Duncan

[Supergirl]

Without wanting to make too much of Duncan's pisspoor performance against the Lakers on Sunday, I have to admit he's had a couple subpar games in a row in the last two weeks. Is this a slump, or a sign of him wearing down for the season? Or is he holding out some reserve for the playoffs, as he has been so good at doing throughout his career?

[honestfool84]

hopefully he's just waiting for the playoffs to begin...

[tdunk21]

hopefully he's just waiting for the playoffs to begin...

this and slump...

[Obstructed_View]

2 points twice in three games against the Lakers.

[bigFUNDAMENTAL]

he's done let's face it..

[hater]

Donecan

[Kobe_5_Duncan_4]

How could anyone in their right mind say he's saving it for the playoffs?

This is who Tim Duncan is now, in his twilight. The man's had a great career but you're kidding yourself if you think yesterday, against the league's biggest and most talented frontline he's thinking "I could play harder but I'm not gonna go all out today, I'll save it for the playoffs."

The Lakers are the biggest obstacle in his way from ever winning again. He knows that. Pop knows that and deep down every Spurs fan knows it whether or not yall wanna acknowledge it.

So yesterday, on your home court for all to see, do you really think he packed it in? I saw that stone cold face of reality plastered on his mug in the 2nd half and in my opinion it was his own confirmation of what we all knew before this season even started; He's no longer dominant player in the middle he needs to be in order for SA to beat LA.

[Supergirl]

2 points twice in three games against the Lakers.

Yeah, Lakers front line clearly gives him trouble. Though, he often has a whole other gear he kicks it into in the playoffs, and I suspect even against the Lakers we'll see some of this. Also, I suspect we'll see Pop playing with defensive rotations more.

The reality is, Duncan can't go at the Lakers front line if Manu, Tony, and the role players aren't making outside shots. And Sunday, they weren't making any of them. The reason for the first two wins against the Lakers is that that wasn't the case.

[Supergirl]

How could anyone in their right mind say he's saving it for the playoffs?

This is who Tim Duncan is now, in his twilight. The man's had a great career but you're kidding yourself if you think yesterday, against the league's biggest and most talented frontline he's thinking "I could play harder but I'm not gonna go all out today, I'll save it for the playoffs."

The Lakers are the biggest obstacle in his way from ever winning again. He knows that. Pop knows that and deep down every Spurs fan knows it whether or not yall wanna acknowledge it.

So yesterday, on your home court for all to see, do you really think he packed it in? I saw that stone cold face of reality plastered on his mug in the 2nd half and in my opinion it was his own confirmation of what we all knew before this season even started; He's no longer dominant player in the middle he needs to be in order for SA to beat LA.

LOL at the overconfidence of Lakers fans...

[midnightpulp]

How could anyone in their right mind say he's saving it for the playoffs?

This is who Tim Duncan is now, in his twilight. The man's had a great career but you're kidding yourself if you think yesterday, against the league's biggest and most talented frontline he's thinking "I could play harder but I'm not gonna go all out today, I'll save it for the playoffs."

The Lakers are the biggest obstacle in his way from ever winning again. He knows that. Pop knows that and deep down every Spurs fan knows it whether or not yall wanna acknowledge it.

So yesterday, on your home court for all to see, do you really think he packed it in? I saw that stone cold face of reality plastered on his mug in the 2nd half and in my opinion it was his own confirmation of what we all knew before this season even started; He's no longer dominant player in the middle he needs to be in order for SA to beat LA.

Regarding his career and his decline, I take solace in this:

"There really isn’t any diplomatic way to this: Tim Duncan’s playoff performances essentially run circles over Kobe Bryant’s."

http://www.warriorsworld.net/2011/02...-debate-close/

[Kobe_5_Duncan_4]

Regarding his career and his decline, I take solace in this:

"There really isn’t any diplomatic way to this: Tim Duncan’s playoff performances essentially run circles over Kobe Bryant’s."

http://www.warriorsworld.net/2011/02...-debate-close/



So Duncan's done. The Spurs season is nothing more than an illusion masked by successful 3p chucking a la the Suns but you take solace in the opinion that Duncan's playoff performances "runs circles" [around] Kobe's.

:lol:lol:lol

I take solace in the fact that Kobe can only add to his already legendary career.

[HarlemHo 37]

TBH, he isn't in a slump... IMO, the Lakers have a huge size advantage and do a good job of bodying Duncan and forcing him to pass the ball out of the low post. He really doesn't get many good looks.

[Kobe_5_Duncan_4]

LOL at the overconfidence of Lakers fans...


No one in Lakerland is conducting polls as to whether Kobe Bryant is "done."

Gain a little perspective.

[Kobe_5_Duncan_4]

Lol @ midnightpulp being able to talk about the game honestly in this thread too. Resorted to trolling about Duncan vs Kobe because he is an emotionally invested douche who also happens to be deranged.

[midnightpulp]

So Duncan's done. The Spurs season is nothing more than an illusion masked by successful 3p chucking a la the Suns but you take solace in the opinion that Duncan's playoff performances "runs circles" [around] Kobe's.

:lol:lol:lol

I take solace in the fact that Kobe can only add to his already legendary career.

But they don't chuck. Visit that thread in the NBA forum to see how I once again wrecked your ass.

[midnightpulp]

Lol @ midnightpulp being able to talk about the game honestly in this thread too. Resorted to trolling about Duncan vs Kobe because he is an emotionally invested douche who also happens to be deranged.

Cry some more. This is exactly the kind of reply I expected when I posted that article, and the reply I wanted, actually. You can't stand the fact that many people out there believe Duncan to be the better player between the two. If basketball fans don't conform to your opinion that Kobe is greater than Duncan, they're "fanboys" and "deluded."

And watching your whine about it is highly entertaining.

[jag]

Gotta love history2b. The guy doesn't even post under his old username anymore because it got shit on so much. The Spurs are so irrelevant that he creates multiple usernames on a Spurs forum.

As far as Duncan, he's obviously in decline and not just saving it for the playoffs. He's still capable of going for 20+ and 15 rebounds on any given night, but i don't think it's smart to depend on it. Duncan can still perform against good front lines (Mavs and Celtics) but Andrew Bynum has the length, athleticism and strength to take Duncan out of the game offensively. It's difficult to really judge Duncan's current ability against a healthy Bynum because Bynum has always been a tough matchup for him. He should be matching up with Gasol...but having a 6'6" center makes that impossible.

[Cessation]

In last 20 games duncan hit double digits in scoring 16 times. Obviously he has bad games once in a while. Who doesn't? Plus he doesn't need to score as much as he used to, due to the depth of the spurs. Lakers shot well, and if they were always this good, they wouldn't be fighting thunder for the 3 seed.

[2Cleva]

Nothing wrong with Duncan, he just doesn't have a matchup he can take advantage of when he plays the Lakers.

Rest of the league : 28.7 minutes per game.

13.5 PPG
9.2 RPG
2 BPG
.488 FG%

vs the Lakers (3 gms) : 28.3 minutes per game.

4 PPG
6.3 RPG
0.7 BPG
.192 FG%

[VBM]

In last 20 games duncan hit double digits in scoring 16 times.

The sad thing is this is meant to be a positive argument for Duncan. Making 5 shots a game shouldn't be that hard for Timmy.

[Old School 44]

The last few years, there's always talk about reducing TDs regular season minutes so he's fresher for the playoffs. This is old news, but if they REALLY wanted to keep him fresh for the playoffs, they should have acquired a defensive big with some length to play along side him. I just think they're asking him to do too much defensively. The Spurs have basically played the entire season with one center.

[phxspurfan]

Donecan

funny stuff



but seriously, (SRSLY), he is just biding his time until he becomes more powerful than we could ever imagine

[phxspurfan]

It's difficult to really judge Duncan's current ability against a healthy Bynum because Bynum has always been a tough matchup for him. He should be matching up with Gasol...but having a 6'6" center makes that impossible.

True. Bynum is younger, fresher, stronger and more athletic. Duncan has more talent, but even that is negated since he's arthritic. We need a big like a Nazr Mohammed (sigh) to body guys like Bynum up.

[Cry Havoc]

Duncan will average 17+ and 10+ in the playoffs. Book it.

[bigdog]

I don't think some people realize the offense Pop is running. Its not Duncan-friendly, but at the same time, it is. It benefits Duncan in that he doesn't have to do much except set some screens and shoot a bank shot every now and then. On defense, obviously he struggles a bit sometimes, but think about how long and athletic some of those guys are that he goes up against. I'm not saying Duncan is going to put up 28 pts, 12 rbs, and 4 blocks per game in the playoffs, I know hes declining, but he's not done. He's been very limited this year.

[Cessation]

The sad thing is this is meant to be a positive argument for Duncan. Making 5 shots a game shouldn't be that hard for Timmy.

This team has 5 players in double figures, with neal and blair also averaging 9 pts. Spurs are just too deep, only so much ball to go around. Duncan doesn't get as many regular touches as he used to, so at times he's out of rythm on offence. Spurs have been beating good teams all season, the rare occasion that lakers finally beat a good team they become unbeatable all of a sudden? lol give me a break.

[JR3]

I have watched him too many years now. He is a whole new animal in the playoffs.

[Hoops Czar]

I have watched him too many years now. He is a whole new animal in the playoffs.

Sort of like last year right? He's 34 with bad knees.... he is in decline.

[jag]

Duncan will average 17+ and 10+ in the playoffs. Book it.

I'd hope so. He'll be playing more minutes.

[romain.star]

hum... maybe a bit of the 3...

[spurs1990]

Nothing wrong with Duncan, he just doesn't have a matchup he can take advantage of when he plays the Lakers.

Rest of the league : 28.7 minutes per game.

13.5 PPG
9.2 RPG
2 BPG
.488 FG%

vs the Lakers (3 gms) : 28.3 minutes per game.

4 PPG
6.3 RPG
0.7 BPG
.192 FG%

OMG bullshit.

[2Cleva]

OMG bullshit.

LOL. Great argument.

http://espn.go.com/nba/player/_/id/215/tim-duncan

[FilSpursFan]

I would like to think he's saving his energy for the playoffs...

[2Cleva]

I would like to think he's saving his energy for the playoffs...

Or against LA he finds himself as the 4th best big man on the floor without the power, size, or quickness to do anything against who he's facing.

[kaji157]

I think it is a combination of things, he clearly is taking care of himself, and that is by design. Same as Manu taking more 3´s.
Once we change a bit our offense to give him more of the looks he is used to he will be fine. Not 2005 fine, but at least he will be able to put up 15-11 on consistent basis.
Look at the shots he took, mainly midrange and quite sporaic. All players needs some rythm, as of now Duncan enters the game without knowing what role he will play on offense. Almost no pick n roll´s or ost ups for him. And that is fine for me while we are up, and in this strange stretch of games where the refs are letting teams be very physical with us on our own court.
TD as of now, doesn´t know if he will have 5 shoots or 15, in the PO the play is always more inside out focused and that´s where Duncan strenghts prevail.

[Thompson]

Hopefully by the time we face the Lakers for the last time in the regular season, we'll have homecourt clinched, and Pop will 'experiment' with Splitter/Duncan starting against the Lakers, just for the hell of it. Splitter seemed to be doing pretty well against their size, and I have to think he'll do better than 6'6" Blair would.

[DPG21920]

Nothing wrong with Duncan, he just doesn't have a matchup he can take advantage of when he plays the Lakers.

Rest of the league : 28.7 minutes per game.

13.5 PPG
9.2 RPG
2 BPG
.488 FG%

vs the Lakers (3 gms) : 28.3 minutes per game.

4 PPG
6.3 RPG
0.7 BPG
.192 FG%

That is eye opening. I haven't checked it, but if true, it is amazing that Spurs beat LA twice this season. That is scary bad. But Tim gets the benefit of the doubt until he doesn't get it done in the playoffs.

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

Tim really pissed me off yesterday. He is essentially a left block player, where he has a nice runner and drop steps to both sides. Yesterday, he went back to a bad old habit - posting up on the right and going middle with his right hand push-shot, which ends up in a perfect position to be stuffed back in his face. It is his weakest move and often gets stuffed. He went to it twice during the 1st Q and, surprise surprise, got blocked both times. He wasn't a factor after that.

He hasn't used it much so far this year, but I wish he'd eliminate that bullshit shot from his arsenal altogether and have been saying so for 5 seasons now.

:pctoss

[ManuBalboa]

He is missing easy shit he used to make without even trying. Duncan is done I'm afraid. If the dude is coasting, at some point you would think glimpses of pride would kick in. I don't even see that. :depressed

[Cry Havoc]

I'd hope so. He'll be playing more minutes.

If he goes for 17.5 and 10.8 it would be hard to say he's declining, wouldn't it?

[benefactor]

http://spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=149772

Once upon a time...I doubted him. I will never do it again.

Believe in Tim Duncan.

[benefactor]

It's funny...that thread is almost exactly a year old. Ironic.

[spurs1990]

http://spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=149772

Once upon a time...I doubted him. I will never do it again.

Believe in Tim Duncan.

It's called old age. He's not the same player even from 2 years ago.

We better hope Bonner/Neal/Hill are draining 3's in come May.

[VBM]

This team has 5 players in double figures, with neal and blair also averaging 9 pts. Spurs are just too deep, only so much ball to go around. Duncan doesn't get as many regular touches as he used to, so at times he's out of rythm on offence. Spurs have been beating good teams all season, the rare occasion that lakers finally beat a good team they become unbeatable all of a sudden? lol give me a break.

Yeah, they're def. not unbeatable. Someone will have to get those bigs in foul trouble though. Duncan will def. have to be a factor.

[G-Dawgg]

Duncan is my favotite player, but he's starting to look like Robert Parish in his last year with the Celtics...

[ezau]

The last few years, there's always talk about reducing TDs regular season minutes so he's fresher for the playoffs. This is old news, but if they REALLY wanted to keep him fresh for the playoffs, they should have acquired a defensive big with some length to play along side him. I just think they're asking him to do too much defensively. The Spurs have basically played the entire season with one center.

that's the reason why the Spurs got Splitter, but sadly, POP doesn't want to use him.

[realtimmyfan]

I still think the acquisition of RJ was a bad trade. The 4-year extension contract was an even worse move by the GM.

We should get a better big instead.

[duncan228]

Just the quote, hit the link for the whole piece.


McDyess: Duncan will recover (http://blog.mysanantonio.com/spursnation/2011/03/07/mcdyess-duncan-will-recover/)
Mike Monroe

..."Tim takes everything personal when he has a bad game,” said the oldest member of the Spurs, at 36 just 1year older than Duncan. “He comes in early and works hard. I look forward to him having a big game against Detroit because he always feels like he let the team down, not only himself.

“He’ll come in with a little more focus and play a little harder.”

http://blog.mysanantonio.com/spursnation/2011/03/07/mcdyess-duncan-will-recover/

[Bito Corleone]

I think it's actually a combination of all three. Duncan is obviously not the player that he was few years ago, or even earlier this season. He's not giving it everything he has in order to save what he has left for the playoffs. Also currently he is in a slump because when you watch him actually trying hard he's still not getting a whole lot of production. I think the Duncan we'll see in the playoffs will be something like 17pts 11rbs 2blks.

[moisaenz]

He is not deteriorating, he is somewhat in a slump. Since he does not get as many touches as before he is not in rhythm to all of a sudden become the #1 scoring option when he is being guard by a good defensive player with size.This is why he struggles agains the Lakers, if he had come in scoring +20 the last 10 games that would be a different story.

[Supergirl]

Spurs don't need Duncan to dominate against the Lakers, they just need him to defend the middle and for the rest of the Spurs to be able to hit shots. Which they will be able to do most of the time. Last Sunday was the exception, I am more and more convinced. They don't have the best record and a 2-1 lead on the Lakers out of luck.

Also, I agree that Duncan will take his bad game out on our next opponent...book it.

[duncan228]

Look for TD to bounce back after his struggles against Lakers (http://blog.mysanantonio.com/spursnation/2011/03/08/look-for-duncan-to-bounce-back-after-his-struggles-against-lakers/)
Tim Griffin

...In his career, Duncan has scored six points or less in 25 games. In the games following, Duncan has averaged 17.5 ponts, 9.5 rebounds, 2.6 assists and 1.4 blocked shots. He’s also hit 50.9 percent from the field.

http://blog.mysanantonio.com/spursnation/2011/03/08/look-for-duncan-to-bounce-back-after-his-struggles-against-lakers/

[tdunk21]

228 :toast

[Spurs7794]

http://blog.mysanantonio.com/spursnation/2011/03/08/look-for-duncan-to-bounce-back-after-his-struggles-against-lakers/

His numbers after those games should be higher if we don't take into account this year. He has scored 6 or less 7 times this year.

[ohmwrecker]

I don't think he's in a slump, nor do I think he is declining as the season goes on. It's clear he is physically not the player he once was, but his decline in stats this year are directly attributed to a new offense that no longer goes through him and a calculated preservation of his energy and minutes. Duncan is in Horry mode and the Spurs are good enough to allow him to coast.

Every few games he reminds you that he still has it. You get used to him never leaving his feet, mistiming blocks and rebounds and being step slow on rotations, but all of a sudden, he will look like the old Timmy. Spry and bouncy, aggressively pulling down boards and blocking shots, hustling down the floor, shaking off defenders in the post . . .

We saw him do this last year, albeit with a much less talented team that required more production from him, but as Benefactor illustrated, you can't count out Tim Duncan. It isn't wise.

I am, hopefully, voting for the third option.

[benefactor]

I don't think he's in a slump, nor do I think he is declining as the season goes on. It's clear he is physically not the player he once was, but his decline in stats this year are directly attributed to a new offense that no longer goes through him and a calculated preservation of his energy and minutes. Duncan is in Horry mode and the Spurs are good enough to allow him to coast.

Every few games he reminds you that he still has it. You get used to him never leaving his feet, mistiming blocks and rebounds and being step slow on rotations, but all of a sudden, he will look like the old Timmy. Spry and bouncy, aggressively pulling down boards and blocking shots, hustling down the floor, shaking off defenders in the post . . .

We saw him do this last year, albeit with a much less talented team that required more production from him, but as Benefactor illustrated, you can't count out Tim Duncan. It isn't wise.

I am, hopefully, voting for the third option.
:tu

Ohm dropping knowledge on the doubting greys.

[Budkin]

It's obvious he's declined drastically, there's no spinning that. However, this warrior has such heart and determination that during the Playoffs he's going to give it everything he's got, and that's much more than we've seen of him all season.

[11:10]

I thought even pau gasol outplayed him in 08. Maybe stats say otherwise, but that's just how I saw it.

[Obstructed_View]

It's obvious he's declined drastically, there's no spinning that. However, this warrior has such heart and determination that during the Playoffs he's going to give it everything he's got, and that's much more than we've seen of him all season.

Sorry, but you're just wrong. His stats are pretty close to his career averages when you consider his limited minutes. Basketball reference has a "per 36 minutes" column, and it's pretty enlightening as to how good he's been defensively while he's on the floor. His shot attempts, his field goal percentage and his free throw attempts have gone down this season, which isn't a surprise. With the focus on keeping him healthy and fresh for a playoff run, the offense isn't going through him. This is a deliberate attempt to keep wear and tear to a minimum. In every other category he's at or above his career averages. Think about that for a minute before you defend your statement that he's "declined drastically".


There should be a "none of the above", because all of those choices are inaccurate.

[Budkin]

Sorry, but you're just wrong. His stats are pretty close to his career averages when you consider his limited minutes. Basketball reference has a "per 36 minutes" column, and it's pretty enlightening as to how good he's been defensively while he's on the floor. His shot attempts, his field goal percentage and his free throw attempts have gone down this season, which isn't a surprise. With the focus on keeping him healthy and fresh for a playoff run, the offense isn't going through him. This is a deliberate attempt to keep wear and tear to a minimum. In every other category he's at or above his career averages. Think about that for a minute before you defend your statement that he's "declined drastically".


There should be a "none of the above", because all of those choices are inaccurate.

I'll give you that I didn't take minutes played into account, but come on... Timmy used to be freaking unguardable. He could get to the basket at will and finish with explosive dunks, when he wasn't busting that bank shot in fools faces. Hell he used to own Shaq in the paint. He's still got a lot left in him, but to say that he hasn't declined at all is just silly.

[Kamala]

Players slow down. It's the nature of things. There will come a day when Kobe slows down and players he used to dominate get the best of him and yell "bitch" in his ear after bustin a 3 in his face. If it happened to Jordan it sure as hell is going to happen to him. I for one will giggle my ass off when that day comes.

[Obstructed_View]

I'll give you that I didn't take minutes played into account, but come on... Timmy used to be freaking unguardable. He could get to the basket at will and finish with explosive dunks, when he wasn't busting that bank shot in fools faces. Hell he used to own Shaq in the paint. He's still got a lot left in him, but to say that he hasn't declined at all is just silly.

I don't think anyone said he hasn't declined at all. Somebody said he'd declined drastically without checking the stats first, and that person was completely wrong. Duncan hasn't relied on his athletecism in a long time. Even though he hasn't gotten the ball much on offense, he's probably had more explosive dunks this year than the previous four or five, which bodes well for the playoffs.