Goaltending rule coming to the NBA?

[Venti Quattro]

HANG TIME HEADQUARTERS (http://hangtime.blogs.nba.com/2010/09/29/new-rules/) – The gap between the NBA game and the international game of basketball continues to shrink at a rapid pace.

FIBA instituted NBA-style rule changes earlier this year (including the dumping of that trapezoid lane, the no-charge zone under the basket and the extended 3-point line). Now comes the NBA’s move towards closing the gap from the other side.

The NBA D-League announced today that is has tweaked its goaltending and overtime rules, the goaltending rule will now mirror the FIBA rule that allows a player to knock the ball away when it is on the rim. Since it serves as, in the words of NBA D-League President Dan Reed, the NBA’s “Research and Development” department, it’s reasonable to assume that it’s just a matter of time before this new goaltending rule is implemented in the NBA.

NBA Commissioner David Stern has been a vocal supporter of changing the rule for years. “As far as I’m concerned, FIBA has it right: It’s in play and the only thing the referee has to judge is, Did it hit the rim? That’s it,” Stern said told Sports Illustrated’s Ian Thomsen last year. “To me, that’s a sensible rule, and it would make foul shooting more fun too.”

The NBA D-League tested the adidas-developed NBA Revolution 30 uniforms you will see on your favorite NBA players this season. So this wouldn’t be the first time the “R&D department” delivered the goods.

If the new goaltending rule is a success in the D-League it could pave the way for one of the most significant rules changes the NBA has seen since the 3-point shot was adopted in the 1979-80 season.

Seriously, can you imagine how crazy it would be to have guys like Dwight Howard, LeBron James, Gerald Wallace, Josh Smith and even an aging but cagey veteran like Kevin Garnett going after the ball while it’s on the cylinder?

Talk about a potential game-changer for some of the league’s elite athletes and craftier players, a new goaltending rule in the NBA could revolutionize the game for some teams and players (the difference in rules go a long way in explaining why some NBA players flourish during international competitions and other struggle, same for the international players that thrive in their game and don’t always make a smooth adjustment to the NBA).
What a shit rule change. We have good NBA blockers and weak stuff like these have no room in the NBA.

I hope this doesn't happen or it will really make the NBA game super crappy.

[balli]

Yeah, that's bullshit. Basically every shot that doesn't go cleanly in will be batted away. Maybe the rule makes sense for unathletic euros, but the NBA is too long and too good and too athletic for that to make any sense at all. It would totally fuck up the game. Very stupid of Stern to even experiment with this garbage.

[lefty]

That would be stupid

Expect players to average 20 rbds/game and think they are the next Rodman

[Venti Quattro]

The NBA beat the Europeans soundly in their own game and now Stern tries to go down to the FIBA level? What a shit policy by the commish! I mean, come on, FIBA is trying to step up to NBA level!!!

[lefty]

February 1st, 1984: worst day in the history of the NBA

[JamStone]

I like the rule. I don't think it would make the game crappy at all. I don't think it really hurts the game in FIBA. How many times do you see a guy shoot the ball and it hits the rim 8 times before dropping and you say something like, "that was totally lucky, they didn't deserve those points?" Well, you're eliminating those kinds of lucky shots. That sounds fair to me.

Plus, I think that's going to make players compete harder to rebound. With that rule in place, defensive rebounding becomes even that much more important. Get some of those lazy ass big men to actually put in work.

[HarlemHeat37]

Wait, this is serious?!..

[Venti Quattro]

Wait, this is serious?!..

I posted a link brah. Links to NBA.com hangtime blog.

[PGDynasty24]

Fucking stupid. I like watching those crazy bounces and rolls shots take once they hit the rim,fuck you stern

[DeadlyDynasty]

I like the rule. I don't think it would make the game crappy at all. I don't think it really hurts the game in FIBA. How many times do you see a guy shoot the ball and it hits the rim 8 times before dropping and you say something like, "that was totally lucky, they didn't deserve those points?" Well, you're eliminating those kinds of lucky shots. That sounds fair to me.

Plus, I think that's going to make players compete harder to rebound. With that rule in place, defensive rebounding becomes even that much more important. Get some of those lazy ass big men to actually put in work.

key words there...The NBA is a whole different animal than FIBA. As for your rebounding point, I see what you're saying but that's only going to lead to more loose ball fouls and FTAs, slowing the game down even more. This rule change has the potential to make games resemble a WNBA boxscore, imo

[xellos88330]

Weird.

I don't like the idea. NBA is too athletic. If they want to experiment with it in the D-League that is fine. I think even in the D-League it will prove that it isn't going to work in the NBA.

JamStone did make a pretty good argument, however the lane will become a complete clusterfuck with people trying to get the rebound since almost every position can dunk the ball with regularity.

[balli]

How many times do you see a guy shoot the ball and it hits the rim 8 times before dropping and you say something like, "that was totally lucky, they didn't deserve those points?" Well, you're eliminating those kinds of lucky shots. That sounds fair to me.
Bouncing off the rim 8 times is an exaggeration, but I personally think the 'shooter's roll' is something that should be preserved. Chance favors the prepared mind, or in this case, the prepared shooter.

If Kyle Korver and Ray Allen are able to miss or make close as a result of their perfect shooting/rotational technique, I see no reason why the League should implement a rule that would basically turn them and every other clean shooter into Shawn Marion.

[lefty]

Dennis Rodman is watching this thead with a lot of interest:



http://www.freakingnews.com/pictures/56500/Dennis-Rodman--56984.jpg

[Ashy Larry]

hope not ... it's a shit rule.

[MmP]

"The NBA beat the Europeans soundly in their own game and now Stern tries to go down to the FIBA level? What a shit policy by the commish! I mean, come on, FIBA is trying to step up to NBA level!!!"


"Maybe the rule makes sense for unathletic euros, but the NBA is too long and too good and too athletic for that to make any sense at all."


Such retard comments

[balli]

"The NBA beat the Europeans soundly in their own game and now Stern tries to go down to the FIBA level? What a shit policy by the commish! I mean, come on, FIBA is trying to step up to NBA level!!!"


"Maybe the rule makes sense for unathletic euros, but the NBA is too long and too good and too athletic for that to make any sense at all."


Such retard comments

Fuck you. I don't think you have any idea how much longer and more athletic the average NBA player is than any other league's. If you did, you wouldn't be running your mouth like a jackass.

[Venti Quattro]

"The NBA beat the Europeans soundly in their own game and now Stern tries to go down to the FIBA level? What a shit policy by the commish! I mean, come on, FIBA is trying to step up to NBA level!!!"

"Maybe the rule makes sense for unathletic euros, but the NBA is too long and too good and too athletic for that to make any sense at all."

Such retard comments

Hey, where were you during the 2010 FIBA Worlds?

They were fouling Americans like fouls were going to be out of stock tomorrow if there was even a slightest hint that the Americans were going out for a fast break attempt. They were constantly hacking them. They beat the FIBA "more physical, less refs, unlike the NBA" game and it's as clear as the day. :toast

[DeadlyDynasty]

this rule change could make DJ Mbenga a valuable trade commodity:greedy

[JamStone]

I think some of you think it will drastically change the game, and I don't think that's the case. It might affect a handful of shots a game, and shots that quite frankly should be up for grabs on the rim. It won't affect every single shot that doesn't go in cleanly. A jumpshot that rattles in the rim but is securely within the rim before falling isn't "on" the rim. A lay-up off the glass won't be up for grabs. A ball that hits the heel of the rim, goes straight up in the air, then falls in won't be "on the rim" to be grabbed or batted away.

These are shots that roll around the rim and probably about half of the time roll off anyway. These are shots that half that 50/50 chance of going in. And, I bet you it will only be a handful of times a game anyway. And you're forgetting that a defensive rebounder still has to fight an offensive rebounder to get the ball or bat it away.

I think it's a good rule for basketball in general, not just for FIBA. We are so used to the goaltending rule the way it is that we think that's the only way and the only right way to call it. It takes innovative thinking to improve the game. I'm sure a lot of fans thought the three point shot would ruin the game. Some argue that it did. But we as fans accept it as a rule and don't really question it. At its inception, there was no dribbling in basketball. You could only pass the ball and run without the ball. Imagine basketball with no dribbling. This is a rule that has been proven to work at many levels of basketball, including the professional level. It makes a lot more sense than some of you want to believe.

[Venti Quattro]

JamStone, I get your point. But we have seen its effects on the FIBA level and I'm adamant that this rule change will DESTROY the NBA game.

[JamStone]

JamStone, I get your point. But we have seen its effects on the FIBA level and I'm adamant that this rule change will DESTROY the NBA game.

What is its effects on the FIBA level that you've seen?

If this rule change destroys the NBA game with all the crap already part of the game that should have destroyed a long time ago, then it's a fragile piece of shit product anyway. The rule change if it's eventually implemented to the NBA at worse will marginally negatively affect the game. At best, it will make it a better product.

[HarlemHeat37]

I don't understand why so many people want to tweak these rules that have very little effect on the quality of the NBA game..I don't think I've ever seen anybody complain about the goaltending rule..I have never even though about it, TBH..why mess with something that doesn't bother most people?..

The NBA's main flaw is their officiating, and that's the main thing they should be looking to fix, not fucking goaltending rules..

Also, most shots that rim in are not "lucky shots"..just by playing baskeball, you should know that good shooters/finishers are much more likely to get those rolls than inferior shooters/finishers, obviously due to the touch on the shot..yes, there are lucky shots at times, but certainly not enough to add a ridiculous goaltending rule..

[HarlemHeat37]

I find it comical that the NBA addressed it's officiating problem by adding more severe consequences to complaints from it's players, which in result, attempts to lessen the negative perception of their refs..

Instead of focusing on their serious officiating problem, they try to mask it, and their focus is now going to changing goaltending rules:lol

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

I agree with Jamstone I don't think it's gonna affect the game that much, and it will make boxing out and consistent work on defense a lot more important.

The Suns are completely fucked if this rule gets implemented :lol

[z0sa]

Both mere speculation and essentially meaningless. I don't see it affecting the game in any but the most marginal ways.

[ChumpDumper]

I don't think I've ever seen anybody complain about the goaltending rule.I have seen plenty of people complain about the goaltending rule; mostly about whether a shot was still in the imaginary cylinder that refs are supposed to judge quickly from bad angles.

The D-League has used the FIBA rules for this in the past. It really only affected a couple of shots each game. The reaction from the crowd that doesn't know the rule is in effect is entertaining to say the least.

[rAm]

I find it comical that the NBA addressed it's officiating problem by adding more severe consequences to complaints from it's players, which in result, attempts to lessen the negative perception of their refs..

Instead of focusing on their serious officiating problem, they try to mask it, and their focus is now going to changing goaltending rules:lol

well said

[MmP]

I don't have a problem with some not wanting to change the rule, I think it's retard to bash the FIBA game because you don't agree with rules. FIBA is a totally different basketball game.

[ChumpDumper]

I don't have a problem with some not wanting to change the rule, I think it's retard to bash the FIBA game because you don't agree with rules. FIBA is a totally different basketball game.Not for much longer.

[diego]

i've always argued the NBA should stick to calling the rules they already have right instead of adding more, but this IMO is a good change because it simplifies things





"Maybe the rule makes sense for unathletic euros, but the NBA is too long and too good and too athletic for that to make any sense at all."



too long and too good and too athletic? if anything, that should mean that less shots will be on the cylinder and therefore the change would have a minimal impact. and if NBA players are so athletic and long, why not let them take advantage of that so they can rebound the ball better? how does this make the game weaker? on the contrary, it rewards strength, athleticism, timing and awareness

i fail to see how this change could DESTROY the NBA

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

I find it comical that the NBA addressed it's officiating problem by adding more severe consequences to complaints from it's players, which in result, attempts to lessen the negative perception of their refs..

Instead of focusing on their serious officiating problem, they try to mask it, and their focus is now going to changing goaltending rules:lol
This is a different issue but a great point nevertheless. Also, of all the FIBA rules the NBA could adopt, why the hell was this random rule chosen? Why not take away the bullshit defensive 3 second rule or become more like FIBA allowing physical play?

This isn't the first random thing Stern implements this time of year that does nothing to make the NBA better. The dresscode in the 05 off season, and the retarded ball change in the 06 off season two recent examples.

[redzero]

Dwight Howard's about to average six blocks a game.

[Cry Havoc]

I don't understand why so many people want to tweak these rules that have very little effect on the quality of the NBA game..I don't think I've ever seen anybody complain about the goaltending rule..I have never even though about it, TBH..why mess with something that doesn't bother most people?..

The NBA's main flaw is their officiating, and that's the main thing they should be looking to fix, not fucking goaltending rules..

Also, most shots that rim in are not "lucky shots"..just by playing baskeball, you should know that good shooters/finishers are much more likely to get those rolls than inferior shooters/finishers, obviously due to the touch on the shot..yes, there are lucky shots at times, but certainly not enough to add a ridiculous goaltending rule..

+1 :tu

As a shooter with pretty decent touch myself, most of the time when my shot hits the inner part of the rim, it's going down. A quick release with good touch is one of the few advantages I have over guys who are over 6'3".

This rule is just going to make the NBA less skilled, because teams will be looking for very tall guys who can swat the ball off the rim. It will give birth to a lot of Shawn Bradley-esque players.

I can see the Rockets playing a lot of 2-3 zone, and anytime a shot hits the rim and goes up, Yao bats it out or immediately grabs it. Same with Dwight Howard or LeBron James, who have the ability to get way above the rim on any high bounces.

I wish the NBA would start emphasizing skill more rather than size. They've been trending that way recently, but this is a bad idea.

[ogait]

Dwight Howard's about to average six blocks a game.

It wont affect bock count because the rule is only different after the ball hits the rim for the first time.

[ogait]

Some people are acting as this would eliminate any basket that doesn't directly go in the net without bouncing on the rim. Defenders still have to box out the player they are defending (even more with this rule) it's not like they can go up there and swipe every ball that hits the rim.

Fiba rules and NBA rules have been becoming more similar with the recent changes. Most of them have been Fiba adapting to NBA rules so this might be some way for the NBA to show that they can adapt to the rest of the world. I agree with the ones saying that the overall impact in the game wouldn't be that big.

[MmP]

In fact this would make games much more tight. I've always liked this rule from FIBA. It makes u pay attention a lot more and play smarter.

[JamStone]

Some people are acting as this would eliminate any basket that doesn't directly go in the net without bouncing on the rim. Defenders still have to box out the player they are defending (even more with this rule) it's not like they can go up there and swipe every ball that hits the rim.

Fiba rules and NBA rules have been becoming more similar with the recent changes. Most of them have been Fiba adapting to NBA rules so this might be some way for the NBA to show that they can adapt to the rest of the world. I agree with the ones saying that the overall impact in the game wouldn't be that big.

This is the way I see it playing out. Early on, more players are going to try to jump earlier as the timing to rebound does change a little bit. So players will start jumping to time when the ball gets right at the rim, instead of jumping to try to get the ball if there is a rebound available. But what they'll realize is that jumping too soon will more often times than not compromise their rebounding positioning. They might jump on the wrong side of the rim and the ball bounces the other way.

The reason I don't think it affects the game as much is because I think FIBA players realize you still have to box out and you still have to get an idea where the ball will be if it does miss. You can't just randomly start jumping before the ball actually gets to the rim because you might put yourself completely out of position and end up giving an offensive player an easy putback. Players will realize that and not jump too soon. So the jumpshot that is a little shaky, hits the rim a couple times and falls through will often still end up going through the hoop. The situations where I've seen players take the ball off the rim the most is when the ball is really rolling off the rim for more than just a split second or is just sitting still on the rim for what seems like forever, or in a situation like a free throw where the offensive players don't really try to crash the offensive backboard and there are like three defensive rebounders for an uncontested rebound. Then if the ball hangs on the rim, they'll snatch quick. But a ball, especially off of long jumpers, that doesn't go in cleanly won't get batted off the rim as much as people think. Again, I think it will be a handful of times a game and be situations where the ball is really 50/50 to go in anyway.

[21_Blessings]

Can we quit with the SKY IS FALLING hyperbole? At worst it will make shot blocking/rebounding more entertaining.

NBA officials usually completely blow the borderline "in the cylinder" goaltending call as is. If anything this will speed up the game by keeping the ball in play.

[JamStone]

The rule will have no effect on shot blocking or how shot blocking may or may not be called as a goal tend.

[Zelophehad]

Well thankfully if you're against it like I am, it seems like its still a few years off at the earliest since they're just testing it in the D-League now.

[PDXSpursFan]

I don't like the FIBA goaltending rule. But I would like the NBA to adopt the physical play of FIBA (hand-checking, ect.)

[SomeCallMeTim]

Only 41 years too late, Stern...

6xHsi6V7mqI

:(

[Darrin]

I like the rule. I don't think it would make the game crappy at all. I don't think it really hurts the game in FIBA. How many times do you see a guy shoot the ball and it hits the rim 8 times before dropping and you say something like, "that was totally lucky, they didn't deserve those points?" Well, you're eliminating those kinds of lucky shots. That sounds fair to me.

Plus, I think that's going to make players compete harder to rebound. With that rule in place, defensive rebounding becomes even that much more important. Get some of those lazy ass big men to actually put in work.

In your example alone, I think that is pretty crappy. Tayshaun Prince has made a career out of those kinds of shots. No, it's not pretty, but it's better than the alternative It ruins footwork because bigs like Tyson Chandler will just guard the rim. What does it matter if you play defense when you get bailed out at the end of a possession?

[JamStone]

Good when it's on your team. Sucks to see those kinds of shots fall against your team. Tayshaun sucks. If he made a career out of those kinds of shots, he should have been in the gym improving that pterodactyl jumpshot of his.

What you don't get, as others in this thread, is that not every single fucking shot that doesn't go cleanly in, is going to be grabbed off the rim or batted away. Still have to box out, still have time the jump right, still have to bang with offensive rebounders, still a defensive three second rule.

It's as if some of you are thinking every single shot is going to be taken off the rim. It won't happen like that.

[TDMVPDPOY]

so does that count as a block when u hit the ball off the rim if its just moving around on the rim? fkn lame

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

In your example alone, I think that is pretty crappy. Tayshaun Prince has made a career out of those kinds of shots. No, it's not pretty, but it's better than the alternative It ruins footwork because bigs like Tyson Chandler will just guard the rim. What does it matter if you play defense when you get bailed out at the end of a possession?

[ogait]

so does that count as a block when u hit the ball off the rim if its just moving around on the rim? fkn lame

No. A block means you touch the ball after it leaves the shooter hand and before it hits the rim or the backboard. If you get the ball on the cylinder and keep possession it will count as a rebound, if you just swipe it out of bounds it wont count as any particular stat just like an interception witch goes out of bounds.

[024]

howard would dominate with this rule. i have a comical picture in my head of howard elevating during every shot and swiping the ball away after it hits the rim.

[duncan228]

Count Dirk against any change in goaltending rule (http://mavsblog.dallasnews.com/archives/2010/10/count-dirk-against-any-change-in-goalten-1.html)
Eddie Sefko

There's been some interesting debate about the NBA's Development League deciding to adopt the international goaltending rule, which means players can touch the ball anytime after it hits the rim.

Donnie Nelson loves the rule. Tyson Chandler hates it.

Dirk Nowitzki came down on the side of sticking with the NBA goaltending rule after practice Thursday night.

"I don't think it could work here,'' Nowitzki said. "Guys are too athletic and too long. I think somebody could spike every ball. There are so many athletes in the league.

"Plus, we want to increase scoring and make the game more fun, not take points away. In Europe, games are in the 60s. Nobody wants to see that. We want to see 110 or 120 points.''

That's from somebody who has played international basketball for most of his life.

Nowitzki added that when he plays international rules, he tries not to take advantage of the generous rule that allows players to touch the ball after it hits the rim, even if it is inside the basket cylinder.

"I don't want to get used to doing it because we can't do it in our league,'' he said.

That alone is enough reason to keep the rule the way it is.

[ogait]

I can see why Dirk wouldn't want this rule since he can be a lazy rebounder at times, and also being a shooter with touch could see some of his balls being knocked out of the cylinder on occasion more than others, but of all the differences between Fiba and Nba rules this is the probably the one with lesser effects on the total scoring in the game.

The games in Europe have lesser scoring because they are shorter, travelling is called differently, more physical play is allowed on defence,etc. and because the average quality of the players is inferior than the NBA. That wouldn't change with this rule.

But well that's why they are testing it. I'm sure if they find out it affects a lot of plays during the course of a game they won't implement it.