*First/Second Team All Defense List*

[PGDynasty24]

Dwight Howard, Rajon Rondo, LeBron James, Kobe Bryant and Gerald Wallace named to NBA All-Defensive First team.



NBA All-Defensive Second Team = Tim Duncan, Josh Smith, Anderson Varejao, Dwyane Wade and Thabo Sefolosha.

http://www.nba.com/2010/news/05/05/all.defense/index.html?ls=iref:nbahpt2

[Mike D]

link?

[Muser]

:tu nice to see G-Force get the credit he deserves.

[LnGrrrR]

Dwight Howard, Rajon Rondo, LeBron James, Kobe Bryant and Gerald Wallace named to NBA All-Defensive First team.



NBA All-Defensive Second Team = Tim Duncan, Josh Smith, Anderson Varejao, Dwyane Wade and Thabo Sefolosha.

Wow, I'm surprised about Rondo. I figured DWill would get the nod.

[HarlemHeat37]

Timmy shouldn't be on the team ahead of Bogut, I guess they penalized him for the missed games, which is stupid..

Kobe making it is ridiculous, as always, and even more ridiculous that he made it over Artest..

Nice to see Thabo and Varajeo getting the recognition..

[The Gemini Method]

Wow, I'm surprised about Rondo. I figured DWill would get the nod.

Didn't Rondo lead the league in steals this year?

[LnGrrrR]

:tu nice to see g-force get the credit he deserves.

+1

[BlackSwordsMan]

duncan center?

[LnGrrrR]

Didn't Rondo lead the league in steals this year?

Yes, he averaged 2.33 per game (second was Monta Ellis at 2.23). I guess I just undervalue steals.

I'm not saying Rondo isn't deserving of being on one of the lists, just figured DWill would get the recognition as "best PG".

I haven't seen many Utah games, but I was under the impression DWill played pretty decent defense.

[namlook]

Here come all the Kobe haters.

LOL. You know it's coming. An avalanche of kobe hate in this thread is imminent in 3....2...1....

[Ghazi]

It's interesting that Kidd just barely missed the 2nd team despite very shoddy on the ball defense these days.

but he's still decent against wings and a premier rebounder and still gets some steals. Not as bad a defender as the quicker PG's make him look to be.

Marion definitely deserved some votes at least.

[Phillip]

yeah its pretty crazy that marion didnt get a single vote. no one is saying hes a shut down defender, but he does a good job generally, and the stats dont lie. mavs are at the top of the league at defending the SF position

[coyotes_geek]

It's interesting that Kidd just barely missed the 2nd team despite very shoddy on the ball defense these days.

but he's still decent against wings and a premier rebounder and still gets some steals. Not as bad a defender as the quicker PG's make him look to be.

Marion definitely deserved some votes at least.

When it comes to the all-d teams, reputation counts. Kidd has a good one, Marion, unfairly IMO, has a bad one because he played for the Suns.

Tim Duncan is another example of the reputation effect.

[ChrisRichards]

Timmy shouldn't be on the team ahead of Bogut, I guess they penalized him for the missed games, which is stupid..

Kobe making it is ridiculous, as always, and even more ridiculous that he made it over Artest..

Nice to see Thabo and Varajeo getting the recognition..
They penalized Bogut because he missed 5 games. ROFL.

Artest cant make it over Kobe because the Forward spots are locked, still I can name a few guards much more deserving than Kobe.


I dont have a problem with Lebron, but I think Josh Smith desrves it over him. Considering Josh also had received more DPOY votes than Bron but whatever Bron is really a good pick anyway. His knack for blocks and steals in transition is one of the best in the league from any perimeter players.


Dwight
Gerald Wallace
Josh Smith
D Wade
Rondo

That should've been the All defense 1st team.


The list is fucked up. Like always.

[ChrisRichards]

I think the league should start assigning these selective duties to the media.

[badfish22]

It's interesting that Kidd just barely missed the 2nd team despite very shoddy on the ball defense these days.


Reputation votes. A lot went around this year, it seems.

[hitmanyr2k]

LOL. You know it's coming. An avalanche of kobe hate in this thread is imminent in 3....2...1....

I don't think it's really hate when it's the truth. Kobe making first team All-Defense the last 4-5 years has been a sick joke. It just shows how weak the NBA is today that a player who rarely ever makes a big impact on defense can be rewarded with a first team selection year after year. Hell, Lebron isn't even that good of a defender but at least he puts some effort in every now and then. Kobe is a ghost on the defensive end most nights.

[lefty]

Howard?

Varejao?

Wade?

Smith?








Really?

[RsxPiimp]

You dont think Howard deserves it?


Really?

[lefty]

You dont think Howard deserves it?


Really?
I don't

He is not fundamuntally sound as a defensive player; he has nice stats thanks to his athleticism

And whlie we're at it, how many tines has he been in foul trouble this season?

[FkLA]

All bullshit aside...

Why in the world does Kobe always get all-defense nods for guarding the likes of Thabo Sefolosha and Wesley Mathews? Than Lakerfan complains about the hype LeBron gets lol...you can go back to Kobe's younger days and guys like Fox or even Devon fucking George normally guarded the opposing team's best player. The last couple of years he had Ariza and now he has Artest to do the same. Sure he'll occasionally man up and guard and shut down guys like Tmac or Westbrook, but since when do glimpses of brilliance equal all-nba nods? Shit that french Bowlbwall guy in Dallas showed alot of glimpses in the Game 6 against the Spurs I hope he gets named to the All-NBA team!!! Ridiculous the hype this rapist gets.

[FkLA]

Howard?

Varejao?

Wade?

Smith?








Really?

you named all those guys, who are pretty deserving btw yet no mention of kobe bean bryant?

really?

really?

[DAF86]

All-defensive selections are a fucking dissgrace. lol Kobe making it.

[Girasuck]

Rondo is the best defensive PG in the game. No surprise he made it. DWill doesn't deserve to be on the all defensive team. That's the biggest weakness in his game.

[lefty]

you named all those guys, who are pretty deserving btw yet no mention of kobe bean bryant?

really?

really?
Oh yeah, and Kobe too

[The Gemini Method]

Not saying that Kobe deserves this recognition, but just to see how many people get incensed over something that will fade into obscurity (like so many awards do...) is comical to say the least.

[TheMACHINE]

lol ...i feel bad for fkla. Always unhappy. haha

[FkLA]

Not saying that Kobe deserves this recognition, but just to see how many people get incensed over something that will fade into obscurity (like so many awards do...) is comical to say the least.

fade into obscurity? doubt it, especially when he's racked up about 10 of these 1st team all-defense over his career...all undeserved btw.


lol ...i feel bad for fkla. Always unhappy. haha

make a case for your boy kobe and why he deserves this nod.

ill wait.

[picc84]

Kobe first team :rollin

They scared of you, Bean. :hat

[ffadicted]

Ive tried to ignore it for a long time ,but goddamn it lefty is either a troll or just fucking dumb

[RsxPiimp]

All bullshit aside...

Why in the world does Kobe always get all-defense nods for guarding the likes of Thabo Sefolosha and Wesley Mathews? Than Lakerfan complains about the hype LeBron gets lol...you can go back to Kobe's younger days and guys like Fox or even Devon fucking George normally guarded the opposing team's best player. The last couple of years he had Ariza and now he has Artest to do the same. Sure he'll occasionally man up and guard and shut down guys like Tmac or Westbrook, but since when do glimpses of brilliance equal all-nba nods? Shit that french Bowlbwall guy in Dallas showed alot of glimpses in the Game 6 against the Spurs I hope he gets named to the All-NBA team!!! Ridiculous the hype this rapist gets.

To be honest with you, I can't think of other guards that are much more deserving than Kobe, Kobe is there because there's really not a lot of great defensive guards roaming the perimeter nowadays but seriously, does anyone here can really say with convicntion they know more than the coaches who picked these players?

[The Gemini Method]

fade into obscurity? doubt it, especially when he's racked up about 10 of these 1st team all-defense over his career...all undeserved btw.



make a case for your boy kobe and why he deserves this nod.

ill wait.

No, you're wrong. He at one point was a premier defender. However, what I was referring to was the fact that makaing All-Anything in any sport is nice gesture but can you recall who made the list in 2001 without resorting to a Sports Almanac or an internet search? I don't see why you're so vehemently aghast at his selection. He doesn't posture for the recognition so, I mean, to be fair its quite humorous you'd find time to waste on such a thing.

[hitmanyr2k]

Not saying that Kobe deserves this recognition, but just to see how many people get incensed over something that will fade into obscurity (like so many awards do...) is comical to say the least.

That won't fade into obscurity. Those kind of awards say you're the best. This guy now has more All-Defense first team selections than Pippen for Christ's sake and he's NOWHERE NEAR Pippen's league as a defender. It's a travesty. The writing was on the wall when Kobe made first team All-Defense with a defensive rating of 109 back in 2007. The guy can crack Steve Nash territory on the defensive rating scale and STILL make the team. It's ridiculous to see this year after year.

[TheMACHINE]

make a case for your boy kobe and why he deserves this nod.

ill wait.

let me ask the 29 coaches that voted and i'll get back to you.

[ChrisRichards]

That won't fade into obscurity. Those kind of awards say you're the best. This guy now has more All-Defense first team selections than Pippen for Christ's sake and he's NOWHERE NEAR Pippen's league as a defender. It's a travesty. The writing was on the wall when Kobe made first team All-Defense with a defensive rating of 109 back in 2007. The guy can crack Steve Nash territory on the defensive rating scale and STILL make the team. It's ridiculous to see this year after year.
Are you serious? Pippen has less? Wow.

[FkLA]

To be honest with you, I can't think of other guards that are much more deserving than Kobe, Kobe is there because there's really not a lot of great defensive guards roaming the perimeter nowadays but seriously, does anyone here can really say with convicntion they know more than the coaches who picked these players?

Shane Battier, Matt Barnes, Aaron Affalo, and hell even Ron Artest. Thats four names off the top of my head that were more deserving. Those guys actually guard the opposing team's best perimeter player every game.



No, you're wrong. He at one point was a premier defender. However, what I was referring to was the fact that makaing All-Anything in any sport is nice gesture but can you recall who made the list in 2001 without resorting to a Sports Almanac or an internet search? I don't see why you're so vehemently aghast at his selection. He doesn't posture for the recognition so, I mean, to be fair its quite humorous you'd find time to waste on such a thing.

I dont hold it past him that he was a premier defender, but like I said he rarely guarded the opposing teams best player...someone has always had that role whether it be Fox, George, Ariza, or Artest. Who cares if he had the ability to be a premier defender when he wasnt actually using it? No reason at all to give such a high honor simply because of what a player is capable of doing and not what he actually goes and does out on the court.


That won't fade into obscurity. Those kind of awards say you're the best. This guy now has more All-Defense first team selections than Pippen for Christ's sake and he's NOWHERE NEAR Pippen's league as a defender. It's a travesty. The writing was on the wall when Kobe made first team All-Defense with a defensive rating of 109 back in 2007. The guy can crack Steve Nash territory on the defensive rating scale and STILL make the team. It's ridiculous to see this year after year.

Thank you.

This rapist will retire with an undeserved reputation as one of the greatest perimeter defenders ever, given all these 1st team all-defense nods he has racked up. Ridiculous. Even more ridiculous since Lakerfan is always bitching about the hype Bron gets, Kobe is right on his heels when it comes to hype.

[RsxPiimp]

Shane Battier, Matt Barnes, Aaron Affalo, and hell even Ron Artest. Thats four names off the top of my head that were more deserving. Those guys actually guard the opposing team's best perimeter player every game.

Dude. They go by POSITIONS. Players you mentioned play the Forward spots. Unless you think those players deserves it more than Lebron, Josh Howard or G. Wallace, then by all means make your case.

[TheMACHINE]

who cares? He's all-team defense, you say he is not. He wasnt guilty of rape, you call him a rapist. All this shit wont change your view about him anyways.

I just love how you get pissed off everytime...its actually amusing. Cant wait till he gets another ring and finals mvp and see how your head explodes. haha

[The Gemini Method]

That won't fade into obscurity. Those kind of awards say you're the best. This guy now has more All-Defense first team selections than Pippen for Christ's sake and he's NOWHERE NEAR Pippen's league as a defender. It's a travesty. The writing was on the wall when Kobe made first team All-Defense with a defensive rating of 109 back in 2007. The guy can crack Steve Nash territory on the defensive rating scale and STILL make the team. It's ridiculous to see this year after year.

Steve Nash's career rating is 110...Kobe's is 104 as is Wade's in a shorter amount of time. I wont go on and say Kobe is in the same category as Nash as defender nor will I justify an argument that he is in Pippen's league. It is kind've hard to compare those two because they played in two different eras in which the rules were constructed differently, so, like any argument--it is biased and left only to opinion. Again, this award is not based on stats but rather, what people close to the game vote on. I'm not sure they factor in actual stats, but in the end its a mere popularity contest. Perhaps he didn't deserve it in 2006-2007, but to say he hasn't had the defense in any year of the past 10 to warrant selection is steeped in considerable fallacy.

[FkLA]

Dude. They go by POSITIONS. Players you mentioned play the Forward spots. Unless you think those players deserves it more than Lebron, Josh Howard or G. Wallace, then by all means make your case.

With the exception of Artest, all those players play both the 2 and 3 really. Afflalo is primarily a 2 though since Melo plays the 3 for the Nuggets. That guy was miles ahead of Kobe defensively this year.

[Muser]

:lmao, how can you argue Dwight doesn't deserve to be on the team? The guy is a beast.

[hitmanyr2k]

Steve Nash's career rating is 110...Kobe's is 104 as is Wade's in a shorter amount of time. I wont go on and say Kobe is in the same category as Nash as defender nor will I justify an argument that he is in Pippen's league. It is kind've hard to compare those two because they played in two different eras in which the rules were constructed differently, so, like any argument--it is biased and left only to opinion. Again, this award is not based on stats but rather, what people close to the game vote on. I'm not sure they factor in actual stats, but in the end its a mere popularity contest. Perhaps he didn't deserve it in 2006-2007, but to say he hasn't had the defense in any year of the past 10 to warrant selection is steeped in considerable fallacy.

I'm not saying Kobe is in Steve Nash's league CAREER-wise but in 2007 the guy had a defensive rating of 109 and still was gifted a first team All-Defense selection. Kobe must know by now he can half-ass it all year and he'll be there no matter what because that's what he continues to do.

[Muser]

And Thabo/Kobe should be swapped IMO.

[The Gemini Method]

I'm not saying Kobe is in Steve Nash's league CAREER-wise but in 2007 the guy had a defensive rating of 109 and still was gifted a first team All-Defense selection. Kobe must know by now he can half-ass it all year and he'll be there no matter what because that's what he continues to do.

Misread the point you were trying to make. I don't disagree that he's the beneficiary of hype. That year in particular doesn't seem to justify his high ranking.

[RsxPiimp]

And Thabo/Kobe should be swapped IMO.

At least give us a reason why.

[Muser]

At least give us a reason why.

Because Thabo is a better offensive player...

[RsxPiimp]

Because Thabo is a better offensive player...

Thought so. Just another poster talking out of his ass.

[supervietnamlakers]

Because Thabo is a better offensive player...
yes, best answer. good job. idiot. :toast

[KidCongo]

Great to see Andy on the 2nd team, maybe they should have switched him and LeBron but it's great anyway.

[SomeCallMeTim]

Timmy shouldn't be on the team ahead of Bogut, I guess they penalized him for the missed games, which is stupid..

Kobe making it is ridiculous, as always, and even more ridiculous that he made it over Artest..

Nice to see Thabo and Varajeo getting the recognition..

Kobe doesn't deserve it, it is a rep/offense award at this point for him. Good defender but he doesn't deserve 1st team or 2nd for that matter.

But he didn't make it over Artest anymore than Duncan did. Artest was beaten out by LeBron and Wallace (and Varejao and Smith since the voters seem to treat PF and SF as one position).

All great defenders but I think Artest > LeBron. LeBron is a great defender in stretches but has to carry so much weight on the offensive end that he just doesn't have enough left over to always bring it defensively.

[SomeCallMeTim]

To be honest with you, I can't think of other guards that are much more deserving than Kobe, Kobe is there because there's really not a lot of great defensive guards roaming the perimeter nowadays but seriously, does anyone here can really say with convicntion they know more than the coaches who picked these players?

If you need a SG, game on the line, to make a defensive play, I'll put Kobe up there with just about anyone.

He just doesn't do it consistently enough to merit All-D. Too much energy expended on the other end. Guys like Battier, Artest, Sefalosha, Varejao all have the advantage of not being primary, secondary, even tertiary scoring threats. They can put more focus on D and do an outstanding job of it.

[21_Blessings]

Kobe is the best man defender at the 2 spot in the entire NBA.

Before he broke his finger he was top 3 in steals as well.

Well deserved 1st team nod yet again. Coaches > Media > You

[JamStone]

Kobe doesn't deserve it. Steve Nash didn't deserve his MVPs. Marcus Camby didn't deserve the DPOY. Shit happens all the time. Who cares? People bitch over shit that really doesn't matter and stuff they can't do shit about. Kobe got it off of name and reputation. So did many other players in the history of the game when it comes to these types of awards. It's not that deep. Deal with it.

[21_Blessings]

Haha. Comparing the media vote to the coaches vote.

[LnGrrrR]

The one thing that bugs me is that they use the generic G and F descriptions.. I'd rather see a PG/SG/SF/PF/C team.

[SomeCallMeTim]

The one thing that bugs me is that they use the generic G and F descriptions.. I'd rather see a PG/SG/SF/PF/C team.

Agreed. Having 2 SFs on the first and 2 PFs on the second, not to mention only one PG between the two teams is a little ridiculous. If they're going to disregard positions, why not just pick the 5 best players period?

[Nahtanoj]

Haha. Comparing the media vote to the coaches vote.

Whoever suggested (page 1/2?) that the voting be done by the media should be shot. I would think that coaches, GMs, executives and players know about basketball a whole lot more than the media. This is how the MVP and other awards was voted in the old days. Bottomline, we all know Duncan should've been DPOY a few times in his career already (and 1999 MVP instead of 2002 which belonged to Kidd), and we all know Kobe should've had more than just one MVP.

[lefty]

Ive tried to ignore it for a long time ,but goddamn it lefty is either a troll or just fucking dumb
Sorry, I didn't know you were a closet Howard fan

Please accept my apologies

[jdev82]

have these ppl ever seen rondo play?

[mogrovejo]

It should have been:

1st team:

Westbrook
Wade

James
Wallace

Howard



2nd team

Rondo
Sefolosha

Artest
Varejao

Bogut

---

Josh Smith selection is even more questionable than Kobe's.

[LnGrrrR]

I never thought of Anderson Varejao as that good of a defender. Above average, but not All-Defensive team. I haven't seen many Cavs games though; just a general impression.

[Pero]

and we all know Kobe should've had more than just one MVP.

We do? :lol

[D-Wade #3]

and we all know Kobe should've had more than just one MVP.

Is that why he couldn't get out the first round w/o Shaq or Gasol?

[TheMACHINE]

Is that why he couldn't get out the first round w/o Shaq or Gasol?

and so?

[The Gemini Method]

Is that why he couldn't get out the first round w/o Shaq or Gasol?

And what has Wade done since Shaq left the South Beach?

[TheMACHINE]

And what has Wade done since Shaq left the South Beach?

dwade#3 is gonna say "i dont care, im not a wade fan" haha

[The Gemini Method]

dwade#3 is gonna say "i dont care, im not a wade fan" haha

Seriously. The Heat fans should be worried about whether or not their own superstar stays or they'll be irrelevant with Beasley as their no. 1 option. Stop obssessing over what Kobe is doing...

[TheMACHINE]

Seriously. The Heat fans should be worried about whether or not their own superstar stays or they'll be irrelevant with Beasley as their no. 1 option. Stop obssessing over what Kobe is doing...

yah crazy how Wade got the Finals MVP when he obviously couldnt do it without shaq.

[The Gemini Method]

yah crazy how Wade got the Finals MVP when he obviously couldnt do it without shaq.

Well, they were playing the Mavs...

[D-Wade #3]

yah crazy how Wade got the Finals MVP when he obviously couldnt do it without shaq.

The fuck are you talking about? I won 4 games in a row by myself, ask Mavfans. And hold the fucking phone, Laker fans hate Shaq because he is the reason Kobe has 3 rings, but say I couldn't do it by myself? :lmao

[The Gemini Method]

The fuck are you talking about? I won 4 games in a row by myself, ask Mavfans. And hold the fucking phone, Laker fans hate Shaq because he is the reason Kobe has 3 rings, but say I couldn't do it by myself? :lmao

No true Laker fan hates Shaq. We are thankful for the run he co-piloted us through. If they do hate him--then they're ungrateful for what he achieved as a member of the Lakers. This old argument doesn't really add up. Because I don't recall Shaq going 1 vs. 5 all those years. What, I as a Laker fan, don't like about Shaq was his inability to keep himself in shape, his wanton demands for more money, and (like Kobe) his inability to act maturely when their egos started to clash. Dwyane didn't do it all alone with the refs having itchy whistle-blowing lips though ;).

[TheMACHINE]

The fuck are you talking about? I won 4 games in a row by myself, ask Mavfans. And hold the fucking phone, Laker fans hate Shaq because he is the reason Kobe has 3 rings, but say I couldn't do it by myself? :lmao

was shaq on your team?

[D-Wade #3]

was shaq on your team?

Yup, right after yours

[TheMACHINE]

Yup, right after yours

so using the same logic as you since "Is that why he couldn't get out the first round w/o Shaq or Gasol?" remark, then Wade shouldnt have gotten the MVP too.

[D-Wade #3]

No true Laker fan hates Shaq. We are thankful for the run he co-piloted us through. If they do hate him--then they're ungrateful for what he achieved as a member of the Lakers. This old argument doesn't really add up. Because I don't recall Shaq going 1 vs. 5 all those years. What, I as a Laker fan, don't like about Shaq was his inability to keep himself in shape, his wanton demands for more money, and (like Kobe) his inability to act maturely when their egos started to clash. Dwyane didn't do it all alone with the refs having itchy whistle-blowing lips though ;).

Neither did the Lakers....See. Lakers/Kings 2002

Mavfans make up imaginary championships all the time, but if anybody has the right to say that their team SHOULD HAVE been champions, it's the Kings, but moral victories don't win you anything

[D-Wade #3]

so using the same logic as you since "Is that why he couldn't get out the first round w/o Shaq or Gasol?" remark, then Wade shouldnt have gotten the MVP too.

You're retarded, when Shaq was with the Lakers, he was the most dominant center in the game, and the main man on the Lakers. When Shaq was with the Heat, he was clearly on the decline, and no longer the main man. Sure he had something to do with getting to the finals, but I won as the MAIN man.

[mogrovejo]

I never thought of Anderson Varejao as that good of a defender. Above average, but not All-Defensive team. I haven't seen many Cavs games though; just a general impression.

He's probably the most important defender in the Cavs. In a vacuum, LBJ is better, but Varejao fully dedicates himself to defend, unlike LBJ who often takes an easier assignment or coasts for a few possessions here and there. So his actual impact is even bigger than James'. Plus, he's their only big who can defend.

Cleveland has been a good defensive team for the last few years. They declined a bit this season but were still good. Even though:

Shaq - Awful defender
Mo Williams - Awful defender
Jamison - Awful defender
Z - Awful to very poor defender
Hickson - Very poor to mediocre defender
Gibson - Very poor to mediocre defender
Parker - Mediocre defender
Moon - Average defender

Delonte West is the only above average defender in the Cavs rotation besides Varejao + LeBron and yet they still manage to be a good defensive squad.

[Pero]

Hickson - Very poor to mediocre defender
Gibson - Very poor to mediocre defender
Parker - Mediocre defender
Moon - Average defender


Hm you know, mediocre means pretty much the same thing as average. :lol

[TheMACHINE]

You're retarded, when Shaq was with the Lakers, he was the most dominant center in the game, and the main man on the Lakers. When Shaq was with the Heat, he was clearly on the decline, and no longer the main man. Sure he had something to do with getting to the finals, but I won as the MAIN man.

and kobe wasnt the main man on the lakers the past two years? GTFO

[D-Wade #3]

and kobe wasnt the main man on the lakers the past two years? GTFO

We saw what Kobe can do as the main man, and it aint pretty. Gasol is the real key to that team

[D-Wade #3]

And Gasol couldn't get out of the first round either, so they were perfect for each other

[mogrovejo]

Hm you know, mediocre means pretty much the same thing as average. :lol

Sometimes:

Adj. 1. mediocre - moderate to inferior in quality; "they improved the quality from mediocre to above average"
second-rate
inferior - of low or inferior quality

3. mediocre - poor to middling in quality; "there have been good and mediocre and bad artists"
bad - having undesirable or negative qualities

I was using mediocre in this sense of below average:
Awful<poor<mediocre<average.

[Pero]

Sometimes:

Adj. 1. mediocre - moderate to inferior in quality; "they improved the quality from mediocre to above average"
second-rate
inferior - of low or inferior quality

3. mediocre - poor to middling in quality; "there have been good and mediocre and bad artists"
bad - having undesirable or negative qualities

I was using mediocre in this sense of below average:
Awful<poor<mediocre<average.

But it seems to me that in none of your examples does it mean below average. In any case it doesn't matter, I was just nitpicking. :)

[mogrovejo]

But it seems to me that in none of your examples does it mean below average.

Uh? It means below average in all of them. The players are ordered from worst to less bad:

Shaq, etc. - Awful
(http://spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=4321432#post4321432)
Hickson - Very poor to mediocre/below average defender
Gibson - Very poor to mediocre/below average defender
Parker - Mediocre/below average defender
Moon - Average defender

[Pero]

Uh? It means below average in all of them. The players are ordered from worst to less bad:


No, I meant in the dictionary examples that you posted (and I was quoting).

[cobbler]

With the exception of Artest, all those players play both the 2 and 3 really. Afflalo is primarily a 2 though since Melo plays the 3 for the Nuggets. That guy was miles ahead of Kobe defensively this year.

Says you. 29 NBA coaches felt differently. That it really really bothers you is only icing on the cake to us Laker fans. Very comical to see all the butt hurt Kobe haters. :toast

[ChrisRichards]

Says you. 29 NBA coaches felt differently. That it really really bothers you is only icing on the cake to us Laker fans. Very comical to see all the butt hurt Kobe haters. :toast
29 NBA coaches also left Artest off their list which undeniably is LA's best perimeter defender. What say you...