Liberty Lost.

[Wild Cobra]

If you all recall, during the primaries and 2008 election, I continually railed about (then) senator Obama not having executive experience. You see, an good executive is a real leader. One who rally the people to his ideals. One who can actually connect, not only with those who shares his ideals, but be appreciated by those who don't. President Reagen in my opinion was the last great leader we had. I will however say that president Clinton was also a really good leader. I just didn't agree with most of his viewpoint, but he was an actual experienced executive. As much as I disagreed with his liberal aspect, I do respect the man. I don't see me ever being able to say that about president Obama. Any of you attempting to say I'm a racist, have no idea how wrong you are. I have black people in my life.

I am seriously concerned about the course our nation is on. We now have a community leader as president. What is a community leader anyway? Why does a community need leadership? Are the people so inept, that they need someone to tell them how to live? This is the extent of his leadership experience. Most of us want other to stay the hell out of our lives. Why is such leadership experience coveted? For the life of me, I cannot imagine someone so pathetic, that they need community leadership.

We are suppose to be in a democratic republic. To me, that means that we elect in a democratic form, advocates to petition our cause in government. The republic signifies to me, that we are not all the same. This is where I solidly believe in "states rights." I am growing more and more worried about the federal governments interference with States Rights. Those of you reading my posts over these last couple years know I have mentioned I think we would be better off if the south had won the civil war. I am in no way racist, or believe in slavery, but what we lost was more important as a nation. We lost States Rights. I honestly believe our nation would have grown past the idea of slavery and that we would have better racial relations today if the south had won.

What do we have now. We have a president, and congress, that are so elite, the don't care how we feel. The continually ram legislation down our throats that we don't want. that are putting our children in so much debt that it will become a runaway expense to national poverty.

Where is the leadership? All I see is dictatorial type actions from our congress and president. They are convincing us that their actions are warranted. This alone, proves they are not leaders. The are dictatorial, and where does it end? Will we survive the 2010 elections, or have they corrupted the system so bad, that they will insure their dictatorship? It is obvious to me, that the majority of the people have now seen past these confidence men (and women). I worry however, that the system is now so cheated, that we may not get them out in November, and that these dictatorial elitists may have solid control over pour lives in the future, with no turning back. I can see the possibility that this happens, and that we may end up having another revolutionary war. Any one care to guess what side I will support should that happen? I will neither confirm or deny. But I will say that I do have the heart of an American.

[admiralsnackbar]

So you go from celebrating certain leaders when they have "executive experience" but then say that community leadership doesn't count. Then you say that anybody who needs a leader must be inept in order to follow one despite the fact that any POTUS is a community leader, as is any Senator or Governor.

Then you say you're not a racist because you have black people in your life, but think that the central reason those black people in your life are allowed to be in your life was bad because it curtailed state's rights. How do the black people in your life feel about that?

Then you start talking about current abuses of state's rights without any examples, how the congress and POTUS are dictators (also, Dude, the preferred nomenclature is "oligarchs") and how you're worried about a new revolution in which you'll rock out your ever-luvin' All American heart.

What the fuck are you on about?

[George Gervin's Afro]

What do we have now. We have a president, and congress, that are so elite, the don't care how we feel.

So a president should base policy decsions on current polls? How can you measure if a Congress 'feels' for you?

[Wild Cobra]

So a president should base policy decsions on current polls?
Absolutely not.

However a president should be a leader of people, and be able to convince more of us that his vision is right.

How can you measure if a Congress 'feels' for you?
Wow...

One of the few really good questions from you in my opinion. I can't say I have a good answer to that one. I can reflect on my opinion that we don't have enough congress members now though. How can 435 members of congress people properly reflect the attitudes of 300 million people?

I simply don't trust our government anymore. haven't for some time. I will never say a president should rule by poles. In fact, I will say a good president is one that can change the opinion of poles. A true leader will explain to the populous why his position is right, rather than having poles that stray away from his position, they will move toward his position.

[admiralsnackbar]

http://www.fixcongressfirst.org/

[rjv]

so you liked some and disliked some, and then agreed with some and disagreed with some of a group that has essentially enforced the same overall agenda?

[ChumpDumper]

I'm sure whenever your team loses you claim the game is fixed too.

[clambake]

i'd love to hear how this "revolutionary war" would develop. lol

[ChumpDumper]

I can see the possibility that this happens, and that we may end up having another revolutionary war. Any one care to guess what side I will support should that happen? I will neither confirm or deny. But I will say that I do have the heart of an American.It's obvious you will be on the traitors' side.

[MiamiHeat]

Wild Cobra, you are racist.

I don't like Obama either, but the points you used are all easily dismissed.

I believe you're a racist. Slave owners also had black people in their lives, so you can't convince yourself you aren't.

[spursncowboys]

So you go from celebrating certain leaders when they have "executive experience" but then say that community leadership doesn't count. Then you say that anybody who needs a leader must be inept in order to follow one despite the fact that any POTUS is a community leader, as is any Senator or Governor.

Then you say you're not a racist because you have black people in your life, but think that the central reason those black people in your life are allowed to be in your life was bad because it curtailed state's rights. How do the black people in your life feel about that?

Then you start talking about current abuses of state's rights without any examples, how the congress and POTUS are dictators (also, Dude, the preferred nomenclature is "oligarchs") and how you're worried about a new revolution in which you'll rock out your ever-luvin' All American heart.

What the fuck are you on about?community organization is not executive experience. this entire post was rewording what his post was. Why not use his exact wording and respond to it, instead of inaccurately paraphrasing to help your self with witty responses.

[spursncowboys]

Wild Cobra, you are racist.

I don't like Obama either, but the points you used are all easily dismissed.

I believe you're a racist. Slave owners also had black people in their lives, so you can't convince yourself you aren't.
so were all slave owners racist? honest question.

[spursncowboys]

Absolutely not.

However a president should be a leader of people, and be able to convince more of us that his vision is right.
I disagree. I dont want a president's assets to be salesmanship.

[George Gervin's Afro]

community organization is not executive experience. this entire post was rewording what his post was. Why not use his exact wording and respond to it, instead of inaccurately paraphrasing to help your self with witty responses.

executive experience is not required to be president. amend the constitution then we can talk but until then your side keeps making things up.

[spursncowboys]

I never said exec experience is required. However we all see what the lack of that experience gets you.

[admiralsnackbar]

community organization is not executive experience. this entire post was rewording what his post was. Why not use his exact wording and respond to it, instead of inaccurately paraphrasing to help your self with witty responses.

Because he didn't have a point. I was re-phrasing him to determine what the fuck he was on about. It turned out he was on about being rambly-drunk.

[admiralsnackbar]

I disagree. I dont want a president's assets to be salesmanship.

Ironic, since that's half of the job description.

[MiamiHeat]

George W Bush was the most corrupt and treasonous President we have ever had. Loss of liberty? LOL did you have your ears and eyes covered during his administration with the things they did to trample the US constitution and loss of civil liberties?

Where was talk of "another revolutionary war" then?

Can you fucking hear yourself? REVOLUTIONARY WAR! LOL

Because a fucking black man is in the white house.

Look at the long disgusting things Dubya did and he is not even in prison, yet Obama has barely done anything and here we have racists like Wild Cobra and others talking about revolution LOL

fucking sad. I don't like Obama either. I didn't vote for him, but you are a racist motherfucker and you should come to terms with it.

[DarrinS]

Because a fucking black man is in the white house.

:rolleyes

[EVAY]

If WC believes in the democratic republic that he says he believes in, then he is bound by its rules. One of those rules is that 'whoever gets the most votes in a democracy gets to govern until the next election'.


If you believe that it is alright to foment revolution (or even participate if someone else foments it) when your side FAILS to win an election, that is not democracy.

In America THAT is treason.

[EVAY]

I fucking hate treasonous talk, especially when it clothed in self-righteous jingoism.

[Stringer_Bell]

Vote everyone out of office and put in new people (people that aren't Dems or GOP), and if the system is still corrupt we all join the Tea Party and have an armed revolt against the lobbyists, big pharma, big oil, and big food. There, fix'd!

[EVAY]

Vote everyone out of office and put in new people (people that aren't Dems or GOP), and if the system is still corrupt we all join the Tea Party and have an armed revolt against the lobbyists, big pharma, big oil, and big food. There, fix'd!

Can I spike my tea?

[FromWayDowntown]

Imagine where we'd be if President Obama had previously been Dr. Obama, licensed surgeon.

[Duff McCartney]

What do you even consider to be "executive experience"? Because if it's just being Governor, then you most consider more than half our Presidents to be bad. Only 17 out of the 44 were governors prior to being President.


We are suppose to be in a democratic republic. To me, that means that we elect in a democratic form, advocates to petition our cause in government. The republic signifies to me, that we are not all the same. This is where I solidly believe in "states rights." I am growing more and more worried about the federal governments interference with States Rights. Those of you reading my posts over these last couple years know I have mentioned I think we would be better off if the south had won the civil war. I am in no way racist, or believe in slavery, but what we lost was more important as a nation. We lost States Rights. I honestly believe our nation would have grown past the idea of slavery and that we would have better racial relations today if the south had won.

What do we have now. We have a president, and congress, that are so elite, the don't care how we feel. The continually ram legislation down our throats that we don't want. that are putting our children in so much debt that it will become a runaway expense to national poverty.

Where is the leadership? All I see is dictatorial type actions from our congress and president. They are convincing us that their actions are warranted. This alone, proves they are not leaders. The are dictatorial, and where does it end? Will we survive the 2010 elections, or have they corrupted the system so bad, that they will insure their dictatorship? It is obvious to me, that the majority of the people have now seen past these confidence men (and women). I worry however, that the system is now so cheated, that we may not get them out in November, and that these dictatorial elitists may have solid control over pour lives in the future, with no turning back. I can see the possibility that this happens, and that we may end up having another revolutionary war. Any one care to guess what side I will support should that happen? I will neither confirm or deny. But I will say that I do have the heart of an American.

I don't even know how to respond to these statements. The South seceded for nothing more than slavery. Revisionists like you want to claim it was more of a states rights issue than anything, but the fact is if slavery didn't exist in the South in such a strong way, there would have been no Civil War. You're nuts if you think the nation would have grown past slavery. The nation still hasn't outgrown racism, and the only reason it did was because the government came in and enacted legislation to make it possible.

Second, calm the hyperbole you simple minded fool. We are in no way coming near a dictatorship. If I recall correctly, it was the previous administration, not this one that eroded the separation of powers and strengthened the executive. If anything, this administration has reached out to the legislative in order to give them more power. Where was your outrage when the Bush administration was giving the executive nearly unlimited power? There was none. Not even a peep of anti-government sentiment from you.

If you want to claim that this administration is being tyrannical then you're a fool because as far as I can tell, the Obama administration has done nothing but try to reach out to the other side and get them to come along rather than block them out of the process. How is that being tyrannical?

Contrary to what you want to think, there is no erosion of liberties. Nobody is trampling on your rights at all. You can still walk around the corner and get a cheeseburger from McDonalds if you so want.

[MiamiHeat]

never knew Wild Cobra was such a sad fucking racist until now.

changes my perception of you quite a bit.

[MiamiHeat]

so were all slave owners racist? honest question.

You are confusing my point.

Wild Cobra said he isn't racist because "there are black people in my life"

Yeah. Slave owners had black people in their life too, so technically they can make the same exact claim. "I ain't racist, I know black people personally!"

We don't know exactly in what context WC's relationship with black people is. For all we know, he owns his own company, and he has a black person underneath him as an employee. Perfect fit for a racist.


To answer your question though, since you wanted to derail the point, yes, all slave owners were racist.

I will predict your next move though. If you own slaves, it doesn't make you less of a racist if you fight for blacks to have some rights. In the end, you are still a racist who just has a soft side for them.

Kind of like dogs. People don't see dogs as equal to humans, but we will protect them and throw them a biscuit.

Still racist.