manu best of all time

[SpursTillTheEnd]

manu is the best foreign player in the nba all time, point blank period.... not soft ass no d playing dirk but manu.. and u can bet that

[mingus]

I disagree, and I'm a hardcore Manu fan too.

[Solid D]

Before you went point blank on this, did you remember that Hakeem Olajuwon, Patrick Ewing, Steve Nash and Dominique Wilkins were International players (not even counting Timmy's Virgin Islands as foreign)?

[Solid D]

Personal favorites aside (Manu) ...then there are those who would say that in their prime, Sabonis, Dejan Bodiroga and Oscar Schmidt were better.

[King]

I don't know that I'd count Dominique Wilkins as international. He was born in Paris while his dad was stationed over there.

[DAF86]

http://www.bothteamsplayedhard.net/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/manu-ginobili.jpg

Manu is better than you, more succesful too.

[Solid D]

However....Ditka could have stopped Olajuwon, Ewing, Nash and Wilkins at the same time. Manu, not so much.

[MmP]

Bodiroga?
He can't be used in the same sentence as Manu. Scrub loser

[Solid D]

Bodiroga?
He can't be used in the same sentence as Manu. Scrub loser

:lol Well, I do like Manu but Dejan was a stud. You wouldn't happen to be a Serbian hating Croat would you?

[redzero]

That's not Dirk, Gasol, Hakeem, or anybody who isn't Manu.

[MmP]

I just happen to be a guy that has seen pussy Dejan skip NBA like a girl and Manu going all in succeding. The disire and passion in both guys it's just different, even when playing internationally with NT.

[Solid D]

I just happen to be a guy that has seen pussy Dejan skip NBA like a girl and Manu going all in succeding. The disire and passion in both guys it's just different, even when playing internationally with NT.

Same can be said for Papaloukas and Dimitris regarding the NBA. Of course, Theo has more desire and passion, no question.

[spurs10]

However....Ditka could have stopped Olajuwon, Ewing, Nash and Wilkins at the same time. Manu, not so much.
You've got a good point there.:toast:toast

[jason1301]

Same can be said for Papaloukas and Dimitris regarding the NBA. Of course, Theo has more desire and passion, no question.

Theo really wanted to play in the NBA, but when NBA teams came knocking on his door it was too late, he was past his prime.

Dejan was the man back then, one the best players I have ever seen compete at any level. That much better than Peja, the way he re-invented the game was brilliant. Not a coincidence Manu modeled (parts of his) his game after Deja.

Dimitris Diamantidis never had any desire to play in the NBA, not as fast to begin with, he could be a bruce type of guy with the ability to create for others once in a while. Other than AK-47 he is the other player that I would love to seen him in spurs uniform when he was younger.

[analyzed]

speaking of international players who should be in the NBA, Kirk Penny and Thomas Abercombrie should be in the NBA.

[Spurs Brazil]

Personal favorites aside (Manu) ...then there are those who would say that in their prime, Sabonis, Dejan Bodiroga and Oscar Schmidt were better.

A lot of people said Sabonis is the best international player ever. Oscar was a fantastic scorer, one of the best I ever seen. And I had a privilege to see him play many times. Even at 37 he was fantastic. I loved go to the games to see him play and it was even better he played for the team that I'm a big fan, Corinthians.
But I think as an overall player Manu is better than him. Oscar for sure was a better scorer but Manu plays better D and have much better playmaking ability.

[temujin]

Bodiroga?
He can't be used in the same sentence as Manu. Scrub loser

You know nothing about Dejan Bodiroga.

[temujin]

Sabonis, Petrovic, Danilovic, Parker and Divac.
Sorry Dirk, you are too much of a loser.

Manu is in a class with Bradley as the only players that won at all levels.

Manu is different by definition.

[Rummpd]

Have to go with the Dream as much as I love Manu or even Dirk's game.

Put Duncan in his prime with the Dream and that team would never lose period.

[Brazil]

manu is the best foreign player in the nba all time, point blank period.... not soft ass no d playing dirk but manu.. and u can bet that

manu is not even the best international player on his own team :stirpot:

[sandman]

Not sure I understand the debate some of you are having about international players that never played in the NBA. It's not in the context of the OP.

IMHO, if we are basing this ranking on the NBA career of the international player, it is Dream. If we are talking about an international NBA player that had huge success both in the NBA and as an international player, then Manu is definitely on the short list. A very short list.

[Solid D]

Not sure I understand the debate some of you are having about international players that never played in the NBA. It's not in the context of the OP.

IMHO, if we are basing this ranking on the NBA career of the international player, it is Dream. If we are talking about an international NBA player that had huge success both in the NBA and as an international player, then Manu is definitely on the short list. A very short list.

I first listed some foreign (non-USA) born NBA players. Then, I brought up the non-NBAers to suggest that some would say that Bodiroga and Schmidt were better than Manu...even though they were never in the NBA. Just spicing up and broadening the discussion.

[in2deep]

Oscar Shmidt - Brazil

dude averaged 44ppg in Seoul Olympics

[duhoh]

Have to go with the Dream as much as I love Manu or even Dirk's game.

Put Duncan in his prime with the Dream and that team would never lose period.

:toast

[cantthinkofanything]

Not sure I understand the debate some of you are having about international players that never played in the NBA. It's not in the context of the OP.

IMHO, if we are basing this ranking on the NBA career of the international player, it is Dream. If we are talking about an international NBA player that had huge success both in the NBA and as an international player, then Manu is definitely on the short list. A very short list.

How can you say that Dream had a better NBA career than Duncan?
Not disputing that he's one of the greatest all time but Duncan has the better career I think.

[in2deep]

How can you say that Dream had a better NBA career than Duncan?
Not disputing that he's one of the greatest all time but Duncan has the better career I think.

nice avatar. I am watching the prisioner blurays these days

[cantthinkofanything]

nice avatar. I am watching the prisioner blurays these days

Nice. I made the mistake of buying the series on standard DVD thinking they wouldn't release it on Bluray.
Did you check out the recent remake on A&E? It wasn't as good as the original but it was decent.

[sandman]

How can you say that Dream had a better NBA career than Duncan?
Not disputing that he's one of the greatest all time but Duncan has the better career I think.

I can say it because I prefaced the statement with IMHO, which of course stands for In My Humble Opinion.

And there is a big difference between being being a 'foreign born' player and being an 'international' player. Duncan may be foreign born, but I personally would not consider him international. Other than growing up on a US territorial island, his life is unremarkedly American in nature.

[cantthinkofanything]

I can say it because I prefaced the statement with IMHO, which of course stands for In My Humble Opinion.

And there is a big difference between being being a 'foreign born' player and being an 'international' player. Duncan may be foreign born, but I personally would not consider him international. Other than growing up on a US territorial island, his life is unremarkedly American in nature.

I guess I don't understand where you ended up. So you didn't include Duncan in the mix? Or do you think, IYHO, that Dream had a better career?

I'm not sure I see a big distinction between the the two in terms of catagorizing them. Both were born in foreign countries and started off in different sports. Both picked up bball at the age of 15 or so. Both played college ball here in the states before the NBA. Is it because Hakeem sounds African when he speaks?

[sandman]

I guess I don't understand where you ended up. So you didn't include Duncan in the mix? Or do you think, IYHO, that Dream had a better career?

I'm not sure I see a big distinction between the the two in terms of catagorizing them. Both were born in foreign countries and started off in different sports. Both picked up bball at the age of 15 or so. Both played college ball here in the states before the NBA. Is it because Hakeem sounds African when he speaks?

No, I don't include Duncan in the mix. The USVI has been a US territory since some time around WWI, so somewhere close to 100 years. While the territory does have a level of autonomous goverment, they are not their own country. They all have US citizenship as well as an elected representative in the US Congress.

This concept of being foreign born is a technicalilty that serves the purpose of debates like this one. I've frankly never understood the insistence to consider him an international player. He is one of the greatest ever to play the game and doesn't need that qualification.

But hey, it makes for discussion during the off season, and I'll never refuse a beer from someone who doesn't agree with me on this point.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

Personal favorites aside (Manu) ...then there are those who would say that in their prime, Sabonis, Dejan Bodiroga and Oscar Schmidt were better.

Good call on Sabonis. Anyone old enough to have seen him play in his prime realized he could have dominated in the league early in his career had he gotten the opportunity.

[analyzed]

I would say this , Manu is the winningest international player of all time. Who can match his resume. 3 NBA rings, 1 euro title , 1 Olympic Gold , runner up world championships.

[cantthinkofanything]

No, I don't include Duncan in the mix. The USVI has been a US territory since some time around WWI, so somewhere close to 100 years. While the territory does have a level of autonomous goverment, they are not their own country. They all have US citizenship as well as an elected representative in the US Congress.

This concept of being foreign born is a technicalilty that serves the purpose of debates like this one. I've frankly never understood the insistence to consider him an international player. He is one of the greatest ever to play the game and doesn't need that qualification.

But hey, it makes for discussion during the off season, and I'll never refuse a beer from someone who doesn't agree with me on this point.

I don't know. You make a good arugment. But I don't think growing up in the Virgin Islands is the same as growing up in the U.S. And it's not like he moved over here in middle school or anything. I just don't see much technical difference between TD and Hakeem.

[ohmwrecker]

I don't know. You make a good arugment. But I don't think growing up in the Virgin Islands is the same as growing up in the U.S. And it's not like he moved over here in middle school or anything. I just don't see much technical difference between TD and Hakeem.

Duncan's status as an international player is effected by a mere technicality.

[Chieflion]

Duncan's status as an international player is effected by a mere technicality.

Is "effected" and "affected" the same technicality you are talking about?

[cantthinkofanything]

Duncan's status as an international player is effected by a mere technicality.

Wait, are you saying he should or should not be regarded as an international player?

What does the NBA consider him?

[ohmwrecker]

Is "effected" and "affected" the same technicality you are talking about?

Yes. Pardon my, very rare, grammatical error. Nice catch, monkey.


Wait, are you saying he should or should not be regarded as an international player?

What does the NBA consider him?

Does the NBA make those types of designations? My point was an affirmation of the position that while the Virgin Islands are a U.S. controlled province, they are still, comparatively, very foreign. As to which anyone who has spent time in the Caribbean can attest.

[cantthinkofanything]

Does the NBA make those types of designations? My point was an affirmation of the position that while the Virgin Islands are a U.S. controlled province, they are still, comparatively, very foreign. As to which anyone who has spent time in the Caribbean can attest.

I'm not sure. From this comment at Wikipedia, it seems like they might, "Note: Even though Joakim Noah has a French passport, he is not considered an "international" player by the NBA because he was born in New York...." But I'm too lazy to follow up by checkign more reliable sources.

I agree with you on the point about the Caribbean. If Nash is considered an international player (which he is), then Duncan shoud be as well.

Tim Duncan - one of the top 10 international players ever.

[spectator]

i have not seen all players listed above, but from my knowledge duncan and the dream are in a league of their own. you could make various points for all others, but those two remain at the top.

also, if you had the option to play with duncan-dirk-parker vs. duncan-manu-parker, most nba fans (not sa fans, but nba fans in general) would pick the first option by a landslide. let's remind ourselves that the spurs won 4 titles without any other player other than timmy finishing in top 15 (first 3 all-nba teams) for that season. having dirk on our team would have been huge, as duncan would have anchored the defense and dirk (while not being a defensive presence, is not a liability when guarding the second best opponent PF/C) would have shared the scoring burden.

[Brazil]

I'm not sure. From this comment at Wikipedia, it seems like they might, "Note: Even though Joakim Noah has a French passport, he is not considered an "international" player by the NBA because he was born in New York...." But I'm too lazy to follow up by checkign more reliable sources.

I agree with you on the point about the Caribbean. If Nash is considered an international player (which he is), then Duncan shoud be as well.

Tim Duncan - one of the top 10 international players ever.

There some major differences between Noah and Tim for instance, Tim played for USA and Noah is playing for France.
So, Noah is an international player, Tim is not.

[cantthinkofanything]

There some major differences between Noah and Tim for instance, Tim played for USA and Noah is playing for France.
So, Noah is an international player, Tim is not.

I wasn't comparing Noah with Timmy. I just quoted the sentence for the wording,

"he is not considered an "international" player by the NBA"

because it inferrs that the NBA does make some distinction.

[Brazil]

I wasn't comparing Noah with Timmy. I just quoted the sentence for the wording,

"he is not considered an "international" player by the NBA"

because it inferrs that the NBA does make some distinction.



I agree with you on the point about the Caribbean. If Nash is considered an international player (which he is), then Duncan shoud be as well.

Tim Duncan - one of the top 10 international players ever.

Nash like Noah is considered an "international" player because he played for Canada. Tim is not an "international" player because he played for tem USA.

that was my point.

[Mel_13]

Nash like Noah is considered an "international" player because he played for Canada. Tim is not an "international" player because he played for tem USA.

that was my point.

By that definition Hakeem is not an an international player. He played for the USA in 1996 and never played for Nigeria.

[ducks]

manu is the best foreign player in the nba all time, point blank period.... not soft ass no d playing dirk but manu.. and u can bet that

you are a fool
dirk is way better then manu
and gasol is better then manu to

[Solid D]

http://media.mysanantonio.com/images/fiba600-unitedstates20100626.jpg

USA guard Trevor Coone dunks over the U.S. Virgin Islands’ Merwin Potter during the United States’ victory in its opening game of the FIBA Americas U18 Championships for Men at Greehey Arena. IVAN PIERRE AGUIRRE/[email protected]

In FIBA, the Virgin Islands competes at all levels (men's and women's teams) in the Americas Zone.

[Solid D]

There some major differences between Noah and Tim for instance, Tim played for USA and Noah is playing for France.
So, Noah is an international player, Tim is not.

Tim could have played for the Virgin Islands or USA national teams. The Virgin Islands was not a top 10 FIBA Americas team like Team USA was and Timmy decided to play for Team USA, after considering both options.

The NBA did produce a list of "International Players" a few years ago and Timmy was listed, along with Raja Bell, as international players with the US Virgin Islands. Link: http://www.nba.com/players/international_player_directory.html

[stéphane]

Tim could have played for the Virgin Islands or USA national teams. The Virgin Islands was not a top 10 FIBA Americas team like Team USA was and Timmy decided to play for Team USA, after considering both options.

The NBA did produce a list of "International Players" a few years ago and Timmy was listed, along with Raja Bell, as international players with the US Virgin Islands. Link: http://www.nba.com/players/international_player_directory.html

Virgin Islands are not a sovereign country as far as I recall thus being a dependent territory. Being from it does not make you anything else than a US citizen... Just like Guadeloupe for french... (they have a soccer national team there also despite being a french territory).

[Solid D]

Virgin Islands are not a sovereign country as far as I recall thus being a dependent territory. Being from it does not make you anything else than a US citizen... Just like Guadeloupe for french... (they have a soccer national team there also despite being a french territory).

Correct, they are not a country. The USVI is a US Territory, as is Puerto Rico, Guam, etc. They can't vote in Presidential elections but they have US citizenship. Although the Virgin Islands were purchased for slightly more than what Tim Duncan makes in 1 season, they are still considered in the basketball community as a separate entity...an international team. Are they foreign? That's open for debate.

[stéphane]

Correct, they are not a country. The USVI is a US Territory, as is Puerto Rico, Guam, etc. They can't vote in Presidential elections but they have US citizenship. Although the Virgin Islands were purchased for slightly more than what Tim Duncan makes in 1 season, they are still considered in the basketball community as a separate entity...an international team. Are they foreign? That's open for debate.

Yeah very much open... I personally consider what we call DOM-TOM resident being 100% french despite their soil just being a remainder of the colonization.

[Brazil]

By that definition Hakeem is not an an international player. He played for the USA in 1996 and never played for Nigeria.

Well, IMO he should not be considered like an international player.
Dirk, Nash, Noah, TP... are and tim, hakeem are not.

[diego]

IMO, and not many will agree, guys who went through US high school / college basketball should not be considered, because they were formed by american basketball. guys like sabonis, petrovic, manu, learned to play outside the states, when they got there they were already formed as ball players. duncan, hakeem, nash (easily among my favorite players), despite their international backgrounds, I dont consider them international. Even a guy like Pepe Sanchez, who never had much of a career in the US, I dont really consider him an international player, because he has a very american style game. Still, he is not from the US, but I just dont consider him an international. just my opinion!

[Sportstudi]

Well, IMO he should not be considered like an international player.
Dirk, Nash, Noah, TP... are and tim, hakeem are not.

I agree completely.

[Obstructed_View]

Lies. Spanoulis are best all times.

[mathbzh]

Well, IMO he should not be considered like an international player.
Dirk, Nash, Noah, TP... are and tim, hakeem are not.
Why Noah? He never played outside the USA. Maybe someday he will play for France but it doesn't look like it seems important for him.

[Brazil]

Why Noah? He never played outside the USA. Maybe someday he will play for France but it doesn't look like it seems important for him.

The odds to see him play for France are much higher than playing for the US. I'm pretty sure he will play for France when his contractual situation with chicago will be settled.