The All Time Phil Jackson Team

[Mav-elous Man]

Sorry if this has been done already. Gonna need some help on this. Would like to do a 1st, 2nd, and 3rd team. Here we go...

1st team

Pg: who gets the start? Paxon, Armstrong, Fisher?
Sg: MJ
Sf: Pippen or do u go with Kobe at the 3
Pf: who gets the start?
C: Shaq

2nd team and 3rd team open for discussion. Opinions welcome.

[Axe Murderer]

1st team is easy

PG: Harper
SG: MJ
SF: Pippen
PF: Rodman
C: Shaq

after that idk

[hater]

chinamagic
Kobe
Morrison
Luke
Kwame

[Mav-elous Man]

1st team is easy

PG: Harper
SG: MJ
SF: Pippen
PF: Rodman
C: Shaq

after that idk

Damn I forgot about Harper. Good 1st team. Gasol, Horry, Grant... Fuck I need to see a list.:lobt2:

[Venti Quattro]

Paxson
MJ
Pippen
Rodman
Shaq

[Dex]

Just run Kobe at the point. He's going to take all the shots anyways.

[Spurtacus]

Don't forget Horace Grant & Bill Cartwright. Gotta be 1st or 2nd team.

Hey wasn't Will Perdue on the team?

[ALVAREZ6]

MJ and Shaq in their primes would sweep every team they face in the playoffs.

[Mugen]

MJ and Shaq in their primes would sweep every team they face in the playoffs.

MJ with pussy gasol and glass knees would sweep every team they face in the playoffs as well, tbh.

[ALVAREZ6]

MJ with pussy gasol and glass knees would sweep every team they face in the playoffs as well, tbh.

True.

CROFL Kobe :lol

[Mav-elous Man]

Was Kukoc a sf or pf? Where do u put him?

[hater]

^ on the bench

[Josepatches_]

1st team is easy

PG: Harper
SG: MJ
SF: Pippen
PF: Rodman
C: Shaq

after that idk

I'd change Harper for Fisher.Now he sucks but he helped his team more than Harper did in Chicago or in LA.

I don't know who to choose betwenn Rodman/Gasol. Rodman wasn't a starter a lot of games in 1998

The other 3 positions are pretty clear.

[z0sa]

MJ with pussy gasol and glass knees would sweep every team they face in the playoffs as well, tbh.

The sour, stingin' truth (for Kobefan).

[DMX7]

You can't argue with this awesome list:


Smush Parker
Adam "2x Champ" Morrison
Luke "Gay brother of Dick Jefferson" Walton
Samaki "Fashion is my thang" Walker
Bison "Shark Bait" Dele

[Spurtacus]

You can't argue with this awesome list:


Smush Parker
Adam "2x Champ" Morrison
Luke Walton
Samaki Walker
Bison "Shark Bait" Dele

:(

[Mugen]

to Kobe's credit, he did wait until the 2nd quarter this time before he quit like a bitch.

He didn't show that type of warrior mentality back in 2006 or 2008 so props for his continued maturation.

[JamStone]

Depends if you're making it like an All NBA first team honors or making a team.

If it's just about the best players Phil has coached:

G: Michael Jordan
G: Kobe Bryant
F: Scottie Pippen
F: Dennis Rodman
C: Shaquille O'Neal

If it's about making a team that makes sense:

PG: Derek Fisher
SG: Michael Jordan
SF: Scottie Pippen
PF: Pau Gasol
C: Shaquille O'Neal

Hard to pick point guard. Harper had size but he also had very little athleticism anymore with his shot knees, and wasn't a knock down shooter (at least I don't remember him as one with the Bulls). I might choose Kerr simply because of his shooting, but Fisher when he was younger had a really nice blend of shooting ability and solid defense.

As far as a 12 man roster:

Derek Fisher / Ron Harper
Michael Jordan / Kobe Bryant / Steve Kerr
Scottie Pippen / Glen Rice
Pau Gasol / Dennis Rodman / Robert Horry
Shaquille O'Neal / Luc Longley (yes over Cartright)

[Kyle Orton]

Just run Kobe at the point. He's going to take all the shots anyways.

This. The obvious first all Phil Jackon team is:

G: Kobe
G: Jordan
F: Pippen
F: Gasol
C: Shaq

[Mugen]

Depends if you're making it like an All NBA first team honors or making a team.

If it's just about the best players Phil has coached:

G: Michael Jordan
G: Kobe Bryant
F: Scottie Pippen
F: Dennis Rodman
C: Shaquille O'Neal

If it's about making a team that makes sense:

PG: Derek Fisher
SG: Michael Jordan
SF: Scottie Pippen
PF: Pau Gasol
C: Shaquille O'Neal

Hard to pick point guard. Harper had size but he also had very little athleticism anymore with his shot knees, and wasn't a knock down shooter (at least I don't remember him as one with the Bulls). I might choose Kerr simply because of his shooting, but Fisher when he was younger had a really nice blend of shooting ability and solid defense.

As far as a 12 man roster:

Derek Fisher / Ron Harper
Michael Jordan / Kobe Bryant / Steve Kerr
Scottie Pippen / Glen Rice
Pau Gasol / Dennis Rodman / Robert Horry
Shaquille O'Neal / Luc Longley (yes over Cartright)

Do you really need Gasol's post scoring on a team with prime MJ and Shaq?

Rodman makes more sense because he's probably the best post defender PJ's ever had with Shaq helping weak side.

I'd probably go with Paxson/Harper over Fisher.

If i had to choose, I'd go:

Kukoc
MJ
Pippen
Rodman
Shaq

MJ or Pippen could guard any opposing PG from the last 30 years and shut them down with Kukoc cross-matching with the opposing 3. That team would be a monster to match up with it's versatility/length.

Kobe would be the best 6th man in history tbh :lol, right where he belongs on that team.

[NewcastleKEG]

Nice list JamStone

But no respect for the First 3-title Bulls. Paxson over Kerr and Cart or Grant over Longley

Cartwright was a 20 point scorer his first couple years in the league and Grant dropped 15/10 & 14/10 in the title years. Luc was nice but he benefited from playing with 3 of the best defenders in league history



Sidenote: Steve Kerr was born in Lebanon and his dad murdered by terrorist

[NewcastleKEG]

This. The obvious first all Phil Jackon team is:

G: Kobe
G: Jordan
F: Pippen
F: Gasol
C: Shaq
Gasol over Rodman? Laughable

E4ZlHwMstDc

[Kyle Orton]

The people calling Rodman a good defender are confusing the late 80's Rodman with the late 90's Rodman (or the one Phil Jackson coached).

[Trainwreck2100]

Kerr needs to come off the bench tbh

[Jess]

Phil's teams have been overwhelmingly successful, and he's a huge part of it. Reading this thread, though, you realize how fortunate he's been talentwise. Jam's 12-man roster has an incredible mix of shooting/size/athleticism/ball-handling/defense. Not to mention almost all of those guys have a penchant for hitting huge shots.

[Kyle Orton]

Gasol over Rodman? Laughable

Gasol over 1996-1998 Rodman? Not really. I agree prime Rodman > prime Gasol, but not the Rodman Phil Jackson coached.

[Spurtacus]

This list would be real interesting if Phil decides to take a year off and then coaches the Knicks or Heat. Stoudemire/Melo/CP3 vs Lebron/Wade/Bosh.

[NewcastleKEG]

The people calling Rodman a good defender are confusing the late 80's Rodman with the late 90's Rodman (or the one Phil Jackson coached).
http://www.sportsmemorabilia.com/files/cache/1b8/march-4-1996-sports-illustrated-dennis-rodman2_1b80b0e97a9a5df69cda4741e7594ad9.jpg


He averaged 15.3 boards a game in his 3 seasons with the Bulls!

[NewcastleKEG]

Phil's teams have been overwhelmingly successful, and he's a huge part of it. Reading this thread, though, you realize how fortunate he's been talentwise. Jam's 12-man roster has an incredible mix of shooting/size/athleticism/ball-handling/defense. Not to mention almost all of those guys have a penchant for hitting huge shots.
Check this out

Inside the Start of the Chicago Bulls' Championship Run


http://www.chicagomag.com/Chicago-Magazine/April-2011/Inside-the-Start-of-the-Chicago-Bulls-1991-Championship/index.php?cparticle=1&siarticle=0#artanc


JERRY KRAUSE (general manager): [After we lost,] I went a little goofy that night in Detroit. I started screaming and yelling in the locker room. I screamed a lot. I said, “This will never happen again. We will not allow this to happen again. You guys should have won tonight. We can’t do this.” There are some people who said a door got messed up. We’ll leave it at that. I wasn’t proud of myself.

STACEY KING (reserve forward): I’ll never forget Michael Jordan standing up in the locker room and giving this emotional speech—basically saying what Jerry said. But it hit home because Jordan was our leader. He said, “This will be the last time this happens. We will never have this feeling again.” It was almost like a religious thing. He had a glow to him. It hit home like a freaking lightning bolt.

MICHAEL JORDAN (starting guard): I knew I had to get stronger. If I was going to go into the post, then I was going to have to play like a big guy. I still had my quickness so I knew if I got stronger, I could turn the tables. Teams such as the Pistons and Knicks had figured the only way to throw me off my game was to throw me out of the air. I’d had enough. I wanted to start dishing out the punishment instead of taking it all the time.

That's why he's THE GOAT

[Kyle Orton]

Sidenote: Steve Kerr was born in Lebanon and his dad murdered by terrorist

He also played in a college game shortly after his dad was killed and dropped 3 after 3 on ASU while literally balling his eyes out as ASU fans chanted "Where's your dad?" and "P.L.U.", good times :lol

[Kyle Orton]

http://www.sportsmemorabilia.com/files/cache/1b8/march-4-1996-sports-illustrated-dennis-rodman2_1b80b0e97a9a5df69cda4741e7594ad9.jpg


He averaged 15.3 boards a game in his 3 seasons with the Bulls!

I said defender, not rebounder.

[da_suns_fan]

Paxson
MJ
Pippen
Rodman
Shaq

Another fucking idiot.

[NewcastleKEG]

He also played in a college game shortly after his dad was killed and dropped 3 after 3 on ASU while literally balling his eyes out as ASU fans chanted "Where's your dad?" and "P.L.U.", good times :lol
Greatest shooter I ever saw, one of the best analyst and great guy

[JamStone]

Do you really need Gasol's post scoring on a team with prime MJ and Shaq?

Rodman makes more sense because he's probably the best post defender PJ's ever had with Shaq helping weak side.

I'd probably go with Paxson/Harper over Fisher.

Rodman was 6'7 and around 215 lbs., maybe 225 later in his career with the Bulls. And he wasn't an elite weakside defender anyway. He was never really a shotblocker. I'll take the 7 foot Gasol with PF skills who will be able to match up with more PFs than Rodman was capable of. Pau isn't just a post scorer. He can hit the midrange jumper off of Shaq post doubles, and is a better passer. Despite all the pussy comments about Gasol in this playoff run, I still take him over Rodman for his size and skill set.

I wouldn't argue much with Harper over Fisher. I already said PG was a tough one for me. But I wouldn't take Paxson over Fisher.




Nice list JamStone

But no respect for the First 3-title Bulls. Paxson over Kerr and Cart or Grant over Longley

Cartwright was a 20 point scorer his first couple years in the league and Grant dropped 15/10 & 14/10 in the title years. Luc was nice but he benefited from playing with 3 of the best defenders in league history


The toughest one to leave out of the 12 man roster was Kukoc, not Paxson or Cartwright or Grant. I'd take Kerr over Paxson because Kerr was a better shooter and that's all I would want from either one of them. I take Longley over Cartwright because all I would want from a back-up center playing probably 10-15 MPG at most is a bruiser/banger. With all the scoring on the roster, do they need Cartwright's 20 points? Not even a little bit.

I took Horry over Kukoc but barely. Would have no problem replacing Horry with Kukoc.

[NewcastleKEG]

I said defender, not rebounder.
Well Gasol doesn't defend and you already have enough scoring on the court with Shaq, MJ and Kobe

Rodman slowed down MVP Malone, he would shut down Gasol

[Kyle Orton]

Greatest shooter I ever saw, one of the best analyst and great guy

Yup. When the Suns made the WCF last year, you could tell he was extremely happy he was able to deliver it to the fans, he wanted to be liked in Phoenix from day 1.

[Pelicans78]

I would let the older Rodman start over prime Gasol. With Shaq in the middle, no reason to start Gasol. He would just get in the way. Let Rodman do the little things like tap rebounds to himself.

I would take B.J. Armstrong over Fisher. Probably because I think Fisher is just a worthless turd who hit a couple of lucky shots and flopped all over the court while B.J did actually make an All-Star team, starting with Pippen, DC, Kenny Anderson, and Shaq. Think Pippen was the All-Star Game MVP with those shiny red shoes.

[NewcastleKEG]

Yeah i get what your saying Stone. Most talented team vs Best team. You need Kerr and Luc to fill roles. Got room for Jud Buechler?

[Kyle Orton]

Well Gasol doesn't defend and you already have enough scoring on the court with Shaq, MJ and Kobe

Rodman slowed down MVP Malone, he would shut down Gasol

I wasn't going by what would be the best collective team, otherwise yeah Rodman would be a much better fit next to Shaq than Gasol. I was going by simply best player at each position, and Rodman averaging 15 boards compared to Pau's 10 doesn't nearly cancel out the giant gap between them offensively.

[JamStone]

I would let the older Rodman start over prime Gasol. With Shaq in the middle, no reason to start Gasol. He would just get in the way. Let Rodman do the little things like tap rebounds to himself.

I would take B.J. Armstrong over Fisher. Probably because I think Fisher is just a worthless turd who hit a couple of lucky shots and flopped all over the court while B.J did actually make an All-Star team, starting with Pippen, DC, Kenny Anderson, and Shaq. Think Pippen was the All-Star Game MVP with those shiny red shoes.

The fact that BJ Armstrong made an all star team really shows you how bad the Eastern Conference was in the mid 90s in terms of talent.

[Amaso]

Kobe
Jordan
Pippen
Malone
Shaq

damn, he's coached some good players

[Jess]

Too true. Everyone forgetting he coached the Glove and Mailman in their twilight.

[ElNono]

How would you know? There was no television in your country at that time. You didn't see shit, you got the highlights in short hand through a pigeon carrier service.

How would you know? Did the pigeon carrier service made it all the way to Pakistan?

[Mav-elous Man]

Too true. Everyone forgetting he coached the Glove and Mailman in their twilight.

And thats exactly why I don't count them.

[baseline bum]

Depends if you're making it like an All NBA first team honors or making a team.

If it's just about the best players Phil has coached:

G: Michael Jordan
G: Kobe Bryant
F: Scottie Pippen
F: Dennis Rodman
C: Shaquille O'Neal

If it's about making a team that makes sense:

PG: Derek Fisher
SG: Michael Jordan
SF: Scottie Pippen
PF: Pau Gasol
C: Shaquille O'Neal

Hard to pick point guard. Harper had size but he also had very little athleticism anymore with his shot knees, and wasn't a knock down shooter (at least I don't remember him as one with the Bulls). I might choose Kerr simply because of his shooting, but Fisher when he was younger had a really nice blend of shooting ability and solid defense.

As far as a 12 man roster:

Derek Fisher / Ron Harper
Michael Jordan / Kobe Bryant / Steve Kerr
Scottie Pippen / Glen Rice
Pau Gasol / Dennis Rodman / Robert Horry
Shaquille O'Neal / Luc Longley (yes over Cartright)

I'd much rather have Rick Fox than Rice on that team. Rice always looked lost in the triangle and played no D. Meanwhile Fox was a rabid dog chasing people off the three point line and was decent spotting up and hitting the open three.

[Axe Murderer]

holy fuck i totally forgot about Gasol :rollin

first team

PG: Harper
SG: Jordan
SF: Pippen
PF: Gasol
C: Shaq

[z0sa]

How would you know? There was no television in your country at that time. You didn't see shit, you got the highlights in short hand through a pigeon carrier service.

:lol it's hilarious how bad you are without the Lakers as your crutch

[z0sa]

holy fuck i totally forgot about Gasol :rollin

first team

PG: Harper
SG: Jordan
SF: Pippen
PF: Gasol
C: Shaq

I would still take Rodman starting tbh. Like someone said, Gasol isn't a reliable enough mid range shooter to start with Daddy down low. Plus, Gasol might get butthurt when Jordan and Shaq take all the (due) credit for every win if he starts.

[Bito Corleone]

1st team

Pg: who gets the start? Paxon, Armstrong, Fisher?
Sg: MJ
Sf: Pippen or do u go with Kobe at the 3
Pf: who gets the start?
C: Shaq

Ho do you leave Ron Harper off the short list at PG? I think he's the obvious choice.

Is PF even up for debate? Dennis Fucking Rodman

[Axe Murderer]

. Like someone said, Gasol isn't a reliable enough mid range shooter to start with Daddy down low.

Are you kidding me? Gasol has a great midrange shot.

Gasol has a 100X better offensive game than Rodman has, and while Rodman is better at defense, Gasol turns into a better defender when he has a big guy like Shaq/Bynum behind him. The gap between Gasol's advantages on offense is much greater than Rodman's on defense

[z0sa]

He has a "good" mid-range shot, but he's a low post player, not a spot-up shooter. He needs touches on the block to establish his rhythm. Just hypothetically speaking, I'd want Rodman's energy, defense, and rebounding for Shaq to start the game, then bring Pau off the bench to massacre the second unit

[JamStone]

I'd much rather have Rick Fox than Rice on that team. Rice always looked lost in the triangle and played no D. Meanwhile Fox was a rabid dog chasing people off the three point line and was decent spotting up and hitting the open three.

If I'm making a team, and I got Jordan, Pippen, and Kobe already on the wings and already have Scottie and Rodman as stud defenders, I'm going to take Rice's potentially prolific shooting over Fox's rabid defense since neither would be getting much PT anyway.

[Kyle Orton]

It all depends on what you mean by "1st team". If it's the most talented team and best possible player at each position, then it's probably Gasol over Rodman. If you're coming up with the best hypothetical team collectively, then Rodman is a much better fit as Rodman's skillset is a lot more valuable next to Shaq while Gasol's skillset is pretty redundant next to Shaq.

[Axe Murderer]

He wouldn't be a "spot up shooter", he'd be playing in the high post where he does a lot of his work anyway.

With his passing abilities I think it would be almost a perfect fit on offense

[Axe Murderer]

When discussing all time/all NBA teams, you always put the best players at each position. You don't worry about how well the team gels.

[z0sa]

He wouldn't be a "spot up shooter", he'd be playing in the high post where he does a lot of his work anyway.

I agree but all his theoretical touches on the block would be given to Shaq or MJ, basically forcing him to be nothing more than a spot up shooter in a standard offensive play. So he'd have to be a hustle player around the rim for easy looks to establish himself past hitting open J's or driving/posting off kickouts which caused match-up switches.

In said broken plays around the rim he's a better finisher than Rodman of course, but Rodman would probably track down more boards overall and he's the more tenacious man defender. Plus Rodman wouldn't demand any of Shaq's looks.


With his passing abilities I think it would be almost a perfect fit on offense

Definitely the better option for offense is Gasol, but with MJ+Shaq on your team most possessions are pretty much already written in stone, at least the first 14 seconds or so.

[z0sa]

When discussing all time/all NBA teams, you always put the best players at each position. You don't worry about how well the team gels.

If we're going with this way of "judging" then I'd go with Gasol every time. But I tend to theorize whether the skillsets are harmonious since chemistry is so important.

[Axe Murderer]

I agree but all his theoretical touches on the block would be given to Shaq or MJ, basically forcing him to be nothing more than a spot up shooter in a standard offensive play. So he'd have to be a hustle player around the rim for easy looks to establish himself past hitting open J's or driving/posting off kickouts which caused match-up switches.


Definitely the better option for offense is Gasol, but with MJ+Shaq on your team most possessions are pretty much already written in stone, at least the first 14 seconds or so.

well like i said here


When discussing all time/all NBA teams, you always put the best players at each position. You don't worry about how well the team gels.

when discussing hypothetical teams like this, you always put the best player at each position on the first team.

For example, this season, Derrick Rose will be the first team all-NBA PG since he was the best PG of the year. He'll start next to LeBron and Wade/Kobe. The NBA isn't gonna cross his name off and put Chris Paul or Steve Nash on there just because they fit that hypothetical team better

[Axe Murderer]

If we're going with this way of "judging" then I'd go with Gasol every time. But I tend to theorize whether the skillsets are harmonious since chemistry is so important.

:tu nevermind the last post then :lol

[z0sa]

:tu probably best to establish the system being used

[Mav-elous Man]

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/690996-25-greatest-players-under-phil-jackson

[Axe Murderer]

Taking chemistry into account, if I was Phil Jackson and I had to build the team that would win the most games out of all the players I've coached, this would be my 12 man.

PG: Harper/Fisher/Kerr
SG: MJ/Kobe
SF: Pippen/Fox/Odom
PF: Rodman/Gasol/Odom
C: Shaq/Bynum

Odom would be an interchangable 3/4

[Josepatches_]

Best players at each position

PG Fisher
SG MJ
SF Pippen
PF Gasol
C Shaq

[baseline bum]

If I'm making a team, and I got Jordan, Pippen, and Kobe already on the wings and already have Scottie and Rodman as stud defenders, I'm going to take Rice's potentially prolific shooting over Fox's rabid defense since neither would be getting much PT anyway.

How many plays would you be running for broken down Laker Rice? If the answer is 'not a lot', then Rice would be almost useless. He looked almost as uncomfortable as a spot-up shooter as Pippen did in his season in Houston.

[JamStone]

How many plays would you be running for broken down Laker Rice? If the answer is 'not a lot', then Rice would be almost useless. He looked almost as uncomfortable as a spot-up shooter as Pippen did in his season in Houston.

More plays than I would need Rick Fox for a defensive possession out on the wing ahead of Jordan, Pippen, Kobe, or even Rodman.

[Girasuck]

If you guys are talking about the best players Jackson has coached, then you're all idiots if you don't pick Malone as the PF. If it's how the players performed while being coached by Jackson, then that's a different story. I'd still probably take Malone over Gasol if that were the case.

[Kyle Orton]

I'd still probably take Malone over Gasol if that were the case.

:lol then you're a moron

[Ashy Larry]

Depends if you're making it like an All NBA first team honors or making a team.

If it's just about the best players Phil has coached:

G: Michael Jordan
G: Kobe Bryant
F: Scottie Pippen
F: Dennis Rodman
C: Shaquille O'Neal



this is the team right here ...... when Harper was apart of those 2nd three-peat Bulls squads, he was pretty much the facilitator with gunshot knees. You take Kobe and put him in that spot and you would be clearly better offensively and defensively, figuring this is the Kobe circa 2006-07. with Mike, Scottie and Kobe around that perimeter and Rodman and Shaquille clogging the paint and getting every board, you'd hafta play a perfect game.

And MJ would choke the shit outta Kobe if he did that roaming shit on defense or shot 25 times ........

[Girasuck]

:lol then you're a moron

Then so be it. Malone was THE leader of that 03-04 team. He kept that team together even through his injury. His individual playoff performance against the Rockets was greater than anything Gasol has done. If he wasn't screwed over by the Lakers training staff and doctors, the Lakers would've won a championship that year.

[Axe Murderer]

:lol Girasuck opens a whole nother can of worms by bringing up the 03-04 team that everyone forgot about.

If we're just talking about career numbers, than Gary Payton technically would slide up to the #1 PG spot :lol

I guess with so many technicalities there really is no right or wrong lineup cause you could make an argument for almost anybody. The only two constants everyone should agree on is MJ at shooting guard and Shaq at Center

[Isitjustme?]

Rodman was still a very good defender while he was with the Bulls. His pick and roll defense was exceptional, and he was still a good post defender. Not sure where this myth originated.

[monosylab1k]

1st team is easy

PG: Harper
SG: MJ
SF: Pippen
PF: Rodman
C: Shaq

after that idk

bump goods per par

[DMC]

The Bulls.

[cobbler]

MJ with pussy gasol and glass knees would sweep every team they face in the playoffs as well, tbh.

Then why didnt he?