Hartman bringing minor league soccer team to SA?

[robino2001]

Take it for what it's worth...? Relatively legit minor league soccer source...

http://acstlfanatic.wordpress.com/2010/10/04/aztex-to-join-nasl-next-season/#more-3486

[FkLA]

MLS or go home

enough of this minor league BS

[METALMiKE]

http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/North_American_Soccer_League_coming_to_SA_10430831 4.html

[fyatuk]

I'm perfectly fine with NASL. It's one step below MLS (provided NASL gets sanctioned as Div 2 like planned), and MLS takes successful teams from other leagues, so it could easily directly lead to MLS. I don't think there'd be enough support to warrant MLS right now, anyway. Several current NASL teams will be moving to MLS in the next couple years.

[robino2001]

Portland and Vancouver are moving up this year. Don't know of plans of anyone else to move up - though Rochester has the support to potentially make the move. Austin is laying the ground work to do something good - but they're moving quickly in the wrong direction if they don't say 2nd division next year because of the politics of it all. Austin staff called trying to get me to renew my season tickets a couple of weeks ago and I told them it all depended on what level they ended up playing... they just said okay and wouldn't even try to lie to me that they were staying up. There is something weird between the Aztex and UT... they are kinda partners, but won't even acknowledge the possibility of using Myers stadium. It's as if it's being worked on in the background and don't want to jinx it. POTENTIALLY, they could move to MLS if they secure the stadium (Myers, likely) for it as the front office knows what they're doing.

[scott]

My understanding is that USL was going away/merging with NASL to form one Div 2 league. Did I dream this?

I'll be a season ticket holder of the SA team. Hopefully we can generate enough support for a move to MLS eventually.

[robino2001]

It's a huge long story about USL/NASL... essentially NASL tried to happen this year but not enough teams broke off. The initial dispute was something about Nike v Adidas... Nike is associated with USL (I think), Adidas-NASL... Adidas claimed Nike had a soccer monopoly, blah blah blah (I could be totally making this up, this is the best I recall it). So anyway, if you look at the league this year, there is a USL conference and a NASL conference. I believe in reality, 8 teams are NASL, 4 are USL (might be 9 and 3). Anyways, everyone committed to NASL next year except for Austin. Vancouver and Portland are going up to MLS, Charleston is moving back up to NASL and I think there may be a new team or two.

Austin refuses to go to NASL because they don't meet the official US Soccer requirements to be sanctioned as D2. Therefore, USL is taking their USL2 (D3) and making it the official sanctioned D2... so essentially Austin may be playing (and essentially crushing) all of the teams in the league currently below them - hence a step backward. That's why I'm saying Austin might have something up their sleeve. The ownership has experience with a team in the Premiership (Stoke) so I trust they know what they're doing - they just won't say anything. They've never publicly expressed wanting to go to MLS... but who knows.

[METALMiKE]

are they going to play at Heroes stadium or what? there is no stadium that ive seen on the STAR complex...

[jack sommerset]

SA had a chance at a MLS team a few years back but pissed that oppurtunity away. I would go back to the drawing board and try again. LoL@minor league soccer

[robino2001]

So all signs point to Austin's franchise being moved to Orlando later today... does it possibly hurt SA's franchise? There goes the Austin/SA rivalry. Rumor is Austin was quite unhappy the closest team was St. Louis... SA would face the same problem.

[robino2001]

double post... confirmed now...

http://www.austinaztex.com/news/headlines/index.html?article_id=466

[scott]

Hartman says the goal is to eventually have this team move up to MLS. It's up to San Antonio to prove we can support the team though.

[robino2001]

Orlando went on the record during their press conference as using USL as a stepping stone to MLS in 3-4 years... I secretly hoped the organization keeping silent the past month or two of what they were doing league-wise was them working to get a deal at Myers (UT's soccer stadium) to move up to MLS but I knew better... the attendance in Austin showed it.

[scott]

Orlando with MLS ambitions too... It's gonna be tough when MLS is sitting at 18 or 19 teams, lots of cities vying for that last couple of spots. Phoenix is a city also pushing hard, NY wants another team, San Diego consistently gets the best ratings for the USMNT... You get the point.

[robino2001]

well there's what... 16 teams now? Did they ever say what they're final goal was... 20? 22? Portland and Vancouver next year... that's 18. I believe Montreal in 2012. That's 19. And I thought Detroit was a leader in the clubhouse for #20. I'll admit, I don't keep up TOO much with the Euro leagues... but are any of the big ones larger than 20 teams? EPL is 20, right? Most of the others are 18 for the most part. Has MLS said anything publically about going larger than 20? Of course, Orlando, SA, etc can always get their teams via relocation...

[MannyIsGod]

MLS is primmed to blow up in the next few years but I'm not sure more than 20 teams is such a good idea.

[scott]

And I doubt American owners will ever allow a Promotion/Relegation system, which is really a shame.

[robino2001]

And I doubt American owners will ever allow a Promotion/Relegation system, which is really a shame.

Totally agree... I would absolutely love it - baseball is semi-set up for it even with the 4 main levels but obviously it would never happen (for too many reasons to even start posting). Makes the games mean a lot more in the end of the season.

Maybe somehow the soccer leagues will take a shot at it if there are 28-30 cities in the end that are showing the necessary support for MLS level... stadium, attendance, etc... and if MLS wants to stand hard at 20 cities. COULD be possible if you find the right cities. You could maybe throw together 30ish towns that would take a shot at it - especially if you start having multiple teams in some cities as has been discussed. I'd be concerned some places would lose too much interest once booted down though (KC, SJ, Dallas?) but I'd assume that same thing can happen all over the world in the national leagues... yall know your MLS much better than I though.

Would be entertaining to see Orlando, SA, Raleigh-Durham whoever making a push to win their league for the priviledge to move up. Would the teams outside of the US complicate the matter though if a system were to get set up (Toronto, Montreal, etc). Would USSF have to merge professional leagues with whatever lower Canadian leagues (and I think PR has a league too)... I'm probably just speaking out of my ass though and have no idea what I'm talking about. It'd never happen.

[MannyIsGod]

http://www.soccerbyives.net/soccer_by_ives/2010/11/garber-state-of-the-league.html

[MannyIsGod]

http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/article/City-Council-OKs-pro-sports-study-904916.php

[scott]

Stung by failed courtships with the NFL, Major League Baseball and Major League Soccer, and fielding pressing questions regarding pro sports, the officials decided to gauge what should or shouldn’t be pursued.

I found this statement interesting, considering that the past "failed courtship" with MLS was San Antonio's fault. The Dynamo were a done deal to be San Antonio's team, until Hardberger (who I thought was an otherwise great mayor) came in and squashed the deal.

Of course this study will probably lead to some dead-end chase for an NFL team that will never come, despite how many threads Buddy Holly tells us otherwise in. MLB has a chance, but a slim one. MLS is San Antonio's best hope.

[MannyIsGod]

Yes, in retrospect the pushing away of the MLS was pretty damn poor decision making. I can only imagine how it would have blown up this past year after the world cup. A true shame.

[Spurstro]

Ed Garza put MLS to S.A. up on a tee for Hardberger and he didn't even get the bat off his shoulder.

With a second team in N.Y. wanted and no teams in the southeast, San Antonio lost it's chance. I think the best chance has to be for FC Dallas to crash and relocate here.

[CagedMonky]

Well respected soccer journalist Brian Quarstad on the SA soccer situation:
http://www.insidemnsoccer.com/2011/01/03/san-antonio-one-team-two-teams-or-no-teams-nasl-or-usl/

[scott]

I fear two teams in San Antonio could end up cannibalizing, and eventually killing both.

I the worst case scenario, I fear the Spurs will put out the inferior product but draw the most fans as they have the marketing dollars to throw at the team, and that Hartman's team will die out for lack of fans then the Spurs team will die out for lack of quality product.

It's a tougher situation here that it appears on the surface.

[CagedMonky]

I fear two teams in San Antonio could end up cannibalizing, and eventually killing both.

I the worst case scenario, I fear the Spurs will put out the inferior product but draw the most fans as they have the marketing dollars to throw at the team, and that Hartman's team will die out for lack of fans then the Spurs team will die out for lack of quality product.

It's a tougher situation here that it appears on the surface.

Good news is that we will find out who will do the Pro Sports Feasibility study this month (crosses fingers) and that they've already admitted pro soccer is on the "front burner" and they will review both Hartman's and Spurs pro soccer plans. I hope the study strongly suggests MLS and either Hartman or Spurs see it through.

Also worth noting that the Spurs brought hockey to San Antonio and it only killed the Iguanas, not each other. It's also good to know the Spurs haven't folded their other minor league teams.

[CagedMonky]

"Spurs Sports & Entertainment Vice President Leo Gomez (http://spurstalk.com/?controllerName=search&action=search&channel=news%2Feducation&search=1&inlineLink=1&query=%22Leo+Gomez%22) said Thursday the company will propose bringing a United Soccer Leagues franchise to Alamo Stadium to play 12 to 15 home games, eventually developing it into a Major League Soccer (http://spurstalk.com/?controllerName=search&action=search&channel=news%2Feducation&search=1&inlineLink=1&query=%22Major+League+Soccer%22) team

"“We believe that if Alamo Stadium is redeveloped appropriately it would have the basic infrastructure to someday in the future upgrade to MLS standards,” Gomez said. “And still abide by the school district's standards.”"



Read more: http://www.mysanantonio.com/default/article/Alamo-Stadium-now-open-for-offers-942707.php#ixzz1AMqNUjLP

"The company's vice president Leo Gomez said Thursday the team would eventually transform into a Major League Soccer team.

Gomez said the proposal would mean maintaining the stadium's football field but eliminating the eight-lane track to create space for the pro soccer field."

Read more: http://www.ktsa.com/Alamo-Stadium-Is-Accepting-Offers-For-Soccer-Team/8934491

[CagedMonky]

Also... The Crocketteers will be in attendance at Monday's presser for Hartman's Team Name Announcment. http://www.crocketteers.com/2011/01/03/nasl-sa-press-conference-january-10th/



The Crocketteers look forward to seeing many of you at the press conference on Monday, January 10, 2011 at 1:00 pm. A special Crocketteers general meeting will be held on Tuesday, January 11, 2011 at 7:30 pm out at Morgan’s Wonderland. Gordon Hartman will be our guest and will going into great detail on the plans for our NASL team. Come be the first to know what’s in store for our team. This is a great opportunity for you to ask questions and have your voice heard about our team. We will also discuss group business and other events the Crocketteers have planned for 2011.


Please note we will also have a General Meeting at Morgan's Wonderland Tuesday evening with Hartman to discuss team plans with the Crocketteers and he will field questions, perhaps even those involving SS&E news. Even if you are not a Crocketteer (maybe you can consider in the future), you can attend and see what we are about and have a chance to hear Gordon Hartman speak about his pro soccer vision.

[Glenn Holland]

pathetic.

metro of over 2 million.
check.

successful nba franchise.
check.

nfl.
never.

mlb.
well, we always have da missions. ;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;

small market tv.
check.

oh wowzers a MINOR league team for a "sport" that no one cares about except mexicans.
lets dooooooooo itttttttttttttttt

[CagedMonky]

MLS on the San Antonio Horizon? SS&E Makes Intentions Clear

http://bit.ly/egOTl3 (http://bit.ly/egOTl3)



The words of Leo Gomez, Spurs Sports & Entertainment (SS&E) Vice President, rang through the air like sweet music to the San Antonio soccer fan’s ears.

“If Alamo Stadium is redeveloped appropriately it would have the basic infrastructure to…upgrade to MLS standards.”

He was not finished.

In announcing that SS&E would be pursuing placing a USL team in Alamo Stadium in the very near future, Gomez added a definitive bit of information for those wondering just how far off the push to MLS might indeed be.

“We would work to grow the market and get to that point sooner rather than later,” Gomez said.

Let’s catch our collective breath for a moment.

It has been a long time since professional soccer could be found in San Antonio. Back in 1976, the San Antonio Thunder called Alamo Stadium home and were led by Bobby Moore, the captain of the 1966 England squad that won the World Cup. Let that sink in.

There were once days when a soccer team in San Antonio played in an intimate, historic 23,000 seat stadium. There were once days that a soccer team in San Antonio featured prominent members of World Cup squads from the most respected footballing nations on earth. There were once days…and, thanks to SS&E, there might soon be days like those again.

As we look at 2012 and the possibilities that exist for professional soccer in San Antonio, it is imperative that we are aware of the incredible potential of an SS&E-run team to call our own.

Local Fit

For a professional soccer franchise to thrive in San Antonio, there will have to be a tremendous “Local Fit”. San Antonio is unique on the American sports landscape. The 7th largest city in America has long been a one-horse town. The NBA’s Spurs are the cornerstone franchise of SS&E and the cornerstone of the San Antonio sports identity. And the Spurs own this town. They also own all other professional sports in this town. Literally.

The San Antonio Rampage of the AHL and the San Antonio Silver Stars of the WNBA are both products of SS&E are both have become stable, healthy franchises on the San Antonio sports landscape. So not only does SS&E get the local sports fan, know how to reach the local sports consumer, and know-how to run a local sports franchise…but they know how to sell tickets and field competitive teams.

The Spurs, Rampage, and Silver Stars ALL draw better than their respective league averages in attendance. What sustains a professional sports franchise? Fans. And who knows how to draw fans, treat fans right, and keep fans coming back for more? SS&E.

The SS&E team has more experience in San Antonio sports than all other groups combined. They have already built the infrastructure of the organization, with ticketing agents, business planners, and managing partners having all been in place for years. SS&E would simply have to add the 2012 soccer franchise to their already unparalleled plan and watch the results bolster their tremendous track record.

And who could compete? The SS&E model is proven in San Antonio. It is impressive. And it should mean great things for a local soccer franchise.

Stadium


As professional soccer in America continues to grow its popularity, the rise of soccer-specific and soccer-optimized stadiums has taken hold. A secondary trend has seen the popularity of urban stadiums dwarf that of their suburban brethren. As San Antonio considers where the local boys should ply their trade, a venue of the right size (15,000 – 25,000) and location (urban core) should be top on the list of qualifiers.

Seattle has seen the optimized (and very urban) Qwest Field become the crown jewel of the MLS landscape. Toronto’s urban soccer-specific BMO Field has become a destination for true soccer aficionados and a guaranteed sellout for every match.

The other side of the coin (and the bottom of the attendance rolls) can be found in Frisco, the gorgeous and tragically empty home of FC Dallas. Other disappointing locales include stadiums outside of Denver and Boston. The suburban model has been tried in modern American soccer and has largely been found wanting.

As Houston builds a new stadium, it looks to avoid the geographical mistakes of Dallas and Colorado by placing its new home right in the urban core, across the freeway from MLB’s Minute Maid Park. New-to-MLS franchises in Portland and Vancouver are also going to be playing in densely-populated areas.

Why all of the talk of urbanity in a soccer column supposedly about SS&E and San Antonio’s MLS future?

While many plans will call for glorified bleachers in a low-density area, the evidence today is that the best hope for a soccer franchise of any level is to place it in an urban area, amidst the condo towers and office buildings.
The best hope is to create a raucous atmosphere, replete with history and universal accessibility. The best hope is perfectly in line with SS&E’s newly-announced plans.

A renovated Alamo Stadium will rival other MLS stadiums in history and charm, not to mention seating capacity and city-wide accessibility. Fans from all parts of town will be no more than 20 minutes away and the growing River North area (on the redeveloped northern portion of the Riverwalk) and it’s growing pub scene awaits supporters groups with open arms.

MLS

It is no secret that Major League Soccer has plenty of room to grow. The top-flight league has been aggressively adding markets in recent years and has another half dozen or so spots before it begins to feel full. For San Antonio soccer fans, the ideal franchise will be the entity with the most likely ramp into MLS. Luckily, San Antonio is blessed with SS&E, one of the premier sports and entertainment companies in the country.

The model for MLS inclusion is simple. A market must be economically viable, contain a sufficient stadium plan, and have an ownership group with deep pockets and a long-term view. In San Antonio, the MLS has a ready-made star. And that star has declared their intentions to rise to the highest level of domestic soccer.

So just how ready for MLS is San Antonio?

The market is primed. San Antonio is hungry. The city has ideal demographics (young, diverse, and employed), a sizeable population (metro over 2 million), and virtually no summer sports competition (the Missions are largely an afterthought and the nearest MLB team is in Houston).
As we outlined above, Alamo Stadium is a dream for MLS, big enough to accommodate the overflow crowds that come to town with the Beckhams and Henrys of the league and yet, due to its age and history, intimate enough to stimulate a incredible atmosphere even when San Jose shows up for a mid-week tilt.
As ownership groups go, there are few more respected in the world of sports than SS&E. They have built annual NBA contenders in a small market, found a way to start-up and sustain franchises in the WNBA, NBDL, and AHL, and have the depth of market expertise and pro sports experience to draw the envy of any group. What’s more, the spread of assets that SS&E maintains means that the overall organization is better positioned to withstand a few years of growing pains and financial losses while the team becomes established, something that a soccer-only owner might struggle under. Shared costs, deep pockets, and the ability to stick with soccer for its long-term potential makes SS&E the ideal MLS owner.
It has been 35 years since San Antonio has seen meaningful professional soccer on its soil. That will all change soon enough. As San Antonio entertains multiple options to take the city into the promised land of American soccer, there is a clear choice for the group that will lead the way. SS&E is here and SS&E is ready.

So the push towards MLS in the Alamo City has begun and the destination is not as far away as it once seemed. San Antonio’s day is coming.

“Sooner rather than later.”

[TheTruth]

San Antonio Scorpions F.C.

I highly doubt this was a popular choice during their fan suggestions phase. Not sure I like the name, but oh well...GO SCORPIONS!!

[Spurstro]

Scorpions?? I'm having a hard time believing that name had the most votes.

[MannyIsGod]

I think it has a pretty good ring to it.

[MannyIsGod]

I really wish relegation would be given a shot here. It would work so beautifully.

[lefty]

The Montreal Impact will officially join the MLS in 2012

I still dont give a flying fuck though

[scott]

Youth Soccer league team name. Way to go, morons.

[CagedMonky]

Fans didnt vote for the name. Fans only suggested names and only 12 people suggested Scorpions. The team only said they would pick from fan suggestions.

Scorpions was not the most suggested name. I wish they would show those numbers.

[lefty]

Can't be worse than :pctoss

http://www.a-league.com/team_images/Montreal_Impact.gif

[Spurstro]

Fans didnt vote for the name. Fans only suggested names and only 12 people suggested Scorpions. The team only said they would pick from fan suggestions.

Scorpions was not the most suggested name. I wish they would show those numbers.

Sorry about that....for some reason I was thinking our vote had a much larger say.

I gotta agree that the top suggested names should be released.

[scott]

On the positive side, at least we aren't called Real San Antonio or something stupid like that.

[Spurstro]

What do you guys think about Alamo City F.C.?

[scott]

I've mentioned in the past that my preference is Alamo FC (no City)

[CagedMonky]

I've mentioned in the past that my preference is Alamo FC (no City)
I've been suggesting Alamo City for some time now. I wanted it to be like Man City or the like.

Your suggestion Alamo FC is short yet super strong imo. It could easily be one of the best one word team name in all of soccer (i.e. Arsenal).

I really dislike the FC in Scorpions FC. I think it is trying too hard. I would be fine with SC for Soccer Club as it embraces our american perspective on the sport.

Please take a moment to read a commentary on the new team name by one of the Crocketteers VP's: http://www.crocketteers.com/2011/01/11/missed-opportunities/

[Spurstro]

Another article on the Spurs and USL to San Antonio...

http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/article/Spurs-bring-soccer-hopes-official-to-Alamo-966999.php

[Libri]

I don't like Scorpions. Alamo City has a nice ring to it.



On the positive side, at least we aren't called Real San Antonio or something stupid like that.

How about SA United? :lol

[Libri]

The Montreal Impact will officially join the MLS in 2012

I still dont give a flying fuck though

How about if they sign the best Algerian player.

[Blake]

pathetic.

metro of over 2 million.
check.

successful nba franchise.
check.

nfl.
never.

mlb.
well, we always have da missions. ;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;

small market tv.
check.

oh wowzers a MINOR league team for a "sport" that no one cares about except mexicans.
lets dooooooooo itttttttttttttttt

[Spurstro]

http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/scorpions/article/Scorpions-defeat-fails-to-dampen-enthusiasm-3484094.php

13k came out last night to their first home game. There's no way we'll be able to match that number again this season, but it was a great turnout.

We had lots of people turn out for the tailgate and the crowd was a lot more lively than I anticipated.

It was good to meet you Scott, and thanks for the free beer.

[velik_m]

http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/scorpions/article/Scorpions-defeat-fails-to-dampen-enthusiasm-3484094.php

13k came out last night to their first home game. There's no way we'll be able to match that number again this season, but it was a great turnout.

We had lots of people turn out for the tailgate and the crowd was a lot more lively than I anticipated.

It was good to meet you Scott, and thanks for the free beer.

I like the kits, the stadium on the other hand kind of sucks tbh.

[Spurstro]

I like the kits, the stadium on the other hand kind of sucks tbh.

They are playing in a high school football stadium this season.

Their own stadium is under constructions and should be finished by next season.

[NASpurs]

I was at the game. It was a pretty cool experience and my first time ever seeing professional soccer. I sat next, unknowingly, to the Puerto Rico Islanders fans (some of them brought vuvuzelas... assholes) and the Crocketteers supporters so it was a nice mix of cheers from both sides of the table. Too bad the game ended up the way it did and Campos missed those two penalties. How the f you miss two penalties is beyond me.

Oh and the parking was horrendous. Had to park on a vacant field.

[MannyIsGod]

I want a kit!

[tlongII]

The kits look good! I've been to several Timbers games when we were in the USL. Puerto Rico was always a pretty strong team.

[MannyIsGod]

Travel costs must be brutal for PR.

[NASpurs]

10,114 in attendance tonight, another strong showing. I mean of course there's going to be a drop off after the 13,000 for the opening game but that's to be expected. Hope the support continues.

[MannyIsGod]

10,000 is still damn good.