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RandomGuy
02-25-2011, 03:46 PM
Hidden Pension Fiasco May Foment Another $1 Trillion Bailout

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=alwTE0Z5.1EA

LONG article. Here are the highlights from this 2009 article:


Public pension funds across the U.S. are hiding the size of a crisis that’s been looming for years. Retirement plans play accounting games with numbers, giving the illusion that the funds are healthy.

The paper alchemy gives governors and legislators the easy choice to contribute too little or nothing to the funds, year after year.

30 Percent Shortfall

The misleading numbers posted by retirement fund administrators help mask this reality: Public pensions in the U.S. had total liabilities of $2.9 trillion as of Dec. 16, according to the Center for Retirement Research at Boston College. Their total assets are about 30 percent less than that, at $2 trillion.

With stock market losses this year, public pensions in the U.S. are now underfunded by more than $1 trillion.

That lack of funds explains why dozens of retirement plans in the U.S. have issued more than $50 billion in pension obligation bonds during the past 25 years -- more than half of them since 1997 -- public records show.

The quick fix for pension funds becomes a future albatross for taxpayers.

...

By law, states must guarantee public pension fund debts.

“What appears to be a riskless strategy is actually very risky,” says David Zion, director of accounting research for New York-based Credit Suisse Holdings USA Inc. “If the returns on the pension bond-financed assets don’t exceed the cost of servicing the debt, the taxpayers bear the brunt.”

With the recession that started in December 2007, cities and states are running huge deficits, which they’re closing by cutting services and firing employees. The economic downturn gives state legislatures another reason to cut back on funding pensions.

Government retirement plans nationwide don’t calculate their shortfalls based on market values of their assets and liabilities, says Orin Kramer, chairman of the New Jersey State Investment Council, which oversees that state’s pension fund.

Paper Over Losses

Fund accountants resort to a grab bag of tricks to get by. They set unrealistically high expected rates of return to reduce governments’ annual contributions. And they use smoothing techniques to paper over investment reverses so they make losing years look like winners.

Accountants do that by averaging gains and losses, usually over a five-year period -- sometimes for as long as 15 years of investment returns.

That means actual results of any one year aren’t used to calculate how much a state legislature contributes, which can delay governments catching up with losses for more than a decade.

This ruse can pass the buck to future taxpayers, who will pay for the retirement benefits of today’s government workers.

“There are accounting gimmicks in pension land which create economic fictions and which disguise the severity of the real problem,” Kramer says. “Unfortunately, pension board members don’t have much of an appetite for disclosing inconvenient truths.”

...

Actuaries consistently permit public pension funds to report artificially high expected rates of return -- most often 8 percent and as much as 8.75 percent. That’s more than the 6.9 percent billionaire investor Warren Buffett sets for his Omaha, Nebraska-based Berkshire Hathaway Inc.’s pension fund.

“Public pension promises are huge and, in many cases, funding is woefully inadequate,” Buffett wrote in his 2008 letter to shareholders. “Because the fuse on this time bomb is long, politicians flinch from inflicting tax pain, given that the problems will only become apparent long after these officials have departed.”

Determining how much expected rates of return should be isn’t complicated, says Rowe, who oversees Texas pension funds.

“Why do they choose high expected rates of return?” he says. “The only reason is to sneak through promising a lot to pensioners -- which means worrying about it later. It’s madness.”

I left out a lot.

Read it.

Be afraid.

You think people are pissed off now about debt, deficits and taxes.

You have not seen but the tip of the iceberg.

Yes, I fully agree that entitlements like Medicare have to be cut, as will Social Security.

I also know that these pension funds, both government and private corporate, will not pay near what they promise. Neither governments, nor companies have put enough money in.

If you aren't saving money now, and think your SS or pension will save you, you are well and truly fucked, if you will paron my choice anglo-saxonism.

RandomGuy
02-25-2011, 03:50 PM
Unfunded government pension liabilities are a huge problem.

They used to be a huge problem in the private sector. Because they were such a problem there, GAAP forced the private corporations to start showing the unfunded or underfunded pensions as a liability. The result was changes in pensions, as well as changes in how they were funded.

The people who were NOT forced to go along with GAAP accounting for unfunded pensions were governments.

So, is the answer to screw the government workers, or is the answer to force governments at the state and local levels to show the same sort of accounting for unfunded liabilities that private enterprise is using, so that their municipal bond offerings can be more reasonably assessed?

Both.

Government workers will have to be screwed a bit, and we will have to force governments to account for this shit properly and transparently.

Marcus Bryant
02-25-2011, 03:55 PM
Very few politicians actually want to do something about it. Though our political system is working and most politicians are reflecting the opinion of those they represent, IMO. That is, it's easy to blame the political class, but at the end of the day they trade on what sells, and that is public fiscal irresponsibility.

If the public truly found fiscal religion, the solution would happen.

boutons_deux
02-25-2011, 04:06 PM
And the status is private pension funds is OK? :)

Companies have been stealing from the pension funds and/or not contributing their full share, to fake their balance sheets, keep those executive (back dated) stock options paying off, keep investors off their under-performing backs.

The whole fucking country is fucking fraud, The American Dream only if you're completely asleep.

RandomGuy
02-25-2011, 04:12 PM
Very few politicians actually want to do something about it. Though our political system is working and most politicians are reflecting the opinion of those they represent, IMO. That is, it's easy to blame the political class, but at the end of the day they trade on what sells, and that is public fiscal irresponsibility.

If the public truly found fiscal religion, the solution would happen.

Yup.

Oddly enough, I am not as far from Yoni et al. on recognizing the problem.

Where we differ is the solution. They are virulently opposed to taxes, as if tax money somehow evaporates out of the economy. If that were really the case I would be just as opposed to tax increases.

But it isn't the case. Tax income bounces right back out into the economy, other than the intrest paid to foreign bond holders, because it is generally spent "in country".

Higher taxes do tend to slightly reduce overall growth, by curbing private investment somewhat. I do acknowledge this much.

There is a point though, at which you let problems like aging infrastructure or education fester, where a lack of public goods can be just as much of a drag on the economy.

Countries that fail to sufficiently invest in their capital, both human and otherwise, pay the price over the long term.

You have to strike a balance between the two.

I don't buy the "small government" schtick for a large developed country like the U.S. Local control and governance is good and desirable, but at some point, you bump up to "tragedy of the commons" issues that can't be solved by mere individual actions.

Corporations, being run for the benefit of a select few stockholders, aren't well suited to this.

Governments are.

I acknowledge the power of free markets to create wealth and standards of living, but I also recognize their limits. Where they leave off, government must begin.

RandomGuy
02-25-2011, 04:19 PM
And the status is private pension funds is OK? :)

Companies have been stealing from the pension funds and/or not contributing their full share, to fake their balance sheets, keep those executive (back dated) stock options paying off, keep investors off their under-performing backs.


More valid than you will likely get any of the Usual Suspects here to admit to.

The big take-away from this is that you can't rely on the government, and you can't rely on your employer. Both have every reason to fuck you over in the long run and lie to you.

We must as a country start saving more, and do so right now.

I welcome any solutions. boutons? Yoni? Anyone?

The problem is, if we start saving more right now, that means we spend less, and that will slow the economy.

IF that were to happen, both sides will start finger pointing as to why. (sighs)

CosmicCowboy
02-25-2011, 05:07 PM
I think retirement is a pretty unrealistic dream for most people. The days of retiring at 65 unless you are a government employee are pretty well over. A million dollars of savings isn't enough for the average 65 year old couple. Most baby boomers are going to work until their employer runs them off. That is gonna suck for you young ones coming out of college.

Spurminator
02-25-2011, 05:20 PM
I think retirement is a pretty unrealistic dream for most people. The days of retiring at 65 unless you are a government employee are pretty well over. A million dollars of savings isn't enough for the average 65 year old couple. Most baby boomers are going to work until their employer runs them off. That is gonna suck for you young ones coming out of college.

We should not be okay with this as a nation.

boutons_deux
02-25-2011, 05:22 PM
One of the best retirement strategies is healthy diet (NOT Standard American Diet) and lots of cardio and resistance exercise, and to quit believing BigPharma's pathogenic shit is gonna save your diseased ass.

RandomGuy
02-25-2011, 05:27 PM
I think retirement is a pretty unrealistic dream for most people. The days of retiring at 65 unless you are a government employee are pretty well over. A million dollars of savings isn't enough for the average 65 year old couple. Most baby boomers are going to work until their employer runs them off. That is gonna suck for you young ones coming out of college.

I fully, completely, 100% agree with you on this one.

My dad never really taught me anything about money or savings, because he never really had any.

He is in a tight bind and has to work at age 66 and probably will need something to bring income in for a while.

My family is living well below our means, so we can pay off the student loans from college, and will likely never really be able to improve our standard of livng much beyond what it is now, by my calculations.

If I do nothing else for my two sons, it will be to teach them about money and saving.

RandomGuy
02-25-2011, 05:30 PM
One of the best retirement strategies is healthy diet (NOT Standard American Diet) and lots of cardio and resistance exercise, and to quit believing BigPharma's pathogenic shit is gonna save your diseased ass.

It will. It will just cost you. :greedy

Medical science will quite probably be able to grow you replacement organs using your own tissue by the time I hit 65.

Whether I can afford it is another matter.

Vegatables, rice, and beans. Good for your pocketbook in more than one way.

RandomGuy
02-25-2011, 05:31 PM
you young ones coming out of college.

I'm 40, btw. "young" I guess to some. :lol

Didn't start college until after Army at age 26. Mother in law said I should go, and she was right, heh.

Grad school one class/semester is slooooooooooow.

coyotes_geek
02-25-2011, 11:16 PM
I left out a lot.

Read it.

Be afraid.

You think people are pissed off now about debt, deficits and taxes.

You have not seen but the tip of the iceberg.

Yes, I fully agree that entitlements like Medicare have to be cut, as will Social Security.

I also know that these pension funds, both government and private corporate, will not pay near what they promise. Neither governments, nor companies have put enough money in.

If you aren't saving money now, and think your SS or pension will save you, you are well and truly fucked, if you will paron my choice anglo-saxonism.

Yep. Sad, but inevitable.

boutons_deux
02-26-2011, 01:15 PM
Blame Wall Street, Not Hard Working Americans, for the Pension Funds Fiasco

in the 2008-2009 financial crisis, the losses of public funds were stupendous. 109 state funds lost $865 billion in about one year. CalPERS lost $72 billion! Now virtually all of these funds are now grossly under-funded. New Jersey and Illinois are each over $50 billion underwater.

The inappropriate investments that caused these massive pension fund losses were not an accident. The pension fund field caught the Wall Street contagion -- financial corruption. It's called "Pay to Play." The SEC saw it years ago but, controlled by anti-regulation political appointees, it did nothing. So a nationwide system of political contributions to elected officials who sit on fund boards and payoffs and kickbacks to politically well-connected "Placement Agents" to steer fund money to Wall Street became widespread. Not surprisingly, the investments obtained by "pay-to-play" kickbacks and contributions have generated horrific losses.

An investment officer of the California Public Employee Pension Fund was forced to resign -- he got an all-expense-paid trip to NYC from an investment group that got $600 million from the fund. The middle men on that deal -- two former top CalPERs officials -- got some $20 million to arrange this placement. Two other former CalPERS officials have been sued by the Attorney General for taking $50 million in placement fees to steer pension investments. CalPERs lost hundreds of millions on such investments. Alan Hevesi -- the former head of the New York State Fund -- pleaded guilty to doling out billions in that Fund's assets to favored managers in return for benefits. The SEC has finally outlawed this system of bribes and kickbacks. But too late -- the damage has already been done to the pension funds. Nationwide, public pension funds lost billions on these types of corrupt investments with Wall Street types.

. The Wall Street money managers lost it in investments acquiesced in by the pension fund trustees they had wined and dined. It's the same old story. The bankers pocket gigantic fees. The privileged few get fat. Ordinary people get run over. And now are even to be blamed -- even punished -- for a mess they did not create.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/william-s-lerach/wall-street-pension-
funds_b_828598.html?view=print

===============

Does anybody still wonder why the VRWC wants to destroy SocSec and have those $Ts gambled in the criminally rigged Wall St casino?

Wild Cobra
02-27-2011, 11:06 AM
Boutons, we have known this for years. The only think new about the story is the updated numbers.

from post 28 (http://spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=172958) in a different thread:


Have you ever looked at how much future debt there is for public employee retirement plans? Some states have really fucked up systems. My state is really starting to hurt now, but the future is looking real bleak. 8% guaranteed investment rate for PERS. Show me a 401k, 403b, etc. that does the same thing.

Who makes up the uninvested difference?

Taxpayers.

Granted, I didn't point out the same details, but most public employee systems have one or more serious failings in the retirement systems. I simply left it as "fucked up" for general usage.

boutons_deux
02-27-2011, 11:10 AM
so the nearly $T that pension funds lost to the Wall St crooks is the reason beat on unions, their pensions, and even push cities, counties, states to bankruptcy to wipe out the pension funds and unions entirely.

The problem is the criminal financial sector, NOT unions, not employees.

"we have known this for years."

When was the last time you or any right-winger mentioned how Wall St pocketed $Bs in fees and pocketed losses by the pension funds?