India or Pakistan?

[RandomGuy]

Which makes the better ally?

They hate each other, and we unfortunately need Pakistan vis a vis Afghanistan, but what happens if they go over the deep end and lapse into theocracy?

We do have a choice, and perhaps we should point this out to the Pakistani people who seem to hate us so much.

[RandomGuy]

Dang. They seem to have messed up the poll options.

I was told by the messages that the maximum number of poll options was "1".

Any clue as to why?

[Viva Las Espuelas]

I'd imagine India. I'm sure a shitstorm is going to happen in Pakistan over OBL.

[DarrinS]

India -- it's not even close RG.


That being said, we must have had some kind of cooperation from Pakistan for this kill mission. I find it hard to believe that we flew choppers into the area of their version of West Point, shot up a place for 45 minutes and NO ONE opened fire on us.

[TeyshaBlue]

Dang. They seem to have messed up the poll options.

I was told by the messages that the maximum number of poll options was "1".

Any clue as to why?

Apparently Kori outsourced the database mgmt to India. Wanna bet the default option is "India"?:lol

[DarrinS]

I'd imagine India. I'm sure a shitstorm is going to happen in Pakistan over OBL.


What happens when a shit storm hits a giant pile of shit?

[LnGrrrR]

Dang. They seem to have messed up the poll options.

I was told by the messages that the maximum number of poll options was "1".

Any clue as to why?

I think the poll option busted; the same happened to me a week ago.

And I would have to say India, with admittedly little knowledge of the pros and cons of both.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

What happens when a shit storm hits a giant pile of shit?

Everyone will get shit on. Which will happen. Last I heard he's been at this mansion since '05. Bush's and Obama's watch.

[EVAY]

Apparently Kori outsourced the database mgmt to India. Wanna bet the default option is "India"?:lol

:lol

Outstanding!!

[Stringer_Bell]

India, for sure. Our best bet is to push the military to take over in Pakistan, don't give those religious freaks a chance to interfere.

[hater]

both are necessary. Making a choice of one over the other would be fucking retarded.

[LnGrrrR]

That being said, we must have had some kind of cooperation from Pakistan for this kill mission. I find it hard to believe that we flew choppers into the area of their version of West Point, shot up a place for 45 minutes and NO ONE opened fire on us.

From what we've been told, no one knew but us. It's not TOO far-fetched; if we are allowed helicopters into the base there, I doubt we'd be contacting them every time we landed/took off from there. So they could've got everything ready, then did the mission quick and flew back.

I've read somewhere that Pakistani flyers were scrambling to intercept near the end of the mission, lending credence to the "We didn't tell them" story.

The only cooperation/coordination I know of with Pakistan relating to Osama was the intel data on the courier.

[EVAY]

Which makes the better ally?

They hate each other, and we unfortunately need Pakistan vis a vis Afghanistan, but what happens if they go over the deep end and lapse into theocracy?

We do have a choice, and perhaps we should point this out to the Pakistani people who seem to hate us so much.

Economically we need India. Militarily, we need Pakistan.

But, Pakistan has been such a basketcase for so long (like since it began) that there is little hope for it getting better any time soon..

The question that you pose is one that, IMHO, froze the Bush administration in its desire to simultaneously curry favor with the Musharref government in Pakistan and fight islamic fundamentalism. The military in Pakistan has always had close ties to Muslim extremists, and the nominal government has never really been free of the overarching influence of the military.

Remember that Pakistan was formed out of the breakup of India, and the breakup of India was in part due to the cultural and religious tensions between Islam and Hinduism.

[EVAY]

I think that we learned the hard way that Pakistan was no reliable ally regarding Bin Laden, and that in fact the only reason this succeeded was that we didn't tell them a damn thing.

[TDMVPDPOY]

lol you guys actually think china will allow you clowns to take over pakistan a muppet govt under the eyes of chinas authority? you do know whose selling arms and shit to the pakis right?

pakistan is just like an extended big wall against india...

imo both india and pakistan have their own internal affairs and shit to worry about

[clambake]

lol you guys actually think china will allow you clowns to take over pakistan a muppet govt under the eyes of chinas authority? you do know whose selling arms and shit to the pakis right?

pakistan is just like an extended big wall against india...

imo both india and pakistan have their own internal affairs and shit to worry about

pakistan scrambled to f-16 jets they got from china?

[boutons_deux]

"some say" Pakistan is a military dictatorship dressed up like a country, not that that has ever stopped US from friending some really nasty countries and people (like Saddam and OBL).

[MannyIsGod]

WTF do we need Pakistan for now? They need US. They're under more danger from the Taliban than we are. Pakistan can go fuck itself, for all I care.

[ChumpDumper]

If ever there is a real war between the two, just stand back and help India rebuild after Pakistan is blown off the map.

[MannyIsGod]

The obvious answer to this question is India. We don't need to nor should we be Pakistan's ally. We just need to make sure we know were those nukes are so when they collapse we can go in and get them out.

[MannyIsGod]

http://politicalwire.com/images/5-4-11.jpg

[ElNono]

I don't have a problem with Pakistan IF they clean up their act... the problem is that it's a huge fucking IF at this point... India would be the obvious choice at the moment...

[TDMVPDPOY]

theres a few surrounding fkn puny countrries in that region govt run by stupid military wankers

[RandomGuy]

lol you guys actually think china will allow you clowns to take over pakistan a muppet govt under the eyes of chinas authority? you do know whose selling arms and shit to the pakis right?

pakistan is just like an extended big wall against india...

imo both india and pakistan have their own internal affairs and shit to worry about

You do know that Pakistan is not geographically between India and China, right?

I assume that you are speaking metaphorically about a buffer.

The problem with that is that Pakistan's economy, to put it bluntly, sucks ass, especially compared to India.

India has more people, is growing faster, and is starting from a large base. It doens't take an economic whiz to figure out who will be important, and who will be increasingly marginalized.

Sure the Paks have nukes, but that only makes up for so much in the long run. Nukes are one of those things that sounds good on paper, but no one will ever really use due to the huge costs of doing so.

China may play them off against each other, but doing so simply means that India's ties to the US get stronger.

Not exactly the kind of thing that is really something most Chinese leaders would be happy with.

[TeyshaBlue]

Exactly. Pakistan has an army, nukes and an economy that couldn't export a ham sandwich.

[RandomGuy]

WTF do we need Pakistan for now? They need US. They're under more danger from the Taliban than we are. Pakistan can go fuck itself, for all I care.

I do not entirely disagree.

If the Pakistani people want to really be all that anti-American, we might as well give them a good reason to be.

[RandomGuy]

Exactly. Pakistan has an army, nukes and an economy that couldn't export a ham sandwich.

"ham" :lol

Try "lamb". :D

[TeyshaBlue]

"ham" :lol

Try "lamb". :D

:lol:lol

[RandomGuy]

Economically we need India. Militarily, we need Pakistan.

But, Pakistan has been such a basketcase for so long (like since it began) that there is little hope for it getting better any time soon..

The question that you pose is one that, IMHO, froze the Bush administration in its desire to simultaneously curry favor with the Musharref government in Pakistan and fight islamic fundamentalism. The military in Pakistan has always had close ties to Muslim extremists, and the nominal government has never really been free of the overarching influence of the military.

Remember that Pakistan was formed out of the breakup of India, and the breakup of India was in part due to the cultural and religious tensions between Islam and Hinduism.

Exactly.

At some point though, our military need for Pakistan will be lessened after we withdraw from Afghanistan, as it appears we are preparing to do. I will believe that when I see it.

Pakistan has increasingly become more and more militantly islamist due to the aforementioned religious schools that provide most of the education in that country.

The best way for us to fight terrorism these days is to build and fund secular schools for Pakistan, IMO. I fear if we don't do that right now, Pakistan will be lost to extremism and ignorance. This will most definitely NOT make us safer.

[MannyIsGod]

I do not entirely disagree.

If the Pakistani people want to really be all that anti-American, we might as well give them a good reason to be.

We just need to get the fuck out of that part of the world ASAP. Mission of destroying Al Queda as an operational network was accomplished in 2001 and now we've finally got Osama Bin Fuckhead so the sooner we get out - and I mean really get out not these bullshit withdrawls Obama loves to do - the better. I see no strategic value in fucking around in a bunch of mountain villages with people that are more likely to lob a grenade down our pants than pat us on the back.

[MannyIsGod]

Damn now I want lamb. Gyros for lunch!

[JoeChalupa]

India

[clambake]

Damn now I want lamb. Gyros for lunch!

you just had a burrito. go jog it off.

[JoeChalupa]

OBL was on the lamb.

[clambake]

:lol
OBL was on the lamb.

[Whisky Dog]

I prefer Squishies and "Thank you come again"

[EVAY]

Exactly.

At some point though, our military need for Pakistan will be lessened after we withdraw from Afghanistan, as it appears we are preparing to do. I will believe that when I see it.

Pakistan has increasingly become more and more militantly islamist due to the aforementioned religious schools that provide most of the education in that country.

The best way for us to fight terrorism these days is to build and fund secular schools for Pakistan, IMO. I fear if we don't do that right now, Pakistan will be lost to extremism and ignorance. This will most definitely NOT make us safer.


That's probably a good idea. (the secular schools) If Pakistan is completely lost to militant Islam, it won't be a grenade they are tossing down our backs, it will be a nuke.

The nuclear threat in the hands of extremists in Pakistan is precisely why the U.S. remains in constant negotiations with those folks. And they know why we are there...that's one of the reasons they don't bother being trustworthy with us...they know that we won't abandon them entirely because it is not in our nation's self-interest to abandon them to the Taliban or other religious extremists.

[RandomGuy]

doesn't india have the 2nd biggest GDP after america? or 3rd or something alike..indians are smart people

Depending on how exactly you measure economies:

The European Union has the #1 spot, followed by the US, followed by China, then Japan, then India.

https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/rankorder/2001rank.html

Pakistan comes in at #28.