Justice Department sues on behalf of Muslim teacher...

[Stringer_Bell]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/justice-department-sues-on-behalf-of-muslim-teacher-triggering-debate/2010/07/28/ABfSPtEB_story.html?hpid=z5


BERKELEY, Ill. — Safoorah Khan had taught middle school math for only nine months in this tiny Chicago suburb when she made an unusual request. She wanted three weeks off for a pilgrimage to Mecca.

The school district, faced with losing its only math lab instructor during the critical end-of-semester marking period, said no. Khan, a devout Muslim, resigned and made the trip anyway.

Read the article, it's fascinating as shit.

She signed a teacher's union contract, made a request outside of the contract, then the Justice Department stepped in after she resigned. Wow.

[baseline bum]

I don't get this stupid standard in America that one's faith grants him special privileges. Why the fuck should the world stop just because you pray to some ghost in the sky?

[CosmicCowboy]

Yeah, I was totally disgusted by this. Our "Justice" Department is seriously fucked up.

[George Gervin's Afro]

She signed a contract...

[LnGrrrR]

Yeah, pretty f'ing stupid. If the contract doesn't say you can take three weeks off/take leave, then you can't. She should've mentioned that during her interview.

[MaNuMaNiAc]

Yeah, pretty f'ing stupid. If the contract doesn't say you can take three weeks off/take leave, then you can't. She should've mentioned that during her interview.

I second this

[vy65]

There's actually pretty strong legal precedent that an employer cannot place job restrictions that interfere with an employee's freedom to practice his or her religion.

I didn't see anything in there about a contract - so I don't know if one existed - but in any event you can make the argument that one can't contract away his or her constitutional rights, i.e., a court would strike down said contract as illegal/unconscionable.

In any event, this is probably more political (the timing with the whole Libya thing is dubious). And I don't really care one way or another on how it turns out. But from a legal perspective, I think the Justice Dept. has a viable argument.

[Vici]

There's actually pretty strong legal precedent that an employer cannot place job restrictions that interfere with an employee's freedom to practice his or her religion.

I didn't see anything in there about a contract - so I don't know if one existed - but in any event you can make the argument that one can't contract away his or her constitutional rights, i.e., a court would strike down said contract as illegal/unconscionable.

In any event, this is probably more political (the timing with the whole Libya thing is dubious). And I don't really care one way or another on how it turns out. But from a legal perspective, I think the Justice Dept. has a viable argument.

Do you know what that precedent is?

[Blake]

There's actually pretty strong legal precedent that an employer cannot place job restrictions that interfere with an employee's freedom to practice his or her religion.

not if it puts an unreasonable hardship on the employer.

what strong precedent do you know of that would allow for 19 consecutive days off?


I didn't see anything in there about a contract - so I don't know if one existed - but in any event you can make the argument that one can't contract away his or her constitutional rights, i.e., a court would strike down said contract as illegal/unconscionable.

it mentioned a teacher union contract.

not sure about Berkeley, but in SA, teachers sign a contract each year.


In any event, this is probably more political (the timing with the whole Libya thing is dubious). And I don't really care one way or another on how it turns out. But from a legal perspective, I think the Justice Dept. has a viable argument.

Apparently the Justice Dept thinks they have a viable argument, although I'm not seeing it.

I can only pray that Jesus grants wisdom to the court and sides with the school district.

[vy65]

Do you know what that precedent is?

Sherbert v. Verner, 374 U.S. 398 (1963), and Thomas v. Review Board, Indiana Employment Security Div., 450 U.S. 707 (1981)

[vy65]

not if it puts an unreasonable hardship on the employer.

what strong precedent do you know of that would allow for 19 consecutive days off?

The hardship question is probably a question of fact - so who knows how that will turn out.

I probably overspoke when I used the word "strong." The cases cited deal with the state witholding unemployment benefits from those discharged from their jobs - so it's not exactly analogous to someone discharged from public employment. However, it seems like the next logical extension of the precedent (going from unemp. benefits to direct protections for those employed by the state).




it mentioned a teacher union contract.

not sure about Berkeley, but in SA, teachers sign a contract each year.

didn't catch that. In any event, if there's a rights violation, then a court would hold the contract unenforceable on the grounds of illegality.




Apparently the Justice Dept thinks they have a viable argument, although I'm not seeing it.

I can only pray that Jesus grants wisdom to the court and sides with the school district.

Nice. We'll see who's god is stronger.

[ploto]

The practice of her faith only REQUIRES that she do this once in her lifetime and it only lasts 5 days. Even if you allow for the fact that she felt she should do this ASAP, the length of her time-off is obviously for more than religious requirements. She did not need 19 days off.

Actually, on further research, the minimum number of days for Hajj may only be 3.

I also have to question how she handled it. Did she schedule it at the beginning of the school year when the school could make plans ahead of time to accomodate her request?

[coyotes_geek]

yeah, pretty f'ing stupid. If the contract doesn't say you can take three weeks off/take leave, then you can't. She should've mentioned that during her interview.

+1

[MannyIsGod]

Man, this is some retarded shit.

BRB Resigning from my job for my 6 month religious vaca...ERRRRRRRRRRRRR pilgrimage.

[TeyshaBlue]

I also have to question how she handled it. Did she schedule it at the beginning of the school year when the school could make plans ahead of time to accomodate her request?

This is the telling question.

[TeyshaBlue]

This is the telling question.

And this is the answer:
"In August 2008, Khan requested an unpaid leave for the first three weeks of December that year. The district said the leave was unrelated to Khan’s job and not authorized by the teacher union contract, according to court documents. Khan resigned in a letter to the school board."

[baseline bum]

Man, this is some retarded shit.

BRB Resigning from my job for my 6 month religious vaca...ERRRRRRRRRRRRR pilgrimage.

Haha... how can I frame a pilgrimage to Amsterdam to be religious?

[Stringer_Bell]

Haha... how can I frame a pilgrimage to Amsterdam to be religious?

http://amsterdam-vacations.net/tag/amsterdam-religious-sights/

Just make sure that you 1) apply for vacation at the start of the school year and 2) keep your "pilgrimage" to less than 2 weeks.

[Wild Cobra]

I don't get this stupid standard in America that one's faith grants him special privileges. Why the fuck should the world stop just because you pray to some ghost in the sky?
The teacher knew the commitments of the job. Should have found a different vocation.

[Wild Cobra]

There's actually pretty strong legal precedent that an employer cannot place job restrictions that interfere with an employee's freedom to practice his or her religion.
At the same time, the employees religion cannot be expected to interfere with the job.

I didn't see anything in there about a contract - so I don't know if one existed - but in any event you can make the argument that one can't contract away his or her constitutional rights, i.e., a court would strike down said contract as illegal/unconscionable.
What rights were taken away? I don't know a single employer anywhere that allows you to take time off anytime you want to.

In any event, this is probably more political (the timing with the whole Libya thing is dubious). And I don't really care one way or another on how it turns out. But from a legal perspective, I think the Justice Dept. has a viable argument.

I doubt it. Did you understand that she was the only teacher for this class?

faced with losing its only math lab instructor during the critical end-of-semester marking period, said no.
Is it just me? I though teachers were there to teach children. Not bail on them during important parts of the education curriculum.

[CosmicCowboy]

So why couldn't she do her pilgrimage during her three month paid vacation in the summer when school is out?

Stupid.

Embarrassing.

Freaking wrong.

Holders "Justice" Department is out of control.

[Blake]

So why couldn't she do her pilgrimage during her three month paid vacation in the summer when school is out?

Stupid.



no shit! A math lab teacher that can't figure out to take her pilgirmage during the summer must be really stupid.

either that or the pilgrimage must take place during the month of Dhu al-Hijja to fulfill the requirements of the hajj.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

I know this is smack-dab in Al Capone-ville, but how in the hell did the justice department get wind of this? Sorry, but I didn't read the article.

[Wild Cobra]

I know this is smack-dab in Al Capone-ville, but how in the hell did the justice department get wind of this? Sorry, but I didn't read the article.
Doesn't matter how they heard of it, what is troublesome is why are they getting involved?