Do you know how a person becomes a legal citizen?

[LnGrrrR]

How many people are actually familiar with the process and what's required?

I'm curious to see what the answers will be.

[boutons_deux]

Why are you curious? Do you have Internet?

[LnGrrrR]

Why are you curious? Do you have Internet?

I know what it consists of... I'm just wondering if the majority of posters know the difficulties involved.

[DarrinS]

Evidently, it's a pain in the ass. Otherwise, the illegal route woudn't be so attractive.

[LnGrrrR]

Evidently, it's a pain in the ass. Otherwise, the illegal route woudn't be so attractive.

Ding ding ding! We do have a winner. It's time-consuming and expensive.

Here are the costs in expenses my wife I have racked up so far (not counting time/effort spent gathering evidence)

$2500 for a lawyer to help with the initial package, which is quite large
$1400 for the initial package to get her green card (Application for green card plus fiance petition)
$545 for the 2 year 'checkup'
$80 for the lawyer to review 2 year checkup package

And coming up...

$675 for her citizenship

and probably another $80 bucks for a lawyer to review.

By the time we're done, it will be about $5200... blah!

I think it was easier getting my security clearance done than this. :)

[TDMVPDPOY]

just marry some clown who has a green card then divorce

[panic giraffe]

By the time we're done, it will be about $5200... blah!

I think it was easier getting my security clearance done than this. :)

wow it's cheaper to get a DWI. that's sad.

and i'm assuming some of this was expatiated due to the fact she married military, or at least air force (woka woka woka)

[in2deep]

By the time we're done, it will be about $5200... blah!

I think it was easier getting my security clearance done than this. :)

$5200?????

that is chump change for an illegal.

I know of illegals that are paying $25,000 for a mere work visa

[LnGrrrR]

wow it's cheaper to get a DWI. that's sad.

and i'm assuming some of this was expatiated due to the fact she married military, or at least air force (woka woka woka)

Nope, same cost. Military spouses don't get discounts; however, if I were deployed, the time for residency would be lowered. (She has to wait 3 years after getting her green card to apply for citizenship.)

I didn't realize DWIs were so expensive.

[LnGrrrR]

$5200?????

that is chump change for an illegal.

I know of illegals that are paying $25,000 for a mere work visa

$25K huh? They must have one heck of a job.

Edit: And if they have a work visa, and they're living here, why not just try to upgrade to residency status?

[z0sa]

It's all about the $$, the rest of that doesn't sound very intimidating

[LnGrrrR]

It's all about the $$, the rest of that doesn't sound very intimidating

Intimidating? Not really.. just a hassle. For instance, our package included:

Documentation of marriage
Pictures, cards, letters etc proving the marriage was valid
Birth certs, social sec card
Shared finances (ie bank statements etc etc)
Signed letters/affidavits from friends and family testifying to the validity of our marriage
Tax returns to show ability to support spouse
The forms themselves (family history, personal items)
Medical examination
Personal interview/fingerprinting

And a few other odds and ends.

My wife and I are just impatient to get this waiting period/form over with, have her take her English and civics test, then say her oath.

[z0sa]

So what is the point of this thread? I assume you are attempting to demonstrate part of the reason why many illegals are illegal in the first place.

[in2deep]

$25K huh? They must have one heck of a job.


no. they are illegal. they have 2-3 shitty jobs and save for a few years to achieve that though.



Edit: And if they have a work visa, and they're living here, why not just try to upgrade to residency status?

exactly, the work visa opens the door to all that.

[Duff McCartney]

Illegals can't marry citizens and then become citizens. It doesn't work that way. The only way an "illegal" can marry a citizen and become legal is if they entered the country legally.

There comes a point in the process where you have to show that you entered here legally, and if you don't have that, you can't continue the process.

The only way that can happen is if they are married and the not legal spouse lives in their country of origin. Then they get a visa, and are allowed to come over here. It is a big hassle.

[LnGrrrR]

It's all about the $$, the rest of that doesn't sound very intimidating

To bitch about having to pay 5K or so? :lol And ostensibly, to educate others on what's involved. But mostly to bitch.

[LnGrrrR]

Illegals can't marry citizens and then become citizens. It doesn't work that way. The only way an "illegal" can marry a citizen and become legal is if they entered the country legally.

There comes a point in the process where you have to show that you entered here legally, and if you don't have that, you can't continue the process.

Well, I don't think that's exactly right... the process can continue, but they have to move to Mexico to continue it. My wife had a VISA so she was allowed to stay, but I can certainly see why illegal immigrants choose not to expose themselves.

In2deep, I don't see why the cost would be 25K... if they're working towards legal residency, then they should be able to pay for the forms/filing fees. Of course, I wouldn't be surprised if some of that was for lawyer fees.

That's the biggest issue, that I see. If you're an illegal immigrant living here, you're probably going to keep working until you make the money. Because if you go to Mexico to make the money, it will take 3x as long... and 5K may seem like chump change to some, but I'm sure it isn't to many immigrants.

[z0sa]

To bitch about having to pay 5K or so? :lol And ostensibly, to educate others on what's involved. But mostly to bitch.

I can agree there, that $5k is worth bitching over. :toast

[John Terry]

Ding ding ding! We do have a winner. It's time-consuming and expensive.

Here are the costs in expenses my wife I have racked up so far (not counting time/effort spent gathering evidence)

$2500 for a lawyer to help with the initial package, which is quite large
$1400 for the initial package to get her green card (Application for green card plus fiance petition)
$545 for the 2 year 'checkup'
$80 for the lawyer to review 2 year checkup package

And coming up...

$675 for her citizenship

and probably another $80 bucks for a lawyer to review.

By the time we're done, it will be about $5200... blah!

I think it was easier getting my security clearance done than this. :)

sorry but I'm afraid it'll cost more to make her a real citizen with full rights, including the rights for being a presidential candidate. Not meaning she'll actually go there someday, I mean you just need to know how much efforts/cashes Obama paid then his presidency looks fairly deserved to you with all these considered.

[clambake]

what?

[jacobdrj]

sorry but I'm afraid it'll cost more to make her a real citizen with full rights, including the rights for being a presidential candidate. Not meaning she'll actually go there someday, I mean you just need to know how much efforts/cashes Obama paid then his presidency looks fairly deserved to you with all these considered.

?

[Duff McCartney]

Well, I don't think that's exactly right... the process can continue, but they have to move to Mexico to continue it. My wife had a VISA so she was allowed to stay, but I can certainly see why illegal immigrants choose not to expose themselves.

That is exactly right. I know people that have tried that way. The only way they can continue is if they go back to Mexico so they can get their visa, but if they go back, they face the penalty of waiting 10 years before they can return to the United States. That is no joke.

[ploto]

Isn't a lot of this because she married a US citizen, and you are having to prove it really is a valid marriage with all these visits and documentation? There are people who do it without spending $3000 on an attorney.

[Duff McCartney]

sorry but I'm afraid it'll cost more to make her a real citizen with full rights, including the rights for being a presidential candidate.

An immigrant can never become President. Nor can they even be in the Presidential line of succession. Meaning no Secretary of State, none of that. Unless of course I am mistaken and it is possible for someone who wasn't born in this country to be President.

[Duff McCartney]

Isn't a lot of this because she married a US citizen, and you are having to prove it really is a valid marriage with all these visits and documentation? There are people who do it without spending $3000 on an attorney.

None of the money that lngrrr is mentioning is paid to an attorney, these are all fees that CIS requires to be paid.

[LnGrrrR]

Isn't a lot of this because she married a US citizen, and you are having to prove it really is a valid marriage with all these visits and documentation?

Yes, we have to prove the marriage is legal and "real" (not taken up just to get her green card).


There are people who do it without spending $3000 on an attorney.

Probably. But they'd still be on the hook for the other $2500 in filing fees.

[word]

How many people are actually familiar with the process and what's required?

I'm curious to see what the answers will be.

Well at least you're aware that there is actually a process.

[Ginobilly]

Yes, we have to prove the marriage is legal and "real" (not taken up just to get her green card).


Probably. But they'd still be on the hook for the other $2500 in filing fees.

Do you include pictures of yourself having sex with your spouse, just so that you can prove it's real?

[ploto]

None of the money that lngrrr is mentioning is paid to an attorney, these are all fees that CIS requires to be paid.


$2500 for a lawyer to help with the initial package

[LnGrrrR]

Do you include pictures of yourself having sex with your spouse, just so that you can prove it's real?

Ha! I don't think they'd accept that. Sharing our Valentine's Day cards was personal enough.

I understand the cost of the fees... I mean, background checking isn't cheap. I don't have to enjoy it though. :lol

[ElNono]

Ding ding ding! We do have a winner. It's time-consuming and expensive.

Here are the costs in expenses my wife I have racked up so far (not counting time/effort spent gathering evidence)

$2500 for a lawyer to help with the initial package, which is quite large
$1400 for the initial package to get her green card (Application for green card plus fiance petition)
$545 for the 2 year 'checkup'
$80 for the lawyer to review 2 year checkup package

And coming up...

$675 for her citizenship

and probably another $80 bucks for a lawyer to review.

By the time we're done, it will be about $5200... blah!

I think it was easier getting my security clearance done than this. :)

We actually did it all without lawyers... and paid about $4K. You forgot to include that on every step they nail you $50 or so for fingerprinting. They must have done my fingerprints like 10 times already between my old H1B visa and my residency. I fully expect to get fingerprinted one more time when I apply for citizenship.

[LnGrrrR]

We actually did it all without lawyers... and paid about $4K. You forgot to include that on every step they nail you $50 or so for fingerprinting. They must have done my fingerprints like 10 times already between my old H1B visa and my residency. I fully expect to get fingerprinted one more time when I apply for citizenship.

You will. I included those fees in my calculations, but yeah, it's pretty bs. Why do they need to take my wife's biometrics three times? Yeesh.

When are you applying ElNono?

[symple19]

I served with guys in the Army who had been in years, fought for America, and still couldn't get their citizenship...Wow

[MiamiHeat]

i assume the point of this thread is to point out how hard it is

i guess i can just bitch and whine, go break the law when i want something, because doing it legally is too hard.

the united states is not a mecca for every single human who wants to come here. it is a country with fucking borders and laws.

"BUT MEXICO SUCKS, I WANT BETTER LIFE"

then fix your fucking country you cockroach. don't run away and scatter. how else do you think countries rise up from the ashes?

fix mexico. get rid of your drug problem, fix your economy, enact new laws.

stop coming to usa.

all of these illegal immigrants are hurting america in almost every way possible.

[LnGrrrR]

i assume the point of this thread is to point out how hard it is

...


So what is the point of this thread? I assume you are attempting to demonstrate part of the reason why many illegals are illegal in the first place.


To bitch about having to pay 5K or so? :lol And ostensibly, to educate others on what's involved. But mostly to bitch.

Reading comprehension fail.

[LnGrrrR]

then fix your fucking country you cockroach. don't run away and scatter. how else do you think countries rise up from the ashes?

fix mexico. get rid of your drug problem, fix your economy, enact new laws.


Does Mexico have superheroes now?

I don't think you realize how failed a state some parts of Mexico are right now. It's not just, "Oh, I'm poor." It's "Oh, I'm poor, and I'm threatened by drug dealers who pretty much own the government."

I'm not saying I'm totally fine with illegal immigration. But to act like it's that simple to fix the problem is retarded.



the united states is not a mecca for every single human who wants to come here. it is a country with fucking borders and laws.



Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame,
With conquering limbs astride from land to land;
Here at our sea-washed, sunset gates shall stand
A mighty woman with a torch, whose flame
Is the imprisoned lightning, and her name
Mother of Exiles. From her beacon-hand
Glows world-wide welcome; her mild eyes command
The air-bridged harbor that twin cities frame.
"Keep, ancient lands, your storied pomp!" cries she
With silent lips. "Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me, I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"


But hey, I guess the Statue of Liberty is a commie liberal.

[Wild Cobra]

Evidently, it's a pain in the ass. Otherwise, the illegal route woudn't be so attractive.
It is.

My ex-wife is a permanent alien resident. We started the process some years back, but it was difficult and unnecessary since she has permanent status.

[Wild Cobra]

You will. I included those fees in my calculations, but yeah, it's pretty bs. Why do they need to take my wife's biometrics three times? Yeesh.

It's to make sure someone else doesn't change places in the middle of the process.

[ElNono]

You will. I included those fees in my calculations, but yeah, it's pretty bs. Why do they need to take my wife's biometrics three times? Yeesh.

When are you applying ElNono?

I'll be a 5 year resident in March 2012...

[ElNono]

It's to make sure someone else doesn't change places in the middle of the process.

Biometrics verification is done by merely sticking your thumb in a portable reader and looking at a camera. Done it plenty of times when coming in from overseas.

What these guys do is a full set of fingerprints + photo every time. I'm pretty sure it's for archival. I'm also pretty sure that the company that received the contract to do this is doing quite well...

[MiamiHeat]

Does Mexico have superheroes now?

I don't think you realize how failed a state some parts of Mexico are right now. It's not just, "Oh, I'm poor." It's "Oh, I'm poor, and I'm threatened by drug dealers who pretty much own the government."

I'm not saying I'm totally fine with illegal immigration. But to act like it's that simple to fix the problem is retarded.




Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame,
With conquering limbs astride from land to land;
Here at our sea-washed, sunset gates shall stand
A mighty woman with a torch, whose flame
Is the imprisoned lightning, and her name
Mother of Exiles. From her beacon-hand
Glows world-wide welcome; her mild eyes command
The air-bridged harbor that twin cities frame.
"Keep, ancient lands, your storied pomp!" cries she
With silent lips. "Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me, I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"


But hey, I guess the Statue of Liberty is a commie liberal.

there is so much flawed logic in this post, i won't even bother

you can figure it out for yourself if you self-reflect on your post.


i will say though, I was talking about ILLEGAL immigration, not legal immigration. I assumed this thread was because "look how hard it is to become a citizen! no wonder illegals commit a crime and sneak into america!"

these cockroaches who sneak in this country, then spawn like fucking insects are ruining state's economies. THEY DONT FUCKING PAY TAXES, yet they suck our resources. These roaches hide in the shadows and then scatter when La Migra comes around.

Higher crime rates, JOB THEFT, bigger burden on education system, government programs, medical care, .....


Mexicans come over here, and then it gives the option to companies to hire a mexican for 2-3 dollars an hour than to hire an american for 7 dollars/hr.

I fully support Arizona and I wish to see EVERY FUCKING STATE DO IT, THEY BROKE OUR LAW THE VERY SECOND THEY STEPPED FOOT ON OUR SOIL ILLEGALY. Throw them out like the fucking cockroaches they are.

[timvpimp]

there is so much flawed logic in this post, i won't even bother

you can figure it out for yourself if you self-reflect on your post.


i will say though, I was talking about ILLEGAL immigration, not legal immigration. I assumed this thread was because "look how hard it is to become a citizen! no wonder illegals commit a crime and sneak into america!"

these cockroaches who sneak in this country, then spawn like fucking insects are ruining state's economies. THEY DONT FUCKING PAY TAXES, yet they suck our resources. These roaches hide in the shadows and then scatter when La Migra comes around.

Higher crime rates, JOB THEFT, bigger burden on education system, government programs, medical care, .....


Mexicans come over here, and then it gives the option to companies to hire a mexican for 2-3 dollars an hour than to hire an american for 7 dollars/hr.

I fully support Arizona and I wish to see EVERY FUCKING STATE DO IT, THEY BROKE OUR LAW THE VERY SECOND THEY STEPPED FOOT ON OUR SOIL ILLEGALY. Throw them out like the fucking cockroaches they are.

you're a legal immigrant? I think to turn yourself a legal immigrant, preliminarily you need to get through some english tests like Toefl first of all, which probably you haven't got done yet.

[MiamiHeat]

you're a legal immigrant? I think to turn yourself a legal immigrant, preliminarily you need to get through some english tests like Toefl first of all, which probably you haven't got done yet.

what? I was born in USA, i'm not an immigrant. i know you are trolling though. so i won't respond to you again if you try it again


to sneak into a country and hide in there, breaking their law, stealing jobs from americans, sucking their resources and sending money back to another country, it's fucking wrong and you know it.

[timvpimp]

what? I was born in USA, i'm not an immigrant. i know you are trolling though. so i won't respond to you again if you try it again


to sneak into a country and hide in there, breaking their law, stealing jobs from americans, sucking their resources and sending money back to another country, it's fucking wrong and you know it.

co-signed, but I have to disagree on your clemency for those immigrants who are "legal". Just because they've got done some tests and probably have bribed some officials of immigration bureau, it doesn't mean they are rightfully to be living in america while the illegals aren't. Your dog might be lovely but you still can't differentiate him from the vagrant dogs who are of the same species yet wandering in street.

[Sense]

Ding ding ding! We do have a winner. It's time-consuming and expensive.

Here are the costs in expenses my wife I have racked up so far (not counting time/effort spent gathering evidence)

$2500 for a lawyer to help with the initial package, which is quite large
$1400 for the initial package to get her green card (Application for green card plus fiance petition)
$545 for the 2 year 'checkup'
$80 for the lawyer to review 2 year checkup package

And coming up...

$675 for her citizenship

and probably another $80 bucks for a lawyer to review.

By the time we're done, it will be about $5200... blah!

I think it was easier getting my security clearance done than this. :)


lmao.... Seriously?

I know people who pay about 3k tops... I guess it depends on the lawyer.


and people pay for working visas about 350 or so... there's a lot of exageration being thrown around.

[Sense]

to sneak into a country and hide in there, breaking their law, stealing jobs from americans, sucking their resources and sending money back to another country, it's fucking wrong and you know it.

Oh wow... hahahah.

I disagree with you on every statement you've made here. You know I've argued countless of times with idiots that view this topic like you do.... never ending arguments.


However, I can't seem to find myself to even start this one, just reading this makes me realize that some of you idiots just won't change your minds on anything relating an illegal immigrant.

I can understand someone like timvpimp, because it's fairly obvious that he's not an idiot when talking about the topic, but stop making yourself look bad... you should go live in Arizona, I'm sure it'll make you happier.

[DJ Mbenga]

Ding ding ding! We do have a winner. It's time-consuming and expensive.

Here are the costs in expenses my wife I have racked up so far (not counting time/effort spent gathering evidence)

$2500 for a lawyer to help with the initial package, which is quite large
$1400 for the initial package to get her green card (Application for green card plus fiance petition)
$545 for the 2 year 'checkup'
$80 for the lawyer to review 2 year checkup package

And coming up...

$675 for her citizenship

and probably another $80 bucks for a lawyer to review.

By the time we're done, it will be about $5200... blah!

I think it was easier getting my security clearance done than this. :)

sounds a little more expensive than it is to pay for a "coyote"

[word]

Ding ding ding! We do have a winner. It's time-consuming and expensive.

Here are the costs in expenses my wife I have racked up so far (not counting time/effort spent gathering evidence)

$2500 for a lawyer to help with the initial package, which is quite large
$1400 for the initial package to get her green card (Application for green card plus fiance petition)
$545 for the 2 year 'checkup'
$80 for the lawyer to review 2 year checkup package

And coming up...

$675 for her citizenship

and probably another $80 bucks for a lawyer to review.

By the time we're done, it will be about $5200... blah!

I think it was easier getting my security clearance done than this. :)

Your clearance won't cost you a dime and it just might be that hard. I've seen 'em take quite a while, over a year, sometimes two. Sometimes not. Depends what kind, how old you are, how much you screwed up in life or not.

[Duff McCartney]

Mexicans come over here, and then it gives the option to companies to hire a mexican for 2-3 dollars an hour than to hire an american for 7 dollars/hr.

That's capitalism my friend. You god damn communist.

[MiamiHeat]

That's capitalism my friend. You god damn communist.

can't tell if you're agreeing with me or not :P

but yeah, this is bullshit. that's called exploitation. harboring criminals, too.

there are federal and state minimum wage laws for a reason, you know.

when an illegal comes here and does a job for 2-3 dollars an hour, that is a stolen job. period. if they weren't here breaking the law and helping corporations to also break the law, then that job would have been filled by an american at a HIGHER SALARY. stolen jobs

[LnGrrrR]

lmao.... Seriously?

I know people who pay about 3k tops... I guess it depends on the lawyer.


and people pay for working visas about 350 or so... there's a lot of exageration being thrown around.

If you had taken out the lawyer numbers, it would be around 2700 roughly.

And if you don't believe me, just go to the USCIS website... they have all the cost of the forms there. Pretty easy to tell if I'm "exagerating" or not.

[LnGrrrR]

Your clearance won't cost you a dime and it just might be that hard. I've seen 'em take quite a while, over a year, sometimes two. Sometimes not. Depends what kind, how old you are, how much you screwed up in life or not.

Well, the biggest thing is that when they did my clearance, I didn't have to collect all the information! :lol

Thankfully mine was never delayed more than six months, but I've seen some people wait for over a year for theirs.

[ElNono]

lmao.... Seriously?

I know people who pay about 3k tops... I guess it depends on the lawyer.


and people pay for working visas about 350 or so... there's a lot of exageration being thrown around.

What? Go take a look at the USCIS site. Prices are there. (LINK (http://www.uscis.gov/portal/site/uscis/menuitem.eb1d4c2a3e5b9ac89243c6a7543f6d1a/?vgnextoid=db029c7755cb9010VgnVCM10000045f3d6a1RCR D&vgnextchannel=db029c7755cb9010VgnVCM10000045f3d6a1 RCRD))
I went through a H1B work visa, including extension and now residency.
The residency form alone is over $1K (I-485)...

I probably filed about 5 different forms in 10 years...

[Wild Cobra]

Biometrics verification is done by merely sticking your thumb in a portable reader and looking at a camera. Done it plenty of times when coming in from overseas.

What these guys do is a full set of fingerprints + photo every time. I'm pretty sure it's for archival. I'm also pretty sure that the company that received the contract to do this is doing quite well...

I'll bet the requirements by law don't get updated as technology does. So many things can be changed, but ever try to make non-political common-sense changes in such a large bureaucracy? I've worked for a couple large corporations, and work for a pretty large employer now. Practical changes almost take an act of God.

[LnGrrrR]

I'll bet the requirements by law don't get updated as technology does. So many things can be changed, but ever try to make non-political common-sense changes in such a large bureaucracy? I've worked for a couple large corporations, and work for a pretty large employer now. Practical changes almost take an act of God.

Eh, I bet it's more of a "show of security" measure as you postulated earlier... Plus, it's more money in the govenments pocket. They have to pay for that equipment somehow... Although at 80 bucks a screening, they must be expensive machines!