Deloitte Study: Consumers Love Spending Less

[Spurminator]

Media Post News, Marketing Daily

Deloitte Study: Consumers Love Spending Less
Summer 2010
July 14, 2010

The good news from Deloitte's "New American Pantry" is that the vast majority of consumers don't feel bad about the recession -- they actually love it: 81% of those surveyed say they find saving money, using such techniques as coupons or loyalty programs, fun.

The bad news is for brands everywhere: The more adept consumers get at saving, the less they care about buying a certain brand, and are more willing to trade down or in favor of a sale than most marketers imagine. Think they've got a favorite brand in many categories? Ha: 51% percent say they are loyal to no more than two to three brands, in any given supermarket.

"There was a very palpable sense of remorse and embarrassment about the way they used to shop," Pat Conroy, vice chairman and Deloitte's consumer products practice leader in the U.S., tells Marketing Daily."They have a real sense of 'I can't believe how wasteful I used to be when I shopped. I didn't even know what was in my pantry and freezer.' Now, it's almost like they are energized by this new approach -- it's like saving money when they shop is a new kind of game, a way to stick it back to the man."

The survey, conducted with the Harrison Group and based on data from more than 2,000 adults, revealed four distinct types of consumers. It calls the largest group (at 36%) spectators -- they are the youngest and most affluent group, the least impacted by the recession and the least likely to change their shopping habits.

Next come the sacrificers (22%), who are the lowest-earning group, and the most impacted. Next (at 21%) are the super planners, who also take the most delight from saving. Finally, planners -- also 21% -- focus more on saving money through food preparation and menu planning.

Of the four, only the sacrificers are resentful about the recession's impact on their shopping, and somewhat bitter at the continual sacrifices the economy has demanded. "For them, there's a real sense of being hit by bad circumstances from all sides," he says.

Overall, 79% say they feel smarter about the way they shop versus two years ago, 65% feel like they aren't sacrificing very much, and 61% say they are more price-conscious. Loyalty cards are critical: 84% have at least one, and 65% say they are either essential or very important as a money-saving method; 44% now use loyalty cards in grocery stores every time they shop.

But brands are clearly huge losers, with 31% saying they are less brand-loyal, and 85% saying they have found several brands that are just as good as national brands. (In fact, 80% believe most store brands are manufactured by the traditional national brands, anyway.)

Deloitte also asked consumers to weigh in on brands in 21 categories -- more than 100 brands in all -- and found that only a handful are what it dubbed "destination brands," which he says means "an abundance of consumers say 'I will seek them out, regardless of channels, and for the most part, regardless of price." The second category was "preferred only" brands, which consumers say they would like to buy, but won't go out of their way to find them.

And finally, there was a category of "sale-only" brands, where consumers say they would only buy them if there were a significant promotion. "Consumers have a real 'I don't need 'em' attitude toward this final category," he says, adding that the implications for marketers are considerable. "There are brands offering coupons and promotions that probably don't need to, and others that need to know how little they are valued."

But Conroy says it would be wrong to think consumers only care about price. "What consumers are really focused on is the value," he says. "They're saying they won't buy large sizes because they are cheaper -- if it results in waste, for example. What's driving this is not just the urge to spend less, but to get the most value."

http://www.mediapost.com/publications/?fa=Articles.showArticle&art_aid=131827

[Parker2112]

our capitalist society unravelling?

[Drachen]

our capitalist society unravelling?

Uh, no, its the invisible hand of the market at work. The market is efficiently choosing winners and losers based on a set of criteria. The only thing that has changed has been that the criteria has shifted.

[CosmicCowboy]

Uh, no, its the invisible hand of the market at work. The market is efficiently choosing winners and losers based on a set of criteria. The only thing that has changed has been that the criteria has shifted.

And capitalism has created better alternatives. HEB Ketchup is just as good as Heinz at half the price.

[Wild Cobra]

our capitalist society unravelling?
No it's not. I would say it's working, and better than before in this case. people are now making smart decisions with purchases rather than letting commercialism affect them too much.

[Wild Cobra]

And capitalism has created better alternatives. HEB Ketchup is just as good as Heinz at half the price.
You know though. I was one who boycotted Heinz when Kerry ran for president. Only about half successful. They have some products that I still prefer.

[boutons_deux]

Everything from Heinz is processed crap.

The consumer society is unsustainable.

We are so fucked because we can't imagine, won't even try to imagine, an economy that is not based on consumption.

Healthy US economy was 70% consumption.

Knock that down just a few % with the Casino Banksters' Great Depression, and the economy craters, 20M unemployed.

[CosmicCowboy]

Boutons you are really a bitter guy. What's the scoop on you? Age? Work? School? Nothing too detailed, just curious where your hateful perspective is coming from.

[Spurminator]

Unless I'm mistaken, he's French and he lives in Texas.

[boutons_deux]

Just stating facts, CC, You Can't Handle The Truth?

[Wild Cobra]

Unless I'm mistaken, he's French and he lives in Texas.
Sound's like he's a North Korean spy, who jealous at how well we have it compared to his motherland.

[Parker2112]

Everything from Heinz is processed crap.

The consumer society is unsustainable.

We are so fucked because we can't imagine, won't even try to imagine, an economy that is not based on consumption.

Healthy US economy was 70% consumption.

Knock that down just a few % with the Casino Banksters' Great Depression, and the economy craters, 20M unemployed.

this is what troubles me. when we start to reduce consumer spending, we are going to hurt our economy even more. consumers will find themselves without work. market at work=good thing=crank up the unemployment rate even more?

But bottom line: we cant afford to spend less walking the tightrope we are currently on.

[Wild Cobra]

this is what troubles me. when we start to reduce consumer spending, we are going to hurt our economy even more. consumers will find themselves without work. market at work=good thing=crank up the unemployment rate even more?

But bottom line: we cant afford to spend less walking the tightrope we are currently on.
What is your solution? Taxes and regulations are driving good wage jobs away. We need more tax payers, not tax users. Illegal workers are taking jobs that our people should be working.

seriously. What is your solution. We have run out of tax payers. Start bleeding them more, and those remaining will flee too.

[Parker2112]

regardless how you spread it, THERE IS A BREAKING POINT. IMO, we have already crossed it and are on life support.

[Parker2112]

What is your solution? Taxes and regulations are driving good wage jobs away. We need more tax payers, not tax users.

We need new markets to take off. it doesnt have to be green tech, but that would be a win-win. we need a silicon valley part two.

I think the resistance to this by people like yourself is stifling our economy to its knees

[Wild Cobra]

regardless how you spread it, THERE IS A BREAKING POINT. IMO, we have already crossed it and are on life support.
And the batteries are draining faster than they can charge.

[CosmicCowboy]

C'mon people, get a grip. The world is not ending. The smart people quit spending and are paying down debt. When they feel more comfortable with their government they will start spending again. Probably in November 2012.

[Parker2112]

If not green tech, some new industry needs to save us. right now our economy is being driven by iphones. this is why we suck

[Parker2112]

And the batteries are draining faster than they can charge.

what the fuck are you talking about? the tax cuts bush gave to the wealthy did shit to help our country. and they are still in place, yet we find ourselves in the worst condition we have been in 70 years.

[Parker2112]

the so-called batteries are trash, unfit for made in mexico toys.

[Parker2112]

they wouldnt know how to find their ass with both hands. we have turned our economy over to private parties, wealth makers, and this is what we get. Im not saying socialize, Im saying get them the fuck out of the wheelhouse.

[Wild Cobra]

C'mon people, get a grip. The world is not ending. The smart people quit spending and are paying down debt. When they feel more comfortable with their government they will start spending again. Probably in November 2012.
Agreed.

it will be a turning point. If we keep democrats in control, we will continue downhill. If we get republicans, and even democrats with enough with "tea part" ideals, we have a chance to turn it around.

[Parker2112]

electing a new president wont do a fucking thing. bankers will still have thier way with policy and with the president himself. Obama has turned on all his promises...can you tell me why? because he doesnt run shit thats why.

[CosmicCowboy]

Did you guys really think the hot economy driven by consumer spending driven by easy borrowing was sustainable?

I didn't.

I pulled the plug 5 years ago and started getting rid of debt.

[Wild Cobra]

what the fuck are you talking about?
It's a simile. The reservoir of money is draining faster than it can be filled.

the tax cuts bush gave to the wealthy did shit to help our country. and they are still in place, yet we find ourselves in the worst condition we have been in 70 years.
WTF are you talking about. Everyone got a tax break, not just the rich, and the economy was fine until 2007, when the demonrats took over.

[Winehole23]

Debt-free (as of 3 years ago), credit card free. I plan to stay that way.

[Spurminator]

the economy was fine until 2007, when the demonrats took over.

That's like saying our airplane is fine even though it's out of gas, because we're still in the air.

[Parker2112]

It's a simile. The reservoir of money is draining faster than it can be filled.

WTF are you talking about. Everyone got a tax break, not just the rich, and the economy was fine until 2007, when the demonrats took over.

you want to talk about taxes, Im telling you taxes arent the issue: the think they can siphon the cream off the economy forever are the problem. they are killing the goose. and you mindlessly repeat the propoganda they feed you.

and are you telling me the tax breaks didnt serve the pockets of the wealthy the most?

[Parker2112]

CC and WC are frauds. I talk about free market being the solution, and they dont even touch it.

you guys arent free-marketeers, your self serving ignorant repubs.

[CosmicCowboy]

Debt-free (as of 3 years ago), credit card free. I plan to stay that way.

No credit cards here either. I'm not totally debt free because I'm real estate poor but I'm working on it. Living relatively cheap (for us) and knocking down $2800 of debt a month.

[Parker2112]

No credit cards here either. I'm not totally debt free because I'm real estate poor but I'm working on it. Living relatively cheap (for us) and knocking down $2800 of debt a month.

CC and WC are frauds. I talk about free market being the solution, and they dont even touch it.

you guys arent free-marketeers, your self serving ignorant repubs.

[Spurminator]

I use a CC for points but it gets paid off every month.

[Parker2112]

What is your solution? Taxes and regulations are driving good wage jobs away. We need more tax payers, not tax users. Illegal workers are taking jobs that our people should be working.

seriously. What is your solution. We have run out of tax payers. Start bleeding them more, and those remaining will flee too.


We need new markets to take off. it doesnt have to be green tech, but that would be a win-win. we need a silicon valley part two.

I think the resistance to this by people like yourself is stifling our economy to its knees


CC and WC are frauds. I talk about free market being the solution, and they dont even touch it.

you guys arent free-marketeers, your self serving ignorant repubs.

[CosmicCowboy]

CC and WC are frauds. I talk about free market being the solution, and they dont even touch it.

you guys arent free-marketeers, your self serving ignorant repubs.

I consider myself more of a libertarian/independent than a republican. Certainly not a libtard like you though.

[Winehole23]

...the economy was fine until 2007, when the demonrats took over.The economy had not yet reached his moment of crisis, but the imbalances that caused that 2007 credit crunch had been building up for at least four years, and had very little to do with the 2006 midterms.

(This is more of that correlation=causation stuff you just can't leave alone, WC.)


Weak!

[Wild Cobra]

you want to talk about taxes, Im telling you taxes arent the issue: the think they can siphon the cream off the economy forever are the problem.
then stop with blaming the Bush tax cuts.

they are killing the goose. and you mindlessly repeat the propoganda they feed you.
I see it as real fact. Do you understand the concept of the Laffer curve?

and are you telling me the tax breaks didnt serve the pockets of the wealthy the most?
Oh, i see....

You have Penis Envy.

[DMX7]

It's a simile. The reservoir of money is draining faster than it can be filled.

WTF are you talking about. Everyone got a tax break, not just the rich, and the economy was fine until 2007, when the demonrats took over.

Did the tax cuts for the Super rich that we couldn't afford expire in 2007? No.

[Parker2112]

http://www.cbpp.org/cms/index.cfm?fa=view&id=1811



The Bush tax cuts have contributed to revenues dropping in 2004 to the lowest level as a share of the economy since 1950, and have been a major contributor to the dramatic shift from large projected budget surpluses to projected deficits as far as the eye can see.
The tax cuts have conferred the most benefits, by far, on the highest-income households — those least in need of additional resources — at a time when income already is exceptionally concentrated at the top of the income spectrum.
The design of these tax cuts was ill-conceived, resulting in significantly less economic stimulus than could have been accomplished for the same budgetary cost. In part because the tax cuts were not as effective as alternative measures would have been, job creation during this recovery has been notably worse than in any other recovery since the end of World War II.


so far all of this has rung true: record deficits prove revenue loss, bankers are still raping our economic corpse, and our economy has tanked so these cuts couldnt have been a stimuli...

[DMX7]

and are you telling me the tax breaks didnt serve the pockets of the wealthy the most?

Trickle down economics, it works every time.

[CosmicCowboy]

The economy had not yet reached his moment of crisis, but the imbalances that caused that 2007 credit crunch had been building up for at least four years, and had very little to do with the 2006 midterms.

I'll agree with that except for the time frame. It was building more like 12 years.

[Wild Cobra]

The economy had not yet reached his moment of crisis, but the imbalances that caused that credit crunch of had been building up for four years, and had very little to do with the 2006 midterms.

(This is more of that correlation=causation stuff you just can't leave alone, WC.)
We've been down this road before.

The economy was on a very slow upward path. So slow, the democrats demonized it, and scared people. In their partisan political wake, they scared people, and the economy. Talking about more taxes and programs made things words. Afterall, tax payers, especially those of us who pay 5 figures or more in taxes annually, see what taxes do to our buying power.

I take it you haven't experienced tax changes while paying 5 figures.

[Wild Cobra]

Did the tax cuts for the Super rich that we couldn't afford expire in 2007? No.
That's because the tax cuts had nothing to do with the downturn.

[Parker2112]

then stop with blaming the Bush tax cuts.

I see it as real fact. Do you understand the concept of the Laffer curve?

Oh, i see....

You have Penis Envy.

do you understand that the laffer curve says that too little taxation means our revenue drops?

Im not blaming the tax cuts for our predicament, Im saying after a period of such cuts it is amazing that you imply the "batteries" for our economy are being drained. if the "batteries" were any fucking good at generating power in our economy we wouldnt be in the shithole predicament that we are.

And I am in the upper middle class. I have a B.S. and a Doctorate. and my dick aint no slouch either...

[DMX7]

That's because the tax cuts had nothing to do with the downturn.

Then tell me SPECIFICALLY what the Democrats did in 2007 that caused the greatest economic crisis since the Great Depression.

[Parker2112]

deregulation was the cause of our downturn. all day. every day. moneymen in the wheelhouse making it easier for the crew to commandeer the ship. which they did. and they are about to sink the damn ship

[Winehole23]

I take it you haven't experienced tax changes while paying 5 figures.None of your beeswax.:p:

[Winehole23]

Let's just say I can't really commiserate, regardless. Did you have a point?

[DMX7]

None of your beeswax.:p:

You can have a relatively modest home and pay close to $10,000 alone in property taxes in Texas. Trust me, I know.

[Winehole23]

deregulation was the cause of our downturn. all day. every day. financial innovation, over-leveraging and counter-cyclical monetary policy had something to do with it too. Too much wealth got poured into dodgy financial paper.

[Winehole23]

You can have a relatively modest home and pay close to $10,000 alone in property taxes in Texas. Trust me, I know.I'm a renter.

[Wild Cobra]

We need new markets to take off. it doesnt have to be green tech, but that would be a win-win. we need a silicon valley part two.
Duh....

No shit. problem is, it's too expensive to do business here.

I think the resistance to this by people like yourself is stifling our economy to its knees
No. I recognize that borrowing more money and mandating more difficult rules for corporations to follow will stifle this economy more. Not help it.

The free market does not need a kick start. It needs an environment it can grow in.

[Wild Cobra]

The economy had not yet reached his moment of crisis, but the imbalances that caused that 2007 credit crunch had been building up for at least four years, and had very little to do with the 2006 midterms.

(This is more of that correlation=causation stuff you just can't leave alone, WC.)


Weak!
Yes, it was on shaky ground. The democrats made it crash.

[Wild Cobra]

And I am in the upper middle class. I have a B.S. and a Doctorate.
So let me ask you this.

Why are so any educated people so damn stupid?

[MannyIsGod]

So let me ask you this.

Why are so any educated people so damn stupid?

:lmao !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Parker2112]

financial innovation, over-leveraging and counter-cyclical monetary policy had something to do with it too. Too much wealth got poured into dodgy financial paper.

which followed deregulation

[Parker2112]

Duh....

No shit. problem is, it's too expensive to do business here.

No. I recognize that borrowing more money and mandating more difficult rules for corporations to follow will stifle this economy more. Not help it.

The free market does not need a kick start. It needs an environment it can grow in.

those days are past. try telling that to a heart patient who needs the paddles. which is what our economy needs.

[Winehole23]

Reading the Panic of 2008 as being precipitated by a crisis of confidence is uncontroversial. What you seem to be confused about is what caused confidence to be shaken.

(Hint: it wasn't caused by people discouraged about their taxes after the 2006 midterms. That you really seem to think so, I find hilarious.)

[Parker2112]

So let me ask you this.

Why are so any educated people so damn stupid?

Why are so many ex military so damn afraid to question the company line? why are they afraid to think for themselves? why is your sole contribution on this board to rehash the same conserv propoganda that I could get on fox news all day every day?

[Wild Cobra]

those days are past.
So you believe the government should pick winners and losers.

Sure you're not a communist?
try telling that to a heart patient who needs the paddles. which is what our economy needs.
Bullshit. Corporations and business are being smothered. What they need is for democrats to take the pillows off their faces.

[Winehole23]

which followed deregulationThe root supports the trunk and the branches, but is not interchangeable with them. Pointing to the root isn't the whole story. Far from it.

[Wild Cobra]

Why are so many ex military so damn afraid to question the company line?
I do no such thing. You should stop making invalid assumptions.

why are they afraid to think for themselves?
That's what I would as you?

why is your sole contribution on this board to rehash the same conserv propoganda that I could get on fox news all day every day?

Why are you obsessed with Fox news? Maybe many of their points are valid. Maybe you should open your mind, and think outside the box.

[Wild Cobra]

The root supports the trunk and the branches, but is not interchangeable with them. Pointing to the root isn't the whole story. Far from it.
Both regulation and deregulation can be right or wrong. Both get abused.

[Parker2112]

So you believe the government should pick winners and losers.

Sure you're not a communist?
Bullshit. Corporations and business are being smothered. What they need is for democrats to take the pillows off their faces.

just the fact that you began mouthing off about "commies" is enough to dismiss you completely. to resort to slander/more propoganda you learned at fox/namecalling puts your own "shortcomings" on full display

[Wild Cobra]

just the fact that you began mouthing off about "commies" is enough to dismiss you completely. to resort to slander/more propoganda you learned at fox/namecalling puts your own "shortcomings" on full display
Look.

Whether communism, socialism, fascism, whatever...

They are authoritarian.

You are an authoritarian, not a libertarian. Where do you fit then? You most certainly believe in control.... don't you?

[DMX7]

Why are you obsessed with Fox news? Maybe many of their points are valid. Maybe you should open your mind, and think outside the box.

A Fox News viewer accusing someone else of not opening their mind? These are the type of people who think nearly every U.S. media outlet not owned by Rupert Murdoch has a liberal bias.

[Parker2112]

Look.

Whether communism, socialism, fascism, whatever...

They are authoritarian.

You are an authoritarian, not a libertarian. Where do you fit then? You most certainly believe in control.... don't you?

enough control to undo the controlling forces we are currently under. yes. then maybe we can move on as a democratic society.

[Wild Cobra]

A Fox News viewer accusing someone else of not opening their mind? These are the type of people who think nearly every U.S. media outlet not owned by Rupert Murdoch has a liberal bias.
Idiot.

I'm not a Fox news viewer, unless you call maybe one a month a viewer.

ASSume away. Show your true stupidity.

[DMX7]

Idiot.

I'm not a Fox news viewer, unless you call maybe one a month a viewer.

ASSume away. Show your true stupidity.

:lol Try to make your lies more convincing next time. You're getting caught too easily.

[Wild Cobra]

:lol Try to make your lies more convincing next time. You're getting caught too easily.
What lies?

ASSuming again?

[CosmicCowboy]

enough control to undo the controlling forces we are currently under. yes. then maybe we can move on as a democratic society.

People like you scare me.

And once these bureaucrats and politicians have complete control you expect them to relinquish power voluntarily? Thats the kind of shit people were saying in Germany before they gave the power to Hitler.

[LnGrrrR]

What is your solution? Taxes and regulations are driving good wage jobs away. We need more tax payers, not tax users. Illegal workers are taking jobs that our people should be working.

seriously. What is your solution. We have run out of tax payers. Start bleeding them more, and those remaining will flee too.

Amnesty? :lol

[LnGrrrR]

That's like saying our airplane is fine even though it's out of gas, because we're still in the air.

:lmao

[LnGrrrR]

The idea that any group of people could singehandedly wreck the economy is laughable. It takes a large group of monied interests to pull it off, and a good helping of self-serving.

[Parker2112]

People like you scare me.

And once these bureaucrats and politicians have complete control you expect them to relinquish power voluntarily? Thats the kind of shit people were saying in Germany before they gave the power to Hitler.

they absolutely will not. they never have. unless the people seize control for themselves. which conservatives would honestly hate, because the majority of americans dont adhere to the ideas of the repugs as currently constructed.

the pendulum swings back and forth, reacting to events as they happen, but THE HARDEST THING, THE MOST IMPOSSIBNLE THING, IS TO MAKE THE PENDULUM STOP IN THE SPOT YOU WANT IT. It wont. and it is for the reason you state CC. but you dont need to be scared of me. Im not involved in the things that have been going on in Washington for the last three decades. and even though these measures get more and more aggressive, people cant be bothered to seize that control.

get the $$$ out of govt. term limits. dont buy the party lines, because they are built to fix the voters' attention spans like spectators at a tennis match, while your car is being stolen in the parking lot.

govt should be about the people. but you and WC carry on about COMMUNISM, FASCISM, ETC. little do you realize, if that power emenates from the people it is the IDEAL POWER. And yet you two would still call it fascism, if you didnt agree with the will of the people. this is teh state of republican party.

On the other hand, if the ultimate power emenates from moneymen with profit as the only agenda, it becomes a tumor. And our country needs chemo.

stop with the typical conservative faux-posturing CC. you would have a fascist in gov if he were to carry out a plan you agreed with. every conservative would. thats how bush got a reapeat performance in 04.

[Parker2112]

The idea that any group of people could singehandedly wreck the economy is laughable. It takes a large group of monied interests to pull it off, and a good helping of self-serving.

you underestimate how much influence lies in that top .7 percent, as opposed to the bottom 99.3.

[Wild Cobra]

Amnesty? :lol
In reality, it may come to that at some point in time. However, I am 100% against any discussions of amnesty, until we can control immigration. Otherwise, it causes a flood, of people wanting to get in before the cut-off.

[boutons_deux]

Repugs are getting their campaign wish, voters will be in pain for a long time.

US Fed says economic outlook worse than expected

http://rawstory.com/rs/2010/0714/fed-economic-outlook-worse-expected/

[Parker2112]

In reality, it may come to that at some point in time. However, I am 100% against any discussions of amnesty, until we can control immigration. Otherwise, it causes a flood, of people wanting to get in before the cut-off.

http://www.fairus.org/site/PageServer?pagename=iic_immigrationissuecentersf13 4

the cost of illegal immigration is about 10% of the cost of the wars we are currently conducting. your complaining about the bleeding from your big toe and your leg just got lopped off?

[Parker2112]

your a fucking genius, WC. I am stupid.

typical repub bs. blame your problem on "outsiders." just like hitler.

[Wild Cobra]

http://www.fairus.org/site/PageServer?pagename=iic_immigrationissuecentersf13 4

the cost of illegal immigration is about 10% of the cost of the wars we are currently conducting. your complaining about the bleeding from your big toe and your leg just got lopped off?
Price differences are subject to interpretation, and wars are authorized in the constitution, as is immigration control. Socialist programs aren't.

[Parker2112]

Price differences are subject to interpretation, and wars are authorized in the constitution, as is immigration control. Socialist programs aren't.

authorized in the constitution doesnt = good for our country. try again.

[Wild Cobra]

authorized in the constitution doesnt = good for our country. try again.
What do you do if good for our country is a violation of the constitution?

[Parker2112]

good for our country is COMPLETELY AUTHORIZED ONCE IT BECOMES THE WILL OF THE AMERICAN PEOPLE.

that fact never comes out of your mouth it seems.

[Wild Cobra]

good for our country is COMPLETELY AUTHORIZED ONCE IT BECOMES THE WILL OF THE AMERICAN PEOPLE.

that fact never comes out of your mouth it seems.
Only if a constitutional change is made.

[Parker2112]

regulation/stimulus/influence on markets that influence our economy are not unconstitutional regardless what glenn beck may have told you.

people can vote elected officials in on platforms that favor a shift in our economy. whether you respect the will of the voters or not.

[Wild Cobra]

regulation/stimulus/influence on markets that influence our economy are not unconstitutional regardless what glenn beck may have told you.

people can vote elected officials in on platforms that favor a shift in our economy. whether you respect the will of the voters or not.
Wait one fucking minute asshole.

I asked "What do you do if good for our country is a violation of the constitution?," got an answer, and now you act as if that wasn't the question.

Again...

What do you do if good for our country is a violation of the constitution?

[Parker2112]

And just what are you implying would be a violation of the constitution, dickweasel?

[Wild Cobra]

And just what are you implying would be a violation of the constitution, dickweasel?
I was asking a hypothetical.

Does your need to do what is right still apply when it violates the constitution?

[Parker2112]

I was asking a hypothetical.

Does your need to do what is right still apply when it violates the constitution?

absofugginlootly not.

[Wild Cobra]

absofugginlootly not.
Good.

You have limits to your authoritarian ideas.

[Parker2112]

Good.

You have limits to your authoritarian ideas.

its not authoritarian if it is the will of the voters. but I will grant you the will of the voters must take a back seat to the framework of our democracy and our constitution

[Wild Cobra]

its not authoritarian if it is the will of the voters. but I will grant you the will of the voters must take a back seat to the framework of our democracy and our constitution
But the things you talk about are not the will of the voters. Look at all the resistance.

[LnGrrrR]

you underestimate how much influence lies in that top .7 percent, as opposed to the bottom 99.3.

Hm... perhaps I will make myself more clear.


The idea that any group of people could singehandedly wreck the economy is laughable. It takes a large group of monied interests to pull it off, and a good helping of self-serving.

[LnGrrrR]

In reality, it may come to that at some point in time. However, I am 100% against any discussions of amnesty, until we can control immigration. Otherwise, it causes a flood, of people wanting to get in before the cut-off.

Fine with me. I'm all for better border control; I just don't agree with some of the bloodlust that others who share that opinion seem to have.

[Parker2112]

Hm... perhaps I will make myself more clear.

my bad. you called it.

[LnGrrrR]

What do you do if good for our country is a violation of the constitution?

Allow indefinite detention of prisoners without charging them with any crime? :lol

[LnGrrrR]

my bad. you called it.

:toast