If you were the GM what would you do for next year ?

[ginobili fan]

with this roster and of course with common sense.

[admiralsnackbar]

I would blame everything on Pop and Bonner and then kill myself.

[ginobili fan]

I would blame everything on Pop and Bonner and then kill myself.

:lmao:lmao:lmao
No hope is... No hope...

[ginobili fan]

Seriously I don't see any issues if killing myself too if I was the GM.

[Chomag]

Spurs need to get rid of all the deadweight they have accumulated over the last few years, but unfortunately thats more then half this team. However honestly at this moment of time I just don't know.

[SpurOutofTownFan]

I would bring PJ Carlesimo back and ask Pop to gracefully retire. Even OKC has to admit they owe some of what is going on right now to him.

[admiralsnackbar]

:lmao:lmao:lmao
No hope is... No hope...
I was fucking with you. :toast

[Texas_Ranger]

Draft a guy that's 7 ft
Sign some solid FA that can play defense
Trade Bonner, Jefferson & Blair

[nkdlunch]

#1 priority - ship Parker out
#2 - retire Pop
#3 - ship Bonner out

[SpurOutofTownFan]

#1 priority - ship Parker out
#2 - retire Pop
#3 - ship Bonner out

This makes sense

[Cane]

If I can dream: Parker, Blair, and whatever for CP3 or Deron Williams

[Spurtacus]

Bonner/Jefferson/Hill/Blair for Dwight Howard

Spurfan in Wonderland

[vander]

Trade Manu for pick(s)
Trade Parker for pick(s)
Trade RJ for pick(s)

Trade picks for star player if possible, otherwise, tank in 2011-12 for great lotto pick

[DesignatedT]

Revamp the entire front line except for tiago and tim.

[AusSpursFan]

I think the time has come to shake up the big three, and if you can find a way of getting rid of RJ then throw that one in also

[ElNono]

Try to lure Sam Presti out of OKC and back into the organization...

[NewcastleKEG]

Trade Manu for pick(s)
Trade Parker for pick(s)
Trade RJ for pick(s)

Trade picks for star player if possible, otherwise, tank in 2011-12 for great lotto pick
100% Agree

Problem: If Duncan doesn't retire are you willing to deal him for draft picks/young player? Why watch him suffer on a ''tanking'' team?

[vander]

100% Agree

Problem: If Duncan doesn't retire are you willing to deal him for draft picks/young player? Why watch him suffer on a ''tanking'' team?

If he wants out, he can have out. if he wants buyout, IR, Trade, whatever, he'll get it. He's TD, He's the ONLY reason the Spurs have ANY rings

[Doctor J]

At least, I would do my best in getting rid of RJ and Bonner.

No offence! But why should I keep the players who would disappear in the post season?

Shaking the Big 3 at this stage is too risky.

I am not a Splitter person, but I would do whatever it takes to get him a starting job.

[NewcastleKEG]

Understood, anyway the situation isn't a clear one because Duncan makes 21M next year? Whose going to take that contract AND deal you worthwhile pieces in return?

[vander]

Understood, anyway the situation isn't a clear one because Duncan makes 21M next year? Whose going to take that contract AND deal you worthwhile pieces in return?

doesn't matter, I'd Take Gilbert fucking Arenas's contract (plus some picks) if TD said he wanted to go to Orlando.

or buy him out for most of the 21 mil if he wanted

[DPG21920]

It's almost impossible (for me at least) to know how next year is going to look. Even if you take that uncertainty out and pretend every thing will go on as it currently is, the Spurs are going to have an extremely difficult road ahead regardless of which direction they decide to go.

[TDMVPDPOY]

Understood, anyway the situation isn't a clear one because Duncan makes 21M next year? Whose going to take that contract AND deal you worthwhile pieces in return?

only one team i think and thats the blazers

they probably wanna get rid of roy and watever bum they on that team...

[z0sa]

Time to blow things up in either a last ditch attempt to stir the pot or as an acceptance that we are no longer contenders (probably both at the same time). Preferably by going back to the defensive style of play we once held so dear.

Get Manu out of here; sorry to say it, but the dude has had multiple types of injuries for several straight years. We'll never forget 03-07, dude, but we shouldn't ignore 08-11 because of those great years. good bye for the best deal we can get (preferably picks or a similar caliber player thats around 7ft).

Build around Parker. It's time to accept we are probably no longer a championship caliber team, and Parker is in his prime and will bring fans to the stadium, and may even be able to propel us into the playoffs with a little help.

RJ might be able to stay with Manu gone, but I'd try to deal him for picks or a big/wing if we trade Manu for a big as well.

Tim Duncan's not too shabby for his age and mileage, but the dude has had no help down low for far too many years.

And Pop. Who do you replace Pop with? Probably no one. But I haven't been more frustrated with him since the 06 small-ball debacle.

As for the rest of the role players ... no one is untouchable, everyone is on the trading block. Attempting to contend again should be firmly matched against rebuilding options and the best deals available should designate which route we take.

[rascal]

#1 priority - ship Parker out
#2 - retire Pop
#3 - ship Bonner out

The team needs to get younger, more athletic and bigger. They came back with the same team as last year. How do you expect different results in the playoffs with the same team that could not get out of the 2nd round.

Its time for some big moves to shakeup the roster. No more conservative line of thinking, bringing this same team back again.

Trade Manu out for a front line starter. Revamp the front line. Get rid of Bonner Splitter Jefferson and McDyess. Manu is getting over the hill and injured too often(4 years now in the playoffs) to be relied on anymore. He won't be worth the lenght of his contract.


Move Hill into starting sg, also develope Anderson next year. Hill will not develope into the player he can be as long as Manu is on the team. Give Hill starters minutes and watch him grow into a top player. We saw glimpses of his ability last year at times. It's a confidence issue with him and regular playing time will work wonders for him.

Hill and Anderson can cover the sg slot. Get a true backup pg.

[wildbill2u]

with this roster and of course with common sense.

Buy a copy of "The Rules and Art of the Ancient Rite of Suppuku" in English.

[baseline bum]

Like I said in the other thread...



I just don't think there is another year in the team. They came out pissed this year and played balls out after the disappointment of 2010, but, as March and beyond have shown, the Spurs are now in a no-man's land of being a first round team with a second round ceiling whose core is declining fast. The only reason not to completely blow the team up is because Tim doesn't deserve to be stuck in a rebuilding effort. I think it needs to be done though.

Tony and Tiago have good value going forward, but of course make them available if someone offers a really nice package. Hill and Blair are talented players who I think can be counted on to be decent role players going ahead.

Go in the lotto this next year and maybe pick up a talented young forward like Anthony Davis, Harrison Barnes, Michael Gilchrist, James McAdoo, Jared Sullinger, or Perry Jones or maybe a promising guard like Austin Rivers. The 2013 draft has some promising bigman prospects with Andre Drummond, Dajuan Coleman, and Isaiah Austin, but of course that's a long way off and who knows how many of these guys live up to the hype. I'd like the team to be drafting high in each of the two drafts after this season's.

I just don't want to pass up having a good 2012 pick when there isn't a lot to gain by bringing the team back next season. The Spurs could really get a nice player in what looks like it could be another 2008-level draft (the one with Rose, Beasley, Mayo, Westbrook, Love, Gallinari, Gordon, Lopez, Hibbert, McGee, Ibaka, Batum, Hill, Jordan, and Dragic). I think Manu still has enough left in the tank to get a nice young player in exchange for him.

If there's one thing you can give credit to Stern for, it's that a small market can build a title contender with smart moves. The Spurs proved it over the past 15 years and now the Thunder are doing the same. While Tim Duncans and Kevin Durants don't come around that often in the draft, this front office has shown the ability to get tremendous value with picks like Parker, Ginobili, Hill, Blair, and Giricek. The Spurs won't be a title contender without landing the next Duncan (or Durant), but they can be a good playoff team with some upside again in a few years if their trend with the draft can hold up.

I don't want to see the front office just kick the can down the road; it's getting near time to build a new Spurs team from the ashes of this incredible one that has given us fans so much. I do hope to keep Pop, as has consistently developed young players who no one gave much of a chance to do much: think Malik Rose, Tony Parker, Stephen Jackson, and George Hill.

[rascal]

At least, I would do my best in getting rid of RJ and Bonner.

No offence! But why should I keep the players who would disappear in the post season?

Shaking the Big 3 at this stage is too risky.

I am not a Splitter person, but I would do whatever it takes to get him a starting job.

Its time to take risks. It was time 3 years ago. The big three as the best players on the team can't do it anymore.

Splitter is not a starting worthy NBA player.

[objective]

if I were the GM, or giving my layperson advice to the GM, I would go for the "keep it fun and watchable" tactic.

Meaning, this era is over. The title window has closed.

But, that doesn't mean there still can't be enjoyable basketball.

They just have to get rid of players who drain the enjoyment of Spurs basketball. Mainly Jefferson and Bonner. Package Hill and Blair and anything else possible, but they have to be gotten rid of.

Let McDyess go into retirement or eat his buyout.

Bring in youth and play them. Even if they're not any good, they should be enjoyable. Be it Ryan Richards and his bum shoulders, or Nando De Colo and his ridiculous turnovers, or Viktor Sanikidze with his old man looks and fierce passion for the game. I'd rather spend the next 3 seasons watching those guys struggle and try too figure it out alongside Tiago and Parker and Ginobili or whoever than watch 3 more years of Jefferson and Bonner and their ilk.

And that's enough. Maybe a scorched earth rebuilding like unloading Parker or Ginobili might be quicker to another run as contenders, but I feel as a Spurs fan that I still want to enjoy being able to watch Ginobili and Parker and Duncan play, just without the baggage of apathy or flummoxed inadequacy of RJ and Bonner or the age of McDyess.

Give other teams permission to talk to Pop. It's not about firing or getting rid of Pop, it's about giving him the opportunity to take jobs he might enjoy more. Lakers, Knicks, Magic, all those teams among others could have vacancies and are willing to pay the big bucks. Pop isn't necessary for a long re-build, neither is Budenholzer. I don't have any alternative that I'd like to see coach, only the feeling that Pop shouldn't have to be obligated to finish coaching this floundering team.

[Agloco]

with this roster and of course with common sense.

I'd kick back and continue enjoying my 7 figure salary. I'd tell the entire roster to do the same.

[Sisk]

This makes sense

:lmao

[Master splitter]

Trade splitter, Blair, Neal, and mcdyse for Kevin love and rights to Ricky Rubio. And hopefully Duncan retires or takes less money to sign free agent Dwight Howard. Trade RJ,bonner, and first round draft pick for Thadeus young. Sign Andre kirelinko or tayshawn prince (back up sf.) at MLE.
C.-Howard/Richards
Pf.-Kevin love/duncan
sf.-Thadeus young/Ak/deshawn butler
Sg.-George hill/Manu/James Anderson
Pg.-Parker/Rubio
And a new coach. Take a hike pop
Sg.-hill/Manu/James A

[wildbill2u]

Spurs need to get rid of all the deadweight they have accumulated over the last few years, but unfortunately thats more then half this team. However honestly at this moment of time I just don't know.

Here's what we have:

Duncan--probably will retire after this fiasco, but if not will not be able to anchor the team. If he stays, he'll have to give up even more minutes and that won't be a problem for a classy guy, but might push a proud superstar into retirement.

Manu--wonderful player, often injured, best possible trade material we have--but I'd hate to lose him for a nothing player half as good. Still good and great at times. The will to win of a great superstar. Let's keep him.

Parker--Tradeable for a decent player--but most teams don't try to trade you even up with a quality player in exchange--and what do you have left without him? Hill?

RJ: Based on the two years here, he is untradeable at his salary level and length of contract. We rolled the dice and lost.

McDyess: An old stallion that still wants to answer the bugles call. Could play a little bench time if he decides to stay on aftet this. Good locker room guy.

Bonner: Simply can't hang with the big boys on defense. OK if he can outshoot the opposition, but Memphis out-coached Pop on this and rendered him ineffective at the 3. As a Hero, he is just a sandwich. Too bad Isaiah Thomas isn't a GM somewhere because he probably is untradeable. A guy like Steve Novak is cheaper and might be a better risk.
I doubt we can get rid of him. ARRRRGH!

Hill: Will never have the killer instinct of a Ginobelli or the resourcefulness of an Indiana Jones. The thought of Hill taking over the Parker minutes permanently should send a chill through everyone. Might be one of the few possibilities we have as trade bait, but we'd probably get someone who sucks.

Neal: Proved he can play a role in this league. Lots of teams will want him, but we should keep him and develop his D. Tough kid with a shooters eye.

Blair: Tough call to say trade this hard-working nice kid--but his liabilities as either a 5 (way too short) or a 4 (too slow or unathletic and no reliable 15 foot shot) against quality opponents have been exposed. When Pop gave Splitter some Blair minutes, he might as well have announced the end of the experiment. Unfortunately, these lack of physical skills and physique limit his value as trade bait. Might get a second round pick with no ACLs for him.

Splitter: Pop delayed his development while rooting for Blair to work out. Too bad he lost this season, but he is the only potential center on our horizon. Not to get into the argument about whether he's gonna be good, bad, or indifferent, let me repeat: HE IS THE ONLY POTENTIAL CENTER ON OUR HORIZON. We'll have to see what he has next year since Pop went with Blair this year. He stays.

What's his name? our rookie draftee? Roberts?, Johnson? Anderson? yeah that's right. And shows what we no about him. No experinence gained this wasted year. As a very low draft pick, he'd be up against other low draft pickes from this year's class if we tried to trade him--and what GM wants a guy that wasn't good enough to play. The GMs can draft their own gambles at those draft slots.

Da Sean Butler; God if he were only to turn our to be half as good as our old Sean. Who knows what he's got left after the injury. FO can flip a coin as to whether to keep him and no one will care which side comes up.

Green, Quin, Novak: Spear carriers in the Opera get more face time than these guys. They really don't matter in rebuilding the team in the long run.

So if you add it all up, we have damn little to trade if we are to remain respectable by keeping the now Middle-level 3 and a problem going forward with them still in key roles.

We ought to ask them if they would like to be traded, even if we have to give them away for players of lesser quality. We owe them for some championship years.

Maybe we should blow it up (Give the Big 3 their unconditional release so they can find their own team) and come in dead last in the league three years in a row and get the next Duncan, Rose, and Kobe in the draft. We should be so lucky.

[NewJerSpur]

James Anderson/Ryan Richards on the way out this mofo.

[kaji157]

Trade Ginobili and Duncan to a team that would become a championship contender with these two so that they can win another championship.
Getting back young players and draft pick for this year's and next year's draft, setting a high possibility that we can get the 1st overall seed in next years draft.

[kaji157]

Trade Ginobili and Duncan to a team that would become a championship contender with these two so that they can win another championship.
Getting back young players and draft pick for this year's and next year's draft, setting a high possibility that we can get the 1st overall seed in next years draft.

[Spurs Brazil]

Spurs can do with Dice what they did with Ferry and Bruce.

I hope the Dice package includes Bonner :drunk

[TDMVPDPOY]

absorb whatever the magic wants to shed salary in a package where d12 is involve, im sure they wanna get rid of agent zeros and turgos contract

[kaji157]

Here's what we have:

Duncan--probably will retire after this fiasco, but if not will not be able to anchor the team. If he stays, he'll have to give up even more minutes and that won't be a problem for a classy guy, but might push a proud superstar into retirement.

Manu--wonderful player, often injured, best possible trade material we have--but I'd hate to lose him for a nothing player half as good. Still good and great at times. The will to win of a great superstar. Let's keep him.

Parker--Tradeable for a decent player--but most teams don't try to trade you even up with a quality player in exchange--and what do you have left without him? Hill?

RJ: Based on the two years here, he is untradeable at his salary level and length of contract. We rolled the dice and lost.

McDyess: An old stallion that still wants to answer the bugles call. Could play a little bench time if he decides to stay on aftet this. Good locker room guy.

Bonner: Simply can't hang with the big boys on defense. OK if he can outshoot the opposition, but Memphis out-coached Pop on this and rendered him ineffective at the 3. As a Hero, he is just a sandwich. Too bad Isaiah Thomas isn't a GM somewhere because he probably is untradeable. A guy like Steve Novak is cheaper and might be a better risk.
I doubt we can get rid of him. ARRRRGH!

Hill: Will never have the killer instinct of a Ginobelli or the resourcefulness of an Indiana Jones. The thought of Hill taking over the Parker minutes permanently should send a chill through everyone. Might be one of the few possibilities we have as trade bait, but we'd probably get someone who sucks.

Neal: Proved he can play a role in this league. Lots of teams will want him, but we should keep him and develop his D. Tough kid with a shooters eye.

Blair: Tough call to say trade this hard-working nice kid--but his liabilities as either a 5 (way too short) or a 4 (too slow or unathletic and no reliable 15 foot shot) against quality opponents have been exposed. When Pop gave Splitter some Blair minutes, he might as well have announced the end of the experiment. Unfortunately, these lack of physical skills and physique limit his value as trade bait. Might get a second round pick with no ACLs for him.

Splitter: Pop delayed his development while rooting for Blair to work out. Too bad he lost this season, but he is the only potential center on our horizon. Not to get into the argument about whether he's gonna be good, bad, or indifferent, let me repeat: HE IS THE ONLY POTENTIAL CENTER ON OUR HORIZON. We'll have to see what he has next year since Pop went with Blair this year. He stays.

What's his name? our rookie draftee? Roberts?, Johnson? Anderson? yeah that's right. And shows what we no about him. No experinence gained this wasted year. As a very low draft pick, he'd be up against other low draft pickes from this year's class if we tried to trade him--and what GM wants a guy that wasn't good enough to play. The GMs can draft their own gambles at those draft slots.

Da Sean Butler; God if he were only to turn our to be half as good as our old Sean. Who knows what he's got left after the injury. FO can flip a coin as to whether to keep him and no one will care which side comes up.

Green, Quin, Novak: Spear carriers in the Opera get more face time than these guys. They really don't matter in rebuilding the team in the long run.

So if you add it all up, we have damn little to trade if we are to remain respectable by keeping the now Middle-level 3 and a problem going forward with them still in key roles.

We ought to ask them if they would like to be traded, even if we have to give them away for players of lesser quality. We owe them for some championship years.

Maybe we should blow it up (Give the Big 3 their unconditional release so they can find their own team) and come in dead last in the league three years in a row and get the next Duncan, Rose, and Kobe in the draft. We should be so lucky.

San Antonio big 3 is not as bad as you put it, the problem is they have NO ONE behind him.
Look at the other teams 4th best players.

Boston: anyone of the BIG 3 (because Rondo is already superior to at leats 2 of them)
Lakers: Artest or Odom depends on how you want to call it.
Miami: Doesn't have, but will soon after this year and their big 3 is better and younger.
Knicks: If Billups retires i don't know what they will be, but i bet a lot of wannabes and oldtimers will look at that island to hang a while.
Chicago: See knicks, and Derrick Rose is like MJ (for the refs)
OKC: See chicago with Durant.

[NewcastleKEG]

Trade splitter, Blair, Neal, and mcdyse for Kevin love and rights to Ricky Rubio. And hopefully Duncan retires or takes less money to sign free agent Dwight Howard. Trade RJ,bonner, and first round draft pick for Thadeus young. Sign Andre kirelinko or tayshawn prince (back up sf.) at MLE.
C.-Howard/Richards
Pf.-Kevin love/duncan
sf.-Thadeus young/Ak/deshawn butler
Sg.-George hill/Manu/James Anderson
Pg.-Parker/Rubio
And a new coach. Take a hike pop
Sg.-hill/Manu/James A
Few issues

Wolves have one single piece from folding that franchise and it's Love. Why deal him for 4 bench players? They can get more from Love than that package from the Spurs. This site written at the All Star break has Hill, Blair and Splitter for Love. But this was of course when Hill & especially Blair had higher values. Your certainty not getting Love & Rubio.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/569090-nba-trade-rumors-10-potential-fits-for-kevin-love-outside-of-minnesota#/articles/569090-nba-trade-rumors-10-potential-fits-for-kevin-love-outside-of-minnesota/page/2


Thing about Howard is it most likely will be a sign n trade. Magic won't let another Shaq happen and especially after seeing what's happened to Cleveland. A Bynum (+ others) for a Howard is more likely BUT either way why would Howard sign with the Spurs to get his head knocked in by superior teams in the Conference. He's already gone through the building a franchise years, he won't want to do it in his peak & downward years

Given the Sixers encouraging performance this season why would they take a step back by agreeing to take on dead weight with Jefferson & Bonner?

ONLY way the Spurs are able to ditch both or (gulp) even one of the Jefferson/Bonners is if they give up something in exchange. No one is gonna take your debt AND give you a player/draft pick (value) in exchange

Basically Spurs are screwed for the the season or two unless they unload Parker & Manu. Even then how do you dump the 50 million for Jefferson and Bonner?

Best case scenario for the Spurs long term is deal Parker/Manu for draft picks/young players and then trade Hill + Jefferson/Bonner for draft pick/young players. Get yourself in the lottery for 2013. With the correct moves you could be the Thunder in 2014/2015.

Worst case scenario for Spurs long term is holding onto Duncan, Manu and Parker as they retire 1 by 1, Spurs keep losing in the 1st Round while not adding any legit young prospects. In 2,3 years they are the Detroit Pistons and in 5 years they are a small market team with a bunch of money.

You could be talking about a decade long rebuilding process at that point. Look at the Bulls

[TDMVPDPOY]

Basically Spurs are screwed for the the season or two unless they unload Parker & Manu. Even then how do you dump the 50 million for Jefferson and Bonner?

Best case scenario for the Spurs long term is deal Parker/Manu for draft picks/young players and then trade Hill + Jefferson/Bonner for draft pick/young players. Get yourself in the lottery for 2013. With the correct moves you could be the Thunder in 2014/2015.

You could be talking about a decade long rebuilding process at that point. Look at the Bulls

if you want d12, must either also absorb their bed ridden contracts in turgo and arenas...i doubt the magic want anything to do with these 2 clowns if howard is bolting, you cant build around with those 2 shitty pieces after what they have shown nothing since being traded to the magic.

if you wanna rebuild quick? either have 4-5 picks in a single year or 2 consecutive years, just like what the thunder and blazers manage to do to keep a young core together as many years to build a team. What we dont need is to go through the system like some teams who always had high picks that ended up doing shit all with them and continue to stay a avg team aka farm teams like the clippers, warriors

as for the bulls? dont bring them up after the so many years of gettin free picks from the knicks and mounting to shit players who have breakout years on a shitty team then gettin traded to the knicks again for more picks...lol eddy curry and tyson chandler, hinrich, crawford, brand etc....they had so many good young prospects from lottery picks ended up jackshit

[outmap]

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3wo8qcy

or this

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3pg8zv5

or this

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3nombda

whomever is dumb enough to take it. throw in a couple of picks.

[Master splitter]

Thanks, now i feel worse. But I really don't think love will stay and dwight Howard won't be with the magic next year. Hopefully Richards and desean butler can bring some talent, this is all we can hope for. So sad the way it ended for us I really thougt we were gonna go all the way with this team. Freakin pop and bonner

[Ginobili2Duncan]

It is time to start over and there is no use prolonging it. You can customize an old broken down car all you want, but at the end of the day it still won't run for you. That's where the Spurs find themselves now. They have tried to squeeze a few more seasons out of this nucleus for a few years now.

The reality is that this could very well be Duncan's last season when you factor in the possibility of a lockout next season. Duncan has always been a low-key guy and his retirement will be symbolic of his demeanor over his career. And I don't think Duncan would have it any other way. I think it would be better for him to go out gracefully, when he believes he has a little bit left in the tank. As opposed to guys like Favre or O'Neal, it's obvious they should've retired years ago.

If the Spurs FO are honest with themselves, they would know that the time has come to start over. Move players like Parker and McDyess. And attempt to move Jefferson, Bonner and even Ginobili. The Spurs should start looking to get draft picks to stockpile young talent. And in the event that they find a piece to their puzzle, some of that talent can be used as trade bait. Hopefully the Spurs have the same fortune as the Thunder in the next five years. However, teams have to get worse before they get better.

[NewcastleKEG]

if you want d12, must either also absorb their bed ridden contracts in turgo and arenas...i doubt the magic want anything to do with these 2 clowns if howard is bolting, you cant build around with those 2 shitty pieces after what they have shown nothing since being traded to the magic.

if you wanna rebuild quick? either have 4-5 picks in a single year or 2 consecutive years, just like what the thunder and blazers manage to do to keep a young core together as many years to build a team. What we dont need is to go through the system like some teams who always had high picks that ended up doing shit all with them and continue to stay a avg team aka farm teams like the clippers, warriors

as for the bulls? dont bring them up after the so many years of gettin free picks from the knicks and mounting to shit players who have breakout years on a shitty team then gettin traded to the knicks again for more picks...lol eddy curry and tyson chandler, hinrich, crawford, brand etc....they had so many good young prospects from lottery picks ended up jackshit
The Bulls comparison is the one major bright spot working in the Spurs favor. They have a reliable and proven track record of drafting well and finding hidden gems. Bulls, like you posted wasted a huge amount of talent over that time period.

[ducks]

spurs have not seen enough of splitter to get rid of him

[ducks]

manu and duncan for ?

package them both together you could get two young studs

[5in10]

Trade Blair and whoever for varejao.

[stealthjbravo]

Spurs need to pick up Shaq, Grant Hill and Allen Iverson. That is 3 championships guaranteed.

[DirkDoesWork]

Trade Jim Dunnan to the Bucks
Parker to the Knicks
Jefferson for anyone offering anything
Keep Ginobili to teach the newcomers how to flop like a boss

[stealthjbravo]

Trade Tim, Manu, or Parker to the mavs so they can have someone with a championship ring in the locker room.

[Master splitter]

Trade Jim Dunnan to the Bucks
Parker to the Knicks
Jefferson for anyone offering anything
Keep Ginobili to teach the newcomers how to flop like a boss

How about Tim Duncan for "dirk NoRingski" lol hey how about we trade our team logos, spurs logo for your stupid sissy my little pony logo lol

[DJ Mbenga]

tell duncan look we are gonna blow it up you want to stay or retire, youve earned the right to know. then trade ginobli and parker, try to package jefferson with one of them and start from scratch.

[DirkDoesWork]

Yeah, I'd love to have a logo that looks like a bedazzled Spur

[Man In Black]

Yao Ming or Greg Oden? Just throwing it out there. Would you be willing to see them re-hab in hopes of gaining their prodigious skills to give this team the defensive lockdown middle?

[Capt Bringdown]

I don't think there's a move to put us back in contention. Integrate Splitter and try to get rid of some of the dead wood - but there's no getting around us being stuck with RJ and Bonner, right?
If we can get upgrades on Dice, Hill & Blair, we'll be competitive/entertaining in the regular season, and that'll be enough to keep butts in the seats.

[DirkISaCocLuvinPuSSy]

try and get Roy Hibbirt trade Tony and Manu for picks and become a defensive team like the good old days and try and be a 03-05 Pistons type team

[20beastie45]

I would find a way to get rid of Novak, Quinn, Jefferson, Blair, Bonner, and maybe Hill. Maybe for a solid draft pick(6'8 to 6'10 small forward or 6'9 to 6'11 front court scorer) and some solid veteran players. Maybe just straight up for other players. IDK.

If we can't land a athletic SF or a scoring PF with a trade, we look for the best possible options in free agency.

Then get a nasty shot blocker to back up Tim.

Give Tiago more playing time

[SenorSpur]

For starters, face the honest reality that this run is over. Begin by aggressively preparing for the long rebuilding effort ahead.

1. Have a heart-to-heart conversation with the Big Three (TD, Manu and Parker). Explain to them that the club is now going in a different (rebuilding) direction. Since Tim has another year to go, he'd be expected back in a backup/leadership role. Explain to Parker, that we're going to seek the best trade for him to a contender. Same for Manu, should he want to go to a contender.

2. Trade away the bad contracts (RJ, Bonner) along with its best asset (Parker) for both young players and future picks. By getting rid of RJ and Bonner, you're freeing up money and ridding the roster of non-performing role players. As a second option, I'd also consider possible, similar deals for both Hill and Blair, if they can be struck.

3. Draft the best available big man (JaJuan Johnson, Bismack Biyombo, Lucas Nogueira, Jordan Williams ) or the best available lockdown SF (Chris Singleton, Tyler Honeycutt) in the upcoming June draft.

4. Continue to build up the international feeder system by continuing to send extremely raw draft picks (i.e. Nogueira or Biyombo if drafted) and 2nd round picks over to Europe, where they can.

5. Continue to utilize and scour the D-League for young talent, which can be acquired cheaply. (i.e. Joe Alexander)

6. Make a play for young, low cost free-agents (Thaddeus Young, Luc Richard Mbah a Moute) over the summer. No mid-career vets, late 20-something or 30-somethings desired. TD and Manu, assuming they're still around, can help lead and indoctrinate the youngsters into the Spurs way.

7. Mandate the accelerated, "on-the-fly" development of the young talent on the roster. That means increaed and exclusive practice time and court time to the likes of James Anderson, Tiago Splitter, Danny Green, Ryan Richards, and DeSean Butler and whomever they draft this June. This means fielding a preferred roster, and a starting lineup next year comprised of mostly young players. A drastic shift in philosophy from anything Pop has ever done. However, the club will live with the results.

At this point, making the playoffs is no longer the goal. Getting high draft choices, stockpiling assets and acquiring young talent should be. The bad news is the Spurs will get killed in the regular season over the next few years. The good news is they should be guest participants in the NBA draft lottery for the next couple of years. Thereby, helping to speed up the talent acquisition process.

Building through the draft is the only sensible and logical way to get back to respectability and possible playoff contenton. Follow the blue print of the Thunder.

[hsxvvd]

Celebrate the title just won, make a few minor tweaks and make a run at back to back titles!






Believe.

[venitian navigator]

First, the season is still not ended...so, for being a GM, I will wait the outcome (I still believe !).

However, also in case of our first round exit, I don't know how much we can "rebuild" in the massive way many of the previous post have rapresented.
We have to consider, more than all, that our main players have given up a lot to stay with us, and probably all of them would like to remain with the team...and, frankly, I can't see Tim, or Manu, or Parker (assuming one or more of the big three are sold) baby sitting a bunch of new little guys with no chance or perspective for winning the title.

One other thing to take in consideration is that, following the summer agreements (at the base of their new contracts) both Manu and Parker will be allowed to play international this summer...and we all (and also other nba teams) know what that means 1) for their market value.
2) for their energies at the end of the regular season

One final thing to take in consideration, is that this year we had the best record quite till the end (an that means that in some way the team works).

So, what will be the realistic strategy ?

My idea : 1) stay with the actual core.
2) not play the big three at the beginning of the season, start to play them in a reserve role in january and start giving them good minutes (I mean more than 20 a game) starting from february...they already have all the "corporate knowledge" possible, and that is the only way to have them fresh at the end of the year, when it counts.
3) play the young guns

Possible starting five at the beginning of the season :

Hill - Anderson - Jefferson - Splitter - Richards

Key reserves : pg : our first round draft pick
G : Neal
F : Butler/Green
PF : Blair
C : anyone we can acquire via trade or via exceptions (or Mc Dyess/Bonner)

I prefer to lose the play offs and develop players than have nothing in return...

[spursbird]

Trade Manu for pick(s)
Trade Parker for pick(s)
Trade RJ for pick(s)

Trade picks for star player if possible, otherwise, tank in 2011-12 for great lotto pick
:toastThe same thought.
If we lose tonight, then it'd be the end of the Spurs era. We should consider rebuilding by drafting talents. And it could cost many years to put the Spurs back in track.

[TJastal]

Trade splitter, Blair, Neal, and mcdyse for Kevin love and rights to Ricky Rubio. And hopefully Duncan retires or takes less money to sign free agent Dwight Howard. Trade RJ,bonner, and first round draft pick for Thadeus young. Sign Andre kirelinko or tayshawn prince (back up sf.) at MLE.
C.-Howard/Richards
Pf.-Kevin love/duncan
sf.-Thadeus young/Ak/deshawn butler
Sg.-George hill/Manu/James Anderson
Pg.-Parker/Rubio
And a new coach. Take a hike pop
Sg.-hill/Manu/James A

Thaddeous Young is on a 2.9m contract that extends into next year. RJ & Bonner combined make 11+, how is that trade gonna work?

:lol

[cantthinkofanything]

I'd replace myself. I'm too lazy to mess with all of that.
But before that, I might trade Bonner and Parker for Chris Paul and David West.

[5in10]

Go back to 2007 in a time machine and draft Marc Gasol over stupid marcus williams.

[John Basedow]

Go back to 2007 in a time machine and draft Marc Gasol over stupid marcus williams.

Ouch:lol

[TJastal]

I'd love to see Popovich hit the road and a new coach with a fresh approach who will stay out of the GM affairs. A coach who will keep focused on coaching the team and one who is committed to developing the younger talent.

I'd like to see this kid Ryan Richards brought in to the summer league and eventually land a spot on the team. I'd like to see Tiago Splitter starting alongside Tim Duncan. I'd like to see Manu & Tim give it one last run with a new coach and a fresh attitude.

I'd like to see McDyess retire after this season, for his own good. (RIP). You gave it all you had Antonio sorry it didn't work out.

I'd like to see Boner sitting on the bench all fucking game every fucking game. Unless one of Duncan, Splitter, Richards, or Blair is hurt.

I'd like to see the spurs find a good lengthy wing player with size and athleticism. Someone in the mold guy like Trevor Ariza, Travis Outlaw, Thaddeous Young. Jefferson is just going to get slower and more stationary as he ages.

Not sure about point guards, but the spurs prob could do with one who can penetrate and distribute rather than just shoot 3's.

[TDMVPDPOY]

the problem is the bench, the mentality killer instinct to win at all costs is just not there, those guys dont have the fire in them to lift to that extra gear....

maybe we were coasting to much in the regular season, that nobody gave a damn and thought it was a cake walk in the park for the playoffs...doesnt help when players are more focus with social network sites then preparing mentally for the playoffs

[temujin]

Bring back Sam Prestigiacomo.

Say bye to Greg Popovich.

[ChumpDumper]

I'd like to see this kid Ryan Richards brought in to the summer league and eventually land a spot on the team.What summer league?

[Tito_Trinidad]

Easy thread:

1-Fire Pop for Rick Adelman
2- Put Duncan 15 minutes per game
3- Trade Blair, Jefferson, Bonner, Green.
4- Put Tiaggo starting Center 35 minutes per game
5- Get tall athletic young SF, PF and a twin tower for Tiaggo
6- Defense as the first priority in every single practice and game.

[Tito_Trinidad]

Wishful roster:

PG- Tony / Rubio / Calderon
SG- Manu / Gerald Wallace / Neal
SF - Danny Granger / Nicolas Batum
PF- Kevin Love/ Duncan
C- Splitter / McGee

[Master splitter]

Thaddeous Young is on a 2.9m contract that extends into next year. RJ & Bonner combined make 11+, how is that trade gonna work?

:lol

You're right. I didnt realize how much Irish spring was getting from his contract. So I take it you agree with me on the Kevin love deal right.

[Texas_Ranger]

Wishful roster:

PG- Tony / Rubio / Calderon
SG- Manu / Gerald Wallace / Neal
SF - Danny Granger / Nicolas Batum
PF- Kevin Love/ Duncan
C- Splitter / McGee



:wow :bang

[cantthinkofanything]

What summer league?

He may have been referring to the Upward Baskeball Summer Camp.

[Isitjustme?]

PJ Carlesimo
:lmao :lmao

Celebrate the title just won, make a few minor tweaks and make a run at back to back titles!






Believe.
:lmao

[Dr. Gonzo]

1-Fire Pop for Rick Adelman


:rollin:rollin:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao

[TJastal]

You're right. I didnt realize how much Irish spring was getting from his contract. So I take it you agree with me on the Kevin love deal right.

I agree its not gonna happen.

[Nathan89]

1. I would bring in Gallenari,W.Chandler or JR. Smith. I would somehow someway bring in one of those three players.

2. Find a big with some weight that could put his body on Bynum. We need to eliminate some of the mismatches.

3. If possible find another athletic big who can shoot a mid range jumper and block shot from the weak side.

Dream-If we could get options 1 and 2. Then find away to get Carl Landry. That guy has offensive talent to make up for what Tim Duncan has lost. He has shown the ability to take Pau Gasol off the dribble. He also can knock down mid-range shots.

Get rid of-
Blair
Bonner
Hill
Anderson
and draft picks

[Wilford Brimley]

1. I would bring in Gallenari,W.Chandler or JR. Smith. I would somehow someway bring in one of those three players.

2. Find a big with some weight that could put his body on Bynum. We need to eliminate some of the mismatches.

3. If possible find another athletic big who can shoot a mid range jumper and block shot from the weak side.

Dream-If we could get options 1 and 2. Then find away to get Carl Landry. That guy has offensive talent to make up for what Tim Duncan has lost. He has shown the ability to take Pau Gasol off the dribble. He also can knock down mid-range shots.

Get rid of-
Blair
Bonner
Hill
Anderson
and draft picks

No to JR Smith. This organization is above malcontents like him.

[Master splitter]

I've been working on this deal with trade machine.
3 team trade spurs/warriors/bucks
Spurs get. Jennings,monta Ellis, and Andrew bogut
Warriors get. Hill,Blair,bonner,mcdyse, and John salmons
Bucks get. Tony Parker, splitter, and James Anderson
This works on trade machine but has spurs at -5 wins

[Nathan89]

I've been working on this deal with trade machine.
3 team trade spurs/warriors/bucks
Spurs get. Warriors get. Bucks get
Monta Ellis George hill Tony Parker
B.Jennings D.blair Splitter
Andrew bogut Matt bonner James Anderson
John salmons
Atonio mcdyse
This trade works on trade machine but it has spurs at -5 wins

Bucks said fuck that.

[Master splitter]

Stupid itouch lol

[Master splitter]

Bucks said fuck that.

They did, really lol

[Venti Quattro]

Castrate the malfunctional dick.

[Nathan89]

Stupid itouch lol

Format it all you want the Bucks still say NO.

[Master splitter]

Castrate the malfunctional dick.

Lol It work just fine

[Nathan89]

No to JR Smith. This organization is above malcontents like him.

Don't worry Spurs will give him some class. I would take him in a heart beat.

[JamStone]

I think it starts with a change to the philosophical approach of the team. With the decline of Tim, Pop decided that it was time to use the strengths of the team and change into a more open and uptempo style. And now we see yet again that just like the Phoenix Suns, the style of play can have success in the regular season, but will generally have trouble in the post season against teams with a more halfcourt style. I think the franchise has to re-assess the change of philosophy going forward. There's nothing wrong with having the ability to get up and down, but a team needs to be able to have the ability to play in a halfcourt style as well. Beyond that, much of the success the Spurs had earlier in the season saw guys like Bonner and Richard Jefferson going crazy from three point land. Once again, we see the old adage is true about living by the three and dying by the three.

Now, taking that into consideration, I don't make major changes to the core. As a Pistons fan, I know what it's like kicking and screaming for change to the core of a team that is successful but seemingly can't get over the top anymore. The Spurs just won 61 games, had a great season for all intents and purposes, and now will seemingly fall to a team that matches up well against them. There is still a lot of positives for this Spurs team. I think the changes need to be philosophical first, and minor roster moves secondly.

I do think they need to do everything they can to ship out Matt Bonner, but he does have three years left on his contract. I don't think Jefferson is tradeable. The only core guy I think could return the Spurs some pretty good value is Tony Parker. But like I said above, I would not be so quick to make major changes to the core.

As well as the philosophical change, I would go into the off-season with this approach:

1. Working all summer with Tiago Splitter to make him a viable option to start. Do whatever it takes, call Hakeem to work with him, let Duncan and David Robinson spend a couple months with him. Whatever it takes. The Spurs made the investment, and now after what seems like a wasted year for him, they should take measures to try to make him a guy they can count on going forward. It's time to use him.

2. Find another back-up big man who has the ability to score in the post. We all know Duncan has started his decline. I don't think he's finished like some do, but he certainly needs help in the frontcourt when it comes to scoring. I think the Bonner experiment has to be over. And as much as I respect him and hoped he could taste a championship, I think it's time for Dice to hang it up. With limited salary to work with, I think the Spurs have to find a cheap option that may surprise. I look at a guy like Carl Landry and although he might not fly under the radar and New Orleans will likely try to keep him, he is a guy who might be affordable and can provide some scoring in the frontcourt. Getting a front court scorer who isn't a three point shooter on the second unit could prove to be very valuable.

3. Add one more legit big for beef and depth. If the Spurs can figure out a way to dump Bonner (have to dump him or Pop will play him if he's on the roster) and Dice retires, then they would still have Duncan, Tiago, Blair, and (as I suggested, someone like) Landry. But as we know, it doesn't hurt to stockpile bigs just in case, especially in the West. A fifth big who has size and beef could also prove valuable. Someone like a Jason Collins or bringing back Nazr on the cheap or even a Magloire, realizing those guys would only be for insurance and to throw at frontcourts like the Lakers.

I think going back to a more halfcourt style and also revamping the frontcourt could put the Spurs back into a better position for the playoffs next season.

I don't think a 60 win season is something to scoff at just because of this first round disappointment. Unless Tim Duncan decides to retire, I think you continue to try to field a team that has a chance to go deep in the playoffs before blowing it all up. I've seen the misery of calling for major changes only to see that having a really good team who doesn't win it all is still better than going through the depression of having a horrible lottery team with no guarantee that it will get back to an elite level even with the changes made. Until Duncan is done for good, you keep the core and try again. You don't blow it all up yet.

[FailureNotAnOption]

My heart yearns for another title run, but my brain says getting stomped by an 8th seed through 4 games has to be a sign of the times, they are a-changin.'

Get bigger, much bigger, and rely on defense once again, instead of our iffy perimeter scoring. That, of course, is the problem. Our guys are looking lost when the pressure is on because they all realize they need to score in order for us to win. Our lack of size and mobile size, at that, has gutted our title-era defense.

Splitter needs to be a starter, and we need another big. Trade Bonner and anyone else outside of the big 3 if necessary for an athletic shotblocker. Maybe even pick up JR Smith also, if possible. Many probably abhor him as a person and I would include myself in that group, but we need a fiery "kid" who can play.

[NewcastleKEG]

2-year Plan

Trade Parker this off season. And who ever else you can trick to eat Jefferson, Bonner, Blair or Hill. Prob have to package worth (Hill) with garbage (Jefferson/Bonner)

Next off season trade Manu. Duncan retires

[Nathan89]

1. I would bring in Gallenari,W.Chandler or JR. Smith. I would somehow someway bring in one of those three players.

2. Find a big with some weight that could put his body on Bynum. We need to eliminate some of the mismatches.

3. If possible find another athletic big who can shoot a mid range jumper and block shot from the weak side.

Dream-If we could get options 1 and 2. Then find away to get Carl Landry. That guy has offensive talent to make up for what Tim Duncan has lost. He has shown the ability to take Pau Gasol off the dribble. He also can knock down mid-range shots.

Get rid of-
Blair
Bonner
Hill
Anderson
and draft picks


I think it starts with a change to the philosophical approach of the team. With the decline of Tim, Pop decided that it was time to use the strengths of the team and change into a more open and uptempo style. And now we see yet again that just like the Phoenix Suns, the style of play can have success in the regular season, but will generally have trouble in the post season against teams with a more halfcourt style. I think the franchise has to re-assess the change of philosophy going forward. There's nothing wrong with having the ability to get up and down, but a team needs to be able to have the ability to play in a halfcourt style as well. Beyond that, much of the success the Spurs had earlier in the season saw guys like Bonner and Richard Jefferson going crazy from three point land. Once again, we see the old adage is true about living by the three and dying by the three.

Now, taking that into consideration, I don't make major changes to the core. As a Pistons fan, I know what it's like kicking and screaming for change to the core of a team that is successful but seemingly can't get over the top anymore. The Spurs just won 61 games, had a great season for all intents and purposes, and now will seemingly fall to a team that matches up well against them. There is still a lot of positives for this Spurs team. I think the changes need to be philosophical first, and minor roster moves secondly.

I do think they need to do everything they can to ship out Matt Bonner, but he does have three years left on his contract. I don't think Jefferson is tradeable. The only core guy I think could return the Spurs some pretty good value is Tony Parker. But like I said above, I would not be so quick to make major changes to the core.

As well as the philosophical change, I would go into the off-season with this approach:

1. Working all summer with Tiago Splitter to make him a viable option to start. Do whatever it takes, call Hakeem to work with him, let Duncan and David Robinson spend a couple months with him. Whatever it takes. The Spurs made the investment, and now after what seems like a wasted year for him, they should take measures to try to make him a guy they can count on going forward. It's time to use him.

2. Find another back-up big man who has the ability to score in the post. We all know Duncan has started his decline. I don't think he's finished like some do, but he certainly needs help in the frontcourt when it comes to scoring. I think the Bonner experiment has to be over. And as much as I respect him and hoped he could taste a championship, I think it's time for Dice to hang it up. With limited salary to work with, I think the Spurs have to find a cheap option that may surprise. I look at a guy like Carl Landry and although he might not fly under the radar and New Orleans will likely try to keep him, he is a guy who might be affordable and can provide some scoring in the frontcourt. Getting a front court scorer who isn't a three point shooter on the second unit could prove to be very valuable.

3. Add one more legit big for beef and depth. If the Spurs can figure out a way to dump Bonner (have to dump him or Pop will play him if he's on the roster) and Dice retires, then they would still have Duncan, Tiago, Blair, and (as I suggested, someone like) Landry. But as we know, it doesn't hurt to stockpile bigs just in case, especially in the West. A fifth big who has size and beef could also prove valuable. Someone like a Jason Collins or bringing back Nazr on the cheap or even a Magloire, realizing those guys would only be for insurance and to throw at frontcourts like the Lakers.

I think going back to a more halfcourt style and also revamping the frontcourt could put the Spurs back into a better position for the playoffs next season.

I don't think a 60 win season is something to scoff at just because of this first round disappointment. Unless Tim Duncan decides to retire, I think you continue to try to field a team that has a chance to go deep in the playoffs before blowing it all up. I've seen the misery of calling for major changes only to see that having a really good team who doesn't win it all is still better than going through the depression of having a horrible lottery team with no guarantee that it will get back to an elite level even with the changes made. Until Duncan is done for good, you keep the core and try again. You don't blow it all up yet.
:tu


I guess we both have eyes for Landry and a beefy big.

I think we need a sg/sf. Chandler or J.R. Smith would be two of the best options.

[JamStone]

Yeah, the Spurs need a scoring option down low if the three pointers are not falling. Duncan can provide that sometimes, but need another one when Duncan isn't able to. Landry fits that and seems like he "might" be affordable. But to be sincerely honest, beyond him, it's slim pickings in free agency because bigs who can score (who are not three pointers) aren't exactly easy to find, especially for cheap. That's why my first point about doing everything to get Tiago ready to start and contribute is probably the most important thing the Spurs need to do. Tiago may not ever be a 20 point scoring big, but he's already on the roster and obviously has talent. Need to do everything they can to maximize his abilities so he can produce for the team.

[Southwest Texas Fan]

Yeah, the Spurs need a scoring option down low if the three pointers are not falling. Duncan can provide that sometimes, but need another one when Duncan isn't able to. Landry fits that and seems like he "might" be affordable. But to be sincerely honest, beyond him, it's slim pickings in free agency because bigs who can score (who are not three pointers) aren't exactly easy to find, especially for cheap. That's why my first point about doing everything to get Tiago ready to start and contribute is probably the most important thing the Spurs need to do. Tiago may not ever be a 20 point scoring big, but he's already on the roster and obviously has talent. Need to do everything they can to maximize his abilities so he can produce for the team.

Jamestone what do you think Tiago's numbers will look like?

[ducks]

make blair and splitter play against each
balir would quit getting blocked
then have splitter go against david robinison

[Chomag]

In order to move a contract like Bonner but way more so Rj's would be to give the other team something they want. Unfortunately a big 3 player is the only thing that Spurs could offer of value for the other team to even consider Rj's ludicrous contract.

[FailureNotAnOption]

Unfortunately a big 3 player is the only thing that Spurs could offer of value for the other team to even consider Rj's ludacris contract.

Couldn't help but :lol

[Master splitter]

:tu


I guess we both have eyes for Landry and a beefy big.

I think we need a sg/sf. Chandler or J.R. Smith would be two of the best options.

Just read an article on hoopshype that new York wants to resign Chandler. Maybe spurs should have traded tp to new York. I'm pretty sure David lee and Chandler would have been more productive than Tony,rj, and bonner.

[Chomag]

Couldn't help but :lol

Proof that rap music does effect the brain :lol

Fixed.

[JamStone]

Jamestone what do you think Tiago's numbers will look like?

No idea. I don't watch Spurs games unless they're nationally televised and haven't seen much of Tiago at all. I just know that the Spurs liked him enough to bring him over and he's not a raw 18 year old project. He's actually a proven basketball player. Now whether he can be a quality NBA starter, that's still very much into question. But Pop did him no favors this past season by not giving him much of an opportunity to play meaningful minutes. Based on his Euro stats, it seems like he has the potential to be close to a 20/9 guy if given opportunity and touches. Don't know if he can do that at the NBA level. But I think if he can produce even 15/8 in around 30-32 MPG, that would be a good start.

I think more important than his actual numbers will be his ability to provide some of the intangibles that Duncan can't do nearly as well as he used to. Be good defensively and with younger, more athletic legs, be the primary defender on the opposing team's best big. Even if it's not being a 20 point scorer, be enough of a threat on offense that it opens up the halfcourt for Duncan and shooters not to be doubled so quickly. Be a force on the offensive glass. If he can do the little things well, with his size and youth, it makes what his actual numbers are less important.

[cantthinkofanything]

I guess we both have eyes for Landry and a beefy big.


I bet you do...:lol

[FailureNotAnOption]

Proof that rap music does effect the brain :lol

Fixed.

:) :downspin:

[baseline bum]

Now, taking that into consideration, I don't make major changes to the core. As a Pistons fan, I know what it's like kicking and screaming for change to the core of a team that is successful but seemingly can't get over the top anymore.

I don't see the comparison to Detroit. The Pistons were stupid in salary-dumping Billups. Unless you're one of the glamor teams (LA, Miami, New York), signing free agents is like getting sloppy seconds. They really should have done like Denver did in moving him for Ray Felton. You just don't see too many good young players hit free agency and leave to one of the smaller market teams unless his old team has soured on him or other team drastically overpays. Detroit should have also dumped Hamilton when they could.

Maybe I'm overrating Manu's trade value, but perhaps you could make a play for OJ Mayo since the Grizzlies have soured on him. Or you relieve Denver of their logjam at point and replace JR Smith by trading Manu for Felton. I still think Ginobili could have some value to both of these up and coming teams, as the West will probably be really wide open again next season; evern moreso than this year with Phil Jackson retiring.

Parker could probably also deliver a pretty nice package of young players and/or picks.

[JamStone]

I wasn't making an exact parallel with the Pistons. The point was as a fan being zealous about making major changes to a team that is still very successful. I think when they've tasted championship success, some fans think falling short of anything but a championship means drastic changes need to be made. But the alternative to a perennial 50+ win team that more often than not makes a pretty deep run in the playoffs might not be what fans think it could be.

Rebuilding often takes quite a few years. If you're prepared for that, I guess that's fine. It's hard to just "re-tool" unless as you suggested you're a team like the Lakers. So with the Duncan-Ginobili-Parker core, it's just my opinion that you ride it out until it's really and completely done. A 60 win season with a disappointing first round upset (if it happens) doesn't tell me that it's really and completely done that requires the team to be blown up.

As for Ginobili, he probably has some value. I just don't trade him. Durability issues or not, regardless of age, I think Ginobili is the heart and soul of the team. Duncan might be the backbone/foundation, but Ginobili is almost nearly irreplaceable in terms of the identity of the team. He's the emotional leader, the closer, and when he's right, the best player on the team. With Duncan on his decline, I don't think there are trades and moves to be made that can give the Spurs a legitimate shot to contend again IF Ginobili is one of the pieces that is moved. Just my opinion.

[baseline bum]

I wasn't making an exact parallel with the Pistons. The point was as a fan being zealous about making major changes to a team that is still very successful. I think when they've tasted championship success, some fans think falling short of anything but a championship means drastic changes need to be made. But the alternative to a perennial 50+ win team that more often than not makes a pretty deep run in the playoffs might not be what fans think it could be.

Rebuilding often takes quite a few years. If you're prepared for that, I guess that's fine. It's hard to just "re-tool" unless as you suggested you're a team like the Lakers. So with the Duncan-Ginobili-Parker core, it's just my opinion that you ride it out until it's really and completely done. A 60 win season with a disappointing first round upset (if it happens) doesn't tell me that it's really and completely done that requires the team to be blown up.

As for Ginobili, he probably has some value. I just don't trade him. Durability issues or not, regardless of age, I think Ginobili is the heart and soul of the team. Duncan might be the backbone/foundation, but Ginobili is almost nearly irreplaceable in terms of the identity of the team. He's the emotional leader, the closer, and when he's right, the best player on the team. With Duncan on his decline, I don't think there are trades and moves to be made that can give the Spurs a legitimate shot to contend again IF Ginobili is one of the pieces that is moved. Just my opinion.

On trading Manu, I meant only in blowing up the team. I would never move him in anything other than a full rebuild for the reasons you stated. This team really struggled to win 50 games last season and those 61 wins came heavily from being red hot in the first two months of the season (28-4) when most teams are lazy and trying to figure out how to play together. I don't really consider this Spurs team to be a typical 1-seed, so the 61 wins don't look as impressive on closer inspection. Not blowing it up when they could get a few decent pieces now would be lunacy to me. I see no reason to keep kicking the can down the road when we're looking at probably a 48-54 win team next season. In addition, drafts like what 2012 looks to be don't come around but every 4-5 years. Passing on the chance to have a decent pick next year could make things much more painful in the long run. If we were looking at the 2011 or 2013 draft next summer then I wouldn't be so eager to blow things up, but there are some really nice forwards in that draft who could be good long-term options.

[JamStone]

If that's how you feel, that's fine. Then you're ready for this group to be done. But if I were a Spurs fan, that's not how I would feel. Complete rebuild to me means you're ready for the whole rebuilding process, including at least several years of at best mediocrity and at worst several years of being a basement dwelling lottery team. And in either scenario, there is no guarantee that the Spurs with a new core will even be a 48-54 win team that you expect next season to be. That's why I ride it out until it is completely obvious that this core group and their run is absolutely over.

[baseline bum]

If that's how you feel, that's fine. Then you're ready for this group to be done. But if I were a Spurs fan, that's not how I would feel. Complete rebuild to me means you're ready for the whole rebuilding process, including at least several years of at best mediocrity and at worst several years of being a basement dwelling lottery team. And in either scenario, there is no guarantee that the Spurs with a new core will even be a 48-54 win team that you expect next season to be. That's why I ride it out until it is completely obvious that this core group and their run is absolutely over.

Being a 20-40 win team for the next 2-4 years is exactly what I want. The late 80s rebuild gave the team David Robinson and a great decade of contention in the 90s. Moving Ice to make room for Robertson gave them a great young trading piece to send to Milwaukee for Cummings in 89. Being lousy in the late 80s brought them Sean Elliott too.

No guarantees the Spurs can come back to a 50 win team in 4-5 years, but the team is fortunate in that they have a GM who drafts really well. There is one guarantee though: Duncan and Ginobili don't have much time left at a high level, and the Spurs are looking at being a 30-win team when they hang it up anyways. Might as well jump-start the process when they can get some pieces that could stick around into the future and maybe even strike gold again in a stacked 2012 draft.

[4>0rings]

If that's how you feel, that's fine. Then you're ready for this group to be done. But if I were a Spurs fan, that's not how I would feel. Complete rebuild to me means you're ready for the whole rebuilding process, including at least several years of at best mediocrity and at worst several years of being a basement dwelling lottery team. And in either scenario, there is no guarantee that the Spurs with a new core will even be a 48-54 win team that you expect next season to be. That's why I ride it out until it is completely obvious that this core group and their run is absolutely over.
This team can still compete in the finals with a decent 7' stiff getting playing time at the same time Duncan is in the game. That's my belief. This team did well enough to get the first seed, now they need to solidify their front court with another twin tower duo and not jump shooting.

[SenorSpur]

I wasn't making an exact parallel with the Pistons. The point was as a fan being zealous about making major changes to a team that is still very successful. I think when they've tasted championship success, some fans think falling short of anything but a championship means drastic changes need to be made. But the alternative to a perennial 50+ win team that more often than not makes a pretty deep run in the playoffs might not be what fans think it could be.

Rebuilding often takes quite a few years. If you're prepared for that, I guess that's fine. It's hard to just "re-tool" unless as you suggested you're a team like the Lakers. So with the Duncan-Ginobili-Parker core, it's just my opinion that you ride it out until it's really and completely done. A 60 win season with a disappointing first round upset (if it happens) doesn't tell me that it's really and completely done that requires the team to be blown up.

As for Ginobili, he probably has some value. I just don't trade him. Durability issues or not, regardless of age, I think Ginobili is the heart and soul of the team. Duncan might be the backbone/foundation, but Ginobili is almost nearly irreplaceable in terms of the identity of the team. He's the emotional leader, the closer, and when he's right, the best player on the team. With Duncan on his decline, I don't think there are trades and moves to be made that can give the Spurs a legitimate shot to contend again IF Ginobili is one of the pieces that is moved. Just my opinion.

Jamstone, I respect your opinion highly. I agree with a portion of what you've stated. Personally, I don't see where there are trades and moves to be made that can give the Spurs a legitimate shot to contend again even IF Ginobili stays. The past two playoff series have made it clear that there is very little left to salvage. There is no reward for mediocrity - meaning a 6th, 7th, or 8th playoff seed. You are correct in that rebuilding could take years.

That was the blueprint that OKC followed and look where they are at now. With smart and astute drafting, along with a solid free agent signing or two, they've positioned themselves as solid contenders for the next 7 years. I believe that's what the Spurs must do. Count me as one who believes that the first phase of the rebuild project should begin immediately.

Therefore, trading probably the team's best asset, Parker, would be a way to bring in a combination of a young player and picks. The Spurs badly need to begin stockpiling assets so they can garner at least two 1st round picks in either the 2012 or 2013 NBA drafts.

Because the Spurs will have a very difficult time attracting free agents, they will have to rely primarily on the draft, the international market and taking flyers on unsigned free agents. I'd rather them start taking their lumps now, while building for the future, than witness another year or two of regular season glory, ending in early playoff failure.

[NewcastleKEG]

But the issue is getting that decent 7'. EVERYONE is in the market for another decent 7 footer. Teams over draft them and over pay for them all the time. Size is the biggest premium in this league

That's why you'll see the Blazers bring Oden back although he's done nothing more than cash in their money for the past 3 seasons. We'll see what the market demands for an injury prone Yao

Say you somehow magically add a Tyson Chandler type, it's an assumption that Duncan will improve his game. Are you still able to hold onto your depth Dice, Bonner & Tiago in the process?

Having Duncan/Chandler down low still leaves the Spurs behind the Thunder & Lakers, who themselves already have that post DUO.

Durant, Westbrook, Harden, Sefolosha > Manu, Parker, Hill/Neal, Jefferson


I think Spur fan needs to realize that the roster isn't just 1 post player away, especially 1 decent post player away from being a title contender. You would need Manu to stay healthy and Parker to up his game. He's getting out played by Conley right now. . .

If you hold onto the Triplets til the bitter end you will end up the Celtics from the 80's. Finals in the late 80's to ECF & SemiFinals in the early 90's and once Bird, McHale and Parrish finally retired the franchise was left with NOTHING. And they fell into a 6 year run without the playoffs

[SenorSpur]

But the issue is getting that decent 7'. EVERYONE is in the market for another decent 7 footer. Teams over draft them and over pay for them all the time. Size is the biggest premium in this league

That's why you'll see the Blazers bring Oden back although he's done nothing more than cash in their money for the past 3 seasons. We'll see what the market demands for an injury prone Yao

Say you somehow magically add a Tyson Chandler type, it's an assumption that Duncan will improve his game. Are you still able to hold onto your depth Dice, Bonner & Tiago in the process?

Having Duncan/Chandler down low still leaves the Spurs behind the Thunder & Lakers, who themselves already have that post DUO.

Durant, Westbrook, Harden, Sefolosha > Manu, Parker, Hill/Neal, Jefferson


I think Spur fan needs to realize that the roster isn't just 1 post player away, especially 1 decent post player away from being a title contender. You would need Manu to stay healthy and Parker to up his game. He's getting out played by Conley right now. . .

If you hold onto the Triplets til the bitter end you will end up the Celtics from the 80's. Finals in the late 80's to ECF & SemiFinals in the early 90's and once Bird, McHale and Parrish finally retired the franchise was left with NOTHING. And they fell into a 6 year run without the playoffs

With the bad money tied up in non-performing players like RJ and Bonner, combined with the $21mil that Duncan is owed next year, the Spurs aren't even close to being able to throw money at a guy like Chandler. I think folks are promoting this idea prematurely.

[NewcastleKEG]

Jamstone, I respect your opinion highly. I agree with a portion of what you've stated. Personally, I don't see where there are trades and moves to be made that can give the Spurs a legitimate shot to contend again even IF Ginobili stays. There is no reward for mediocrity - meaning a 6th, 7th, or 8th playoff seed. I'm of the opinion that the first phase of the rebuild project should begin immediately.

Therefore, trading probably the team's best asset, Parker, would be a way to bring in a combination of a young player and picks. The Spurs badly need to begin stockpiling assets so they can garner at least two 1st round picks in either the 2012 or 2013 NBA drafts.

Because the Spurs will have a very difficult time attracting free agents, they will have to rely primarily on the draft, the international market and taking flyers on unsigned free agents.
Every franchise who has felt and lived through greatness has to make that tough decision. Are we a Championship Franchise or were we merely riding the wave that Player A or B created?

Franchises like the Lakers, 49ers, and Braves were able to sustain decades of winning by letting players go 1 year too early than 1 year too late.

Lakers traded Shaq (struggled for 2,3 years) and used those pieces in the trade to build a new Dynasty

49ers let greats like Ronnie Lott, Joe Montana and Roger Craig go/traded and were able to win another SB

Braves won through trades & and a great farm system (draft)


All these franchises had to make the tough decisions to let HOF players walk/trade them away to be able to reload.

Are the Spurs a franchise like that? Or are they merely Tim Duncan's franchise and will never reload again?

[NewcastleKEG]

With the bad money tied up in non-performing players like RJ and Bonner, combined with the $21mil that Duncan is owed next year, the Spurs aren't even close to being able to throw money at a guy like Chandler. I think folks are promoting this idea prematurely.
Agreed. Spurs missed the ship on dealing with the Knicks who were willing with ANYONE. They would have eaten a bad contract and givin you nice pieces in return for Parker

For the Spurs sake, hopefully your front office realizes this regular season was a mirage and there is no reason to keep the status quo because your trading pieces lose value by the day & each day your nearing a Shaq/Orlando situation where he walks/retires and your left with nothing

[J_Paco]

I think it starts with a change to the philosophical approach of the team. With the decline of Tim, Pop decided that it was time to use the strengths of the team and change into a more open and uptempo style. And now we see yet again that just like the Phoenix Suns, the style of play can have success in the regular season, but will generally have trouble in the post season against teams with a more halfcourt style. I think the franchise has to re-assess the change of philosophy going forward. There's nothing wrong with having the ability to get up and down, but a team needs to be able to have the ability to play in a halfcourt style as well. Beyond that, much of the success the Spurs had earlier in the season saw guys like Bonner and Richard Jefferson going crazy from three point land. Once again, we see the old adage is true about living by the three and dying by the three.

Now, taking that into consideration, I don't make major changes to the core. As a Pistons fan, I know what it's like kicking and screaming for change to the core of a team that is successful but seemingly can't get over the top anymore. The Spurs just won 61 games, had a great season for all intents and purposes, and now will seemingly fall to a team that matches up well against them. There is still a lot of positives for this Spurs team. I think the changes need to be philosophical first, and minor roster moves secondly.

I do think they need to do everything they can to ship out Matt Bonner, but he does have three years left on his contract. I don't think Jefferson is tradeable. The only core guy I think could return the Spurs some pretty good value is Tony Parker. But like I said above, I would not be so quick to make major changes to the core.

As well as the philosophical change, I would go into the off-season with this approach:

1. Working all summer with Tiago Splitter to make him a viable option to start. Do whatever it takes, call Hakeem to work with him, let Duncan and David Robinson spend a couple months with him. Whatever it takes. The Spurs made the investment, and now after what seems like a wasted year for him, they should take measures to try to make him a guy they can count on going forward. It's time to use him.

2. Find another back-up big man who has the ability to score in the post. We all know Duncan has started his decline. I don't think he's finished like some do, but he certainly needs help in the frontcourt when it comes to scoring. I think the Bonner experiment has to be over. And as much as I respect him and hoped he could taste a championship, I think it's time for Dice to hang it up. With limited salary to work with, I think the Spurs have to find a cheap option that may surprise. I look at a guy like Carl Landry and although he might not fly under the radar and New Orleans will likely try to keep him, he is a guy who might be affordable and can provide some scoring in the frontcourt. Getting a front court scorer who isn't a three point shooter on the second unit could prove to be very valuable.

3. Add one more legit big for beef and depth. If the Spurs can figure out a way to dump Bonner (have to dump him or Pop will play him if he's on the roster) and Dice retires, then they would still have Duncan, Tiago, Blair, and (as I suggested, someone like) Landry. But as we know, it doesn't hurt to stockpile bigs just in case, especially in the West. A fifth big who has size and beef could also prove valuable. Someone like a Jason Collins or bringing back Nazr on the cheap or even a Magloire, realizing those guys would only be for insurance and to throw at frontcourts like the Lakers.

I think going back to a more halfcourt style and also revamping the frontcourt could put the Spurs back into a better position for the playoffs next season.

I don't think a 60 win season is something to scoff at just because of this first round disappointment. Unless Tim Duncan decides to retire, I think you continue to try to field a team that has a chance to go deep in the playoffs before blowing it all up. I've seen the misery of calling for major changes only to see that having a really good team who doesn't win it all is still better than going through the depression of having a horrible lottery team with no guarantee that it will get back to an elite level even with the changes made. Until Duncan is done for good, you keep the core and try again. You don't blow it all up yet.

Jamstone, FTW.

Also, finding a real back-up SF that can defend and knock down three-pointers is huge. The Spurs may need to move either Hill, Neal or Anderson, possibly some combination of the three, to accomplish that but it needs to be done. I like Anderson more as the back-up SG, so moving either Hill or Neal should happen, IMO.

Is Chris Wilcox coming off the books this summer? He is a poor man's Drew Gooden, that isn't a complement by the way, but could be a good cheap option to ponder.....



Are the Spurs a franchise like that? Or are they merely Tim Duncan's franchise and will never reload again?

Bullshit, especially coming from a Chicago Bulls fan. The Bulls were/are Michael Jordan's franchise and it has taken them 14-15 years of misery, mediocre play and philosophy changes to become competitive again. Sometimes you need to bite the bullet and keep the team intact, because there is no guarantee a new "core" can ever accomplish the same thing. If, like Olajuwon and Ewing, Timmy wants to move on and the Spurs agree to it then so be it. Releasing, waiving, letting leave or trading the greatest player this franchise has ever seen would cause long-term (PR) damage.

[elemento]

Jamstone is one of the best posters in Spurstalk

Very nice post !

[NewcastleKEG]

Bullshit, especially coming from a Chicago Bulls fan. The Bulls were/are Michael Jordan's franchise and it has taken them 14-15 years of misery, mediocre play and philosophy changes to become competitive again. Sometimes you need to bite the bullet and keep the team intact, because there is no guarantee a new "core" can ever accomplish the same thing. If, like Olajuwon and Ewing, Timmy wants to move on and the Spurs agree to it then so be it. Releasing, waiving, letting leave or trading the greatest player this franchise has ever seen would cause long-term (PR) damage.
Bulls are a bad but also good example of what the Spurs should do

Jordan retired, which would be best case scenario for Duncan in Spur fans perspective. You get a ton of cap money & you don't have to watch him on another team

While they did indeed sign & trade Pippen, they got NOTHING in return - Roy Rogers and a future second round draft pick. And they waived Rogers a week later! They simply released Rodman.

Bulls wasted countless draft picks and poor trades which led to the decade of rebuilding. They had Elton Brand (dominating Heat tonight) and Ron Artest the following season and should have built on that. They had easily the dumbest front office in the league and made so many stupid trades. Spur fan shouldn't worry about that with a reliable front office that drafts well and helps players mature (yes even with the Tiago stuff currently going on)

Plus it would have been different if Jordan's Bulls were steadily declining. This would be Duncan's 3rd 1st Round lose in 4 years?