Spurs going same route as 80s Celtics?

[Fabbs]

The similarities abound.
The Celts had a big 3, as do the Spurs.
The Celts won 3 titles in 6 years, the Spurs 3 in 5 (4 in 9).
Both had a coatail riding coach who did little if anything to help get the titles, but who definitely screwed up (and continues to screw up) chances for more titles and at least one repeat.

So the subject again comes up of (gasp) trade one or more of the Big 3.
The Celts chose not to, and in all fairness the death of Lenny Bias and continuation of KC Popavich as coach were huge contributing factors to their downfall. Still, they hung onto Bird, McHale and Bob Parish til they had much less trade value and the team was run into the ground. Classy? Well I'm not arguing it was not nice of them to let those three choose to retire as Celts, yet at what point does team become more important then sentimentality? (I think Bob Parish could have stayed if he wanted to, i know he left for Charlotte then went on to play a small role but contributing role in two more titles with a real coach on the Bulls.)

Point being, they got n-o-t-h-i-n-g in return for the Big 3 and drifted into suckhood. Instead, they traded the youngest of their core, Danny Ainge who went on to start in like 3 more Finals. For Joe Klein. Can you say "dumbass front office"?

Spurs have likewise chosen to hold onto the Big 3. Bruce Bowen was forced to stay out (shut your pieholes you "he brought us Jefferson" morons, he could have afterwords been signed for minimal after he was bought out by Milwaukee) so that Mike Finley could continue his affair and marriage with Pop, Ian M could rust on the bench and other 10 11 and 12 bench players could sit uselessly while Pop continued his tyrist with Matt Bonner.

Lewie Scola is decided to be bypassed so that Mike Finley and Matt Bonner can hold down the PF spot instead 2008-present. In return for Scola, we get Greek guard who stays in Greece, Phoenix gets Gordan Dragavic (sp) who torches for 23 in a playoff quarter. Nice.

Again, at what point in time is team more important then sentimentality?
Make that a title contending team.
Trade one of the Big 3 (gasp!). Well, with Popazit at the helm, what good has it done to hold onto them since the 2007 Championship? Would OKCity have gone for a Parker for the #2 pick (Kevin Durant)? I'm sure OKC would have at least considered it. That's just one possibility. Do you have others?

Don't get me wrong, i would have much rather seen all of the Big 3 kept, along with Bowen being brought back and a real coach at the helm who would have used Blair and other benchies appropriately. It didn't happen, it ain't gonna happen. So, trade one, two of the Big 3? Or become like the Celtics and lose for 20 more years? Frankly all three of the Big 3 have dropped in trade value quite a bit since summer 2007.

[MaNu4Tres]

With all due respect to Len Bias and Reggie Lewis, hopefully Splitter can come in here and make the kind of impact those two great players could have made.

Celtics had extremely bad luck with what happened to those two players and with the lottery for years and years.

Hopefully Spurs fans don't have to deal with that long of a drought.

[scottspurs]

The Celtics also had a case of extreme bad luck with the whole Len Bias situation. If Bias doesn't overdose the celtics might have won a couple of more championships. The spurs have been very lucky picking up George Hill and Dejuan Blair so late in the Draft.

Remember how Tony Parker improved every season for the first 5-6 seasons of his career? Expect the same from George Hill. Parker was also very inconsistent in the playoffs his first few seasons. Expect Hill to get better and better in both the regular season and playoffs. Blair will also improve next season. If he finds a jump shot he could be deadly.

In my opinion there are three things the spurs can do to become title contenders again.

Priority number one this offseason will be convincing Splitter to come over. Adding a defensive minded Center is exactly what the spurs need. Splitter is a great pick and roll player that will only give the spurs another option offensively.

I know I'm asking for a lot, but the spurs need one more steal in the draft at Pick 20. If the spurs scouts can find either a knockdown three point shooter or a decent shooter/good defender on the wing that would be great. I'm not asking for the spurs to find another Bruce Bowen type player who can lock players down because it's not going to happen. Just someone who will work hard, hustle, and slow players down defensively not named Keith Bogans. The more likely option would be to find a great shooter. I think this draft has a lot of depth and the spurs can find a very good player at 20. I also wouldn't mind if the Spurs picked a good big man there if one were to slip through the cracks like Blair. You can never have enough big men.

Lastly, and this is a prayer, the spurs need to wait out free agency and let one of these free agents be left without a dance partner. This is one of the best free agent classes that I can remember and there is going to be some very good players left without a team once all the cap room runs out. I'm not saying the spurs will end up with someone like Lebron, Bosh, or Wade, but Ray Allen would not be to hard to believe. Finding someone committed to winning that will fit in the spurs system for the LLE could be what puts the spurs over the top and back into contention.

So the spurs need to

1. Convince Splitter

2. Get another Draft steal

3. Wait out Free Agency and find the right cheap fit.

This could happen, it's not to hard to believe unlike all these Trade Parker for (insert probable mistake here) trade whispers. Besides the spurs don't need to create more depth problems by trading away their only true point guard.

So my hope is that the spurs are not the 80's celtics, but just a continuation of the Spurs we know and love. Breaking up the chemistry now would be disastrous and would only put the spurs further from number 5. GO SPURS GO

[K-State Spur]

With all due respect to Len Bias and Reggie Lewis, hopefully Splitter can come in here and make the kind of impact those two great players could have made.

Celtics had extremely bad luck with what happened to those two players and with the lottery for years and years.

Hopefully Spurs fans don't have to deal with that long of a drought.

Bias was an absolute BEAST. Splitter can come in here and be a tremendous contributor and still not make the impact that Bias (likely) would have.

[blizz]

Both had a coatail riding coach who did little if anything to help get the titles, but who definitely screwed up (and continues to screw up) chances for more titles and at least one repeat.

THAT...is bullshit. You know nothing about basketball.

[Cane]

THAT...is bullshit. You know nothing about basketball.

True that. Fabbs is nothing more than an idiot.

[spursfaninla]

The more obvious flaws in the OP:

1) celtics being without a championship for 20 years is not the same as being "bad" for 20 years. They had plenty of playoff teams in that span. Lots.

2) was only marginally connected to hanging onto mediocrity by keeping their aging core. Sure, they would have "improved quicker" if they killed themselves and completely rebuilt.

3) Spurs will do the same that Utah did: lose their top players (one day); be really bad the next year, draft well, and start to build a contender again, slowly, over a decade. That is how MOST teams actually do it.

3) It also had to do with picking poorly and getting screwed out of the top pick one year (duncan).

[Dex]

Both had a coatail riding coach who did little if anything to help get the titles, but who definitely screwed up (and continues to screw up) chances for more titles and at least one repeat.

Stopped reading here.

[Ocotillo]

In my opinion there are three things the spurs can do to become title contenders again.


1. Convince Splitter

2. Get another Draft steal

3. Wait out Free Agency and find the right cheap fit.



You forgot a 4th thing. Convince David Stern to waive the salary cap rules that will let us sign a free agent since most of the MLE will go to Splitter and we have no cap room to sign any sort of free agent except for minimum contracts to fill out a roster.

[blizz]

it doesn't matter if we have cap room. no one wants to come here.

[purist]

Bullshit. Pop created the culture that kept Duncan here and sought out talents like Ginobilli and Parker.

And, Mahinmi did not rust on the bench. He plain sucks.

[Gervin44Silas13]

I like this post...It really clearly shows that our team close too heading of to the sunset , not now but in the years to come....
Let's face it man.....it's gonna happen that we are gonna go through the BS of 21-61 and sub-par seasons. But that's a reality and we have be prepped for it.
I had my share of seening the Spurs just outright suck post Gervin and even during the Robinson era, while fucking teams like the piss gold Lakers and the gay Celtics, and the gambling Bulls...were wining....that time sucked...but the Spurs will get back there again...the question is when?

[Fabbs]

The more obvious flaws in the OP:

1) celtics being without a championship for 20 years is not the same as being "bad" for 20 years. They had plenty of playoff teams in that span. Lots.

2) was only marginally connected to hanging onto mediocrity by keeping their aging core. Sure, they would have "improved quicker" if they killed themselves and completely rebuilt.

3) Spurs will do the same that Utah did: lose their top players (one day); be really bad the next year, draft well, and start to build a contender again, slowly, over a decade. That is how MOST teams actually do it.

3) It also had to do with picking poorly and getting screwed out of the top pick one year (duncan).
1. So you are yet another board advocate for "Lower the Bar!"?
The Celts never sniffed the Finals from 1988-2008 save 2001-2 when they made the EC Finals. They either missed the playoffs entirely or got punked in the 1st round 17 of those seasons. That is bad.

2. If the Celts offered Bird, McHale and Parish after the '87 season you think the offers they would have gotten would have killed them? :rollin
Likewise, the Spurs offering say Parker for the #2 pick (turned out to be Durant) or similar deals for Duncan or GNob would in no way shape or form "kill themselves and be a complete rebuild". All depends on what pick/who was offered. Entirely possible the Spurs could get much better. Now, with all three on decline who knows?

3. Likewise it was the only way San Antonio got back on top (the Duncan ping pong ball) and prompted Pop to coatail. So just as Boston was unlucky the Spurs were lucky.

[Budkin]

Stopped reading here.

Same. What a load.

[5in10]

The Celtics also had a case of extreme bad luck with the whole Len Bias situation. If Bias doesn't overdose the celtics might have won a couple of more championships. The spurs have been very lucky picking up George Hill and Dejuan Blair so late in the Draft.

Remember how Tony Parker improved every season for the first 5-6 seasons of his career? Expect the same from George Hill. Parker was also very inconsistent in the playoffs his first few seasons. Expect Hill to get better and better in both the regular season and playoffs. Blair will also improve next season. If he finds a jump shot he could be deadly.

In my opinion there are three things the spurs can do to become title contenders again.

Priority number one this offseason will be convincing Splitter to come over. Adding a defensive minded Center is exactly what the spurs need. Splitter is a great pick and roll player that will only give the spurs another option offensively.

I know I'm asking for a lot, but the spurs need one more steal in the draft at Pick 20. If the spurs scouts can find either a knockdown three point shooter or a decent shooter/good defender on the wing that would be great. I'm not asking for the spurs to find another Bruce Bowen type player who can lock players down because it's not going to happen. Just someone who will work hard, hustle, and slow players down defensively not named Keith Bogans. The more likely option would be to find a great shooter. I think this draft has a lot of depth and the spurs can find a very good player at 20. I also wouldn't mind if the Spurs picked a good big man there if one were to slip through the cracks like Blair. You can never have enough big men.

Lastly, and this is a prayer, the spurs need to wait out free agency and let one of these free agents be left without a dance partner. This is one of the best free agent classes that I can remember and there is going to be some very good players left without a team once all the cap room runs out. I'm not saying the spurs will end up with someone like Lebron, Bosh, or Wade, but Ray Allen would not be to hard to believe. Finding someone committed to winning that will fit in the spurs system for the LLE could be what puts the spurs over the top and back into contention.

So the spurs need to

1. Convince Splitter

2. Get another Draft steal

3. Wait out Free Agency and find the right cheap fit.

This could happen, it's not to hard to believe unlike all these Trade Parker for (insert probable mistake here) trade whispers. Besides the spurs don't need to create more depth problems by trading away their only true point guard.

So my hope is that the spurs are not the 80's celtics, but just a continuation of the Spurs we know and love. Breaking up the chemistry now would be disastrous and would only put the spurs further from number 5. GO SPURS GO

I highly doubt the spurs can get allen, but I must say this is the best post about the offseason I have read so far.

[FromWayDowntown]

Obviously, the Spurs should have traded Tim Duncan in 2006 and Ginobili in 2008 to get something in return for the Big 3, but also should have held on to Bruce Bowen no matter what.

And Pop should have been fired in the summer of 1996. I know he wasn't coach of the Spurs yet, but people really should have known.

[EricB]

Obviously, the Spurs should have traded Tim Duncan in 2006 and Ginobili in 2008 to get something in return for the Big 3, but also should have held on to Bruce Bowen no matter what.

And Pop should have been fired in the summer of 1996. I know he wasn't coach of the Spurs yet, but people really should have known.


Everyone knows that bob hill was a far superior coach.

[ffadicted]

I am sorry sir, but you don't know tha' fuck you're talkin bout

Try again later

[Fabbs]

Everyone knows that bob hill was a far superior coach.
Your ascertion:
Everyone knows Bob Hill is the only choice the Spurs could have made since 1996 onward til now. No one else could be considered. It's either Bob Hill or Pop, no one else.

Why don't you stop this silly, tired, misleading fabrication?

[EricB]

Your ascertion:
Everyone knows Bob Hill is the only choice the Spurs could have made since 1996 onward til now. No one else could be considered. It's either Bob Hill or Pop, no one else.

Why don't you stop this silly, tired, misleading fabrication?


Pardon me, John Lucas. Wait Jerry tarkanian... Tom thibedou!

:lol

keep up your bs campaign of lies however.

[Fabbs]

Obviously, the Spurs should have traded Tim Duncan in 2006 and Ginobili in 2008 to get something in return for the Big 3, but also should have held on to Bruce Bowen no matter what.

And Pop should have been fired in the summer of 1996. I know he wasn't coach of the Spurs yet, but people really should have known.
Yes because Duncan could not be traded in 2008, it had to be 2006.
Ginobili for Kevin Durant and more would have been a disaster, yes indeed.
Bruce Bowen should not have been brought back after Milwaukee bought him out. He would have probably took minimal, but keeping Mike Finley, Ratliff and not playing the 10-13th bench players was soo much better.

Lame.

[Fabbs]

Pardon me, John Lucas. Wait Jerry tarkanian... Tom thibedou!

:lol

keep up your bs campaign of lies however.
Says T_Porkle as he is lieing. :toast
Frustrated much?

[FromWayDowntown]

Yes because Duncan could not be traded in 2008, it had to be 2006.
Ginobili for Kevin Durant and more would have been a disaster, yes indeed.
Bruce Bowen should not have been brought back after Milwaukee bought him out. He would have probably took minimal, but keeping Mike Finley, Ratliff and not playing the 10-13th bench players was soo much better.

Lame.

So wait, now you just assume that Seattle would have traded the #2 pick for Parker or Ginobili and then blast the Spurs for NOT having made a trade that is entirely a product of your imagination?

Now that's a convenient strawman to bolster an argument.

Do you have any proof that the Spurs didn't inquire about Seattle's pick in the Oden/Durant draft and somehow balked when the Sonics made an unconditional offer of the #2 pick for either of the Spurs minor stars?

[EricB]

So wait, now you just assume that Seattle would have traded the #2 pick for Parker or Ginobili and then blast the Spurs for NOT having made a trade that is entirely a product of your imagination?

Now that's a convenient strawman to bolster an argument.

Do you have any proof that the Spurs didn't inquire about Seattle's pick in the Oden/Durant draft and somehow balked when the Sonics made an unconditional offer of the #2 pick for either of the Spurs minor stars?


It's all in his own mind. Ala Duncan shouldve been traded already :lmao

[FromWayDowntown]

I'm pretty sure that the Spurs could have gotten Lebron James or Dwyane Wade for Tim Duncan in 2008, when he was undoubtedly at the height of his abilities.

Just think, between the Duncan for Lebron trade and the Ginobili for Durant trade that were clearly available to the Spurs in the last few years, they could have a starting lineup with Lebron James, Kevin Durant, AND Tony Parker, plus Dejuan Blair and -- well, Fabbs, probably.

[mogrovejo]

The 80s Celtics were better.

Actually Danny had a conversation with Red in 1988 and told him he should trade the Big 3. Red ended up trading him. But Ainge has said multiple times that he'd have traded Bird+McHale after Bias death + the loss to the Pistons in the conference finals and that in a similar situation he'll do the same (meaning Pierce probably won't end his career as a Celtic).

[superjames1992]

The similarities abound.
The Celts had a big 3, as do the Spurs.
The Celts won 3 titles in 6 years, the Spurs 3 in 5 (4 in 9).
Both had a coatail riding coach who did little if anything to help get the titles, but who definitely screwed up (and continues to screw up) chances for more titles and at least one repeat.

I stopped reading after that. :wow

[ShoogarBear]

Both had a coatail riding coach who did little if anything to help get the titles, but who definitely screwed up (and continues to screw up) chances for more titles and at least one repeat.

So you don't like KC Jones, but what exactly did he do to "screw up " the Celtics chances for more titles?

KC Jones' last season, 1988, the Celtics won 57 games and made it to the ECF. He then retired, a short two years after the last Bird title. The horrible Jimmy Rodgers coached them for the next 2 years, followed by Chris Ford for five.


in all fairness the death of Lenny Bias and continuation of KC Popavich as coach were huge contributing factors to their downfall.

See above.


(I think Bob Parish could have stayed if he wanted to, i know he left for Charlotte then went on to play a small role but contributing role in two more titles with a real coach on the Bulls.)


BOB Parish? Might as well call him Zack Parish.

He got one ring with the Bulls, playing two games in the playoffs that year, i.e., Glen Robinson contributed more to get his ring.



Instead, they traded the youngest of their core, Danny Ainge who went on to start in like 3 more Finals. For Joe Klein. Can you say "dumbass front office"?

So you criticize the Celtics for trading the youngest of their core, and then in the same post you suggest this:


Would OKCity have gone for a Parker for the #2 pick (Kevin Durant)? I'm sure OKC would have at least considered it. That's just one possibility.

It's okay to criticize Pop and the front office. I've been critical of some of Pop's coaching moves, and so have others. But try to do it in a coherent, logical fashion.

So much concentrated fail here; it's like the Black Hole of Fail.

[Fabbs]

The 80s Celtics were better.

Actually Danny had a conversation with Red in 1988 and told him he should trade the Big 3. Red ended up trading him. But Ainge has said multiple times that he'd have traded Bird+McHale after Bias death + the loss to the Pistons in the conference finals and that in a similar situation he'll do the same (meaning Pierce probably won't end his career as a Celtic).
So do you have any other reasonable people in Boston who would have at least considered what Ainge suggested?

[mogrovejo]

So do you have any other reasonable people in Boston who would have at least considered what Ainge suggested?

Well, hindsight is great, but when Red had to make the decision he had a team that had the 2nd best regular season record, lost the conference finals in a close series while dealing with health problems all year along and having Mark Acres as the 6th man. They were 2 years removed from being probably the best team in the history of the game and the core was the same. Do you blow up a top-3 team? Now it's obvious they never recovered from the health problems, but in 88 I don't think it was. Bird had a great year between the back issues, arguably one of his career years - 30/9/6/2 with crazy scoring efficiency. Ainge was proven right, but I understand Red's reluctance.

As for the current team, I've been on record for awhile saying they should blow up the team, even if they win the title. From the current roster, I'd keep Rondo, maybe Scalabrine, maybe Perkins if I couldn't get good offers for him but I'd shop him hardly.

Not sure if it's the right idea for the Spurs though. I don't think it is. I believe the Spurs have the assets to be strong contenders in the next 2 years. After that they stop with the retooling and can enter into a proper rebuilding stage. Heck, trade RJ for Pierce or Garnett, add a small-ball 4 and you're a top team in the NBA just like that. Bring De Colo to be the backup guard and shop Parker around, it's another good option to improve the team in the short term.

Plus, sometimes the best decision for a franchise is not the one that maximizes their chances of winning titles. How would the city of San Antonio react to the Spurs trading Duncan? Even the national media. I think it'd get ugly. There's more to the game than winning.

[mogrovejo]

So you don't like KC Jones, but what exactly did he do to "screw up " the Celtics chances for more titles?


Exactly what he did to enhance the Celtics chances: waived towels.

No complaining from me.

[Ignignokt]

Fabbs just bukkaked Eric B, FWD, and ShoogarBear hardcore.

NO surprises here.

[Mr Bones]

I actually feel pretty optimistic about the future because the Spurs have, for the first time in a long time, some great trade assets and options:
1. Own the rights to Splitter, one of the best centers in the world not currently in the NBA.
2. Young talent like Hill and Blair, both of whom are attractive to other teams because of thier combination of talent and low salaries.
3. Parker. An asset that many teams would be willing to trade for.
4. The highest pick in the draft in a very long time.
5. A huge expiring contract in Jefferson that many teams will covet next year while trying to clear cap space for the 2011 free agency market.

The Spurs have a ton of options.

[poop]

first three responses to this thread all discussed 'splitter' :rolleyes

[Fabbs]

Well, hindsight is great, but when Red had to make the decision he had a team that had the 2nd best regular season record, lost the conference finals in a close series while dealing with health problems all year along and having Mark Acres as the 6th man. They were 2 years removed from being probably the best team in the history of the game and the core was the same. Do you blow up a top-3 team? Now it's obvious they never recovered from the health problems, but in 88 I don't think it was. Bird had a great year between the back issues, arguably one of his career years - 30/9/6/2 with crazy scoring efficiency. Ainge was proven right, but I understand Red's reluctance.
Right on all accounts. Red was understandably reluctant, but the right thing to do would have been to do at the least a partial blow up. The possibilities are (well, were :lol ) salivating to me. Bird available for trade?! Can you imagine what some of the other teams owners/GMs would give up for Bird? Shaun Kemp and X McDaniel i would think Seattle would do in 0.0 seconds but I'm sure the Celts could have done much better.
Would Seattle even have done McHale or Parrish for Kemp?
Bird for Stockton and ____? There's your All Star point guard for the next 10 years.
1987 that rebound that McHale and Parrish fought over and lost to gift the Lakers a 3-1 lead instead of a 2-2 tie. That was a nightmare. What fried me tho was KC Moron letting a 16 point lead evaporate as he (like Moronovich) gave NO confindence to his younger fresher bench so that gassed McHale, Parish and Bird could get some much needed rest.

As for the current team, I've been on record for awhile saying they should blow up the team, even if they win the title. From the current roster, I'd keep Rondo, maybe Scalabrine, maybe Perkins if I couldn't get good offers for him but I'd shop him hardly.


Not sure if it's the right idea for the Spurs though. I don't think it is. I believe the Spurs have the assets to be strong contenders in the next 2 years. After that they stop with the retooling and can enter into a proper rebuilding stage.
With a good coach, sure. With Popovich, they're gonna keep fading like the Celts did.


Heck, trade RJ for Pierce or Garnett, add a small-ball 4 and you're a top team in the NBA just like that.
No way Boston falls for that.


Plus, sometimes the best decision for a franchise is not the one that maximizes their chances of winning titles. How would the city of San Antonio react to the Spurs trading Duncan? Even the national media. I think it'd get ugly. There's more to the game than winning.
They'd get over it real fast if the Spurs took a 5th Championship. This is where it takes a strong GM and owner. They've instead given the keys to the car to Popovich in 2008, "President of All Things Basketball" or whatever his title is.

[galvatron3000]

Spurs may need to trade Jefferson to Utah for AK 47. AK would fit better and if he is hurt it would be just like having Jefferson, if he isn't then he will be better than Jefferson. Jefferson can play with a PG that can push the ball and find him in the offense and on the break.

Spurs need to draft and sf or a center/pf.

Also, consider trading Parker, love him but it may be necessary to trade him to bring in something.

The bench needs a semi uhaul, Bonner, Mason and Bogans should be gone.
Hairston should get some burn, Gee should get a shot in training camp and Garrett may have earned a spot already, I like Phil love big pg's.

Pop should have given Hairston some burn against Phoenix.

[lefty]

The 80s Celtics were better.

Actually Danny had a conversation with Red in 1988 and told him he should trade the Big 3. Red ended up trading him. But Ainge has said multiple times that he'd have traded Bird+McHale after Bias death + the loss to the Pistons in the conference finals and that in a similar situation he'll do the same (meaning Pierce probably won't end his career as a Celtic).
:lol

[TampaDude]

Wow...I remember Len Bias...he went to UMCP...I grew up in the DC area, and that was a huge, huge story...what a tragedy...that kid was gonna be a monster in the NBA. His younger brother, James, was shot and killed a few years later, too...fucking heartbreaking.

[Ignignokt]

Incase you missed it ST, Fabbs just applied some zygote jelly on the foreheads of EricB and FWD.

Truly a remarkable thread.

[Ignignokt]

Just so you remember, this thread is all about how Fabbs sploaded on ST regulars.

These are things we know.

[Blackjack]

You do know that Fabbs completely ripped this notion from Simmons, right (as this was talked about more than a year ago)?

[Ignignokt]

You do know that Fabbs completely ripped this notion from Simmons, right (as this was talked about more than a year ago)?

I'm pretty sure everything you write is all your original whimsical thoughts.

[Blackjack]

Appreciate the vote of confidence. :tu

I don't have a problem with discussing something someone else brought to the fore but I have a hard time giving them credit for it.

[Fabbs]

You do know that Fabbs completely ripped this notion from Simmons, right (as this was talked about more than a year ago)?
:lol spare us.
Anyone on this board for any length of time knows I've been posting about Popzit and the Spurs Championships -or not- since long before the Simmons article.

If anything as has been posted by many, the *jounalists* lurk around ST and rip us off.

[Blackjack]

Sure, brah. :tu

We're all aware of your disdain for Pop and the amount of maturity you choose to display incessantly when showing it. This we know; doesn't have anything to do with you coming up with the Celtics comparison.

And I really couldn't care less about Simmons or what he has to say (he's entertaining at times and usually brings a decent perspective), you're just not going to get credit from me for rehashing something that was talked about ad nauseum after a couple of his columns and excerpts from his book were posted here more than a year ago . . .

[Fabbs]

Sure thing bra.

You've added a lot to the discussion. Like zero cred.
http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=128648&highlight=Jones
Ignignokt, could you please add Zero Cred errr i mean BlackJacker to the sploaded list.

[Blackjack]

Sure thing bra.

You've added a lot to the discussion. Like zero cred.
http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=128648&highlight=Jones
Ignignokt, could you please add Zero Cred errr i mean BlackJacker to the sploaded list.

:lmao

Just as I suspected.

Check the date, brah; I'm sure it's just a coincidence that your thread was started less than a month after the Simmons' thread and even longer after Simmons first started making the comparisons.

Just to make it easy on you, June 14, 2009 comes after May 20, 2009 (and it happens to only reinforce my first thought).

http://anyworld.files.wordpress.com/2007/08/fail3.jpg

Hey, Ignignokt ... could you please add Zero Cred Fabbster to the sploaded list?

Thank you much. :toast

[Fabbs]

^^oh my. 1st time I've checked back. That you want to believe Simmons is the 1st person to compare Boston and the Spurs titles? Go for it.
And/or that i ripped Simmons off? :rolleyes

Before i was going to say "You must be or be related to a journalist".
Now i know. :rollin

[Fabbs]

The 80s Celtics were better.

Actually Danny had a conversation with Red in 1988 and told him he should trade the Big 3. Red ended up trading him. But Ainge has said multiple times that he'd have traded Bird+McHale after Bias death + the loss to the Pistons in the conference finals and that in a similar situation he'll do the same (meaning Pierce probably won't end his career as a Celtic).

galvatron3000
Spurs may need to trade Jefferson to Utah for AK 47. AK would fit better and if he is hurt it would be just like having Jefferson, if he isn't then he will be better than Jefferson. Jefferson can play with a PG that can push the ball and find him in the offense and on the break.

Spurs need to draft and sf or a center/pf.

Also, consider trading Parker, love him but it may be necessary to trade him to bring in something.

The bench needs a semi uhaul, Bonner, Mason and Bogans should be gone.
Hairston should get some burn, Gee should get a shot in training camp and Garrett may have earned a spot already, I like Phil love big pg's.

Pop should have given Hairston some burn against Phoenix.
And the key for both the Celts and the Spurs is to make the right trade, not just a trade for the sake of trading. Celts of old could have kept it going depending on who they traded for post 1987.

Probably going to be a moot point for the Spurs as all indications are Monronvich is simply going to ride the wheels off Duncan Gnob and Parker and then coatail off while his Apologists will then spout how much he is missed as the predecessor has to attempt to rebuild from the ruins. :depressed

[G-Dawgg]

I'm worried the Spurs r gonna suck next year. Realistically we are rebuilding now. We have to many holes that need to be filled and most likly wont. If players ARE found to fill some holes then they'll likely need time to develop or learn the system. Sorry for saying exactly how it is, but the spurs are no longer contenders and likely wont be for while.

[Solid D]

Richard Jefferson was the Spurs' Len Bias...in a manner of speaking.

Lol at the comparison of KC Jones and Pop. The only close comparison is that one was an NBA player known for his defense and the other is an NBA legendary coach known for his defensive philosophy.

[Solid D]

'Just a couple of other thoughts about the direction or route the Spurs are taking. It's difficult to expect a franchise to continue to flourish year after year. There are eventually going to be valleys and the NBA system works against extended success. The Spurs have made the playoffs 19 times out of the past 20 seasons. It's core is getting older so unless they replace it's oldest stars with real talent, there will be a fall-off. The Spurs did a major FAIL when they did not bring in Luis Scola. They made up for it a bit by sticking their glove up in the air, closing their eyes and having the ball (DeJuan Blair) land in their glove. They were smarter than what everyone here gave them credit for in drafting George Hill. Now they have to find a true young Big. If they fail to do so, the Spurs will continue to slide farther toward the fringe. Whether it's Splitter, or a trade for a chance at another good bigman, the Spurs will need to be both smart and fortunate.

It's been a good ride. It won't be an easy off-season and depending on decisions made, the Spurs could very easily be headed for a few seasons of famine.

[ChuckD]

I don;t know why people get their panties in a wad about rebuilding in a couple of years. It's the natural cycle of the NBA. You build, you attain a level of success and ride it as far as you can, then you crater and re-build. As Solid D said, we've had a run of 19 playoffs in 20 years. Top that off with 10 years or so of championship contender status stitched around 4 LoBs, and it sucks much less to be looking at rebuilding in our position than say Dallas or Phoenix, who are both staring down the same time frame for retooling.

[ShoogarBear]

Richard Jefferson was the Spurs' Len Bias...in a manner of speaking.

Oh, man. Harsh. :lol

I would argue that the Spurs dealing Scola was more like the Celtics losing Bias.

If the Spur had kept Scola, it would have kept some wear and tear off Duncan. The Spurs also then could have afforded to keep around and make better use of a nonscoring interior defender like Kurt Thomas or Ratliff for 10-15 MPG. It probably cost them another title.

Only down side is I doubt the Spurs would have drafted Blair if they had Scola.

[ShoogarBear]

I don;t know why people get their panties in a wad about rebuilding in a couple of years. It's the natural cycle of the NBA. You build, you attain a level of success and ride it as far as you can, then you crater and re-build. As Solid D said, we've had a run of 19 playoffs in 20 years. Top that off with 10 years or so of championship contender status stitched around 4 LoBs, and it sucks much less to be looking at rebuilding in our position than say Dallas or Phoenix, who are both staring down the same time frame for retooling.

What you mean we, NY boy.

Problem is, in the NBA, there isn't really a natural cycle unless you're the Lakers. More than any other sport, titles are more concentrated among a select few. The only teams that you could argue won a title, had some down time, then came back to win another were the Pistons and the Sixers. The Celtics hit rock bottom for almost 20 years.

Based on NBA history, there's a good chance that once Duncan goes, a generation may pass before you see the Spurs in the Finals again.

[ChuckD]

What you mean we, NY boy.

Problem is, in the NBA, there isn't really a natural cycle unless you're the Lakers. More than any other sport, titles are more concentrated among a select few. The only teams that you could argue won a title, had some down time, then came back to win another were the Pistons and the Sixers. The Celtics hit rock bottom for almost 20 years.

Based on NBA history, there's a good chance that once Duncan goes, a generation may pass before you see the Spurs in the Finals again.

Oh, I'm not saying that it'll be 3-4 down years, then the Finals for SA. I'm NOT one of the ones in favor of blowing things up now. I'm just saying that at some point, you have to get much worse before you get better again. That IS an NBA cycle. You do get to a point where your current cycle is over, whatever the level of success you've reached.

The important thing to realize is that if you "cheat" (sign lukewarm FAs for MAX money) on the other side, you can make your job a lot harder. The best example of a rebuild in recent times is SEA/OKC. They were in the WCSFs against the Spurs in 2005, and giving the Lakers everything they could handle in 2010 with only one player common to the two teams: Nick Collison. They offloaded some minor stars like Ray Allen and Rashard Lewis that were much more supporting players than franchise players in return for draft picks, and crashed hard, earning good picks for themselves. They accepted their 3-4 years of SUCK to build from the bottom with home grown pieces.

[Blackjack]

The anatomy of a Fabbs fail:


Incase you missed it ST, Fabbs just applied some zygote jelly on the foreheads of EricB and FWD.

Truly a remarkable thread.


Just so you remember, this thread is all about how Fabbs sploaded on ST regulars.

These are things we know.


You do know that Fabbs completely ripped this notion from Simmons, right (as this was talked about more than a year ago)?

You will notice here how I responded to a Fabbs' fan or troll and not Fabbs himself. I really didn't say anything all that outlandish, just that Fabbs' OP was regurgitated.

There's really nothing wrong with that, I was just having a hard time finding the brilliance Ignignokt found or the means to credit Fabbs with bringing anything new or insightful to the table.

Let me make this clear: I have no problem with Fabbs comparing the Spurs to the Celtics of yesteryear.


:lol spare us.
Anyone on this board for any length of time knows I've been posting about Popzit and the Spurs Championships -or not- since long before the Simmons article.

If anything as has been posted by many, the *jounalists* lurk around ST and rip us off.

Now this was just rich.

First off, this is just trademark, classic, Fabbs right here. The immaturity towards Pop is really something to behold. The only thing greater than it is the obvious insecurity he's masking with his cheap-shot insults of the coach's appearance; maybe his daddy never loved him or he was constantly bullied but no way does any man go out of their way, that often, to make a comment about another man's looks without having some serious problems of their own.

Fabbs, if you're an ugly sonbitch or just someone that's been unfairly crapped on for the majority of your life, it's okay. I'm sure there are plenty of support groups out there for you. You're just going to have to man up and take the first step. You can do it, Fabbs. Have a little faith and belief in yourself. If you don't, who will ? Maybe that's it, "who will?"

And of course, all the journalists hang out at theses forums and just rip all of their material from people like us. Because obviously we're just a different breed and all journalists are Jeff McDonald or Mike Monroe. I got news for you, Fabbs, the Express News is an exception, not the rule. And though there are plenty of exceptions out there, so are there plenty of passionate, quality writers with more access and insight than the majority here. Please, Fabbs, let's not let insecurity rule our lives with this incessant need for self-importance. Humility isn't a four-letter word.


Sure thing bra.

You've added a lot to the discussion. Like zero cred.
http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=128648&highlight=Jones
Ignignokt, could you please add Zero Cred errr i mean BlackJacker to the sploaded list.

Now here is where you want to laugh but you start to feel that maybe the guy just doesn't know any better. It's like picking on a kid who's mentally handicapped or completely devoid of confidence or the means to defend himself: Sure, it's rather easy to do and you might even find some tiny bit of satisfaction in it at first but as soon as you realize how low you've sunk or the type of person you're taking advantage of, the brief satisfaction turns to regret and disgust. It's just not a good look.

So what was his saving grace and his retort that he didn't lift this notion from Simmons. Well, he posted a link to a thread he posted on June 14, 2009. Well, there you have it! The guy brought it up a year ago. Case closed. Nothing to see here, folks. Just Blackjack making a fool of himself, yet again.

Oh, but wait. Wait just a second, y'all! The person I believed he had lifted the notion from didn't only write about the subject well before Fabbs, but 2Cleva actually posted Simmons' column here on May 20, 2009. Well, surely Fabbs knew nothing of this. It was posted on the NBA board, no one commented on it and it was lost in the shuffle before much if any could see it.

What!?! It was posted on the Spurs board? Ya don't say! But it surely wasn't seen by anyone, I mean it got lost in the shuffle, right?

Yeah, not so much; the thread made it to 8-pages by May 26, 2009 and Fabbs' thread came about just 19 days later. Weird . . .


^^oh my. 1st time I've checked back. That you want to believe Simmons is the 1st person to compare Boston and the Spurs titles? Go for it.
And/or that i ripped Simmons off? :rolleyes

Before i was going to say "You must be or be related to a journalist".
Now i know. :rollin

Now this was particularly funny because I had a good laugh noticing Fabbs being online and actually visiting the thread after I posted, but failing to make a comment. Maybe he just missed the post though, just like he missed the 8-pages of Simmons' thread before blessing us with his infinite wisdom. You really should have just left well enough alone, bro. I didn't bump the thread to make you look bad or gloat over your fail. I thought about it briefly but, as mentioned before, I knew what that brief satisfaction would become.

Please, my SpursTalk brethren, don't turn a cold shoulder to this man in his time of need. Our brother needs the help and support of this community to find that little scared or lost little boy inside of himself so that he can address what brought about this insecurity and grow into the man he was supposed to be.

Fabbs . . .


http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i233/rachel1919/funny%20stuff/you-can-do-it.jpg

(And yes, I am both related to a journalist and a journalist myself. But I must withhold the identity of both, for the repercussions would be disastrous. But since you don't know my name or what I look like, I can tell you this: Fabbs, I am Batman; Fabbs, I am also your father.

Get the help you need, son. :toast)


http://i423.photobucket.com/albums/pp319/wewantthelion/now_im_done.jpg

Now I'm done . . .

[Fabbs]

Pardon me, John Lucas. Wait Jerry tarkanian... Tom thibedou!

:lol

keep up your bs campaign of lies however.
Eric_Park thinking he is being cutesy by saying the choice of Tom Thibodeau as coach would have been a disaster the likes of Lucas and Tark.

Nice to bring you up to date, T_Park. :toast

[TJastal]

Eric_Park thinking he is being cutesy by saying the choice of Tom Thibodeau as coach would have been a disaster the likes of Lucas and Tark.

Nice to bring you up to date, T_Park. :toast

lmao...

[ChumpDumper]

Blackjack must be multitroll....