Kobe: "Loss had nothing to do with me"

[djohn2oo8]

Said Bryant: "I'm concerned. This team can beat us. It's clear. We've just got to come in ready to play Game 2."

The Lakers didn't pound the ball down low very often, Andrew Bynum (http://spurstalk.com/topic/sports/basketball/andrew-bynum-PESPT000009250.topic) scoring eight points on three-for-eight shooting and Pau Gasol (http://spurstalk.com/topic/sports/basketball/pau-gasol-PESPT002503.topic) scoring 15 on five-for-10 shooting.

Bryant repeatedly said it wasn't his fault, pointing instead to the Lakers' reserves.

"It had nothing to do with me," he said. "I'm going to do what I do. I think the second unit, we've got to make a conscious effort to get the ball in to Pau and get the ball in to Andrew."



http://www.latimes.com/sports/basketball/nba/lakers/la-sp-lakers-mavericks-20110503,0,4815198,full.story

[BlackSwordsMan]

great fucking team leader :cry

[Ashy Larry]

I don't really believe in the +/- .... but it really speaks volumes in this game.


The Killer B's and Odom = -9

Mavs Bench = +33

brutal .....

[Giuseppe]

He ain't done bad:::

Kobe: 5

tired old shit bag Duncan: 4

[BlackSwordsMan]

I shoot the ball it no go in, what you want me to do :cry

[djohn2oo8]

Kobe: "Everyone else has to get Pau and Bynum the ball cuz I sure as hell ain't doin it"

[endrity]

Kobe: "Everyone else has to get Pau and Bynum the ball cuz I sure as hell ain't doin it"

lol, pretty much

[Giuseppe]

Kobe: "Everyone else has to get Pau and Bynum the ball cuz I sure as hell ain't doin it"


He got 'em to CA. for Game One instead of TX.

[Spur-Addict]

Steve Nash: "Dirk's wrong-legged runner with 40 seconds left...BANANERS

:lol

[Vertical]

hilarious pointing to the bench as the culprit lol

Phil Jackson just sucks now...

[Lukor]

I don't really believe in the +/- .... but it really speaks volumes in this game.


The Killer B's and Odom = -9

Mavs Bench = +33

brutal .....

The Killer B's ? Gay nickname is gay.

[ChrisRichards]

"It had nothing to do with me," he said. "I'm going to do what I do. I think the second unit, we've got to make a conscious effort to get the ball in to Pau and get the ball in to Andrew."



Kobe's assist total from last night?

Yea, thought so...:lol

[Giuseppe]

Steve Nash: "Dirk's wrong-legged runner with 40 seconds left...BANANERS

:lol


Twixt these two:::nary a ring.

[cheguevara]

this season Jackson and Pop have both gone senile. Both should retire together.

[BlackSwordsMan]

''In a world...''

[Giuseppe]

this season Jackson and Pop have both gone senile. Both should retire together.

Hold on a second, daddy. You, you lost to an 8. Not us. You.

Don't even try and lump us in with your shit.

Uh, uh. Not on my watch, sassafras.

[lefty]

" Can't fuck with me ! "

http://28.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_l3etjerGgF1qabh2go1_250.gif

[Spur-Addict]

Twixt these two:::nary a ring.

But that doesn't mean it isn't funny

:lol

[ChrisRichards]

Holy shit Batman, 32,700 post count!

[da_suns_fan]

Yep. Still a douche bag.

[Kyle Orton]

32,700 one liners that no one finds funny

[Spur-Addict]

Someone needs a Binky

[SpurOutofTownFan]

He ain't done bad:::

Kobe: 5

tired old shit bag Duncan: 4

you are an idiot sir

kobe just threw his teammates under the bus

that's not so duncan

[Ashy Larry]

take away Kobe's 4-9 from three point range, the Lakers shot 1-10 and Fisher was 1-2.

Starting backcourt 5-11

Rest of team 0-8 ... there's eight more touches for Bynum and Gasol

[Giuseppe]

you are an idiot sir

kobe just threw his teammates under the bus

that's not so duncan

It's not a f'in' game. It's a business. Bryant ain't a babysitter, or, glad hander. He's not their friend. It's not about that. Bryant is there for a finite time. He already wasted 5 years fuckin' around up in CO. There is no more time to waste.

[LakerHater]

With that attitude, he mighta just lost his teammates!!

[Giuseppe]

With that attitude, he mighta just lost his teammates!!

Holding one accountable is never bad.

[ChrisRichards]

32,700 one liners that no one finds funny
:lol, lefty's aiight. His one liners really are terrible, but that's his MO and its working for him lol.

[SpurOutofTownFan]

It's not a f'in' game. It's a business. Bryant ain't a babysitter, or, glad hander. He's not their friend. It's not about that. Bryant is there for a finite time. He already wasted 5 years fuckin' around up in CO. There is no more time to waste.

i wouldn't be surprised if his teammates now tank the games just to see him lose another opportunity at a ring

man it reminds me of the end of the kobe & shaq era - just can't get over himself - imagine how many more rings could have the won had they stayed together, even with the rise of the mighty spurs

[lefty]

:lol, lefty's aiight. His one liners really are terrible, but that's his MO and its working for him lol.
Kyle Orton doesnt get it

[lefty]

32,700 one liners that no one finds funny
I just quoted what Kobe said in that gif, fucktard

[mavsfan1000]

lXTxhYkZbrE&feature=related Reminds me of this scene at 9:15.

[IronMexican]

Glad Kobe said this. Pau still played like a fagot, even if it was his best game this post-season.

[Giuseppe]

Glad Kobe said this. Pau still played like a fagot, even if it was his best game this post-season.

GD rights.

Pau has regressed steadily since the end of the Orlando Finals. He's just about where he was when the Celtics left him in the '08 Finals. All that f'in' work and rehab to get him to act like somebody is gone...Poof!

[Banzai]

Last time Gasol was really hungry in the playoffs was in 08..before the finals. Since..he's been coming down to earth slowly. Just look at his scoring in 08/09 and now..not so much anymore.

[Giuseppe]

Last time Gasol was really hungry in the playoffs was in 08..before the finals. Since..he's been coming down to earth slowly. Just look at his scoring in 08/09 and now..not so much anymore.

He's foreign:::strike one.

An American male is already lit at birth. It's the gun thing & money thing, and the never satisfied thing.

[Venti Quattro]

Glad Kobe said this. Pau still played like a fagot, even if it was his best game this post-season.

Pauggot

Pretty much tbh. He did fuck up the clutch but the bench was really terrible

[da_suns_fan]

take away Kobe's 4-9 from three point range, the Lakers shot 1-10 and Fisher was 1-2.

Starting backcourt 5-11

Rest of team 0-8 ... there's eight more touches for Bynum and Gasol

TRANSLATION: What do you expect with teammates like THIS?!!!!

As if Kobe doesnt have the most talented supporting cast in the league.

Switch Kobe with Dirk. Can you imagine the Lakers with Dirk instead of Kobe?

[Giuseppe]

Switch Kobe with Dirk. Can you imagine the Lakers with Dirk instead of Kobe?

Yeah, we're locked at 14.

[Ghazi]

He got 'em to CA. for Game One instead of TX.

and the Mavs took away that advantage.

Just like that

[Giuseppe]

and the Mavs took away that advantage.

Just like that

True. But, Bryant didn't know that when he rose up in Sacramento to keep in CA..

[Jose Canseco]

Love him or hate him, Kobe never lacks for bitchassness.

He might have a point, but does he have to be such a bitchass about it?

[Giuseppe]

Love him or hate him, Kobe never lacks for bitchassness.

He might have a point, but does he have to be such a bitchass about it?

You don't ring by doing good. It's a nasty business. It ain't daycare. They're all grown men and Bryant w/Fish dragged them all to this point.

[Cry Havoc]

You don't ring by doing good. It's a nasty business. It ain't daycare. They're all grown men and Bryant w/Fish dragged them all to this point.

82 games gone, just like that. Washed away because Kobe can't keep his balance and Pau can't hold onto the ball. :lol

Every other coach in the league would give their left nut to have Lamar Odom come off the bench, and yet Kobe's teammates just "aren't talented enough".

Funny, I never heard Jordan say his teammates sucked shit and that's why they lost. I always thought it was the leader who was supposed to step up and take responsibility, to, you know, lead, but hey what do I know. :lol

Kobe mad though. He mad. Dirk done did him dirty and Kobe knows he can't stop him.

[Giuseppe]

82 games gone, just like that. Washed away because kobe can't keep his balance and pau can't hold onto the ball. :lol

every other coach in the league would give their left nut to have lamar odom come off the bench, and yet kobe's teammates just "aren't talented enough".

Funny, i never heard jordan say his teammates sucked shit and that's why they lost. I always thought it was the leader who was supposed to step up and take responsibility, to, you know, lead, but hey what do i know. :lol

kobe mad though. He mad. Dirk done did him dirty and kobe knows he can't stop him.

8

[Cry Havoc]

Kobe, the man who has two guaransheed All-Stars on his team alongside him, and the perennial 6th man candidate, just doesn't have enough help to beat the fucking Dallas Mavericks. What a winner. :lmao

[IronMexican]

Has Pau complained to the media about touches yet?

[Giuseppe]

kobe, the man who has two guaransheed all-stars on his team alongside him, and the perennial 6th man candidate, just doesn't have enough help to beat the fucking dallas mavericks. What a winner. :lmao

8

[Cry Havoc]

Has Pau complained to the media about touches yet?

Bynum should be. How is it that Kobe is complaining about his bench when the best player from last series got an avg of 2 shots per quarter this game?

[Giuseppe]

Bynum should be. How is it that Kobe is complaining about his bench when the best player from last series got an avg of 2 shots per quarter this game?

Bynum admitted it's his own fault.

[TampaDude]

Kobe had zero assists last night...ZERO! That loss had everything to do with him. What a fuckstick. :lol

[Cry Havoc]

Bynum admitted it's his own fault.

Yep. It's his fault that Kobe isn't passing to him. :lmao

Why is it that Jordan never had this problem? Or Bird? Why is it just Kobe?

[BlackSwordsMan]

Assists are over rated, Chris paul had 20 a game and look where that got him

[redzero]

Kobe had zero assists last night...ZERO! That loss had everything to do with him. What a fuckstick. :lol

Kobe gave his teammates 15 chances to get the ball back. What more can one ask for?

[TampaDude]

Kobe gave his teammates 15 chances to get the ball back. What more can one ask for?

:lmao

[daspurs]

holy shit i went to sleep because i thought it was over ... lol kobe :lol

[Ghazi]

8

:lol

[TheMACHINE]

it aint the bench, its Phil leaving the bench in till 6 minutes in the 4th.

[v2freak]

it aint the bench, its Phil leaving the bench in till 6 minutes in the 4th.

Team effort by Jackson and the bench to lose the game, then.

[TheMACHINE]

Kobe, the man who has two guaransheed All-Stars on his team alongside him, and the perennial 6th man candidate, just doesn't have enough help to beat the fucking Dallas Mavericks. What a winner. :lmao

lol 1 loss against dallas and cryhavoc trying to tear down 5 rings. good shit.

[Greg Oden]

the best part is him trying to belittle the Mavericks when his team just lost to a fuckin 8th seed :lol

[TampaDude]

lol 1 loss against dallas and cryhavoc trying to tear down 5 rings. good shit.

Those 5 rings don't mean shit right now. This is 2011, son. :lol

[BlackSwordsMan]

Tell bin laden the past doesn't matter and you've killed an innocent man with shit kidneys you fuck you.

[daspurs]

Those 5 rings don't mean shit right now. This is 2011, son. :lol

lol these fuckers are still stuck in 2010

[TampaDude]

Tell bin laden the past doesn't matter and you've killed an innocent man with shit kidneys you fuck you.

Uh...not sure where you're going with this... :lol

[TheMACHINE]

spurs fans are right...its 2011...hows the 2011 playoff treating you guys? Haha

[TheMACHINE]

Lol butthurt from the mauling

[TampaDude]

spurs fans are right...its 2011...hows the 2011 playoff treating you guys? Haha

Thanks for making my point. Past glory doesn't mean shit this year. Lakers fans are gonna find that out real soon. :lol

[Killakobe81]

Mehh ...pile on. We choked a 16 point lead ...we deserve it. Artest, Phil, Kobe and Pau ALL share blame for this loss ...bench too. I dont even care if Artest and bench dont score just play some damn defense ...

[SpurOutofTownFan]

you know when kobe throws his team under the bus that there's some shit going on... house is on fire right now

[Brazil]

He ain't done bad:::

Kobe: 5

tired old shit bag Duncan: 4

wrong serie

you must actualize your shit

Kobe: 5

Dirk best player in the west: 0

[lefty]

Kobe gave his teammates 15 chances to get the ball back. What more can one ask for?
:lmao

[TampaDude]

you know when kobe throws his team under the bus that there's some shit going on... house is on fire right now

http://www.deskpicture.com/DPs/Miscellaneous/HouseFire_2.jpg

[cobbler]

you are an idiot sir

kobe just threw his teammates under the bus

that's not so duncan

Maybe had Duncan pressed the issue with hus FO you guys wouldnt be losing to 8th seeds today and it would be Duncan 5 and Kobe 4.

[cobbler]

With that attitude, he mighta just lost his teammates!!

Not a chance. They know they fucked up. You are going to see one energized Laker team for game 2. There is not going to be all those wide open 3's this time around.

[cobbler]

i wouldn't be surprised if his teammates now tank the games just to see him lose another opportunity at a ring

man it reminds me of the end of the kobe & shaq era - just can't get over himself - imagine how many more rings could have the won had they stayed together, even with the rise of the mighty spurs

Moron

[Cry Havoc]

lol 1 loss against dallas and cryhavoc trying to tear down 5 rings. good shit.


the best part is him trying to belittle the Mavericks when his team just lost to a fuckin 8th seed :lol

I'll take my four rings that are free of whining/bitching/complaining about having the most talented highest paid team in the league. :toast

$91,000,000 isn't enough for Kobe to think he's got a good team. :lmao

[Greg Oden]

yeah, you don't have any rings.

[Cry Havoc]

yeah, you don't have any rings.

Ah, that argument again. No one has made that before. :lmao

[redzero]

yeah, you don't have any rings.

And you don't have knees! Zinger!

[Greg Oden]

you have as many rings as me or cobbler, regardless of your retarded statement.

[Cry Havoc]

spurs fans are right...its 2011...hows the 2011 playoff treating you guys? Haha

29 teams finish in 2nd. Getting past the first round doesn't mean a thing if you get knocked out in the next round.

[easy7]

The Mavs just borrowed the 14 incher from the Grizzlies and the skunker from the Suns and are about to go medieval on that Laker's ass... :hat

[Greg Oden]

And you don't have knees! Zinger!

http://www.gifsoup.com/view/297169/turiaflol-o.gif

[cobbler]

TRANSLATION: What do you expect with teammates like THIS?!!!!

As if Kobe doesnt have the most talented supporting cast in the league.

Switch Kobe with Dirk. Can you imagine the Lakers with Dirk instead of Kobe?

Can you imagine ONE... I say ONE championship parade in Phoenix?

[Kyle Orton]

Yeah, his teammates are def. gonna tank the games just to spite Kobe, the guy who can get anyone traded away from the Lakers he wants to. I'm sure that's it.

[Cry Havoc]

you have as many rings as me or cobbler, regardless of your retarded statement.

And it's common vernacular to refer to one's favorite team as "theirs", and adopt their accomplishments. A bit of reflected glory, but it shouldn't be too difficult to figure out, considering every fanbase on the planet uses that kind of statement informally. :lol

[Cry Havoc]

Yeah, his teammates are def. gonna tank the games just to spite Kobe, the guy who can get anyone traded away from the Lakers he wants to. I'm sure that's it.

Artest might lose it. Pau could fade into even more of a shadow of his former self. Everyone else will play hard. Both teams will play hard.

[Jose Canseco]

Lol mad Spurs fans premature ejaculating after the first game of the series. You'd think it was 3-0 Dallas.

[cobbler]

Bynum should be. How is it that Kobe is complaining about his bench when the best player from last series got an avg of 2 shots per quarter this game?

Were you there? Were you watching as Bynum was often the last guuy down the floor. Were you watching Haywood push him around. Drew lacked aggression from the begining. I saw at lewast two passes Kobe made to Drew who just tossed crap up because he was to lazy to get position. Drew had a bad game. Kobe did not.

[redzero]

Can you imagine ONE... I say ONE championship parade in Phoenix?

http://i51.tinypic.com/2hp87mg.gif

[Ashy Larry]

Can you imagine ONE... I say ONE championship parade in Phoenix?


5vGzth8cCag


What the fuck are you talking about??? The Suns do have a championship parade. Probably the only WCF championship Parade in NBA History :lmao

Fuck PHX

[cobbler]

Kobe had zero assists last night...ZERO! That loss had everything to do with him. What a fuckstick. :lol

Of course those 8 or so passes to wide open Artest, Pau, and Drew never happened I guess. Funny thing about assists that the friggen player wide open needs to make the shot no? You stat whores crack me up. Kobe mad a few mistakes last night with turnovers etc but other than that he played a great all around game including passing to the open shooter. What he said in the Times was spot on even if you pussies think its too harsh.

Funny thing is, the players and staff all agree with him and have said so. Go figure.

[Cry Havoc]

Lol mad Spurs fans premature ejaculating after the first game of the series. You'd think it was 3-0 Dallas.

I still expect the Lakers to win this series. That's not what it's about. It's about Kobe's team having a payroll of 91,000,000 and then whining continuously about how "woe is me". First he's "injured". Now this loss has nothing to do with him, despite ringing up the big 0fer in the assist department. Kobe tries to be the greatest of all-time and he's not even a good leader. That's the hilarity here.


Were you there? Were you watching as Bynum was often the last guuy down the floor. Were you watching Haywood push him around. Drew lacked aggression from the begining. I saw at lewast two passes Kobe made to Drew who just tossed crap up because he was to lazy to get position. Drew had a bad game. Kobe did not.

Yes, because as we all know, when a teammate is hitting a rough patch or having trouble getting into a rhythm, completely denying him the ball is a great way to get him involved in the offense. :tu

[Jose Canseco]

I still expect the Lakers to win this series. That's not what it's about. It's about Kobe having a payroll of 91,000,000 and then whining continuously about how "woe is me". First he's "injured". Now this loss has nothing to do with him, despite ringing up the big 0fer in the assist department. Kobe tries to be the greatest of all-time and he's not even a good leader. That's the hilarity here.

What does payroll have to do with anything? You do know that $55 million of that $91 million is all in 3 players. When that happens, you have to build a supporting cast of relatively cheap players. And regardless, I don't see why a player can't call out his teammates. Sure he's a dick and a bitchass for it, but I don't get why you're trying to make a connection with the payroll. He's a jerk for the comments. Doesn't matter how much the Lakers payroll is.

You do know that Dallas has a payroll over $90 million too, right?

[cobbler]

Yep. It's his fault that Kobe isn't passing to him. :lmao

Why is it that Jordan never had this problem? Or Bird? Why is it just Kobe?

You obviously never watched MJ then.

[cobbler]

you have as many rings as me or cobbler, regardless of your retarded statement.

I have 16.

[Cry Havoc]

What does payroll have to do with anything? You do know that $55 million of that $91 million is all in 3 players. When that happens, you have to build a supporting cast of relatively cheap players.

If you want to call the next 8 guys on the roster who average $4.5 mil a piece cheap, sure.


And regardless, I don't see why a player can't call out his teammates. Sure he's a dick and a bitchass for it, but I don't get why you're trying to make a connection with the payroll.

Because his teammates are massively talented.


He's a jerk for the comments. Doesn't matter how much the Lakers payroll is.

A fair point.


You do know that Dallas has a payroll over $90 million too, right?

And when I hear Dirk bitch about how much his teammates suck, I'll say the same thing about him that I am now about Kobe. But that won't happen, because only someone with the ego of Kobe would think himself as being above his teammates.

[da_suns_fan]

Of course those 8 or so passes to wide open Artes, Pau, and Drew. Funny thing about assists that the friggen player wide open needs to make the shot no? You stat whores crack me up. Kobe mad a few mistakes last night with turnovers etc but other than that he played a great all around game including passing to the open shooter. What he said in the Times was spot on even if you pussies think its too harsh.

Funny thing is, the players and staff all agree with him and have said so. Go figure.

Yeah..Jason Terry! :lol

[cobbler]

And it's common vernacular to refer to one's favorite team as "theirs", and adopt their accomplishments. A bit of reflected glory, but it shouldn't be too difficult to figure out, considering every fanbase on the planet uses that kind of statement informally. :lol

Ever notice its often the fans of teams with ZERO titles that have issues with the "we" that comes with the fan and the franchise association? Lamest argument on the board. Nothing but sour grapes.

As the t-shits that the franchise is giving out at 1st games of series say:

It's "my" life. It's "my" Lakers.

According to all the losers here... I guess they should have said "It's my life. It's Buss's Lakers"

[cobbler]

Artest might lose it. Pau could fade into even more of a shadow of his former self. Everyone else will play hard. Both teams will play hard.

Over one game and comments by Kobe? Uh huh, You leep believing that. :lol

[cobbler]

Lol mad Spurs fans premature ejaculating after the first game of the series. You'd think it was 3-0 Dallas.

It's almost too good to be true. Not only do they go down to a 8th seed making history but they then get to loose AGAIN rooting for the franchise they mock on a daily basis.

[redzero]

I have 16.

NWBA rings don't count.

[cobbler]

What the fuck are you talking about??? The Suns do have a championship parade. Probably the only WCF championship Parade in NBA History :lmao

Fuck PHX

My bad! :lmao

[da_suns_fan]

Ever notice its often the fans of teams with ZERO titles that have issues with the "we" that comes with the fan and the franchise association? Lamest argument on the board. Nothing but sour grapes.

As the t-shits that the franchise is giving out at 1st games of series say:

It's "my" life. It's "my" Lakers.

According to all the losers here... I guess they should have said "It's my life. It's Buss's Lakers"

Just remember that when the going got tough, Kobe demanded to be traded. Theres even cell phone video evidence of him telling Laker fans to get ready to buy Bulls jerseys.

Just a reminder that Kobe doesnt give a shit about the Lakers, the city of Los Angeles or especially YOU, yet you still get defensive every time someone criticizes him. :lol

[cobbler]

Yes, because as we all know, when a teammate is hitting a rough patch or having trouble getting into a rhythm, completely denying him the ball is a great way to get him involved in the offense. :tu

It was no rough patch. He was playing with no effort and even admitted so after the game. Said he just didnt bring it. So I guess when a guy isnt hustling and you toss it to him a couple times to see trash thrown up you need to keep feeding that guy until he gets his head in it and gets it right or the clock runs out.

BRILLIANT!

[Cry Havoc]

Over one game and comments by Kobe? Uh huh, You leep believing that. :lol

Nah. Ron had a horrific game one, and that guy seems to be on a perpetual hair trigger.

Gasol only because he's been playing scared since the playoffs started. Or maybe disinterested/tired. Either way I don't know if you can really expect him to break out of it for game 2.

[BRHornet45]

sons what a pathetic, overrated, sack of fucking shit. maybe if Kobe actually knew how to pass the ball then just maybe his team could have won last night. lol at Americans and the media obsessing over "points scored" and ONLY "points scored" by star players instead of focusing on other stats as well. this asshole should be sitting in a prison cell right now anyways. God I hope he blows out his knee in Game 2 and ends his ridiculously undeserving and overrated career.

[Cry Havoc]

It was no rough patch. He was playing with no effort and even admitted so after the game. Said he just didnt bring it. So I guess when a guy isnt hustling and you toss it to him a couple times to see trash thrown up you need to keep feeding that guy until he gets his head in it and gets it right or the clock runs out.

BRILLIANT!

Bynum is one of the youngest centers in the league. There's no excuse for a guy like Pau struggling, but this is the first playoffs where the Lakers have really been going to Bynum heavily. Dude might need a little guidance here and there. Freezing him out because he lacks aggression early? That just doesn't make sense to me. I doubt Kobe had the mentality he does now when he was what, 22? But he expects Bynum to man up and dominate... come on, it's incredibly unreasonable.

[TheMACHINE]

Thanks for making my point. Past glory doesn't mean shit this year. Lakers fans are gonna find that out real soon. :lol

what point? that past glorys dont count this year? Yes..you are right...the Spurs wont be able to win this year. The Lakers? Last time i checked , we still in the playoffs.

Come back when we get eliminated cuz youve been saying the same shit the past 2 years. :lmao

[da_suns_fan]

Kobe is right. The bench needs to step up. If Duncan had the balls to call his teammates out maybe they wouldn't have gotten tossed by an 8th seeder. Instead he's called a fucking pussy by Dyess.

:lol:lol

Butt-hurt Laker fan!

"Dont criticize Kobeeee! Im gonna make fun of your team!"

[Cry Havoc]

Hey gamer.

http://download-naruto-episodes.edogo.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/691312naruto_shippuden_collection_v2_by_neon_drane .jpg

Sup?

[TheMACHINE]

I'll take my four rings that are free of whining/bitching/complaining about having the most talented highest paid team in the league. :toast

$91,000,000 isn't enough for Kobe to think he's got a good team. :lmao

lol low standards

[TheMACHINE]

:lol:lol

Butt-hurt Laker fan!

"Dont criticize Kobeeee! Im gonna make fun of your team!"

:lol:lol

butthurt suns fan

[Cry Havoc]

sons what a pathetic, overrated, sack of fucking shit. maybe if Kobe actually knew how to pass the ball then just maybe his team could have won last night. lol at Americans and the media obsessing over "points scored" and ONLY "points scored" by star players instead of focusing on other stats as well. this asshole should be sitting in a prison cell right now anyways. God I hope he blows out his knee in Game 2 and ends his ridiculously undeserving and overrated career.

He's probably the only former MVP in the history of the league who could miss a clear look at the game winning shot and then have the audacity to say, "This loss had nothing to do with me."

I mean, really?

[BRHornet45]

You still bitter...

and son you're still an individual who doesn't live anywhere near the state of California nor have any direct ties to the city of Los Angeles, but somehow you conveniently became a Lakers fan. funny how that works ... let me ask, who are your favorite football and baseball teams as well?

[cobbler]

Just remember that when the going got tough, Kobe demanded to be traded. Theres even cell phone video evidence of him telling Laker fans to get ready to buy Bulls jerseys.

Just a reminder that Kobe doesnt give a shit about the Lakers, the city of Los Angeles or especially YOU, yet you still get defensive every time someone criticizes him. :lol

I could care less what he thinks of me, the Lakers, or the city as long as he's helping bring championships. Were at 5 now with him on the team and I'm giddy about getting the 6th this year. The NBA is a cold hard business.

By the way, how did the whole "Kobe demands" saga play out? How's that title count going for your nice sweet little boy Nash.

and BTW... I have gone on record many times saying Kobe is an arrogant prick and a jerk. Most players at that level are. I just love defending him because all you get so upset about it. And look, we are all talking about my Lakers in the process. :lol

[da_suns_fan]

:lol:lol

butthurt suns fan

"Dont criticize Kobeeeee! Im gonna make fun of YOU!"

:rollin

You guys care SO MUCH about what people think of Kobe!!!

[Jose Canseco]

If you want to call the next 8 guys on the roster who average $4.5 mil a piece cheap, sure.

Cheap by NBA standards. That's less than the MLE. And MLE players are generally good role players. Players making less are less than good role players.




Because his teammates are massively talented.

He has three very talented teammates. The one with the most talent is playing like a pussy.




And when I hear Dirk bitch about how much his teammates suck, I'll say the same thing about him that I am now about Kobe. But that won't happen, because only someone with the ego of Kobe would think himself as being above his teammates.

See, I don't see a problem with urging your teammates to pick up their play and start playing better. The manner in which he did it is bad form and poor leadership. But only because it was to the media. I am positive that guys like you mention with Jordan and Bird were equally hard on their teammates if not more so. The way Kobe sometimes does it is what makes him a bitchass. But there's nothing wrong with wanting your teammates to play better.

[da_suns_fan]

I could care less what he thinks of me


But you care what other people think of him.


A LOT!

[Cry Havoc]

See, I don't see a problem with urging your teammates to pick up their play and start playing better. The manner in which he did it is bad form and poor leadership. But only because it was to the media. I am positive that guys like you mention with Jordan and Bird were equally hard on their teammates if not more so. The way Kobe sometimes does it is what makes him a bitchass. But there's nothing wrong with wanting your teammates to play better.

Agree with this.

Expecting them to do a lot on the offensive end while you're jacking up 30 shots in a game is kind of ridiculous, however.

[cobbler]

Nah. Ron had a horrific game one, and that guy seems to be on a perpetual hair trigger.

Gasol only because he's been playing scared since the playoffs started. Or maybe disinterested/tired. Either way I don't know if you can really expect him to break out of it for game 2.

Huh? Ron has been a solid citizen as a Laker. You are stretching there big time. And word is Gasol is still suffering from complications from a upper resp infection. Who knows.

[Spurtacus]

lol Black Mamba going into hibernation for the summer

[BRHornet45]

He's probably the only former MVP in the history of the league who could miss a clear look at the game winning shot and then have the audacity to say, "This loss had nothing to do with me."

I mean, really?

son that was about as clear of a look that a player can get and he bricked it. but what more should any of us expect from Kobe? like I have said before he is hands down the most overrated NBA player .... wait no ... the most overrated ATHLETE arguably over the last 50 years. never in my life have I seen any other athlete receive the type of help from the officials and undeserving praise from the media that he has received throughout his entire career.

if you take away all of Kobe's bogus free throws that were awarded to him by the NBA to inflate his scoring numbers, then he would be nothing more than a 15-19 point per game player with a pathetic shooting percentage.

[HarlemHeat37]

:lol BR and da suns fan are going in on this thread, no rubber, more covers..

[da_suns_fan]

son that was about as clear of a look that a player can get and he bricked it. but what more should any of us expect from Kobe? like I have said before he is hands down the most overrated NBA player .... wait no ... the most overrated ATHLETE arguably over the last 50 years. never in my life have I seen any other athlete receive the type of help from the officials and undeserving praise from the media that he has received throughout his entire career.

if you take away all of Kobe's bogus free throws that were awarded to him by the NBA to inflate his scoring numbers, then he would be nothing more than a 15-19 point per game player with a pathetic shooting percentage.

I dont know about that. Hes extremely talented. Its just a shame he has no friends because he's a total D-Bag.

I wonder how long he practiced "the face" in the mirror before the game yesterday. :lol

[cobbler]

Bynum is one of the youngest centers in the league. There's no excuse for a guy like Pau struggling, but this is the first playoffs where the Lakers have really been going to Bynum heavily. Dude might need a little guidance here and there. Freezing him out because he lacks aggression early? That just doesn't make sense to me. I doubt Kobe had the mentality he does now when he was what, 22? But he expects Bynum to man up and dominate... come on, it's incredibly unreasonable.

Then GTFO Bynum. It's a mans game. Consistency is a big part of it. It's not Kobe's job to coddle Drew. If he needs it, which is absurd, thats on the coaching staff.

Nobody froze Drew out. Had he hustled and got in position, he would have got the ball. He didn't and didn't. Last I looked too, there were 3 other guys on the court yet only Kobe didn't pass it to drew. :lol

[Jose Canseco]

Agree with this.

Expecting them to do a lot on the offensive end while you're jacking up 30 shots in a game is kind of ridiculous, however.

Why? He's done it plenty of times and the Lakers won. This is not the first time Kobe has taken a lot of attempts. Don't you think his teammates are used to it? And this isn't a 6-for-24. He was actually hitting. Means his teammates have to make the most of their opportunities when they do get touches and shots. You act like this is the first time Kobe has taken close to 30 shots in a game. At least he was hitting.

You're coming off as pretty disingenuous. At least try to be reasonable.

[Cry Havoc]

Cheap by NBA standards. That's less than the MLE. And MLE players are generally good role players. Players making less are less than good role players.

But every team has scrubs that make almost nothing, even the Lakers. Drop their $$$ from the table and you're left with very decent to good role players. 4 great players and a set of good players isn't enough for Kobe.


He has three very talented teammates. The one with the most talent is playing like a pussy.

Truth, but keep in mind that Gasol did have 15/11. It's not like he was invisible out there. Without him the Lakers get crushed in this game, even if he did play poorly in the 4th.

[cobbler]

I dont know about that. Hes extremely talented. Its just a shame he has no friends because he's a total D-Bag.

I wonder how long he practiced "the face" in the mirror before the game yesterday. :lol

Now you know how many friends he has? Please clue us in on this. Links? Comments? I would love to see where you aquirred this knowledge.

I'll wait...

[Jose Canseco]

Agree with this.

Expecting them to do a lot on the offensive end while you're jacking up 30 shots in a game is kind of ridiculous, however.

Why? Is this the first time Kobe has taken close to 30 shots in a game? His teammates are used to it. There have been plenty of times where Kobe has taken a lot of shots and the Lakers won the game. It's up to his teammates to make the most of their opportunities when they get touches. It's not like they're not used to it. And this wasn't 6-for-24. Kobe was actually hitting. You're reaching.

The Lakers should be more concerned about how they defend Dirk and Terry, and how Marion actually can be impacting the game. The Lakers had control of the game for the most part. The second unit gave it away early in the fourth quarter. You may not like how Kobe did it, but he has a point.

You're coming off as disingenuous. At least be reasonable.

[cobbler]

But every team has scrubs that make almost nothing, even the Lakers. Drop their $$$ from the table and you're left with very decent to good role players. 4 great players and a set of good players isn't enough for Kobe..

So calling out your teammates for playing shitty is blowing up the team? He called them out. They will resopnd. Nothing more than that. And it was enough to garner 5 btw.



Truth, but keep in mind that Gasol did have 15/11. It's not like he was invisible out there. Without him the Lakers get crushed in this game, even if he did play poorly in the 4th.

Oh, so if Pau doesnt give us his half shitty game we lose by more. BRILLIANT! How about if he steps up they blow the Mavs out?

[da_suns_fan]

Then GTFO Bynum. It's a mans game. Consistency is a big part of it. It's not Kobe's job to coddle Drew. If he needs it, which is absurd, thats on the coaching staff.

Nobody froze Drew out. Had he hustled and got in position, he would have got the ball. He didn't and didn't. Last I looked too, there were 3 other guys on the court yet only Kobe didn't pass it to drew. :lol

Translation: You can criticize other Lakers. Just dont criticize KOBE! :lol

btw - which other Laker shot the ball 30 times without an assist?

[Jose Canseco]

But every team has scrubs that make almost nothing, even the Lakers. Drop their $$$ from the table and you're left with very decent to good role players. 4 great players and a set of good players isn't enough for Kobe.

So if you admit their scrubs, what's wrong with Kobe telling the scrubs to play better?




Truth, but keep in mind that Gasol did have 15/11. It's not like he was invisible out there. Without him the Lakers get crushed in this game, even if he did play poorly in the 4th.

2008 NBA Finals all over again. If you looked at Gasol's stats against Boston in the 2008 NBA Finals, it would have told you Gasol was steady and had a good series. Anyone who actually watched the series knows Gasol got punked by the Celtics frontline and played like the walking vagina he was called.

Gasol did not play well last night. Forget the stats. He got pushed around, stripped, blocked, and was largely ineffective.

[baseline bum]

3BkIh1R5utY

[da_suns_fan]

Now you know how many friends he has? Please clue us in on this. Links? Comments? I would love to see where you aquirred this knowledge.

I'll wait...

Im pretty sure he's got no friends on the Lakers bench. :rollin

Maybe Im being harsh. He DID buy those watches for his teammates when he was trying to show the media he had changed so he could get that MVP award! Someone might have been dumb enough to believe he geniunely wanted to be their friend.

You would be his friend, huh Cobbler?

[Obstructed_View]

:lol leader
:lol clutch
:lol Jordan

[da_suns_fan]

:lol leader
:lol clutch
:lol Jordan

:lol

[Cry Havoc]

Then GTFO Bynum. It's a mans game. Consistency is a big part of it. It's not Kobe's job to coddle Drew. If he needs it, which is absurd, thats on the coaching staff.

So 23 year old Kobe never had an off-night? Never had a game where he wasn't cutting it in the first half? It has NOTHING to do with coddling Bynum. He's a young guy who doesn't have a lot of playoff experience, and he's playing a team with a very sizable, defensive minded front line. The fewer looks he gets, the harder it's going to be for him to figure out how to score as the series goes on.


Nobody froze Drew out. Had he hustled and got in position, he would have got the ball. He didn't and didn't. Last I looked too, there were 3 other guys on the court yet only Kobe didn't pass it to drew. :lol

Sorry, I thought Kobe wanted to be the leader of the Lakers? If you're the leader you better lead by example and be prepared to take responsibility for the losses. You know damn well if Kobe hit that 3, it would be all over the papers about how Kobe "led" the Lakers to a win in the closing seconds. But he missed it, and all of a sudden the loss is on his teammates? That's absolute bullshit and in no other sports city in the US would it fly like it does in LA. I haven't checked Lakersground but I hope at least a few of the fans over there are displeased by the way Kobe is ducking this.


Why? He's done it plenty of times and the Lakers won. This is not the first time Kobe has taken a lot of attempts. Don't you think his teammates are used to it? And this isn't a 6-for-24. He was actually hitting. Means his teammates have to make the most of their opportunities when they do get touches and shots. You act like this is the first time Kobe has taken close to 30 shots in a game. At least he was hitting.

You're coming off as pretty disingenuous. At least try to be reasonable.

It's still a team game. It's tough for guys to get into a rhythm when they don't get touches. Odom was aggressive practically EVERY time he got the ball. The result? 10 shots in 31 minutes. And he was scoring on 50% too. Where are his touches? He even got to the line as much as Kobe despite shooting NINETEEN less attempts. 10 shots.

[Cry Havoc]

3BkIh1R5utY

:lmao

Way too close to the mark to be parody. :lmao

[cobbler]

Translation: You can criticize other Lakers. Just dont criticize KOBE! :lol

btw - which other Laker shot the ball 30 times without an assist?

You can criticize all players if it warranted. First of all he didnt shoot 30 times he shot 29 and MADE 14. He was on. Sercond, you do know who the Laker assist leader is over the last 5 years no? Thirdly, He passed the ball to an open Artest, Pau, and Drew who bricked their shots. Funny thing about those assists that the wide open player Kobe passed to needs to make it.

[Cry Havoc]

You can criticize all players if it warranted. First of all he didnt shoot 30 times he shot 29 and MADE 14. He was on. Sercond, you do know who the Laker assist leader is over the last 5 years no? Thirdly, He passed the ball to an open Artest, Pau, and Drew who bricked their shots. Funny thing about those assists that the wide open player Kobe passed to needs to make it.

48% = on fire for Kobe. :lol

[cobbler]

Im pretty sure he's got no friends on the Lakers bench. :rollin

Maybe Im being harsh. He DID buy those watches for his teammates when he was trying to show the media he had changed so he could get that MVP award! Someone might have been dumb enough to believe he geniunely wanted to be their friend.

You would be his friend, huh Cobbler?

I have met him several times. Was always cordial to me.

Again, you said Kobe has no friends. Now you say he has no friends on the bench.

Please show me your sources for this info. I honestly interested.

[da_suns_fan]

You can criticize all players if it warranted. First of all he didnt shoot 30 times he shot 29 and MADE 14. He was on. Sercond, you do know who the Laker assist leader is over the last 5 years no? Thirdly, He passed the ball to an open Artest, Pau, and Drew who bricked their shots. Funny thing about those assists that the wide open player Kobe passed to needs to make it.

Amazing that Gasol managed 7 assists considering the other Lakers cant make shots. :lol

[Jose Canseco]

Sorry, I thought Kobe wanted to be the leader of the Lakers? If you're the leader you better lead by example and be prepared to take responsibility for the losses. You know damn well if Kobe hit that 3, it would be all over the papers about how Kobe "led" the Lakers to a win in the closing seconds. But he missed it, and all of a sudden the loss is on his teammates? That's absolute bullshit and in no other sports city in the US would it fly like it does in LA. I haven't checked Lakersground but I hope at least a few of the fans over there are displeased by the way Kobe is ducking this.

Kobe had 36 points last night. Regardless if Kobe makes or misses that shot, he was the biggest reason for the Lakers having a chance to win. Making or missing that shot doesn't change the fact that some of his teammates, particularly the bench, didn't play well.

Your point doesn't make sense.



It's still a team game. It's tough for guys to get into a rhythm when they don't get touches. Odom was aggressive practically EVERY time he got the ball. The result? 10 shots in 31 minutes. And he was scoring on 50% too. Where are his touches? He even got to the line as much as Kobe despite shooting NINETEEN less attempts. 10 shots.On the season, Lamar Odom averaged 10.9 FGA in 32.2 MPG.

You need to stop it with this line of logic. Kobe shoots a lot. He always has. Always will. He knows it. You know it. I know it. Phil knows it. Every one of his teammates know it. This isn't the first time. Shooting a lot is what Kobe does on this Lakers team. It has worked the last two seasons. No way is this an issue where Kobe is shooting too much so his teammates playing poorly is a result of that. Come on now.

[cobbler]

Amazing that Gasol managed 7 assists considering the other Lakers cant make shots. :lol

And who passed the ball to Gasol so he could? You are really stretching here. Rewatch the game and see how many open looks he created for teammates that ended up bricking them. You making yourself look as foolish as Cry

[Jose Canseco]

Amazing that Gasol managed 7 assists considering the other Lakers cant make shots. :lol

Lol 4 of those assists were to Kobe, who was hitting jumpers. 2 were for Bynum dunks.

You are not smart.

[Cry Havoc]

On the season, Lamar Odom averaged 10.9 FGA in 32.2 MPG.

He was effective. Wasn't Kobe's contention that his teammates sucked, and the bench needed to step up? So if you're not Kobe, and you're playing really well, you're only entitled to your avg. number of shot attempts? Does that make sense? Odom was giving the Mavs fits last night.


You need to stop it with this line of logic. Kobe shoots a lot. He always has. Always will. He knows it. You know it. I know it. Phil knows it. Every one of his teammates know it. This isn't the first time. Shooting a lot is what Kobe does on this Lakers team. It has worked the last two seasons. No way is this an issue where Kobe is shooting too much so his teammates playing poorly is a result of that. Come on now.

Kobe had a wide open look at a game winning 3. He missed. He then blamed his teammates (specifically the bench even though Odom had a very very good game). Just pointing out how stupid that is. You're more than welcome to continue disagreeing. :toast

[da_suns_fan]

Lol 4 of those assists were to Kobe, who was hitting jumpers. 2 were for Bynum dunks.

You are not smart.

Which is 2 more than the Kobe-ster got. :lol

I guess all the assists the Lakers had were all passes to Kobe.

[da_suns_fan]

Kobe had a wide open look at a game winning 3. He missed. He then blamed his teammates (specifically the bench even though Odom had a very very good game). Just pointing out how stupid that is. You're more than welcome to continue disagreeing. :toast

Exactly. Kobe shot the ball 19 times more than any other teammate and he blames the bench for not getting guys involved?

Did he black out the last minute of the game?

But Kobe apologists think Kobe is immune from criticism. You cant reason with them. It doesnt matter if Kobe shot the ball 30 or 60 times. Kobe does no wrong!

[Jose Canseco]

He was effective. Wasn't Kobe's contention that his teammates sucked, and the bench needed to step up? So if you're not Kobe, and you're playing really well, you're only entitled to your avg. number of shot attempts? Does that make sense? Odom was giving the Mavs fits last night.

I don't think Kobe was targeting Lamar in his rant. The two bench guards, Blake and Brown, had as many assists as Kobe, zero. Kobe's criticism was that the bench needed to get Pau and Bynum the ball. Blake and Brown are not Kobe. They should have utilized either Pau or Bynum better, whichever was in the game.

It's not that I don't think Kobe doesn't share blame. It's on him to play better to, at least in making sure the bigs get involved. But the zero assists is skewed. Kobe was passing the ball too. Collecting assists still is dependent on the guy you pass it to making the shot. But sure Kobe needs to play better too.




Kobe had a wide open look at a game winning 3. He missed. He then blamed his teammates (specifically the bench even though Odom had a very very good game). Just pointing out how stupid that is. You're more than welcome to continue disagreeing. :toast

The game wasn't won or lost only on that last shot attempt. If Kobe was 3-for-20 on the game for 8 points and hit the winner, he wouldn't have been considered to have "led the team to victory." But he wasn't. He had 36 points up to that point. It was his shooting and scoring that was largely why the Lakers had a chance to win the game. That's why people would have said Kobe led the Lakers to the win if he made that shot. Not just because of that shot.

Making that shot wouldn't have meant the bench played well.

[Cry Havoc]

The game wasn't won or lost only on that last shot attempt. If Kobe was 3-for-20 on the game for 8 points and hit the winner, he wouldn't have been considered to have "led the team to victory." But he wasn't. He had 36 points up to that point. It was his shooting and scoring that was largely why the Lakers had a chance to win the game. That's why people would have said Kobe led the Lakers to the win if he made that shot. Not just because of that shot.

Making that shot wouldn't have meant the bench played well.

Kobe wants to be the leader. He wants to be the alpha male. But he doesn't want to take responsibility when HIS team loses? That's bullshit, and most Hall of Famers would agree with that. If his team is disinterested, it's on him to motivate. That's what leaders do.

[Jose Canseco]

One could easily argue that calling out his teammates in the media is a form of motivation.

[da_suns_fan]

Making that shot wouldn't have meant the bench played well.

How did Lamar Odom play? Does he start?

I just cant believe some people. Kobe shoots a disproportionate number of shots, turns it over in the final minute, bricks the potential game winner and then says the loss had nothing do with him.

Lakers might not have lost if he didnt forget Jason Terry plays for the Mavs.

Lakers might not have lost if he didnt trip over his own two feet on that hand-off.

Lakers might not have lost if he didnt choke a fat one on a WIDE OPEN shot at the buzzer.

Yet the Loss "had nothing to do with him".

Whats more pathetic is the apologists who feel the need to defend him.

Could you even imagine Dirk saying "It had nothing to do with me" after a loss, regardless of how his teammates played?

[da_suns_fan]

One could easily argue that calling out his teammates in the media is a form of motivation.

Yeah..you go with that one, bro.

[Cry Havoc]

One could easily argue that calling out his teammates in the media is a form of motivation.

No problem with him calling them out. At all. Encouraged, even.

But the blame game is seriously at the level of rec center maturity, where you have the one guy who shoots every time he touches the ball and then immediately calls a foul and/or bitches at his team anytime the other team scores. :lol

[Cry Havoc]

Could you even imagine Dirk saying "It had nothing to do with me" after a loss, regardless of how his teammates played?

People would be talking about how gaping his vagina is. :lol But Kobe does it and it's just him being a competitor and wanting his teammates to play better. :lol

[Jose Canseco]

I think your problem with Kobe is that he's being Kobe. This is who Kobe is and has been for most of his career. He's an asshole of a team leader. He throws everyone else under the bus but him. And he'll call out anyone for losing. Is this a new and different Kobe? Well is it?

You're criticizing him for being him. It hasn't hurt them the past two seasons. And if they don't win it all this year, if they get beat by the Mavs this series, I highly doubt it will be because Kobe didn't take accountability.

He shares the blame. But why are you so obsessed with that very irrelevant fact? It bears nothing on the rest of the series. If it has any effect on his teammates, it will be a positive one in terms of their play. I think it's ridiculous to suggest as one post did earlier that his teammates will now quit just so Kobe won't win.

[Cry Havoc]

I think your problem with Kobe is that he's being Kobe. This is who Kobe is and has been for most of his career. He's an asshole of a team leader. He throws everyone else under the bus but him. And he'll call out anyone for losing. Is this a new and different Kobe? Well is it?

You're criticizing him for being him. It hasn't hurt them the past two seasons. And if they don't win it all this year, if they get beat by the Mavs this series, I highly doubt it will be because Kobe didn't take accountability.

He shares the blame. But why are you so obsessed with that very irrelevant fact? It bears nothing on the rest of the series. If it has any effect on his teammates, it will be a positive one in terms of their play. I think it's ridiculous to suggest as one post did earlier that his teammates will now quit just so Kobe won't win.

Where did I suggest that his teammates will quit? Please show me.

And this situation goes to the argument about Kobe's place in the all-time greats. He's not a great leader. Most of the top 20 all-time players are great leaders.

[z0sa]

I think your problem with Kobe is that he's being Kobe. This is who Kobe is and has been for most of his career. He's an asshole of a team leader. He throws everyone else under the bus but him. And he'll call out anyone for losing. Is this a new and different Kobe? Well is it?

Why do you have such huge troubles understanding Kobe's clearly wrong, the loss is on him as the team leader? furthermore, isn't he clearly outside the category of leaders like Tim Duncan or Shaq or many other winning legends by calling out his teammates yet not assuming any of the blame?

Kobe is a total punk, who continues to prove to true NBA fans that he is an all-time great scorer and not much else.

[Cry Havoc]

Why do you have such huge troubles understanding Kobe's clearly wrong, the loss is on him as the team leader? furthermore, isn't he clearly outside the category of leaders like Tim Duncan or Shaq or many other winning legends by calling out his teammates yet not assuming any of the blame?

Imagine what Kobe would do if you switched him and Chris Paul last series and he had to deal with CP3's teammates. Yet you didn't hear Paul shirking responsibility or talking about how his teammates sucked.

[z0sa]

Imagine Kobe switched with, well, anyone. The media lets him get away with this, and that's the sole reason Kobe fanboys get away with defending him.

Any other superstar would get heavily criticized, minimum, and maybe crucified for passing the blame onto his teammates. Additionally, other *winning* superstars understand the blame starts with them.

Kobe with an epic failure. Anyone defending this, especially with the usual BSPN-spawned hype-machine talk "It's just Kobe being Kobe dawg!" deserves to be ridiculed.

[cobbler]

How did Lamar Odom play? Does he start?

I just cant believe some people. Kobe shoots a disproportionate number of shots, turns it over in the final minute, bricks the potential game winner and then says the loss had nothing do with him.

Lakers might not have lost if he didnt forget Jason Terry plays for the Mavs.

Lakers might not have lost if he didnt trip over his own two feet on that hand-off.

Lakers might not have lost if he didnt choke a fat one on a WIDE OPEN shot at the buzzer.

Yet the Loss "had nothing to do with him".

Whats more pathetic is the apologists who feel the need to defend him.

Could you even imagine Dirk saying "It had nothing to do with me" after a loss, regardless of how his teammates played?

"I know we got that crazy last minute there, but we've got to come out in the second half and play better," said Andrew Bynum, who managed eight points and five rebounds for Los Angeles. "We didn't lose it at the end. We lost it in the third quarter."

[Cry Havoc]

"I know we got that crazy last minute there, but we've got to come out in the second half and play better," said Andrew Bynum, who managed eight points and five rebounds for Los Angeles. "We didn't lose it at the end. We lost it in the third quarter."

What about when you're up 3 points with 60 seconds to play? Should you not win about 90% of those games in the playoffs?

[cobbler]

What about when you're up 3 points with 60 seconds to play? Should you not win about 90% of those games in the playoffs?

Absolutely, and the Lakers will. I actually think this was that blessing in disguise game. Kobe is at fault for his driving turnover no doubt. I'm not going to blame him for the last shot. He had a good look. Some you make some you dont. Again, it should have never got to a one shot outcome.

So in that last 60 seconds it was all Kobe's fault? What about Gasols foul? What about PJ's substitution blunder? What about Pau turning the ball over?

4 miscues in the last 60 seconds not including the last shot miss and only one of them was Kobe's. Any one of those 4 don't happen and it doesnt come down to a desperation 3 to win.

"The game was won in the third quarter when we got the lead and stopped playing defense and stopped playing offense, basically," Jackson said.

But hey... What would PJ know?

[Giuseppe]

Why do you have such huge troubles understanding Kobe's clearly wrong, the loss is on him as the team leader? furthermore, isn't he clearly outside the category of leaders like Tim Duncan or Shaq or many other winning legends by calling out his teammates yet not assuming any of the blame?

Kobe is a total punk, who continues to prove to true NBA fans that he is an all-time great scorer and not much else.

Kobe: 5

tired old shit bag Duncan: 4

[da_suns_fan]

"I know we got that crazy last minute there, but we've got to come out in the second half and play better," said Andrew Bynum, who managed eight points and five rebounds for Los Angeles. "We didn't lose it at the end. We lost it in the third quarter."

1) Contrast that statement with the one Kobe made. Amazing maturity from the young Drew.

2) In spite of the HORRIFIC 3rd quarter in which the Lakers were outscored 27-25, the Lakers still had the lead and the ball with the 30 seconds to go. Then Mr. "Loss had nothing to do with me" shit a brick.

[JamStone]

Where did I suggest that his teammates will quit? Please show me.

And this situation goes to the argument about Kobe's place in the all-time greats. He's not a great leader. Most of the top 20 all-time players are great leaders.

Had to switch computers...

I didn't say you said that. I said one post did earlier, not you.

Your "leadership" critism is pretty weak IMO. Jordan was notoriously a dick to his teammates. Bird was an asshole. Zeke was an asshole. There have been plenty of great players who weren't the "sympathetic" or "coddling" type of leader you suggest as a knock against Kobe. Winning championships forgives those charcter flaws over time. The same will be the case with Kobe. History won't remember Kobe as a poor leader. It will remember Kobe as a multiplte championship winner, multiple Finals MVP winner, and one of the greatest players in the history of the game. You're obsessing over what I feel is a "non-issue."

Kobe sucks as a leader when it comes to taking responsibilty. I don't argue otherwise. But it doesntreally change anything. Nor do I think it will negatively affect the Lakers chances of winning or losing.

[cobbler]

Kobe: 5 working on 6

tired old shit bag Duncan: 4 and done

Ammended

[da_suns_fan]

Kobe: 5

tired old shit bag Duncan: 4

:lol

Hey you show some RESPECT Cubby or I'll make you ride the Dan Majerle bus for a week.

[z0sa]

Kobe: 5

tired old shit bag Duncan: 4

The Rapist coattailed Daddy to 3 titles and singlehandedly cost his team 2 other titles.

Tim > Kobe

[JamStone]

Why do you have such huge troubles understanding Kobe's clearly wrong, the loss is on him as the team leader? furthermore, isn't he clearly outside the category of leaders like Tim Duncan or Shaq or many other winning legends by calling out his teammates yet not assuming any of the blame?

Kobe is a total punk, who continues to prove to true NBA fans that he is an all-time great scorer and not much else.


What trouble understanding? Kobe's wrong. The comments showed poor judgment on his part to share in the blame. I still think it's irrelevant to the series.

I am a Kobe fan but I don't defend his personality. I don't defend him as a person. I'm a fan of his game and his game only. But to suggest all he is is a great scorer shows your bias.

[Giuseppe]

The Rapist coattailed Daddy to 3 titles and singlehandedly cost his team 2 other titles.

Tim > Kobe

No. The proof is after the divorce....

Kobe: 2

Daddy: 1

P.S., you've no room. Your Neal raped as well.

[z0sa]

Ammended

It's hard to sustain title contention for 14 seasons, and even harder to re-tool/build while maintaining it.

Kobe couldn't do it, that's for damn sure. Not even close to it.

[Giuseppe]

I am a Kobe fan

You're a lieing sack of shit.

[z0sa]

What trouble understanding? Kobe's wrong. The comments showed poor judgment on his part to share in the blame. I still think it's irrelevant to the series.

I am a Kobe fan but I don't defend his personality. I don't defend him as a person. I'm a fan of his game and his game only.

Laughable, tbh. Your argument ALWAYS revolves around Kobe just bein' Kobe, dawg. Taking the good with the bad. You always fail to understand Kobe being Kobe has never worked unless he had the most talented team in the League.

Additionally, calling out his teammates like this without taking the blame after this many seasons and 5 titles?

Pathetic.

[z0sa]

No. The proof is after the divorce....

Kobe: 2

Daddy: 1

P.S., you've no room. Your Neal raped as well.

Daddy: 38 years old
Kobe: 33 years old

If Daddy had those 5 years, there'd be no Kobe-led titles in LA. And maybe no Kobe in LA, either.

[JamStone]

Talent wins. Is Kobe supposed to apologize for having talent on his team?

You're criticizing him for character flaws when you talk about his leadership or being a dick or a punk. His game has flaws too but is good enough to be the best player of champioship teams. You'd be better served to criticize his game, not his personality or his comments that are made after the game.

[Giuseppe]

Daddy: 38 years old
Kobe: 33 years old

If Daddy had those 5 years, there'd be no Kobe-led titles in LA. And maybe no Kobe in LA, either.

I ain't doin' "If", Z. I don't have to.

Kobe: 5

Duncan: 4

Kobe: 2

Daddy: 1

I waited in stoic silence, tight lipped, ashened faced for the numbers to tote up in my favor. & now that they have I'm gonna Lord it over every mother's son.

Let us proceed...

[NewcastleKEG]

Has there ever been a multiple champion that TALKED so much as the Lakers?

STFU and play

[SpurOutofTownFan]

I like dick.

Ammended

[z0sa]

Talent wins. Is Kobe supposed to apologize for having talent on his team?

Flawed line of questioning. The issue here in this thread is, why is Kobe's character constantly suspect? Why does he feel he never has the blame of a loss? Why must he vocalize his issues with his teammates when, with or without them, he's proven just as stubborn and big-headed?


You're criticizing him for character flaws when you talk about his leadership or being a dick or a punk. His game has flaws too but is good enough to be the best player of champioship teams. You'd be better served to criticize his game, not his personality or his comments that are made after the game.

Kobe's extremely suspect character allows him to constantly jack up shots without being called out by his teammates or the media. Being the best scorer and ball-handler on an extremely talented title team doesn't mean he was a great team leader who persevered through the difficulties. He's over-hyped and overrated as a leader and a supposed "warrior." He's as insecure and big-headed as they come and no one with respect for the game should forget that.

[Baseline]

29 shots and 0 assists?

And because he happens to make 14 of those shots (a decent percentage for once), the loss has nothing to do with him. Okay, sure.

This guy's ego surpasses anything in the history of sport, if not the world.

Honestly, with three of the longest guys in the league in the paint, one would think Bryant would get 2-3 assists by accident, like dribbling it off his foot.

[Giuseppe]

Has there ever been a multiple champion that TALKED so much as the Lakers?

STFU and play

You got no room. You acted a bitch last night...and the Hawks...they fucked ya like a bitch.

[z0sa]

I ain't doin' "If", Z. I don't have to.

Kobe: 5

Duncan: 4

Kobe: 2

Daddy: 1

I waited in stoic silence, tight lipped, ashened faced for the numbers to tote up in my favor. & now that they have I'm gonna Lord it over every mother's son.

Let us proceed...

The only thing you need to remember is

Tim, Shaq, and MJ > Kobe, regardless of team accomplishment counts

[Giuseppe]

The only thing you need to remember is

Tim, Shaq, and MJ > Kobe, regardless of team accomplishment counts

No. It's:::

Kobe: 5

Duncan: 4

Daddy: 4

MJ: 6 and frozen.

[ALVAREZ6]

lol

"we gotta feed it in more to Gasol and Bynum, my bench has to do a better job of that"


"but I'm gonna keep doin what I do, and that's take 29 shots. In fact, I might take more than that in game 2, because as a leader of this team the loss had nothing to do with me. Nothing to do with my bad passes in crunch time. But somehow we gotta feed the ball inside more while I take more shots. I challenge the bench to pull that off."


:lol Kobe

[z0sa]

:lmao

Kobe, the obvious tool. How do people defend this dude without getting sick to their stomach?

[Giuseppe]

:lmao

Kobe, the obvious tool. How do people defend this dude without getting sick to their stomach?

I like to see somebody triumph over Media:::Daddy did it in 2000 Vs. Indy when they were ready to string him up by Buster Browns. And Kobe did it in '09 when they were set to break his ass. Thus by extention I get to smight "you people" who serve at the behest of Media.

There is nothing more rewarding to me than:::

Kobe: 5

Duncan: 4

I enjoy Kobe's deep mental disturbance, and his ability to rub his foes nose in their makings to spite them. You/They thought they'd defeated him, denied him his onions. But, You/They were wrong.

It's get better than that. But, I'll be damned if I can cite it.

[z0sa]

Tim, Shaq, MJ > Kobe

[Giuseppe]

Tim, Shaq, MJ > Kobe

No:::

Kobe: 5

Duncan & Daddy: 4

MJ: 6 & frozen in time.

[z0sa]

Tim, Shaq, MJ > Kobe

Horry > Kobe by your logic, as well

[Giuseppe]

Tim, Shaq, MJ > Kobe

Horry > Kobe by your logic, as well

I got no problem with Horry.

But, otherwise, it's:::

Kobe: 5

Duncan & Daddy: 4

MJ: 6 and land locked.

[z0sa]

Horry > Kobe

[Ashy Larry]

I know I saw Bean hit the open man a few times last night ... that man being Ron Artest and dude just couldn't hit shit .... can't get an assist unless players make shots.

1-8 was horrid

[JamStone]

Flawed line of questioning. The issue here in this thread is, why is Kobe's character constantly suspect? Why does he feel he never has the blame of a loss? Why must he vocalize his issues with his teammates when, with or without them, he's proven just as stubborn and big-headed?

I'm waiting for the relevance of his character. Does it affect the Lakers winning of losing? Kobe's personality has been the same as the last two seasons. When his teammates don't play well, he acts like a bitch and tells them to play better. If it was that much of an issue, it should have adversely affected their chances to win the last two seasons. It did not.

I ask politely one more time, what relevance is the criticism about his character to the Lakers' chances of winning and losing?




Kobe's extremely suspect character allows him to constantly jack up shots without being called out by his teammates or the media. Being the best scorer and ball-handler on an extremely talented title team doesn't mean he was a great team leader who persevered through the difficulties. He's over-hyped and overrated as a leader and a supposed "warrior." He's as insecure and big-headed as they come and no one with respect for the game should forget that.

So not only can a poor leader win a championship, but a poor leader can lead a team two back-to-back championships? They win despite Kobe's leadership, right? If that were the case, could we argue hypothetically that other great championship players in the past could have also been bad leaders but they just had the talent themselves and on their teams to win despite their poor leadership? In today's highly media covered society with youtube and twitter and facebook, professional athletes (not just Kobe) are even more under a microscope than ever. Every character flaw, every little blow-up, every poorly judged comment will get seen and heard and criticized. Mind you, it doesn't mean Kobe isn't wrong or isn't an egomaniac or a isn't a poor leader. I just think people obsess way too much about comments to the media and his personality when the bottomline is what happens on the basketball court when the game is being played.

I agree Kobe is stubborn and big headed and insecure in his own way. If that's your best criticism of the guy because you rather talk about that than his jacking up shots or failure to get an assist, I think your time is poorly spent.

With all of negative character flaws Kobe has exhibited last night, does that mean the last two seasons, he was a good leader? Does that mean he wasn't insecure or big headed or stubborn or a jerk or a bad leader the previous two seasons? Winning cures all. Winning forgives those criticisms. And if Kobe can't win this season, the vultures will fly down and take their piece. But this is the same Kobe that led the Lakers two the last two NBA championships. There is plenty of criticism you can make about his game. I don't know why some of you insist on obsessing over his comments about his teammates and his "leadership" and his ego, etc.

[RedsLakers24]

http://i52.tinypic.com/29lg3uo.jpg

[Killakobe81]

I'm waiting for the relevance of his character. Does it affect the Lakers winning of losing? Kobe's personality has been the same as the last two seasons. When his teammates don't play well, he acts like a bitch and tells them to play better. If it was that much of an issue, it should have adversely affected their chances to win the last two seasons. It did not.

I ask politely one more time, what relevance is the criticism about his character to the Lakers' chances of winning and losing?





So not only can a poor leader win a championship, but a poor leader can lead a team two back-to-back championships? They win despite Kobe's leadership, right? If that were the case, could we argue hypothetically that other great championship players in the past could have also been bad leaders but they just had the talent themselves and on their teams to win despite their poor leadership? In today's highly media covered society with youtube and twitter and facebook, professional athletes (not just Kobe) are even more under a microscope than ever. Every character flaw, every little blow-up, every poorly judged comment will get seen and heard and criticized. Mind you, it doesn't mean Kobe isn't wrong or isn't an egomaniac or a isn't a poor leader. I just think people obsess way too much about comments to the media and his personality when the bottomline is what happens on the basketball court when the game is being played.

I agree Kobe is stubborn and big headed and insecure in his own way. If that's your best criticism of the guy because you rather talk about that than his jacking up shots or failure to get an assist, I think your time is poorly spent.

With all of negative character flaws Kobe has exhibited last night, does that mean the last two seasons, he was a good leader? Does that mean he wasn't insecure or big headed or stubborn or a jerk or a bad leader the previous two seasons? Winning cures all. Winning forgives those criticisms. And if Kobe can't win this season, the vultures will fly down and take their piece. But this is the same Kobe that led the Lakers two the last two NBA championships. There is plenty of criticism you can make about his game. I don't know why some of you insist on obsessing over his comments about his teammates and his "leadership" and his ego, etc.

Jamstone is back taking the weaker posters of this forum to the wood-shed. I agree 100% why not fault Kobe for missing his last 5 game-winning or game tying playoff shots anstead? But by getting all emo in these arguments and and saying he is a poor leader compared to Duncan (or anyone else) is a fool's errand. The bottom line is winning ...duh! and with all the leadership skills that Duncan or Kobe have or do not have, wouldn't mean shit without winning...

and let's be honest the locker-room leader of the Lakers is Fisher. he is the "good-cop". Kobe that asshole cop and he plays it well. But Phil is the leader of the Lakers and i will be curious to see how Kobe steps as a leader or fails after Phil is gone ...

[RedsLakers24]

Kobe actually said not Feeding the ball to Bynum and Gasol wasnt his fault, he never said the loss wasnt on him. In the 13 min that he sat, Bynum and Gasol only had 3 FGA.

[Ashy Larry]

http://i52.tinypic.com/29lg3uo.jpg



league average is 28% .... Bean happens to be 28%

[Giuseppe]

But Phil is the leader of the Lakers and i will be curious to see how Kobe steps as a leader or fails after Phil is gone ...

Kobe has been the leader since Phil left. He brought Gasol to Los Angeles. He brought Phil back to Los Angeles. He brought Artest to Los Angeles.

Make no mistake, Bryant is the first & last word.

[Ashy Larry]

Kobe actually said not Feeding the ball to Bynum and Gasol wasnt his fault, he never said the loss wasnt on him. In the 13 min that he sat, Bynum and Gasol only had 3 FGA.


completely unacceptable ......

[Giuseppe]

completely unacceptable ......

GD it, Bynum would not get low. Chandler resisted him to start with and Bynum never fought him. Chandler called ass and Bynum balked.

[Ashy Larry]

Drew did basically say he played like a bitch. Then Odom needs to get his ass on the box because he was making it look so easy yesterday when he got aggressive. Hopefully Bynum gets his head out of his ass.

And one of those fucks really have to make Dirk spend energy on the defensive end. He literally played one end last night

[ArtVandelay]

lmao
dude so desperately wants to be the one and only reason his team succeeds
asshole continually makes a concerted effort not to allow anyone else to get any credit

[Giuseppe]

lmao
dude so desperately wants to be the one and only reason his team succeeds
asshole continually makes a concerted effort not to allow anyone else to get any credit

Baloney. He already lauded Gasol time & again stating that both he & Gasol are responsible jointly.

[ChrisRichards]

Enough with this Kobe has leadership skills BS. Kobe has none. The Lakers are winning because they have a great team coached by the winningest Coach of all time.

Kobe's a great closer and an an all world talent But he is NOT a leader. Fisher is the real leader of the Lakers. He is the voice of reason that commands respect from the whole team. Kobe is "liked" because he is the franchise player. There is a huge difference there.


Being the best player on a winning team does not automatically make you a great leader. There are so many great players these days with almost zero leadership skills, so this is not a knock on Kobe, not everyone can be like Magic.

[TheMACHINE]

Enough with this Kobe has leadership skills BS. Kobe has none. The Lakers are winning because they have a great team coached by the winningest Coach of all time.

Kobe's a great closer and an an all world talent But he is NOT a leader. Fisher is the real leader of the Lakers. He is the voice of reason that commands respect from the whole team. Kobe is "liked" because he is the franchise player. There is a huge difference there.


Being the best player on a winning team does not automatically make you a great leader. There are so many great players these days with almost zero leadership skills, so this is not a knock on Kobe, not everyone can be like Magic.

CR is right...Fisher is the leader...just like Alonzo Mourning was the leader of the 2006 Heat Championship Team and Haslem is the leader of this years Heat team.

[Cessation]

Jordan was selfish early in his career, but by the time he won his first championship, he knew how to regularly get his teamates involved. By staying within the offence throughout the game, keeping it close, and then taking over in the fourth to close it out. Yet another aspect of the game where bean is inferior to jordan. Maybe if bean wasn't such a chucker he'd be able to take over a game with effieciency, when the defence tightens up.

[DMC]

Enough with this Kobe has leadership skills BS. Kobe has none. The Lakers are winning because they have a great team coached by the winningest Coach of all time.

Kobe's a great closer and an an all world talent But he is NOT a leader. Fisher is the real leader of the Lakers. He is the voice of reason that commands respect from the whole team. Kobe is "liked" because he is the franchise player. There is a huge difference there.


Being the best player on a winning team does not automatically make you a great leader. There are so many great players these days with almost zero leadership skills, so this is not a knock on Kobe, not everyone can be like Magic.

It's a good thing. He would be hated by Laker fans everywhere. You have to throw your teammates under the bus every year and whine about quitting like a sissy faggot before Laker fan takes notice and wears your jersey. Magic never did that, ergo he's a tired shit bag.

[picc84]

Whatever Bryant does during the game, he's gotta make that last 3 pointer. Thats what he's paid for, and its what everyone in Hollywood expects. Gotta put that down, Bean.

[DMC]

He makes the last one. It's often not the right one though.

[picc84]

The last one is always the right one. He got a good look. It didn't go. For Bryant, thats unacceptable. Its the only thing keeping him afloat in the conversation whilst the Wade's and James's fly around and about on their young legs.

[Giuseppe]

Whatever Bryant does during the game, he's gotta make that last 3 pointer.


Nothin' but the truth.

[DMC]

supasta!

[Daddy_Of_All_Trolls]

So, Lakers get their second home loss, and the Mavs their first road win. Both are great road teams. Translation? Probably going 7 games.

[ChrisRichards]

CR is right...Fisher is the leader...just like Alonzo Mourning was the leader of the 2006 Heat Championship Team and Haslem is the leader of this years Heat team.
I'm actually going to agree with you there a little bit. Wade was not the leader of that 2006 Championship team, but he sure was the best player, so let's just acknowledge that fact while we're at it.


Mourning was the heart and soul of that team, he served as an inspiration to the whole cast but he still wasn't no leader. Just like the Lakers of today, Wade benefited playing with another HOF coach, and a great cast so the result was a no brainer.


That team had a LOT of ego's. Do you think Wade was barking at Mourning, Payton and Shaq? (Well he did at Payton) of course not. Forget what the tabloid and every journalists wants you to believe. That team had one leader and it was Pat. He had so much control over that team its not even funny.

[FkLA]

I'm waiting for the relevance of his character. Does it affect the Lakers winning of losing?

Most people, including myself, dont detest Kobe simply because of the type of person he is. Its because his ego-filled character is interrelated with how he plays the game, I dont think theyre independent of each other at all. Bron is completely full of himself but on the court he drops that and plays the right way...you cant say the same for Kobe. This nigga needs to be the center of attention at all times on the court, and hes made it pretty apparent with how he plays the game that theres only one way to do that. And thats by scoring. Which means tons of shots, even at the expense of his team's success. Its been pretty well chronicled over the years that Kobe going into chucker makes the Lakers a very ordinary team. Yet this continues to be a re-occurring issue, at age 33 and 15(?) seasons in?? Ridiculous.

Yes, hes won alot during his career but the Lakers are a storied winning organization. Theyve won before him, with him, and will unfortunately win without him. They attract talent and like you said talent wins. Kobe's been blessed with that, which makes alot of people overlook the fact that for as talented a player as he is he also has a tendency to negatively affect his team. Can you imagine Kobe playing a more balanced game and feeding his bigs? The Laker's road to championships would be so much smoother, nobody in the NBA can compete with that frontline in a 7-game series. Yet theyve had their struggles these past two years because Kobe refuses to share the spotlight. I mean make no mistake about it, Kobe has been the biggest reason why theyve won these two titles...but at the same time his egotistical way of playing the game has also hindered those Laker teams. Im convinced that you put someone equally as talented as Kobe but with a more team-oriented mindset and their road is easier. And vice-versa, switch Kobe to a team like the the '10 Cavs with less individual talent and moreso solid role players that depend on a superstar to create for them and Kobe gets exposed. This nigga's attitude and selfish approach to the game makes him absolutely suck at maximizing his teammates talents.

This clown is a Top 10, possibly even Top 5 individual talent of all-time no doubt. But this media-driven notion that hes a Top 10(and rising) basketball player of all-time is a joke. Basketball is alot more than just being able to put the ball in the basket at will.

[HarlemHeat37]

Eh, I'd still say he's definitely a top 10 player of all-time, and I'm one of the biggest Kobe haters on the planet..there's no way I'd even think about putting guys like Jerry West ahead of Kobe..

However, he's easily the most overrated player of all-time, which can easily be proven in an argument..

[Giuseppe]

Yes, hes won alot during his career

That's all there is. There is nothing else.

It's not a CYO league. It's a profession. It's not supposed to be fun or fair. It's business.

[cobbler]

It's a good thing. He would be hated by Laker fans everywhere. You have to throw your teammates under the bus every year and whine about quitting like a sissy faggot before Laker fan takes notice and wears your jersey. Magic never did that, ergo he's a tired shit bag.

Wrong again as usual.

Look up Paul Westhead hater boy. And dont even go the coach isnt a teammate route. Magic often called out his teammates to perform better.

[FkLA]

That's all there is. There is nothing else.

It's not a CYO league. It's a profession. It's not supposed to be fun or fair. It's business.

No. The winning can be analyzed as well. 4 NCAA Championships by Butler is more impressive than 5 NCAA Championships by Duke/NC/UCLA during a 10 yr span. The latter has all the resources and talent. Duncan is at Butler, Kobe is at Duke/NC/UCLA.

Duncan>Kobe

Neal with it.

[cobbler]

Most people, including myself, dont detest Kobe simply because of the type of person he is. Its because his ego-filled character is interrelated with how he plays the game, I dont think theyre independent of each other at all. Bron is completely full of himself but on the court he drops that and plays the right way...you cant say the same for Kobe. This nigga needs to be the center of attention at all times on the court, and hes made it pretty apparent with how he plays the game that theres only one way to do that. And thats by scoring. Which means tons of shots, even at the expense of his team's success. Its been pretty well chronicled over the years that Kobe going into chucker makes the Lakers a very ordinary team. Yet this continues to be a re-occurring issue, at age 33 and 15(?) seasons in?? Ridiculous.

Yes, hes won alot during his career but the Lakers are a storied winning organization. Theyve won before him, with him, and will unfortunately win without him. They attract talent and like you said talent wins. Kobe's been blessed with that, which makes alot of people overlook the fact that for as talented a player as he is he also has a tendency to negatively affect his team. Can you imagine Kobe playing a more balanced game and feeding his bigs? The Laker's road to championships would be so much smoother, nobody in the NBA can compete with that frontline in a 7-game series. Yet theyve had their struggles these past two years because Kobe refuses to share the spotlight. I mean make no mistake about it, Kobe has been the biggest reason why theyve won these two titles...but at the same time his egotistical way of playing the game has also hindered those Laker teams. Im convinced that you put someone equally as talented as Kobe but with a more team-oriented mindset and their road is easier. And vice-versa, switch Kobe to a team like the the '10 Cavs with less individual talent and moreso solid role players that depend on a superstar to create for them and Kobe gets exposed. This nigga's attitude and selfish approach to the game makes him absolutely suck at maximizing his teammates talents.

This clown is a Top 10, possibly even Top 5 individual talent of all-time no doubt. But this media-driven notion that hes a Top 10(and rising) basketball player of all-time is a joke. Basketball is alot more than just being able to put the ball in the basket at will.

Team leading assits over the last 10 years would suggest that the other 11 Lakers play even worse team ball. Kobe is a scorer. He's a volume shooter. Always has been, always will be.

Also, all this talk about him wanting all the glory is complete BS. He has stated many many times that they would have won nada without Pau as his partner. You may not like the way the Lakers play. Kobe's faults are well documented. Some overblown and some understated. He is what he is. A winner. And I'll take an egotistical arrogant asshole winner over a egotistical arrogant "plays the right way" loser anyday. I'm kinda having a hard time though seeing how quitting on your team in the playoffs and tucking tail and bolting is concidered "playing the right way". I guess it's just me. :lol

The only "right" way in my book is the way that ends up with your team winning the last game of the playoffs.

[Giuseppe]

Duncan>Kobe

Neal with it.

No.

Kobe: 5

tired old shit bag Duncan: 4

& you've no room. Your Neal raped as well.

[Giuseppe]

The only "right" way in my book is the way that ends up with your team winning the last game of the playoffs.

Yep, there is nothing else.

[TheMACHINE]

Jordan was selfish early in his career, but by the time he won his first championship, he knew how to regularly get his teamates involved. By staying within the offence throughout the game, keeping it close, and then taking over in the fourth to close it out. Yet another aspect of the game where bean is inferior to jordan. Maybe if bean wasn't such a chucker he'd be able to take over a game with effieciency, when the defence tightens up.

Jordan 6

Bean 5

Duncan 4

[Josepatches_]

Horry 7

[Giuseppe]

Pippen saved Jordan from a fate worse than death.

[SpurOutofTownFan]

No.

Kobe: 5

tired old shit bag Duncan: 4

& you've no room. Your Neal raped as well.

hey i want some kool aid too

[Giuseppe]

hey i want some kool aid too

Bend over. I'll give ya some f'in' kool aid.

[JamStone]

Most people, including myself, dont detest Kobe simply because of the type of person he is. Its because his ego-filled character is interrelated with how he plays the game, I dont think theyre independent of each other at all. Bron is completely full of himself but on the court he drops that and plays the right way...you cant say the same for Kobe. This nigga needs to be the center of attention at all times on the court, and hes made it pretty apparent with how he plays the game that theres only one way to do that. And thats by scoring. Which means tons of shots, even at the expense of his team's success. Its been pretty well chronicled over the years that Kobe going into chucker makes the Lakers a very ordinary team. Yet this continues to be a re-occurring issue, at age 33 and 15(?) seasons in?? Ridiculous.

Yes, hes won alot during his career but the Lakers are a storied winning organization. Theyve won before him, with him, and will unfortunately win without him. They attract talent and like you said talent wins. Kobe's been blessed with that, which makes alot of people overlook the fact that for as talented a player as he is he also has a tendency to negatively affect his team. Can you imagine Kobe playing a more balanced game and feeding his bigs? The Laker's road to championships would be so much smoother, nobody in the NBA can compete with that frontline in a 7-game series. Yet theyve had their struggles these past two years because Kobe refuses to share the spotlight. I mean make no mistake about it, Kobe has been the biggest reason why theyve won these two titles...but at the same time his egotistical way of playing the game has also hindered those Laker teams. Im convinced that you put someone equally as talented as Kobe but with a more team-oriented mindset and their road is easier. And vice-versa, switch Kobe to a team like the the '10 Cavs with less individual talent and moreso solid role players that depend on a superstar to create for them and Kobe gets exposed. This nigga's attitude and selfish approach to the game makes him absolutely suck at maximizing his teammates talents.

This clown is a Top 10, possibly even Top 5 individual talent of all-time no doubt. But this media-driven notion that hes a Top 10(and rising) basketball player of all-time is a joke. Basketball is alot more than just being able to put the ball in the basket at will.

You're entitled to your opinion.

I think Kobe is just wired a certain way. And I look at it this way. Kobe wouldn't have had the success individually or team-wise that he's had if he wasn't the way he was. Some of the great players in the NBA want to be all stars. Some players are just happy to be in the league and want to have fun. Some players want to be rich and famous. Some want to be the best player in the league. Kobe doesn't want to be the best player in the league. Kobe wants to be the best player ever. That's Kobe. That's his mentality.

Now I believe that's why Kobe is the way he is. Throughout his career, obsessively imitating Jordan who was considered the GOAT by most, obsessively training and conditioning his body even in the off season, being the first guy in the gym and the last guy out. That type of shit. It has also bred that ego and stubbornness and probably the borderline foolish confidence. You know why he wants the spotlight all to himself? Because he thinks he's the best, the second best, the third best, and probably the fourth best option for his teams to win. It has to be in his hands. That's how much confidence he has in his ability and his preparation for those moments.

Now we all know he's not the greatest ever. And it's a virtual certainty he won't even be in the conversation when he's done playing. But it's that obsession to be the best. It's that obsession to surpass Michael. It's that obsession as to why he is the player and the person that he is. I think him being a dick of a teammate and leader is a product of that. His teammates are worried about winning games and hopefully challenging for championships. Kobe is concerned about that BUT ALSO about his own legacy. He's absolutely selfish in that regard.

That's Kobe. There's both good and bad as a result of it. But if he wasn't that way, I doubt he would have had the success he's had, both individually and in terms of championships for his teams. That obsession for ultimate greatness is what I appreciate about Kobe as a player. The byproduct of being a dick and a negative leader and poor teammate and coming off as a selfish asshole are things that seem to be indirect results.

[cobbler]

^
Well said. :toast

Couldn't agree more. And it's also the very reason Buss chose Kobe over Shaq. Boiled down and in 2 words. Work Ethic.

[HarlemHeat37]

Yes, that was it..it wasn't age, or anything of that nature:lol..

[SomeCallMeTim]

Wow, guess I'm late to the party on this one. Ten pages?

What Kobe said was totally inexcusable. Doesn't even matter if it's true -- and of course it isn't completely true. You win as a team and you lose as a team. Anything else is unacceptable.

[Giuseppe]

And it's also the very reason Buss chose Kobe over Shaq. Boiled down and in 2 words. Work Ethic.

& we've never looked back.

[Red Hawk #21]

Kobe had zero assists last night...ZERO! That loss had everything to do with him. What a fuckstick. :lol

This man really had zero assists. I mean come on, everyone knows he's a ballhog but ZERO assists? :wow

[da_suns_fan]

& we've never looked back.

Yeah..except in 2006 when Daddy won his fourth and Kobe was demanding to be traded.

[Giuseppe]

Yeah..except in 2006 when Daddy won his fourth and Kobe was demanding to be traded.

I'm saying we never looked back with regret at running Daddy off.

Kobe getting after Buss with hammer & tong is a separate & yet another sage decision by Kobe.

[cobbler]

Yeah..except in 2006 when Daddy won his fourth and Kobe was demanding to be traded.

Yeah.... that was right about the time your team was choking its 38th season in a row with ZERO titles. Perhaps someone along the line, maybe even 2 time MVP boy, should have made some demands and you wouldn't be so envious. BTW... How did the big Craptus work out for ya?

[Man In Black]

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/2011/may/02/mj-kobe-debate-somehow-pops-playoffs/

When it gets down to it, can't get any better than 2nd best SG ever.

[Ashy Larry]

lol @ the Daddy ......

The Lakers organization had to make a choice. Kobe or Shaquille. You can only have one.

Lakers chose Kobe. Dude may be a douche or may may be a good guy, but on the court, no one works harder than him. If you ran a business and it was open for 82 days, you'd probably hire Bean as your employee figuring he'd show up for work while Shaquille will more than likely show up for fifty, if that.

Bad fingers, bad ankle, bad back and Bean played 82 regular season games. Shaquille?? LOL

Doc Buss didn't get a PhD in chemistry, millions in real estate and get to hang out with Heff at the Mansion by being stupid. He knows what he's doing. That's why his offices are laced with these and a hot daughter:

http://lakersblog.latimes.com/.a/6a00d8341c506253ef0134892e2006970c-pi

[Ashy Larry]

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/2011/may/02/mj-kobe-debate-somehow-pops-playoffs/

When it gets down to it, can't get any better than 2nd best SG ever.



totally agree .... he's there right now. Really don't see him passing Black Jesus unless he goes on a magnificent run in these last four years ...... this year being one of them, can't let this year go to waste.

[Man In Black]

You're entitled to your opinion.

I think Kobe is just wired a certain way. And I look at it this way. Kobe wouldn't have had the success individually or team-wise that he's had if he wasn't the way he was. Some of the great players in the NBA want to be all stars. Some players are just happy to be in the league and want to have fun. Some players want to be rich and famous. Some want to be the best player in the league. Kobe doesn't want to be the best player in the league. Kobe wants to be the best player ever. That's Kobe. That's his mentality.

Now I believe that's why Kobe is the way he is. Throughout his career, obsessively imitating Jordan who was considered the GOAT by most, obsessively training and conditioning his body even in the off season, being the first guy in the gym and the last guy out. That type of shit. It has also bred that ego and stubbornness and probably the borderline foolish confidence. You know why he wants the spotlight all to himself? Because he thinks he's the best, the second best, the third best, and probably the fourth best option for his teams to win. It has to be in his hands. That's how much confidence he has in his ability and his preparation for those moments.

Now we all know he's not the greatest ever. And it's a virtual certainty he won't even be in the conversation when he's done playing. But it's that obsession to be the best. It's that obsession to surpass Michael. It's that obsession as to why he is the player and the person that he is. I think him being a dick of a teammate and leader is a product of that. His teammates are worried about winning games and hopefully challenging for championships. Kobe is concerned about that BUT ALSO about his own legacy. He's absolutely selfish in that regard.

That's Kobe. There's both good and bad as a result of it. But if he wasn't that way, I doubt he would have had the success he's had, both individually and in terms of championships for his teams. That obsession for ultimate greatness is what I appreciate about Kobe as a player. The byproduct of being a dick and a negative leader and poor teammate and coming off as a selfish asshole are things that seem to be indirect results.

All of that stems from his FATHER'S inability to become a star player in the NBA. So he infused all that disappointment and hate into his son. Jellybean always felt that he should be franchise player but was never treated as such in his time in the NBA. Even when he played for the Clippers in San Diego, he wasn't treated as a star. He was a ballhog then too but when your team has Lloyd "World B" Free and Randy Smith, you don't need a ballhog scorer to dominate the ball, so he bailed off to Italy. That's what it took for Jellybean to get his SPOTLIGHT. Once his kid started to show some talent, Jellybean took BEAN and meld him into the player that he wanted to be. It's a typical Father living his dream through his son thing but having his son exceed the ego to a point, the son gives his Pop's a capital F-you, I marrying the Hot Latina chick and doing my own thing.
Hell of a player yes, 2nd best SG ever with no chance at #1 yes, charitable...at times, loved and hated all over the NBA...no doubt. Bean is a polarizing figure, but if you wanted to know how he got that way, look no further than his father.

[Giuseppe]

All of that stems from his FATHER'S inability to become a star player in the NBA. So he infused all that disappointment and hate into his son. Jellybean always felt that he should be franchise player but was never treated as such in his time in the NBA. Even when he played for the Clippers in San Diego, he wasn't treated as a star. He was a ballhog then too but when your team has Lloyd "World B" Free and Randy Smith, you don't need a ballhog scorer to dominate the ball, so he bailed off to Italy. That's what it took for Jellybean to get his SPOTLIGHT. Once his kid started to show some talent, Jellybean took BEAN and meld him into the player that he wanted to be. It's a typical Father living his dream through his son thing but having his son exceed the ego to a point, the son gives his Pop's a capital F-you, I marrying the Hot Latina chick and doing my own thing.
Hell of a player yes, 2nd best SG ever with no chance at #1 yes, charitable...at times, loved and hated all over the NBA...no doubt. Bean is a polarizing figure, but if you wanted to know how he got that way, look no further than his father.

Like Amadeus' daddy, only instead of musical instruments Jellybean used a leather sphere. Daddy would be like F. Murray, I'd be the gusset in Mrs. Amadeus' lingerie drawer. Herself would be Marie Antoinette, and Kool would be her brother Jeffrey Jones. The Count Orsiney Rosenberg would be rightfully played by hardass Jammie.

A QM Production.

[JamStone]

That's an interesting take. Didn't really care to know how Kobe got the way he did, but that's cool. People are often affected by their upbringing and their parents and other influences when they were kids. Your theory is reasonable. I'm sure it has something to do with it, probably a good deal to do with it.

I only bring up Kobe's personality as it relates to the opinions in this thread about how he's a bad leader or big headed, stubborn, and an all around jerk. I don't defend it. I just think it's part of who he is and a big reason why he's been as successful as he has been in his career. Wherever it stems from is not really a big deal to me. People are motivated by a lot of different things. He could be a great leader, accommodating, approachable, nurturing to his teammates, a sympathetic and compassionate friend to them, a diplomatic and endearing media personality. He could be all of that and I don't think he'd be the player he is today. Maybe it works for some players. Maybe a Magic Johnson smile works for some. Maybe being buddy-buddy to all your teammates like LeBron was in Cleveland works for a certain type of personality. But that's simply not Kobe. I'm sure some of Kobe's teammates consider themselves friends of Kobe. Deep down inside, I don't think Kobe gives a fuck if they're his friend or not. And yes, he's a mean cuss and an all around S.O.B. And that's how he'll always be. It's how he got where he is. And he's not apologetic about it.

10 years from now when Kobe's giving his Hall of Fame speech, it wouldn't shock me at all if in his acceptance speech he says "fuck you, dad" and "fuck you, Shaq." I'm sure he'll smile then.

[Giuseppe]

10 years from now when Kobe's giving his Hall of Fame speech, it wouldn't shock me at all if in his acceptance speech he says "fuck you, dad" and "fuck you, Shaq." I'm sure he'll smile then.


I just hope he's standing there with at least 7.

[DMC]

I'm saying we never looked back with regret at running Daddy off.

Kobe getting after Buss with hammer & tong is a separate & yet another sage decision by Kobe.
I agree with this. The reason the Lakers are winning again is because of the pressure Kobe put on the organization.

Some guys, even really great players, are content to just tough it out every season and come up short. Some even thrive on really shitty teams for years. Kobe knew he was in his prime and didn't want to sit around for 10 years watching the Finals.

[Cry Havoc]

"Game 2 had nothing to do with me either."

[Josepatches_]

Kobe was right.

The problem is Pau.You can't win when your best player sucks

[djohn2oo8]

"Game 2 had nothing to do with me either."

Crucify em' Cry. Send that Kobe fanboy ass to the tree of Woe :lmao