The Lakers need to get quicker...fast

[DazedAndConfused]

I never thought this Laker team would fall from grace so fast, but unless serious roster changes are made next season to improve perimeter quickness the Lakers aren't getting anywhere near another LOB.

Watching the Heat and the Bulls is making me realize how incredibly slow their perimeter players are. When Kobe is your fastest guy you have major problems. Fisher absolutely needs to be demoted to a minor role next season and a much younger and more athletic PG needs to be brought in. You simply can't play good defense when your PG is consistently getting burned off the first few dribbles. It compromises the entire defense.

Also, the Lakers need more athletic wing players coming off the bench. A Trevor Ariza style player that can hustle, hit open shots, and play solid defense is sorely lacking from this current roster. Shannon Brown is not the answer, as Kobe once famously said "SHIP HIS ASS OUT".

[cheguevara]

just face it lakerfan. lakers will be slow for a while. Fisher is not retiring. Bag of shit Bryant is bone on bone. nothing can be done about that

[JamStone]

I'm sure Luke Walton and Steve Blake could get the Lakers a young, athletic wing player... maybe someone like James White.

[picc84]

No shit.

Artest is signed for 3 more years, btw.

Enjoy.

[DazedAndConfused]

Nah Fisher has seen his last days as starting PG of the Lakers.

In a way, I have to commend DAL for soundly thrashing the Lakeshow. It's going to force the FO to take a long and hard look at the team and make the changes that need to be made.

And don't you ever forget. This is the fucking Lakers we're talking about here. They are never down and out. As for your franchise.... :lmao :lmao

[TheManFromAcme]

I never thought this Laker team would fall from grace so fast, but unless serious roster changes are made next season to improve perimeter quickness the Lakers aren't getting anywhere near another LOB.

Watching the Heat and the Bulls is making me realize how incredibly slow their perimeter players are. When Kobe is your fastest guy you have major problems. Fisher absolutely needs to be demoted to a minor role next season and a much younger and more athletic PG needs to be brought in. You simply can't play good defense when your PG is consistently getting burned off the first few dribbles. It compromises the entire defense.

Also, the Lakers need more athletic wing players coming off the bench. A Trevor Ariza style player that can hustle, hit open shots, and play solid defense is sorely lacking from this current roster. Shannon Brown is not the answer, as Kobe once famously said "SHIP HIS ASS OUT".

We mortgaged his development in this team for Ron-Ron. In hindsight, I get it and Ron was key in getting the LOB last year but did we really do the right thing?

People will be quick with their assessments on Trev with Houston and NO but he was a p-u-r-f-e-c-t- fit with L.A.

:depressed...Damn,

[TheManFromAcme]

just face it Spurs fan. Spurs will be slow for a while. Duncan is not retiring. Bag of shit Duncan is heel on bone. nothing can be done about that

fixed and repaired :D

[JamStone]

Don't second guess a move that directly results in a title. Ariza likely couldn't have had an impact on Paul Pierce Artest had.

[Kyle Orton]

Don't second guess a move that directly results in a title. Ariza likely couldn't have had an impact on Paul Pierce Artest had.

This. If LA has Ariza last year, they lose to Boston.

[Giuseppe]

Though Pierce backin' up on Artest at the arc was incredibly stupid. But, then Pierce had vowed not to even be there in Los Angeles at that point.

[Kyle Orton]

Devin Ebanks IMO should get a shot as a rotation player next year.

[Kyle Orton]

Ariza's shooting performance in the 2009 playoffs was somewhat fluky. I think LA knew he'd never shoot like that again, and so far he hasn't.

[TheManFromAcme]

Don't second guess a move that directly results in a title. Ariza likely couldn't have had an impact on Paul Pierce Artest had.

In essence, that's what I typed Jam. "In hindsight, I get the move" to get Ron-Ron. I understand that immediacy is the concept in this league but it does bite you in the ass and owner and fan bases shouldn't cry once the candy has been eaten.

[JamStone]

Selita Ebanks should get a shot over Fisher.

[Giuseppe]

Ariza's shooting performance in the 2009 playoffs was somewhat fluky. I think LA knew he'd never shoot like that again, and so far he hasn't.

....no matter where he's landed.

[picc84]

Artest is all but useless if we're not playing a team with a slow wing player they depend on scoring from. And even in that he's started to slip and lose his hold a little.

We probably lose with Ariza last year, but going forward I think he'd be the better fit for this LA team. His man defense on wing players is worse than Ron's, but not by as much as Ron's finishing at the rim/transition baskets/cutting is worse than Trevors.

This team needs easy points in the worst way.

[JamStone]

Would Laker fans trade Pau for Josh Smith and Kirk Hinrich?

I think Atlanta would strongly consider that with Teague playing pretty well and being able to slide Marvin Williams to the starting role again. They'd lose an important piece but add a lot in the frontcourt in terms of size and scoring. Lakers would lose a lot of size but address two starting positions and get much more athletic. Could start LO at the 4 and Josh at the 3. They'd lose depth up front but that's a nice starting 5.

[Cry Havoc]

Who are the Lakers going to trade besides Bynum? The only players worth anything on the team are expirings and Andrew Bynum. Kobe, Gasol, Blake, and Ron-ron are locked up through 2014 to monster contracts. Walton makes 5.7 mil next year and 6.1 the year after that. The Lakers have $61,000,000+ wrapped up in FOUR players in 2014.

Good luck with that. I suspect Memphis isn't going to be content to be your farm team this time around.

[picc84]

Jam,

No.

[Cry Havoc]

Would Laker fans trade Pau for Josh Smith and Kirk Hinrich?

I think Atlanta would strongly consider that with Teague playing pretty well and being able to slide Marvin Williams to the starting role again. They'd lose an important piece but add a lot in the frontcourt in terms of size and scoring. Lakers would lose a lot of size but address two starting positions and get much more athletic. Could start LO at the 4 and Josh at the 3. They'd lose depth up front but that's a nice starting 5.

I like Hinrich, but he doesn't appear to address the Lakers problems right now. Their bench is thin as it is. They just have no one who can run on that team. Consider a Fisher/Kobe/Odom/Smith/Bynum lineup. That just seems primed to give up 105+ points to any competent offensive team. To say nothing if any of those players get in foul trouble with the Lakers bench as-constructed, minus Odom on the starting 5.

[picc84]

Who are the Lakers going to trade besides Bynum? The only players worth anything on the team are expirings and Andrew Bynum. Kobe, Gasol, Blake, and Ron-ron are locked up through 2014 to monster contracts. Walton makes 5.7 mil next year and 6.1 the year after that. The Lakers have $61,000,000+ wrapped up in FOUR players in 2014.

Good luck with that. I suspect Memphis isn't going to be content to be your farm team this time around.

Fucking godamnit. Walton is like the neverending contract, I swear that shit seems to get longer every year.

Artests 5 year contract was almost as much of a bumblefuck. Have the Lakers ever heard of depreciating assets?

[cheguevara]

good luck having Hinrich chase the Westbrooks, Conleys, Roses, Rondos, Parkers, Bareas of the NBA.

[Cry Havoc]

Fucking godamnit. Walton is like the neverending contract, I swear that shit seems to get longer every year.

Artests 5 year contract was almost as much of a bumblefuck. Have the Lakers ever heard of depreciating assets?

Here's the thing. Players obviously love long contracts. The Lakers basically said, "We can get a group of really, really good players now if we oversign them to massive deals." So they locked Kobe up ($30,000,000 in 2014!), they paid Artest the paper, and spent a huge sum on the frontcourt, thinking it would be enough to mitigate an atrocious bench and no competent point guard.

It did really well. You guys got two titles out of it. But now the aftermath of that is closing in. Fisher is just done, and you can't blame him as he outlived his expectancy long ago for clutchness. Shannon Brown is just not the player the Lakers FO expected him to be. Barnes wasn't the same after his injury and doesn't appear to be a good fit despite the Lakers' need for a player like him. Kobe is aging faster than they hoped. Artest is suddenly a bad player overall and seems to hate playing next to Kobe. And while this happened, the West took a breath and just got so much younger and faster. It's not a coincidence that in the span of about 18 months Kobe went from being one of the best defensive guards in the league to actually having trouble slowing down anyone out West. I wouldn't call him a liability now, but I would hesitate to say he's even "good" on defense anymore, especially when he's frustrated by any mental errors his team makes (although obviously when he makes one, it was just Kobe being Kobe). And now the Lakers are left holding the bag (for what it's worth, the Spurs are in the same boat, except we aren't contract-locked like LAL). The bag has 2 LOBs in it, but at the expense of the next 3-4 years in addition to this one. Who knows how the CBA will change things, but as they stand it's going to be really freaking difficult to retool. There are just too many gaps in the roster.

You can't overpay players ridiculous sums of money, win two titles, and still be able to reload year after year.

And FWIW, I don't see Marc ever being at the level that Pau is/was. He might end up being a better player soon, but if Pau doesn't come to LA, neither do two titles. You might be looking better now going forward (although that's debatable), but it was still a very obvious trade to make, IMO.

I still don't understand how the Lakers' FO thought Walton or Blake were worth that much. Artest I can understand because you were desperate for a d-stopper and an enforcer, and you had to pay the man. But Walton and Blake... wow. :lol

[Giuseppe]

You can't overpay players ridiculous sums of money, win two titles, and still be able to reload year after year.

Give us at least a fortnight to reload.:rolleyes

[Cry Havoc]

Give us at least a fortnight to reload.:rolleyes

Why? Got another farm team in your pocket? You hoping Orlando is going to bail you out now? Just answer me: who on your team has a trade value that even approaches their current contract outside of Bynum? What do the Lakers do if Dwight stays in Orlando? Any ideas at all?

[Giuseppe]

Why? Got another farm team in your pocket? You hoping Orlando is going to bail you out now? Just answer me: who on your team has a trade value that even approaches their current contract outside of Bynum? What do the Lakers do if Dwight stays in Orlando? Any ideas at all?

I've been of the "be still" contingent since The Downfall, Cry. I want to see a confirmation of the body next Summer before I throw the towel.

Howard ain't no answer, nor panacea.

We'll rehabilitate Pau & Odom once & again, set Bynum up, and confirm Kobe's tread reading.

You go home with who brung you.

They brung me.

[jacobdrj]

Adleman is a good choice over Shaw for the simple reason that while Adleman is an inferior coach to P-Jax, he does do at least 1 at least as well or better than P-Jax, and that is ego management. He had Artest before and got a whole lot out of him. He did just about as well as anyone could have massaging the egos of Peja and C-Webb back in the day, and he actually got some value out of Bonzi Wells way back when. This is a veteran team, so there will not be any 'rookie doghouse' issues.

[Killakobe81]

We mortgaged his development in this team for Ron-Ron. In hindsight, I get it and Ron was key in getting the LOB last year but did we really do the right thing?

People will be quick with their assessments on Trev with Houston and NO but he was a p-u-r-f-e-c-t- fit with L.A.

:depressed...Damn,

ariza was the better long-term solution. but his agent stalled. I dont blame the FO for signing artest. And without ron's toughness no way we win the 2nd LOB, so I have no regrets on that matter. for the future, of course Ariza was the better fit. It was one of the reasons why I wanted Shannon back. check my posts from the time of the deal. I agreed Ron was the better player but it made us very slow. Losing farmar, even slower and giving away Sasha for smith to save money transformed us to one of the slowest teams n the whole NBA. the other older teams like dallas and Boston have rondo, JJB, and Roddy to add speed. we have? who do we have exactly?

Ariza is a good role player, but he only addresses the speed/athleticism issue, we also have no shooters either ..

[IronMexican]

And don't you ever forget. This is the fucking Lakers we're talking about here. They are never down and out. As for your franchise.... :lmao :lmao

This is why I don't wan the Lakers to blow the team up. Trade Pau or Bynum for an obvious upgrade. It's LA, and that usually gives them the upper hand on anyone for FA signing, and trade leverage.

[Killakobe81]

Adleman is a good choice over Shaw for the simple reason that while Adleman is an inferior coach to P-Jax, he does do at least 1 at least as well or better than P-Jax, and that is ego management. He had Artest before and got a whole lot out of him. He did just about as well as anyone could have massaging the egos of Peja and C-Webb back in the day, and he actually got some value out of Bonzi Wells way back when. This is a veteran team, so there will not be any 'rookie doghouse' issues.

I agree with this. but we have to find a way to infuse some youth in the perimeter especially the back-court. Ebanks may be the answer at the backup SF but whomever the coach is will have to be OK with letting a young PG or SG carve out a role on this team. Mitch has to find someone ... Adelman must be willing to play that someone(s).

[Venti Quattro]

As ironic as it may sound, Artest is more fixable than Walton

[Cry Havoc]

Trade Pau or Bynum for an obvious upgrade.

Who, aside from Dwight, is an "obvious upgrade"?

[Venti Quattro]

Who, aside from Dwight, is an "obvious upgrade"?

Tiago Splitter

[Giuseppe]

Who, aside from Dwight, is an "obvious upgrade"?

Even though I don't agree that Howard is an upgrade, Cry is right:::who else of any legit esteem is going to be available?

It's not only my choice to remain intact, it's by & large compulsory.

[jag]

Tiago Splitter

I agree

[pad300]

While I think there are quickness issues, I suspect that Chemistry is a more important concern than quickness right now. It is unclear to me who Gasol can't live with anymore - is it Kobe or Brown? (If it was Brown, see here, http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=179743, I can't see why Phil didn't just exile the idiot - tell him to stay away from the team, no practices, nothing, and just trade him for scrap later...That locker room needed an immediate fix, and I can't see PJ not trying it on his last run. So maybe it is between Kobe and Pau).
If it's between Pau and Kobe, Pau is probably the better trade possibility (better player, more palatable contract (relatively speaking of course)).
Lakers need to start thinking big trade(s), and should expect relatively low value on the dollar (ie. Damaged goods/ending contracts coming back not Dwight Howard).

[IronMexican]

Who, aside from Dwight, is an "obvious upgrade"?

Chris Paul for Pau would be. I don't think NO would do it, but they have to get something for Paul before he bolts. I think the only teams willing to trade for Pau are teams that have an established star, though, or some team that feels they are almost there. He clearly isn't a #1 in this league. I thought he was a 1.5, but I don't think so any more.

[Cry Havoc]

Chris Paul for Pau would be. I don't think NO would do it, but they have to get something for Paul before he bolts. I think the only teams willing to trade for Pau are teams that have an established star, though, or some team that feels they are almost there. He clearly isn't a #1 in this league. I thought he was a 1.5, but I don't think so any more.

They have David West. Why would they shop Paul to the Lakers for another long jump-shooting PF? LA isn't the only team out there with trade assets. Paul is a fantasy at this point for LAL, to say nothing of your ability to pay him, pre OR post CBA.

[21_Blessings]

Here's the thing. Players obviously love long contracts. The Lakers basically said, "We can get a group of really, really good players now if we oversign them to massive deals." So they locked Kobe up ($30,000,000 in 2014!), they paid Artest the paper, and spent a huge sum on the frontcourt, thinking it would be enough to mitigate an atrocious bench and no competent point guard.

It did really well. You guys got two titles out of it. But now the aftermath of that is closing in. Fisher is just done, and you can't blame him as he outlived his expectancy long ago for clutchness. Shannon Brown is just not the player the Lakers FO expected him to be. Barnes wasn't the same after his injury and doesn't appear to be a good fit despite the Lakers' need for a player like him. Kobe is aging faster than they hoped. Artest is suddenly a bad player overall and seems to hate playing next to Kobe. And while this happened, the West took a breath and just got so much younger and faster. It's not a coincidence that in the span of about 18 months Kobe went from being one of the best defensive guards in the league to actually having trouble slowing down anyone out West. I wouldn't call him a liability now, but I would hesitate to say he's even "good" on defense anymore, especially when he's frustrated by any mental errors his team makes (although obviously when he makes one, it was just Kobe being Kobe). And now the Lakers are left holding the bag (for what it's worth, the Spurs are in the same boat, except we aren't contract-locked like LAL). The bag has 2 LOBs in it, but at the expense of the next 3-4 years in addition to this one. Who knows how the CBA will change things, but as they stand it's going to be really freaking difficult to retool. There are just too many gaps in the roster.

You can't overpay players ridiculous sums of money, win two titles, and still be able to reload year after year.

And FWIW, I don't see Marc ever being at the level that Pau is/was. He might end up being a better player soon, but if Pau doesn't come to LA, neither do two titles. You might be looking better now going forward (although that's debatable), but it was still a very obvious trade to make, IMO.

I still don't understand how the Lakers' FO thought Walton or Blake were worth that much. Artest I can understand because you were desperate for a d-stopper and an enforcer, and you had to pay the man. But Walton and Blake... wow. :lol

Lot of empty words coming from a fan of team that hasn't sniffed a title in years.

1) Kobe's D is fine. The liabilities are Fisher, Blake and Pau.

2) Marc is already better than Pau. He's earned that this postseason

3) People still overvalue Pau. He easily has more trade value than anything the Spurs could ever muster.

4) LOL talking about overpaying players when the Spurs gave Duncan superstar money and that fag 50 million. The Lakers just won a :lobt: :lobt: and are one trade away from being back in the Finals.

Going to be great watching Havoc, Cry when Deron is throwing lobs to Baby Drew.

[dirk4mvp]

rofl 21_Palins

what a flaming faggot


Did you get excited when Bynum flashed his jugs?

[IronMexican]

Deron Williams isn't det guud

[Cry Havoc]

Also, Arenas+Howard for Bynum+Odom doesn't work. You'd have to force Orlando to take on 10+ million more in salary to do that. Good luck with the current roster.

[IronMexican]

Pretty sure Pau, Luke and Odom works.

[Cry Havoc]

Lot of empty words coming from a fan of team that hasn't sniffed a title in years.

1) Kobe's D is fine. The liabilities are Fisher, Blake and Pau.

2) Marc is already better than Pau. He's earned that this postseason

3) People still overvalue Pau. He easily has more trade value than anything the Spurs could ever muster.

4) LOL talking about overpaying players when the Spurs gave Duncan superstar money and that fag 50 million. The Lakers just won a :lobt: :lobt: and are one trade away from being back in the Finals.

Going to be great watching Havoc, Cry when Deron is throwing lobs to Baby Drew.

http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRBCxxfA42SoFi3oo4PdbeQ7rTkseIqC sDbtk7FRaoQjf0tkfoa&t=1

[Sportcamper]

http://www.welovetheiraqiinformationminister.com/images/07-minister.jpg

Lakers are still the Champions, and will emerge victorious again!

[Cry Havoc]

Pretty sure Pau, Luke and Odom works.

Nope. $3 million short in that scenario.

[IronMexican]

It works. And the Lakers lose 3 wins, according to stat guy:lol

Edit: I read it wrong. Lakers get 3 wins.

[IronMexican]

Nope. $3 million short in that scenario.

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3vjow9g

[Cry Havoc]

It works. And the Lakers lose 3 wins, according to stat guy:lol

My bad, I was using Bynum.

Seriously doubt you're getting Howard for Pau.

[21_Blessings]

http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRBCxxfA42SoFi3oo4PdbeQ7rTkseIqC sDbtk7FRaoQjf0tkfoa&t=1

What I figured.

Sorry about the Spurs being stuck in perpetual 1st/2nd round exit mode while the Lakers have all the tools to structure another quick reload, again. :cry

Hurts, don't it?

[wanggi]

Recruit Rick Fox would be helpful.

[Cry Havoc]

What I figured.

Sorry about the Spurs being stuck in perpetual 1st/2nd round exit mode while the Lakers have all the tools to structure another quick reload, again. :cry

Hurts, don't it?

All the tools = the most expensive combined collective contracts in the NBA + aging stars who are well past their prime.

U HAZ THE TOOLZ.

[picc84]

Having Howard and Bynum on the same team would be an epic fail for the Lakers.

Again, the frontcourt is not the problem for LA. The backcourt is. Positions 1-3 need speed and shooting, and the team will be fine.

[Giuseppe]

Recruit Rick Fox would be helpful.

:rolleyes

[21_Blessings]

Deron Williams isn't det guud

Elaborate.

20/9 on a mediocre offensive Jazz team. Can defend the 1 and the 2, something the Lakers sorely need in the backcourt. Good shooter, with range. Ability to destroy teams through the pick and roll (aka most used NBA play ever). Knees aren't shot like Paul's.

What's not to like?

[wanggi]

I'm obsessed with his wife
:wow

[Killakobe81]

Obviously Dwight, Paul or Dwill are "dream scenarios" ...to get any of those guys THOSE players would have to have a "clear agenda" to get to L.A. . if they do, Lakers have SOME leverage to strike a deal. if they do not Lakers have few options because even if the CBA is restructured I doubt it will offer the Lakers much cap relief.

But I laugh at those that scoff at the value of Kobe, Pau, Lamar even Walton has value a year from now when he expires. Kobe is still the best player and has most value of this group because he still at least a top 10 player an elite though volume scorer, and despite not being a ALL NBA defender he is far froma sieve on defense. Add to the fact he is one of the most marketable stars despite his transgressions, if the Lakers wanted to Kobe would bring a return to the right team.
Fact of the matter is Buss would not trade him. Kobe can still fill seats at Staples and as much as the Lakers charge, no way they trade Kobe without getting a superstar back. who could they really get back in return that would be acceptable? So in regards to Kobe I agree the Lakers are stuck and it is in their best interest to ride it out.

Now overall Bynum is the best trade chip, but his knee is suspect. If they keep Bynum, pau is the most logical trade asset. If Bynum goes, you have to get a big ...and I would sacrifice Pau and Odom if need be (for Dwight) but only if we dont haveto eat Arenas shite, contract in return. If so Lakers should pass, and focus on the backcourt and bench.

[Giuseppe]

:wow

:rolleyes

[21_Blessings]

All the tools = the most expensive combined collective contracts in the NBA + aging stars who are well past their prime.

So you're saying no NBA team could use a player like Odom, Pau or Bynum? All three would upgrade the Spurs immediately. Hahaha.

You're confused.

[TheManFromAcme]

All the tools = the most expensive combined collective contracts in the NBA + aging stars who are well past their prime.
U HAZ THE TOOLZ.


do you analyze or do you just throw stuff out there and see what sticks?
I mean, really?

[Killakobe81]

Having Howard and Bynum on the same team would be an epic fail for the Lakers.

Again, the frontcourt is not the problem for LA. The backcourt is. Positions 1-3 need speed and shooting, and the team will be fine.

Agree, it's not front-court. it's shooting, athleticism and bench at the 1-3 spots ...

[TheManFromAcme]

Agree, it's not front-court. it's shooting, athleticism and bench at the 1-3 spots ...

+1 :tu

[Giuseppe]

do you analyze or do you just throw stuff out there and see what sticks?
I mean, really?

Cry has the best intentions going in. But, after 5 minutes he reverts to an a-hole.

[Cry Havoc]

So you're saying no NBA team could use a player like Odom, Pau or Bynum? All three would upgrade the Spurs immediately. Hahaha.

You're confused.

It's funny how quickly you shifted out of troll mode when I threw your schtick back at you. Almost like you're... worried... about the Lakers' chances of rebuilding? :lol

Odom is aging and probably will begin a steady decline in production now. Pau is not worth his contract because of his newfound ability to disappear for an entire playoffs. He's also got way more miles on him than the typical big for his age, and even admitted that he's tired.

Bynum is definitely a legit trade chip, as, you know, I mentioned earlier. The problem is who to trade him for? Can you justify giving away a big like Drew unless you get Howard back in return? What if you don't get Howard? Who do you pursue then, and who else on the Lakers is tradeable that's going to give equal value back?


do you analyze or do you just throw stuff out there and see what sticks?
I mean, really?

What's hilarious is that out of all the 21_Blessings posts recently, you choose to call me out for that? :lol

[21_Blessings]

Agree, it's not front-court. it's shooting, athleticism and bench at the 1-3 spots ...

I would argue Pau is a complete liability defensively. Even more so when he loses focus. Bynum has been covering his defensive deficiencies for years now.

Dirk shot nearly 80% on his Pau's pasty ass and in the 40s against the rest of the team. Partly Phil's fault there, but the only other option was to bench him. Which probably should have happened to be honest.

[Cry Havoc]

Agree, it's not front-court. it's shooting, athleticism and bench at the 1-3 spots ...

The problem is who to give up? Who's going to take Artest's back-ended contract? You might be able to swing Gasol for some decent young guards, but then what? I doubt you'll get a premium point for him, and the Lakers need at least someone decent running the plays.

[TheManFromAcme]

.... just poking at ya Cry....no big deal. :tu

[21_Blessings]

It's funny how quickly you shifted out of troll mode when I threw your schtick back at you. Almost like you're... worried... about the Lakers' chances of rebuilding? :lol

I don't troll....

Your definition of a "schtick" is posting some lame .img that you probably have saved in some folder with a bunch of other lame, unoriginal internet images. :lol


Odom is aging and probably will begin a steady decline in production now.

Double double guy, shot over 50% and won 6th man of the year. Yeah, no trade value. At all. You're right.


Pau is not worth his contract because of his newfound ability to disappear for an entire playoffs. He's also got way more miles on him than the typical big for his age, and even admitted that he's tired.

It's not a newfound ability. It was there in Memphis.

And he's still worth more than Duncan. A team will shell out for a player like Pau when he still has the ability to give a lottery team 17/10/3 and can play the 4 or 5. He's a luxury on the Lakers when they have two superior big men.


Bynum is definitely a legit trade chip, as, you know, I mentioned earlier.

So is Pau Gasol and Odom... That's three decent trade chips. Now compare that to the pile of shit the Spurs have going for them. :lmao



The problem is who to trade him for? Can you justify giving away a big like Drew unless you get Howard back in return? What if you don't get Howard? Who do you pursue then, and who else on the Lakers is tradeable that's going to give equal value back?

What's hilarious is that out of all the 21_Blessings posts recently, you choose to call me out for that? :lol

I want a) point guard b) speed/youth/athletes

What's hilarious is you typing out serious paragraphs of misinformed garbage that you cover with shits of glitter and hope while acting like you know what you are talking about. Almost as if you're wishing the Lakers would just go away and die. Sorry, but it's not happening. If Buss does one thing well, it's retooling his dynasties into new dynasties. :flag:

[IronMexican]

Elaboration:

Christ Paul > Deron

[21_Blessings]

Elaboration:

Christ Paul > Deron

Either would do.

[mavsfan1000]

The Lakers need Chris Paul. They also need a shooter at the 3 position. Artest is awful for that team.

[cesare borgia]

The triangle offense must die first!

[picc84]

Yes, it must. I look forward to a new system.

I prefer Williams to Paul. Let CP3 play with his butt-buddies in NY as his body breaks down even further.

[21_Blessings]

It's not really a system problem. The Lakers just lost the ability to score in transition efficiently by getting rid of their young team speed and never properly addressing the point guard position.

[Cry Havoc]

I don't troll....

lol


Your definition of a "schtick" is posting some lame .img that you probably have saved in some folder with a bunch of other lame, unoriginal internet images. :lol

I don't waste time replying to idiotic comments.


Double double guy, shot over 50% and won 6th man of the year. Yeah, no trade value. At all. You're right.

He's a bench player making a cool $17 mil over the next 2 years. He's a big who doesn't play like one. Do you know of any teams who are willing to part with their young promising shooting guard to take on Odom? In 2012 he'll be worth a lot more as his contract is set to expire. Right now, he's medium trade-bait at best.


It's not a newfound ability. It was there in Memphis.

:lmao Man, Laker fans waste no time shitting on a guy that won them two titles alongside Kobe. Sad to see.


And he's still worth more than Duncan.

Immaterial considering the Spurs would never trade Duncan.


A team will shell out for a player like Pau when he still has the ability to give a lottery team 17/10/3 and can play the 4 or 5.

They sure will. However, will they give you their promising young players of even close to equal value while still meeting salary restrictions?


He's a luxury on the Lakers when they have two superior big men.

Who's the other "superior" big man to Gasol?


So is Pau Gasol and Odom... That's three decent trade chips. Now compare that to the pile of shit the Spurs have going for them. :lmao

You mean 3 of the 4 best players on your team have some trade value!? This is shocking. What I would like to know is how the Lakers intend to find a team who will sell out their future to have Gasol/Odom play for them for 2/3 seasons? Who are you going to find who wants THOSE contracts AND is willing to give you a top tier young guard for them?


I want a) point guard b) speed/youth/athletes

Again, shocking. Most teams want to be slow, old, and unathletic. Your desires are unique to the league and puts you in a unique place at the bargaining table, as no other GMs are looking for any of these traits!


What's hilarious is you typing out serious paragraphs of misinformed garbage that you cover with shits of glitter and hope while acting like you know what you are talking about. Almost as if you're wishing the Lakers would just go away and die. Sorry, but it's not happening. If Buss does one thing well, it's retooling his dynasties into new dynasties. :flag:

As I've said before, I think the Lakers will be back, eventually. However, this notion that some fans have that retooling is as simple as forcing Orlando to trade Dwight, or getting Deron from NJ like it's just a simple snap of the fingers is hilarious. You are stacked with monster contracts that other teams are going to be extremely hesitant to deal with given the current status of the CBA. As constructed the Lakers are probably due to be a weaker west power for the next 2-3 years... after which Kobe will probably be reduced to a role player.

I've asked you, repeatedly, who you think the Lakers have a shot in hell of getting realistically, and you can't answer. I think your rage in response, rather than calmly examining the situation, is perhaps the most telling thing in this discussion. :lol

[Axe Murderer]

lol LakerFan thinking they could get D-Will and Howard

[Giuseppe]

lol LakerFan thinking they could get D-Will and Howard

Like you thinking you could get 11 & Forever!

[Cry Havoc]

lol LakerFan thinking they could get D-Will and Howard

Walton + Blake for Wade! :lol

[Giuseppe]

Walton + Blake for Wade! :lol

Psssssssssstttt....Scola!

[Cry Havoc]

Psssssssssstttt....Scola!

http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcT7teXJmdgLMqpc9xBD5aR6I8y-WWCk9nTepA8-lgG-sSbsISf1eg&t=1

:lol

[21_Blessings]

I don't waste time replying to idiotic comments.

So I guess you're trolling yourself by replying then.




He's a bench player

Not on the Spurs, he's not. :lmao He's starter on numerous NBA teams.


Immaterial considering the Spurs would never trade Duncan.

But he's still worth more than Duncan. Ha Ha.


You mean 3 of the 4 best players on your team have some trade value!? This is shocking.

Must be for you, since you denied that 2 of them had any trade value before your backpedal :lol

What I would like to know is how the Lakers intend to find a team who will sell out their future to have Gasol/Odom play for them for 2/3 seasons? Who are you going to find who wants THOSE contracts AND is willing to give you a top tier young guard for them?


Again, shocking. Most teams want to be slow, old, and unathletic. Your desires are unique to the league and puts you in a unique place at the bargaining table, as no other GMs are looking for any of these traits!

Yeah, what GM/team would want a big man capable of averaging a double double.


As I've said before, I think the Lakers will be back, eventually. However, this notion that some fans have that retooling is as simple as forcing Orlando to trade Dwight, or getting Deron from NJ like it's just a simple snap of the fingers is hilarious. You are stacked with monster contracts that other teams are going to be extremely hesitant to deal with given the current status of the CBA.

You must still be bitter at all the times the Lakers retooled their championship squad the past 30 years then.

Meanwhile, back in San Antonio.... :lmao


As constructed the Lakers are probably due to be a weaker west power for the next 2-3 years... after which Kobe will probably be reduced to a role player.

:lmao :lmao :lmao


I've asked you, repeatedly, who you think the Lakers have a shot in hell of getting realistically, and you can't answer. I think your rage in response, rather than calmly examining the situation, is perhaps the most telling thing in this discussion. :lol

Well, now that you have officially backpedaled on your position regarding the Lakers trade pieces, maybe you should go back and read the thread.

Things will become clearer after the new CBA is in place, but the Lakers have the pieces and desirability to make a run at just about any big name with uncertain team status the next 2-3 years.

The Lakers just went to 3 out of the last 4 NBA finals. Yeah, I'm just raging about the dire straits the Lakers organization is currently stuck in.

[picc84]

Its somewhat a system problem, because as long as the triangle is being run, the PG's will have next to no flexibility and Kobe will continue to have all of the ballhandling/playmaking responsibilities. There's no point to having a decent PG if we're running the tri.

If you're starting Derek Fisher, the triangle is fine. If you're starting Deron Williams or Chris Paul, as we plan to do in the near future, the offense needs to change to accommodate their respective talent.

[Cry Havoc]

So, Lakerfan's solution to their current problems is to trade for DWill or Chris Paul. It's going to suck for them when they realize the Spurs plan to move Bonner + Jefferson for LeBron James. :lol

[21_Blessings]

Its somewhat a system problem, because as long as the triangle is being run, the PG's will have next to no flexibility and Kobe will continue to have all of the ballhandling/playmaking responsibilities. There's no point to having a decent PG if we're running the tri.

That's not true at all. You do realize Tri-sets aren't run on every offensive possession.


If you're starting Derek Fisher, the triangle is fine. If you're starting Deron Williams or Chris Paul, as we plan to do in the near future, the offense needs to change to accommodate their respective talent.

This is another fallacy. The Lakers won titles despite Fisher. Deron and Paul would do just fine in triangle. The main difference would be more pick & roll and easy transition buckets.

[21_Blessings]

So, Lakerfan's solution to their current problems is to trade for DWill or Chris Paul. It's going to suck for them when they realize the Spurs plan to move Bonner + Jefferson for LeBron James. :lol

Yeah what team would want Andrew Bynum or Pau Gasol when they could get Matt Bonner and Richard Jefferson. Great equivalence there.

[IronMexican]

Either would do.

Will is a fagot, though. The only good thing is he's a Kobe ballwasher, so they'd get along.

[Cry Havoc]

Yeah what team would want Andrew Bynum or Pau Gasol when they could get Matt Bonner and Richard Jefferson. Great equivalence there.

:lol If you trade Bynum for Deron Williams I can only imagine what the Lakers defense will be like next year. You'll certainly score, but it won't matter if you're giving up 115 a game. :lol

As for Pau, yeah, the fact that you think you can trade Pau fucking Gasol for Chris Paul and not see how much of a pipe dream that is is ridiculous. :lol Yeah, NO is going to give up one of the greatest PGs in NBA history for a PF who recently forgot how to separate "girlfriend" from "playoffs". :lmao

[picc84]

Either Paul or Williams would be great on the Lakers in the tri, because they're too good not to. They'll look good anywhere under any system.

But to maximize their talents, another system would be ideal. And with Phil gone, I wouldn't trust Shaw with the helms anyway, and it looks like the FO feels the same way. There's almost no chance they give him the job so we're looking at a near-certainty of new system implementation.


So, Lakerfan's solution to their current problems is to trade for DWill or Chris Paul. It's going to suck for them when they realize the Spurs plan to move Bonner + Jefferson for LeBron James. :lol

Our last major trade was for Pau Gasol. Your's was for Dick Jefferson. I'd say we've set enough of a standard to speculate....have you? :lol

[TheManFromAcme]

:lol If you trade Bynum for Deron Williams I can only imagine what the Lakers defense will be like next year. You'll certainly score, but it won't matter if you're giving up 115 a game. :lol

As for Pau, yeah, the fact that you think you can trade Pau fucking Gasol for Chris Paul and not see how much of a pipe dream that is is ridiculous. :lol Yeah, NO is going to give up one of the greatest PGs in NBA history for a PF who recently forgot how to separate "girlfriend" from "playoffs". :lmao

Cry......

funnier things have happened and these "funnier" things have just about all been orchestrated by the Laker FO.....be careful what you say less it bite you in the a$$....:nope

..just sayin..

[21_Blessings]

:lol If you trade Bynum for Deron Williams I can only imagine what the Lakers defense will be like next year. You'll certainly score, but it won't matter if you're giving up 115 a game. :lol

Better than the Spurs, that much is guaranteed.


As for Pau, yeah, the fact that you think you can trade Pau fucking Gasol for Chris Paul and not see how much of a pipe dream that is is ridiculous. :lol Yeah, NO is going to give up one of the greatest PGs in NBA history for a PF who recently forgot how to separate "girlfriend" from "playoffs". :lmao

You were just defending Pau two posts ago. Be consistent.

What leverage does New Jersey or NOH even have? Pau Gasol would upgrade the front court of both teams.

[21_Blessings]

Will is a fagot, .

So is CP3 though. And he's a Lebron ball-washer, legendary flop artist.

[Cry Havoc]

Our last major trade was for Pau Gasol. Your's was for Dick Jefferson. I'd say we've set enough of a standard to speculate....have you? :lol


Cry......

funnier things have happened and these "funnier" things have just about all been orchestrated by the Laker FO.....be careful what you say less it bite you in the a$$....:nope

..just sayin..

So you guys are essentially hoping that you have another farm team in your back pocket that won't shop around their superstars to any other teams in order to take whatever "offer" the Lakers are willing to give them? If you're willing to believe that, then yeah, I can see why you think you'll get Chris Paul in a Laker uniform soon. Talking about it like it's a done deal is pretty ridiculous, though.


Better than the Spurs, that much is guaranteed.

You were just defending Pau two posts ago. Be consistent.

Yes, because saying a guy is decent trade bait is equivalent to saying you could get a top 5 player in the NBA for him. :lmao Joe Johnson is a good player but I'm not quite sure that the Hawks should start thinking about having Dirk on their team next year for JJ.


Pau Gasol would upgrade the front court of both teams.

Yeah, because having David West as your PF doesn't mean anything.



What leverage does New Jersey or NOH even have?

You're right, I must have missed that new rule that passed that said teams are ONLY allowed to trade their top 5 superstars for someone in a Lakers uniform. Dunno how that slipped by me.

[Cry Havoc]

It says something about the quality of a thread when Guiseppe is the most reasonable Lakers fans posting in it. :wow

[ducks]

good luck having Hinrich chase the Westbrooks, Conleys, Roses, Rondos, Parkers, Bareas of the NBA.

fisher does a better job:rolleyes

[21_Blessings]

Yes, because saying a guy is decent trade bait is equivalent to saying you could get a top 5 player in the NBA for him. :lmao Joe Johnson is a good player but I'm not quite sure that the Hawks should start thinking about having Dirk on their team next year for JJ.

Top 5 player? If you're referring to Cp3, he's going to be a free agent. Getting an All-NBA player sounds like a bargain considering the alternative.



Yeah, because having David West as your PF doesn't mean anything.

Why would it when they would be upgrading the center and backup PF position and possibly West's future replacement?



You're right, I must have missed that new rule that passed that said teams are ONLY allowed to trade their top 5 superstars for someone in a Lakers uniform. Dunno how that slipped by me.

It's nice when your team has the pieces to make said trade happen after winning 2 out of the last 3 NBA championships. Not like a Spur fan would know anything about that, though.

[Ghazi]

21_Blessings...

"Shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh"

-Dirk Nowitzki, 5/4/11, Staples Center

[Giuseppe]

21_Blessings...

"Shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh"

-Dirk Nowitzki, 5/4/11, Staples Center

:lmao at G lodgin' it in Texas.:lmao

[mavsfan1000]

Btw I don't if I've said it yet but lol Lakers.

[Kyle Orton]

....no matter where he's landed.

Yep.

[Spur-Addict]

Smelled like shit when I opened the thread. Took a look around, and saw all this faggotry. That explains the scent

[21_Blessings]

Smelled like shit when I opened the thread. Took a look around, and saw all this faggotry. That explains the scent

That's just the smell of the Spurs future, really.

[Def Rowe]

That's just the smell of the Spurs future, really.

That... or his upper lip.

[TheManFromAcme]

Smelled like shit when I opened the thread. Took a look around, and saw all this faggotry. That explains the scent

.....take the butt-plug out of your mouth then

[Spur-Addict]

That's just the smell of the Spurs future, really.

That's all you have? :lol


That... or his upper lip.

1999 in the house


.....take the butt-plug out of your mouth then

:sleep


Dirk laid that pipe, now you're crying for a savior :lol

[Killakobe81]

Will is a fagot, though. The only good thing is he's a Kobe ballwasher, so they'd get along.

Dwill can ball. After last season I would definitely list him 3rd in the PG order and dropping. But he is better than everyone else not named Rose or Paul and he is not THAT far behind Paul TBH ...

Also, Dwill's size and the principles that PJ believed in (big guards unless named Fisher) williams game would be a good fit.

LOL I dont get why IM just shits on certain players. dont get me wrong there are players like Tony Parker, Rondo etc that I dont like, but I dont call them faggots or say they cant ball.

[Killakobe81]

It says something about the quality of a thread when Guiseppe is the most reasonable Lakers fans posting in it. :wow

You may be right ... but I love how people judge the most "reasonable" or best poster by who they AGREE with more ...

[baseline bum]

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=172596

I thought you were going to bump this thread come playoff time

[Ace]

:lol This is what 21 has resorted to? From championship talk to what if we trade for this player...

[daslicer]

Laker fans before the playoffs "We got the best player and best team in the world and we haven't turned on the switch yet."

After the playoffs
"Yeah yeah we will get the championship back next year once we trade for blah blah."

I can see the majority of laker nation are going through denial right now that their run is over.

[Giuseppe]

Laker fans before the playoffs "We got the best player and best team in the world and we haven't turned on the switch yet."

After the playoffs
"Yeah yeah we will get the championship back next year once we trade for blah blah."

I can see the majority of laker nation are going through denial right now that their run is over.

We ain't lost over consecutive Junes.

[ezau]

We mortgaged his development in this team for Ron-Ron. In hindsight, I get it and Ron was key in getting the LOB last year but did we really do the right thing?

People will be quick with their assessments on Trev with Houston and NO but he was a p-u-r-f-e-c-t- fit with L.A.

:depressed...Damn,

A title is a title. If Greg Ostertag is needed to get the LOB, I wouldn't fault the FO for doing it.

[ezau]

This is why I don't wan the Lakers to blow the team up. Trade Pau or Bynum for an obvious upgrade. It's LA, and that usually gives them the upper hand on anyone for FA signing, and trade leverage.

The Lakers FO isn't going to trade Bynum. Laker fans should realize that he' gonna be the team's franchise player once Kobe hangs them up.

[Cry Havoc]

You may be right ... but I love how people judge the most "reasonable" or best poster by who they AGREE with more ...

Not at all. I agreed with several posters in the thread, especially about Bynum's trade value.

However, to talk like Chris Paul is already in yellow and gold like it's a done deal and to ignore the 28 other NBA franchises that are out there, of which a pretty high number could also make an offer for him, is so fantastical it's ludicrous. It's the neurotic, self-serving bubble that so many Laker fans live in that cause them to be so blinded, and is eerily similar to the "fans" that show up for their playoff games expecting to sweep every other team and win by 40. I don't know any other fanbase that could get 4-0ed in the 2nd round and come out of it talking about how they're going to dominate next year. But I guess it's easier to be arrogant than realistic.