The Parker/Billups matchup.

[TwoHandJam]

Whoever gets the better of this matchup might really sway the outcome of the series. We all know Parker has struggled against Billups before but I feel that even if he can't defend him well, as long as he contests every shot and takes advantage of his speed over Billups to generate offense, he can make up for his defensive shortcomings.

However, I have another suggestion. We've all seen Pop let Manu run the offense for Parker in stretches when he struggles and have Tony play shooting guard where his quickness gets him open for all kinds of shots and gets his confidence going. He pulled this against the Suns and it led to Parker breaking out of a funk and getting open for a pivotal layup to seal the game 5 victory.

I think this could cause matchup problems for Detroit since they'd probably put Rip on Parker to keep up with him leaving Billups matched up with a taller Bowen and Manu able to generally beat Prince off the dribble. Prince couldn't stop Wade's first step and probably will have trouble with Manu's which is one of the fastest in the league.

In moderation, when Parker is struggling, I think this could be trouble for Detroit as it was for Phoenix. What do you think?

[Nikos]

If Parker outplays Billups, the Spurs will not lose this series. No way. If they do it would be a huge choke job.

Actually if they lose in general, they would have to play their worst basketball since....well the Lakers of 2004.....

[timvp]

Digging a little deeper into this matchup, here are the stats between the two players ...


Billups 2002
8.0 Points
4.3 Assists
.406 FG%

Parker 2002
9.8 Points
4.3 Assists
.438 FG%


Billups 2003
6.0 Points
1.0 Assists
.250 FG%

Parker 2003
17.5 Points
7.5 Assists
.630 FG%


Billups 2004
11.0 Points
3.5 Assists
.263 FG%

Parker 2004
10.5 Points
4.5 Assists
.360 FG%


Billups 2005
21.5 Points
5.0 Assists
.619 FG%

Parker 2005
16.0 Points
4.0 Assists
.500 FG%

So really, Parker has at least held his own over the years. In three of the four years, Parker has actually outplayed Billups.

The time is now for Parker. He needs to prove it when it counts.

[theMUHMEshow]

It doesnt matter what Billups does on the offensive end, fact of the matter is, Chauncey is an all defensive team player. He does not get exploited on D ever. Parker hasnt played a PG like him all year, (I dont think he matched up against Kidd this year due to Kidds injury). We all know how much stronger Chaunc is then TP. That is going to be a huge problem for him.

Rip...is going to get his 20 no matter who is on him, he proved it when they tried to put Artest on him. The guy will get 20 no matter what. I hope to god you guys put Bowen on him, that leaves Manu on Tay, lol.

I am not sure about this, but I have seen it on this forum, I guess no one guards Timmay better then Sheed? So I guess that helps us out, plus I am not really worried now that Ben doesnt have to worry about SHAQ (geezzus that guy is a pain), he will be all over the floor.

Its going to be a good series...I am saying 'Stones in 6. We have been talking about this matchup since last year. We got shortchanged last year and had to deal with the scrubs from LA, smoked their asses. Again, we had to deal with the Diesel, beat him again, now we got who we wanted.

I hope it is a good series...I am looking for Barry to have a huge series, along with Billups.

Remember last year...it wasnt a fluke to beat a team 4/5 times, that is filled with HALL OF FAMERS. Think what you want...we are fo real!

WELCOME TO DETROIT!
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y266/jm_phenom23/KidRock1.jpg

[timvp]

We got shortchanged last year and had to deal with the scrubs from LA, smoked their asses.

Nice.

:rollin


I am looking for Barry to have a huge series.

Please make that happen.

[Mr. Body]

So I guess that helps us out, plus I am not really worried now that Ben doesnt have to worry about SHAQ (geezzus that guy is a pain), he will be all over the floor.

I wouldn't leave Mohammad if I were Ben Wallace. Not too far, anyway. Spurs look for quick dump-downs to him.

I don't see Bowen guarding Prince. If anything, the Spurs might swap Parker on Hamilton and put Bowen on Billups. Be interesting.

By the way, 'Stones' has to be one of the lamest nicknames ever.

Rasheed gives Duncan trouble (especially when Tim rolls and ankle on his foot), but at least Tim's getting rolling now. Too bad he's not his old self, but he's looking better. If he can command double-teams, that will really help.

[Pistons < Spurs]

By the way, 'Stones' has to be one of the lamest nicknames ever.





LOL I've always thought that aswell.

[slayermin]

TP will have to play well for the Spurs to pull this series out. His matchup with Billups will be put under the microscope every single trip downcourt.

Billups has a similar body to Stephon Marbury which really worries me. Though Chauncey isn't as quick or as good off the dribble as Marbury, he can outmuscle Parker anytime he wants to get off his shot. That will be a problem.

If TP can hit a nominal percentage from the perimeter and battle Billups at every turn, he can win this matchup. He is way too quick for Billups. And yes, Detroit fan, I know Billups is an All-NBA defender. I hope TP learned something from Steve Nash and incorporates some of what he saw in the West Finals against the Pistons. If he can shoot that tear drop successfully, the Piston bigs will begin to breakdown and he should be able to create for others. He needs to keep his dribble alive against that Piston interior defense. He needs to keep them off balance and make them move their feet.

[Sense]

It doesnt matter what Billups does on the offensive end, fact of the matter is, Chauncey is an all defensive team player. He does not get exploited on D ever. Parker hasnt played a PG like him all year, (I dont think he matched up against Kidd this year due to Kidds injury). We all know how much stronger Chaunc is then TP. That is going to be a huge problem for him.

Rip...is going to get his 20 no matter who is on him, he proved it when they tried to put Artest on him. The guy will get 20 no matter what. I hope to god you guys put Bowen on him, that leaves Manu on Tay, lol.

I am not sure about this, but I have seen it on this forum, I guess no one guards Timmay better then Sheed? So I guess that helps us out, plus I am not really worried now that Ben doesnt have to worry about SHAQ (geezzus that guy is a pain), he will be all over the floor.

Its going to be a good series...I am saying 'Stones in 6. We have been talking about this matchup since last year. We got shortchanged last year and had to deal with the scrubs from LA, smoked their asses. Again, we had to deal with the Diesel, beat him again, now we got who we wanted.

I hope it is a good series...I am looking for Barry to have a huge series, along with Billups.

Remember last year...it wasnt a fluke to beat a team 4/5 times, that is filled with HALL OF FAMERS. Think what you want...we are fo real!

WELCOME TO DETROIT!
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y266/jm_phenom23/KidRock1.jpg





You have to remember we are gonna be in SA...and we dominated PHX, something no one in the NBA ever did.


Also... I think you need to start thinking how SA can match with DET on detroits defense... we have 3 people that can finish a game for sure...

I think no one can stop Tim, even if its Rasheed.. Did you remember the last 2 games in which Duncan played?

Prince can't guard ginobili..and vice versa..so they will be cancelling each other out.


You aren't a smart Pistons fan.

[Kori Ellis]

Rip...is going to get his 20 no matter who is on him, he proved it when they tried to put Artest on him. The guy will get 20 no matter what. I hope to god you guys put Bowen on him, that leaves Manu on Tay, lol.

I am not sure about this, but I have seen it on this forum, I guess no one guards Timmay better then Sheed?

I don't care if Rip gets his 20, as long as Bowen makes him work and his shooting percentage is relatively low. I don't know what to really think about Manu-Tayshaun matchup -- Manu played only 15 minutes or so in the last game against Detroit when Duncan went down. (Devin had a good day and led the Spurs in scoring -- too bad he's not healthy).

As for Rasheed, for some reason he's always frustrated Duncan. I think two of Duncan's worst games of his NBA career have come against Rasheed when he was in Portland. But this is NBA Finals version of Duncan, not the regular season versus a bad Blazers team version. Duncan will come up big.

I like this series. It's going to be fun.

[Sense]

I don't care if Rip gets his 20, as long as Bowen makes him work and his shooting percentage is relatively low. I don't know what to really think about Manu-Tayshaun matchup -- Manu played only 15 minutes or so in the last game against Detroit when Duncan went down. (Devin had a good day and led the Spurs in scoring -- too bad he's not healthy).

As for Rasheed, for some reason he's always frustrated Duncan. I think two of Duncan's worst games of his NBA career have come against Rasheed when he was in Portland. But this is NBA Finals version of Duncan, not the regular season versus a bad Blazers team version. Duncan will come up big.

I like this series. It's going to be fun.



All of this is True.

[SouthernFried]

oh ya, I like this series a lot.

One of the purest shooters, and most underrated players, imho...is Detroits Hamilton. I just love his fluidity. And he has, what I've always believed, the most potent weapon any ball player can have...the pull-up jumper off the dribble. Hardest shot to guard, and it's a joy to watch someone who can actually do it night after night. That shot was both Jordans and Kobe's bread and butter shot. Hamilton has it too.

Still, I think the key to this series is the Tony/Billups matchup.

Everything else is so even. If Tony steps up, and is aggressive...I think his quickness could win out. He also HAS to hit the outside shot.

If Tony disappears, there's a good chance DT wins.

[Cant_Be_Faded]

billups will get OWWWNNNED

its like

just keep him from shooting threes and hes nullified

[SPARKY]

I see Ghost Writer's cousin from Detroit has shown up...

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y266/jm_phenom23/SiGGY.jpg

[SPARKY]

It seems as though the Pistons' O is a bit overrated and the Spurs' D is a bit underrated by some forum prognosticators. I've seen the Pistons' offense go through stretches of shear futility against some rather inept team defenses this season. This is where the difference between the two teams lies. The Spurs' D is as good if not better than Detroit's but offensively the Spurs are somewhat better than Detroit. Yes, Detroit can make the Spurs work on the offensive end but that doesn't make a series. How exactly is Detroit going to score against the best defensive team in the NBA?

Spurs in 5.

[gospursgojas]

Chauncy will be the next Gary Payton for Tony... alot bigger than him but can in no way keep up with the speed of Parker.

[DesiSpur_21]

It seems as though the Pistons' O is a bit overrated and the Spurs' D is a bit underrated by some forum prognosticators. I've seen the Pistons' offense go through stretches of shear futility against some rather inept team defenses this season. This is where the difference between the two teams lies. The Spurs' D is as good if not better than Detroit's but offensively the Spurs are somewhat better than Detroit. Yes, Detroit can make the Spurs work on the offensive end but that doesn't make a series. How exactly is Detroit going to score against the best defensive team in the NBA?

Spurs in 5.

Hey Sparky, you hit it right on! That's exactly is my point - check out sa-spurs.blogspot.com

[Rick Von Braun]

I don't care if Rip gets his 20, as long as Bowen makes him work and his shooting percentage is relatively low. I don't know what to really think about Manu-Tayshaun matchup -- Manu played only 15 minutes or so in the last game against Detroit when Duncan went down. (Devin had a good day and led the Spurs in scoring -- too bad he's not healthy).

As for Rasheed, for some reason he's always frustrated Duncan. I think two of Duncan's worst games of his NBA career have come against Rasheed when he was in Portland. But this is NBA Finals version of Duncan, not the regular season versus a bad Blazers team version. Duncan will come up big.

I like this series. It's going to be fun. Good analysis.

The key is Bowen being an effective defender when fighting through one or two screens while defending Rip. He was somehow neutralized by the Lakers last year using one or more hard screens with bigs, and the Pistons will probably try to exploit that. It is important for our bigs to step out, similarly to what they did against the Suns, to give Bowen time to recover. Bowen's goal should be: Rip gets one point per shot attempt. If Rip finishes the series with a PPS of ~1.0, Bowen did a good job. I think this is perfectly doable by Bowen, mainly because Rip takes a lot of jumpers, doesn't go to the rack aggresively trying to get fouls (or at least in comparison to some other scorers in the league), and doesn't take that many treys.

In the last game the Spurs played against Detroit, Manu played only 16 minutes. This was by design, because Manu missed the previous 5 games with a groin strain, and this was the first game coming back from the injury, thus Pop limited his minutes. He finished the game with 14 points, 4-6 FG%, 2-3 3PT%, 4-6 FT%, 4 Reb, 3 Ast in just 16 minutes. He was very efficient while being guarded by the 'stopper' Prince. Furthermore, I think most Pistons fans haven't seen this version of Manu in the playoffs, and they will be ready for a rude awakening once they watch him play. Manu has been a top 3 player in productivity in the entire league during the entire playoffs. The Pistons don't have anyone remotely as good as him that could match this year Manu's playoffs performance. Mark my words, Manu will be too handful for Prince, and Rip will end up defending him (similarly to what happened with Wade). He is just too quick for Prince.

IMHO, Rasheed Wallace is one of the best Duncan's defenders in the league. This observation comes from the regular season games against the Blazers. I don't think Rasheed has seen Duncan playing in playoff's mode though. It will be an interesting matchup. Detroit has enough bodies to frustrate Duncan. It is critical that Nazr gets it going from the very beginning.

It is extremely important that TP exploits his speed advantage against Billups and takes it to the rack. He should not be afraid of absorbing contact. This will increase his confidence, and quite possible increase the fouls on Detroit's bigs. Floaters, short jumpers, layups, anything at close distance. TP should try to hit 75% of his FT in this series. If TP just settles for outside jumpers while shooting at very high rate (the second FGA/g on the team), the Spurs will be in trouble.

In general, the Spurs should try to exploit the speed advantage they have against the Pistons and run them to death. If the Spurs get a significant advantage in transition points, they may have an easier series than expected.

Good Times http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/images/smilies/smismokin.gif

[SPARKY]

Detroit will need to get out and run to get some easy scores on the Spurs. Problem is, the Spurs definitely have the best transition defense in the NBA. Again, Detroit's relatively weaker offense will be their downfall against these Spurs.

I agree that the key for Bowen is to make Hamilton work hard for his. If Hamilton is going up against Bruce Bruce for most of the game on the offensive end and then expected to defend Manu on the other end he is going to get worn out quick. I don't care how much energy he has, if he's playing 40+ minutes without a break on either end of the court he's going to lose his effectiveness pretty soon.

[The Mask]

I give Billups the edge simply becuase Parker has weak 3 ball. Billups will be able to sag back and play the penetration.

[SPARKY]

I give Billups the edge simply becuase Parker has weak 3 ball. Billups will be able to sag back and play the penetration.

Please dare him to shoot.

[The Mask]

Please dare him to shoot.

They likely will. If he is off, he is waaaay off.

[SPARKY]

Others have tried that. They are now home watching basketball.

[Ginofan]

http://www.grioo.com/images/rubriques/3/2596.jpg
Believe!

[theMUHMEshow]

Chauncy will be the next Gary Payton for Tony... alot bigger than him but can in no way keep up with the speed of Parker.


HELLO!!!! WE PLAYED IVERSON THE FIRST ROUND!!!!UMM AND WE PLAYED HIM LAST YEAR....AND WE PLAY HIIM 4 TIMES A YEAR!!!! CHAUNCEY GUARDS HIM...I THINK HE IS USED TO GUARDING SOMEONE WITH A QUICK FIRST STEP AND SOMEONE THAT CAN CREATE OFFENSE....

Bowen is your key to winning...if he hits the open shots, you guys have a great chance to win...TP Billups matchup will cancel eachother out...And I think I am being generous! WHO WAS THE FINALS MVP LAST YEAR???????

come on guys at least be objective with your homerism

[vanvannen]

This is definitely a tough match up for us. I would have gone with Miami every day of the week.
I think every player in this Detroit squad can score if we let him loose. The key would probably be a good 3p defense on Chauncy and Rip. TP should not allow the 3 from Billups and force him to penetrate. Chauncy is no Steve Nash, he will get trapped with our bigs, he won't be able to keep the dribble alive like Nash or find a team-mate with some miraculous pass.
We should go with Manu against Prince with slashing and try to finish to draw fouls from their bigs or finding Tim or Mohammed for the layup/dunk.
Although Manu can’t guard Prince, I don’t think he is such an offensive threat really. We should benefit from that match up.

[duncan_21]

LOL I've always thought that aswell.


Isn't the stones the trailblazers nickname? :smokin

[The Mask]

This is definitely a tough match up for us. I would have gone with Miami every day of the week.
I think every player in this Detroit squad can score if we let him loose. The key would probably be a good 3p defense on Chauncy and Rip. TP should not allow the 3 from Billups and force him to penetrate. Chauncy is no Steve Nash, he will get trapped with our bigs, he won't be able to keep the dribble alive like Nash or find a team-mate with some miraculous pass.
We should go with Manu against Prince with slashing and try to finish to draw fouls from their bigs or finding Tim or Mohammed for the layup/dunk.
Although Manu can’t guard Prince, I don’t think he is such an offensive threat really. We should benefit from that match up.

Prince is the Pistons most consistant offensive player. The fact is you have to defend all five, becuase all five can score.

[vanvannen]

Prince is the Pistons most consistant offensive player.

I have no doubt he is the most consistent scorer. Bowen had the best 3p% in 2003 and I would never say he is a best 3p shooter than Kerr.

[QUOTE=The fact is you have to defend all five, becuase all five can score.[/QUOTE]

That's exactly what I said in my post.

[TwoHandJam]

Prince is the Pistons most consistant offensive player. The fact is you have to defend all five, becuase all five can score.
Isn't Hamilton the most consistent at .48 fg% vs. Prince at .45? It seems to me he and Chauncey are the go to guys when you really need a basket. Even if you believe Prince is the most consistent, Rip still scores the majority of your points.

[TwoHandJam]

Nobody seems to have commented on one of the main thrusts of my initial post. Do we have an advantage if Parker plays off-guard and Manu handles the ball in stretches as he did against the Suns?

[HB22inSA]

This is the mis-match of the series, heavily in favor of Detroit.

[SPARKY]

Nobody seems to have commented on one of the main thrusts of my initial post. Do we have an advantage if Parker plays off-guard and Manu handles the ball in stretches as he did against the Suns?

Manu is definitely the better creator against good defensive units. If the Spurs aren't able to get out and run I suspect that Manu will start handling the rock in some of the halfcourt sets.

[The Mask]

Isn't Hamilton the most consistent at .48 fg% vs. Prince at .45? It seems to me he and Chauncey are the go to guys when you really need a basket. Even if you believe Prince is the most consistent, Rip still scores the majority of your points.

If you saw the MIA series Rip wasn't very consistant.

[ducks]

I think you see what Parker does to begin with
then what larry counters with
then pop can counter him and move tp to the 2 guard

[ducks]

This is the mis-match of the series, heavily in favor of Detroit.

alot thought mvp nash would destroy parker

[picnroll]

Billups will have to outplay Parker and by a fairly wide margin for the Pistons to win this series. If Parker even keeps the Parker - Billups matchup reasonably close the Pistons will lose.

[TwoHandJam]

If you saw the MIA series Rip wasn't very consistant.
Um, ok but the term "consistent" by definition doesn't imply performance in one series but performance against all teams. In that respect, Hamilton is your most consistent scorer. Whether he will be consistent with Bowen guarding him is yet to be seen.

[SPARKY]

Um, ok but the term "consistent" by definition doesn't imply performance in one series but performance against all teams. In that respect, Hamilton is your most consistent scorer. Whether he will be consistent with Bowen guarding him is yet to be seen.


Bowen will make Hamilton work offensively, no matter what. If Hamilton is also expected to spend time trying to shut down Manu he is going to lose his effectiveness quick.

[1Parker1]

I like the idea of having Manu handle the ball if Tony is struggling. This will give him some of his confidence back. Last series, Parker wasn't really looking for the assist anyways as much as he should have. Pop needs to remind him to continue to play agressive, because even if he is missing shots, Tony needs to realize that just by his penetrating and using speed, that makes the other guy work on defense and wears him down.

[Louae]

HELLO!!!! WE PLAYED IVERSON THE FIRST ROUND!!!!UMM AND WE PLAYED HIM LAST YEAR....AND WE PLAY HIIM 4 TIMES A YEAR!!!! CHAUNCEY GUARDS HIM...I THINK HE IS USED TO GUARDING SOMEONE WITH A QUICK FIRST STEP AND SOMEONE THAT CAN CREATE OFFENSE....

come on guys at least be objective with your homerism

Unfortunately, Iverson doesn't have Duncan or Manu to drop it off to when he penetrates as Parker will.

[Rick Von Braun]

I like the idea of having Manu handle the ball if Tony is struggling. This will give him some of his confidence back. Last series, Parker wasn't really looking for the assist anyways as much as he should have. Pop needs to remind him to continue to play agressive, because even if he is missing shots, Tony needs to realize that just by his penetrating and using speed, that makes the other guy work on defense and wears him down. BINGO! The key is for Parker to keep penetrating and maximize his talent and natural speed. Even if his shot does not fall, he would draw defenders out of position, or draw fouls, or allow our bigs to get offensive rebounds and putbacks. I would rather TP doing that (even when his shot does not fall) than him taking long jumpers that are low percenatge shots.

[spurs_fan_in_exile]

We've all said it at least a few times apiece on this board during the regular season, if Parker stays aggressive good things will eventually come from it. It's basically going to be a race to see who can get the other guy in foul trouble first. If Parker gets the lead in that early then the Pistons are in major trouble. Watching the Heat series the offense really starts hurting when Billups hits the bench. It's not quite as bad as when Nash would sit for the Suns, but the lag is noticeable.

Ultimately I like Tony in this matchup because he's got the younger legs in this war of attrition that they are going to wage. I think that Billups is going to get tired of chasing Parker faster than Parker will get tired from Billups trying to post him or anything else.

[tlongII]

The keys to this series will be Duncan vs Sheed and the speed at which the game is played. Sheed must at least hold his own against Duncan although it will be difficult. He has played well against Duncan in the past, but we all know that TD is the superior player. The Spurs will need to get their transition game going to have a chance. If it's a slow-down half-court game the Pistons will win.

[picnroll]

Parker needs to penetrate and unless he's absolutely certain he canget to the rim uncontestd he needs to put up the floater. Even if the floater doesn't go down, if he draws the bigs to contest it Nazr and TD can clean up the putbacks.

[SPARKY]

The keys to this series will be Duncan vs Sheed and the speed at which the game is played. Sheed must at least hold his own against Duncan although it will be difficult. He has played well against Duncan in the past, but we all know that TD is the superior player. The Spurs will need to get their transition game going to have a chance. If it's a slow-down half-court game the Pistons will win.


Ha. Pistons need some prayers if they are going to score against the best defense in the NBA in the halfcourt.

[td4mvp3]

yeah, i'm not buying the slow down half court game as the spurs demise. weren't they built for the half-court? wasn't the big surprise from last series the fact that the spurs were outrunning and gunning the runner gunner sunners? i'd be stunned if the spurs lost this series, to be honest. if you check the matchup stats on espn, the spurs score more points and play at least as good of defense as the pistons. certainly the pistons may stun us all like they did last year, but that would be the point: it would be stunning.

[The Mask]

yeah, i'm not buying the slow down half court game as the spurs demise. weren't they built for the half-court? wasn't the big surprise from last series the fact that the spurs were outrunning and gunning the runner gunner sunners? i'd be stunned if the spurs lost this series, to be honest. if you check the matchup stats on espn, the spurs score more points and play at least as good of defense as the pistons. certainly the pistons may stun us all like they did last year, but that would be the point: it would be stunning.

Prepare to get stunned.

[SPARKY]

Prepare to get stunned.

After you.

How do you expect your weaker offense to produce against a better halfcourt defense?

Methinks Piston fan didn't see much of the Spurs this season.