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[ElNono]

...to foot GE's tax bill.

Not only GE will not pay corporate taxes this year, they're getting $3.2 billions in tax benefits back...

Corporate tax too high? Only for the suckers...

----------

G.E.’s Strategies Let It Avoid Taxes Altogether (http://www.nytimes.com/2011/03/25/business/economy/25tax.html)

General Electric, the nation’s largest corporation, had a very good year in 2010.

The company reported worldwide profits of $14.2 billion, and said $5.1 billion of the total came from its operations in the United States.

Its American tax bill? None. In fact, G.E. claimed a tax benefit of $3.2 billion.

That may be hard to fathom for the millions of American business owners and households now preparing their own returns, but low taxes are nothing new for G.E. The company has been cutting the percentage of its American profits paid to the Internal Revenue Service for years, resulting in a far lower rate than at most multinational companies.

Its extraordinary success is based on an aggressive strategy that mixes fierce lobbying for tax breaks and innovative accounting that enables it to concentrate its profits offshore. G.E.’s giant tax department, led by a bow-tied former Treasury official named John Samuels, is often referred to as the world’s best tax law firm. Indeed, the company’s slogan “Imagination at Work” fits this department well. The team includes former officials not just from the Treasury, but also from the I.R.S. and virtually all the tax-writing committees in Congress.

While General Electric is one of the most skilled at reducing its tax burden, many other companies have become better at this as well. Although the top corporate tax rate in the United States is 35 percent, one of the highest in the world, companies have been increasingly using a maze of shelters, tax credits and subsidies to pay far less.

In a regulatory filing just a week before the Japanese disaster put a spotlight on the company’s nuclear reactor business, G.E. reported that its tax burden was 7.4 percent of its American profits, about a third of the average reported by other American multinationals. Even those figures are overstated, because they include taxes that will be paid only if the company brings its overseas profits back to the United States. With those profits still offshore, G.E. is effectively getting money back.

Such strategies, as well as changes in tax laws that encouraged some businesses and professionals to file as individuals, have pushed down the corporate share of the nation’s tax receipts — from 30 percent of all federal revenue in the mid-1950s to 6.6 percent in 2009.

Read More ---> (http://www.nytimes.com/2011/03/25/business/economy/25tax.html)

[boutons_deux]

"US corps have the highest tax rates"

--- WC's check-box parrot

but US corps don't pay high taxes, and their percentage of total US tax revenue is way below other industrial countries.

[fraga]

But we need to stop those Teacher/Educator fat cats sitting in their mansions...

[jack sommerset]

Pricks

[CosmicCowboy]

Not to mention that GE Capital got bailout funds.

[ChumpDumper]

Google does it too.

Double Irish.

Dutch sandwich.

[coyotes_geek]

GE pays income taxes. They're just paying them to foreign governments who have lower corporate income tax rates.

If you want companies like GE to start paying their income taxes in America, you need to lower America's corporate income tax rate.

[baseline bum]

Haha Rangel... of course.

[boutons_deux]

"you need to lower America's corporate income tax rate"

GE's non-taxes in the article are on their UCA income, not on their foreign income.

GE and others have $10Bs in untaxed profits parked offshore they want to repatriate.

Besides paying little or on UCA income come tax, the corps also are trying to cut a deal like the Repugs gave them a few years ago. $300B profits repatriated at 5% tax rate, with the provision that they create US jobs. BigPharma was a huge beneficiary of dubya's give-away, and then laid off 10s of 1000s of US employees.

[CosmicCowboy]

Still peanuts compared to the 140 Billion they got in bailout funds.

[ChumpDumper]

Still peanuts compared to the 140 Billion they got in bailout funds.You may be mischaracterizing the amount you are listing.

[ElNono]

GE pays income taxes. They're just paying them to foreign governments who have lower corporate income tax rates.

If you want companies like GE to start paying their income taxes in America, you need to lower America's corporate income tax rate.

This is such bullshit, coyote...

Are you trying to tell me that they don't have any taxable assets or income in the US? How can you claim 5.1 billion dollars in US profit, but a tax liability of -3.2 billion? If it's not a tax loophole, then it's a tax break bordering on scam.

I have no problem with them making and keeping their money out of the country, but if you make your money in the US, you should pay up like everybody else.

This whole thing reeks of greasing washington up and hiring every person that know their way into tax loopholes. With that in mind, the percentage of corporate tax is irrelevant. While stuff like this exists, paying up even 1% is simply too much anyways.

[George Gervin's Afro]

It's the unions who are ruining this country!

[Viva Las Espuelas]

GE-Jeffrey Immelt-NBC-MSNBC-etc.

[boutons_deux]

Despite Paying No Income Taxes, GE CEO Lauded His Company’s Patriotism In 2009 West Point Speech

http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/jeffimmelt1.jpg

http://thinkprogress.org/2011/03/25/geo-ceo-greed-taxes/

====

More of "Don't watch what I do, be fooled by what I say"

[lazerelmo]

From the article....

President Obama (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/people/o/barack_obama/index.html?inline=nyt-per) has said he is considering an overhaul of the corporate tax system, with an eye to lowering the top rate, ending some tax subsidies and loopholes and generating the same amount of revenue. He has designated G.E.’s chief executive, Jeffrey R. Immelt (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/people/i/jeffrey_r_immelt/index.html?inline=nyt-per), as his liaison to the business community and as the chairman of the President’s Council on Jobs and Competitiveness (http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/2011/01/21/announcing-new-council-jobs-and-competitiveness), and it is expected to discuss corporate taxes.


Sounds like a plan to me... If you can't beat'em, Hire'em.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

And people shat over halliburton dot dot dot

[Wild Cobra]

"US corps have the highest tax rates"

--- WC's check-box parrot

but US corps don't pay high taxes, and their percentage of total US tax revenue is way below other industrial countries.
Except for those who have cronies the government to get subsidies. Go talk to your hero, president Obama, and your liberal heroes in congress about these deals.

[ChumpDumper]

Except for those who have cronies the government to get subsidies. Go talk to your hero, president Obama, and your liberal heroes in congress about these deals.But you say they aren't subsidies.

Hypocrite.

[Stringer_Bell]

Despite Paying No Income Taxes, GE CEO Lauded His Company’s Patriotism In 2009 West Point Speech

http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/jeffimmelt1.jpg

http://thinkprogress.org/2011/03/25/geo-ceo-greed-taxes/

====

More of "Don't watch what I do, be fooled by what I say"

In case you weren't aware, GE makes weapons that are used by the military...the military that protects your right to criticize everything under the American flag. It's patriotic, for sure. So, take a moment between your hate-filled accusations to kiss the boots that keep you safe (don't worry, Mr. Immelt keeps them real clean and shiny thanks to Libtards).

[Viva Las Espuelas]

But you say they aren't subsidies.

Hypocrite.

I'm not taking sides here but is this concerning that grant/subsidies splitting-hairs debate me, randomguy, WC and whoever else were having the other day?



On another note, Im pretty surprised Lawrence O'Donnell called out GE on this tonight. I disagree with pretty much all he believes but he gained a little respect from me for doing that. fwiw

[boutons_deux]

In case you weren't aware, GE makes weapons that are used by the military...the military that protects your right to criticize everything under the American flag. It's patriotic, for sure. So, take a moment between your hate-filled accusations to kiss the boots that keep you safe (don't worry, Mr. Immelt keeps them real clean and shiny thanks to Libtards).

what horse shit.

GE is part of the MIC owning DC and payin DC to go to bullshit wars, unending, undecisive wars, that waste US military and make the US not one bit safer.

The military does fuck all about anybody's rights.

They enlist, suckered or not, they pay the price for getting fucked over in bogus wars and then abandoned by the politicians and military brass.

[PublicOption]

GE-Jeffrey Immelt-NBC-MSNBC-etc.


=Keith Olbermann out......coincidence.:wow

[PublicOption]

I thought the Koch Brothers were bad.

MSNBC you better report this shit or you are toast on my cable box.

MSNBC better report this or their just as much a corporate sell out as NewsCorp.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

=Keith Olbermann out......coincidence.:wow

Who knows. Frankly, with him, who cares but O'Donnell going off on GE tonight was pretty interesting. I'm interested to see what happens to him. Who knows if anything will

[ElNono]

BTW, this is just another year...

http://abcnews.go.com/Business/Tax/ge-exxon-paid-us-income-taxes-09/story?id=10300167

[admiralsnackbar]

GE pays income taxes. They're just paying them to foreign governments who have lower corporate income tax rates.

If you want companies like GE to start paying their income taxes in America, you need to lower America's corporate income tax rate.

Oh c'mon, CG -- that's nonsense. What you're proposing is forcing a developed superpower (with its attendant overhead) to match or beat the tax rates of tiny third-world Caribbean nations in order to collect revenue.

The only differences between that arrangement and the bailouts are that the government never even touches the money before giving it away, and that the give-aways aren't one-time jackpots, but in perpetuum allowances.

I understand megacorporations wield a lot of leverage over the government as economic furnaces, but at what point does that leverage simply become outright control?

[boutons_deux]

There are conventions between countries to avoid double taxation.

Just another VRWC LIE: US corp tax rate is too high, making US corps uncompetitive.


Just another VRWC LIE: Cutting corp taxes and killing the minimum wage creates jobs.

If the VRWC's lips are moving, they're lying.

[coyotes_geek]

Oh c'mon, CG -- that's nonsense. What you're proposing is forcing a developed superpower (with its attendant overhead) to match or beat the tax rates of tiny third-world Caribbean nations in order to collect revenue.


What I'm proposing is that we accept the reality that a high corporate income tax rate serves no purpose. Those who can avoid it are avoiding it. Those who can't avoid it are merely passing those costs along to consumers.

[MannyIsGod]

What I'm proposing is that we accept the reality that a high corporate income tax rate serves no purpose. Those who can avoid it are avoiding it. Those who can't avoid it are merely passing those costs along to consumers.

Neither of those things has anything to do with the level of income tax crops face. IE, you could say the exact same thing about a low income tax rate. We're still going to have the cost passed on as consumers and corps will still avoid it if possible.

[ManuBalboa]

GE's close partnership with this administration has been no secret. Now you understand the true meaning behind GE going GREEN. Idiots.

[coyotes_geek]

Neither of those things has anything to do with the level of income tax crops face. IE, you could say the exact same thing about a low income tax rate. We're still going to have the cost passed on as consumers and corps will still avoid it if possible.

Sure, taxes would still be passed along and corps would continue looking for the better deal. With a lower tax rate the costs being passed along would be lower and the better deal would be harder to find. I'm okay with that situation.

[ElNono]

Sure, taxes would still be passed along and corps would continue looking for the better deal. With a lower tax rate the costs being passed along would be lower and the better deal would be harder to find. I'm okay with that situation.

How so?

[LnGrrrR]

Is it really taxes alone pushing businesses overseas? No mention of cheaper labor?

[SnakeBoy]

This is an outrage. The only way it will get fixed is if the American people put a Democrat in the White House and give him Democratic super majorities in both houses.

[MannyIsGod]

Is it really taxes alone pushing businesses overseas? No mention of cheaper labor?

Labor on Barbados (random Caribbean nation as an example) isn't really a reason of why corporations headquarter themselves there.

[MannyIsGod]

Sure, taxes would still be passed along and corps would continue looking for the better deal. With a lower tax rate the costs being passed along would be lower and the better deal would be harder to find. I'm okay with that situation.

I'm not too sure about that one bit.

[ElNono]

This is an outrage. The only way it will get fixed is if the American people put a Democrat in the White House and give him Democratic super majorities in both houses.

I detect the sarcasm. But, you don't think this is outrageous?

[admiralsnackbar]

What I'm proposing is that we accept the reality that a high corporate income tax rate serves no purpose. Those who can avoid it are avoiding it. Those who can't avoid it are merely passing those costs along to consumers.

So what of GE, which avoids taxes, banks in the private sector, uses its size and our money to insure itself on risky bets, employs non-unionized labor exclusively (mostly abroad, of course -- cheaper), and gets obscene government subsidies? I mean shit, man... is it even possible to have more control over one's assets?

Naturally, all that cash inevitably leads to more growth, and all that growth inevitably leads to more political leverage, and all that political leverage leads to more cash...ad nauseam. How can anybody compete with that, be it a smaller business or, ultimately, a government?

I guess I'm just curious, then: are you cool with letting mega-corporations maintain this sort of unchecked growth -- even as it becomes progressively more parasitic and anti-competitive? Or is your position more about dispassionately accepting the futility of government regulation/tax enforcement? (...actually don't know why I make the distinction, come to think of it -- it's the same position).

Anyway, not trying to put words in your mouth as much as trying to ask where your buck stops? If you can accept that the GEs won't pay taxes because they don't want to, and you can accept that they are actually taxing you via gov subsidies squeezed out by political leverage, and you can accept that they can now pimp politicians to you (post Citizens United) to increase their power...at what point do you say "fuck this?"

[coyotes_geek]

How so?

The fewer the countries with a lower corporate tax rate than the U.S., the fewer the number of places where corporations can get tax treatment friendlier than in the U.S.

[Stringer_Bell]

Silly liberals are outraged over a company not paying taxes when they should be outraged over the government wasting money it doesn't have on programs that don't stimulate the citizenry or the economy.

Maybe if Americans were more thoughtful, vigilant workers they wouldn't be losing their jobs to the Taiwanese and Guatemalans. lol Americans

[boutons_deux]

After Paying Zero Income Taxes, GE Plans To Ask Its Union Workers To Make Wage And Benefits Concessions

http://thinkprogress.org/2011/03/28/ge-union-workers-cuts/

[ElNono]

The fewer the countries with a lower corporate tax rate than the U.S., the fewer the number of places where corporations can get tax treatment friendlier than in the U.S.

It doesn't get any friendlier than a negative tax rate, at least for companies like GE.

Do you think a 1% tax rate is too high? How about 0%?
Why would GE stop doing what it's doing given tax rates like that?

The problem is not the rate, it's the loopholes and the seemingly lack of enforcement of tax laws due to their leverage/greasing of palms.


Silly liberals are outraged over a company not paying taxes when they should be outraged over the government wasting money it doesn't have on programs that don't stimulate the citizenry or the economy.

Maybe if Americans were more thoughtful, vigilant workers they wouldn't be losing their jobs to the Taiwanese and Guatemalans. lol Americans

The outrage is partially shared with the government. There's two sides to this story, the company being a bad citizen and the government that enables it to do so.

[boutons_deux]

"don't stimulate the citizenry or the economy."

you mean you Repugs bullshit, bogus wars and the MIC, subsidies/taxcuts for oil/gas/coal cos, ,etc, etc?

The current historially high deficit is not an accident or Act of God. It's the intentional result of VRWC policies.

[boutons_deux]

Bank Of America Paid Nothing In Federal Income Taxes Last Year And Got Almost $1 Billion From Taxpayers

Bank Of America Paid Nothing In Federal Income Taxes Last Year And Got Almost $1 Billion From Taxpayers

[coyotes_geek]

So what of GE, which avoids taxes, banks in the private sector, uses its size and our money to insure itself on risky bets, employs non-unionized labor exclusively (mostly abroad, of course -- cheaper), and gets obscene government subsidies? I mean shit, man... is it even possible to have more control over one's assets?

Naturally, all that cash inevitably leads to more growth, and all that growth inevitably leads to more political leverage, and all that political leverage leads to more cash...ad nauseam. How can anybody compete with that, be it a smaller business or, ultimately, a government?

I guess I'm just curious, then: are you cool with letting mega-corporations maintain this sort of unchecked growth -- even as it becomes progressively more parasitic and anti-competitive? Or is your position more about dispassionately accepting the futility of government regulation/tax enforcement? (...actually don't know why I make the distinction, come to think of it -- it's the same position).

Anyway, not trying to put words in your mouth as much as trying to ask where your buck stops? If you can accept that the GEs won't pay taxes because they don't want to, and you can accept that they are actually taxing you via gov subsidies squeezed out by political leverage, and you can accept that they can now pimp politicians to you (post Citizens United) to increase their power...at what point do you say "fuck this?"

My only point here is that I think the 35% U.S. corporate income tax rate is counterproductive and that it would be beneficial to all of us if that rate were lowered significantly.

But since you brought up other issues I'll say that I'm against bailouts and subsidies. I also believe the government does have a role in ensuring a competitive marketplace. As an example, I've repeatedly stated that I think the government should use anti-trust legislation to break up the mega banks.


It doesn't get any friendlier than a negative tax rate, at least for companies like GE.

Do you think a 1% tax rate is too high? How about 0%?
Why would GE stop doing what it's doing given tax rates like that?

The problem is not the rate, it's the loopholes and the seemingly lack of enforcement of tax laws due to their leverage/greasing of palms.

GE doesn't have a negative tax rate. They have a 35% tax rate on $0 worth of taxable earnings. Lower that tax rate and they've got less incentive to find ways to reduce their taxable earnings. The money they park overseas is getting taxed overseas, why not lower the tax rate so that they'll be motivated to let that money get taxed here?

[boutons_deux]

"The money they park overseas is getting taxed overseas"

Not necessarily.

They probably tell, or bribe, the foreign tax officials, that they are going to repatriate the profits to America and pay taxes there, avoiding foreign taxes.

[SnakeBoy]

I detect the sarcasm. But, you don't think this is outrageous?

I don't find it any more outrageous than than 40% or so of americans who don't pay any taxes. It's the entire tax code that I find outrageous.

[Winehole23]

http://www.cjr.org/the_audit/ge_flubs_social_media_pushback_nyt.php?page=1