your money where your mouth is.

What are we betting?

I'm betting Spurs won't dig to the bottom of the barrel and add a Novak, Kurtz, Tolliver, Cook for the 5th spot in the rotation.

You in or are you out?

TD 21

05-27-2010, 11:35 PM

Yeah I do, #35 bald guy who frequently competed with Malik on who could dive on the floor the most and get down and dirty. Had one of the purest set shots the silver and black has seen. That unfortunately never fell against the Lakers.

Ferry was a small forward. He wasn't a big man. He could have played the 4, but they never played him at power forward or the 4 spot. He always played the small forward position with Derek Anderson at the 2 and Terry Porter at point.

Making your point irrelevant. He wasn't a 4.

We were and are talking about the 5th spot in the rotation, assuming the successful pursuit of Splitter.

They didn't sign Haislip as their 5th big. He was a low risk;high reward small forward/power forward that they didn't expect to contribute. It was a low risk; high reward situation and he was the 7th big behind Mahinmi, Ratliff, Bonner, Blair, Duncan and Dyess.

Like I said before, Spurs will need their 5th big to be able to contribute right now. Quality will be the priority, regardless if they can stretch the floor or not for this spot on the active roster.

Now once they add their quality big man as their 5th big, like resigning Mahinmi for instance, then I can see the Spurs adding a project stretch 4 for the minimum as the 6th guy, who would be sporting a his best wardrobe from Men's Warehouse.

But since we are talking about the 5th big in the rotation ( not 6th, not 7th like Haislip, which is irrelevant in the grand scheme of things), I'm willing to bet anything they won't dig to the bottom of the barrel, overlooking overall quality, just to find a player of lesser quality that has the ability to stretch a defense out.(Kurz, Tolliver, Novak)

What you got?

50,000 VBookie cash? You down or what? Put your money where your mouth is.

What are we betting?

I'm betting Spurs won't dig to the bottom of the barrel and add a Novak, Kurtz, Tolliver, Cook for the 5th spot in the rotation.

You in or are you out?

You're right, he was more of a three than a four, but really he was a combo forward and particularly towards the end of his Spurs tenure, he played mostly as a four. The Spurs would play three bigs: Duncan, Robinson, Rose. The fourth, depending on match-up, would be Willis or Ferry.

Haislip was not a SF at all; he was strictly a PF. You obviously drank the kool-aid about how the Spurs could see him playing SF. The point is, I think he was signed obviously as a flier, but also looking ahead to this season as a potential mix of Bonner/Mahinmi as the fifth big. I don't have any so-called sources like you apparently do, that's just my opinion. Sorry, Mr. Technical, Haislip was not the 7th big, he was 6th to start the season; Mahinmi was 7th.

To the Spurs, a tall guy who's an outside threat is contributing. Even if that player is a liability in most other aspects of the game. Quality is YOUR priority, how do you know it's theirs? As least I'm basing my thinking on past history. You're just saying what you'd like to see happen and passing it off as fact.

I doubt the Spurs carry 15 players next season, which is why I don't see their being a 6th big and why I see the 5th big being a shooter.

I don't even use Vbookie cash, but even if I did, I don't have 50, 000 to bet.

I'm betting the Spurs will bring in one of those types, IF the first four bigs are Duncan, Splitter, McDyess and Blair.

MaNu4Tres

05-28-2010, 12:14 AM

As least I'm basing my thinking on past history.

So in regards of the active roster, the Spurs always dig to the bottom of the barrel of the free agency pool to fill it out? So in regards of filling out the active roster out, they always overlook the overall quality of the free agent as long as they have the ability to make a three? For the active roster? I'm talking about the big men for the active roster.

I can hear Pop and R.C right now," Attention free agents, we've had success with one of the best role players, who happened to be one of the best 3 point shooting power forwards in the history of the game from 2004 through 2007. We were also fortunate to find a diamond in the rough when we traded for Matt Bonner's expiring contract because we made a mistake giving the Rasho Nestorovic a 48 million dollar contract. Fortunately for us Bonner earned his stripes and slowly earned quality minutes by the 2008 season. He ended up one of the most consistent 3 point shooting role players in the league for us the past 3 seasons.

With that, since we've had success with them, we are willing to sign anyone who has the ability to make a 3 point shot to fill out an important spot on the active roster. Only stipulations are you have to be 6'8" are above. Don't worry we don't care about anything else you can or can't do on the court. Tryouts will be held at Incarnate Ward University. Goodluck."

That is what you're basically saying. You are saying Spurs don't care about overall quality for the 5th spot on the active roster and they will overlook that aspect to add a player like Novak, Kurtz, Tolliver, or Cook.

I have to disagree.

So we can agree to disagree obviously.

We will find out in time.

The Truth #6

05-28-2010, 01:28 AM

I don't know...I think they do put a high priority on finding their stretch 4. A few years back we already Bonner and Gist was playing extremely well in Summer league. We desperately needed a mobile 4 who was athletic and could hustle. Instead, we sign Tolliver just to have insurance in case Bonner didn't produce. We cut Tolliver and Bonner still didn't produce. I'd say that's putting a high priority on having a stretch 4. Basically, Pop is locked into past archetypes and he will keep looking for the next Horry - even though Horry's greatest strength was defense and BBIQ - two things Bonner utterly lacks. Horry made big shots but was not a great shooter. Bonner is a great shooter who has never made a big shot. Nonetheless, we stuck with him every time.

In other words...I don't see Ian coming back.

MaNu4Tres

05-28-2010, 01:42 AM

I'm aware on how Popovich likes the ability to have a stretch 4 to spread the floor. I know I wear glasses from time to time, but I'm not that blind.

I think they would like to have a stretch 4 in the perfect scenario. I just don't think they would sign a player of Kurtz, Novak, Cook, or Tolliver's caliber to be an important 5th big man.

And I say important because next year that 5th big will see more time than usual due to Tim and McDyess' anticipated limited minutes. I just don't see them making such of a desperate addition just to have a stretch 4.

I wouldn't be surprised if they made a move to find a better quality stretch 4 instead of the players TD 21 mentioned, or draft a player like Babbit in hopes of him being a hybrid 3/4 man.

I just don't see them searching at the bottom of the free agent pool for a player like Kurtz, Novak, Tolliver or Cook for that 5th spot. As I've said many times.

The Truth #6

05-28-2010, 02:09 AM

I hope they don't either.

objective

05-28-2010, 03:16 AM

Ferry was a small forward. He wasn't a big man. He could have played the 4, but they never played him at power forward or the 4 spot. He always played the small forward position with Derek Anderson at the 2 and Terry Porter at point.

Making your point irrelevant. He wasn't a 4.

I'm not involved in the argument but Ferry definitely played the 4 at times with the Spurs. And on paper even the 5.

He started a playoff game against the Suns in 03 in place of Robinson and pulled down 10 boards for just one instance.

MaNu4Tres

05-28-2010, 03:40 AM

I'm not involved in the argument but Ferry definitely played the 4 at times with the Spurs. And on paper even the 5.

He started a playoff game against the Suns in 03 in place of Robinson and pulled down 10 boards for just one instance.

My bad I forgot about that game and now that I think of it he did see spot/ garbage minutes at the 4 spot in his last year 02/03, but my point was Ferry played small forward more often than not. I'd probably say 80% of the time he played small forward roughly during his 3 year (really 2 years) with the Spurs? If my memory is correct?

That percentage was higher in 00/01 and 01/02 from what I remember I could be wrong?

Regardless of what I can and can't remember, a proven valuable role player in the NBA like Ferry still has nothing to do with the argument I'm trying to make.
( I'm too lazy and tired to type it all out again) :sleep

I'm aware on how Popovich likes the ability to have a stretch 4 to spread the floor. I know I wear glasses from time to time, but I'm not that blind.

I think they would like to have a stretch 4 in the perfect scenario. I just don't think they would sign a player of Kurtz, Novak, Cook, or Tolliver's caliber to be an important 5th big man.

And I say important because next year that 5th big will see more time than usual due to Tim and McDyess' anticipated limited minutes. I just don't see them making such of a desperate addition just to have a stretch 4.

I wouldn't be surprised if they made a move to find a better quality stretch 4 instead of the players TD 21 mentioned, or draft a player like Babbit in hopes of him being a hybrid 3/4 man.

I just don't see them searching at the bottom of the free agent pool for a player like Kurtz, Novak, Tolliver or Cook for that 5th spot. As I've said many times.

mogrovejo

05-28-2010, 04:35 PM

please elaborate this.

- That rotation has only one guy who can shoot out of 11ft and is a 36 years old McDyess in what may be his last NBA season. In today's NBA, that equates to make life extremely difficult for your guards to drive inside or even to get the ball inside.

- There's only one player with good quickness+fastness for a PF in Splitter, but it's not like he's some kind of explosive athlete either.

That's your opinion. Which I respect.

Although I disagree to an extent. Of course versatility is something teams look for. But do you dig to the bottom of the barrel just to add a 6'8"+ shooting big man that has the ability to shoot? I think not. And if you do would it make a difference in the grand scheme of things?

An example can be Scalabrine on the Celtics right now. Is his addition really as valued as you claim, in regard of teams value versatility over quality to a degree? I don't see it.

I'd much rather use Jefferson at the 4 than put my eggs into the basket of a Scalabrine or a Tolliver. That's just me though.

But Boston's big man rotation has 3 shooters, 3 guys who can fire 20ft jumpers - Garnett, Davis and Wallace - which weathers down the problem. I can't think of a single NBA team without shooting in their big man rotation.

But it's definitely a hole Boston have. A healthy Garnett can still shut down perimeter 4s, for most of the season that type of players were a big problem for Boston.

For example, it's part of the reason why they were 28th in offensive rebounding, they had to sacrifice stuff in order to defend the transition. And they still have Scalabrine as a 5th/6th big, which is comforting.

mogrovejo

05-28-2010, 04:38 PM

You are saying Spurs don't care about overall quality for the 5th spot on the active roster and they will overlook that aspect to add a player like Novak, Kurtz, Tolliver, or Cook.

Have you seen Tolliver this season?

I think Tolliver is becoming a solid rotational player if he keeps improving his outside jumper. He'll be a quality 4th big for some team. He has a diverse skill-set that is rare to find in rotational players.

MaNu4Tres

05-28-2010, 04:48 PM

He'll be a quality 4th big for some team. He has a diverse skill-set that is rare to find in rotational players.

For a lottery team. I agree. :tu

But for a playoff team with championship aspirations, I have to disagree.

mogrovejo

05-28-2010, 05:16 PM

For a lottery team. I agree. :tu

But for a playoff team with championship aspirations, I have to disagree.

Okay, but I meant for a good team. In a lottery team, he can be a 3rd big or even a starter.

TD 21

05-28-2010, 06:18 PM

The Truth #6 and mogrovejo essentially conveyed my thoughts...

I'll just add: Maybe the Spurs wouldn't go quite so low as a guy like Kurz or Novak (who, like Ferry is primarily an SF), but Tolliver? I think they'd jump at the chance to have him as their fifth big. Although I think mogrovejo is overstating his value, if he plays next season similar to how he did last season, he'd be a solid addition.

If it's not Tolliver, I know don't, there aren't a ton of names that spring to mind to fill this role, but based on this regime's history of constructing teams and like mogrovejo said, the way the league is going (in terms of teams coveting shooting bigs), I've got to think the Spurs come up with someone to fill this role. Maybe they pluck someone from obscurity, I'm not sure. But, I can't see this not being the route they go. Again, assuming Splitter is signed and McDyess is retained.

You act like teams don't target specific skills, when in reality that's exactly how a core is surrounded. Rarely is it with dynamic all around players, it's generally with specialists. Particularly with championship teams, none more so than the Spurs, who have always done things this way.

MaNu4Tres

05-28-2010, 06:43 PM

You act like teams don't target specific skills, when in reality that's exactly how a core is surrounded. Rarely is it with dynamic all around players, it's generally with specialists. Particularly with championship teams, none more so than the Spurs, who have always done things this way.

No I don't.

You're totally ignoring the whole point I'm trying to make.

And making false assumptions.

Read again

I'm aware on how Popovich likes the ability to have a stretch 4 to spread the floor. I know I wear glasses from time to time, but I'm not that blind.

I think they would like to have a stretch 4 in the perfect scenario. I just don't think they would sign a player of Kurtz, Novak, Cook, or Tolliver's caliber to be an important 5th big man.

And I say important because next year that 5th big will see more time than usual due to Tim and McDyess' anticipated limited minutes. I just don't see them making such of a desperate addition just to have a stretch 4.

I wouldn't be surprised if they made a move to find a better quality stretch 4 instead of the players TD 21 mentioned, or draft a player like Babbit in hopes of him being a hybrid 3/4 man.

I just don't see them searching at the bottom of the free agent pool for a player like Kurtz, Novak, Tolliver or Cook for that 5th spot. As I've said many times.

I do agree though that Tolliver is the best out of the group you mentioned. But 3 out of the 4 guys you said you could see the Spurs go after for the 5th spot are really bad players.

The guys you mentioned was the reason why I made the whole argument in the first place.

Comprehension skills. C'mon son.

TD 21

05-28-2010, 07:02 PM

So in regards of the active roster, the Spurs always dig to the bottom of the barrel of the free agency pool to fill it out? So in regards of filling out the active roster out, they always overlook the overall quality of the free agent as long as they have the ability to make a three? For the active roster? I'm talking about the big men for the active roster.

I can hear Pop and R.C right now," Attention free agents, we've had success with one of the best role players, who happened to be one of the best 3 point shooting power forwards in the history of the game from 2004 through 2007. We were also fortunate to find a diamond in the rough when we traded for Matt Bonner's expiring contract because we made a mistake giving the Rasho Nestorovic a 48 million dollar contract. Fortunately for us Bonner earned his stripes and slowly earned quality minutes by the 2008 season. He ended up one of the most consistent 3 point shooting role players in the league for us the past 3 seasons.

With that, since we've had success with them, we are willing to sign anyone who has the ability to make a 3 point shot to fill out an important spot on the active roster. Only stipulations are you have to be 6'8" are above. Don't worry we don't care about anything else you can or can't do on the court. Tryouts will be held at Incarnate Ward University. Goodluck."

That is what you're basically saying. You are saying Spurs don't care about overall quality for the 5th spot on the active roster and they will overlook that aspect to add a player like Novak, Kurtz, Tolliver, or Cook.

I have to disagree.

So we can agree to disagree obviously.

We will find out in time.

This is the post I was referencing when I made the comment about how you act like teams don't target specific skills.

I don't want Kurz, Novak, Cook, etc., which you not surprisingly seem to be failing to comprehend. I'm just saying I could see the Spurs bringing in someone like that to fill this role. Probably not them specifically, but someone of that ilk.

You're talking to me about comprehension skills? The same guy who routinely takes what I said out of context or completely misunderstands my view point. You're so caught up in trying to have an argument that you've failed to realize that I actually agree with quite a few things that you've said on this; I'm just playing devil's advocate. Looking at it from the organization's/Mahinmi's point of view and basing my thinking off of past history of this regime.

MaNu4Tres

05-28-2010, 07:06 PM

What you just posted is pretty darn similar to this:

I'm aware on how Popovich likes the ability to have a stretch 4 to spread the floor. I know I wear glasses from time to time, but I'm not that blind.

I think they would like to have a stretch 4 in the perfect scenario. I just don't think they would sign a player of Kurtz, Novak, Cook, or Tolliver's caliber to be an important 5th big man.

And I say important because next year that 5th big will see more time than usual due to Tim and McDyess' anticipated limited minutes. I just don't see them making such of a desperate addition just to have a stretch 4.

I wouldn't be surprised if they made a move to find a better quality stretch 4 instead of the players TD 21 mentioned, or draft a player like Babbit in hopes of him being a hybrid 3/4 man.

I just don't see them searching at the bottom of the free agent pool for a player like Kurtz, Novak, Tolliver or Cook for that 5th spot. As I've said many times.

And that is everything I had to argue the past page or so, but all in a nut shell. So you obviously misunderstood my point in the first place.

TD 21

05-28-2010, 07:11 PM

No, I understood you all along.

The difference is I don't think the Spurs would "like to have a stretch 4 in the perfect scenario", as you say, I think they'll specifically plan to get one, even if it's not an ideal one, this off season. They probably won't go as low as Kurz (unless they plan to carry 6 bigs; which I doubt), but I think their mindset will be (assuming Splitter is signed and McDyess is retained), we want our fifth big to be someone who can stretch the floor.

Just like last off season, even though depth wise they were fine on the wings, they were determined to add a guy who they felt could help fill the wing stopper role. Was he any good? No. Would they have been better served playing a younger player? Arguably. But, they didn't care. They decided that was what they wanted and they went out and got it.

That's why I expect this situation to be the same. We're not talking about a franchise big man here, which is a rare thing. If they want a (relatively) tall guy who can make shots, they'll find a way to acquire one.

MaNu4Tres

05-28-2010, 07:42 PM

No, I understood you all along.

but I think their mindset will be (assuming Splitter is signed and McDyess is retained), we want our fifth big to be someone who can stretch the floor.

Well from my interpretation you obviously didn't really understand me. I was arguing the whole time that they would not go as low as Kurz (for the 5th spot;6th likely) and you refuted it by using the whole " history proves otherwise remarks". That remark you made made it apparent that you were basically comparing a low caliber player like Novak, Cook or Kurtz to Horry and Bonner's situation in San Antonio.

The reason why I use Horry and Bonner in comparing the 5th spot in the rotation is because that spot will be needed to contribute and be a proven commodity(IMO), due to Duncan and McDyess' anticipated limited minutes. You can't compare this 5th spot to Haislip because Haislip was brought in as a low risk high reward gamble and a long shot. They didn't need Haislip to come in and contribute. That's a different scenario than what the Spurs have with their 5th spot in the rotation.

I also said multiple times that I can see the Spurs adding a development/gamble stretch 4 like Kurtz or someone of less ability as a 6th man. But in order to find a stretch 4 to regulate the 5th big spot on the active roster, they will have to either do it via draft or make a trade to find a player of better quality, due to limited resources available. Or resign Bonner, if he signs for less out of loyalty. (All of what I've already stated).

I just think you misunderstood my whole point, which is fine.

Just like last off season, even though depth wise they were fine on the wings, they were determined to add a guy who they felt could help fill the wing stopper role. Was he any good? No. Would they have been better served playing a younger player? Arguably. But, they didn't care. They decided that was what they wanted and they went out and got it.

Again your point here is under the premise which the depth was fine. Therefore it was a low risk; high reward pick up that may suit a need. Like Haislip was. I can see that.

However in the situation that we have been arguing about, the depth is NOT fine. We are talking about the 5th spot. Which will be more important than any other year. Therefore a gamble like Haislip, Kurz, Novak or Cook wouldn't make sense for this spot.IMO That doesn't mean I don't think Spurs want a stretch 4 at all. I just don't think they will be so desperate (talent wise) just to find a big man that has the ability to hit an outside shot for the 5th spot.IMO

Blackjack

05-28-2010, 09:22 PM

I think you two are talking past each other a bit and are a lot closer in your view then the debate would leave one to believe.

http://lauriekendrick.files.wordpress.com/2008/03/rodney_king.jpg

:downspin:

The Truth #6

05-29-2010, 09:27 AM

I propose we make peace by appealing to the lowest common denominator...criticizing Matt Bonner, of course.

Blackjack

05-29-2010, 09:43 AM

Throw in a healthy dose of Mason and I think you're on to something. :tu

BronxCowboy

05-29-2010, 04:52 PM

Doesn't anyone hate Finley anymore?

TD 21

05-29-2010, 05:05 PM

Well from my interpretation you obviously didn't really understand me. I was arguing the whole time that they would not go as low as Kurz (for the 5th spot;6th likely) and you refuted it by using the whole " history proves otherwise remarks". That remark you made made it apparent that you were basically comparing a low caliber player like Novak, Cook or Kurtz to Horry and Bonner's situation in San Antonio.

The reason why I use Horry and Bonner in comparing the 5th spot in the rotation is because that spot will be needed to contribute and be a proven commodity(IMO), due to Duncan and McDyess' anticipated limited minutes. You can't compare this 5th spot to Haislip because Haislip was brought in as a low risk high reward gamble and a long shot. They didn't need Haislip to come in and contribute. That's a different scenario than what the Spurs have with their 5th spot in the rotation.

I also said multiple times that I can see the Spurs adding a development/gamble stretch 4 like Kurtz or someone of less ability as a 6th man. But in order to find a stretch 4 to regulate the 5th big spot on the active roster, they will have to either do it via draft or make a trade to find a player of better quality, due to limited resources available. Or resign Bonner, if he signs for less out of loyalty. (All of what I've already stated).

I just think you misunderstood my whole point, which is fine.

Again your point here is under the premise which the depth was fine. Therefore it was a low risk; high reward pick up that may suit a need. Like Haislip was. I can see that.

However in the situation that we have been arguing about, the depth is NOT fine. We are talking about the 5th spot. Which will be more important than any other year. Therefore a gamble like Haislip, Kurz, Novak or Cook wouldn't make sense for this spot.IMO That doesn't mean I don't think Spurs want a stretch 4 at all. I just don't think they will be so desperate (talent wise) just to find a big man that has the ability to hit an outside shot for the 5th spot.IMO

I conceded that they more than likely wouldn't go as low as Kurz to be the 5th big, but I wouldn't be the least big surprised if they settle for someone a cut above.

Once again, the history proves otherwise comment meant in general they prioritize having a stretch four on the roster. You can debate natural positions, where they've been on the depth chart, etc., the fact of the matter is they've prioritized them. That's not opinion; it's fact.

I didn't compare, I just said the one thing they have in common is they're all (relatively) tall guys who are known to stretch the floor. Obviously, someone like Novak isn't anywhere near Horry's level as a player. But at the end of the day, they're both 6-10 (listed, at least) guys who were/are known as shooters.

Anticipated limited minutes? How much lower do you think the Spurs will be able to get away with? Duncan played 31 mpg and McDyess 21 mpg. Maybe, if everything breaks right, they limit them to 30 mpg and 18-19 mpg respectively, but there's not going to be some precipitous drop coming. Maybe more games off, should the Spurs have the luxury of doing so, if that's what you're thinking. But in those games, I'd imagine Splitter and in particular, Blair, will play significantly more. The fifth big will probably see limited minutes even in that scenario.

Of course they'll need the fifth big to be a viable player, but if the guy can stretch the floor that will probably be enough. Honestly, how good of a fifth big are you expecting, if the first four are what we're expecting? Someone like Tolliver is probably the high end.

No, I understood your point. Basically, you're saying ideally they'd like to have a quality stretch four, but given their limited resources they're unlikely to obtain one. I'm saying, despite their limited resources, they're going to have the mindset that their fifth big will be a stretch four, even if it has to be someone who's less than ideal.

I think the depth is better than you given it credit for, because of the quality of the first four. In reality, the first four are all really top three caliber bigs. Blair is not a true fourth big. Like I said, all those names I brought up, I don't want (with the exception of Tolliver, though it's that I'm enamored with him), I'm just throwing out names.

NewJerSpur

05-29-2010, 05:07 PM

If Ian has to go, the Spurs will just have to find some way to keep moving as an organization, somehow......you're up Tiago.

Manufan909

05-29-2010, 10:34 PM

Let's hope he doesn't. If they add Splitter and Bonner stays, then there is almost no way for Ian to get minutes.

With how Pop treated him this season, I wouldn't expect to be back if he sniffs a chance anywhere else. All those that think the decline of Duncan/Dyess will get Ian PT, look at all the opportunities Ian had to play this year. It was prob under 10% chance Ian would play on any given night. With Splitter likely coming, and Bonner likely getting resigned if Splitter bails once again, along with the guarantee of Blair having a bigger role, Ian is screwed unless Pop is forced to play a 3-man big rotation... Oh wait, that happened, and Pop still found a way out of giving Ian some burn.

Ian is like an abused wife, and all the optimists here are the abusive husband's friends, who claim that Pop will come to his senses.:bang

I truly want Pop to see the light and quit his love affair with the Red Rocket, but look how long Fin and Pop lasted.:lol

Mr Bones

06-01-2010, 01:38 AM

There's one stat that is important for a defensive minded big man that obviously isn't going to be a big part of the offense with the Spurs, and that's block to foul ratio... it has always been Mahinmi's downfall, and last season didn't change anything as he averaged 0.3 bpg and 1.2 fouls per game. It has been 4 years since he had a terrible ratio with Pau-Orthez and 3 years since he had a terrible ratio with the Toros in the D-league... at a certain point, after practicing alongside Tim Duncan and Antonio McDyess and still not improving, I have to concede that he's probably not going to be as good as Dan Gadzuric, and that all of this anxious hand-ringing over his fate with the Spurs is probably not really worth it. Honestly, if most fans of the Spurs went on to a site dedicated to the Lakers or Celtics and read their fans talking about a D-league guy the way spurstalk does about Mahinmi, would they take it seriously? Or start cracking jokes about homerism?

The Truth #6

06-01-2010, 12:06 PM

The Spurs don't practice much but I remember a quote where Dice complimented his game.

He never got legitimate playing time. So, I don't think it's easy to make any realistic claim about him yet. He still has potential. He has some athletic tools. He has some fundamentals. He has a good jump shot. Obviously there are things he needs to work on but playing time will help him improve.

From his perspective I don't know why he would stick around if he can get PT somewhere else. If Splitter is signed I don't know why he would sign because his minutes will vanish. And as the FO needs time to figure out everyone else first, I imagine Ian will not wait around unless he has no other options.

Not playing him this last season was pretty dumb considering everyone and their momma knew that Bonner would underperform in the end.

duncan228

06-02-2010, 03:31 PM

Posted this on the Spurs board (http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=155606), thought it should be here too.

Ian Mahinmi Could Be Summer's Secret Prize (http://nba.fanhouse.com/2010/06/02/ian-mahinmi-could-be-summers-secret-prize/)
By Tom Ziller

This summer's NBA free agent extravaganza revolves around basketball deities like LeBron James and Dwyane Wade. But as we've documented at FanHouse, this is also a mighty deep class of players, with perhaps 40 free agents who can expect contracts in excess of $2 million. My list of the NBA's top 50 free agents (http://nba.fanhouse.com/2010/04/06/top-50-2010-nba-free-agents/) has an ever-growing addendum, and it (for the most part) ignores potential acquisitions currently playing overseas.

Well-known veterans will indeed get the bulk of attention come July 1. But there's a corps of young, relatively anonymous players up for grabs as well. One of the most mysterious in this set is 6'11 Spurs forward Ian Mahinmi. The Frenchman, 23, saw only spotty action in San Antonio this season, appearing in 26 games and logging more than 15 minutes in a game only twice. In that limited action, Mahinmi performed, shooting 63 percent from the floor and collecting more than 18 percent of all available rebounds while on the court.

That production syncs with his more extensive NBA D-League experience. Mahinmi played more than 1,300 minutes with the Spurs-owned Austin Toros in 2007-08, finishing the season third in the league in PER, top-10 in rebounds and blocks per game, fourth in effective field goal percentage, second in True Shooting percentage, second in Win Shares, and a first-team All D-League honoree. Basically, Mahinmi is what almost every team is looking for in the draft this June: an active, productive young big man.

But why, then, is Mahinmi such an afterthought heading into free agency? Why did the Spurs decline his cheap option for 2010-11? Why are the Spurs considered unlikely to make a strong effort to keep Mahinmi?

On the surface, Mahinmi simply hasn't played much lately, which could explain the lack of buzz. Mahinmi suffered a season-ending injury at the start of the 2008-09 season, limiting the Frenchman to just one game with the Toros and not a single minute with the Spurs. Mahinmi came back healthy for the '09-10 season and remained on S.A.'s roster for the entirety of the year. But the free agent addition of Antonio McDyess and the drafting of DeJuan Blair pushed Mahinmi down the pecking order. McDyess, the 13-year veteran, started 50 games for the Spurs, and Blair -- who many observers felt was underused -- averaged 18 minutes a night in playing all 82 games. With Tim Duncan continuing to anchor the frontcourt and Matt Bonner at the ready for "stretch-4" situations, Mahinmi struggled to get off the bench. While Bonner is a free agent and McDyess and Duncan continue to get closer to retirement, the potential signing of 2007 Spurs draft pick Tiago Splitter may keep the rotation too tight for Mahinmi to break through in San Antonio.

As so many prospects before Mahinmi have learned, building a reputation without opportunity is difficult. But at just 23 years old, Mahinmi has to worry just as much about his next contract as the one in play this summer. As such, Mahinmi and his agent have made noise about going to a team who promises to get the forward plenty of playing time. NBA teams rarely agree to such demands (especially for unproven players), which has me thinking Mahinmi is on his way back to Europe. That's unfortunate for NBA fans, because this kid can really play. But unless an NBA team can see through the fog and find a deal that works for Mahinmi (by providing a reasonable opportunity for playing time), joining an upper echelon European club makes the most sense for the Frenchman.

As a fan of Mahinmi, I'll continue to hold out hope some young team will convince him to stay in the States. While signing Mahinmi won't be as impactful as prying LeBron from Cleveland or Chris Bosh from Toronto, grabbing the Frenchman could wind up looking like the summer's most prescient move.

*********************

MORE MAHINMI

FanHouse's Tom Ziller joined Timothy Varner and Andrew McNeill of 48 Minutes of Hell (http://www.48minutesofhell.com/) on the 4-Down Podcast to discuss Ian Mahinmi's future.

Hear the Podcast (http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2010/06/02/4-down-podcast-ian-mahinmi-tom-ziller/)