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View Full Version : WikiLeaks is not journolism, it's left-wing activism



DarrinS
07-27-2010, 12:00 PM
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/27/opinion/27exum.html?_r=1




ANYONE who has spent the past two days reading through the 92,000 military field reports and other documents made public by the whistle-blower site WikiLeaks may be forgiven for wondering what all the fuss is about. I’m a researcher who studies Afghanistan and have no regular access to classified information, yet I have seen nothing in the documents that has either surprised me or told me anything of significance. I suspect that’s the case even for someone who reads only a third of the articles on Afghanistan in his local newspaper.

Let us review, though, what have been viewed as the major revelations in the documents (which were published in part by The Times, The Guardian of London and the German magazine Der Spiegel):

First, there are allegations made by American intelligence officers that elements within Pakistan’s spy agency, the Directorate for Inter-Services Intelligence, have been conspiring with Taliban factions and other insurgents. Those charges are nothing new. This newspaper and others have been reporting on those accusations — often supported by anonymous sources within the American military and intelligence services — for years.

Second, the site provides documentation of Afghan civilian casualties caused by United States and allied military operations. It is true that civilians inevitably suffer in war. But researchers in Kabul with the Campaign for Innocent Victims in Conflict have been compiling evidence of these casualties, and their effect in Afghanistan, for some time now. Their reports, to which they add background on the context of the events, contributed to the decision by the former top commander in Afghanistan, Gen. Stanley McChrystal, to put in place controversially stringent new measures intended to reduce such casualties last year.

Third, the site asserts that the Pentagon employs a secret task force of highly trained commandos charged with capturing or killing insurgent leaders. I suspect that in the eyes of most Americans, using special operations teams to kill terrorists is one of the least controversial ways in which the government spends their tax dollars.

The documents do reveal some specific information about United States and NATO tactics, techniques, procedures and equipment that is sensitive, and will cause much consternation within the military. It may even result in some people dying. Thus the White House is right to voice its displeasure with WikiLeaks.

Yet most of the major revelations that have been trumpeted by WikiLeaks’s founder, Julian Assange, are not revelations at all — they are merely additional examples of what we already knew.

Mr. Assange has said that the publication of these documents is analogous to the publication of the Pentagon Papers, only more significant. This is ridiculous. The Pentagon Papers offered the public a coherent internal narrative of the conflict in Vietnam that was at odds with the one that had been given by the elected and uniformed leadership.

The publication of these documents, by contrast, dumps 92,000 new primary source documents into the laps of the world’s public with no context, no explanation as to why some accounts may contradict others, no sense of what is important or unusual as opposed to the normal march of war.

Many experts on the war, both in the military and the press, have long been struggling to come to grips with the conflict’s complexity and nuances. What is the public going to make of this haphazard cache of documents, many written during combat by officers with little sense of how their observations fit into the fuller scope of the war?

I myself first went to Afghanistan as a young Army officer in 2002 and returned two years later after having led a small special operations unit — what Mr. Assange calls an “assassination squad.” (I also worked briefly as a civilian adviser to General McChrystal last year.) I can confirm that the situation in Afghanistan is complex, and defies any attempt to graft it onto easy-to-discern lessons or policy conclusions. Yet the release of the documents has led to a stampede of commentators and politicians doing exactly that. It’s all too easy for them to find field reports to reaffirm their preconceived opinions about the war.

The Guardian editorialized on Sunday that the documents released reveal “a very different landscape ... from the one with which we have become familiar.” But whoever wrote that has not been reading the reports of his own newspaper’s reporters in Afghanistan.

The news media have done a good job of showing the public that the Afghan war is a highly complex environment stretching beyond the borders of the fractured country. Often what appears to be a two-way conflict between the government and an insurgency is better described as intertribal rivalry. And often that intertribal rivalry is worsened or overshadowed by the violent trade in drugs.

The Times, The Guardian and Der Spiegel did nothing wrong in looking over the WikiLeaks documents and excerpting them. Despite the occasional protest from the right wing, most of the press in the United States and in allied nations takes care not to publish information that might result in soldiers’ deaths.

But WikiLeaks itself is another matter. Mr. Assange says he is a journalist, but he is not. He is an activist, and to what end it is not clear. This week — as when he released a video in April showing American helicopter gunships killing Iraqi civilians in 2007 — he has been throwing around the term “war crimes,” but offers no context for the events he is judging. It seems that the death of any civilian in war, an unavoidable occurrence, is a “crime.”

If his desire is to promote peace, Mr. Assange and his brand of activism are not as helpful as he imagines. By muddying the waters between journalism and activism, and by throwing his organization into the debate on Afghanistan with little apparent regard for the hard moral choices and dearth of good policy options facing decision-makers, he is being as reckless and destructive as the contemptible soldier or soldiers who leaked the documents in the first place.

Oh, Gee!!
07-27-2010, 12:14 PM
and wikipedia is not an encyclopedia

boutons_deux
07-27-2010, 12:31 PM
That's a good article.

The leaks did serve to move the forgotten Afghan war to front burner for 15 mintues or so, but it's gone again, like the BP oil spill.

DMX7
07-27-2010, 12:31 PM
And this op-ed is written in the NY Times, a liberal rag. I don't know who to trust anymore!

Wild Cobra
07-27-2010, 01:51 PM
It's pretty sad that such a good tool is slanted.

LnGrrrR
07-27-2010, 02:48 PM
This article comes to a poor conclusion. If anything, the founder of Wikileaks may be biased, but Wikileaks itself has shown no bias. If it can be shown that Wikileaks have refused to release information that may be harmful to the left, sure, throw that charge around.

Stringer_Bell
07-27-2010, 03:24 PM
I can't recall Wikileaks, at least since 2006, ever trying to come across as journalism rather than activism. So what if it's activist? It's strange that the director is now trying to change its perception, perhaps there is more money to find in being thought of as more legitimate.

There is no left or right bias that I can tell, it's just anti-government. Is it shitty to release sensitive information about the location of troops and leaders that make it easy for terrorists to exploit? Hell fuckin yea, but the article barely touched on the implications of it. All it says is "if these documents fell on your desk, you - a simpleton, would not know how to properly read them and extract information." That in itself is pathetic IMHO.

Galileo
07-27-2010, 03:50 PM
USA Today Propaganda

From the hard copy July 27, 2010, USA Today newspaper

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=254699

Nbadan
07-27-2010, 04:00 PM
The Pentagon Papers offered the public a coherent internal narrative of the conflict in Vietnam that was at odds with the one that had been given by the elected and uniformed leadership.

...this writer must be living in wing-nut-land if he thinks that these revelations are not 'at odds with the ones that had been given by the elected and uniformed leadership'...in fact, they are exactly that...many of the revelations may not be new to everyone, but when viewed holistically, they are very significant to public opinion about the war...

Marcus Bryant
07-27-2010, 04:16 PM
The timing of the WikiLeaks', well, leak, was not a bad followup to the WaPo's Top Secret America series. The problem, of course, is the institutional inertia against any meaningful change abroad or at home is great.

LnGrrrR
07-27-2010, 04:30 PM
The timing of the WikiLeaks', well, leak, was not a bad followup to the WaPo's Top Secret America series. The problem, of course, is the institutional inertia against any meaningful change abroad or at home is great.

Marcus, I'm disappointed that you didn't have a comment on my Top Secret America post. Of course, it is buried now on the second page, after the great majority of board conservatives had nothing to say about it.

Marcus Bryant
07-27-2010, 04:41 PM
Marcus, I'm disappointed that you didn't have a comment on my Top Secret America post. Of course, it is buried now on the second page, after the great majority of board conservatives had nothing to say about it.

Well, I missed it. As for my opinion on the TSA series, while virtually all of the information was publicly accessible, I am glad that it was aggregated and presented in such a manner. The obvious question is to what does this lead? Institutional inertia in DC being what it is, this domestic national security behemoth is not going away. When virtually anyone, instead of other states, is deemed to pose an existential threat to this country, the die is cast for a continual erosion of individual liberty in the name of collective "safety" (and in practical terms, for the benefit of the various bureaucratic bosses and sycophantic contractors).

American politics is ruled by an ignorant, paranoid majority. Ideology is fungible. That some seek to force ideological distinctions upon it is pure madness.

Nbadan
07-27-2010, 06:20 PM
http://editorialcartoonists.com/cartoons/SiersK/2010/SiersK20100727_low.jpg

Winehole23
07-28-2010, 03:45 AM
Marcus, I'm disappointed that you didn't have a comment on my Top Secret America post. Of course, it is buried now on the second page, after the great majority of board conservatives had nothing to say about it.War is a big blind spot for soi disant (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/soi-disant) conservatives.

The liberal internationalists got to them, a long time ago.

boutons_deux
07-28-2010, 05:26 AM
Defense spending and war is (just another way) how conservatives transfer taxpayer wealth to themselves. Conservatives are blind to war, it's one of their main tools for self-enrichment.

Winehole23
07-28-2010, 05:53 AM
For conservative voters? How so?

Winehole23
07-28-2010, 05:54 AM
When did liberals ever shrink the US military, btw?

Winehole23
07-28-2010, 05:58 AM
Thinking of the DoD as a GOP clubhouse and as being receptive exclusively to Republicans is plainly wrong. The DoD does very well, regardless who runs the show.

PublicOption
07-28-2010, 08:07 AM
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/27/opinion/27exum.html?_r=1



ah, dumbass, these guys broke the climate gate emails.


this is like a preemptive strike, for when these guys get the dirt on the bushies.

:nope

balli
07-28-2010, 12:30 PM
There is no left or right bias that I can tell, it's just anti-government.
Had Darrin read the profile of Julian Assange that the New Yorker ran a couple months back, or really, known who the fuck Assange was before a week ago, his take might have been more nuanced.

Of course, hoping for as much from a scum-sucking moron like Darrin is so wildly outlandish it might as well be considered delusional.

Darkwaters
07-28-2010, 02:50 PM
When did liberals ever shrink the US military, btw?

Clinton destroyed more than a few military careers.

Darkwaters
07-28-2010, 02:55 PM
Defense spending and war is (just another way) how conservatives transfer taxpayer wealth to themselves. Conservatives are blind to war, it's one of their main tools for self-enrichment.

Cleary neither Afghanistan nor Iraq were really in need a change nor were they a threat to anyone.

9/11? Masood's assasination? Al Qaeda and rampant Talibs? Lies.
Iran War? Attempted Kurdish genocide? Bullshit.

It was just a great way to pump money into the conservative machine.

PS: Operation Desert Fox? Genius. I love you Bill Clinton.

Nbadan
07-28-2010, 09:22 PM
...with the 'soviet' threat in decline, the GOP needed someone to scare the crap out of American consumers, so they invented Al-Queda and the 'radical Islam threat'...fact is radical Islam was in decline prior to the Afghanistan and Iraq wars....911 gave the military/industrial complex and multinational oil companies the perfect opportunity to suck billion, or trillions of taxpayer dollars and take control of one of the largest oil reserves in the world....

Winehole23
07-29-2010, 02:39 AM
911 gave the military/industrial complex and multinational oil companies the perfect opportunity to suck billion, or trillions of taxpayer dollars and take control of one of the largest oil reserves in the world....Why are the Chinese, the Russians, the Italians and the Danish getting the monster contracts, if we control the reserves?

boutons_deux
07-29-2010, 02:50 AM
"getting the monster contracts"

The Repugs/neo-cons invaded Iraq for oil, but couldn't get all of it. Even if they failed to getting all or most of the oil on the terms they wanted (but no other country agrees to anymore), the US/UK oilcos and oil industry contractors are doing better there now than the would have been if Saddam had stayed in power and excluded them completely as was the case early 2003.

Part of the neo-con hubris was that Iraq would be a castrated puppet govt would gratefully allow US/UK oilcos run the entire show. They were proven wrong, like they and Repugs always are.

Darkwaters
07-29-2010, 04:31 AM
...with the 'soviet' threat in decline, the GOP needed someone to scare the crap out of American consumers, so they invented Al-Queda and the 'radical Islam threat'...fact is radical Islam was in decline prior to the Afghanistan and Iraq wars....911 gave the military/industrial complex and multinational oil companies the perfect opportunity to suck billion, or trillions of taxpayer dollars and take control of one of the largest oil reserves in the world....

Seriously? Are you that stupid? I'm sure that you believe that the government is responsible for 9/11 and also likely killed JFK too, huh?

Have you ever been to Iraq or Afghanistan? Have you ever met a member of al Qaeda, the Haqqani network or a Talib? Have you ever seen the hate in their eyes and had them (try to) spit in your face?

No?

Then shut the fuck up.

Darkwaters
07-29-2010, 04:33 AM
"getting the monster contracts"

The Repugs/neo-cons invaded Iraq for oil, but couldn't get all of it. Even if they failed to getting all or most of the oil on the terms they wanted (but no other country agrees to anymore), the US/UK oilcos and oil industry contractors are doing better there now than the would have been if Saddam had stayed in power and excluded them completely as was the case early 2003.

Part of the neo-con hubris was that Iraq would be a castrated puppet and gratefully allow US/UK oilcos run the entire show. They were proven wrong, like they and Repugs always are.

So then why did we invade Afghanistan?

Garlic naan and mud qalats? Yep, definitely more GOP war mongering to get all the valuable resources in Afghanistan.

admiralsnackbar
07-29-2010, 05:31 AM
So then why did we invade Afghanistan?

Garlic naan and mud qalats? Yep, definitely more GOP war mongering to get all the valuable resources in Afghanistan.

"The previously unknown deposits — including huge veins of iron, copper, cobalt, gold and critical industrial metals like lithium (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/subjects/l/lithium_metal/index.html?inline=nyt-classifier) — are so big and include so many minerals that are essential to modern industry that Afghanistan could eventually be transformed into one of the most important mining centers in the world, the United States officials believe. "

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/14/world/asia/14minerals.html

boutons_deux
07-29-2010, 06:01 AM
there is no infrastructure (like electricity and water) in the area of those minerals. As with most mining, it takes a lot of water which is then polluted beyond recoverability.

However, in eastern Caspian and on the shore east of the Caspian (Turkmenistan), there's apparently lots of gas and oil, so a pipeline south from there across Afganistan and Pakistan would have the oilcos slobbering.

admiralsnackbar
07-29-2010, 06:26 AM
there is no infrastructure (like electricity and water) in the area of those minerals. As with most mining, it takes a lot of water which is then polluted beyond recoverability.


No argument here, however water pipelines are cheaper to install and maintain/defend than oil and gas ones are, and forgetting for a moment that batteries are a crucial component of the hybrid (and what will ultimately be electric) cars that will continue gaining market share, cell phones and laptops make the world go around.

In other words, lithium is valuable now, and stands to be strategically invaluable in the near future. I very much doubt mining interests will much care if they poison Afghanistan and its people with toxic runoff... hell, they don't much mind doing it to this country as far as coal is concerned.

Stringer_Bell
07-29-2010, 06:46 AM
Seriously? Are you that stupid? I'm sure that you believe that the government is responsible for 9/11 and also likely killed JFK too, huh?

Have you ever been to Iraq or Afghanistan? Have you ever met a member of al Qaeda, the Haqqani network or a Talib? Have you ever seen the hate in their eyes and had them (try to) spit in your face?

No?

Then shut the fuck up.

I think what Nbadan was trying to get at is similar to the BBC Documentary "The Power of Nightmares." US officials, rather than call a spade a spade after 9/11 and acknowledge the top to bottom fuck-ups that allowed such a terrible event to occur, found it an opportune time to engage in various strategic military efforts in the Middle East. In doing so, they created more outrage among Muslims and another recruiting tool for the jihadists...sort of like a self-fulfilling prophecy. Any bozo can look at a map and see where Iraq and Afghanistan are located in relation to Iran and understand what the endgame was supposed to be. But it's been a failure and everyone's lost except for contractors and the oil industry.

Also, might wanna wait to tell people to shut the fuck up unless they call you out. I can't stand half the stuff I read on here, but there's a small shred of intelligence in the majority of opinions.

boutons_deux
07-29-2010, 08:59 AM
"water pipelines are cheaper to install"

where does piped water come from?

Electricity is really the bigger of the two fatal impediments, and building huge coal or nuclear plants near the minerals won't find financing, esp in such a volatile, strife-torn, unstable area.

admiralsnackbar
07-29-2010, 10:22 AM
"water pipelines are cheaper to install"

where does get piped water come from?

Electricity is really the bigger of the two fatal impediments, and building huge coal or nuclear plants near the minerals won't find financing, esp in such a volatile, strife-torn, unstable area.

Are you seriously not seeing that if you can pipe oil and gas out of Afghanistan and into central Russia for profit, you can pipe water from central Russia into Afghanistan for profit? For a cut of extraction, Russia would be all over that... and uneducated Afghans would be, too -- if they got a percentage of the water piped in. Shit, Haliburton would be all too happy to build them defective aqueducts and plumbing systems to be a part of the New American Century in energy.

Winehole23
07-29-2010, 12:02 PM
Clinton destroyed more than a few military careers.So did GHWB. Maybe the end of the Cold War had more to do with it than anything else.

boutons_deux
07-29-2010, 12:24 PM
"pipe oil and gas out of Afghanistan and into central Russia for profit"

why would US military be dying to enable that? What US/UK oilco would do that?

Russian showed BP how badly joint oil ventures work out.

admiralsnackbar
07-29-2010, 12:42 PM
"pipe oil and gas out of Afghanistan and into central Russia for profit"

why would US military be dying to enable that? What US/UK oilco would do that?

Russian showed BP how badly joint oil ventures work out.

I'm not saying that would be done, I'm saying that has been done.

Nbadan
07-29-2010, 11:15 PM
Are the MANPADS being supplied to the taliban to shoot at U.S. planes being supplied by the Pakistan ISS?


...One of the major revelations to come out of the 92,000 previously classified documents recently released by wikileaks is that apparently the Taliban have on several occasions fired at U.S aircraft using surface to air missiles better known as MANPADS (Man Portable Air Defense Systems). The media has seized upon this story as yet another government blunder since, after all, wasn't it the U.S. government who originally supplied the Mujahideen with stinger missiles back in the 80's when they were fighting the Soviets? However, a closer examination of the specs on these stingers leads one to a far different and perhaps more dangerous conclusion; that Pakistan has begun to supply the Taliban with their own surface to air missiles to use against U.S. forces...

Huff (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/jeremy-white/taliban-missiles-likely-s_b_662812.html)

Nbadan
07-31-2010, 05:36 AM
...this dude from Wikileaks is like the dell dude in the last Diehard movie...



After leaking 92,000 classified US military documents, Julian Assange, the founder of the whistle blowing website, has uploaded a file called “insurance” to the website and elsewhere. The file is 1.4 gigabytes, a thousand times larger than the recently leaked documents.

The file is encrypted under AES256, which is equal to the methods used by the US to encrypt Top Secret material. It is estimated that even the fastest computer would take millions of years to decrypt the file.

It is believed that Assange, who is under intense scrutiny by the US, may have distributed the pass key to supporters, who could release it to the public. However, the talented former hacker would realise that this could place supporters in a difficult position.

=snip=

The contents of the file are unknown. However, the recent release of documents, detailing the coalition’s experiences in Afghanistan, are not part of the 500,000 documents from Iraq, alleged to have been sent to WikLeaks by Bradley Manning, who is currently held in the US. Manning is also accused of passing a video of an incident in Garani in Afghanistan that local authorities say killed 100 civilians, most of them children were killed during a helicopter assault, as well as 260,000 U.S. State Department cables.

Link (http://www.neurope.eu/articles/WikiLeaks-founder-uploads-mystery-file/102093.php)

ferg
08-01-2010, 05:54 PM
When did liberals ever shrink the US military, btw?

ummm the air force is set to cut down by over 6,000 airmen RIGHT NOW. UNDER THE CURRENT CnC! if you think thats not alot, take this into consideration: alot of the air force is already working 12 hour days, such as my job, security forces. when you factor in being at work an hr before the 1700 start of shift to draw weapons and at least an hr after to turn in, plus fit in time for P.T, thats an easy 18 hour day. so i guess the libs never shrank the military. now is not the time to cut down on the military!

Winehole23
08-02-2010, 04:42 AM
Fair enough, but Obama ain't done yet.

Those in or affiliated with the US military may feel different about downsizing defense. I respect that. I also happen to disagree, but perhaps that's for another conversation..

Wild Cobra
08-02-2010, 12:28 PM
Fair enough, but Obama ain't done yet.

True.

He has a ways to go yet before he totally destroys this nation.