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symple19
05-24-2010, 06:26 AM
from Sporting News.com


USC could be stripped of its 2004 national football championship by the BCS if the NCAA rules that Reggie Bush is guilty of accepting illicit benefits while playing for the Trojans, USA Today reports.
The BCS in 2007, as the investigation into USC and Bush continued, quietly implemented a policy stating that teams' bowl appearances and BCS titles are to be vacated when major rules violations are discovered and schools are sanctioned by the NCAA. BCS executive director Bill Hancock confirmed that provision to the newspaper.
But Hancock said, "Nothing would happen until the very end of the NCAA process, including any appeals."
The BCS policy states, "When the NCAA or a conference makes a finding of violations ... and imposes a sanction of forfeiture or vacation of contests in which an ineligible student-athlete participated, we will presume that vacation of participation in a BCS bowl game is warranted."
The BCS' Presidential Oversight Committee, made up of university CEOs and currently chaired by Nebraska Chancellor Harvey Perlman, would make the ultimate decision.

And from Al.com...


The race for the 2004 national championship in college football is about to get interesting.
Say the NCAA hammers USC, and the BCS and the AP take away the national titles they awarded the Trojans and their semi-pro tailback, Reggie Bush.
Say the BCS revisits its policy on the subject and the AP re-votes, and one or both of those organizations decides to correct the greatest injustice of the BCS era by crowning, as the rightful champs, the Auburn Tigers.
What should Auburn do six years later? Please. That’s easy. Accept it. Celebrate it. And never, ever apologize for it.
In other words, Auburn should follow Alabama’s lead. After all, the Crimson Tide has a lot more experience with the national championship thing.
Alabama hasn’t filled a trophy case and built a statue for every national title that everyone from the Dunkel Index to Dunkin’ Donuts has tried to throw at it, but the school has said yes more often than not.
And why not?
These things are decided, to a greater or lesser degree, on the hard drives of computers and in the thick skulls of voters as much as they are on the field. Unless and until there’s a bona fide playoff, if someone wants to give you a national championship, say thank you, take it and run with it.
USA Today first noticed last week that three years ago, with the USC investigation gaining speed, the BCS instituted a policy for just this kind of eventuality. A quick read of the BCS website reveals that the policy contains the following provisions:
You win a BCS game.
The NCAA Infractions Committee later finds you guilty of violations that provided a competitive advantage or involved an ineligible player.
One of your sanctions forces you to forfeit or vacate victories.
Those victories include games that allowed you to reach the BCS game or the BCS game itself.
In that case, the BCS will vacate your participation in its bowl game. If that game was for the national championship, the BCS will take away your national championship.
But that’s only half the equation. The BCS policy does not say if or how a new champion will be crowned.
If the NCAA blasts USC – and a ruling should be imminent; shouldn’t it? – the BCS won’t act until the appeal process is complete. At that point, it’ll be an interesting dilemma, whether to leave that 2004 championship vacant or to choose between unbeaten Auburn and Oklahoma, which was unbeaten itself until getting undressed by the Trojans.
Yes, I know, Utah finished without a loss too, but only Orrin Hatch thinks the Utes belong in this conversation.
If the BCS decides to pick a winner, with the Orange Bowl wiped from the record books, OU could argue that it was ranked ahead of Auburn in the final BCS standings after the regular season.
Auburn could argue that you can’t erase its Sugar Bowl victory over Virginia Tech.
Advantage: Auburn.
Someone at the BCS would have to make the call. It probably wouldn’t be executive director Bill Hancock, since he’s an administrator and not a policy-maker, and lucky for Auburn.
Hancock is an Oklahoma native and a 1972 journalism graduate of the University of Oklahoma, where he later worked as an assistant sports information director.
If the decision gets kicked upstairs to the BCS Presidential Oversight Committee, you’ll never guess who could have a voice in it.
Alabama president Robert Witt.
Something tells me Witt didn’t sign up for this kind of duty when he became one of the 12 members of that committee.
Of course, fairness would demand that he recuse himself. And then Oklahoma would demand that committee chairman Harvey Perlman recuse himself because he’s the chancellor at rival Nebraska.
Sooner or later, the title would have to be decided by a game of rock, paper, scissors between Bob Stoops and Tommy Tuberville.
Remember Tuberville’s defiant prediction after Jetgate, the year before ’04? ‘‘We are gonna win the national championship,” he vowed. ‘‘And you can write that.”
He might be right after all.

Of course this is a big ole' "if" scenario, but i'm not sure how I would feel about Auburn sliding into the role of champion if USC does get crushed by the NCAA. I've never been a big fan of forcing teams to vacate wins, especially when it's over the actions of one player, assuming that's all the NCAA has dirt on regarding that years USC team.

That USC team was ridiculous, and I'll never forget the Okie band playing Boomer Sooner (or whatever the fight song is named) after first downs because they were getting crushed so badly. Auburn had a very good team, but tended to play down to their competition too often. Not sure they could have beaten USC that year, although I'm convinced they would have made a better showing than did OU.

Titles are won on the field, not in retrospect. I guess I would have mixed feelings if this "what if" scenario plays itself out. I would be glad to add a second title to AU's resume, but would also regret the fact that they most likely weren't the best team in CFB that year...

What do you guys think?

Blake
05-24-2010, 12:13 PM
so if USC gets their NC taken away, does that automatically mean that Auburn gets the trophy?

I'm not so sure.

Either way, Tuberville FTW.

mookie2001
05-24-2010, 12:51 PM
It would be vacated, which means nobody wins shit


But damn USC cheats like no other


They just keep getting caught, cheating

uniformly, systematically

cheaters.

mookie2001
05-24-2010, 12:52 PM
Why do they cheat so much, basketball, football, steroids, cash, condos

dirk4mvp
05-24-2010, 01:16 PM
Bush lateral!

IronMexican
05-24-2010, 01:40 PM
Bush latral i said crofl

cart mccry

we know this

Marklar MM
05-24-2010, 02:20 PM
it would be forfeited. No winner. No telling whether or not Oklahoma would have blown Auburn out.

Blake
05-24-2010, 02:29 PM
It would be vacated, which means nobody wins shit


so basically they become like Auburn

mookie2001
05-24-2010, 02:30 PM
Cheating.


The worst thing one can do in sports


And it's what USC is known for

Blake
05-24-2010, 02:30 PM
They just keep getting caught

exactly

mookie2001
05-24-2010, 02:31 PM
Systematically

symple19
05-24-2010, 02:53 PM
The AP would apparently re-vote, so you would get another AP champion, but the BCS has no policy in place to crown another team...

Should be interesting to watch it play out, Oklahoma would certainly have an argument since it was also unbeaten heading into the NC game, at least as far as a re-vote for the AP champion

Whisky Dog
05-24-2010, 06:47 PM
USC was the best football team in 2004, no matter how much money Bush took, and that's all I care about.

Whisky Dog
05-24-2010, 06:48 PM
That means strip the title for cheating, but don't give it to anyone. It becomes like MLB 1994.

Whisky Dog
05-24-2010, 06:51 PM
That also means that they would have to vacate that 2005 natio... Oh wait. VY already took care of that cheatin ass

Stump
05-24-2010, 07:11 PM
Sucks for Auburn that they can only at best get a tainted championship without the opportunity to prove they're the best. I feel a bit for Oklahoma too, but whether USC are cheaters or not, at least they had a shot at it.

As to if Auburn would actually be champions, I'm obviously biased but I'd say yes. The definition of champion in college football has always been hazy and in doubt, even after the BCS was added to try to clarify the issue. If there is no BCS champion, then they let that be and crown an AP champion, something they did for decades before the new system came to be.

Ghazi
05-25-2010, 09:01 AM
jeez, so if Auburn should've won it all that year, and after Alabama defends its national title this year... that's 7 SEC national championships in the past 8 years.

jeez... wheres the competition?

Marklar MM
05-25-2010, 10:58 AM
jeez, so if Auburn should've won it all that year, and after Alabama defends its national title this year... that's 7 SEC national championships in the past 8 years.

jeez... wheres the competition?

Other conferences actually have souls...they don't sell themselves to football.

Blake
05-25-2010, 11:05 AM
Other conferences actually have souls...they don't sell themselves to football.

so that's how the Big 10 explains why they have sucked the past decade

mookie2001
05-25-2010, 11:18 AM
jeez, so if Auburn should've won it all that year, and after Alabama defends its national title this year... that's 7 SEC national championships in the past 8 years.

jeez... wheres the competition?Yeah and all you had to do was pull two MNCs out of thin air


Want to start a Jordan Jefferson thread?

Marklar MM
05-25-2010, 11:39 AM
so that's how the Big 10 explains why they have sucked the past decade

Big12 hasn't been much better my friend.

Stump
05-25-2010, 11:46 AM
Ghazi, didn't you used to claim LSU as your team?

mookie2001
05-25-2010, 11:49 AM
And that's why conference smack is worthless

Michigan state arguing with tech about who's better, Texas or Ohio state

While LSU with possibly the worst QB- head coach combo in the nation, has to root for Florida and bama to keep some sort of fictional streak alive

Stump
05-25-2010, 12:09 PM
And that's why conference smack is worthless

I disagree. If anything, this thread and the 2004 national championship should show how important the reputation of a conference as a whole can be. The 2004 regular season ended with three undefeated teams from BCS conferences, and the decision of which two to allow into the championship game came down in many ways to the prestige of the respective programs and their conferences.

Since then, Oklahoma was shown to be overrated after getting smeared, and USC has allegedly cheated their way to the top. The SEC, represented in '04 by Auburn, has proven to year in and year out be the best football conference out there.

Question: If next season concludes with undefeated teams from the Pac-10, Big 12, and SEC, who gets snubbed? I guarentee you it won't be the SEC. Not because of '04, but because of '06, '07, '08, and '09.

Conference smack shouldn't matter, but as long as a seriously flawed system like the BCS exists, it is important.

mookie2001
05-25-2010, 01:03 PM
Yes naturally the sec is good, don't act like 6 years is historical or back in the day though, how old are you 19?

do you sport an SEC starter jacket? Would you buy a fly SEC fitted? No

never


That's not college football. That's espn talking head shit. I guarantee you if OU makes another title game I won't be rooting for them, fuck the big 12 i'm a Texas fan. How sad it must be to not have a team that can stand on it's own

Blake
05-25-2010, 01:18 PM
Big12 hasn't been much better my friend.

Since 2000:

Big XII: 2 National Champions, 7 total appearances (3 different teams)

Big 10: 1 National Champion, 3 total appearances (all Ohio St)

yes, actually the Big XII has fared much better, imo.

Blake
05-25-2010, 01:19 PM
And that's why conference smack is worthless

Michigan state arguing with tech about who's better, Texas or Ohio state

While LSU with possibly the worst QB- head coach combo in the nation, has to root for Florida and bama to keep some sort of fictional streak alive

why you crying

NFO
05-25-2010, 01:49 PM
Since 2000:

Big XII: 2 National Champions, 7 total appearances (3 different teams)

Big 10: 1 National Champion, 3 total appearances (all Ohio St)

yes, actually the Big XII has fared much better, imo.

That is a weak arguement. You can look over any decade of time and point to conference X being better than confernce Z.

So the Big XII has more appearances than the Big 10, the Big XII's winning percentage in those games is less than the Big 10s. That coul dbe argues that the Big XII may have an easier road to the National Title game.

Fact is the Big Ten has more BCS appearances (21) than any other conference like the Big XII (17). The Big 10 is 10-11 (.476) in those games while the Big XII is 7-10 (.438). Each conference has had 7 different representatives.

Big Ten:
Ohio State (5-3)
Michigan (1-3)
Wisconsin (2-0)
Penn State (1-1)
Illinois (0-2)
Iowa (1-1)
Purdue (0-1)

Big XII:
Oklahoma (2-5)
Texas (3-1)
Nebraska (1-1)
Kansas (1-0)
Colorado (0-1)
Kansas State (0-1)
Texas A&M (0-1)


Over the BCS era I would call the two conferences pretty much equal. While the Big XII has one more championship the Big 10 has more wins and a better winning percentage, so I would say it is pretty much a wash.

mookie2001
05-25-2010, 02:24 PM
So in other words ^ this whole reply you could have just posted


Oklahoma.

Blake
05-25-2010, 03:02 PM
That is a weak arguement. You can look over any decade of time and point to conference X being better than confernce Z.

yes you can. I point to the Big XII being better than the Big 10 in this particular decade.


So the Big XII has more appearances than the Big 10, the Big XII's winning percentage in those games is less than the Big 10s. That coul dbe argues that the Big XII may have an easier road to the National Title game.

Winning percentage is a pretty weak argument when you are only talking about 3 trips. It's like saying the Raven are better for their one Super Bowl than the Bills 4 failed attempts.

If only Ohio St hadn't made it the last two times.......then your college would be batting 1000.


Fact is the Big Ten has more BCS appearances (21) than any other conference like the Big XII (17). The Big 10 is 10-11 (.476) in those games while the Big XII is 7-10 (.438). Each conference has had 7 different representatives.

Big Ten:
Ohio State (5-3)
Michigan (1-3)
Wisconsin (2-0)
Penn State (1-1)
Illinois (0-2)
Iowa (1-1)
Purdue (0-1)

Big XII:
Oklahoma (2-5)
Texas (3-1)
Nebraska (1-1)
Kansas (1-0)
Colorado (0-1)
Kansas State (0-1)
Texas A&M (0-1)

That's a pretty weak argument as well, considering Nebraska was a made field goal away from being in a BCS game.........which in turn would have taken UT out of the title game.

Payouts aside, you tell me which is better for the conference.......a team in the title game or two teams in BCS games.

Ultimately, in my opinion [again], having teams go to title games is definitely better for the conference in the long run.


Over the BCS era I would call the two conferences pretty much equal. While the Big XII has one more championship the Big 10 has more wins and a better winning percentage, so I would say it is pretty much a wash.

Nah. Big XII has 4 more trips to the title game than the Big 10 this past decade, so I would say Big XII > Big 10.

Stump
05-25-2010, 03:24 PM
Yes naturally the sec is good, don't act like 6 years is historical or back in the day though, how old are you 19?

do you sport an SEC starter jacket? Would you buy a fly SEC fitted? No

never


That's not college football. That's espn talking head shit. I guarantee you if OU makes another title game I won't be rooting for them, fuck the big 12 i'm a Texas fan. How sad it must be to not have a team that can stand on it's own
22, so I'm certainly no college football historian. I'm not an SEC fanboy at all. I rooted for Texas in the championship game a few months back and was not happy to see Alabama win it.

I can't and won't argue that the SEC was the best conference in 2004, but they were strong enough for an undefeated SEC champion to have a bad taste in their mouth about being left out of the championship game. Most people will agree that Oklahoma was overrated and Auburn should have taken their place.

My point was that if the 2004 situation happened in 2010, then Auburn would have gotten the nod because of the SEC's reputation. Due to the BCS's retarded method's, a conference's reputation is important.

mookie2001
05-25-2010, 05:26 PM
Uhhh yeah I guess

the bcs system was designed to put the #1 and #2 teams in the BCS rankings in the same bowl, so that's not a method, it worked

my point is it's vacated, so nobody wins shit. It's almost like college football cannot be discussed without

1. Declaring the sec the best conference

2. Talking about bcs and realignment

that's not football, that's espn talking head bullshit

Stump
05-25-2010, 09:40 PM
It's almost like college football cannot be discussed without

1. Declaring the sec the best conference

2. Talking about bcs and realignment

that's not football, that's espn talking head bullshit
Although I get that point, this is a thread about the bcs championship and an sec team's potential right to that crown. I think you clicked the wrong thread. :lol

Plus it's the offseason. Not much to discuss.