Anyone troubled by this?

[Yonivore]

Wellesley, Massachusetts Public School Students: Taken to Mosque - Learn to Pray to Allah

A-UTGkdB5uU

[clambake]

10 minutes? really?

[ChumpDumper]

Are they all Muslims now?

[jack sommerset]

I guess they did a little more than checking out the architecture and observing islam religion.

[jack sommerset]

I wouldn't allow my kid to go to a mosque or a church or any religious cult shops with their school for a field trip.

[clambake]

I wouldn't allow my kid to go to a mosque or a church or any religious cult shops with their school for a field trip.

OMG! i agree with jack! :depressed

[balli]

When I was a school-kid I was dragged to Catholic and Presbyterian cathedrals, a synagogue and plenty of times, cult mormonism landmarks and 'religious' facilities. Never a mosque though. Are you troubled by that, yoni?

[Spurminator]

If what happened is accurately summarized by the headline (I'm not going to watch it), then it definitely crosses the church/state separation line. The children can be taught about the religion without being asked to participate in or recreate it.

Do I find it troubling? Not really. Just another fringe incident that will probably be overhyped to imply that this is something that could probably happen to OUR CHILDREN in the near future unless we all vote Republican.

[ChumpDumper]

Are they all Muslims now?

[George Gervin's Afro]

Wellesley, Massachusetts Public School Students: Taken to Mosque - Learn to Pray to Allah

A-UTGkdB5uU

I'm not worried because you are always wrong.

[TeyshaBlue]

I'm not worried because you are always wrong. Somehow I don't believe your inuendo that the school to kids to learn how to pray to allah is true (call me crazy). it's not surprising that your side seems to agree with your premise.. I know you better than they do..

Well, it appears that it actually did occur as advertised, but was not exactly the nerfarious plot as was implied. This was a visit, among many visits to other religious sites. There was a terrible error in judgement in letting 5 students participate in the prayer session...I honestly have no idea what the teachers were thinking. Here's a little more on the topic:

http://www.wickedlocal.com/wellesley/news/x191992911/Wellesley-schools-apologize-for-letting-students-pray-at-Islamic-mosque

"Wellesley schools apologize for letting students pray at Islamic



By Teddy Applebaum
Wicked Local Wellesley
Posted Sep 16, 2010 @ 04:31 PM
Last update Sep 17, 2010 @ 12:00 AM
Wellesley — Wellesley’s superintendent of schools apologized today after Wellesley middle school students were allowed to pray at an Islamic mosque during a May field trip.

“It was not the intent for students to be able to participate in any of the religious practices,” Superintendent Bella Wong wrote in a letter being sent to parents later today. “I extend my sincere apologies for the error that occurred and regret the offense it may have caused.”

Wong said the field trip to the Roxbury-based Islamic Society of Boston Cultural Center—which faced opposition during its construction—was part of a social studies course called “Enduring Beliefs and the World Today,” that includes introductions to a number of religions. During the course students visit a mosque, synagogue, attend a gospel performance, and meet with Hindus.

“These activities provide experiences for our students that enhance their understanding of the curriculum,” Wong wrote in the letter. “The purpose of the field trip was for students to observe a place of worship.”

In the letter, Wong said students required parental permission to go on the field trip during which “a representative of the Mosque told students they were welcome to join in the prayer that was occurring.”

The trip gained wider attention after the Boston-based group Americans for Peace and Tolerance released a video on Sept. 16 showing five middle school students praying during the trip. A parent who chaperoned the field trip allegedly shot the footage of the trip included in the video.

“Today, Americans for Peace and Tolerance released a video showing 6th graders from Wellesley, MA as they rise from prostrating themselves alongside Muslim men in a prayer to Allah,” the group wrote on their website. “Teachers did not intervene. Parents have not been told.”

The video claims the permission form for the trip said that students would only observe and not participate in the prayer event. It also highlights male and female students separated during the prayer claims historical information presented during the visit by representatives of the mosque as inaccurate.

“In various parts of the country, public schools are allowing Muslim extremists to promote Islam to our children,” the Americans for Peace and Tolerance wrote on its site. “Something’s broken here. Our leadership is failing. It’s now up to ordinary citizens to fix it.”

Members of Wellesley’s school committee forwarded comment to School committee chair KC Kato who said she was supporting Wong’s position.

“I’m supportive of [Wong’s] letter and I’m supportive of the educational program which we provide,” she said.

Wong said prior to the video being released her department hadn’t received complaints regarding the field trip though one family declined to allow their child on the trip.

“Apparently someone wasn’t happy and it just took some time for it to come back to us," she said.

Following the incident, Wong said she teachers were told students shouldn’t have been allowed to pray.

“We’re giving better guidance to our teachers. I don’t know if they’ll do [the field trip] differently but it won’t necessarily be because of this,” she said. “I support the field trip, I support them being able to go to observe; I do think allowing kids to participate in the prayer crossed the line.”




Stupid mistake, for sure. Active plot to subvert our children? Not so much.

[LnGrrrR]

I thought conservatives always were bitching about keeping prayer in schools? :lol

Honestly, it doesn't sound like the teachers MADE them pray, just that some students wanted to pray there. If that's the case, who cares? If children wanted to take a moment to pray, I don't see a big problem letting them.

[TeyshaBlue]

I thought conservatives always were bitching about keeping prayer in schools? :lol

Honestly, it doesn't sound like the teachers MADE them pray, just that some students wanted to pray there. If that's the case, who cares? If children wanted to take a moment to pray, I don't see a big problem letting them.

I think that's a lapse in judgement on the part of the teachers. The kids, in all likelihood, were not followers of Islam and likely had very little understanding of what was transpiring. That's where adults are supposed to step in and provide protection and/or context. This did not happen in this situation. Being an ex-teacher myself, I can understand the catch-22 they probably felt like they were in...damned if they pull the kids out...and damned if they don't. Probably would've been wiser to have not let the situation arise in the first place.

[Yonivore]

When I was a school-kid I was dragged to Catholic and Presbyterian cathedrals, a synagogue and plenty of times, cult mormonism landmarks and 'religious' facilities. Never a mosque though. Are you troubled by that, yoni?
If the field trip had been as advertised, no. But, you've obviously not watched the entire video...

[LnGrrrR]

If the field trip had been as advertised, no. But, you've obviously not watched the entire video...

How was it different from what was advertised? You mean, the fact that children participated in prayer when it said they wouldn't on the permission slip form?

What's wrong with children who voluntarily wish to pray doing so?

[Yonivore]

If what happened is accurately summarized by the headline (I'm not going to watch it), then it definitely crosses the church/state separation line. The children can be taught about the religion without being asked to participate in or recreate it.

Do I find it troubling? Not really. Just another fringe incident that will probably be overhyped to imply that this is something that could probably happen to OUR CHILDREN in the near future unless we all vote Republican.
Not a fringe incident. There is an entire organization dedicated to getting schools to bring their kids to mosques so they can be proselytized.

Watch the video. It was much more than a field trip. Some poor Jewish middle school child (and a couple of others) were actually convinced to join in midday prayer, prostrating themselves to Allah and all that...

This wasn't a school that decided to take a field trip to a mosque, this was a Muslim organization that pitches these field trips to schools as a way to proselytize Islam to children.

[Blake]

Are they all Muslims now?

My youtubaIslamophobia makes me think I'll turn into one if I watch the clip.

[TeyshaBlue]

How was it different from what was advertised? You mean, the fact that children participated in prayer when it said they wouldn't on the permission slip form?

What's wrong with children who voluntarily wish to pray doing so?

I think that's already been codified, LnG. I doubt a field trip is an appropriate time to do that and coupled with the fact that the parents really need to have granted permission for them to take place in any other organized activity outside of the field trip, makes for a colossal failure in the teacher's judgement.

I understand where you're coming from, especially in light of Yoni's unhinged ascertation that Mosques are preying on our children ( :rolleyes ), but the fact remains, there's a pretty clear divider in when a student can and cannot take part in an organized religious activity during the school day.

[Yonivore]

How was it different from what was advertised? You mean, the fact that children participated in prayer when it said they wouldn't on the permission slip form?
See my response to Spurm.


What's wrong with children who voluntarily wish to pray doing so?
Well, how voluntary is it when the female chaperons are ushered out of the prayer room and middle school-age children are left with their Muslim handlers. It's one thing for a child to voluntarily pray according to the beliefs with which they woke up that morning; quite another thing to claim they voluntarily engaged in prayer in a religion anathema to their own and after being cajoled, encouraged, or whatever by perfect strangers.

I'm sure you're going to continue arguing for the sake of opposing whatever I say but, if you're not disturbed by the video (after watching it all) then I don't think we'll ever come to agree on the matter.

[TeyshaBlue]

See my response to Spurm.


Well, how voluntary is it when the female chaperons are ushered out of the prayer room and middle school-age children are left with their Muslim handlers. It's one thing for a child to voluntarily pray according to the beliefs with which they woke up that morning; quite another thing to claim they voluntarily engaged in prayer in a religion anathema to their own and after being cajoled, encouraged, or whatever by perfect strangers.

I'm sure you're going to continue arguing for the sake of opposing whatever I say but, if you're not disturbed by the video (after watching it all) then I don't think we'll ever come to agree on the matter.

lol @ anathema. Me thinks you presume just a wee bit too much.

[ChumpDumper]

lol anathema

[balli]

If the field trip had been as advertised, no. But, you've obviously not watched the entire video...

I have not watched any of the video. Me and the average teabagger differ in that I generally don't form my political and cultural opinions from the content of fucking youtube videos. Go sell stupid someplace else.

[Yonivore]

I think that's already been codified, LnG. I doubt a field trip is an appropriate time to do that and coupled with the fact that the parents really need to have granted permission for them to take place in any other organized activity outside of the field trip, makes for a colossal failure in the teacher's judgement.

I understand where you're coming from, especially in light of Yoni's unhinged ascertation that Mosques are preying on our children ( :rolleyes ), but the fact remains, there's a pretty clear divider in when a student can and cannot take part in an organized religious activity during the school day.
If you didn't stick around for the DawaNet and Primary Source segment of the video then you don't understand from where my assertion comes.

[ALWAYS bet on BLACK]

This is some sick fucking shit. Absolutely pure shit.

[clambake]

i kinda agree with yoni. all forms of prayer (persuaded or practiced) is disturbing to innocent children.

[Yonivore]

Ignorance is bliss.

[balli]

You are a fucking clown. Yeah, the printed word is so much more ignorant than some unsourced, bigoted, xenophobic, rightwing blog produced, piece of shit youtube video. Get a clue you testicle sucking fuck.

[LnGrrrR]

I think that's already been codified, LnG. I doubt a field trip is an appropriate time to do that and coupled with the fact that the parents really need to have granted permission for them to take place in any other organized activity outside of the field trip, makes for a colossal failure in the teacher's judgement.

I understand where you're coming from, especially in light of Yoni's unhinged ascertation that Mosques are preying on our children ( :rolleyes ), but the fact remains, there's a pretty clear divider in when a student can and cannot take part in an organized religious activity during the school day.

I can understand where it might be poor thinking on the teacher's part, but if a child asked to go pray, I don't think it'd be poor timing to do so on a field trip to a mosque. I'm fine with agreeing to disagree there.

Now, I don't believe children should be "coerced" or forced in any way into prayer. I'm only stating that if a child asked to be part of a prayer, then (time/schedule permitting) I don't see a problem with letting that child express his freedom of speech and religion.

[LnGrrrR]

Well, how voluntary is it when the female chaperons are ushered out of the prayer room and middle school-age children are left with their Muslim handlers. It's one thing for a child to voluntarily pray according to the beliefs with which they woke up that morning; quite another thing to claim they voluntarily engaged in prayer in a religion anathema to their own and after being cajoled, encouraged, or whatever by perfect strangers.

I agree that children shouldn't be "coerced". If they were asked "Would you like to join?" and they said yes, I'm not too concerned.

Also, I think it's fine for a child to pray for a religion he may not believe in; children are growing and learning about the world aroudn them, and some students may decide to "try out" different forms of religion and the practices involved.


I'm sure you're going to continue arguing for the sake of opposing whatever I say but, if you're not disturbed by the video (after watching it all) then I don't think we'll ever come to agree on the matter.

The video contained a little bit too much demagougery for my liking.

[MannyIsGod]

Wait, did the kids want to participate? I don't see how thats a problem if they're not being forced or its not a school sanctioned event.

[TeyshaBlue]

I don't see how thats a problem if they're not being forced or its not a school sanctioned event.

That's the kicker tho...it was a field trip.

[Spurminator]

Not a fringe incident. There is an entire organization dedicated to getting schools to bring their kids to mosques so they can be proselytized.

Or so they can be exposed to regular Muslims participating in their form of worship. I don't think exposure to other religions is, itself, a bad thing. But if kids were in a mosque and praying as a part of a school sanctioned FT, that crosses a line.


Watch the video. It was much more than a field trip. Some poor Jewish middle school child (and a couple of others) were actually convinced to join in midday prayer, prostrating themselves to Allah and all that...

You say that, others say the kids volunteered to participate. I'm taking the others' word for it over yours. No offense.


This wasn't a school that decided to take a field trip to a mosque, this was a Muslim organization that pitches these field trips to schools as a way to proselytize Islam to children.

Schools get pitched FT destinations all the time, from a number of different religious groups. Christian Science museums reach out to schools all the time.

It's up to the schools to decide which ones to go on. No Muslim organization can MAKE public schools bring kids to their places of worship.

[clambake]

i can't believe they took those kids to the belly of satan.

[Yonivore]

Wait, did the kids want to participate? I don't see how thats a problem if they're not being forced or its not a school sanctioned event.

Who would know? The adults (since they were all females and Islam is a sexist religion) were all ushered from the room before whatever was said or done to get the kids involved.

[MannyIsGod]

That's the kicker tho...it was a field trip.

Yeah, I don't know though. I mean could they STOP a kid from praying if they wanted? Its probably best to avoid any field trips to any non historical religious sites unless the kids are in some type of religious education program.

The more I think about it there are too many possible problems with children visiting religious locations like this. It should be avoided in the future.

[MannyIsGod]

Personally I would like my children exposed to a lot of different religions so they could form an open minded opinion on where their spirituality lies. Obviously though, schools won't be able to accommodate every religion and that makes it inherently unfair and impossible to provide equality so they should just stay out of the situation and let parents handle it at home.

[ALWAYS bet on BLACK]

And the repercussions need to be termination for those adults who allowed this to happen

[MannyIsGod]

Stick to trolling.

[ALWAYS bet on BLACK]

Stick to being cuckolded.

[MannyIsGod]

k

[LnGrrrR]

The more I think about it there are too many possible problems with children visiting religious locations like this. It should be avoided in the future.

Eh I disagree. I think most of the board are aware that I'm an atheist, but no one can deny the numerous historical, artistic and various other contributions that religion has brought about. I think it's important for children to understand religion, and the impact it had has on society, throughout our history. I think field trips to religious sites are invaluable in understanding these cultures, just as field trips to the beach are helpful in determining the type of creatures that live in the coast.

Reading about something in a book is far less effective than actually experiencing it.

[TeyshaBlue]

Ok, Yoni. I actually gave that video a full viewing.

You're right. It's very disturbing...but probably not for the reasons you think it is.

lol @ sad piano music. C'mon, what a cheap propaganda hack trick.

lol @ earnest voice overs.

lol @ naked excerpts of sermons with no context other than the narrative.

lol @ Saudi History lesson.

lol @ using a moment of very poor judgement to base your rallying cry upon.

Look, I'm a pretty staunch atheist. I'm really predisposed to not tolerating any of that bullshit. However, I am possessed of an occupied brain-pan. It's clear there's a problem here. It's also clear that the video is a ridiculous piece of propaganda.

[jack sommerset]

Don't forget the actress that did the voice over for the parents letter. Very compelling.

[LnGrrrR]

Personally I would like my children exposed to a lot of different religions so they could form an open minded opinion on where their spirituality lies. Obviously though, schools won't be able to accommodate every religion and that makes it inherently unfair and impossible to provide equality so they should just stay out of the situation and let parents handle it at home.

I think it's perfectly acceptable for a school to focus on religions that have had a significant impact on history, and leave out those that are relatively minor in the big scheme of things. I think the expectation that schools might have to accommodate every religion is as absurd as the idea that they have to incorporate every theory on a subject just to be "fair".

[DarrinS]

Obviously, if you are troubled by this, you are Islamophobic.

Did they let the kids witness a female genital cutting?


mspMEMD8OeE

[jack sommerset]

Obviously, if you are troubled by this, you are Islamophobic.

Did they let the kids witness a female genital cutting?


mspMEMD8OeE

LoL...That's disgusting!

[DarrinS]

LoL...That's disgusting!

That video makes me want to cry.

[Spurminator]

Obviously, if you are troubled by this, you are Islamophobic.

Obviously if your concern is on a church/state separation level, that would apply across religions and would not necessarily be Islamophobia.

Obviously if you are troubled because you see Islam as a brainwashing cult that is targeting your children and there is nothing you can do to prevent your kids from praying to Allah and disgracing your Christian heritage, then you are Islamophobic.


Did they let the kids witness a female genital cutting?


mspMEMD8OeE

Obviously if you post something like this out of nowhere you are Islamophobic. But we already knew that. What's next?

[DarrinS]

Obviously if you post something like this out of nowhere you are Islamophobic. But we already knew that. What's next?


If criticizing certain practices of Islam that I think are backward-assed and barbaric makes me Islamophobic, then I'm Islamophobic.

[jack sommerset]

Obviously if you post something like this out of nowhere you are Islamophobic. But we already knew that. What's next?

Give it a rest with your obvioulsy bullshit. Those people are fucking animals butchering those kids up.

[TeyshaBlue]

If criticizing certain practices of Islam that I think are backward-assed and barbaric makes me Islamophobic, then I'm Islamophobic.

Weird. This wasn't declared illegal in the US until 1996.

btw...where do you find this in the Koran/Quaran/Qur'an (would somebody please fucking standardize this spelling)?

[MannyIsGod]

I think it's perfectly acceptable for a school to focus on religions that have had a significant impact on history, and leave out those that are relatively minor in the big scheme of things. I think the expectation that schools might have to accommodate every religion is as absurd as the idea that they have to incorporate every theory on a subject just to be "fair".

Sure, but a random mosque has no historical significance.

The problem I see here is can you imagine the students visiting a Wiccan organization and the uproar that would cause? There's no reason to expose children to religion at school unless there is a valid historical reason

[DarrinS]

Weird. This wasn't declared illegal in the US until 1996.

btw...where do you find this in the Koran/Quaran/Qur'an (would somebody please fucking standardize this spelling)?


In a bizarre, politically correct move, the American Academy of Pediatrics actually sanctioned so called "ritual nick" as female circumcision option.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/07/health/policy/07cuts.html?_r=1

And in July of this year withdrew the policy statement.

I had no idea it had ever been legal in the US.

[Spurminator]

If criticizing certain practices of Islam that I think are backward-assed and barbaric makes me Islamophobic, then I'm Islamophobic.

It's not your criticism that makes you Islamophobic. The frequency and manner in which you communicate those criticisms is only symptomatic of your Islamophobia.

You think that anyone who is Muslim, even in America, is inherently a greater threat to this country by virtue of his or her Muslim beliefs. You feel that all Muslims share accountability for the actions of terrorists who share their religion, and that they should vocally protest and/or apologize for those terrorists. You are admittedly skeptical of Muslim-looking passengers on the same plane as you.

It's become your sole reason for posting on this board. As Galileo is to 9/11 conspiracies and Ron Paul, you are to Bad Muslims. The shoe fits, buddy. Sorry. Not everyone who disagrees with Islamic practices is Islamophobic, but only Islamophobic people obsess over Muslims as much as you do.

And it's all central to your opposition to a mosque in Lower Manhattan.

[DarrinS]

You think that anyone who is Muslim, even in America, is inherently a greater threat to this country by virtue of his or her Muslim beliefs. You feel that all Muslims share accountability for the actions of terrorists who share their religion, and that they should vocally protest and/or apologize for those terrorists.



fail

[MannyIsGod]

Its the truth. You're obsessed. The fact that you think that regular Muslims in NYC need to somehow change their actions based on extremists.

[LnGrrrR]

If criticizing certain practices of Islam that I think are backward-assed and barbaric makes me Islamophobic, then I'm Islamophobic.

Do you think male circumcision is also barbaric? Some people do; just curious if you do as well. (Note: I'm not suggesting the two are equal in terms of health/safety or barbarism, and recognize that male circumcision is usually a) performed soon after birth to minimize trauma and b) has positive benefits, such as reducing AIDS transmission.)

I ask this because if one were to take video of a moyel performing a ritual circumcision on a baby, I would assume that would also look somewhat barbaric.

[LnGrrrR]

Sure, but a random mosque has no historical significance.

Well, I would assume they would use it as representative of mosques in general. After all, not every class can go visit historically relevant cathedrals/churches/etc.


The problem I see here is can you imagine the students visiting a Wiccan organization and the uproar that would cause? There's no reason to expose children to religion at school unless there is a valid historical reason

I would argue that Wicca has obviously done much less of historical note than Islam. The only time that Wicca was probably historically relevant was during the Witch Trials of Salem. :lol (And let me tell you, as a student in Lynn, MA, a field trip to Salem, MA is tons of fun in October. I plan on visting when I go back home next month.)

[MannyIsGod]

Historical significance is really really really subjective. You get into a lot of problems when you call a group historically insignificant. This is why I think its better to avoid things.

[ChumpDumper]

If criticizing certain practices of Islam that I think are backward-assed and barbaric makes me Islamophobic, then I'm Islamophobic.Do you think all Muslim girls are subject to genital mutilation?

Do you think they genital mutilation is an exclusively Islamic practice?

[fraga]

Oh sweet baby jesus...you mean these kids were DRAGGED to this place of devil worship and FORCED to pray to this evil prophet...now this is what I call GOTCHA religion by the left wing elitest...and...oh no wait...or

This was a field trip where the parents were "given" the option to have their kids visit a Muslim center where while they were "asked" to pray along...

[ploto]

Would you be so upset if this had happened at a Christian church and some kids voluntarily prayed there?

[Spurminator]

If that had happened, Nbadan would have posted a thread instead of Yonivore.

[LnGrrrR]

Historical significance is really really really subjective. You get into a lot of problems when you call a group historically insignificant. This is why I think its better to avoid things.

Eh, I think it's rather obvious that the Judeo-Christian religions (Judaism, Christianity, Islam) have all had significant historical impact, moreso than many other religions. You're not saying a religion is historically insignificant, just that teaching time is limited and so lessons are restricted to the religions with the most impact.

I mean, kids today in history learn about the Crusades, why the Pilgrims came to America, how Protestantism came about, etc etc. All these events were severely influenced/motivated by religion, and yet they still teach them.

[Spurminator]

fail

Oh?

Let's go point by point...


You think that anyone who is Muslim, even in America, is inherently a greater threat to this country by virtue of his or her Muslim beliefs.

Evidence supporting this claim:


It's weird how a statistically insignificant number of reported Toyota problems leads to Toyota spending billions of dollars, having their brand tainted, and having their president grilled before congress.

I'm sure not ALL Toyotas are coffins on wheels.

But just don't apply the same principle to a few "defective" Muslims.

Do you think Muslims commit a disproportionate number of terrorist attacks?

Those poor, beseiged Muslims. Why, they're as harmless as puppies. Why on Earth would anyone scrutinize them?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_battles_and_other_violent_events_by_death_ toll#Terrorist_attacks

Probably. They're too busy frisking old women and single moms. Too bad they won't profile high risk individuals.

Check.



Next...

You feel that all Muslims share accountability for the actions of terrorists who share their religion, and that they should vocally protest and/or apologize for those terrorists.

Evidence supporting this claim:

The creation of this thread: http://spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=162294

Also,

No, I'm saying there's a reason that people will be suspicious (and rightfully so) of Muslims. I actually feel bad for the regular, law-abiding, moderate Muslim. They suffer because their religion has so many America-hating nutjobs. But, it's not my job to apologize to the moderate Muslim for the extremists among them.


(Article posted as new thread, presumably because you agree with it... Highlight quoted)

http://www.jpost.com/Opinion/Op-EdContributors/Article.aspx?id=186290

...Treating homegrown terror acts as isolated incidents of psychological disturbances while denying their ideological roots has given American Muslim leaders the illusion that they can achieve public acceptance without engaging in serious introspection and responsibility sharing for allowing victimhood, anger and entitlement to spawn such acts.

And here's a BONUS POST where you attempt to justify your phobia scientifically:

An interesting study:

Prejudice Is Hard-Wired Into The Human Brain, Says ASU Study

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2005/05/050525105357.htm

So for someone who is not Islamophobic you sure spend a lot of time arguing that it's reasonable and justified for you to be Islamophobic.

[Wild Cobra]

I can understand where it might be poor thinking on the teacher's part,
You're kidding, right?

With all the media coverage of not allowing religion in the schools, how can these teachers even consider such a thing? i would say they are either stupid to the point of being unqualified, or they are pushing an agenda in the schools.

All involved should be fired. No if, ands or buts.

[Veterinarian]

I'm troubled by the fact that you can still start threads.

[LnGrrrR]

You're kidding, right?

With all the media coverage of not allowing religion in the schools, how can these teachers even consider such a thing? i would say they are either stupid to the point of being unqualified, or they are pushing an agenda in the schools.

All involved should be fired. No if, ands or buts.

If a student asked to be involved in a prayer, and it didn't interrupt the class lesson, wouldn't you say denying that would be a denial of a student's freedom to express their religion?

[Wild Cobra]

If a student asked to be involved in a prayer, and it didn't interrupt the class lesson, wouldn't you say denying that would be a denial of a student's freedom to express their religion?
Why is it OK to pick and choose what religion is OK for academia? Liberals put a stop to Christianity any chance they get in the schools. If they are fair, they wouldn't allow other religions sponsored school activities.

Again, it's the hypocrisy that is the issue here. Is this too complicated of a nuance for you?

[George Gervin's Afro]

Why is it OK to pick and choose what religion is OK for academia? Liberals put a stop to Christianity any chance they get in the schools. If they are fair, they wouldn't allow other religions sponsored school activities.

Again, it's the hypocrisy that is the issue here. Is this too complicated of a nuance for you?

I am begining to think you don't understand what hypocrisy means..

[fraga]

He sure as shit knows what "nuance" means...

[LnGrrrR]

Why is it OK to pick and choose what religion is OK for academia? Liberals put a stop to Christianity any chance they get in the schools. If they are fair, they wouldn't allow other religions sponsored school activities.

Again, it's the hypocrisy that is the issue here. Is this too complicated of a nuance for you?

lol nuance

If I read correctly, this was a series of field trips taken to various religious areas. Of course, if the teachers didn't allow children to pray at a church, but did at a mosque, I'd have problems with that. But that isn't what happened, is it?

Liberals don't put a stop to Christianity; they put a stop to organized prayer. Kids are, AFAIK, still allowed to pray on their own in their free time, and there are a few religious-based after-school clubs in many schools as well.

[Wild Cobra]

lol nuance

If I read correctly, this was a series of field trips taken to various religious areas. Of course, if the teachers didn't allow children to pray at a church, but did at a mosque, I'd have problems with that. But that isn't what happened, is it?

Liberals don't put a stop to Christianity; they put a stop to organized prayer. Kids are, AFAIK, still allowed to pray on their own in their free time, and there are a few religious-based after-school clubs in many schools as well.
Now if that is correct, that changes things.

I didn't see anything about other religions for this. Is there a link available?

[TeyshaBlue]

Now if that is correct, that changes things.

I didn't see anything about other religions for this. Is there a link available?

See post #11. They were to visit a church, a mosque, a synagogue..etc...

[Wild Cobra]

See post #11. They were to visit a church, a mosque, a synagogue..etc...
Thank-you.

Consider most or all of what I said taken back. I somehow missed that key information.

[LnGrrrR]

Thank-you.

Consider most or all of what I said taken back. I somehow missed that key information.

:toast