Maybe I'm Too Easy

[DMC]

Maybe I don't have high enough aspirations for my team. Maybe I should be cursing at Pop and demanding his head on a platter. Perhaps I should disown the team and claim free agency to the last team standing. I don't know.

I do know that I am very happy about the Spurs season this year. I wasn't disappointed at the loss to Memphis because of the circumstances. We raced an older, less expensive car and got into the money. I didn't expect us to do this well after how we finished last year. Hell, I was even glad we got out of the 1st round last year. I don't expect my team to win every year because I know they do not have the pieces to win and don't have the buying power to get them. Sure we could wholesale anyone I care about on the team for some rogue mercenaries to shit on the Spurs image and still lose, but I prefer how we are doing it now. I like it that Timmy stuck around and will likely retire a Spur. I like it that his 21 will grace our rafters. I like it that the young guns got to play alongside him for a few years to learn what humility in the face of defeat means, and how to win without popping jerseys and acting a fool.

Maybe it's just me though. I am older and realize time keeps moving along. I like the moderate pace of the Spurs franchise, hammering the rock, not hiring contractors to come haul it away.

[wunderkindepiphany]

+1

[dbestpro]

-1

[Splits]

Only small market team to ever achieve dynasty status

A model franchise not just in the NBA, but in all of sports

Do it the right way, reject greedy selfish talent in favor of character

Steady hand, make the most of what you have, identify and develop global talent before anybody else sees it

Only 3 teams in the history of the NBA with more chips, all of them big markets. For fucks sake, even NEW YORK has only half the chips the Spurs own

I don't care if the Spurs don't make the playoffs for the next 2 decades. I am grateful for their accomplishments, and the glory they have spread over our city

Fuck off haters

[Nick Manning]

spurs=class

[Splits]

-1

minuselleventybillion go fuck yourself bandwagon fan

[Dex]

No one could've foretold that Manu would forget how to go around a Duncan screen in the last game of the season.

[silverblk mystix]

Only small market team to ever achieve dynasty status

A model franchise not just in the NBA, but in all of sports

Do it the right way, reject greedy selfish talent in favor of character

Steady hand, make the most of what you have, identify and develop global talent before anybody else sees it

Only 3 teams in the history of the NBA with more chips, all of them big markets. For fucks sake, even NEW YORK has only half the chips the Spurs own

I don't care if the Spurs don't make the playoffs for the next 2 decades. I am grateful for their accomplishments, and the glory they have spread over our city

Fuck off haters

In other words....

I am a loser and accept losing because I can't bear the thought of change...

Fuckin' moron.

[Splits]

In other words....

I am a loser and accept losing because I can't bear the thought of change...

Fuckin' moron.

2,224 posts. All which can be reduced to:



Fire Pop
Splitter is God
Bonner is Devil
Fuck the previous poster


Well done worst poster in the history of ST

[rmt]

Only small market team to ever achieve dynasty status

A model franchise not just in the NBA, but in all of sports

Do it the right way, reject greedy selfish talent in favor of character

Steady hand, make the most of what you have, identify and develop global talent before anybody else sees it

Only 3 teams in the history of the NBA with more chips, all of them big markets. For fucks sake, even NEW YORK has only half the chips the Spurs own

I don't care if the Spurs don't make the playoffs for the next 2 decades. I am grateful for their accomplishments, and the glory they have spread over our city

Fuck off haters

I teach my children to strive to do their best, to dream, to reach for the stars. This country is the land of opportunity, where if you dare to dream and work hard, the sky's the limit. Your kind of attitude - to rest on their laurels - is sooo defeatist. What's wrong with trying to improve and holding players/coach accountable?

[Splits]

I teach my children to strive to do their best, to dream, to reach for the stars. This country is the land of opportunity, where if you dare to dream and work hard, the sky's the limit. Your kind of attitude - to rest on their laurels - is sooo defeatist. What's wrong with trying to improve and holding players/coach accountable?

There is nothing wrong with holding players and coaches to account. I will root for and criticize the team every single season, regardless of their chances. But the simple fact is that there are 30 NBA teams, most of them with much greater resources at their disposal than the Spurs, and for what this franchise has accomplished compared to the rest of their counterparts, I will never forget or let those accomplishments be minimized. They are the only small-market team to ever achieve a dynasty. They are admired by all other professional sports franchises as a way to model an organization. And that is a model I hope my kids follow: to strive for excellence, yet be humble and proud of your achievements and don't forget your past.

[jjktkk]

I teach my children to strive to do their best, to dream, to reach for the stars. This country is the land of opportunity, where if you dare to dream and work hard, the sky's the limit. Your kind of attitude - to rest on their laurels - is sooo defeatist. What's wrong with trying to improve and holding players/coach accountable?

I'm curious as to how you think the Spur's were resting on their laurels? They reupped both Parker and Ginoboli, which was vital. They found a all rookie in Neal. The RJ signing is looking horrible, but at the time of his signing I thought the Spurs finally found a athletic sf who could be a solid scoring option, but the Spurs aren't the 1st team to miss on a player. Pop can definitely be criticized, but I haven't seen any evidence from Pop, RC, or the Spur's ownership, that they were resting on their laurels.

[TJastal]

I think most of us are grateful for what the spurs organization as a whole has stood for and done for over the last decade, that's why its so upsetting to see the team going in the direction it has been for the past 4 years. Pop had a nice run, but I think the stress of trying to do two jobs at the same time and wear so many hats has finally taken its toll over the years... the man is finished and the sooner people realize that (and especially Peter Holt) the quicker a replacement can be found. This was confirmed to me when somebody posted Pop's casual remark to Peter Holt before the season that he could be a "consultant" for the spurs and Holt basically blew him off and told him to forget it. So even Pop has realized his best coaching days are behind him. The longer this situation is allowed to go on, the more obvious it is going to get IMO.

[silverblackfan]

+1
I am normally in hibernation for the first month after the Spurs get eliminated, but had to comment on this thread.
I have always been a proud Spurs fan. They win and lose with class. They are small market and anti-hype. First David and now Tim have steered this ship with a very steady hand on the wheel.
Only one team can win it all, but every season for the past 12 years, we have been in the mix. I am hoping for at least one more good year from TD and Manu and really just hope there is not a season ending lock-out. After that, I will enjoy watching the younger Spurs carry on the tradition until the next star is born on the hardwood.

[K-State Spur]

Agreed with OP.

Most of the nation had effectively closed the window LAST YEAR. the fact that the team played so well for 8 months that the grizz loss served as such a disappointment is a testament to how they were able to (temporarily) rebuild on the fly.

the funny thing is, most of the posters who would accuse the team of resting on its laurels or standing pat are recommending moves that wouldn't make the team closer to a contender, but farther from one.

[hater]

Maybe I don't have high enough aspirations for my team. Maybe I should be cursing at Pop and demanding his head on a platter. Perhaps I should disown the team and claim free agency to the last team standing. I don't know.

I do know that I am very happy about the Spurs season this year. I wasn't disappointed at the loss to Memphis because of the circumstances. We raced an older, less expensive car and got into the money. I didn't expect us to do this well after how we finished last year. Hell, I was even glad we got out of the 1st round last year. I don't expect my team to win every year because I know they do not have the pieces to win and don't have the buying power to get them. Sure we could wholesale anyone I care about on the team for some rogue mercenaries to shit on the Spurs image and still lose, but I prefer how we are doing it now. I like it that Timmy stuck around and will likely retire a Spur. I like it that his 21 will grace our rafters. I like it that the young guns got to play alongside him for a few years to learn what humility in the face of defeat means, and how to win without popping jerseys and acting a fool.

Maybe it's just me though. I am older and realize time keeps moving along. I like the moderate pace of the Spurs franchise, hammering the rock, not hiring contractors to come haul it away.

- Scola
- RJ resigning
- Bonner signing
- waste of Splitter's 1st year

those things should have never happened.

[Giuseppe]

Only small market team to ever achieve dynasty status

You gotta go Back-2-Back to register a dynasty. And, daddy-O, you failed chronologically there.

I'll give ya credit though:::you closed down The Forum.

[dbestpro]

minuselleventybillion go fuck yourself bandwagon fan

This is the most important question for a fan to ask of a true great team. It is the question the Steelers and Patriot fans ask every year regardless of market size.

What have you done for me lately?

[TheManFromAcme]

Only small market team to ever achieve dynasty status

A model franchise not just in the NBA, but in all of sports

Do it the right way, reject greedy selfish talent in favor of character
Steady hand, make the most of what you have, identify and develop global talent before anybody else sees it

Only 3 teams in the history of the NBA with more chips, all of them big markets. For fucks sake, even NEW YORK has only half the chips the Spurs own

I don't care if the Spurs don't make the playoffs for the next 2 decades. I am grateful for their accomplishments, and the glory they have spread over our city

Fuck off haters

No doubt the Spurs have a classy franchise with some stand up guys in the past but dude........your so full of hate man.....:lol eaaasssssyy.....

[mexicanjunior]

- scola
- rj resigning
- bonner signing
- waste of splitter's 1st year

those things should have never happened.

+1

[cantthinkofanything]

Do it the right way, reject greedy selfish talent in favor of character

Steady hand, make the most of what you have, identify and develop global talent before anybody else sees it



you forgot one guideline,

end up with two number one picks in the NBA draft in years where there the hands down best player (and incidentally a big man) was available.

[TJastal]

you forgot one guideline,

end up with two number one picks in the NBA draft in years where there the hands down best player (and incidentally a big man) was available.

I'm sure Splitman 4evah was gonna mention that, he just forgot :lol

[Man In Black]

You gotta go Back-2-Back to register a dynasty. And, daddy-O, you failed chronologically there.

I'll give ya credit though:::you closed down The Forum.


Larry Bird -Part of the Celtics Dynasty. NEVER Went Back-to-Back. Try again OLD MAN.

[mjnxn]

Yeah, what Tony Parker did was the epitome of class. As what Gary Neal was accused of doing.

I'm tired of people pulling the "class" card. The only true player who deserved that kind of recognition was 5-0. So, unless the 12 man roster was filled with D-rob clones, I'd rather actually...i don't know, WIN CHAMPIONSHIPS, as opposed to losing with "character."

The San Antonio Spurs compete for NBA championships, not beauty pageants. Give me Kobe, Lebron, Tim Duncan, Kevin Garnett, and Andrew Bynum in the silver and black with Phil jackson coaching on the sidelines, and i don't think any of you would be pulling the character card.

[lowdown]

I, for the life of me, do not understand why everything has to be one extreme opinion or the other. I appreciate all the Spurs have accomplished under Pop but I just don't understand some of the decisions made while you have an awesome core of players under your leadership. It's precisely the reason people scratch their head concerning some of Pop's decisions while Duncan's career is winding down and Parker & Ginobli are getting older.

[Giuseppe]

Larry Bird -Part of the Celtics Dynasty. NEVER Went Back-to-Back. Try again OLD MAN.

But, Bird was white. Your guys aren't.

[TheManFromAcme]

Larry Bird -Part of the Celtics Dynasty. NEVER Went Back-to-Back. Try again OLD MAN.

huh?

Between 1980-1989

Lakers won '80,82,85,87,88 (5)

Boston won '81, '84 and '86 (3)

Lakers dominated the '80's with a back-to-back thus establishing a "dynasty"
Bird Celtics were never a dynasty in that decade. Now, you wanna talk about the 60's?...you got me there :tu

help me understand your reasoning.....

[JR3]

Only small market team to ever achieve dynasty status

A model franchise not just in the NBA, but in all of sports

Do it the right way, reject greedy selfish talent in favor of character

Steady hand, make the most of what you have, identify and develop global talent before anybody else sees it

Only 3 teams in the history of the NBA with more chips, all of them big markets. For fucks sake, even NEW YORK has only half the chips the Spurs own

I don't care if the Spurs don't make the playoffs for the next 2 decades. I am grateful for their accomplishments, and the glory they have spread over our city

Fuck off haters

I'm with you on everything but the playoff drout part... If we hold to all those principles.. there is no way we go that long not making th playoffs. Proud to be a true spurs fan.

[rmt]

I'm curious as to how you think the Spur's were resting on their laurels? They reupped both Parker and Ginoboli, which was vital. They found a all rookie in Neal. The RJ signing is looking horrible, but at the time of his signing I thought the Spurs finally found a athletic sf who could be a solid scoring option, but the Spurs aren't the 1st team to miss on a player. Pop can definitely be criticized, but I haven't seen any evidence from Pop, RC, or the Spur's ownership, that they were resting on their laurels.


Your (Splitman4evah's) kind of attitude - to rest on their laurels - is sooo defeatist.

I never said that Pop, RC or Spurs' ownership was resting on their laurels. I was referring to Splitman4evah. Below are the things that the Spurs have totally messed up on - things that were in their control.


- Scola
- RJ resigning
- Bonner signing
- waste of Splitter's 1st year

those things should have never happened.

[underdawg]

Maybe I don't have high enough aspirations for my team. Maybe I should be cursing at Pop and demanding his head on a platter. Perhaps I should disown the team and claim free agency to the last team standing. I don't know.

I do know that I am very happy about the Spurs season this year. I wasn't disappointed at the loss to Memphis because of the circumstances. We raced an older, less expensive car and got into the money. I didn't expect us to do this well after how we finished last year. Hell, I was even glad we got out of the 1st round last year. I don't expect my team to win every year because I know they do not have the pieces to win and don't have the buying power to get them. Sure we could wholesale anyone I care about on the team for some rogue mercenaries to shit on the Spurs image and still lose, but I prefer how we are doing it now. I like it that Timmy stuck around and will likely retire a Spur. I like it that his 21 will grace our rafters. I like it that the young guns got to play alongside him for a few years to learn what humility in the face of defeat means, and how to win without popping jerseys and acting a fool.

Maybe it's just me though. I am older and realize time keeps moving along. I like the moderate pace of the Spurs franchise, hammering the rock, not hiring contractors to come haul it away.

Maybe it would be easier to concede failure and remember the championships, but I don't think I can do it - my father didn't raise me to be a quitter. I hold the FO and Pop accountable as a fan because of their inability to provide the big 3 with the supporting cast necessary for another championship.

The Spurs are like an older prize fighter in his last rounds of his last fight. He's been knocked down and I'm yelling at him to get up while you're reminiscing about his good ole days and what a good guy he is. Maybe I'm the fool for thinking he can get up.

I feel for Tim as he's been cheated by the FO (especially after what he's done for the organization) - if that's being a hater, so be it.

[DMC]

Maybe it would be easier to concede failure and remember the championships, but I don't think I can do it - my father didn't raise me to be a quitter. I hold the FO and Pop accountable as a fan because of their inability to provide the big 3 with the supporting cast necessary for another championship.

Nice detour from the point I was making. Whether or not your father raised you to be a quitter, you aren't playing the game. You are sitting on your couch watching. Did your father raise you to be a fan? Your post also begs the question of whether or not I was suggesting quitting or submitting. I am doing neither. I have as much influence on the decision of the Spurs as you have from your home on the decision of the fighter to get off the canvas. If the fighter has been knocked out already, I prefer that fighter retire instead of getting killed in the ring. The Spurs aren't down for the count. The count happened a few weeks ago. Their future is up to them, not me. I just posted that I have always enjoyed the team, and especially these past few years.

I could take the demanding approach as well, but you will just be butt hurt eventually. Tim Duncan isn't going to be reincarnated, and if he was, he wouldn't come to the Spurs. Until the Spurs become a lottery team, they will never have the buying power or luck to get a Dwight Howard, Lebron, Wade, Carmelo, Amar'e, or anyone of that level. Instead we will have to accept the retiring McDyesses and Glenn Robinsons of the league. We will get people like Mo Williams, but not people like Dwight Howard. We can probably get a Darko, but not Kevin Love.

Seriously, look at the Spurs. They have always been one or two really great 1st overall picks and some really insanely fortunate pickups and old vets who push for that one ring they never got.

It's what you accept when you are a Spurs fan. You can bitch for the best in the league, it's not going to happen.

Any team who plays Bonner for 30 minutes a game isn't going to attract big talent.

Thanks for pretending I was asking you to join me though. Thanks also for pretending "quitting" is synonymous with gratitude.


The Spurs are like an older prize fighter in his last rounds of his last fight. He's been knocked down and I'm yelling at him to get up while you're reminiscing about his good ole days and what a good guy he is. Maybe I'm the fool for thinking he can get up.
I've seen this fighter for many years. I knew this fighter's father. I care about the well being of this fighter. I won't shit on him just for the thrill of supporting a winner.


I feel for Tim as he's been cheated by the FO (especially after what he's done for the organization) - if that's being a hater, so be it.He's gotten 4 rings. He's not been cheated. Had he been cheated, he's smart enough to know and had a chance to leave.

Sorry, but that river you are crying doesn't go anywhere I want to be.

[DMC]

I, for the life of me, do not understand why everything has to be one extreme opinion or the other. I appreciate all the Spurs have accomplished under Pop but I just don't understand some of the decisions made while you have an awesome core of players under your leadership. It's precisely the reason people scratch their head concerning some of Pop's decisions while Duncan's career is winding down and Parker & Ginobli are getting older.

No one understands the capabilities of Tim and Manu like Pop. If Manu doesn't get hurt before the playoffs, it's a different result. Same for Tim. Shit happens. Deal with it and move on. In my mind, the Spurs are still the struggling team who have mustered 4 rings out of the fights they've been in. They aren't the favored dynasty team that the Lakers and Bulls were.

[DMC]

This is the most important question for a fan to ask of a true great team. It is the question the Steelers and Patriot fans ask every year regardless of market size.

What have you done for me lately?
Ask whatever you like. I've been watching this team since the early 80's. They are still that team to me. I didn't first find them on the cover of Sports Illustrated after their championship.

[pancakechef]

No one understands the capabilities of Tim and Manu like Pop. If Manu doesn't get hurt before the playoffs, it's a different result. Same for Tim. Shit happens. Deal with it and move on. In my mind, the Spurs are still the struggling team who have mustered 4 rings out of the fights they've been in. They aren't the favored dynasty team that the Lakers and Bulls were.

They would have been with any other coach. Pop has never coached a team to outperform expectations. IF you were a fan from the 80s you would know that POP didnt settle for near accomplishments. Thats exactly how he took Hill's job when Dave got injured. Now he's ridden Duncan to the end of the line and he is being exposed. Pop doesnt know SQUAT. Hes does a nice job with character recruitment, but he doesnt develop ANYONE. Any coach in the league now, 100 years ago, or 100 years after could have won rings with at least 4 of our squads from 1997 on. Its telling that we didnt win more. Its also time that pop followed his own advice and get fired for not only not winning with the best on paper team in the NBA but also nose diving when it counts 4th Q and playoffs.

He's never had "it" and he never will.

[DMC]

They would have been with any other coach. Pop has never coached a team to outperform expectations.


:lmao

You expected 61 wins from this group? Show me the prediction thread.


IF you were a fan from the 80s you would know that POP didnt settle for near accomplishments. Thats exactly how he took Hill's job when Dave got injured. Now he's ridden Duncan to the end of the line and he is being exposed. Phil got exposed too it seems. Everyone gets exposed when their resources diminish. Coaches coach, they don't play.

Pop doesnt know SQUAT. Hes does a nice job with character recruitment, but he doesnt develop ANYONE. Any coach in the league now, 100 years ago, or 100 years after could have won rings with at least 4 of our squads from 1997 on. Its telling that we didnt win more. Its also time that pop followed his own advice and get fired for not only not winning with the best on paper team in the NBA but also nose diving when it counts 4th Q and playoffs.
Post hoc.

Our squads were only good because they had good coaching. The Spurs coaching team would get the Wolves to the playoffs at least.


He's never had "it" and he never will.He's got 4 rings that say otherwise. Larry Brown didn't get them, Bob Hill didn't get them, Jerry Lucas didn't get them, Tark didn't either. Whatever it takes to get rings, Pop has them.

You likely don't know what "it" is.

[jjktkk]

Maybe it would be easier to concede failure and remember the championships, but I don't think I can do it - my father didn't raise me to be a quitter. I hold the FO and Pop accountable as a fan because of their inability to provide the big 3 with the supporting cast necessary for another championship.

The Spurs are like an older prize fighter in his last rounds of his last fight. He's been knocked down and I'm yelling at him to get up while you're reminiscing about his good ole days and what a good guy he is. Maybe I'm the fool for thinking he can get up.

I feel for Tim as he's been cheated by the FO (especially after what he's done for the organization) - if that's being a hater, so be it.

You seem to think that its so easy to keep the Spurs dynasty rolling. I don't think you realize how hard it is to win a championship. The Spurs have had a great run, but all dynasties eventually end. This Spur's team has gotten old and because the Spur's ownership doesn't possess the deep pockets, nor the trade assets to acquire top level talent, they are pretty much doing the only thing possible as far as trying to contend. You rant and rave about the FO's inability to put a decent surrounding cast around Duncan, but given the Spur's dynamics, small market, ownerships limited finances, please throw out some examples, or to be specific, players, the Spurs could of acquired. They reupped Ginoboli and Parker. Although the RJ sigining is a bust, at the time it looked like a solid sigining. Its okay to hate, and to be disappointed, but try being alittle more realistic about this team.

[underdawg]

Nice detour from the point I was making. Whether or not your father raised you to be a quitter, you aren't playing the game. You are sitting on your couch watching. Did your father raise you to be a fan? Your post also begs the question of whether or not I was suggesting quitting or submitting. I am doing neither. I have as much influence on the decision of the Spurs as you have from your home on the decision of the fighter to get off the canvas. If the fighter has been knocked out already, I prefer that fighter retire instead of getting killed in the ring. The Spurs aren't down for the count. The count happened a few weeks ago. Their future is up to them, not me. I just posted that I have always enjoyed the team, and especially these past few years.

I could take the demanding approach as well, but you will just be butt hurt eventually. Tim Duncan isn't going to be reincarnated, and if he was, he wouldn't come to the Spurs. Until the Spurs become a lottery team, they will never have the buying power or luck to get a Dwight Howard, Lebron, Wade, Carmelo, Amar'e, or anyone of that level. Instead we will have to accept the retiring McDyesses and Glenn Robinsons of the league. We will get people like Mo Williams, but not people like Dwight Howard. We can probably get a Darko, but not Kevin Love.

Seriously, look at the Spurs. They have always been one or two really great 1st overall picks and some really insanely fortunate pickups and old vets who push for that one ring they never got.

It's what you accept when you are a Spurs fan. You can bitch for the best in the league, it's not going to happen.

Any team who plays Bonner for 30 minutes a game isn't going to attract big talent.

Thanks for pretending I was asking you to join me though. Thanks also for pretending "quitting" is synonymous with gratitude.
I've seen this fighter for many years. I knew this fighter's father. I care about the well being of this fighter. I won't shit on him just for the thrill of supporting a winner.
He's gotten 4 rings. He's not been cheated. Had he been cheated, he's smart enough to know and had a chance to leave.

Sorry, but that river you are crying doesn't go anywhere I want to be.

wait a second - I'm not playing and I'm not on the team? Crap, I thought I was and now I'm just upset.

Ok, mighty Spur fan from the 80's - let me explain how Duncan was cheated. Duncan was cheated after he helped the Spurs win 4 rings and took less money to help win an addtional champion ship or two, but FO failed to acquire the right pieces to help Tim get at least one more. It wasn't just because he was a nice guy - he wanted to help the organization spend the money to get the right personnel and they failed him.

And yes, when you concede the run is over you have given up and that makes you a quitter. And don't give me this realist crap because the reality is that the FO has underachieved since 2007, but some of you won't admit it.

[TJastal]

wait a second - I'm not playing and I'm not on the team? Crap, I thought I was and now I'm just upset.

Ok, mighty Spur fan from the 80's - let me explain how Duncan was cheated. Duncan was cheated after he helped the Spurs win 4 rings and took less money to help win an addtional champion ship or two, but FO failed to acquire the right pieces to help Tim get at least one more. It wasn't just because he was a nice guy - he wanted to help the organization spend the money to get the right personnel and they failed him.

And yes, when you concede the run is over you have given up and that makes you a quitter. And don't give me this realist crap because the reality is that the FO has underachieved since 2007, but some of you won't admit it.

+1

FO dropped the ball big time, there is no doubt about that.

[ohmwrecker]

+1

FO dropped the ball big time, there is no doubt about that.

Scola thread?

[underdawg]

You seem to think that its so easy to keep the Spurs dynasty rolling. I don't think you realize how hard it is to win a championship. The Spurs have had a great run, but all dynasties eventually end. This Spur's team has gotten old and because the Spur's ownership doesn't possess the deep pockets, nor the trade assets to acquire top level talent, they are pretty much doing the only thing possible as far as trying to contend. You rant and rave about the FO's inability to put a decent surrounding cast around Duncan, but given the Spur's dynamics, small market, ownerships limited finances, please throw out some examples, or to be specific, players, the Spurs could of acquired. They reupped Ginoboli and Parker. Although the RJ sigining is a bust, at the time it looked like a solid sigining. Its okay to hate, and to be disappointed, but try being alittle more realistic about this team.

Where did I claim that it was easy? If you said I was overvaluing the talent fo the big 3 for the past 4 years, you might have a better argument.

The Spurs ownership's budget had nothing to do with the Finley extension, Butler being signed and Scola not, RJ being resigned and Bonner being resigned. RJ had done nothing with the Spurs to warrant a resigning. Bonner being resigned was all about Pop trying to make a failed stategy work.

You want specifics - it's kind of hard to do so, since I'm just a fan that only sees information in the press after the fact. But I don't have to be a quarterback coach to notice that a player with a 35% completion rate has some accuracy issues. Look here are some free agents that I feel the Spurs had a shot (or long shot) at in 2010 instead of going with RJ (trade him during the reg. season) and Bonner:
-Outlaw, J. O'Neal, Warrick, D. Wright, W. Matthews, M. Barnes, R. Brewer, Frye, Scola, etc.

[ChumpDumper]

The Spurs ownership's budget had nothing to do with the Finley extension, Butler being signed and Scola not, RJ being resigned and Bonner being resigned. RJ had done nothing with the Spurs to warrant a resigning.The Scola and RJ situations probably had quite a bit to do with budgetary concerns.

[Leetonidas]

Some of you guys are fucking retarded.
'
The FO did screw up massively on Scola. They also screwed up by resigning RJ. However, since acquiring Duncan, the FO has done a decent job at putting pieces that fit around Tim that excel in specific areas. Getting Manu, Parker, Bruce, Horry, Barry, Nazr, six players who all contributed meaningfully to an NBA title. In 2008, they tried to trade for Kurt Thomas and they even got Barry back. Hell, they tried to trade for J.R. Smith a couple seasons prior to that and they took a chance and traded for RJ in 2009 who most people that would fit in decently as he wouldn't be relied on to score.

They've made some blunders, but to say they haven't been fairly successful and have failed at/trying to put pieces around Tim, is flat out stupid. It's very difficult to win an NBA title. Some of you think just because we had Tim that he should've had more titles and Pop fucked it up somehow, when in reality, Pop's system + players around Duncan + Duncan's prime skill = championships, and you need all components. There's a reason players like Kevin Garnett, Paul Pierce, and Ray Allen never won a ring until they teamed up. And while Piece and Allen are way below Duncan's level, Garnett is only a tier below mostly due to a lack of hardware.

[underdawg]

Some of you guys are fucking retarded.
'
The FO did screw up massively on Scola. They also screwed up by resigning RJ. However, since acquiring Duncan, the FO has done a decent job at putting pieces that fit around Tim that excel in specific areas. Getting Manu, Parker, Bruce, Horry, Barry, Nazr, six players who all contributed meaningfully to an NBA title. In 2008, they tried to trade for Kurt Thomas and they even got Barry back. Hell, they tried to trade for J.R. Smith a couple seasons prior to that and they took a chance and traded for RJ in 2009 who most people that would fit in decently as he wouldn't be relied on to score.

They've made some blunders, but to say they haven't been fairly successful and have failed at/trying to put pieces around Tim, is flat out stupid. It's very difficult to win an NBA title. Some of you think just because we had Tim that he should've had more titles and Pop fucked it up somehow, when in reality, Pop's system + players around Duncan + Duncan's prime skill = championships, and you need all components. There's a reason players like Kevin Garnett, Paul Pierce, and Ray Allen never won a ring until they teamed up. And while Piece and Allen are way below Duncan's level, Garnett is only a tier below mostly due to a lack of hardware.

it's not as clear cut as just saying because the Spurs had Tim Duncan they should have won another ring. The Spurs having Tim, Tony and Manu should have at least kept them in the running during '09, '10 and '11.

Also, pre-2007 the Spurs made some pretty great moves, but since 2007 there have been no more Horry, Barry, Bruce, Jackson, Elie, Nazr signings. Thomas and Gooden were decent, but not enough.

[underdawg]

The Scola and RJ situations probably had quite a bit to do with budgetary concerns.

I understand the intention, but what was the net effect on the budget?

[ChumpDumper]

I understand the intention, but what was the net effect on the budget?The net effect was not losing several million dollars.

[ohmwrecker]

I think everyone can appreciate the difficulty in operating an NBA franchise within a budget and putting a successful product on the floor year after year. The difficulty seems to be in player development. Maybe there can only be so much energy and resource and just pure luck devoted to development, but the Spurs FO probably has a few regrets as well.

[underdawg]

The net effect was not losing several million dollars.

Now I'm not following you - you're saying the latest RJ contract will save the Spurs several million dollars?

Not signing Scola saved them several millions of dollars? I understand dumping Butler was involved, but I don't believe they made lemonade out of the lemons they got themselves into there.

[ChumpDumper]

Now I'm not following you - you're saying the latest RJ contract will save the Spurs several million dollars?It already has.


Not signing Scola saved them several millions of dollars? I understand dumping Butler was involved, but I don't believe they made lemonade out of the lemons they got themselves into there.It wasn't a basketball move. It was a money move.

Both moves allowed the Spurs to avoid the luxury tax for one or more seasons, and subsequently claim their share of the luxury tax collected from teams that did pay it.

[underdawg]

It already has.

It wasn't a basketball move. It was a money move.

Both moves allowed the Spurs to avoid the luxury tax for one or more seasons, and subsequently claim their share of the luxury tax collected from teams that did pay it.

I get the Scola/Butler - luxury tax avoidance, but in terms of the money lost from the team not advancing further in the playoffs (I understand you can't pin that on a player or a couple of players), it probably didn't save them money in the long run. Would Scola have helped in '08, '09, '10 and '11 - I believe so. He signed for 9.5 mil/3 year deal in '07 a year after the Spurs signed Butler to a 7 mil/3 year deal - that's just terrrible.

While the RJ contract saved them in 2011, his overall contract will be a hard one to unload and in doing so, it's possible they lose the money that they saved. Ticket sales are also imporant to a budget and losing in the playoffs doesn't help and players that don't play well won't sell tickets either.

[ohmwrecker]

Both moves allowed the Spurs to avoid the luxury tax for one or more seasons, and subsequently claim their share of the luxury tax collected from teams that did pay it.

You're absolutely right, and that's all well and good, but I would think that, ultimately, it should be about basketball. I realize that it's a delicate balance, but the priority should be about winning, right?

I would think that championships would generate revenue . . .

[ChumpDumper]

I get the Scola/Butler - luxury tax avoidance, but in terms of the money lost from the team not advancing further in the playoffs (I understand you can't pin that on a player or a couple of players), it probably didn't save them money in the long run. Would Scola have helped in '08, '09, '10 and '11 - I believe so. He signed for 9.5 mil/3 year deal in '07 a year after the Spurs signed Butler to a 7 mil/3 year deal - that's just terrrible.So?

"Probably didn't save them money in the long run" is pure speculation. They saved money. They made money. Luxury tax savings and proceeds are real.


While the RJ contract saved them in 2011, his overall contract will be a hard one to unload and in doing so, it's possible they lose the money that they saved. Ticket sales are also imporant to a budget and losing in the playoffs doesn't help and players that don't play well won't sell tickets either."It's possible."

It's definite they did already save money.

Manu sells the tickets no matter how well he plays (or doesn't play). That's just how things go sometimes.

[Calispursfan11]

Maybe I don't have high enough aspirations for my team. Maybe I should be cursing at Pop and demanding his head on a platter. Perhaps I should disown the team and claim free agency to the last team standing. I don't know.

I do know that I am very happy about the Spurs season this year. I wasn't disappointed at the loss to Memphis because of the circumstances. We raced an older, less expensive car and got into the money. I didn't expect us to do this well after how we finished last year. Hell, I was even glad we got out of the 1st round last year. I don't expect my team to win every year because I know they do not have the pieces to win and don't have the buying power to get them. Sure we could wholesale anyone I care about on the team for some rogue mercenaries to shit on the Spurs image and still lose, but I prefer how we are doing it now. I like it that Timmy stuck around and will likely retire a Spur. I like it that his 21 will grace our rafters. I like it that the young guns got to play alongside him for a few years to learn what humility in the face of defeat means, and how to win without popping jerseys and acting a fool.

Maybe it's just me though. I am older and realize time keeps moving along. I like the moderate pace of the Spurs franchise, hammering the rock, not hiring contractors to come haul it away.

Great attitude. You are a tried and true Spurs enthusiast and it shows. I am not thrilled about their downward spiral heading into their short playoffs, but I am always a fan of the team and what they have stood for (among them professionalism and maturity) ever sinc D Rob. It hurt immensely to watch the Spurs get bounced after such a great season, but I love this team and will be a fan even as they will surely head into the depths of the lottery in the next few years.

[jjktkk]

Some of you guys are fucking retarded.
'
The FO did screw up massively on Scola. They also screwed up by resigning RJ. However, since acquiring Duncan, the FO has done a decent job at putting pieces that fit around Tim that excel in specific areas. Getting Manu, Parker, Bruce, Horry, Barry, Nazr, six players who all contributed meaningfully to an NBA title. In 2008, they tried to trade for Kurt Thomas and they even got Barry back. Hell, they tried to trade for J.R. Smith a couple seasons prior to that and they took a chance and traded for RJ in 2009 who most people that would fit in decently as he wouldn't be relied on to score.

They've made some blunders, but to say they haven't been fairly successful and have failed at/trying to put pieces around Tim, is flat out stupid. It's very difficult to win an NBA title. Some of you think just because we had Tim that he should've had more titles and Pop fucked it up somehow, when in reality, Pop's system + players around Duncan + Duncan's prime skill = championships, and you need all components. There's a reason players like Kevin Garnett, Paul Pierce, and Ray Allen never won a ring until they teamed up. And while Piece and Allen are way below Duncan's level, Garnett is only a tier below mostly due to a lack of hardware.

As far as the Scola fiasco, was that a directive by ownership that they are not gonna spend $$$$ on Scola?

[jjktkk]

+1

FO dropped the ball big time, there is no doubt about that.

Speaking of "dropping the ball" whenever they decide to post, but on to other things. Why is it that 99% percent of all NBA GMs, NBA owners, the media, and knowledgable NBA fans, consider the Spur's FO one of, if not the best in the league, but a very small minority, namely you, get up on their tiny ST soap box and go above and beyond to rant and rave about how horrible a coach and GM Pop is? Have you ever seriously tried taking off your Pop hate glasses and put down your Pop voodoo doll down for a second and look across the league at former coaches and gms who got their start under Pop. How can I take you seriously when, for most of the season, you were staying away from ST when the Spurs were rolling along with the best record in the league, but come out of hibernation to spew shit about Pop's inadequacies after their ouster in the playoffs? Why wern't you throwing out the Pop's an idiot chants in December or January?

[ALVAREZ6]

No one could've foretold that Manu would forget how to go around a Duncan screen in the last game of the season.

It wasn't just the last game, he was just lucky it too so long for it to happen. He's been going around screens like that forever, trailing his arm behind all recklessly pretending it's a tail, helping him highlight and act out the contact from the trailing defender.

It is fucking annoying and he had that shit coming to him. Unfortunately his health was one of many problems in that series and that pussy ass team was going nowhere, along with its head coach Greggory "It Wouldn't Be Fair to the Team" Popovich.

[TJastal]

Speaking of "dropping the ball" whenever they decide to post, but on to other things. Why is it that 99% percent of all NBA GMs, NBA owners, the media, and knowledgable NBA fans, consider the Spur's FO one of, if not the best in the league, but a very small minority, namely you, get up on their tiny ST soap box and go above and beyond to rant and rave about how horrible a coach and GM Pop is? Have you ever seriously tried taking off your Pop hate glasses and put down your Pop voodoo doll down for a second and look across the league at former coaches and gms who got their start under Pop. How can I take you seriously when, for most of the season, you were staying away from ST when the Spurs were rolling along with the best record in the league, but come out of hibernation to spew shit about Pop's inadequacies after their ouster in the playoffs? Why wern't you throwing out the Pop's an idiot chants in December or January?

http://img850.imageshack.us/img850/4080/youmadcuzimstylinonyout.jpg

[DMC]

I think everyone can appreciate the difficulty in operating an NBA franchise within a budget and putting a successful product on the floor year after year. The difficulty seems to be in player development. Maybe there can only be so much energy and resource and just pure luck devoted to development, but the Spurs FO probably has a few regrets as well.

I think plenty people didn't become Spurs fans before the Spurs won their first ring. That means that, for most of their time as a fan, the Spurs have been contenders. If you take the fan base that's been around for 30 years or so, they might see it a bit differently. They might realize that there are a ton of non-successful recipes and only a few successful ones because they have been part of the "try but fail" group for a long time before ever winning a ring.

[DMC]

wait a second - I'm not playing and I'm not on the team? Crap, I thought I was and now I'm just upset.

I was only addressing your statement about not being raised to be a quitter. How are fans quitters by acknowledging and appreciating what their team has done?


Ok, mighty Spur fan from the 80's - let me explain how Duncan was cheated. Duncan was cheated after he helped the Spurs win 4 rings and took less money to help win an addtional champion ship or two, but FO failed to acquire the right pieces to help Tim get at least one more. It wasn't just because he was a nice guy - he wanted to help the organization spend the money to get the right personnel and they failed him.
That's not true. The FO didn't make Manu foul Dirk in that playoff game. They didn't make Fish hit the .4 second shot. The Spurs can only build a competitive team. They cannot build a championship team. Championships are won, not made. The Spurs had a shot at a couple more rings. All they had to do was perform.


And yes, when you concede the run is over you have given up and that makes you a quitter. And don't give me this realist crap because the reality is that the FO has underachieved since 2007, but some of you won't admit it.You can wallow in your false fan bravado all you like. You are still just a fan and a fan is a fan for a reason. I gave mine in the OP.

[DMC]

http://img850.imageshack.us/img850/4080/youmadcuzimstylinonyout.jpg
I think he read you pretty well. You disappeared for the entire season and returned after they lost in the playoffs. If that's not telling enough to discount anything you say as tripe, your response to him was.

[ohmwrecker]

I think plenty people didn't become Spurs fans before the Spurs won their first ring. That means that, for most of their time as a fan, the Spurs have been contenders. If you take the fan base that's been around for 30 years or so, they might see it a bit differently. They might realize that there are a ton of non-successful recipes and only a few successful ones because they have been part of the "try but fail" group for a long time before ever winning a ring.

I'm one of those who have the perspective of being grateful for the success informed by the experience of disappointment, but I also understand the feeling of thinking that some obvious mistakes have been made that could have made the difference in some of those seasons where they fell just short.
You can never be satisfied as an extremist. You have to be able to accept the delicate balance of the moderate reality if you are going to be a fan of a fiscally conservative, small market team. The only thing keeping this team in San Antonio is that balance. Which means, you probably won't win every year, but you will do well enough to still have a team the following year.

[Caeman]

I'm one of those who have the perspective of being grateful for the success informed by the experience of disappointment, but I also understand the feeling of thinking that some obvious mistakes have been made that could have made the difference in some of those seasons where they fell just short.
You can never be satisfied as an extremist. You have to be able to accept the delicate balance of the moderate reality if you are going to be a fan of a fiscally conservative, small market team. The only thing keeping this team in San Antonio is that balance. Which means, you probably won't win every year, but you will do well enough to still have a team the following year.

What disappointment? You an NBA fan. You jump on the next horse still in the race. Don't believe me? Check out your 'Memphis Train' thread. You were the first to jump on. :rollin

I'll ask again. What disappointment? :rollin

[Caeman]

More to the point of the thread. It's time to stop "being easy" on the Spurs and FO. It's been 4 years since we've won a championship. I am not disappointed that we haven't won in 4 years. I am disappointed with how we have lost.

Pop progressively becoming more senile. Bonner getting big minutes. Defense going right out the fucking window. And the big 3 playing softer each year due to age.

It's time to stop being easy and start holding people responsible for the fucked up decisions in the recent past.

[DMC]

I'm one of those who have the perspective of being grateful for the success informed by the experience of disappointment, but I also understand the feeling of thinking that some obvious mistakes have been made that could have made the difference in some of those seasons where they fell just short.
You can never be satisfied as an extremist. You have to be able to accept the delicate balance of the moderate reality if you are going to be a fan of a fiscally conservative, small market team. The only thing keeping this team in San Antonio is that balance. Which means, you probably won't win every year, but you will do well enough to still have a team the following year.

This is what I live by. :toast

[DMC]

More to the point of the thread. It's time to stop "being easy" on the Spurs and FO. It's been 4 years since we've won a championship. I am not disappointed that we haven't won in 4 years. I am disappointed with how we have lost.

:lmao 4 years. Wow what a drought. It's been that long for everyone except LA and Boston. Much much longer for most others.


Pop progressively becoming more senile. Bonner getting big minutes. Defense going right out the fucking window. And the big 3 playing softer each year due to age.

I have not seen anything from Pop to indicate he's senile. We weren't sitting in the 2 week meeting the staff had last summer. We are left to guess after tipoff.


It's time to stop being easy and start holding people responsible for the fucked up decisions in the recent past.
Stop being a fan. That's the only way to vote, with your dollar.

[underdawg]

I was only addressing your statement about not being raised to be a quitter. How are fans quitters by acknowledging and appreciating what their team has done?
That's not true. The FO didn't make Manu foul Dirk in that playoff game. They didn't make Fish hit the .4 second shot. The Spurs can only build a competitive team. They cannot build a championship team. Championships are won, not made. The Spurs had a shot at a couple more rings. All they had to do was perform.
You can wallow in your false fan bravado all you like. You are still just a fan and a fan is a fan for a reason. I gave mine in the OP.

you're not a quitter for appreciating the team - every fan appreciates the team, so stop acting like you're unique in that. You're a quitter for just accepting that the Spurs are done - it really is that easy to explain.

By the way, Duncan signed his extension and took less money than he was due after the Manu foul on Dirk and .4 - the FO failed to live up to their end of the bargain and acquire quality players with the money they saved on Duncan's contract.

False fan bravado - really?

[DMC]

What disappointment? You an NBA fan. You jump on the next horse still in the race. Don't believe me? Check out your 'Memphis Train' thread. You were the first to jump on. :rollin

I'll ask again. What disappointment? :rollin
I admitted openly that I am not disappointed.

Don't try to discount someone's loyalty to a team because they are still watching the game after that team lost. Even Pop said he's going to watch the games. Is he not loyal?

Seriously, weak ass argument.

Here, see if this helps you:

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=169863

[Caeman]

:lmao 4 years. Wow what a drought. It's been that long for everyone except LA and Boston. Much much longer for most others.

I have not seen anything from Pop to indicate he's senile. We weren't sitting in the 2 week meeting the staff had last summer. We are left to guess after tipoff.

Stop being a fan. That's the only way to vote, with your dollar.

You moron.

Did you not read my post? I said I wasn't disappointed that the Spurs lost. I'm disappointed in the way they have lost.

Learn to read you idiot and maybe you'll see that I'm disappointed for the right reasons. You're a loser who lives in the past. Time to move faggot!

[DMC]

you're not a quitter for appreciating the team - every fan appreciates the team, so stop acting like you're unique in that. You're a quitter for just accepting that the Spurs are done - it really is that easy to explain.

I didn't say I was unique. I gave me stance. You came along and went all "The Titans" on me with the quitter speech. You're watching on TV. This isn't WoW. I don't pretend well.


By the way, Duncan signed his extension and took less money than he was due after the Manu foul on Dirk and .4 - the FO failed to live up to their end of the bargain and acquire quality players with the money they saved on Duncan's contract.

False fan bravado - really?
Really. The whole "my dad didn't raise a quitter" makes it sound like you are actually doing something to win. You are hoping a team does something to win. I hope they do as well. Appreciating them for what I have been lucky enough to witness in my lifetime isn't the same as quitting. I am not going to pretend flaming their roster, coach, owner, mascot, building and city is going to influence their choices. I am a fan of the franchise.

I do, however, appreciate the concern by fans such as yourself as long as it doesn't turn into a lynch mob.

A team remains viable for a short time. We have 4 rings from Tim Duncan's era. Name all the players of Tim's caliber that have 4 rings in your lifetime. You probably only need one hand.

[Giuseppe]

DMC, gettin' his caca rearranged by his fellows.

:lmao

[Caeman]

DMC, gettin' his caca rearranged by his fellows.

:lmao

DMC has the balls to admit that he is okay with being a loser and okay to live in the past. We don't need that pussy attitude. That shit contributes to the shitty approach this FO has had these last 4 years. "We're only one piece away"...Yeah, one big fucking piece away.

Moves needed to be made, and they were never made. Now the era is done and we are disappointed.

But DMC has the balls to call us fairweather fans because we're disappointed. Fucking moron.

[DMC]

DMC has the balls to admit that he is okay with being a loser and okay to live in the past. We don't need that pussy attitude. That shit contributes to the shitty approach this FO has had these last 4 years. "We're only one piece away"...Yeah, one big fucking piece away.

Moves needed to be made, and they were never made. Now the era is done and we are disappointed.

But DMC has the balls to call us fairweather fans because we're disappointed. Fucking moron.

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=230&pictureid=1616

No where in my OP did I call anyone a fair weather fan. In fact, I haven't called anyone here a fair weather fan. I just said fair weather fans disappoint me.

[DMC]

DMC, gettin' his caca rearranged by his fellows.

:lmao
This is basketball talk Culby. The romper room is downstairs.

[Caeman]

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=230&pictureid=1616

No where in my OP did I call anyone a fair weather fan. In fact, I haven't called anyone here a fair weather fan. I just said fair weather fans disappoint me.


In another thread you called Spurs fans that were disappointed with how this year turn out 'fairweather fans'. Just cause it's not in the OP, doesn't mean you didn't say it.

edit*disappointed fans are not fairweather fans. We want to win. That doesn't make us fairweather fans. That happens when fans follow teams on when they win; it isn't defined as the desire for your team to win.

[DMC]

In another thread you called Spurs fans that were disappointed with how this year turn out 'fairweather fans'. Just cause it's not in the OP, doesn't mean you didn't say it.

Show me.


edit*disappointed fans are not fairweather fans. We want to win. That doesn't make us fairweather fans. That happens when fans follow teams on when they win; it isn't defined as the desire for your team to win.
I said this exactly:


Fair weather fans. That's always a disappointment but it's the nature of the business.

I didn't call anyone a fair weather fan. I said fair weather fans disappoint me.

You are really jousting at windmills here, Quixote.

[Caeman]

Show me.

I said this exactly:



I didn't call anyone a fair weather fan. I said fair weather fans disappoint me.

You are really jousting at windmills here, Quixote.

So, you go into a thread where fans are expressing their disappointment with how the season turned out, drop "fair weather fans diappoint me", but aren't referring to the people in the thread?

WTF were you doing then? (besides getting youre +1)

[DMC]

So, you go into a thread where fans are expressing their disappointment with how the season turned out, drop "fair weather fans diappoint me", but aren't referring to the people in the thread?

WTF were you doing then? (besides getting youre +1)

It's a public forum and a thread about disappointments. Mine is that I was disappointed in the fair weather fans.

If I was referring to those in the thread, I would have called them out. I've had no problem doing that in the past.

Here's a neat idea: Next time, find out who I am referring to then address it.

[Caeman]

It's a public forum and a thread about disappointments. Mine is that I was disappointed in the fair weather fans.

If I was referring to those in the thread, I would have called them out. I've had no problem doing that in the past.

Here's a neat idea: Next time, find out who I am referring to then address it.


You're comment was vague and you know it. The OP asked for 10 things that disappointed fans. You enter the thread and only drop that line and don't expect some to read it as though you were referring to the fans in the thread? :rolleyes

[DMC]

You're comment was vague and you know it. The OP asked for 10 things that disappointed fans. You enter the thread and only drop that line and don't expect some to read it as though you were referring to the fans in the thread? :rolleyes
It wasn't that vague. It didn't address you personally so, when a comment is vague, should you:

A: Ask for clarification

B: Make a hasty conclusion and attack the poster

Take your time.

[UnWantedTheory]

Damned if you do, damned if you don't. You can't win them all.

[UnWantedTheory]

:tu to Chump & DMC.