Mendenhall is an idiot

[LnGrrrR]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=6471433

[QUOTE]The Pittsburgh Steelers running back on Monday tweeted: "What kind of person celebrates death? It's amazing how people can HATE a man they have never even heard speak. We've only heard one side..."

Mendenhall didn't hold back, even making a reference to the Sept. 11 attacks.

"We'll never know what really happened. I just have a hard time believing a plane could take a skyscraper down demolition style."[/QUOTE

I hope he gets booed every time he touches the ball. It's one thing to say that we shouldn't celebrate a death, that's arguable.

But then he goes full-blown retard. Fucking moron.

[symple19]

Fucking moron.

[CubanSucks]

Speaking of people I've never spoken to, I really don't understand all the hatred towards Hitler. I mean, it's not like I've heard his side of it. Just sayin, don't knock him if you don't truly know him :rolleyes



The Pittsburgh Steelers running back on Monday tweeted: "What kind of person celebrates death? It's amazing how people can HATE a man they have never even heard speak. We've only heard one side..."

Mendenhall didn't hold back, even making a reference to the Sept. 11 attacks.

"We'll never know what really happened. I just have a hard time believing a plane could take a skyscraper down demolition style."[/QUOTE

I hope he gets booed every time he touches the ball. It's one thing to say that we shouldn't celebrate a death, that's arguable.

But then he goes full-blown retard. Fucking moron.

Considering who died, how is it arguable?

[monosylab1k]

lol "only heard one side"

he does know osama has released a shitload of tapes and videos sharing his side, right? what a dumbass.

but tbh saying that getting paid millions of dollars to play football is "parallel to slavery" is even more retarded.

[NewcastleKEG]

Considering who died, how is it arguable?
Remember the outrage over Muslims that danced and celebrated 9/11. Were doing the same thing. . . .

[LnGrrrR]

Considering who died, how is it arguable?

One could be of the mind that any loss of life is unfortunate/regrettable. (For instance, a hardcore pacifist.) I don't share that, but I won't begrudge people their beliefs, even if I think they're dumb.

[LnGrrrR]

Remember the outrage over Muslims that danced and celebrated 9/11. Were doing the same thing. . . .

Uhm... one is celebrating the death of thousands of innocents, one is celebrating the death of a mass murderer.

This poster deserves

EXILE

[BlackSwordsMan]

Books and learning aren't a big deal in THAT community. Can't really hold him at fault

[BlackSwordsMan]

''There is not an ignorant bone in my body. I just encourage you to #think''

[NewcastleKEG]

Uhm... one is celebrating the death of thousands of innocents, one is celebrating the death of a mass murderer.

This poster deserves

EXILE
Because we didn't kill innocent people in the name of collateral damage when searching for Bin Laden?

[BlackSwordsMan]

Because we didn't kill innocent people in the name of collateral damage when searching for Bin Laden?

Difference is their family gets 50 US dollars when we accidentally drop a bomb in their living room and kill a kid. We didn't get shit from the muslims.

[NewcastleKEG]

Difference is their family gets 50 US dollars when we accidentally drop a bomb in their living room and kill a kid. We didn't get shit from the muslims.
Well some muslims prefer to hijack a plane and crash it into our building instead of taking the 50 bucks

[BlackSwordsMan]

But uh they wouldn't be getting bombed if they didn't hijack a plane tbh

[NewcastleKEG]

But uh they wouldn't be getting bombed if they didn't hijack a plane tbh
Chicken or the Egg discussion no?

Last I checked US has been meddling in Middle East politics since post World War I

[LakerHater]

Remember the outrage over Muslims that danced and celebrated 9/11. Were doing the same thing. . . .

Those Muslims were pissed about Bin Ladin & wanted the US to keep the Muslim tradition & bury 1 day after death!!!

[LnGrrrR]

Because we didn't kill innocent people in the name of collateral damage when searching for Bin Laden?

No one is celebrating collateral damage; they're celebrating the death of Bin Laden. The two aren't the same.

EXILE

[LakerHater]

Who was killed.... All I know is that piece of shit Bin Laden was using 1 of his 4 wifes as a human shield... she was only injured in the leg!!
Him... well, he got 1 above the eye & in the chest!

[NewcastleKEG]

No one is celebrating collateral damage; they're celebrating the death of Bin Laden. The two aren't the same.

EXILE
and those Muslims weren't celebrating the attacks on civilians in the towers, they were celebrating payback for the death of a family member killed by a US bomb

[BlackSwordsMan]

you muslim bro?

[NewcastleKEG]

you muslim bro?
Nope, just playing devils advocate. Trying to show people how the other side might be looking at the situation

IMO, there have been countless innocent people killed on both sides. But did Afghan's even have a choice in ''their actions''? I read an article months ago that in one of the major cities in Afghanistan the population overwhelming (Like 90%) had NO IDEA that 9/11 happened. For all they knew these white guys in matching clothing and huge weapons attacked them one day.

Americans are aware of 1980's politics and Zionist hypocrisy (to touch the surface) and yet a significant portion of the American public spewed crap like ''Let's turn the ME into glass'' or ''Let's bomb them into the stone age''.

Afghan's are not only ignorant but downright clueless. Americans have no excuses, we live in so called ''freest nation in the world" which one would assume has free and open media. There is no excuse for our ignorance.

The saddest part is those that represented the nation of Afghan in the 9/11 attacks (the hi jackers) were they even Afghani? A good portion of them were from Germany for example. IMO, we killed and humiliated innocent and completely ignorant Afghan people for the actions of a few. That's the biggest shame in all this IMO

[Blake]

and those Muslims weren't celebrating the attacks on civilians in the towers, they were celebrating payback for the death of a family member killed by a US bomb

specifically what Muslims?

link?

[BlackSwordsMan]

http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii276/kingshootr/sigpic.jpg

[NewcastleKEG]

specifically what Muslims?

link?
Okay how bout Palestinians

In their defense they most likely lost a family member by weapons that US handed to Israel

http://www.google.com/#hl=en&safe=off&sa=X&ei=I4_ATezELa7ciALh9P2DAw&ved=0CBoQvwUoAQ&q=muslims+celebrating+9/11&spell=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&fp=48743d1567ae2695

[Blake]

Okay how bout Palestinians

In their defense they most likely lost a family member by weapons that US handed to Israel

http://www.google.com/#hl=en&safe=off&sa=X&ei=I4_ATezELa7ciALh9P2DAw&ved=0CBoQvwUoAQ&q=muslims+celebrating+9/11&spell=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&fp=48743d1567ae2695

I don't know. You brought it up. What about the Palestinians?

That link was just youtubes and a few Islamic articles.

I'm asking you about the Muslims you said were celebrating payback for the death of a family member killed by a US bomb. What Muslims are you specifically talking about?

[NewcastleKEG]

I don't know. You brought it up. What about the Palestinians?

That link was just youtubes and a few Islamic articles.

I'm asking you about the Muslims you said were celebrating payback for the death of a family member killed by a US bomb. What Muslims are you specifically talking about?
Okay how bout

- the countless weapons/billions handed to Israel that they in turn use to kill thousands of Palestinians

- Or the Iraq sanctions backed by US in which estimated 1.5 million Iraqi's died



If you were a family member, was it justified to celebrate on 9/11?

[Blake]

Okay how bout

- the countless weapons/billions handed to Israel that they in turn use to kill thousands of Palestinians

- Or the Iraq sanctions backed by US in which estimated 1.5 million Iraqi's died



If you were a family member, was it justified to celebrate on 9/11?

Are you saying people used those reasons to celebrate on 9/11?

Do you have any evidence of that at all or are you just going to continue with this stupid line of speculation?

[NewcastleKEG]

Are you saying people used those reasons to celebrate on 9/11?

Do you have any evidence of that at all or are you just going to continue with this stupid line of speculation?
What do you want me to link you? There were/are countless youtube videos of people dancing or articles

Were you living in a coma after 9/11?

[Warlord23]

This idiot needs to keep his idiot mouth shut and focus on holding on to the ball

[Blake]

What do you want me to link you? There were/are countless youtube videos of people dancing or articles

Were you living in a coma after 9/11?

I know about people dancing after 9/11.

You were the one who said you were playing devil's advocate.

I'd like to know more about the ones you said were celebrating payback for the death of a family member killed by a US bomb

[Kyle Orton]

He went about it in maybe the worst way possible, but, there is something to be said for how the towers collapsed.

[Kyle Orton]

Nope, just playing devils advocate. Trying to show people how the other side might be looking at the situation

IMO, there have been countless innocent people killed on both sides. But did Afghan's even have a choice in ''their actions''? I read an article months ago that in one of the major cities in Afghanistan the population overwhelming (Like 90%) had NO IDEA that 9/11 happened. For all they knew these white guys in matching clothing and huge weapons attacked them one day.

Americans are aware of 1980's politics and Zionist hypocrisy (to touch the surface) and yet a significant portion of the American public spewed crap like ''Let's turn the ME into glass'' or ''Let's bomb them into the stone age''.

Afghan's are not only ignorant but downright clueless. Americans have no excuses, we live in so called ''freest nation in the world" which one would assume has free and open media. There is no excuse for our ignorance.

The saddest part is those that represented the nation of Afghan in the 9/11 attacks (the hi jackers) were they even Afghani? A good portion of them were from Germany for example. IMO, we killed and humiliated innocent and completely ignorant Afghan people for the actions of a few. That's the biggest shame in all this IMO

Saudi Arabia was the country most responsible for 9/11, and it's not even close. The fact the US blamed a fuckin secular dictator in Iraq more for 9/11 than they did Saudi Arabia is disgraceful.

[LnGrrrR]

and those Muslims weren't celebrating the attacks on civilians in the towers, they were celebrating payback for the death of a family member killed by a US bomb

You're an

IDIOT

[Kyle Orton]

And tbh I love terrorist sympathizer like the cuckold in this thread who blame Israel for not sharing a tiny ass country with Palestinians when the countries like Libya, Syria, Saudi Arabia and Iran that take such issue with it want nothing to do with the Palestinians and would never even consider the idea of welcoming them into their country.

[NewcastleKEG]

And tbh I love terrorist sympathizer like the cuckold in this thread who blame Israel for not sharing a tiny ass country with Palestinians when the countries like Libya, Syria, Saudi Arabia and Iran that take such issue with it want nothing to do with the Palestinians and would never even consider the idea of welcoming them into their country.
Why should the Middle East suffer even more for the failures of western powers like US & England. It was their stupid idea to put Jews there to begin with

Remember the Jews were too good for the ME so they packed up and went to Europe?

[Kyle Orton]

:lmao you fuckin moron. They were run out of Israel thousands of years ago, they didn't "pack their bags for Europe".

If Palestinians are supposedly such peaceful, nice people, why would another country "suffer" for taking them in?

[NewcastleKEG]

:lmao you fuckin moron. They were run out of Israel thousands of years ago, they didn't "pack their bags for Europe".

If Palestinians are supposedly such peaceful, nice people, why would another country "suffer" for taking them in?
Why should the Palestinians be going anywhere. WTF

When should I expect American land to be given back to Mexico?


http://www.muslimrap.net/picture/palestinethealbum/Stealing%20of%20Palestinian%20land%20by%20Israel%2 0with%20the%20help%20of%20the%20west.png

[The 4cc Dictionary]

Why should the Palestinians be going anywhere. WTF

When should I expect American land to be given back to Mexico?


http://www.muslimrap.net/picture/palestinethealbum/Stealing%20of%20Palestinian%20land%20by%20Israel%2 0with%20the%20help%20of%20the%20west.png

Mexico?? More like Southern Texas i saaaiiidd

[Kyle Orton]

If you wanna play that card, Israel was around originally before Palestine ever was.

[NewcastleKEG]

If you wanna play that card, Israel was around originally before Palestine ever was.
Who cares they left/were booted out/whatever

Let's be honest, the whites booted them outta Europe and threw them into the ME: "They are now your problem". America is now playing its role by handing weapons and billions to Israel yearly

If I was Palestinian I would try and kill every Jew I met. Same with those supplying them with weapons and the means to continue killing my people; America

[NewcastleKEG]

What Palestine does is EXACTLY what Jews did in the Warsaw Ghettos. The hypocrisy is hilarious

[Trainwreck2100]

Why should the Palestinians be going anywhere. WTF

When should I expect American land to be given back to Mexico?


http://www.muslimrap.net/picture/palestinethealbum/Stealing%20of%20Palestinian%20land%20by%20Israel%2 0with%20the%20help%20of%20the%20west.png

we won that mexico shit fair and square

[JoeTait75]

Why should the Middle East suffer even more for the failures of western powers like US & England. It was their stupid idea to put Jews there to begin with

You might want to read up on ME history rather than borrow talking points from HuffPo and Justin Raimondo.

[Kyle Orton]

:lmao JoeTait bullying niggas

[Spursfan092120]

If he wants to go the route of "What would God say?" I give you Proverbs 11:10...
"When it goes well with the righteous, the city rejoices, and when the wicked perish there are shouts of gladness."

[Homeland Security]

NewcastleKEG isn't playing devil's advocate; he's simply on the other side.

I would celebrate his death.

[crc21209]

I always had a feeling Mendenhall was a weirdo. He just looked "different" to me...:lol

[Spursfan092120]

The Steeler fanbase is loyal as hell..but I wonder what they'll say about this...will Mendenhall be booed at home, if there is a season this year?

[janetcn12]

Wow...by the messages posted by NewcastleKEG he is a sympathizer of bin Ladin and also an anti American...

[NewcastleKEG]

NewcastleKEG isn't playing devil's advocate; he's simply on the other side.

I would celebrate his death.
Whats the ''other side'' ?

And I'm sure you were one of those Americans yelling post 9/11 - ''See look at those Muslims celebrating on tv, we should kill every last one of them. Let's bomb the entire ME back to the stone age''

You don't have to admit it on here but I'm right huh. . .

[NewcastleKEG]

Wow...by the messages posted by NewcastleKEG he is a sympathizer of bin Ladin and also an anti American...
Because I'm able to comprehend WHY 9/11 happened, that makes me a sympathizer and anti-American?

How can change occur - political manipulation/payback etc, if one is unable to realize their own part in the problem?

One decade, 2 wars (which were still currently in) and millions dead and some Americans still haven't learned a damn thing. Scary and sad

[janetcn12]

Lol. You might be right but u don't know the real situation. What u do is read and read and pieced it together. SMH....

[LnGrrrR]

Because I'm able to comprehend WHY 9/11 happened, that makes me a sympathizer and anti-American?

How can change occur - political manipulation/payback etc, if one is unable to realize their own part in the problem?

One decade, 2 wars (which were still currently in) and millions dead and some Americans still haven't learned a damn thing. Scary and sad

You tried to compare people cheering the death of a mass murdering terrorist with people cheering the death of innocent Americans.

You're an idiot.

[NewcastleKEG]

You tried to compare people cheering the death of a mass murdering terrorist with people cheering the death of innocent Americans.

You're an idiot.
And your simple minded if you can't see the correlation. Both sides are cheering death

[LnGrrrR]

And your simple minded if you can't see the correlation. Both sides are cheering death

Statements like that make you look dumb.

Death of a mass murderer =/= death of thousands of innocents

Trying to say they're the same thing is being simple minded.

[rayjayjohnson]

An article on NESN (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_England_Sports_Network) criticized Mendenhall's tweets[33] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rashard_Mendenhall#cite_note-NESN-32) while another article on Sporting News (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sporting_News) noted how his comments could, "cause a public relations nightmare for what's considered to be one of the league's classiest franchises."[ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rashard_Mendenhall#cite_note-AOL-31)

classy. like the spurs.

both have rapists.

[redzero]

I wonder what Mendenhall would have preferred. Does he think that the Seals should have used bean bags, tasers or mace, even though the enemies were using live ammunition?

[fyatuk]

One could be of the mind that any loss of life is unfortunate/regrettable. (For instance, a hardcore pacifist.) I don't share that, but I won't begrudge people their beliefs, even if I think they're dumb.

I applaud the fact that bin Laden's been stopped, but at the same type I regret his death, for a variety of reasons.

I'm afraid a lot of people will see this as curing a disease when in reality it's just covering the most visible symptom. I don't see a reason to really celebrate.


Last I checked US has been meddling in Middle East politics since post World War I

And many of the problems in the middle east were pretty much caused by European's drawing arbitrary borders when the relinquished control a long time ago. Followed by decades of US picking kings and rulers, and arming one group or another. What's been done to the Middle East by all the Western Powers is a pretty black stain.

It's like we bred them to be fighters and then get upset when they do what we trained them to do.

The whole situation is sick and twisted on both sides.

[Blake]

I applaud the fact that bin Laden's been stopped, but at the same type I regret his death, for a variety of reasons.

I'm afraid a lot of people will see this as curing a disease when in reality it's just covering the most visible symptom. I don't see a reason to really celebrate.

So you would rather Bin Laden still be alive? For what purpose?


It's like we bred them to be fighters and then get upset when they do what we trained them to do.

The whole situation is sick and twisted on both sides.

We never trained anyone on how to fly commercial planes in order to make suicide runs into tall buildings.

I absolutey see a reason for people to celebrate the death of the one that actually pushed such training.

[LnGrrrR]

I applaud the fact that bin Laden's been stopped, but at the same type I regret his death, for a variety of reasons.

I'm afraid a lot of people will see this as curing a disease when in reality it's just covering the most visible symptom. I don't see a reason to really celebrate.

Definitely. His capture/death is somewhat bittersweet. It doesn't end the war, or reverse what we have done, or justify some of the actions we have taken.




And many of the problems in the middle east were pretty much caused by European's drawing arbitrary borders when the relinquished control a long time ago. Followed by decades of US picking kings and rulers, and arming one group or another. What's been done to the Middle East by all the Western Powers is a pretty black stain.

It's like we bred them to be fighters and then get upset when they do what we trained them to do.

The whole situation is sick and twisted on both sides.

I'm very skeptical of how much change we can affect in a country. Ultimately, itsup to the people to decide their way.

Let's face it, it's not like those areas were rainbows and bubblegum before the Western Powers stepped in.

[fyatuk]

So you would rather Bin Laden still be alive? For what purpose?

Actually, yes.

I'd rather he be alive and captured. It'd be a bigger insult to him personally, and more demoralizing to his followers. It'd allow the world to publically try him, which would probably bring about a greater sense of closure for those who lost loved ones. It would have prevented his "martyrdom" which will motivate his followers.

His death accomplishes nothing, but letting people puff out their chest at a feeling of vengeance (the same feeling that cause 9/11 anyway).


We never trained anyone on how to fly commercial planes in order to make suicide runs into tall buildings.

Actually, we did. Besides the fact that the pilots were trained in flying within the US, we spent a great deal teaching bin Laden guerilla tactics to use against the USSR, as well as arming him and helping him set up his own training grounds.


I absolutey see a reason for people to celebrate the death of the one that actually pushed such training.

He's not the first, and certainly won't be the last. Like I said, he was just the most visibile symptom and his death does nothing to stop the root problem.

It's like celebrating a strong cough suppressant keeping you from coughing when you have walking pneumonia....

[BlackSwordsMan]

Bump's new troll is amazing.

[fyatuk]

Definitely. His capture/death is somewhat bittersweet. It doesn't end the war, or reverse what we have done, or justify some of the actions we have taken.

Exactly.


I'm very skeptical of how much change we can affect in a country. Ultimately, itsup to the people to decide their way.

I would say when we choose the leaders of a country (as we have on at least a couple occassions), we have a great effect on that country.


Let's face it, it's not like those areas were rainbows and bubblegum before the Western Powers stepped in.

Quite true. One of the reasons the Western Powers were able to take control of the area was the large amount of tribal strife, etc, in the area. The way the Western Powers exited, then kept meddling, just didn't help matters any.

I'm not saying the problems in the ME should be laid completely at the Western Powers feet, but let's not pretend the bad blood isn't at least partially justified.

[LnGrrrR]

I would say when we choose the leaders of a country (as we have on at least a couple occassions), we have a great effect on that country.

Good catch. I agree in those instances.


I'm not saying the problems in the ME should be laid completely at the Western Powers feet, but let's not pretend the bad blood isn't at least partially justified.

Sure. Heck, even if meddling in that area was justified, I wouldn't be surprised if people were resentful. (After all, accepting help can be considered shameful, and if there's one thing they take serious over there it's pride.)

[Blake]

Actually, yes.

I'd rather he be alive and captured. It'd be a bigger insult to him personally, and more demoralizing to his followers. It'd allow the world to publically try him, which would probably bring about a greater sense of closure for those who lost loved ones. It would have prevented his "martyrdom" which will motivate his followers.

meh, pure speculation on your part. I don't see it making much of a difference to his followers at this point.

they seem motivated enough while he was alive. Doubtful much changes in that regard.


His death accomplishes nothing, but letting people puff out their chest at a feeling of vengeance (the same feeling that cause 9/11 anyway).

That's not what I see when I google "bin laden death closure"


.... the death of Osama bin Laden at the hands of U.S. special operations forces may help to start some healing, said Christian and Muslim religious leaders, relatives of victims, and a generation who grew in the shadow of 9/11.

http://articles.cnn.com/2011-05-02/world/bin.laden.catharsis_1_bin-world-trade-center-imam-feisal-abdul-rauf?_s=PM:WORLD


Actually, we did. Besides the fact that the pilots were trained in flying within the US, we spent a great deal teaching bin Laden guerilla tactics to use against the USSR, as well as arming him and helping him set up his own training grounds.

Actually, no we did not specifically train them for the specific purpose of flying a commercial jet into a building.

teaching Bin Laden how to use guerilla tactics back in the 80s against the Soviets is not the same thing.


He's not the first, and certainly won't be the last. Like I said, he was just the most visibile symptom and his death does nothing to stop the root problem.

It's like celebrating a strong cough suppressant keeping you from coughing when you have walking pneumonia....

Imo, it's more like getting stung badly by a bee, finding the bee, squashing the bee and celebrating that you finally killed the mother fucker that got you.

[Kyle Orton]

I love it when people take a tier 1 humanities class about the middle east their freshman year of college taught by an extremely bias Islamic Professor and then think they're now experts on the middle east.

[Flintstones32]

It's great that bin laden is fucking dead. I agree with that, but I also think it would have been more satisfying to just me personally to see him brought to trial and hung up like fucking Saddam for the world to see him killed.

Especially now that they decided not to release the death photos.

[Kyle Orton]

Why was seeing Sadam hung satisfying? He had never done anything to America. Suppressing Islamic extremism in Iraq and keeping it a secular country (albeit through brutal methods) was good for America. He was an evil human being who deserved to die, but the collapse of Sadam's regime strengthened Islamic terrorism and hurt America.

[fyatuk]

meh, pure speculation on your part.

Of course it's speculation. Anything that starts out "If this had happened instead" is speculation. You asked for my opinion and I gave it.


I don't see it making much of a difference to his followers at this point.
they seem motivated enough while he was alive. Doubtful much changes in that regard.

Well see what happens. I'm just saying there's more of a chance of large-scale retaliation for his death than his capture.


That's not what I see when I google "bin laden death closure"

True, I shouldn't have the said the feeling of vengeance was the "only" thing accomplished. I still believe, psychologically speaking, there would be a more widespread feeling of closure if he had been captured, tried, then executed (or put behind bars for life, whatever floats your boat).


Actually, no we did not specifically train them for the specific purpose of flying a commercial jet into a building.

teaching Bin Laden how to use guerilla tactics back in the 80s against the Soviets is not the same thing.

Wow, you want a specific training course? "How to fly planes into buildings 101?"

We taught bin Laden and others how to come up with alternate methods of attack. He (and others) used that training to come up with a plan to attack us and put it into action.

Sorry if you don't see a connection.


Imo, it's more like getting stung badly by a bee, finding the bee, squashing the bee and celebrating that you finally killed the mother fucker that got you.

And meanwhile the hive of bees is still there waiting to sting you again and again and again...

Killing the specific bee is pointless. Getting rid of the hive would be smart.

[CubanSucks]

Killing the specific bee is pointless

not when the bee that stung you has a major impact on the hive's morale and strategy

[CubanSucks]

Actually, yes.

I'd rather he be alive and captured.

Tell that to the team of Seals who's main objective was to capture. Unfortunately they were answered with a gunfight

[JoeTait75]

I love it when people take a tier 1 humanities class about the middle east their freshman year of college taught by an extremely bias Islamic Professor and then think they're now experts on the middle east.

I had a Poly-Sci class taught by a Middle Easterner when I went to school at Kent. We did a mock UN vote on recognition of Israel in the class and she stacked the vote so Israel would lose. :lol

[fyatuk]

not when the bee that stung you has a major impact on the hive's morale and strategy

Except that most people expect the rest of the hive to respond with anger and try to attack you.

Also, bin Laden did not have a very large effect on strategy. al Qaeda has been decentralized for a long time, and at most bin Laden would have approved high profile ops (and probably not even that). He didn't even have a particularly large role in the planning of 9/11.


Tell that to the team of Seals who's main objective was to capture. Unfortunately they were answered with a gunfight

Except their mission was to kill and not capture: http://www.haaretz.com/news/international/we-aimed-to-kill-not-capture-osama-bin-laden-1.359428

[LnGrrrR]

Killing the specific bee is pointless. Getting rid of the hive would be smart.

Well, if it happened to be the queen bee that stung you... :stirpot:

[LnGrrrR]

I had a Poly-Sci class taught by a Middle Easterner when I went to school at Kent. We did a mock UN vote on recognition of Israel in the class and she stacked the vote so Israel would lose. :lol

She must be a good teacher then... she was getting you used to political processes. :lmao

[fyatuk]

Well, if it happened to be the queen bee that stung you... :stirpot:

:lol

Good one!

[Kyle Orton]

I had a Poly-Sci class taught by a Middle Easterner when I went to school at Kent. We did a mock UN vote on recognition of Israel in the class and she stacked the vote so Israel would lose. :lol

Not surprising. I took the class "middle eastern humanities" my freshman year to fill the "diversity class" requirement Arizona has, and for a full week the teacher had a unit where all she basically did was show pictures of 12 year old Palestinian kids stranded and injured in the middle of a war zone. I knew the class was bullshit and I should just get my A and move on, but I find it hilarious no one ever wonders what the fuck Palestinian children are doing in the middle of war zones running up to Israelis, and why the hell someone is taking pictures of nothing but injured Palestinians in the middle of a war zone where a bomb can go off anywhere.

[leemajors]

Mendenhall might have been better off saying Bin Laden has been dead and on ice since 2003. At least Alex Jones would have his back.

[Blake]

Of course it's speculation. Anything that starts out "If this had happened instead" is speculation. You asked for my opinion and I gave it.

Except you didn't pass off your speculation as opinion until called out on it.


Well see what happens. I'm just saying there's more of a chance of large-scale retaliation for his death than his capture.

Is this more speculation/opinion or do you have something concrete that proves that's true?


Wow, you want a specific training course? "How to fly planes into buildings 101?"

We taught bin Laden and others how to come up with alternate methods of attack. He (and others) used that training to come up with a plan to attack us and put it into action.

Sorry if you don't see a connection.

You made this statement:


It's like we bred them to be fighters and then get upset when they do what we trained them to do.


You are implying that training them in guerilla warfare against the Soviets somehow backfired on us because they used that same training in September of 2001.

Sorry, I don't see the connection and you are failing to concretely provide one.


Killing the specific bee is pointless. Getting rid of the hive would be smart.

You have to find the hive first, but I feel better knowing that one of the bees is gone.

[fyatuk]

Except you didn't pass off your speculation as opinion until called out on it.

So when asked for my opinion, I'm supposed to say "This is my opinion, it's speculation?" Yeah, sorry. I've said before, anyone's opinion is speculation, and if you need someone to identify opinions as speculation, there's something not quite right with you.


Is this more speculation/opinion or do you have something concrete that proves that's true?

It's speculation (obviously since it specifies a degree of chance), but one shared by a wide array of experts, which has been discussed to death over the last decade or so as terrorist psychology and radical Muslim ideas of Martyrdom have become more typical topics of conversations.


You are implying that training them in guerilla warfare against the Soviets somehow backfired on us because they used that same training in September of 2001.

Sorry, I don't see the connection and you are failing to concretely provide one.

Actually, the statement related to the fact that we trained and ecouraged them to fight someone else, then they turned around and fought us.

You're the one who decided to make the argument specifically related to the towers.

Considering the CIA trained many of the mjuahadeen's forces, and has been blatantly partially responsible for numerous bombings and attempts against US interests (1993 WTC was carried out by a CIA trained mujahadeen, the 1989 embassy bombings were helped along by a former Army Ranger who trained the mujahadeen). The CIA helped construct what would become al Qaeda's training camps, the same ones almost definitely used to train the terrorists who conducted 9/11.

A former SAS soldier, Tom Carew, who took part in the training said "The Americans were keen to teach the Afghans the techniques of urban terrorism — car bombing and so on — so that they could strike at the Russians in major towns ... Many of them are now using their knowledge and expertise to wage war on everything they hate" back in 2000.

There's no possibility that our training had nothing to do with 9/11.


You have to find the hive first, but I feel better knowing that one of the bees is gone.

No one is saying you shouldn't be happy one of the bees is gone. I'm just saying we shouldn't celebrate like terrorism has been defeated because we killed one guy.

[Kyle Orton]

Our "training" had nothing to do with 9/11, but empowering Al Queda and setting up a government in Afghanistan that would allow Al Queda to operate freely in Afghanistan certainly had everything to do with 9/11. Al Queda wouldn't exist if it weren't for the Reagan administration.

[Flintstones32]

Why was seeing Sadam hung satisfying? He had never done anything to America. Suppressing Islamic extremism in Iraq and keeping it a secular country (albeit through brutal methods) was good for America. He was an evil human being who deserved to die, but the collapse of Sadam's regime strengthened Islamic terrorism and hurt America.

I'm not all about long term effects from the death of this person or this person. Saddam was an evil fucker and I enjoyed seeing him die. I am pretty simple minded when it comes to that.

Same with Bin laden. I would have loved to see his death pictures as well.

It is what it is and having both of them off this planet today makes me feel better, no matter the long term effects.

[JoeTait75]

I really don't see the point in the "root causes" stuff. If you're as big and powerful a country as the United States you're going to piss people off along the way. There isn't any way around it. If you want to be a country that goes through history without stepping on anyone's toes you'd better be Andorra.

To me it just comes off as self-flagellation, which gets us absolutely nowhere.

As far as Afghanistan is concerned, maybe we should blame the Soviets for a.) engineering a coup that overthrew their king in 1973 and b.) invading the country in 1978 to prop up the puppet government they installed in place of that king. Those two events started this spiral.

[Kyle Orton]

I basically agree Joe, anyone who thinks the US became the world's most powerful country without any dirty tricks and empowering the wrong people for political gain behind the scenes is delusional and stupid.

But the US didn't need to empower the Mujahiddin and set up their own government just to have a symbolic victory over the Soviets. Reagan and his cronies didn't give two shits about helping the Afghans when the Soviets invaded, his only goal was to make the Soviets look like the losers and the US look like the winners.

In the process, they empowered the most powerful terrorist organization in the world.

[Bukefal]

Yeah he maybe a moron and yeah he isnt right, but this is what I find strange and interesting in the USA is the way how teams and leagues interfere with their players. The guy said his opinion, you and his team may be having a different opinion, but still it's his own opinion, he has to do and think whatever he wants to.

Why does his team need to publish a statement about this? Its none of their bussines. Same with Tiger Woods and Roethlisberger. They did something in their private lives, they had private issues and yet Tiger needed to apologize and humiliate himsef on live television and roethlisberger needed to apologize too and his team came with all kinds of statements.

In europe it's different, if a player does something in his personal life like the tiger issues or rape or just stating his opinion, well that's his problem, not the team's problem and he is in no way obliged to apologize on TV or to his team or anyone, especially not if he isnt even charged or found guilty in the case of rape accusations.

Of course I understand image issues for the team, but still I think it's going too far, they are interfering too much. That a player needs to apologize to his own team, fine, but it should be private and between them, not the world.

Now that the player will lose his image with his own sponsors, well that too is his own problem and his own responsibility. The team has nothing to do with it.

So these players are really owned by the league or teams. In europe too but it's more personal/private. Then again, in the US they also share mug shots and criminal records with anyone. That would be unthinkable in Europe.

[Blake]

So when asked for my opinion, I'm supposed to say "This is my opinion, it's speculation?" Yeah, sorry. I've said before, anyone's opinion is speculation, and if you need someone to identify opinions as speculation, there's something not quite right with you.

I asked for your opinion on why you think it would be better if he were alive.

You passed off other information as fact, whether you realize it or not.


Actually, the statement related to the fact that we trained and ecouraged them to fight someone else, then they turned around and fought us.

You're the one who decided to make the argument specifically related to the towers.

Considering the CIA trained many of the mjuahadeen's forces, and has been blatantly partially responsible for numerous bombings and attempts against US interests (1993 WTC was carried out by a CIA trained mujahadeen, the 1989 embassy bombings were helped along by a former Army Ranger who trained the mujahadeen). The CIA helped construct what would become al Qaeda's training camps, the same ones almost definitely used to train the terrorists who conducted 9/11.

A former SAS soldier, Tom Carew, who took part in the training said "The Americans were keen to teach the Afghans the techniques of urban terrorism — car bombing and so on — so that they could strike at the Russians in major towns ... Many of them are now using their knowledge and expertise to wage war on everything they hate" back in 2000.

There's no possibility that our training had nothing to do with 9/11.

If you want to say that the US indrectly aided Al Queda somewhere down the line, that's fine.

But for you to say:


It's like we bred them to be fighters and then get upset when they do what we trained them to do.



which is basically saying that the U.S. should partly blame itself for Bin Laden's actions....

...which I find to be ridiculous as we have every right to be upset in this specific case.


No one is saying you shouldn't be happy one of the bees is gone. I'm just saying we shouldn't celebrate like terrorism has been defeated because we killed one guy.

Strawman says hey.

[Spursfan092120]

You tried to compare people cheering the death of a mass murdering terrorist with people cheering the death of innocent Americans.

You're an idiot.

[Spursfan092120]

No one is saying you shouldn't be happy one of the bees is gone. I'm just saying we shouldn't celebrate like terrorism has been defeated because we killed one guy.
We're not celebrating that terrorism has been defeated. We're celebrating because a sumbitch who killed thousands of innocent Americans has got his just deserts...None of us are ignorant enough to believe that Al Qaeda is dead...but knowing that a man who admittedly spearheaded the most devastating terrorist attack in US history is dead is why people are celebrating.

[symple19]

We're not celebrating that terrorism has been defeated. We're celebrating because a sumbitch who killed thousands of innocent Americans has got his just deserts...None of us are ignorant enough to believe that Al Qaeda is dead...but knowing that a man who admittedly spearheaded the most devastating terrorist attack in US history is dead is why people are celebrating.

lol cowboys

[Spursfan092120]

lol cowboys

See you in Week 2 :toast

[Dr. Gonzo]

I can't wait to hear Toby Keith's Bin Laden is dead tribute song.

[Spursfan092120]

I can't wait to hear Toby Keith's Bin Laden is dead tribute song.
You do know that he was against the war, right? Just because a guy supports soldiers doesn't mean he supports war. "Courtesy of the Red White and Blue" was written after we went to war, and it was supporting our soldiers. "American Soldier.." same thing. The guy is constantly going to USO shows taking no money whatsoever, so you can't say it's about money...he's turned down constant paying tour dates to do so.

[mojorizen7]

I can't wait to hear Toby Keith's Bin Laden is dead tribute song.

:lol

[Kyle Orton]

90210 getting a yeast infection when he saw a negative comment about Toby Keith was about as predictable as it gets.

[Spursfan092120]

90210 getting a yeast infection when he saw a negative comment about Toby Keith was about as predictable as it gets.

Didn't have to do with Toby Keith. Had to do with somebody making an ignorant comment about something they knew nothing about.

[symple19]

You do know that he was against the war, right? Just because a guy supports soldiers doesn't mean he supports war. "Courtesy of the Red White and Blue" was written after we went to war, and it was supporting our soldiers. "American Soldier.." same thing. The guy is constantly going to USO shows taking no money whatsoever, so you can't say it's about money...he's turned down constant paying tour dates to do so.

Okay so i havent gotten my period this month. I am never irregular. I am not on B.C and i did have sex with my boyfriend. We used a condom but we are not sure. Rght around when i was supposed to get my period i had a real bad pain on my left side by my pelvic. It felt like a lil ball was in me and it hurt when i moved. then the pain went away in 3 days but i started with brwn spotting and discharge for like 3 days then one day i had one glob of blood. Then it all stopped. n not i am 2 weeks late i took a prgnancy test from walgreens and it came out negative. Does anyone know what this can be?

[Spursfan092120]

Okay so i havent gotten my period this month. I am never irregular. I am not on B.C and i did have sex with my boyfriend. We used a condom but we are not sure. Rght around when i was supposed to get my period i had a real bad pain on my left side by my pelvic. It felt like a lil ball was in me and it hurt when i moved. then the pain went away in 3 days but i started with brwn spotting and discharge for like 3 days then one day i had one glob of blood. Then it all stopped. n not i am 2 weeks late i took a prgnancy test from walgreens and it came out negative. Does anyone know what this can be?

awww..wasn't that creative...

[symple19]

awww..wasn't that creative...

Does anyone know if the UTSA football jerseys are out and for sale yet, and if they are, where I can get ahold of them? If not, do you know where I can get one when they do come out?

[Axe Murderer]

crofl at this last page

[Kyle Orton]

lol UTSA football jerseys
lol UTSA football

[Spursfan092120]

Does anyone know if the UTSA football jerseys are out and for sale yet, and if they are, where I can get ahold of them? If not, do you know where I can get one when they do come out?


lol UTSA football jerseys
lol UTSA football

lol anyone having issues with someone trying to support local college football. Longhorns are my team..always will be..but there's nothing wrong with supporting something that will bring income to the economy in my area.

[Kyle Orton]

um yeah sounds cool...........lol UTSA

[JoeTait75]

Reagan and his cronies didn't give two shits about helping the Afghans when the Soviets invaded, his only goal was to make the Soviets look like the losers and the US look like the winners.

In the process, they empowered the most powerful terrorist organization in the world.

It was payback for them doing the exact same thing to us in Vietnam. At the time the US government probably couldn't believe its luck- five years after Vietnam the Soviets were putting themselves in the same position and giving us the same opportunity to bleed them white without shedding any blood of our own.

Obviously it backfired.

To be fair it was the Carter Administration that first funded the mujahadeen. Reagan just picked up where Carter left off.

[NewcastleKEG]

Not surprising. I took the class "middle eastern humanities" my freshman year to fill the "diversity class" requirement Arizona has, and for a full week the teacher had a unit where all she basically did was show pictures of 12 year old Palestinian kids stranded and injured in the middle of a war zone. I knew the class was bullshit and I should just get my A and move on, but I find it hilarious no one ever wonders what the fuck Palestinian children are doing in the middle of war zones running up to Israelis, and why the hell someone is taking pictures of nothing but injured Palestinians in the middle of a war zone where a bomb can go off anywhere.
Because Israelis roll tanks and bulldozers through their neighborhood

http://palestinesolidarityproject.org/multimedia/jabalia%20nov24.jpg

http://lebanon82.tripod.com/idf_files/image007.jpg

You forget about the 2006 Israeli-Lebanon conflict where there was a 35 to 1 death ratio?

[NewcastleKEG]

Consider how many innocent Afghan's we killed the past 6 years searching for Bin Laden while he was hanging out in Pakistan (our buddies)


Let's put this in perspective
9/11: Nearly 3,000 dead

Afghan war 2001-2004: up to 20,000 dead
2005: 1,700 dead
2006: 4,400 dead
2007: 7,700 dead
2008: over 2,000 dead
2009: over 2,000 dead


So because of the deaths of 3,000 people, America was behind and assisted (with coalition) the death of nearly 40,000

Do that math 3k vs 40k

UN-FKN-BELIEVABLE. That's 40,000+ new recruits against America


*Keep in mind these are deaths we have accounted for. The real number is probably around 50,000-100,000 dead

[JoeTait75]

Do that math 3k vs 40k

You'd rather it be the other way around?

Look, I'm not very keen on this war either. I felt at the beginning we should have put a multi-million dollar bounty on bin Laden's head and allowed private individuals to pursue him.

But if my country is in a war I'd sure as hell NOT want to be the one absorbing 95 percent of the casualties. I'd rather that be the other side, thank you very much.

[NewcastleKEG]

You'd rather it be the other way around?

Look, I'm not very keen on this war either. I felt at the beginning we should have put a multi-million dollar bounty on bin Laden's head and allowed private individuals to pursue him.

But if my country is in a war I'd sure as hell NOT want to be the one absorbing 95 percent of the casualties. I'd rather that be the other side, thank you very much.
The fact Bin Laden's been hiding in USA's buddies place for 6 years while we wasted American lives, Afghan civilians, & bottomless money has to be a very bitter pill to swallow

[janetcn12]

What a stupid discussions.

[fyatuk]

I asked for your opinion on why you think it would be better if he were alive.

You passed off other information as fact, whether you realize it or not.

Nope. Anyone who believe I was stating facts when discussing my opinions and "whatifs" doesn't understand the concept of opinions and "whatifs".


If you want to say that the US indrectly aided Al Queda somewhere down the line, that's fine.

lol. Indirectly. Bloody organization would likely not exist if it wasn't for the US.


Strawman says hey.

Now that's just funny, considering your entire debate strategy is based on argument framing and logical fallacies.

I've never seen you participate in discussion when you weren't just stretching arguments so far into specifics that they are unrecognizable.

It's fun and entertaining at times, but leaves me not taking you seriously ;)

[Dr. Gonzo]

You do know that he was against the war, right? Just because a guy supports soldiers doesn't mean he supports war. "Courtesy of the Red White and Blue" was written after we went to war, and it was supporting our soldiers. "American Soldier.." same thing. The guy is constantly going to USO shows taking no money whatsoever, so you can't say it's about money...he's turned down constant paying tour dates to do so.

If I was a soldier I'd jump into the line of fire rather than listen to some uneducated trailer park junkie sing that shit music. Fuck him and his exploitation of the troops.

[Kyle Orton]

If I was a soldier I'd jump into the line of fire rather than listen to some uneducated trailer park junkie sing that shit music. Fuck him and his exploitation of the troops.

The NFL forum can never have enough Dr. Gonzo :tu

[LnGrrrR]

Consider how many innocent Afghan's we killed the past 6 years searching for Bin Laden while he was hanging out in Pakistan (our buddies)


Let's put this in perspective
9/11: Nearly 3,000 dead

Afghan war 2001-2004: up to 20,000 dead
2005: 1,700 dead
2006: 4,400 dead
2007: 7,700 dead
2008: over 2,000 dead
2009: over 2,000 dead


So because of the deaths of 3,000 people, America was behind and assisted (with coalition) the death of nearly 40,000

Do that math 3k vs 40k

UN-FKN-BELIEVABLE. That's 40,000+ new recruits against America


*Keep in mind these are deaths we have accounted for. The real number is probably around 50,000-100,000 dead

Just a question: Where'd you get the numbers from?

And yes, I think any unintended casualty is a tragedy, and will be used further to make new terrorists.

You're still dumb for implying that cheering for 9/11 = cheering Osama is dead.

[LnGrrrR]

If I was a soldier I'd jump into the line of fire rather than listen to some uneducated trailer park junkie sing that shit music. Fuck him and his exploitation of the troops.

Where were you, when they made that ladder to Heaven?

[Dr. Gonzo]

Where were you, when they made that ladder to Heaven?

I was doing what every red blooded American should have been doing after 9/11. I was fucking a Muslim bitch from the back with her burka pulled up over her head.

[jag]

I was doing what every red blooded American should have been doing after 9/11. I was fucking a Muslim bitch from the back with her burka pulled up over her head.

:lol

[LnGrrrR]

I was doing what every red blooded American should have been doing after 9/11. I was fucking a Muslim bitch from the back with her burka pulled up over her head.

Someone must've missed that South Park episode.

[SpursNextRomanEmpire]

I basically agree Joe, anyone who thinks the US became the world's most powerful country without any dirty tricks and empowering the wrong people for political gain behind the scenes is delusional and stupid.

But the US didn't need to empower the Mujahiddin and set up their own government just to have a symbolic victory over the Soviets. Reagan and his cronies didn't give two shits about helping the Afghans when the Soviets invaded, his only goal was to make the Soviets look like the losers and the US look like the winners.

In the process, they empowered the most powerful terrorist organization in the world.

What's the most powerful terrorist organization in the world?

[CubanSucks]

Where were you, when they made that ladder to Heaven?

"Did it make you cry, or did you think it was kinda gay?"

[Blake]

Nope. Anyone who believe I was stating facts when discussing my opinions and "whatifs" doesn't understand the concept of opinions and "whatifs".

I understand how you passed off your opinion as fact, whether you realize it or not.


lol. Indirectly. Bloody organization would likely not exist if it wasn't for the US.

Clear it up. Does or doesn't the US have itself to blame for 9/11?


Now that's just funny, considering your entire debate strategy is based on argument framing and logical fallacies.

I've never seen you participate in discussion when you weren't just stretching arguments so far into specifics that they are unrecognizable.

It's fun and entertaining at times, but leaves me not taking you seriously ;)

What you think about my posts from previous threads is irrelevant to the strawman you propped up in this thread.

However, seeing someone get butthurt and make up something about my debate strategy instead of acknowledging the obvious fallacy they propped up in this thread is more entertaining, imo. ;) ;)

[Spursfan092120]

If I was a soldier I'd jump into the line of fire rather than listen to some uneducated trailer park junkie sing that shit music. Fuck him and his exploitation of the troops.
OK..that's fine..I don't give a shit what you think of his music..I think he's ok..not a big fan of his newer stuff at all..but that doesn't change his feelings about the war.

[BlackSwordsMan]

woops
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/05/05/rashard-mendenhall-loses-endorsement-deal-with-champion/related

[BlackSwordsMan]

''The athletic apparel company Champion has decided it no longer wants to be associated with Rashard Mendenhall, days after Mendenhall wrote on Twitter that he didn’t believe hijacked planes caused the collapse of the World Trade Center, and that people shouldn’t celebrate the death of Osama bin Laden.''

[CubanSucks]

woops
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/05/05/rashard-mendenhall-loses-endorsement-deal-with-champion/related

:lmao:rollin:lmao

[Spursfan092120]

woops
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/05/05/rashard-mendenhall-loses-endorsement-deal-with-champion/related
Can't say I didn't see that one coming.

[fyatuk]

Clear it up. Does or doesn't the US have itself to blame for 9/11?

I've never talked about blame. I said we enabled them to do it via training, funding, and outfitting al Qaeda's predecessor, then pissing them off.


What you think about my posts from previous threads is irrelevant to the strawman you propped up in this thread.

However, seeing someone get butthurt and make up something about my debate strategy instead of acknowledging the obvious fallacy they propped up in this thread is more entertaining, imo. ;) ;)

Actually, I have no problem admitting I toss in the occassional strawman and other logical fallacies. Never denied it was a fallacy, just that it was funny you pointing it out :p

We've had that discussion before, and we've well established I don't give a crap about the outcome of a discussion as long as it's fun for me :p

And I made up nothing about your debate strategy. I have never seen you offer one shred of information to a discussion. You're all about picking a target and trying to tear it down. I do that myself sometimes (tweaking people is fun).

[Dr. Gonzo]

OK..that's fine..I don't give a shit what you think of his music..I think he's ok..not a big fan of his newer stuff at all..but that doesn't change his feelings about the war.

That doesn't change his bank account either on all the money he got from exploiting 9/11.

[Blake]

I've never talked about blame. I said we enabled them to do it via training, funding, and outfitting al Qaeda's predecessor, then pissing them off.

That's not what I asked.


Does or doesn't the US have itself to blame for 9/11?



Actually, I have no problem admitting I toss in the occassional strawman and other logical fallacies. Never denied it was a fallacy, just that it was funny you pointing it out :p

We've had that discussion before, and we've well established I don't give a crap about the outcome of a discussion as long as it's fun for me :p

I guess I had forgotten that you don't take your own posts seriously.

duly noted for future reference.



And I made up nothing about your debate strategy. I have never seen you offer one shred of information to a discussion. You're all about picking a target and trying to tear it down. I do that myself sometimes (tweaking people is fun).

My entire debate strategy is not based on argument framing and logical fallacies. You absolutely made that up.

But it won't surprise me in the future when/if it happen again, now that I know you don't take your posts seriously.

[fyatuk]

That's not what I asked.

Yes, but your question had nothing to do with our previous discussion, and I refused to allow the redirection.


My entire debate strategy is not based on argument framing and logical fallacies. You absolutely made that up.

But it won't surprise me in the future when/if it happen again, now that I know you don't take your posts seriously.

Like I said, I've never seen you add anything to a discussion, only try to tear down viewpoints through technicalities and symantics.

Maybe I just haven't seen your posts where you actually supported an opinion :toast

[Blake]

Yes, but your question had nothing to do with our previous discussion, and I refused to allow the redirection.

"Yes", as in "yes, the U.S. should blame itself for 9/11"?


Like I said, I've never seen you add anything to a discussion, only try to tear down viewpoints through technicalities and symantics.

Maybe I just haven't seen your posts where you actually supported an opinion :toast

I'm not/wasn't trying to "tear down" your viewpoint.

I don't have a hardline stance on any of my opinions and am flexible to change it if a differing opinion makes sense.
If you/someone has a differing opinion, I usually just want clarification on how you came to that opinion, especially if you throw out numerical info without immediately backing it up.

If you get butthurt about me calling you out and call that entertainment, I'd agree with your opinion. :tu

[fyatuk]

"Yes", as in "yes, the U.S. should blame itself for 9/11"?

Again, I've never spoken towards blame. But if you are curious, you first have to understand I define a difference between blame and responsibility. Blame can only be achieved through conscious decisions towards and action, but responsibility includes anything that contributes to the event in question.

So to answer your question:

No, the US should not blame itself for 9/11. The blames lies only on those who planned and executed the attack.

However, the US should recognize that it bears some responsibility (including training, funding, and assisting in the founding of what would later become al Qaeda, pursing a foriegn policy that upset those who would become members of al Qaeda, and ignoring identified threats directly related to the events of 9/11 over the course of several years by 2 different Presidents).


"I'm not/wasn't trying to "tear down" your viewpoint.

I don't have a hardline stance on any of my opinions and am flexible to change it if a differing opinion makes sense.
If you/someone has a differing opinion, I usually just want clarification on how you came to that opinion, especially if you throw out numerical info without immediately backing it up.

What a crock. You say you want clarification on people's opinions, but you belittle interpretation of facts through personal biases, which is the basis of everyone's opinions.

You set the burden of proof as something so exacting as to be unreachable (such as earlier wanting a specific example of the US teaching the mujahadeen/al Qaeda specifically to fly planes into buildings).

You latch on to symantical issues to undermine opinions (such as declaring that I presented obvious speculation as fact. Speculation cannot be fact, so that's a rather asinine argument).

It's amusing, IMO.


"If you get butthurt about me calling you out and call that entertainment, I'd agree with your opinion. :tu

lol. Butthurt. Hard to be butthurt when you find something entertaining.

[Blake]

So to answer your question:

No, the US should not blame itself for 9/11. The blames lies only on those who planned and executed the attack.


so then we have a right to be upset at what happened then, correct?


What a crock. You say you want clarification on people's opinions, but you belittle interpretation of facts through personal biases, which is the basis of everyone's opinions.

I'm not belittling anyone's interpretation of facts.

I was asking if your statements were fact or opinion.


You set the burden of proof as something so exacting as to be unreachable (such as earlier wanting a specific example of the US teaching the mujahadeen/al Qaeda specifically to fly planes into buildings).

You latch on to symantical issues to undermine opinions (such as declaring that I presented obvious speculation as fact. Speculation cannot be fact, so that's a rather asinine argument).

It's amusing, IMO.

No I didn't.

Again, I wanted clarification on what you stated in regards to this statement:


It's like we bred them to be fighters and then get upset when they do what we trained them to do.

The whole situation is sick and twisted on both sides.

I got the idea that you are saying that we have little to no reason to be upset.

I also wanted to know why the situation was twisted on our side.

But you have since backpedaled saying "no, the U.S. should not blame itself" so it looks like my opinion won't be changing.


lol. Butthurt. Hard to be butthurt when you find something entertaining.

What you are posting looks butthurt to me, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt.

If you find getting caught in a contradiction and being forced to backpedal entertaining, I'd agree again. lol. lol.

[fyatuk]

so then we have a right to be upset at what happened then, correct?

Never said we didn't.


I'm not belittling anyone's interpretation of facts.

I was asking if your statements were fact or opinion.


You responded like this to my opinion:


meh, pure speculation on your part.

Aka, dismissing it. If you were truly interested in another's opinion, you would have asked why I believed that. Instead, you dismiss it as speculation, when you asked for it.

There was no question of fact or opinion at that point. It was a later post that you decided to complain I had passed speculation off as fact.



No I didn't.

Again, I wanted clarification on what you stated in regards to this statement:

I gave you clarification on the comparison to us breeding them to be fighters, providing widely accepted historical references to our assistance of the mujahadeen.

You responded:

Actually, no we did not specifically train them for the specific purpose of flying a commercial jet into a building

PS, you're way of asking for "clarification" was:

We never trained anyone on how to fly commercial planes in order to make suicide runs into tall buildings.

I absolutey see a reason for people to celebrate the death of the one that actually pushed such training.

That's not exactly showing a desire for clarification. It does show a desire to undermine the statement without bothering to refute it.


I got the idea that you are saying that we have little to no reason to be upset.

I also wanted to know why the situation was twisted on our side.

Then you understood wrong. It was a commentary of the cyclical nature of hatred common with terrorists and their targets.

And you never once asked why I declared the situation twisted on either side.


But you have since backpedaled saying "no, the U.S. should not blame itself" so it looks like my opinion won't be changing.

And that is why I initially declined to answer your question about blame. I never once mentioned blame before this, and you're acting like I changed my statement.

Meanwhile, I'm still waiting to see where you genuinely asked for clarification on anything.

[Blake]

Meanwhile, I'm still waiting to see where you genuinely asked for clarification on anything.


Clear it up. Does or doesn't the US have itself to blame for 9/11?


You can't even keep up with your own posts.

No surprise you can't keep up with mine.

Entertaining though. :tu

[fyatuk]

You can't even keep up with your own posts.

No surprise you can't keep up with mine.

Entertaining though. :tu

Good job pointing out a nosequitor question that had nothing to do with anything I said before it. :tu

You really are funny. :lol

[Blake]

Good job pointing out a nosequitor question that had nothing to do with anything I said before it. :tu

You really are funny. :lol

It was a good job of me pointing out to you where I genuinely asked for clarification on something (anything).

You really are an idiot. :lol :lol

[fyatuk]

It was a good job of me pointing out to you where I genuinely asked for clarification on something (anything).

You really are an idiot. :lol :lol

Guess you missed my point in that last post.

You weren't asking for clarification. You were asking for new information.

Plus, it wasn't an honest attempt. You were trying to use it as a trap question.

But I don't really care about it.

I've already shown you either have no idea how to ask for clarification, or you're exactly what I said earlier. :toast

[Blake]

Guess you missed my point in that last post.

You weren't asking for clarification. You were asking for new information.

Plus, it wasn't an honest attempt. You were trying to use it as a trap question.

But I don't really care about it.

I've already shown you either have no idea how to ask for clarification, or you're exactly what I said earlier. :toast

You said:


It's like we bred them to be fighters and then get upset when they do what we trained them to do.

The whole situation is sick and twisted on both sides.

which implies the U.S. should take some blame for training them.

This apparently confused you when I called you out on it so I then asked for clarification here:




Clear it up. Does or doesn't the US have itself to blame for 9/11?

I've clearly shown that you either don't know what asking for clarification means or you are simply trying to spin your way out by trying to take a shot at me.

Either way, you're an idiot. :tu

[Bill_Brasky]

Hopefully Mendenhall gets stuck to the bench and my boy Baron Batch gets his touches.

[Spursfan092120]

That doesn't change his bank account either on all the money he got from exploiting 9/11.
Obviously it also doesn't change you opening your mouth when, just like before, you have no idea of the situation. He didn't even want to release "Courtesy of the Red White and Blue." He wrote it because he felt that would be what his father would think of the subject, and he was only going to sing it at the USO shows. The Marine Corps commandant told him he needed to release it...that it would be his way of serving his country.

http://www.songfacts.com/detail.php?id=5041

And American Soldier had nothing to do with 9/11 per se...it had to do with the soldier's life in itself.

[Dr. Gonzo]

Obviously it also doesn't change you opening your mouth when, just like before, you have no idea of the situation. He didn't even want to release "Courtesy of the Red White and Blue." He wrote it because he felt that would be what his father would think of the subject, and he was only going to sing it at the USO shows. The Marine Corps commandant told him he needed to release it...that it would be his way of serving his country.

http://www.songfacts.com/detail.php?id=5041

And American Soldier had nothing to do with 9/11 per se...it had to do with the soldier's life in itself.

So a song about a soldier fighting in a war that was directly caused by 9/11 during a time where support for the troops is at an all time high because of the patriotism 9/11 created isn't exploited said event? Got it.

[Spursfan092120]

So a song about a soldier fighting in a war that was directly caused by 9/11 during a time where support for the troops is at an all time high because of the patriotism 9/11 created isn't exploited said event? Got it.

American Soldier was written in 2003...right about the time when Americans were getting pissed off that we were over there...to the point where people started shunning the soldiers. That was the whole point of the song...to remind people that they're just trying to do their job. Once again..not knowing what you're talking about and still opening your mouth. You really make a habit out of that, don't you? While I'm not a huge fan of his new music, his patriotism can't be challenged.

[Kyle Orton]

:lmao calling someone who whore's tragedy and war in America to make money a "Patriot"

[Spursfan092120]

:lmao calling someone who whore's tragedy and war in America to make money a "Patriot"

:lmao a poser making fun of anybody........period.

[Blake]

While I'm not a huge fan of his new music, his patriotism can't be challenged.

lol patriotism

[Dr. Gonzo]

Patriotism!!!!!!!!!!

[Dr. Gonzo]

If he was such a patriot wouldn't he have signed up to go fight? Wait, he just exploited a tragic event for his own benefit. I guess that's what a real patriot would do.

[Blake]

when Toby says "we'll put a boot in your ass, it's the American way" he means "we" like gnsf that says "we can still beat Memphis in 7"

[Kyle Orton]

^:lmao

[Spursfan092120]

If he was such a patriot wouldn't he have signed up to go fight? Wait, he just exploited a tragic event for his own benefit. I guess that's what a real patriot would do.

Man..when you think you're on a roll you really don't fucking pay attention, do you? I said he was AGAINST the war...if he didn't want the war in the first place, why would he fight in it?

[Kyle Orton]

Because he's a Patriot. Pat Tillman was against the war, and he gave up an NFL career to fight in it. You know why? Cause he's a fuckin patriot.

[symple19]

iY-IFU9LFkY

[Dr. Gonzo]

Man..when you think you're on a roll you really don't fucking pay attention, do you? I said he was AGAINST the war...if he didn't want the war in the first place, why would he fight in it?

So by that rationale, every soldier fighting is for the war?

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

Shock'n Y'all is the most patriotic album name ever.

How dare you say that he exploited the war.

[Kyle Orton]

DLF#54,927, bringing the motherfuckin goods to the NFL forum at the most unexpected times, per usual, par the course, tbh, imo, fwiw.

[symple19]

freedom isn't free

it costs a heavy fuckin' fee

[Dr. Gonzo]

http://img219.imageshack.us/img219/4136/tobykeithpatriot.jpg

[Spursfan092120]

So by that rationale, every soldier fighting is for the war?

No..never said that..I said why would someone who is against the war sign up just to fight in it. Wouldn't make sense.

[Kyle Orton]

No..never said that..I said why would someone who is against the war sign up just to fight in it. Wouldn't make sense.

Because he's a Patriot, and a fuckin Patriot like Toby Keith should be proud to serve his country in every which way possible!

Pat Tillman's patriotism >>>>> Toby Keith's

[Spursfan092120]

Because he's a Patriot, and a fuckin Patriot like Toby Keith should be proud to serve his country in every which way possible!

Pat Tillman's patriotism >>>>> Toby Keith's

lol..what a tool..comparing patriotism...no shit Pat Tillman's is more than Toby's...lol...god you guys are such douchebags...thanks for a good laugh.

[Kyle Orton]

America, fuck yeah!