Can Richard Jefferson be the Spurs' "Lamar Odom"?

[vednam]

No, Richard Jefferson is not going to make the Big 3 the Big 4. No, he is not going to be able to bring it every night. No, he is certainly not going to earn his 14-15 million per year.

But people complaining about that at this point are missing the big picture.


Jefferson is still a huge upgrade over Michael Finley or whoever else the Spurs might have tried at the 3. He's still a decent athlete on a team that needs athleticism. He's not a great defender, but he's competent. When he's finishing around the basket, it adds another dimension to the Spurs. It's a welcome sight after watching everyone outside the Big 3 stand behind the three point line the whole game.


Lakers fans have complained about Lamar Odom for the same reasons Spurs fans now complain about Jefferson. He's always been overpaid, underachieving, inconsistent, and dull at times. But on a team with two or three guys better than him, his occasional good games create headaches for opponents. And he's an undeniable factor. Having Odom (or Jefferson) is far, far better than having an old stiff who will never surprise you or add another dimension to the team.


The Spurs don't need Jefferson to be a star. Can he be the talented, inconsistent player who puts them over the top?

[Duncanoypi]

I love Dick!

[vednam]

people focus too much on how much he's making and on inflated expectations than on the very real upgrade he has been...

[Slydragon]

people focus too much on how much he's making and on inflated expectations than on the very real upgrade he has been...

I expect a lot from someone who gets paid more than anyone of the big 3.

[Spurologist]

I love Dick!

Too Much Information

[mingus]

i was concerned that RJ and TP couldn't play well together. after game 1, i really believed that. they finally started to give him the ball more, esp. inthe right spots, and RJ is looking nice. he needs to be in the 14 point range. his rebounding has to be there as well. if he can do both of those things he'll be a success. but much of that success depends more on people loooking toget him the ball than him being aggressive.

[Andy25]

Yeah seriously you want Finley or Jefferson playing?

And those that say you want Bruce back... in 2008 he had already lost a step or two and wasn't knocking down his corner 3. I love Bruce too, but I don't think Spurs fans would of been happy with that situation either.

So all in all go Jefferson!

[TheSullyMonster]

I expect a lot from someone who gets paid more than anyone of the big 3.

Duncan makes more.:nope

[vednam]

I expect a lot from someone who gets paid more than anyone of the big 3.

The Spurs didn't decide what to pay him. They got him because he was the best small forward available.


Would you rather the Spurs not have traded for Jefferson and be playing Keith Bogans? Then you could say "at least he's paid proportionally to his worth".

[MaNu4Tres]

The Spurs didn't decide what to pay him. They got him because he was the best small forward available.


Would you rather the Spurs not have traded for Jefferson and be playing Keith Bogans? Then you could say "at least he's paid proportionally to his worth".

Couldn't agree more...

Wise words vednam

[DespЏrado]

all things can be forgiven if he keeps playing the way he has the last few games.
The dude has been everything we need out of him. Who gives a crap about the regular season anymore.

[Sisk]

all things can be forgiven if he keeps playing the way he has the last few games.
The dude has been everything we need out of him. Who gives a crap about the regular season anymore.

All of this. Seriously.

He's been playing great recently

Game 1 - -8 (everyone played pretty poorly, highest was +7 by bonner)
Game 2 - +22 best game of the series for him
Game 3 - +11 low scoring, still contributed
Game 4 - +4 good scoring


Sure, +/- isn't everything but I've been more than pleased with his performance so far. Much better than the regular season. Not to mention his two free throws down the stretch this last game that really helped out.

Forget the regular season already, and forget his damn salary.

[milkyway21]

if Pop will play his cards right, JR could win a title ahead of J Kidd :D

I don't need Jefferson to score 20 or 30. Just be ready when the any of the scorers like Duncan or Manu has an off night (or injury), like in game 2. Last night GHill was ready, he could be the target in game 5, so be prepared JR.

[tuncaboylu]

Jefferson is pretty good right now, and yes he is more like Odom at Lakers.

[z0sa]

RJ doesn't have the versatility, especially when it comes to rebounding, but he's a mini-Odom in some aspects. What he really excels at is finishing and there, Odom doesn't hold a candle. I hope he continues playing off the Big 3 and Hill for efficient offense while keeping up the hard nosed D.

[100%duncan]

yeah having RJ giving us 8-15 pts consistently in this playoffs will surely help the spurs big time

[will_spurs]

The question of his salary is overblown and there's only one truth to it: if the Spurs go deep, nobody will care how much RJ is paid--and if the Spurs exit early he will have been a bust. As simple as that.

[tdunk21]

RJ is better than odom in the playoffs so far....

[Manufan909]

The question of his salary is overblown and there's only one truth to it: if the Spurs go deep, nobody will care how much RJ is paid--and if the Spurs exit early he will have been a bust. As simple as that.

This sums it up best. But I doubt bust would be the right word, unless he pulls a Bonner and starts shooting under 30%. He was a huge factor in all but Gm 1. Sadly, in the home games the Big 3 plus Hill and Blair really overshadowed his contributions. He has been a vital cog so far, and when RJ plays like crap, the Spurs lose. I know Hill was off too, plus Dirk swished almost everything he threw up, but RJ is one of the players who has no excuse not to play well. He's a PO veteran, not to mention he's on the court with a combo of the Big 4 Four a majority of the time.

Dice would be another player with no excuse, but he's proven so far to arguably be the steadiest player on the team. His work on Dirk and hitting open looks/cheap points have been unreal, so I have no real worries with him. He's seems to be akin to Horry in that he blossoms in April.

Blair gets a pass for his rookie status, but Bonner has no one but himself to blame for missing wide-open shots 70% of the time. Bogans will be only truly needed against a star guard, which the Mavs don't come close to having, so we'll have to wait to judge him.

[MateoNeygro]

No, Richard Jefferson is not going to make the Big 3 the Big 4. No, he is not going to be able to bring it every night. No, he is certainly not going to earn his 14-15 million per year.

But people complaining about that at this point are missing the big picture.


Jefferson is still a huge upgrade over Michael Finley or whoever else the Spurs might have tried at the 3. He's still a decent athlete on a team that needs athleticism. He's not a great defender, but he's competent. When he's finishing around the basket, it adds another dimension to the Spurs. It's a welcome sight after watching everyone outside the Big 3 stand behind the three point line the whole game.


Lakers fans have complained about Lamar Odom for the same reasons Spurs fans now complain about Jefferson. He's always been overpaid, underachieving, inconsistent, and dull at times. But on a team with two or three guys better than him, his occasional good games create headaches for opponents. And he's an undeniable factor. Having Odom (or Jefferson) is far, far better than having an old stiff who will never surprise you or add another dimension to the team.


The Spurs don't need Jefferson to be a star. Can he be the talented, inconsistent player who puts them over the top?

Not to be a dick but a lot of what you said is wrong. I agree he is an upgrade over Finley but he didn't exactly replace Finley, and as for your statement that he's better than anyone we might have tried to get at the 3 is false. I believe a number of players would have been a better fit. Don't get me wrong I appreciate Jefferson now that he's playing well but S-Jax, Ariza, and Iggy would all have been better fits if you ask me. As for the "can he be our Lamar Odom" umm the only thing good about Odom is the match up problems he creates. Other than that I've never really seen him play with any heart or hustle so umm fuck Lamar Odom but hey that's just my opinion.

[ezau]

if Pop will play his cards right, JR could win a title ahead of J Kidd :D

I don't need Jefferson to score 20 or 30. Just be ready when the any of the scorers like Duncan or Manu has an off night (or injury), like in game 2. Last night GHill was ready, he could be the target in game 5, so be prepared JR.

J. Reddick?

[MateoNeygro]

The Spurs didn't decide what to pay him. They got him because he was the best small forward available.


Would you rather the Spurs not have traded for Jefferson and be playing Keith Bogans? Then you could say "at least he's paid proportionally to his worth".

Good Point

[MaNu4Tres]

Not to be a dick but a lot of what you said is wrong. I agree he is an upgrade over Finley but he didn't exactly replace Finley, and as for your statement that he's better than anyone we might have tried to get at the 3 is false. I believe a number of players would have been a better fit. Don't get me wrong I appreciate Jefferson now that he's playing well but S-Jax, Ariza, and Iggy would all have been better fits if you ask me.

Love ya MateoNegro :tu but I disagree.

Stephen Jackson wasn't available until the regular season started. Therefore possibly trading for him wasn't an option in the summer.

Ariza might have been a better fit , but then the Spurs wouldn't have been able to use the MLE to sign McDyess if this played out. The key in trading for Jefferson was trading Oberto and Bowen before free agency started, so the team receiving Oberto and Bowen could decline their option and shave money off their cap for this season. Spurs gained a lot of value and put themselves in a less vulnerable position going into free agency by using those trading assets before free agency started.

If Spurs would have let that opportunity pass they would have put themselves in a vulnerable situation with only the MLE to make additions at the small forward and the most important starting C/PF position next to Duncan. In this case I would much rather have Jefferson/ McDyess than Ariza/ Bonner. And there's no guarantee he would have came here in the first place. Passing up on a deal proposed such as Jefferson for nothing is not a very smart thing to pass up on with the hopes on signing a free agent that has 30 teams to choose from. Ariza would have fit in a little better, but the dropoff between him and Jefferson fitting in the Spurs system isn't that significant where the gamble would have been worth it.

Andre Igoudala wasn't available in the summer either. The only reason why you heard Igoudala's name in trade scenarios this past February was due to Brand's inflated and ridiculous contract. Philly was willing to do everything possible, such as including Igoudala in a deal to get rid of Brand's contract. Which was hard to do because Iggy and Brand are owed over 134 million the next 4 years. Something the Spurs would be pretty stupid to do. (Paying 134 million over 4-5 years for players who are never going to make an All-Star team is pretty stupid.)

People want to cry about R.J's salary, but it was only for 2 years and doesn't put the Spurs future in a vulnerable position. Which is why the Spurs were fine with the deal.

[MateoNeygro]

Love ya MateoNegro :tu but I disagree.

Stephen Jackson wasn't available until the regular season started. Therefore possibly trading for him wasn't an option in the summer.

Ariza might have been a better fit , but then the Spurs wouldn't have been able to use the MLE to sign McDyess if this played out. The key in trading for Jefferson was trading Oberto and Bowen before free agency started, so the team receiving Oberto and Bowen could decline their option and shave money off their cap for this season. Spurs gained a lot of value and put themselves in a less vulnerable position going into free agency by using those trading assets before free agency started.

If Spurs would have let that opportunity pass they would have put themselves in a vulnerable situation with only the MLE to make additions at the small forward and the most important starting C/PF position next to Duncan. In this case I would much rather have Jefferson/ McDyess than Ariza/ Bonner. And there's no guarantee he would have came here in the first place. Passing up on a deal proposed such as Jefferson for nothing is not a very smart thing to pass up on with the hopes on signing a free agent that has 30 teams to choose from. Ariza would have fit in a little better, but the dropoff between him and Jefferson fitting in the Spurs system isn't that significant where the gamble would have been worth it.

Andre Igoudala wasn't available in the summer either. The only reason why you heard Igoudala's name in trade scenarios this past February was due to Brand's inflated and ridiculous contract. Philly was willing to do everything possible, such as including Igoudala in a deal to get rid of Brand's contract. Which was hard to do because Iggy and Brand are owed over 134 million the next 4 years. Something the Spurs would be pretty stupid to do. (Paying 134 million over 4-5 years for players who are never going to make an All-Star team is pretty stupid.)

People want to cry about R.J's salary, but it was only for 2 years and doesn't put the Spurs future in a vulnerable position. Which is why the Spurs were fine with the deal.

fair enough, as you know. I'm on a ship in the middle of nowhere with very little access to the outside world so I'm not super up to date on my Spurs like I want to be. Anyway would you say he's like our Lamar Odom? Do you even like Lamar Odom's game??

[Chief]

Richard Jefferon has the ability on any given night to go off, I think that´s worth his contract alone. Finley could go off but on what, 3 pointers alone? R.J. if he really wants to can drive to the hoop, is more athletic then anyone we would´ve kept, and other then manu, can actually dunk the ball (not counting big men who are supposed to)

[MaNu4Tres]

fair enough, as you know. I'm on a ship in the middle of nowhere with very little access to the outside world so I'm not super up to date on my Spurs like I want to be. Anyway would you say he's like our Lamar Odom? Do you even like Lamar Odom's game??

I understand ya homie. When are coming back? We need to catch up and have a few cervesas.


His game isn't like Odom's by any means. I just think you are able to compare the two. Both were paid as the 1st or 2nd options from their previous teams and now they are on a team where they are the 4th or 5th options. Tough to become as productive when your opportunities are limited. That's why I tend to look at overall shooting percentage than actual numbers. (Jefferson's shooting percentage has improved from last year btw.)

I like the versatility Odom brings to the Lakers and I wish Spurs had a player off the bench that brings what he brings. He was the reason why Lakers beat the Spurs in 2008. Spurs didn't have an answer for him defensively and he absolutely killed us on the glass. Giving the Lakers a multitude of 2nd chance opportunities. The knock on him throughout his tenure with the Lakers has been consistency and it still is a problem. Against the Spurs though he brings it for whatever reason.

And I don't think the guy will ever reach his full potential. Out of Rhode Island he had the potential to be a star in the league. There weren't very many 6'10" players out of college that had the potential to play every position.

[MateoNeygro]

I understand ya homie. When are coming back? We need to catch up and have a few cervesas.


His game isn't like Odom's by any means. I just think you are able to compare the two. Both were paid as the 1st or 2nd options from their previous teams and now they are on a team where they are the 4th or 5th options. Tough to become as productive when your opportunities are limited. That's why I tend to look at overall shooting percentage than actual numbers. (Jefferson's shooting percentage has improved from last year btw.)

I like the versatility Odom brings to the Lakers and I wish Spurs had a player off the bench that brings what he brings. He was the reason why Lakers beat the Spurs in 2008. Spurs didn't have an answer for him defensively and he absolutely killed us on the glass. Giving the Lakers a multitude of 2nd chance opportunities. The knock on him throughout his tenure with the Lakers has been consistency and it still is a problem. Against the Spurs though he brings it for whatever reason.

And I don't think the guy will ever reach his full potential. Out of Rhode Island he had the potential to be a star in the league. There weren't very many 6'10" players out of college that had the potential to play every position.

Good observations, I totally agree. I just don't really like him because he very rarely seems to care. Maybe it's a misconception on my part i dunno. Anyway I'll be back towards the end of the summer man. We'll have a few when I'm back in the mother land for sure. GO SPURS GO!

[SpurCharger]

RJ has played pretty Good so far In the playoffs.... if we can Get 11 to 18 pts a game from him, then we have a shot to beat anybody!

[ohmwrecker]

I can't believe everyone is still bitching about RJ's paycheck. How many time's does this need to be explained?

RJ is better than Finley? No shit. He's also better than '08-'09 Bruce. He more than doubles Bowen's offensive production and there is only a marginal difference defensively. He actually almost makes up for Oberto and Thomas on the boards most nights. He'll be even better next year. I hope he stays.

Even if the Spurs if the Spurs knew then what they know now about RJ, I think they still pull the trigger on that deal. No question.

[Frenchise player]

Lakers fan are right to complain about Odom and it's normal that Spurs fans do the same about RJ. A championship team doesn't need an overpaid, frustrating player, the Lakers won their title because they had the best roster with two of the best players in the league.
RJ upside is not the same as Odom either, Lamar has a combo of size/speed that makes him a nightmare to defend when he's on.

I don't buy in the argument that the Spurs couldn't find any other way to invest this kind of money, this is a league where some teams are ready to make crazy moves just to reduce the payroll, there must be a scenario where 15 millions lands you better than an underachieving Jefferson.

If the Spurs reach the finals and RJ finds a way to contribute significatively then it's all money well spent but there's still a lot games ahead.

[SpurCharger]

I can't believe everyone is still bitching about RJ's paycheck. How many time's does this need to be explained?

RJ is better than Finley? No shit. He's also better than '08-'09 Bruce. He more than doubles Bowen's offensive production and there is only a marginal difference defensively. He actually almost makes up for Oberto and Thomas on the boards most nights. He'll be even better next year. I hope he stays.

Even if the Spurs if the Spurs knew then what they know now about RJ, I think they still pull the trigger on that deal. No question.
I agree with you.... I think Jefferson has found his Roll With This team..... But more important I think the Team has finally Adapted to him as well!

[Seventyniner]

J. Reddick?

Jeffard Richardson.

[jimo2305]

at this rate.. RJ needs to be like playoffs mvp for me to forgive him for his wrong doings all season

[ShoogarBear]

Who gets to be the Spurs "Khloe Kardashian"?

[EricB]

at this rate.. RJ needs to be like playoffs mvp for me to forgive him for his wrong doings all season


Oh get over yourself.

[SCdac]

I'm just glad Richard Jefferson is an above-average player skill wise that can at times have empty games, not a below-average player (say Udoka) who can have a couple big games out of ten. Jefferson, in my opinion, has been a trooper this season on a team that is entirely new to him and his way of playing. What I like the most is, he has blocked more shots this season than almost the last 3 seasons combined, and per-36 minutes he's rebounded more than he has since 05-06. He's been one of the most athletic help defenders we've had in some time, and in the long run it's helped. Somebody like Caron Butler should be tearing our team up, but when RJ has defended him he's "stayed in front of him" about as well as we could ask without fouling or overcommitting. Add in the fact that he's been tasked with guarding power forwards at different parts of the season, I think his struggles are understandable, frustrating, but ultimately could be alot worse for him and our team.

[jimo2305]

Who gets to be the Spurs "Khloe Kardashian"?

i dunno... some guy O.o

[Sisk]

I think people are still missing the point of this thread (as the OP intended it, I believe) in the fact that he's not comparing Odom's game to RJ's, but saying they take on the same role. Not that RJ takes threes, but that each of their games are important to their team's success.

[Obstructed_View]

I think people are still missing the point of this thread (as the OP intended it, I believe) in the fact that he's not comparing Odom's game to RJ's, but saying they take on the same role. Not that RJ takes threes, but that each of their games are important to their team's success.

In that sense, RJ is exactly the same as Odom. If they play to their capabilities and contribute, they suddenly take a very good team and turn it into a great team.

[ShoogarBear]

Odom has the ability to be an end-to-end dominant offensive talent in stretches, and is capable of actually carrying the Lakers for bursts or even for entire games. When Odom is on in addition to Kobe and Gasol, the Lakers are probably unbeatable.

RJ will never be anything other than a complimentary piece dependent on others.

Having said that, if the Spurs end up facing the Lakers, RJ outplaying Odom would be a key factor in victory for the Spurs.