16th?

[pad300]

Dick Jefferson - 16th best small forward in the NBA?
http://ca.sports.yahoo.com/nba/blog/ball_dont_lie/post/Ranking-the-small-forwards-20-through-11?urn=nba-264472#remaining-content

Is Kelly Dwyer on drugs?

(other parts of this series,
1 to 11
http://ca.sports.yahoo.com/nba/blog/ball_dont_lie/post/Ranking-the-small-forwards-11-through-1?urn=nba-264568
21 to 30
http://ca.sports.yahoo.com/nba/blog/ball_dont_lie/post/Ranking-the-small-forwards-30-through-21?urn=nba-264012
)

How Spurs fans would rather have any of the following players:
Marvin Williams (#21)
Josh Childress (#22)
Shane Battier (#24)
Mickael Pietrus (#26)
Omri Casspi (#27)
Carlos Delfino (#28)
Trevor Ariza (#18)
Travis Outlaw (#17)

How about
Grant Hill (#29)
Jared Dudley (#25)
Wilson Chandler (#20)
Shawn Marion (#19)

[PDXSpursFan]

The only player in your list that could really help the Spurs this year is Battier.

[spectator]

i would only take these 3 over RJ:

Marvin Williams (#21)
Mickael Pietrus (#26)
Trevor Ariza (#18)

battier is too old man. he'll turn 32 in september.

[admiralsnackbar]

The only player in your list that could really help the Spurs this year is Battier.

As big a fan as I am of Battier, I might go with Casspi, Ariza, and Childress before him at this point. He's a great role layer, but his defense started to slip due to age last season. Still better suited to our system than RJ, though.

[Nathan89]

Grant Hill is better than Rj. He plays better defense and shoots the mid-range shot better than Rj.

[spectator]

As big a fan as I am of Battier, I might go with Casspi, Ariza, and Childress before him at this point. He's a great role layer, but his defense started to slip due to age last season. Still better suited to our system than RJ, though.

i also like battier - very much, but his defense last season was similar to bowen's in 2007. that is why i worry he will have the same drop in efficiency, due to his injuries; just how bowen slipped due to his age.

i like pietrus better for his 3PT%, defense on lebron-type players (rebounding is an issue for him - just 1.4 reb/game, even though he plays with d-howard) and williams because he is a younger RJ, with length (6-9), so he can guard the taller SFs like durant.

however, out of all these players, i take ariza by far. young, tall, athletic, good defense + remember his play-off shooting with the lakers? 50% from 3. obviously, when he was forced to create his shot in houston, that % decreased, but as a role-player charged to make open shots and play defense, he is by far the best option here. alas, he plays for no.

[Nathan89]

Marvin Williams (#21)-I thought this guy was a undersized pf.

Josh Childress (#22)-Rj is better

Shane Battier (#24)-Shane is way better than rj at defense and shoots the three. He would make the spurs much better.

Mickael Pietrus (#26)- He is better. Shoots3,defense,athletic

Omri Casspi (#27)-Don't know much about this guy.

Carlos Delfino (#28)-Rj is better.

Trevor Ariza (#18)-He is better.

Travis Outlaw (#17)-Don't know much about this guy. I think this guy can't shoot though so he would suck in the spurs system.

Grant Hill (#29)-He is better. Plays better D and shoots the mid-range shot. Grant was playing great defense against kobe but referees took care of that and put him on the bench.

Jared Dudley (#25)-How did this guy do against the Lakers? I know he can shoot the three and he has good size. This one is close. I would hate to give him the nod because I discriminate to the players that look out-of-shape.

Wilson Chandler (#20)-Don't know much about this guy.

Shawn Marion (#19)-Rj is better. Marion has the worst touch in the Nba.

[Bruno]

Jefferson is a very good NBA player. It's not surprising to have him high on a "best SF" list.

[Nathan89]

Jefferson is a very overrated NBA player. It's not surprising to have him high on a "best SF" list.

[benefactor]

With the exception of Shawn Marion, I'd take all those guys over RJ.

[DPG21920]

I would even take Marion over RJ because he can still defend better. RJ is a better player than most of those guys overall, but for the Spurs, I would take all of them (not taking into consideration contracts) except for Dudley.

[Bartleby]

Omri Casspi (#27)-Don't know much about this guy.



Casspi had a very solid year. RJ is better right now, but Casspi looks very promising. I think the Spurs had him on their radar for a couple of years before he was drafted.

[ohmwrecker]

Grant Hill is better than Rj. He plays better defense and shoots the mid-range shot better than Rj.

Maybe, but his feet might burst into powder at any moment.


Jefferson is a very good NBA player. It's not surprising to have him high on a "best SF" list.

Sometimes I think you are the only one with any sense around here.


With the exception of Shawn Marion, I'd take all those guys over RJ.


I would even take Marion over RJ because he can still defend better. RJ is a better player than most of those guys overall, but for the Spurs, I would take all of them (not taking into consideration contracts) except for Dudley.

I really think that you two are so blinded by hatred that you cannot be trusted to make fair or reasonable assessments. I'm putting the both of you on double secret probation until further notice.

[benefactor]

I really think that you two are so blinded by hatred that you cannot be trusted to make fair or reasonable assessments. I'm putting the both of you on double secret probation until further notice.
And I think that you and Manu4tres and the other two guys in the picture with RJ.

[ohmwrecker]

And I think that you and Manu4tres and the other two guys in the picture with RJ.

Wrong. I took the picture . . . I mean . . . Look over there!

[SouthTexasRancher]

Dick Jefferson - 16th best small forward in the NBA?
http://ca.sports.yahoo.com/nba/blog/ball_dont_lie/post/Ranking-the-small-forwards-20-through-11?urn=nba-264472#remaining-content

Is Kelly Dwyer on drugs?

(other parts of this series,
1 to 11
http://ca.sports.yahoo.com/nba/blog/ball_dont_lie/post/Ranking-the-small-forwards-11-through-1?urn=nba-264568
21 to 30
http://ca.sports.yahoo.com/nba/blog/ball_dont_lie/post/Ranking-the-small-forwards-30-through-21?urn=nba-264012
)

How Spurs fans would rather have any of the following players:
Marvin Williams (#21)
Josh Childress (#22)
Shane Battier (#24)
Mickael Pietrus (#26)
Omri Casspi (#27)
Carlos Delfino (#28)
Trevor Ariza (#18)
Travis Outlaw (#17)

How about
Grant Hill (#29)
Jared Dudley (#25)
Wilson Chandler (#20)
Shawn Marion (#19)


RJ is going to set the NBA on fire this coming season. He alone will make everyone forget all about the 3 gay amigos down in Little Cuba. Pop has done sprinkled some 'Woofle Dust' on RJ's head and we are all going to see the second coming of MJ.

Last year on the other hand I'd have taken just about any of those listed over RJ. But, Pop has something up his sleeve and I'm hoping it is something good. :lobt2:

[Waps1980]

RJ is worthy of that ranking especially considering he was the 4th option most of the year. When he was able to be the 2nd or 3rd his games were much better.
When his offense is up his all round game is better, confidence is a big key for RJ.
His rebounding improved and I think this year his D will pick up also plus ppg will increase.
I wouldn't be suprised if after this season his ranking amoungst SF will increase.

[DPG21920]

Maybe, but his feet might burst into powder at any moment.

Link?




Sometimes I think you are the only one with any sense around here.

Lame.




I really think that you two are so blinded by hatred that you cannot be trusted to make fair or reasonable assessments. I'm putting the both of you on double secret probation until further notice.

Why. Please explain why my assessment is unfair. I can give a legit reason for all the players I said over RJ. Can you defend all of them with both logic and statistics?

Also, please show me where I have "blindly" hated on RJ without having a legitimate argument, thanks. I have said RJ is a good player and I stated I have nothing against RJ personally. It is the fit. The numbers, advanced metrics and impact have all been proven.

[8FOR!3]

I don't know why people are whining about RJ being so high. I'm wondering more about Shawn Marion...Above Wilson Chandler? Give me a break, Marion can't score like that in his dreams.

[ohmwrecker]

Link?

It was a bit of a joke, but if you want a serious answer:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/playoffs/2010/columns/story?columnist=adande_ja&page=granthill-100428

"When the team plane landed in Detroit after the game Hill went straight to a hospital at 3 a.m. for X-rays. The image shocked Pistons trainer Mike Abdenour. If you think of the bulbous ankle bone as an orange, Hill's ankle looked as if someone had sliced off part of the orange.The result over the next five seasons included multiple surgeries, six screws, a plate and a giant staple in his left foot and 292 missed games. At one point he developed a near-fatal staph infection.
Hill can describe surgical procedures and body parts using words that make sense only to a podiatrist or an orthopedist. There were more injuries in different places, including a career-threatening hernia, due to the awkward gait caused by his altered foot. (It still doesn't feel right to him when he walks around barefoot.) And it was all on the $93 million contract the Orlando Magic took on when they acquired Hill in a sign-and-trade deal with the Pistons in 2000, hoping in vain that his foot problems were behind him."

Don't get me wrong. I'm a big fan of Grant Hill, and truth be told, I wouldn't really be upset if we traded RJ for him.


Lame.

Really?



Why. Please explain why my assessment is unfair. I can give a legit reason for all the players I said over RJ. Can you defend all of them with both logic and statistics?

Also, please show me where I have "blindly" hated on RJ without having a legitimate argument, thanks. I have said RJ is a good player and I stated I have nothing against RJ personally. It is the fit. The numbers, advanced metrics and impact have all been proven.

I don't have the time or inclination to go dig up a bunch of quotes, but I think your position on the matter is widely accepted as largely negative. I don't buy the whole "bad fit" argument. There are too many examples of players who are seemingly bad fits on their respective teams who actually worked out pretty well to make that the wholesale crux of an argument. Conversely, there have been a lot of players who looked like they would be good matches on a particular team that didn't work out.
I think RJ was a disappointment last season. Especially considering the ridiculously lofty expectations that a lot of Spurs fans had, but I don't believe it is a situation that cannot be solved with a little more focus on RJ's part and a little concession on Pop's part. It's not a doom and gloom thing for me. RJ is just a piece of the puzzle and the Spurs' success does not live and die with him.
I feel pretty sure that he will improve his confidence and focus this season and I know he has the skill to succeed if he can do that. I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt anyway.

Now, given that this is still August and I am bored as hell, I was, mostly, just giving you shit. Relax, dude. Do a J, or something.

[DPG21920]

I know you were giving me crap, I was just making a (missed the mark) jab back.

[ohmwrecker]

I know you were giving me crap, I was just making a (missed the mark) jab back.

Cool. Let me hit that, will ya?

[DPG21920]

Don't break the cipher.

[ohmwrecker]

Well. I guess we can close the file on that one.

[Bito Corleone]

The only player in your list that could really help the Spurs this year is Battier.

Or Pietrus, Ariza, Outlaw, Childress, Hill, and Marion...some of the others as well.

[ElNono]

Delfino is really a SG. And I would still take him over RJ. At least he can still go around people.

[Ditty]

That's about right for him maybe we can make cases for batum and artest but alot of people don't give rj the credit he deserves sure he was inconsitent but 12 ppg for a guy who has averaged around 18 ppg being technically the 4th option on the team is a real bad thing idiots :lmao

Ariza may be better but it looks like he's heading toward the 1 year wonder stage

maggette is too high also

[will_spurs]

Is Kelly Dwyer on drugs?

Yes, that has been established for a fact a number of times before.

The first thing to consider is that the whole list is weird, apart from the top 3-4 players, and a list like that really drives the point home that SF is a) a really shitty position across the NBA, with very few high quality players and b) where defensive specialists shine, making it hard to rank players contributing on defense only (e.g. Batum, Pietrus or Bowen in his time) with players contributing on both ends of the floor (and even with a few players contributing only on offense and getting all the media attention because scoring points > winning, as we all know).

That's how you get a list with only 2 legit superstars (James and Durant), Iguodala ranked 5th (last year was ranked as a SG) over Pierce (#7), Kirilenko ranked #9 (Kirilenko is a SF?), etc.

The 2nd thing to consider is the explanation going with RJ's ranking, to wit:


Something in me really, really wants to rank Jefferson higher. To recognize that the Spurs are looking at him as their best chance to try for one more title in the Tim Duncan (http://ca.sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3173/;_ylt=AogPhuEHkc0ezuDxPa78_1zzbwM6)(notes) (http://ca.sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3173/news;_ylt=AsBjEVOy8pii_hwZPV3esb7zbwM6) era. To see that his gifts are really well-suited for San Antonio's schemes on both ends of the court, despite Jefferson looking terribly out of place last season. And yet, even considering the offseason tutelage from coach Gregg Popovich and the "it-can't-get-worse-than-last-season" scenario, I have to pull back with this ranking. Few small forwards will be more pivotal than Jefferson this season, but coming off that miserable 2009-10? Sixteenth sounds about right.

16th is not at all unfair - the list is not "who would be the best fit for the Spurs?" but "who is the best SF?" - there's a difference.

[ezau]

Why do all the pictures in Dwyer's articles have Lebron James in them? Pay more attention and you'll know what I'm talking about.

[howbouthemspurs]

RJ is an awesome player who wasn't used right.... I think hell do better this season

[admiralsnackbar]

Why do all the pictures in Dwyer's articles have Lebron James in them? Pay more attention and you'll know what I'm talking about.

Do you not get the joke, or are you making one of your own?

[ezau]

Do you not get the joke, or are you making one of your own?

I think I got it now. I wasn't reading the articles LOL. Stupid me:lol

[ezau]

16th is a bit too high. He should be between 25 and 30

[admiralsnackbar]

I think I got it now. I wasn't reading the articles LOL. Stupid me:lol

It could happen to anyone. :toast

[superbigtime]

Fuck dryer. RJ is top 10-15

[JustinJDW]

The only player in your list that could really help the Spurs this year is Battier.This.

[timtonymanu]

Im waiting for the PF list. I have a feeling Duncan will be 3 or 4.

Pau, Dirk, Duncan

[4down]

He's 16 out of how many starting 3's??? 30? That puts him just below average as a starting 3. He's saying half them are better than RJ. Not preposterous. People want to shit all over him becasue he performed below expectations and that's fair, but being in the 50th percentile of starting 3's seems about right.