Spurs listed as one of the "five true title contenders"

[Rummpd]

http://nba-point-forward.si.com/2010/10/13/key-questions-for-the-five-title-contenders/#

5. SAN ANTONIO SPURS

The obvious question: Can the old guys still carry the load for a championship team?

There’s not much original to say here. Tim Duncan and Manu Ginobili are into their mid-30s, and both of them — along with Tony Parker – battled various injuries last season. Again, we can only wait and watch.

The meatier question: Do the Spurs need to overhaul their formula?

The Spurs have won the same way for a decade: with low-risk basketball. On offense, they want one good shot. That means no turnovers and (mostly) no crashing the offensive glass for fear of giving up a transition bucket on the other end. On defense, they want to force you into taking one bad shot. They don’t gamble for steals, and they don’t give you second chances.

The Spurs stretched that model to its breaking point two years ago, when they ranked last in offensive rebounding, drawing fouls on offense and forcing turnovers on defense. They topped the league in the opposite categories — defensive rebounding, protecting the ball and avoiding fouls. It was low-risk hoops, as if implemented by a computer system.

The team made small movements away from those extremes last season, and they may have to continue on that path if they want to challenge the Lakers and the East’s elite. Their personnel demands it. DeJuan Blair pushed the Spurs above the league average in offensive rebounding last season for the first time since 2004-05, when they were right at the league average mark. Blair and George Hill can both swipe the ball on defense, and Hill is a demon of a finisher on the break. Richard Jefferson, once a slasher (I swear!), attempted a career-low 4.1 free throws per 36 minutes last season; the Spurs need that number to jump back up, or their four-year, $38.9 million commitment to Jefferson will be a sunk cost. Parker and Ginobili, if healthy, should get to the line more.


Nice article and right on the money that you cannot discount the Spur's as true title contenders!

[lefty]

2008-09 preview thread
2009-10 preview thread

[ohmwrecker]

::cough:: . . . Ahem!

[HarlemHeat37]

They could be argued at #5, on the same level as a bunch of teams..currently, I wouldn't put them on the same level as Orlando and Boston, but they could definitely reach that level if everything goes to plan(which obviously isn't a given)..I don't think they can reach the Miami/LA level without a legit SF/perimeter defender though..

[GinobiliForTres]

Isn't Splitter more than just a center? Doesn't he defend the perimeter sometimes too?

[Leetonidas]

They could be argued at #5, on the same level as a bunch of teams..currently, I wouldn't put them on the same level as Orlando and Boston, but they could definitely reach that level if everything goes to plan(which obviously isn't a given)..I don't think they can reach the Miami/LA level without a legit SF/perimeter defender though..

Orlando is not a legitimate title contender. They never were. People overrate them way too much. Dwight + 4 jump shooters will once again fail in the playoffs, especially considering Dwight still has no post game. Lewis, Cater, and Nelson = garbage last season.

[nkdlunch]

yeah but they are miles behind the top 4

the only team I think the Spurs could compete with is Miami. IF Tiago + Dice fullfill expectations. Duncan, Blair, Tiago, Dice would kill any Miami frontline

teams that would rape us are Boston, Lakers, Magic

[alchemist]

after LA/MIA it's a toss up

[DesignatedT]

West is wide open. Lakers are going to take a big step back this year IMO and all the rest of the teams are pretty even. We could finish 1 or we could finish 7 again but IMO closer to the top. Having Boston,Orlando and Miami in the east is very nice since I view those 3 teams as the best in the NBA next season.

[Rummpd]

after LA/MIA it's a toss up


Correction after LAL it is a toss up - the Heat look pathetic without either James or Wade on the floor despite one good stretch last night. That team has no shown no depth as of yet.

[nkdlunch]

Correction after LAL it is a toss up - the Heat look pathetic without either James or Wade on the floor despite one good stretch last night. LAL should be the strong favorite period.

r u serious?

any team looks pathetic without their top 2 players, plus, it's preseason

[jjktkk]

Correction after LAL it is a toss up - the Heat look pathetic without either James or Wade on the floor despite one good stretch last night. That team has no shown no depth as of yet.

I highly doubt you will see both Wade and James off the floor at the same time, during the regular season.

[Rummpd]

Granted but you would think the others on the team would be trying to establish themselves and so far they have not shown much. Not discounting the Heat but they need to prove they are a full team, not just two superstars + Bosh however you rate him.

Below is part of a great articelhttp://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/post/_/id/20054/the-heats-old-slow-bench on this issue:


Pat Riley and his staff get an A+ for how they handled the offseason. They got the big things so right that it almost didn't matter how they handled the little things.

However ... Let's be clear. Not all those little things went perfectly. If they gave separate grades for signing role players, the Heat staff would get a D for that.

If for some reason this team does not work out, if there are not rings for everybody in the years to come, it's worth noting that Riley and company had countless options in filling out this roster. They could have scoured Europe and the D-League. They could have coaxed all kinds of players to play alongside these stars. They could have used their vast scouting apparatus to uncover some gem.

The opportunity was huge. Instead, they are left almost entirely without young, developing players, and with a major shortage of bench athleticism and speed. With hardworking veteran leadership they have a great environment to get the best out of impressionable young athletes -- yet there are hardly any of those guys in Heat camp. With unbelievable quickness and size from the perimeter stars, the Heat has the chance be the the fastest team in NBA history -- but not with brittle aging athletes like Zydrunas Ilgauskas, Juwan Howard or James Jones on the floor.

Imagine if an executive with less juice -- say Billy King in New Jersey -- had filled the bench with the crusty half-dozen of Jamaal Magloire, Carlos Arroyo, Ilgauskas, Howard, Jones, and Eddie House (while drafting Dexter Pittman, Jarvis Varnado and Da'Sean Butler).

If someone besides Riley-on-a-hot streak had done that, they would have said indecent things about him on talk radio for three weeks, and he's have been left fighting to keep his job to the end of preseason.

When is the last time any one of those players had a great game, or even a decent season?

[HarlemHeat37]

Orlando is not a legitimate title contender. They never were. People overrate them way too much. Dwight + 4 jump shooters will once again fail in the playoffs, especially considering Dwight still has no post game. Lewis, Cater, and Nelson = garbage last season.

I don't consider them to be a legitimate threat right now either, but they're still currently a tier above the Spurs..

[DeadlyDynasty]

West is wide open. Lakers are going to take a big step back this year IMO and all the rest of the teams are pretty even. We could finish 1 or we could finish 7 again but IMO closer to the top. Having Boston,Orlando and Miami in the east is very nice since I view those 3 teams as the best in the NBA next season.

http://www.funnypictureblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/NotSureIfSerious.jpg

[HarlemHeat37]

The Heat have only played 2 serious games so far(games where Lebron played 15 minutes or more, pretty much), and they dominated Detroit, and beat a very hyped OKC team, despite their 2nd best player not even playing(a top 3 player in the NBA, too)..

If you're basing it on preseason games, then you would have to take points off the Lakers, since they look terrible so far..basing anything on preseason games is stupid..

[DeadlyDynasty]

I agree with the Spurs being a Top 5 team (health permitting), but they aren't true contenders just yet...

1. Lakers
2. Celtics
3. Heat
4. Magic
5. Spurs

[HarlemHeat37]

Putting the Celtics above the Heat is just silly..they only have 1 serious advantage over Miami(defense in the paint), and that advantage completely depends on Perkins' health, which is far from a given at this point..

Boston is probably the most overrated team in the NBA right now..if they make the Finals, I'll never post here again..

[ohmwrecker]

I agree with the Spurs being a Top 5 team (health permitting), but they aren't true contenders just yet...

1. Lakers
2. Celtics
3. Heat
4. Magic
5. Spurs

I came up with the same exact list a couple of months ago and got miles of shit for it . . . I look like a goddamn clairvoyant right about now.

[ohmwrecker]

I don't consider them to be a legitimate threat right now either, but they're still currently a tier above the Spurs..

Ridiculous. Why? Because they have a one-dimensional (although admittedly dominant) center, old, choking VC, Lewis, Nelson and an unimpressive bench? The Magic are good, but they aren't THAT much better than the Spurs. One could argue that the Spurs' championship pedigree puts them slightly above the Magic.


Putting the Celtics above the Heat is just silly..they only have 1 serious advantage over Miami(defense in the paint), and that advantage completely depends on Perkins' health, which is far from a given at this point..

Silly? Aside from the fact that the Cs are the defending EC champs and the Heat haven't done shit yet?


Boston is probably the most overrated team in the NBA right now..if they make the Finals, I'll never post here again..

Go Celtics!

[DeadlyDynasty]

Putting the Celtics above the Heat is just silly..they only have 1 serious advantage over Miami(defense in the paint), and that advantage completely depends on Perkins' health, which is far from a given at this point..

Boston is probably the most overrated team in the NBA right now..if they make the Finals, I'll never post here again..

The list is subject to change throughout the year (no shit), but to put Miami ahead of Boston right now is pure ignorance. Miami hasn't proven a damn thing yet, and as Ohm said they are the defending EC champs. Besides having a MASSIVE ADVANTAGE in the paint (where I'm pretty sure it matters in the playoffs last I checked), the celtics bench is better and Rondo>>>>>>>whatever POS the Heat play at PG

[z0sa]

Too many unknowns for too many teams. Putting LA at a (mostly) undisputed #1 is all I can do.

[ALVAREZ6]

yeah but they are miles behind the top 4

the only team I think the Spurs could compete with is Miami. IF Tiago + Dice fullfill expectations. Duncan, Blair, Tiago, Dice would kill any Miami frontline

teams that would rape us are Boston, Lakers, Magic

Incorrect.


Orlando is not a legitimate title contender. They never were. People overrate them way too much. Dwight + 4 jump shooters will once again fail in the playoffs, especially considering Dwight still has no post game. Lewis, Cater, and Nelson = garbage last season.

Correct.


Orlando is TERRIBLE compared to what they've been hyped to be the past year. They are a good team but they won't ever win a championship, they're missing a lot. They just ran through 2 overrated teams in the playoffs, stumbled to the floor when they hit a decent playoff opponent.

I think the Spurs can definitely beat the Magic, and definitely compete with Boston. I honestly think the Lakers were the only other team other than the one that ended our run last season that could beat the Spurs. Of course, this is a new year, you have older Spurs and Celts but a meatier Boston team, and at least Rondo is a young star they have that's improving. And now the Miami show as well, so it's a different story.

But back to the Magic.... I completely disagree, of all the teams that are regularly considered contenders by media and popular opinion, I think they are the ones on a completely different (lower) level in playoff scenario. Any of the others would stomp them.

[ALVAREZ6]

Jesus Christ people do you guys watch and understand basketball?

LOL Orlando is NOT a good team!!!! OK fine they're a great team during the regular season in their weaker conference overall, at least definitely last year, and when the games don't matter. They cannot beat the Celts, Lakers, Spurs, or Heat in the playoffs. Not even close.

[z0sa]

Carter missing those free throws cemented his status as career underachieving loser.

[Trill Clinton]

The Magic are built for the regular season and that's pretty much it. When the playoffs come around they get owned because only one player on their team can play defense.

Said player also struggles on the offensive end and he is their marquee player. Until Howard can develop a consistent low post game and the team as a whole learns the concept of team defense, this team will not advance to the finals.

[z0sa]

The Magic are built for the regular season and that's pretty much it. When the playoffs come around they get owned because only one player on their team can play defense.

Said player also struggles on the offensive end and he is their marquee player. Until Howard can develop a consistent low post game and learn the concept of team defense, this team will not advance to the finals.

They already have, but your point stands. I realize it wasn't the same team, but a strong improvement to Howard and less jumpshooting from carter and Nelson could make this team a bonafide contender.

Lots of questions, few answers for this season thus far.

[Trill Clinton]

They already have, but your point stands.

Oh shit I forgot...they got served too.

[ALVAREZ6]

The Magic are built for the regular season and that's pretty much it. When the playoffs come around they get owned because only one player on their team can play defense.

Said player also struggles on the offensive end and he is their marquee player. Until Howard can develop a consistent low post game and the team as a whole learns the concept of team defense, this team will not advance to the finals.

And said player also ends up in foul trouble every other game...can't control his flying elbows and his bitch as whining.

[ALVAREZ6]

What's certain is they won't be reaching the finals again. I guarantee it.

Not within the next 3 years anyway.

[HarlemHeat37]

All this talk about the East is irrelevant anyways..there's one team that stands in front of the Spurs, and while they're on the decline, the Spurs still don't match up too well against them..

[ALVAREZ6]

All this talk about the East is irrelevant anyways..there's one team that stands in front of the Spurs, and while they're on the decline, the Spurs still don't match up too well against them..

:tu

It is all that matters, and both teams are on the decline, however one team is declining from a much higher point.

[crc21209]

West is wide open. Lakers are going to take a big step back this year IMO and all the rest of the teams are pretty even. We could finish 1 or we could finish 7 again but IMO closer to the top. Having Boston,Orlando and Miami in the east is very nice since I view those 3 teams as the best in the NBA next season.

This. The dogfight has now switched over to the East with Boston, Miami, and Orlando as 3 of the top 5 teams in the league. In the West, after the Lakers, its WIDE open:

1. The Spurs, even though they are aging- you know are going to be there when it is all said and done with the core of Tim, Tony, and Manu.

2. The Mavs, always good in the regular season will be there as well but no one knows how they will end up doing in the post-season like always.

3. No one has a clue what the Suns are going to look like with no Amare and Warrick taking his place. Also with the additions of Hedo and Childress, that team is looking at getting dominated in the paint.

4. The Nuggets are also there, but lets face it they are going to be dealing with Carmelo drama the entire season until they trade him, and then once they do, who knows what they'll look like?

5. The trendy up and coming team in the West is the OKC Thunder, but other than adding Daequan Cook and Morris Peterson, they really didnt change their team. I still think the weak link to their team is Jeff Green- who is an on again, off again type of player. Last year's post-season debut may help them in the long run, but I still believe they are a piece or two from truly contending. Another thing to look out for is that now teams will be gunning for them after the year they had last season.

6. The Rockets are team with a big question mark as well. How long will Yao last? They are always in the thick of things as well, but not enough for me to consider them a "title contender."

7. The Blazers were the OKC Thunder of a year or 2 ago, expected to take that step to the next level- and then Oden got hurt, and hurt, and hurt some more. Oden wasnt the only one hit by injuries, as Roy, Pryzbilla, and Batum also went down last year. They are a good team when healthy, but being healthy is the true problem for them.

8. The Jazz are always going to be a pretty good team under Jerry Sloan. They have a top 5 PG in the game in Deron Williams and have added Al Jefferson after losing out on Boozer. Question is, can Jefferson provide what Boozer brought to the pick n' roll game with Williams?

[DPG21920]

What is the logic behind saying the Lakers will take a step back?

[DPG21920]

I came up with the same exact list a couple of months ago and got miles of shit for it . . . I look like a goddamn clairvoyant right about now.

No one is saying your list was wrong (although many teams could be argued for the 5th spot).

What everyone was arguing was your interpretation of the list. Just because a team is arguably the 5th best in the league does not make them a legit contender.

Are the Spurs contenders? Yes, but they are fringe at best. Are the Spurs arguably the 5th best team in the league? Yes, but at this point, logic and recent history tells us that they are pretty damn far behind those in front of them for the most part. So being the 5th best team (arguably) means nothing in and of itself.

Lets put it this way: The gap between the Spurs and teams above them (excluding Orlando imo who is better, but not miles better) is much, much larger than the gap between the Spurs and the teams arguably below them.

[Death In June]

Pop use his players strengths? Nah, man. The system is infallible. There's a genius to using Rodger Mason as a PG, RJ as a power forward, and Anderson, former scoring champion, a defensive specialist and the next Bruce Bowen.

[ohmwrecker]

No one is saying your list was wrong (although many teams could be argued for the 5th spot).

What everyone was arguing was your interpretation of the list. Just because a team is arguably the 5th best in the league does not make them a legit contender.

Are the Spurs contenders? Yes, but they are fringe at best. Are the Spurs arguably the 5th best team in the league? Yes, but at this point, logic and recent history tells us that they are pretty damn far behind those in front of them for the most part. So being the 5th best team (arguably) means nothing in and of itself.

Lets put it this way: The gap between the Spurs and teams above them (excluding Orlando imo who is better, but not miles better) is much, much larger than the gap between the Spurs and the teams arguably below them.

A simple apology would suffice. Many teams? Like who? Dallas? OKC? Denver? Putting any of those teams in the 5 spot is more of a stretch than the Spurs, in my opinion.
I don't think you are interpreting "the list" correctly. I'm not saying it's an automatic lock or that the Spurs will have the fifth best record or that they won't have to have a little good fortune. I'm saying that of all the teams in the league that are built to win a championship. That have the potential, tools, experience and intangibles to win a championship, the Spurs are right in the top 5. Easy. I don't see how this is even an argument.
I think most of us can agree that we saw two different Spurs teams in the playoffs last season. The Spurs that we saw in the Mavericks series was an energized, hungry squad that looked pretty damn dangerous. The Suns series showed us a polar opposite. A banged up, old, slow and defeated team. The round 1 Spurs are definitely a contender. The round 2 Spurs, obviously, are not.
The big question is will the Spurs be the team that beat the Mavs or the team that got "skunked" by the Suns. Will they be better or worse? There are a lot of factors that will contribute to that answer and we all know what those questions are, but all teams have questions and doubts to overcome even the Lakers, definitely the Heat, absolutely the Celtics and Magic. The Spurs are not the only team reliant on chemistry, health, luck and being hot at the right time. Everybody has to play that game.

[Jelloisjigglin]

What is the logic behind saying the Lakers will take a step back?

He's just hoping they take a step back. lol

[DPG21920]

:lol An apology for what?

[DAF86]

What is the logic behind saying the Lakers will take a step back?

Kobe's old and injured. unconscious relaxation after going back to back.

[DAF86]

Remember how excited we were at this point of the season last year? Why aren't we at least equally excited right now? We have a better team than last season.

[dunkman]

With everyone healthy:

1. Celtics 35% 2010-2011 championship probability
2. Lakers 30%
3. Heat 20%
4. Spurs 15%
5. Magic 0%

[ALVAREZ6]

Remember how excited we were at this point of the season last year? Why aren't we at least equally excited right now? We have a better team than last season.

Because the Lakers are still the dominant force in the West that the Spurs have to take out if they want to even reach the finals, and if the Heat end up molding well and playing well together, they're gonna be a force. It's not just the big 3 (lol, a big 3 with arguably 2 of the top 4 players in the league, plus a really good big), but they have a pretty nice set of pieces around them. It's not the best bench and role players, but in my opinion better than average, and when you have better than average combined with Lebron, Wade, and Bosh...I just think they'll be too good to stop if they develop decently. And they have all 82 regular season games to do that, and of course their first round of playoff action is guaranteed to be a breeze as they'll likely be a 1 or 2 seed.


But having said that, I'm still exciting for this season, I always look forward to being able to watch the Spurs again, and I just want them to prove people wrong. If they stay healthy I hope they can go far into the playoffs and it's no stretch to say they will. But, as always, way too many factors now to really predict what will happen.

[benefactor]

HH is right...unless the Spurs find a legit perimeter defender or one of the pool of prospects miraculously turns into one, they are not contenders.

[ALVAREZ6]

With everyone healthy:

1. Celtics 35% 2010-2011 championship probability
2. Lakers 30%
3. Heat 20%
4. Spurs 15%
5. Magic 0%

I have no idea what my percentages are but I'd rank Celtics at 3, behind the Lakers and Heat. Definitely behind the Lakers, since 3 of their 4 most important players are very old now. And like I've said, I think the Heat are gonna be motivated and hungry to get what they all want. I can't imagine a motivated Wade, Lebron, and Bosh failing...but of course the popular projection is not always what happens.

1. Lakers-Heat (I simply can't decide who I think has better chances, I'd consider the difference marginal, and not sure which way at this point)
3. Celtics
4. Spurs


And the list ends there for me because the Magic along with every other team in the league certainly don't stand a chance.

[TD 21]

The Magic are coming off an NBA Finals appearance + a ECF loss to a team that was 1 game away from being the NBA champions..the Spurs are coming off a 1st round exit and a 2nd round sweep to a Suns team that had no business being in the WCF..

They have the best player of both teams(Howard), the best defender(Howard), better overall defense, better shooters, better perimeter defenders, a better bench..

The Spurs only advantage is their experience(which is overplayed) and individual matchups(meaning Duncan isn't really far off from Howard, and Gino/Parker are better than Carter/Nelson)..however, the Magic team is currently built much better than the current Spurs team..

While I don't believe Orlando will legitimately compete for a title(due to making Carter a 2nd option at this point and his career, and having to rely on Rashard Lewis for anything), they are clearly favored over the Spurs at this point..a lot of Spurs fans seem to be setting themselves up for disappointment..while our team has improved on paper, you have to realize that this is a team coming off a 2nd round sweep to a Suns team that really wasn't that great..

The Suns may not have been all that great, but they were playing perilously close to that level at the time. If not for the Lakers getting lucky at the end of game 5, the Suns may have ended up in the Finals (personally, I still think the Lakers would have won the series though).

But as you surely know, basketball, more than any other sport, is a game of match-ups. If you paid close attention to the season series between the Spurs-Lakers and Spurs-Suns last season, you'll know that it was evident that the Spurs matched up better and played better against the Lakers than the Suns. I'm not saying they'd have beaten the Lakers in a series, but I think they could have fared better against them than they did the Suns.

Even if they wouldn't have, it's mostly irrelevant. How the Spurs finished last season has little bearing on this season. The '09 Suns missed the playoffs. The '10 Suns, with Frye being their only notable addition, made it to game six of the Conference Finals. The '09 Nuggets were swept in the 1st round by the Lakers. The '10 Nuggets made it to game six of the Conference Finals against the Lakers. Granted, they added Billups and subtracted Iverson, but still. I have a hard time believing Billups alone elevated them to that extent.

I get that the Spurs have to prove it, but they shouldn't be easily dismissed because of how they ended last season or because the consensus in the media is they're not contenders.

Other than mobility, the main thing Howard has over Duncan is durability, which makes him more valuable over a long season. In a short series, so long as the Spurs haven't worn him to a nub by then, Duncan is still good enough to at least play Howard to a virtual draw. Even if you don't believe that, the Spurs would still have three of the four best players in the series and Howard isn't James, so it's not like they'd have the best player by a wide margin. Speaking of James, look how that worked out for the Cavs when they ran into the Celtics last season.

The Magic are favored by the media and people who go along with the consensus. If the two teams were to met in the Finals and were both healthy, I wouldn't even consider it an upset if the Spurs won.

Setting themselves up for disappointment? They have one glaring hole and it's not like it's unattainable. For sure, it won't be easy to acquire (without giving him a key piece, at least), but we're not talking about trying to acquire a top fifteen player, either.

[ogait]

Orlando is being overrated. Just like in 2009 it will take something special like an injury to a key player for them to go past Boston or Miami witch are the real contenders in the east.

I do believe the West is much more open than the East and I don't even thing the Lakers will clinch the number one seed as easily as they did the past seasons but if healthy they will turn it on in the play-offs and are the favourites.

So yeah there are 3 real contenders (Miami, Boston, LA), everyone else is far behind at this point even the Spurs.

[ALVAREZ6]

LOL at even considering Dwight Howard's some sort of "star power" for these playoff scenarios... he's a star in the NBA but he's not the type of dominant force any legitimate contender should worry extensively about. He's just a very athletic big. That's it. He gets great numbers, all due to his athleticism and really doesn't affect a game or series in the way that a true star does.

So, to elaborate, he's just a very athletic big, with no offensive game, terrible FT shooter, and constantly in foul trouble. The Spurs never have problems scoring on the Magic, no one on that team can guard Manu. With a guy like Tim Duncan, you don't have to worry about Howard really, since Duncan, the big fundamental, understands defense in and out. So he knows how to position on players, and that's all Dwight has to establish himself on offense...getting in position, spinning off a noob big man defender and catching alley-oop passes for dunks. That may happen once or thrice a game, who cares.


You may have to prepare to face Kobe Bryant, Pau Gasol, Dirk Nowitzki, etc. But LOL Dwight Howard should be the least of anyone's concerns when speaking about the "stars" in the NBA.

[ezau]

I agree with the Spurs being a Top 5 team (health permitting), but they aren't true contenders just yet...

1. Lakers
2. Celtics
3. Heat
4. Magic
5. Spurs

I don't think the Spurs should be ranked that high. I mean I need to see how Jefferson and Splitter will pan out before I can be convinced. Right now, the Spurs are a very good team, but definitely not yet in the league of the Heat and Lakers.

I just want the Spurs to go for the kill as early as possible because it has become very difficult to win on the road in the playoffs.

At the end of day, I want the BIG THREE to be healthy and ready when playoff time comes. :toast And oh, if Blair becomes a double-double threat every game, that would be fucking amazing:flag:

[ElNono]

No love for OKC?
I think their athleticism could give us trouble, and we have nothing to throw at Durant. Thoughts?

[ezau]

No love for OKC?
I think their athleticism could give us trouble, and we have nothing to throw at Durant. Thoughts?

We have Dick Jefferson to shut down Durant, oh wait.... :depressed

[DPG21920]

Teams clearly above Spurs: LA, MIA, BOS, ORL (although I don't feel they are way above).

Spurs are on the same level (arguably) as all of these teams: OKC, CHI, UTA, DAL, POR.

[ezau]

LOL at even considering Dwight Howard's some sort of "star power" for these playoff scenarios... he's a star in the NBA but he's not the type of dominant force any legitimate contender should worry extensively about. He's just a very athletic big. That's it. He gets great numbers, all due to his athleticism and really doesn't affect a game or series in the way that a true star does.

So, to elaborate, he's just a very athletic big, with no offensive game, terrible FT shooter, and constantly in foul trouble. The Spurs never have problems scoring on the Magic, no one on that team can guard Manu. With a guy like Tim Duncan, you don't have to worry about Howard really, since Duncan, the big fundamental, understands defense in and out. So he knows how to position on players, and that's all Dwight has to establish himself on offense...getting in position, spinning off a noob big man defender and catching alley-oop passes for dunks. That may happen once or thrice a game, who cares.


You may have to prepare to face Kobe Bryant, Pau Gasol, Dirk Nowitzki, etc. But LOL Dwight Howard should be the least of anyone's concerns when speaking about the "stars" in the NBA.

I agree with D12 having almost zero offense, but the dude is a very good defender. I mean, people tend to forget that he's a very good defensive anchor.

[chasky]

Teams clearly above Spurs: LA, MIA, BOS, ORL (although I don't feel they are way above).

Spurs are on the same level (arguably) as all of these teams: OKC, CHI, UTA, DAL, POR.

Maybe Houston and Milwaukee are in the second group.

[DPG21920]

I can't put MIL there with Bogut being a huge question mark with regards to his health. Houston is possible, but I don't personally put them there.

[ALVAREZ6]

I agree with D12 having almost zero offense, but the dude is a very good defender. I mean, people tend to forget that he's a very good defensive anchor.

Doesn't matter, he can only defend one player at any time, and with Duncan, Parker, and Ginobili (and hopefully even if RJ attacks the basket more this season), he will foul out every game, or be forced to sit for longer periods than the Magic would like.

[ALVAREZ6]

Teams clearly above Spurs: LA, MIA, BOS, ORL (although I don't feel they are way above).

Spurs are on the same level (arguably) as all of these teams: OKC, CHI, UTA, DAL, POR.

Come on man how can you say Orlando is clearly above the Spurs?

They're a regular season team, going nowhere in playoffs. The Spurs would have beaten them last year in a 7 game series.


You have to consider that the Spurs don't care about the regular season...they limit the big 3's playing time, and they all had some time off due to injuries last year.

[DJ Mbenga]

http://nba-point-forward.si.com/2010/10/13/key-questions-for-the-five-title-contenders/#

5. SAN ANTONIO SPURS

The obvious question: Can the old guys still carry the load for a championship team?

There’s not much original to say here. Tim Duncan and Manu Ginobili are into their mid-30s, and both of them — along with Tony Parker – battled various injuries last season. Again, we can only wait and watch.

The meatier question: Do the Spurs need to overhaul their formula?

The Spurs have won the same way for a decade: with low-risk basketball. On offense, they want one good shot. That means no turnovers and (mostly) no crashing the offensive glass for fear of giving up a transition bucket on the other end. On defense, they want to force you into taking one bad shot. They don’t gamble for steals, and they don’t give you second chances.

The Spurs stretched that model to its breaking point two years ago, when they ranked last in offensive rebounding, drawing fouls on offense and forcing turnovers on defense. They topped the league in the opposite categories — defensive rebounding, protecting the ball and avoiding fouls. It was low-risk hoops, as if implemented by a computer system.

The team made small movements away from those extremes last season, and they may have to continue on that path if they want to challenge the Lakers and the East’s elite. Their personnel demands it. DeJuan Blair pushed the Spurs above the league average in offensive rebounding last season for the first time since 2004-05, when they were right at the league average mark. Blair and George Hill can both swipe the ball on defense, and Hill is a demon of a finisher on the break. Richard Jefferson, once a slasher (I swear!), attempted a career-low 4.1 free throws per 36 minutes last season; the Spurs need that number to jump back up, or their four-year, $38.9 million commitment to Jefferson will be a sunk cost. Parker and Ginobili, if healthy, should get to the line more.


Nice article and right on the money that you cannot discount the Spur's as true title contenders!

:lol

[Russ]

Teams clearly above Spurs: LA, MIA, BOS, ORL (although I don't feel they are way above).

Spurs are on the same level (arguably) as all of these teams: OKC, CHI, UTA, DAL, POR.

I'm sorry but after that analysis, the Tribe has spoken. Please return your card. :lol

TXlUS5-ag_g

[ohmwrecker]

:lol An apology for what?

I just threw that in there for a laugh. I guess it worked.


Teams clearly above Spurs: LA, MIA, BOS, ORL (although I don't feel they are way above).

Spurs are on the same level (arguably) as all of these teams: OKC, CHI, UTA, DAL, POR.

The only team I am willing to place clearly above the Spurs is LA.
Like I said, Miami are paper contenders at this point. Yes, they will probably be very good, but I have a problem bringing out the "anointing oils" until they show that they can gel and play as a team.
The Spurs, at full strength, are as good as Boston and Orlando. I'll give the Cs extra credit for being EC champs.
OKC is a young and dangerous team and they might make the step into "legit contender" this season, but not as it stands presently.
The Bulls and Jazz have major components to integrate this season, but it still remains to be seen whether or not Boozer or Jefferson,respectively, are going to make those two teams much better than they were at season's end. Portland is just loaded with talent, but they have to be the most doomed franchise in NBA history. I am not a believer.
Here's the thing with Dallas, I think that the Spurs stomping of the Mavs in the first round last year is diminished by a lot of people because of how poorly the Spurs performed in the second round. Dallas did not get absolutely better this off season. They are going to play well and win a lot of games, but their "issues" remain the same.
I think the Spurs improved, maybe just marginally, but improved nonetheless. The major factor is that the Spurs will have the advantage of having the big 3 healthy to start the season. This is huge and I think it's being undervalued. Getting off to a strong start would make an enormous difference in how the Spurs view their chances. The Spurs struggles with chemistry, defining roles and injuries wore on the team physically and mentally. An attitude shift would be extremely advantageous to a team who has championship experience. It could be the difference that will keep the Spurs from having another meltdown in the playoffs.
It all remains to be seen, but there is no reason to put so much separation between any of the top teams this early in the season.

[DPG21920]

I'm sorry but after that analysis, the Tribe has spoken. Please return your card. :lol

TXlUS5-ag_g

Solid take.

[nkdlunch]

Jesus Christ people do you guys watch and understand basketball?

LOL Orlando is NOT a good team!!!! OK fine they're a great team during the regular season in their weaker conference overall, at least definitely last year, and when the games don't matter. They cannot beat the Celts, Lakers, Spurs, or Heat in the playoffs. Not even close.

:rolleyes

Orlando is a good team and way better than the Phoenix team that raped the Spurs last year.

Nobody is saying Orlando is a favorite but if the Spurs are "contenders", Orlando sure damn well is too. They are a better team than the Spurs as of right now. Wake up and face reality.

[Supergirl]

I think it's a pretty spot on article. I don't think any of those teams are without question marks. The Lakers are the obvious favorites still, since they're the defending champs and they were so so good last year, defensively as well as offensively. But they are getting old and battling injuries.

Heat are already overrated and could easily be the NBA's biggest bust since the so called "Dream Team" of the Lakers when they got Karl Malone. Magic are soft, and the Celtics are old. Spurs are right there with all those teams, but with just as many questions.

[Supergirl]

Bulls and OKC would be next to add to the list, IMO.

[nkdlunch]

Bulls and OKC would be next to add to the list, IMO.

Of course many teams can join the list as season goes along.

But right now IMO only 3 "true" title contenders: Lakers, Boston, Heat. because noone would be surprised if any of those 3 wins it all.

Next tier would be Orlando, Spurs. Because many ppl would be surprised if they reach the finals.

[Rick Von Braun]

I can't put MIL there with Bogut being a huge question mark with regards to his health. Houston is possible, but I don't personally put them there.
But by the same token, you did put Chicago in the list with Boozer being an equal question mark. If Bogut returns before Boozer, MIL may win the Central Division by one or two games margin (around 50). It is that close!

[Russ]

Solid take.

Okay, you're back in. :lol

[phxspurfan]

:rolleyes

Orlando is a good team and way better than the Phoenix team that raped the Spurs last year.

Nobody is saying Orlando is a favorite but if the Spurs are "contenders", Orlando sure damn well is too. They are a better team than the Spurs as of right now. Wake up and face reality.

I tend to disagree with the Orlando hype. They are reliant on a top performer who has zero reliable offense (and no go-to moves besides being athletic). They are not clutch and have no clutch players besides a (last year) hobbled mighty mouse. THeir best player, D12, can be sent to the line and nullified, and also commits the stupidest fouls. Their second-best player, Lewis, is overpaid for the type of player he is at this point in his career. He is also a defensive liability. They can shoot the ball well thanks to Lewis and some of their role players, but guys like Reddick can be d'ed up by our personnel (Hill). And to top it all, they have issues respecting their coach.

On the other hand, the Suns (like the Spurs to Dallas last year) were our worst matchup. They hated us to the point of crying after their game 1 win. There's something to say for that kind of emotional energy added onto a surprising level of talent and playoff experienced vets like Amare (who is no longer there...) and Nash (who is yet another year into his 50s last I checked). The Suns wanted to beat us, chop us up and feed us to their children. But if they played Dallas that same second round last year, I guarantee they would have lost.

[ALVAREZ6]

They are a better team than the Spurs as of right now. Wake up and face reality.

I think you should.


Orlando cares about the regular season, the Spurs clearly don't. They care about having their aging stars ready to play in the playoffs, and you know this of course.

Spurs dominate Magic in the playoffs, however that scenario is essentially impossible. The Spurs are better; way better coach, clutch players, and their best player isn't solely an athlete that has zero offensive game. The contrary, the big 3 can all create offense for themselves.




If you want to use regular season success as a metric of how good a team is, then.... nevermind, just don't, because it's stupid. Because by judging teams on how they do in the regular season, then the Atlanta Hawks, the Denver Nuggets, and the Dallas Mavericks were all better teams than the Spurs last season. Clearly we saw in the first round that the latter was not true, the Spurs won in 6.


Atlanta? LOL




The Magic are overrated. Spurs would spank. Manu would do what he wants against them.

[ALVAREZ6]

The Spurs played Orlando twice last season.

They won one, and lost one, but in the loss, Duncan had a terrible game (1 for 10 FGs, 5 points), and Parker didn't even play. So we can discard the loss.

In the win, the Spurs won 112-100, Manu torched for 43, and Dwight fouled out.


So as this is the only sample we have of both teams, and sure is a small one, considering this as well, Spurs>Magic



IDK how you can even argue it.

[ohmwrecker]

:rolleyesOrlando is a good team and way better than the Phoenix team that raped the Spurs last year.

I don't understand this reasoning. Team A beat Team B and Team C beat Team A. So, naturally, Team C will beat Team B?

It doesn't work that way, cowboy. It's all about match-ups. The Spurs match-up much more evenly with the Magic. They play a similar style.
The Suns had the personnel to out match the Spurs. They play a more up tempo style that the Spurs obviously don't do well against. Conversely, The Spurs can diminish Orlando's strengths more effectively than Phoenix. The Suns series is irrelevant when it comes to how the Spurs and Magic match up.

By the way, the Suns and Spurs both split their games with the Magic last season.

[ohmwrecker]

Actually, the Spurs/Suns series is irrelevant to a lot of things as they relate to this season. I wish people would stop relying on it so heavily in arguments. It's a crutch at this point. I don't think the Spurs are so weak mentally that the outcome of that series will have any impact on this season whatsoever.

[objective]

Teams clearly above Spurs: LA, MIA, BOS, ORL (although I don't feel they are way above).

Spurs are on the same level (arguably) as all of these teams: OKC, CHI, UTA, DAL, POR.

seems reasonable to me as far as teams above SA. I'm not too crazy about Chicago aka Utah-East.


But by the same token, you did put Chicago in the list with Boozer being an equal question mark. If Bogut returns before Boozer, MIL may win the Central Division by one or two games margin (around 50). It is that close!

fwiw, Boozer only broke the pinky knuckle.

Bogut has pubicly stated to the media this pre-season that he doesn't expect to be to 100% at any point of the 10-11 season, and that he will have to wear protective gear and be in pain all season.

I still like MIL better than Chicago, but it seems likely that the Bulls will have a 100% Boozer for more games than MIL will have a 100% Bogut (which will be zero games).

[Rummpd]

I just threw that in there for a laugh. I guess it worked.



The only team I am willing to place clearly above the Spurs is LA.
Like I said, Miami are paper contenders at this point. Yes, they will probably be very good, but I have a problem bringing out the "anointing oils" until they show that they can gel and play as a team.
The Spurs, at full strength, are as good as Boston and Orlando. I'll give the Cs extra credit for being EC champs.
OKC is a young and dangerous team and they might make the step into "legit contender" this season, but not as it stands presently.
The Bulls and Jazz have major components to integrate this season, but it still remains to be seen whether or not Boozer or Jefferson,respectively, are going to make those two teams much better than they were at season's end. Portland is just loaded with talent, but they have to be the most doomed franchise in NBA history. I am not a believer.
Here's the thing with Dallas, I think that the Spurs stomping of the Mavs in the first round last year is diminished by a lot of people because of how poorly the Spurs performed in the second round. Dallas did not get absolutely better this off season. They are going to play well and win a lot of games, but their "issues" remain the same.
I think the Spurs improved, maybe just marginally, but improved nonetheless. The major factor is that the Spurs will have the advantage of having the big 3 healthy to start the season. This is huge and I think it's being undervalued. Getting off to a strong start would make an enormous difference in how the Spurs view their chances. The Spurs struggles with chemistry, defining roles and injuries wore on the team physically and mentally. An attitude shift would be extremely advantageous to a team who has championship experience. It could be the difference that will keep the Spurs from having another meltdown in the playoffs.
It all remains to be seen, but there is no reason to put so much separation between any of the top teams this early in the season.



Nice analysis!:toast