Garcia: Mavs spur deal for Jefferson, wait pays off with Marion

[Spurs Brazil]

Mavs spur deal for Jefferson, wait pays off with Marion

Posted Apr 21 2010 11:54AM

DALLAS -- Richard Jefferson and Shawn Marion were on the lot last summer and the Mavericks kicked the tires on both. The two offered many of the same features: 6-foot-7 slashers, playoff experience, history with Jason Kidd.

As with many used cars, the price was a big factor. Marion offered value. Jefferson, sticker shock. But comparison shopping in Dallas wasn't done with CarMax-speed. Time -- and a lucky bit of timing -- were involved.

"This wasn't just a case of either-or," Mavericks general manager Donnie Nelson said as the Mavs readied for Game 2 of their first-round series against San Antonio, scheduled for Wednesday night here. "This was really about the right deal presenting itself."

Milwaukee shopped Jefferson, along with Michael Redd and anyone else with a long-term, big-money contract that wasn't part of the future. Marion, a longtime pest for both San Antonio and Dallas, was a free agent after a 17-month detour through Miami and Toronto.

For a deal to work, the Bucks were asking for a load of expiring contracts in return. The Mavericks had plenty -- Erick Dampier, Josh Howard and Jerry Stackhouse for starters -- but making a play for RJ and the $29.2 million left on his contract didn't make financial sense. Not even with Mark Cuban's billions.

It also didn't compute on the player side. The Mavericks were reluctant to part with Howard, hoping they could make a deteriorating relationship work. Stackhouse's contract wouldn't get it done alone. And moving Dampier would have left Dallas without a center. (Had Orlando not matched Dallas' offer sheet for Marcin Gortat, the Mavericks might have parted with Dampier.)

Dallas passed. The Spurs pounced, electing to pass on the big-ticket items in free agency by trading for Jefferson before the Draft. San Antonio's end of the deal included Bruce Bowen and Kurt Thomas, two aging vets that many in the Alamo City might like to see in this series.

Spurs fans, at the time, lauded the move. Jefferson had played with Tim Duncan and for Gregg Popovich on Team USA. Jefferson had that San Antonio sensibility, a mix of track record and humbleness.

Dallas followers moaned. San Antonio had done it again, bringing in exactly what that team needed to rebuild while missing out on what the Mavericks could use.

Nelson, instead, waited and the dominoes began to fall. Few free agents were getting more than the mid-level exception, with many teams already planning for 2010. A buyers' market took another turn in Dallas' direction when Hedo Turkoglu backed out of a deal with Portland in favor of Toronto. The Raptors couldn't keep Marion and sign Turkoglu.

"We got lucky there with Shawn," Nelson admitted. "The reality is that Turkoglu thing went in a different direction. That was something that was a shock to everyone. We were in position to do something. It was a good fit for Shawn and there we were."

Nelson began putting together a complex deal that eventually included four teams, and the Mavericks moved Stackhouse, Antoine Wright and fillers in a complex sign-and-trade. Marion was brought on board for five years and $39.9 million, with a first-year salary ($6.6 million) less than half of Jefferson's $14.2 million.

"It's like deer hunting and you've got one or two bullets," Nelson said. "You've got to take your best shot when it presents itself. That's kind of what it was. Situations present themselves to different teams at different times."

The Mavericks going cheaper tells only part of the story. The decision to hold onto Howard, though it backfired early, led to the midseason trade for Caron Butler, Brendan Haywood and DeShawn Stevenson. Suddenly, the Mavericks had two tough-minded 6-foot-7 former All-Stars in Marion and Butler.

Meanwhile, Marion, though hardly enjoying a standout season, was at least a fit. He doesn't demand the ball. He's able to guard nearly every position. He even asked coach Rick Carlisle to check the opposition's best scorer nightly, winning over his teammates and coaching staff in one swoop. He has been low maintenance and high versatility all season.

"It was his all-around game that drew us to him, and drew Mark and Donnie to him," Carlisle said.

Marion has seen only a fraction of the scrutiny Jefferson has faced in San Antonio. Following a 100-94 loss in Game 1, the Spurs' Popovich had some stinging words for some of his players. Jefferson -- who played 32 minutes, scored only four points and grabbed seven rebounds -- was the No. 1 offender, at least in the eyes of fans.

Jefferson's pricetag is a big reason behind the criticism. He made about as much this season as the combined total of George Hill, Matt Bonner, Antonio McDyess, Roger Mason and Keith Bogans -- the Spurs besides the Three Amigos (Tim Duncan, Manu Ginobili and Tony Parker) who played in Game 1.

Jefferson was supposed to give San Antonio a Fab Four. That's why the Spurs willingly took on the last two years of his contract, believing Jefferson would flourish on a team in desperate need of explosiveness on the wing. Peter Holt was praised for opening his wallet and allowing the front office to exceed the luxury tax, a long-held no-no in San Antonio.

Jefferson finished the season on an uptick, as Popovich noted before the series started. Without the benefit of a Kidd-like, pass-first point guard, Jefferson renewed his commitment to rebounding and running the floor during the Spurs' surge following the All-Star break.


What Jefferson gave Sunday was forgettable. Slowed by foul trouble early, he didn't score in the first half and remained non-existent while San Antonio tried to mount a fourth-quarter rally. Marion didn't fare much better in his matching 32 minutes -- nine and five -- but he chased Ginobili, blocked a couple of shots and the Mavericks won.

"We all know he can get a lot bigger numbers than what he's scoring," Dirk Nowitzki said of Marion earlier this season. "Ultimately, if you want to win the championship, the whole team has to make sacrifices."

When it comes to second-guessing, Marion may always have the easier road in Texas. Without a title in the rafters, the Mavericks' shortcomings will always land at Nowitzki's sneakers. Those that have come to Dallas are charged with trying to get Dirk a ring.

The Spurs' basketball trinity are living/playing legends. While they're not entirely above reproach, is anyone really going to fault Timmy, Manu and Tony for falling short? They've got a lifetime pass after a decade of dominance. So when the Spurs don't win the last game in late June, it's someone else's fault.

That's probably going to be Jefferson this year if the Spurs get knocked out in the first round for the second straight year. Jefferson can opt-out of the last year of his contract and become a free agent this summer.

"I want to be as successful as I possibly can here," he said recently. "I've enjoyed my time in San Antonio. I'd love to continue staying here and playing here."

There's no way the Mavericks or Spurs could have predicted the season either Jefferson or Marion would have or the reaction each has generated. Both seem so similar. Both scored about 12 points per game. Had the Mavericks moved on Jefferson, maybe Marion finds his way into silver and black.

"They made a real solid deal and I thought ours was a solid deal," Nelson said. "Of course, every move looks great on paper. It's not what goes in the oven, but what comes out."

Art Garcia has covered the NBA since 1999. You can e-mail him here and follow him on twitter.

http://www.nba.com/2010/news/features/art_garcia/04/21/marion.jefferson/index.html

[Ghazi]

matrix :tu

[timvp]

Marion, a longtime pest for San Antonio:lol

I'd rather have RJ overpaid for one more season than Marion overpaid for four more seasons.

[in2deep]

:lol

I'd rather have RJ overpaid for one more season than Marion overpaid for four more seasons.

not if Marion gets his first ring and RJ plays like a dog. I don't

[lcroock]

not if Marion gets his first ring and RJ plays like a dog. I don't

Spurs are winning 4 in a row if George is back to 70% or more. No rings for Dallas anytime soon.

[Death In June]

This Garcia guy has been cock jockeying the Mavs pretty hard lately. I mean, they're a great team and all, but let's not get crazy and overate shawn marion.

[timvp]

not if Marion gets his first ring

:lol

[baseline bum]

Marion, a longtime pest for San Antonio


:lol



Yeah, I thought that was pretty good too. He was Bonner-level in the 05 WCF.

[scottspurs]

If I had to choose between the two I would probably still pick Jefferson. Marion is overrated as a defender and would bring nothing offensively to the spurs. I would definitely would not want Marion for the next four years.

[baseline bum]

Seriously, a one-dimensional player like Marion should be dubbed The Scalar.

[in2deep]

let's see... so far when it matters:
Marion 9pts 5reb 3ast 2blk 40%fg
RDog 4pts 7reb 2ast 0blk 25%fg

edge goes to marion so far

[HarlemHeat37]

It doesn't matter though..even if Marion is currently a better player, which is arguable, having him for 4 more years is obviously a lot worse than having Jefferson for 1 more year, especially when there's a possibility of flipping Jefferson's contract for a contributor like Iguodala or a Luol Deng type..

[badfish22]

which is arguable

:lmao

Marion turned our defense around and held stars well below their season averages. Marion was better than Dick in every way this season.

[Big P]

If we had held steady & not traded for rj...how much $ would we have to spend on a player? After resigning Manu would we have still had money leftover to be a player in FA?

[InK]

RDog

:lmao:lmao:lmao

[chichi!gettheyeyo]

"Every dog has his day, huh, Mel?"

[mavsfan1000]

The Matrix has been great for Dallas. Jefferson obviously hasn't.

[HarlemHeat37]

My statement wasn't about the better player and better fit this season, it's about the better overall player in a comparison..there isn't a significant difference between the 2 as overall players IMO..

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

I'd rather have RJ off the books next year than have Marion's contract the next four seasons.

[Mark in Austin]

The Marion we've seen in Dallas this year might be a better fit in San Antonio than Jefferson for the role the Spurs need over the next year or two, (play D, hit the three, dirty work) but for that many years? Um, no. And his locker room behavior in PHX and MIA left a lot to be desired from what I remember reading. Looks like he's turned it around in Dallas (props to him) like Randolph did in Memphis but before the season started the odds were against both happening. Marion was a gamble.

Agree with everyone else on the stupidity of calling Marion a longtime pest for SA. Hell, he HELPED San Antonio get past PHX when they played.

[MateoNeygro]

I think Marion would struggle in SA's offensive system which is a slower pace. RJ would have benefited from the MAV's style offense(a little more free flowing, fast paced) Marion has been better for the Mav's than Rj has been for the Spurs. Marion would bring a long defender so that would have helped the Spurs.

[Sportstudi]

Spurs are winning 4 in a row if George is back to 70% or more. No rings for Dallas anytime soon.

Put away the crack my friend....

This series will go down the wire and either team can win. Minimum will be 6 games, but I expect 7.

[Sportstudi]

Spurs are winning 4 in a row if George is back to 70% or more. No rings for Dallas anytime soon.

Edit: Double post

[baseline bum]

The Matrix has been great for Dallas. Jefferson obviously hasn't.

What are you talking about? Jefferson was phenomenal for Dallas in game 1.

[baseline bum]

If we had held steady & not traded for rj...how much $ would we have to spend on a player? After resigning Manu would we have still had money leftover to be a player in FA?

They'd have been about $5 million under the cap, which is less than the MLE. Hence, not trading for Jefferson and re-signing Manu for what he was signed to would have not given the Spurs a cent more to spend this summer.

[TheChillFactor]

As bad as he sucks, he should change his nickname to "The Matrix 3". I thought "The Matrix" was a pretty good movie...

as far as i'm concerned they can keep him and and his ugly ass jumper...

[jack0fspeed]

Seriously, a one-dimensional player like Marion should be dubbed The Scalar.

Let's compromise and call him "the Eigenvector".

[baseline bum]

Of course, that would have opened up a max slot by not trading for Jefferson and not re-signing Manu. Not that I think the Spurs would have gotten anything decent in free agency when competing with cities like New York, Miami, Chicago, and possibly Brooklyn.

[baseline bum]

Let's compromise and call him "the Eigenvector".

How about The Kernel?

[da_suns_fan]

Marion would have been a much better fit for the Spurs.

Hes not a good shooter, but he runs the floor well, rebounds and plays defense.

But 5 years was waaaay too long of a contract to give a player who has always relied on his athleticism. Especially when there was virtually no market for him.

[jack0fspeed]

How about The Kernel?

Sounds too military.

[baseline bum]

The Nullspace?

[jack0fspeed]

The Nullspace?

Too glass half empty.

[DesignatedT]

they both suck

[jack0fspeed]

Seriously though ... Marion is a great fit with the Mavs because they needed somebody to guard Carmelo (and maybe Kobe and Lebron).

[Lukor]

Marion would have been a much better fit for the Spurs.

Hes not a good shooter, but he runs the floor well, rebounds and plays defense.

But 5 years was waaaay too long of a contract to give a player who has always relied on his athleticism. Especially when there was virtually no market for him.

I think year 4 and 5 will be quite brutal with Marion but to be honest the Mavs will most likely be rebuilding in 3 years or so, so i'm not quite sure i care about having a bad contract when youre not competing for anything.
Unless Dampier lands us Lebron or Wade in the summer LOL.

[jack sommerset]

Would it matter if Marion was on the Spews and Jefferson was on Mavs?

[G-Nob]

Hindsight's 20/20, Art Garcia, former Fort Worth Star-Telegram Mavericks beat writer.

[Solid D]

Garcia: Mavs spur deal for Jefferson

It would make more sense to me if his title read "Mavs spurn deal for Jefferson".

[ohmwrecker]

:lmao

Marion turned our defense around and held stars well below their season averages. Marion was better than Dick in every way this season.

Wrong. They are pretty much dead even in every major statistical category. As bad as Jefferson has been from three, Marion is worse. Jefferson has had more pressure to perform than Marion as well. I still say the Spurs got the better player and I hope RJ proves me right tonight.

[mavsfan1000]

What are you talking about? Jefferson was phenomenal for Dallas in game 1.
:lol True

[jason1301]

Yeah, yeah the article makes a few interesting points, but I can't help but question, how easily you can re-write it (to favour RJ) if RJ had 7pts and Marion 4 --in which case Spurs win!

Its premature to state one as failure and the other as successful based on the outcome of one game where both players didn't play any good.

Marion played a bit better than RJ, but so did Dirk over TD, Kidd over TP and the list goes on...

I still think RJ was the better deal at that time. You can't foresee the future --Marion being available. And even though Marion seems to be a better fit in the spurs system, I still think the fact that RJ has an expiring contract next year, makes me believe that once we move to the second round. RJ will be viewed as a success, and it would be much easier to replace him over the summer.

With the way the lakers are playing, TP, Manu, Hill, Dice, TD, Blair, Bonner w.o Mason, RJ, will be a scary team to deal with, if we add guys like splitter, draft pick and free agents.

The way I see it, we took our chances with RJ, it didn't quite work, but we still have one the best teams in the NBA and we are in good position to further improve our team this summer.

The Mavs, not so much. They are loaded right now, and everything but a ring, will be considered a failure. I just don't see them being as good next year, regardless.

[crc21209]

:lol

I'd rather have RJ overpaid for one more season than Marion overpaid for four more seasons.

+1....Plus, as bad as RJ has been, Marion has been even worse than RJ this season..

[crc21209]

Seriously though ... Marion is a great fit with the Mavs because they needed somebody to guard Carmelo (and maybe Kobe and Lebron).

You and everyone else greatly overrate his defense...

[benefactor]

As others have stated, the contract length is the great equalizer here. Jefferson will either get traded or will be gone by the end of next year...while the Mavs will begin the 2012-13 season with a 34 year old Marion that has 2 years and 18 million left on his contract. Did I mention he has a 15% trade kicker? :)

[jack0fspeed]

You and everyone else greatly overrate his defense...

http://www.nba.com/2010/news/04/20/howard.defensive.poy/index.html?rss=true

2009-10 NBA Defensive Player of the Year presented by Kia Motors | Results
PLAYER TEAM 1st Place (5 Pts) 2nd Place (3 Pts) 3rd Place (1 pt) Total Points
Dwight Howard Orlando 110 8 2 576
Josh Smith Atlanta 3 34 19 136
Gerald Wallace Charlotte 1 29 21 113
LeBron James Cleveland 4 11 8 61
Rajon Rondo Boston 1 13 11 55
Ron Artest Los Angeles Lakers - 7 8 29
Andrew Bogut Milwaukee 1 2 12 23
Thabo Sefolosha Oklahoma City 2 1 7 20
Anderson Varejao Cleveland - 5 3 18
Dwyane Wade Miami - 2 7 13
Marcus Camby Portland - 3 4 13
Kobe Bryant Los Angeles Lakers - 1 6 9
Shawn Marion Dallas - 2 2 8
Tim Duncan San Antonio - 2 1 7
Shane Battier Houston - 1 2 5
Andrei Kirilenko Utah - 1 1 4
Arron Afflalo Denver - - 1 1
David Lee New York - - 1 1
Ben Wallace Detroit - - 1 1
Brendan Haywood Dallas - - 1 1
Matt Barnes Orlando - - 1 1
Kendrick Perkins Boston - - 1 1
Luc Richard Mbah a Moute Milwaukee - - 1 1
Kenyon Martin Denver - - 1 1

[Spurs Brazil]

Mavs fans don't have any idea of what defense is, so they think Marion is great.

[da_suns_fan]

As others have stated, the contract length is the great equalizer here. Jefferson will either get traded or will be gone by the end of next year...while the Mavs will begin the 2012-13 season with a 34 year old Marion that has 2 years and 18 million left on his contract. Did I mention he has a 15% trade kicker? :)

I doubt the Spurs will be able to move him this summer. Teams dont usually trade for expiring "cost cutting" deals until around the trade deadline.

[jack0fspeed]

As others have stated, the contract length is the great equalizer here. Jefferson will either get traded or will be gone by the end of next year...while the Mavs will begin the 2012-13 season with a 34 year old Marion that has 2 years and 18 million left on his contract. Did I mention he has a 15% trade kicker? :)

The Mavs have a starter in hand that they are happy with and who's contract they wrote.

The Spurs have a rental starter who's only trade value is as an expiring contract.

If RJeff's expiring can be used to acquire a starter level player, then maybe someday we can argue about who got the best deal.

Today, there's no argument. Marion is the better deal.

[sefant77]

Wrong. They are pretty much dead even in every major statistical category. As bad as Jefferson has been from three, Marion is worse. Jefferson has had more pressure to perform than Marion as well. I still say the Spurs got the better player and I hope RJ proves me right tonight.

Wow, thats just so bad...

Marion is a great fit to the Mavs. His contract is ok, the 5th year was a signing gift/bonus and will be then an expiring contract to use. I see Dirk until 35+ in Dallas and honestly i can see Kidd playing 3-4 years more. He will be able to have 3 more nice years like this year. I remember everyone ripping Kidds new 3/25 deal as too long and big.

The Mavs were desperatly in need for a versatile good defender (check), good rebounder (check), able to run the fastbreak with Kidd (check), cut to the basket (check), cleaning up garbage points (check).

They didnt want the Suns Marion standing at the perimter jacking up threes or demanding the ball and touches to score 20+. They exactly wanted from Marion the things Marion delivered this season.

But of course if you just see boxscores you probably think that Sefolosha sucks and shouldnt start anywhere in the NBA :rolleyes

RJ on the other hand just sucked most of the time and didnt FIT into the spurs team...

[benefactor]

I doubt the Spurs will be able to move him this summer. Teams dont usually trade for expiring "cost cutting" deals until around the trade deadline.
Probably not...but regardless he will be off the books after next season.

The Mavs have a starter in hand that they are happy with and who's contract they wrote.

The Spurs have a rental starter who's only trade value is as an expiring contract.

If RJeff's expiring can be used to acquire a starter level player, then maybe someday we can argue about who got the best deal.

Today, there's no argument. Marion is the better deal.
I'm sure they will be just as happy in 2012 when RJ is a distant memory and the still owe Marion 18 million...an 18 million that they won't be able to move.

[ohmwrecker]

Wow, thats just so bad...

Marion is a great fit to the Mavs. His contract is ok, the 5th year was a signing gift/bonus and will be then an expiring contract to use. I see Dirk until 35+ in Dallas and honestly i can see Kidd playing 3-4 years more. He will be able to have 3 more nice years like this year. I remember everyone ripping Kidds new 3/25 deal as too long and big.

Yes. You're right. That is a bad contract.


The Mavs were desperatly in need for a versatile good defender (check), good rebounder (check), able to run the fastbreak with Kidd (check), cut to the basket (check), cleaning up garbage points (check).They didnt want the Suns Marion standing at the perimter jacking up threes or demanding the ball and touches to score 20+. They exactly wanted from Marion the things Marion delivered this season.

But of course if you just see boxscores you probably think that Sefolosha sucks and shouldnt start anywhere in the NBA :rolleyes

RJ on the other hand just sucked most of the time and didnt FIT into the spurs team...

I agree. The Mavs did not need as much from Marion as the Spurs needed from Jefferson. Struggles aside, The Spurs are actually getting what they expected out of Jefferson. Maybe not as consistently as they would like, but he is filling a role. When he isn't playing PF, he is good on the boards, a good defender and is, usually the 3rd or 4th best scorer on the team. When RJ is aggressive he is better than Marion. The problem is, he defers too much.
No, I don't just rely on box scores. I was responding to the person who said Marion was better in every way with some facts.

[sefant77]

Probably not...but regardless he will be off the books after next season.

I'm sure they will be just as happy in 2012 when RJ is a distant memory and the still owe Marion 18 million...an 18 million that they won't be able to move.

Shouldnt you wait until 2012 to see if Marion is done with 34 :rolleyes I doubt it.

Bottom line Mavs will pay 39 million for 4 years great fitting versatile Marion on the roster and having him another year as expiring.

Spurs will pay 29 million for 1 year of sucking, leaving the roster with the hole they thought they filled and 1 year as expiring...

Whats better? Of course RJ :rollin

W

[elbamba]

Marion sucks. He cannot defend for crap. I love it when they and the Suns used to put him on Parker. RJ might have been a mistake, but Marion will be a mistake for another 5 years. Dallas always hands out overrated players bloated contracts. See Dampier, Van Horn. Shawn Bradley, Howard, etc...

[sefant77]

Marion sucks. He cannot defend for crap. I love it when they and the Suns used to put him on Parker. RJ might have been a mistake, but Marion will be a mistake for another 5 years. Dallas always hands out overrated players bloated contracts. See Dampier, Van Horn. Shawn Bradley, Howard, etc...

So the entire Mavs organization was blind the whole year about Marion and his influence for the Mavs game. I see. He was a major mistake :rollin

Ah and Marion doesnt play with the Suns anymore. He has now actually help in defense and can play even better team defense.

Talking about bad contracts, Ginos last year gonna hurt plenty. He should be done then too.

[MannyIsGod]

The Matrix has been great for Dallas. Jefferson obviously hasn't.

What? From where I'm sitting Jefferson has been absolutely phenomenal for Dallas.

[MannyIsGod]

What are you talking about? Jefferson was phenomenal for Dallas in game 1.

FUUUUUUUUUUUUUU

Should have finished the thread before replying. It was so fucking obviously easy.

[DPG21920]

What are you talking about? Jefferson was phenomenal for Dallas in game 1.


What? From where I'm sitting Jefferson has been absolutely phenomenal for Dallas.

[Big P]

They'd have been about $5 million under the cap, which is less than the MLE. Hence, not trading for Jefferson and re-signing Manu for what he was signed to would have not given the Spurs a cent more to spend this summer.

Thats what I was thinking..thanks BB

[crc21209]

mavs fans don't have any idea of what defense is, so they think marion is great.

+1

[elbamba]

So the entire Mavs organization was blind the whole year about Marion and his influence for the Mavs game. I see. He was a major mistake :rollin

Ah and Marion doesnt play with the Suns anymore. He has now actually help in defense and can play even better team defense.

Talking about bad contracts, Ginos last year gonna hurt plenty. He should be done then too.

Obviously my use of the word "used" implied that in the past the Suns would use him in that capacity, the Tony stopper. Of course, it usually meant TP would go for 35 and 7 on 50% shooting.

Gino, arguably the best player in the NBA for the past 11/2 months signed a three year deal. You guys will be stuck with Marion for 4 more years. While Manu has been injury prone, when he plays, he is one of the best players in the NBA and despite the fact that he was supposed to be too old to play this year, he continue to defy the odds. Marion looks to old too play today. He might have a couple of put backs but his defense is overrated. Marion has not mattered for about 3 years now, why do you think the Suns were so happy to get rid of him...because he is overrated.

[sefant77]

Honestly do you think it matters at all if Marion gets 5 or 8 million a year? Mavs need him and his contract wont stop Cuban from making other expensive trades.

So its not a big topic. Marion was a player type the Mavs were desperatly in need to get and they got him. I give a crap about Suns Marion and overrated or not.

I like Mavs Marion, he was all year really important for the Mavs (and really no one can decline that) and we all can live with his contract. Other owner blow their money with the 5th house and the 3rd boat, Cuban does it with his hobby and doesnt care about LT.

[da_suns_fan]

Obviously my use of the word "used" implied that in the past the Suns would use him in that capacity, the Tony stopper. Of course, it usually meant TP would go for 35 and 7 on 50% shooting.

Gino, arguably the best player in the NBA for the past 11/2 months signed a three year deal. You guys will be stuck with Marion for 4 more years. While Manu has been injury prone, when he plays, he is one of the best players in the NBA and despite the fact that he was supposed to be too old to play this year, he continue to defy the odds. Marion looks to old too play today. He might have a couple of put backs but his defense is overrated. Marion has not mattered for about 3 years now, why do you think the Suns were so happy to get rid of him...because he is overrated.

He WAS over-rated. They used to group him with the "best all around players in the league" category. He got a few third place MVP votes etc.

No one thinks hes that good anymore. The reason I thought the Mavs screwed up is that they gave Marion a great contract considering there was no one else going after him. Giving Marion 5-39 sounds like something Cuban used to do in the early 2000s.

[rayray2k8]

Hmmm. How about we wait till the playoffs to see who sucks more?

[benefactor]

Shouldnt you wait until 2012 to see if Marion is done with 34 :rolleyes I doubt it.

You are right. There are 34 yr old ultra athletic forwards that have been in the league for 16 seasons falling out of trees.


Bottom line Mavs will pay 39 million for 4 years great fitting versatile Marion on the roster and having him another year as expiring.

I'm sure I mentioned a 15% trade kicker...maybe I didn't.


Spurs will pay 29 million for 1 year of sucking, leaving the roster with the hole they thought they filled and 1 year as expiring...

Whats better? Of course RJ :rollin

W
Oh the RJ deal is bad...there is not disputing that. But it will only be bad for a short time. With no knowledge of the new CBA, the Mavs locked themselves into a back loaded, long term deal that they will eat every penny of. Short term consequences>moderate short term benefit with long term consequences.

[sefant77]

Why is a tradekicker important in his last year?

And i remember all that talking about Kidd being done and slow in 2008.

[benefactor]

Why is a tradekicker important in his last year?

Because any team that takes him will have to eat an extra 1.4 million to take him. The even worse problem is that a trade kicker counts for 15% of the remaining amount on the contract. So if he does start to break down early...like in 2011-2012...that is going to be a pretty big, immovable number.


And i remember all that talking about Kidd being done and slow in 2008.
Did you just compare Shawn Marion to Jason Kidd?

lol.

[benefactor]

lol Marion
lol stuck with a playoff choker
lol 4 more years
lol untradeable

[TDMVPDPOY]

there was still plenty of players on the market they couldve gone after

like jax or maggette

[TheProfessor]

Hmmm. How about we wait till the playoffs to see who sucks more?
:tu

[Cry Havoc]

Jefferson > Marion

Seriously, at least RJ scores OCCASIONALLY in a set offense.

lol Marion missing the most open shot of the game (well aside from Hill's layup, but GH3 made up for that in spades).

lol Shawn "clamps" Marion

lol huge acquisition

lol half-court offense

lol Marion

[LoneStarState'sPride]

"Clamps"

ROFLMFAO

[santymrc]

Where are the Mavs fans to defend Marion? Hahahahaha

[Spurtacus]

lol The Matrix

[DPG21920]

Marion played fine imo. It was not his fault the Mavs lost.

[CubanMustGo]

http://img80.imageshack.us/img80/8752/clamps.jpg

[Waps1980]

RJ still has the ability to be the X factor in any playoff series.
He showed up in what 3 games, I'm sure there is more to come, and without his 17 first half points in game 2 we possibly wouldn't have got the edge over Mavs that was a major part of the series.
Back our boys Spurs fans we've got the team to go all the way bring it.
Go Spurs Go!

[NFGIII]

Marion's MO has been know for some time IMHO. He is a great transition/fast break player who has some serious hops. He still has one of the quickest second jumps around the rim on missed shots and can get rebounds against almost anyone.

Having said that he is a dismal failure when forced to play in a half court game. There was a reason that he sat on the bench at crucial times against the Spurs and why the Suns moved him. Once the Spurs slowed it down to the half court he became ineffective.

Marion wont change and learn the half court game. He really doesn't have the body to play down low and needs to use his speed and hops to br effective. And so far he doesn't seem to be mentally tough, either. He also needs a playmaker to thrive since I'm not impressed with his ability to create on his own. Just MHO.

[elbamba]

I thought jefferson played well and defended about as good as we could hope for. He will never be worth the money, but he was a nice player in this series.